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An end to the "clash of civilizations"

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Having once been in a war myself I'll just say that no one deserves to die but as the wise old Gypsy woman once said

"Sometimes life sucks"

 

Life certainly sucks for the people of Laos who are still being killed by US cluster bomblets.

 

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2003-12-11-laos-bombs_x.htm

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article3818771.ece

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Someone raised the point of security of wmd that may be in the hands of undesirables.If its any comfort to anyone out there, my mate abdul says the two he's got in the lockup at the back of his curry joint up spital hill are, "well safe" he tells me he's just got one of those new combination bike locks from Halfords on the door and he's chucked a few old tyres on the roof,to stop it blowing off in the wind. Which is a lot more than I can say for uncle sams caretaking skills, Im sure you are all aware of the "lost device" in Greenland,but what about the FOUR nuclear devices that fell out of a B52 over the village of palomares Almeria' Spain in the early 60s(gooole it).I've alot more confidance in Abdul, I mean thats 5 bleedin atom bombs Sam has screwed up on !!! Abdul also says if any body has any Eskimo mates in Greenland who should stumble upon the afore mentioned device P M him cos he's got a mate who might be interseted and he's got cash, no questions

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My late uncle Ed might not agree with the "barbaric" part. He spent almost three years in a Jap POW camp, ill treated, beaten, starved and more dead than alive when liberated

 

Sounds like Guantanamo Bay.

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Plebhanov,

:roll:

 

In your own warped-time world i may have failed. go and do a balanced search on huntington and you will find plenty of critisicms.

It is your not my responsibility to substantiate your assertions.

 

This "give me evidence this second otherwise your wrong" is quite pedantic and clutching at straws.

How is it pedantic to ask people to back up wild assertions with evidence? I'm not quibbling about minor details but pointing out the complete lack of any evidence whatsoever to substantiate any of your claims.

 

have you even read neitzche or heidegger? if you did you wouldnt have replied like you did. Philosophy means a theory for ALL civilisations (how you live your life). Seeing as the above nailed the coffin to the end of modern philosophy then using common sense huntingtons incorrect theories are invalid (again they were used by the "powers that be" to deliberately create a rucus, you have selectively avoided this issue havent you)? Look at the publicity Poodle Bliar is getting now? Anyone can be pushed in the limelight, being correct isnt a qualificiation for it either. So does that make him right? Now i ask you again, have you even read the works of Neitzche and Heidegger, and read about the modern philosophy movement? Heidegger i admit is a bit complicated to get into in one post so i have summarised his main points for clarify.

 

he said "forget about thinking if their is/isnt a God. This question will always remain. What about YOU. No not "clash of civilisations"/darkies/eskimos/nazis. YOU. He very successfully turned the modern philosophical movement and said WHAT IS HERE AND NOW COUNTS. So are you good? Are you treating everyone as they should be treated? as a theory it can be applied to anyone. "East" or "West" doesnt even come into it. its invalid. thats my point. Which is why he blasts hungtington to the moon and he is quite irrelevent.

So your argument is basically that because we can't ever really know anything, we shouldn't try to study or learn about the world and instead just worry about our selves :roll:

 

You haven't rebutted 'The Clash of Civilisations' thesis at all you've simply dropped the names of a few famous philosophers and then arbitrarily declared that their far from universally accepted writings prove Huntington to be wrong. Just because you seem to be very taken with post-modern philosophy that doesn't magically invalidate all attempts to understand the world at anything beyond a personal subjective level.

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<snip yet another post selectively plucking incidents from history to try and make the US look bad whilst studiously ignoring any good it did or the crimes of its enemies>

This is getting rather tiresome Wildcat, you determinedly ignore everything the US did to liberate Europe and then help set up prosperous liberal democracies in France, Belgium, Holland, Denmark, Scandinavia, Italy, Germany... and instead whinge about attempts to influence elections in Italy to stop communists taking over. Whilst simultaneously remaining studiously ignorant of the many and varied monstrous crimes of Communists.

 

Like any country the US obviously has a mixed ethical record in it's foreign policy, by denying all the good it has done and instead concentrating solely upon every crime (be it merely alleged or well proven) of the US that you can find you simply discredit yourself and come across as nothing but the mirror image of stereotypical Reagan worshipping red neck.

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Dont you think it was a bit odd that uncle sam parked all his boats in the same place knowing what was going off at the time ? I mean , You may as well build a couple of big towers with a sign on the top that says up yours pal.

:huh: Can you name a navy that doesn't use ports?

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:huh: Can you name a navy that doesn't use ports?

 

ITs called putting all your eggs in one basket. Sam could have parked up in a dozen and one places from alaska to mexico, however he chose one of the nearest to japan.

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ITs called putting all your eggs in one basket. Sam could have parked up in a dozen and one places from alaska to mexico, however he chose one of the nearest to japan.

Why do you insist on underlining your ignorance?

 

Far from having 'all it's eggs in one backet' the US simply had a portion of one of it's fleets in Pearl Harbour when it was attacked, with many other ships at other bases and out at sea.

 

As for the fleet being at Pearl Harbour it's an excellent strategic location for a naval base as it's pretty much in the middle of the Pacific, which is why it's still a major US naval base.

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This is getting rather tiresome Wildcat, you determinedly ignore everything the US did to liberate Europe and then help set up prosperous liberal democracies in France, Belgium, Holland, Denmark, Scandinavia, Italy, Germany... and instead whinge about attempts to influence elections in Italy to stop communists taking over. Whilst simultaneously remaining studiously ignorant of the many and varied monstrous crimes of Communists.

 

Like any country the US obviously has a mixed ethical record in it's foreign policy, by denying all the good it has done and instead concentrating solely upon every crime (be it merely alleged or well proven) of the US that you can find you simply discredit yourself and come across as nothing but the mirror image of stereotypical Reagan worshipping red neck.

 

I disagree with you about Italy, I think the US's influence there has led to the perpetuation of far right politics that still tarnishes Italy today.

 

As for the rest of europe my point is the same as the one that you made. There were many reasons for US support for europe, many of them self serving, their support for democracy does not appear to be a primary reason, especially not when seen in the context of the rest of their foreign policy both since the second world war and indeed prior to that. That said yes I am grateful for the Marshall plan and their assistance in defeating the Nazis, but whilst that is significant it shouldn't prevent us from looking objectively at their international influence, nor from criticising their support for the German militarisation prior to the war.

 

Come to think of it it wasn't until the end of the 1960s that blacks even had the vote, hardly an example of a country acting as the world defender of democracy when it only reluctantly gave blacks the vote a quarter of a century after the end of the second world war.

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Why do you insist on underlining your ignorance?

 

Far from having 'all it's eggs in one backet' the US simply had a portion of one of it's fleets in Pearl Harbour when it was attacked, with many other ships at other bases and out at sea.

 

As for the fleet being at Pearl Harbour it's an excellent strategic location for a naval base as it's pretty much in the middle of the Pacific, which is why it's still a major US naval base.

 

Whats the point in having warships if you are not going to use them? So, sam was looking for a war then.

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I did do Philosophy but all I can remember about Nietsche was his verging on insane rants against christianity, that are sort of funny. Heidegger i only remember for being a boozy beggar :D

 

The Clash of Civilisations, does look like a load of tosh. Class is a more important consideration than culture or religion. It is more directly about the sort of power inequalities that are important and the sort of political power that creates conflicts. Class on its own is too simplistic an analysis, but one that can easily be refined by including other power relationships like the sort Foucault describes.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Clash_of_Civilizations#Criticism

 

Admittedly this is an early foray for me into their works. Neitzche, from what i do know....its difficult. On the one hand i greatdly admire the openess and love individual christians can have. That sharing, bond, being kind to oneself and the neighbour. This is a very worthy trait. However i detest the preisthood and heirarchy and how the Vatican turned it into a "business" and did countless horros to humankind. If Neitzche pointed this out then he cant really be faulted can he? Remember Europe is still "hung over" from centuries of dogmatic Christian/papal rule (thank God it got rid of it too), although Britian is a small exception due to Henry VIII but lets not get into that.

 

Slight typo by me, they didnt say "forget about God" they meant "Push this question aside" and turned philosophy on its head. I must read more as it is fascinating, although i definately dont recommend endorsing any of huntingtons view. the man clearly had an agenda to please his masters.

 

right wheres that bottle :D

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