Speeding Yet Again - They're Having A Laugh!

[Cyclone 10]

Originally posted by AndrewC

?????????????

 

I'm confuzzled? your law abiding dad was doing 34mph in a 30mph zone? That doesn't make sense?!

 

Coincidently, every so often, those 4mph are the difference between someone getting away with bad injuries and someone dying.

 

and you'd be surprised just how infrequent that is.

[foo_fighter 10]

Originally posted by Whelk

Well I've learned a lot from this.

 

1) Everybody on here with the exception of me and some unlucky old man is a brilliant law abiding driver who never even unintentionally transgress even the smallest law.

 

2) Everything in life is black and white. Nothing should ever be questioned.

 

3) Even if a law is unjust and unfair people will still let it go unquestioned.

 

4) Some poor old sod gets mugged for £60 and because the government did it then it is considered his own fault.

 

Thanks for the education.

Whelk, your rapidly heading from the ludicrous to...

 

...well, I'll not say.

 

That is not what is being said (I think) by most people, the gist, as I get it is that a law *was* broken, and therefore why complain about it after the fact.

 

If you (and others) feel so strongly, go join the ABD or some other campaigning organisation and lobby for the law to be changed. Then you won't have to break it. This applies of course to any law, lobby your MP if you want something changing, it's what they are there for.

 

There simply is NO use just bleeting about it on here after you've been caught.

[Cyclone 10]

unless the bleating on is actually gathering support and testing the waters of public opinion.

[foo_fighter 10]

Originally posted by Cyclone

unless the bleating on is actually gathering support and testing the waters of public opinion.

1) No, that still won't reduce the fine.

 

2) If that *was* the motive, why not start a thread entitled "Do you agree with speed limits in the UK" ?

[neeeeeeeeeek 10]

In theory the police do not get to decide which laws they enforce, they have to do everything within their ability to enforce all laws.

In reality they have the power of discretion, they may choose to give someone a telling off instead. A copper is much more likely to slap your wrist if he catches you driving on a deserted road in good driving conditions slightly over the speed limit than a camera!

[iffypop 10]

MobileB - since this has happened to your dad, has your opinion changed on the matter?

 

Most of the time, most of the people will possibly agree that - if the council had a policy of taking personal circumstances into account - nothing would get done. Once people knew that there was a chance you could 'get away with it' - everyone would try. I'd prefer the people working for my tax money to be doing other things.

 

I obviously only feel this way when no emotion is involved - when something bad happens to me or someone I know, i'm the first one to moan. But thats just me - did you feel this strongly a week ago?

[MobileB 10]

Originally posted by AndrewC

?????????????

 

I'm confuzzled? your law abiding dad was doing 34mph in a 30mph zone? That doesn't make sense?!

 

Coincidently, every so often, those 4mph are the difference between someone getting away with bad injuries and someone dying.

 

At 6.30 am, morning after boxing day on a country lane?

[iffypop 10]

Originally posted by MobileB

At 6.30 am, morning after boxing day on a country lane?

 

(I dont think it matters where/when you get hit by a car )

[Bikertec 12]

Maybe we should all stop looking out the window and just concentrate on our speed, atleast we would have a good excuse for hitting some one "Sorry I didn't see them I was watching my speedo":loopy:

[MobileB 10]

Originally posted by iffypop

MobileB - since this has happened to your dad, has your opinion changed on the matter?

 

Most of the time, most of the people will possibly agree that - if the council had a policy of taking personal circumstances into account - nothing would get done. Once people knew that there was a chance you could 'get away with it' - everyone would try. I'd prefer the people working for my tax money to be doing other things.

 

I obviously only feel this way when no emotion is involved - when something bad happens to me or someone I know, i'm the first one to moan. But thats just me - did you feel this strongly a week ago?

 

To be honest Iffy, I did try my best not to express an opinion and just state the facts. I accept that they were slanted.

 

But, I accept the Law, as my father does, and will pay the fine (actually me and me sisters have paid it for him!). But as someone on here said, that does not make it fair or right.

 

(Dnp I accept that Argos have small print saying their price might not be correct on their notifications telling you the price of something - that does not make it fair or right).

 

We have a system a very complicated and strange system of Government. For instance, you can work in a job and pay National Insurance for 30 years. This gives you access to the NHS, Pension and Unemployment Schemes. You are then made redundant. After six months, whether you receive benefits is based on a means tested system. That despite you paying the insurance for 30 years. If that was run by an insurance company, the FSA would raise serious doubts.

 

Similarly, the Government boasts about its pension credit scheme to guarantee pensioners a minimum income each week but is it surprising that 45% of the population have not taken up their entitlement given the means test they have to go through. Yes they try to make it easier by ringing the applicants back and going through the form with them but not before someone has read the form and given up. My parents only carried on because I persisted with them and in the end they got £3.13 per week!! (although admitedly it did get them Council Tax rebate but not before another form had to be filled in!).

 

However, on the other side of the coin, when it comes to Government Revenue, you get a single fine irrespective of degree of crime, with the excuse they havent got time to means test everyone who gets fined. So if he was doing 55 mph in that zone he would have got the same fine for a 34mph.

 

So what would I do. Well first stage would be stagger the punishment. Maybe <15% would be say 1 point. 15-25% 3 points 25%-50% 6 points and above 50% a ban. Anyone doing more than 45mph in a 30 zone wants banning.

 

I would also take into account a previous conviction system. If someone has a clean license and has had for a number of years, why punish them with such draconian measurers for first. If their first transgression was less than say 20% and they have had a clean license for more than 5 years then caution them with no punishment; like they do with any young offenders now for virtually any crime!

 

I would also look at the fines system and look to tie it in with the NI system. The Government does know how much every individual in this country earns. Each person is currently banded with tax rates. I'm sure this can be turned accordingly with the fines system so that a pensioner and a low income person proportinately is fined the same.

 

And finally, I would find some system to stop a lot of the many offences that frustrate many of the otherwise law abiding road users that seem to receive the brunt of the speeding notices:

 

1 - insist an insurance docket is desplayed on the windscreen similar to the tax disc (it works fine in ROI )

2 - get the police cars that are sat on the edge of motorways looking for cars doing 90mph+ to also pull these doing 40-50mph and middle lane drivers and add points and fines to their licenses.

 

I could go on. But I hope this might give someone somewhere with some power food for though.

[iffypop 10]

Thanks for your reply

 

I cant agree on your idea of weighting punishment in favour of those with no previous convictions or low income earners : this would throw the whole idea of a fine as a speed deterrent out of the window.

 

As many low income earning kids own unneccesarily fast cars as high earners; I would hate to think that one group believed it had more of a right to bomb around street corners than another.

 

I believe the same argument could be applied to those with no previous convictions - In exceptional circumstances, might they be more likely to put their foot down hoping that they'll only get half the fine?

 

I do realise that this is taking the debate entirely out of the scope of what happened to your father,

 

I do however agree totally on your point of staggering punishment, "<15% would be say 1 point. 15-25% 3 points 25%-50%" etc, I think thats a great idea.

 

iffy

[dinp 10]

Doesnt matter if your 18 or 80, black, white, male or female and if you drive one mile or a million miles a year.

 

The speed limits apply to us all.

 

You can debate the legibility of the speed camera van and all that (as they are sneaky B*****ds IMO) but if you're caught, you're caught.