What is Secularism?

I'm religious (though not Theistic), but I am also a secularist in as much as I think politics and religion should be kept seperate, solely on the grounds of our multicultural faith, and I think that the religious should not have special priviledges in society.

What I want to know, or try to ascertain, is how far that secularism goes.

Obviously I think that religious people should be able to practice their religion within the law, but should they be allowed to practice certain aspects that give them what others may consider priviledges in the work place? Should they be allowed to wear clothing or jewellery that identifies them with a certain faith?

For example, the salat (Islamic prayer), each should take roughly five minutes, but should they be allowed to do it in work time? Bear in mind that in an average 9-5 job they should only be praying about twice during that time, and if they have a 12-1 lunch hour that would (at least in Sheffield, in February) cover one of those.

How does that compare with a smoker who is allowed out in work time to have a cigarette for example, do other secularists think that one (either one) is acceptable and not the other?

What about clothing, is religious clothing acceptable? Is it acceptable in the work place (for both jobs with and without uniform policies).

I'm just trying to ascertain if there is a uniform view or if different secularists have different levels of acceptance.

The principle of secularism is simple enough; it is that your religion should be an entirely personal matter, and the state should have nothing to do with anybody's religion.

The fine details, as you've clearly pointed out, can easily get bogged down. If a company has a uniform policy (for instance, "no jewellery") ... does someone whose religious beliefs include wearing a cross on a chain, be subject to that law or not? Should a blanket "no hat or head coverings" rule mean people cannot wear the burqa or a turban?

There are no simple, straightforward answers to such questions as you pose, and you'll find people who are perfectly willing to argue both sides, with great vehemence.

Incidentally, did you know that in Arabic there is no word equivalent to "secular," which has often caused grief when the Arabs think that people are telling them they should have an anti-religious government. Obviously secular should not mean anti-religious; it should refer to things done which are simply not relevant to any religion, like how much money do we spend on building roads what's the most effective way to provide healthcare.

The principle of secularism is simple enough; it is that your religion should be an entirely personal matter, and the state should have nothing to do with anybody's religion.

 

 

The fine details, as you've clearly pointed out, can easily get bogged down. If a company has a uniform policy (for instance, "no jewellery") ... does someone whose religious beliefs include wearing a cross on a chain, be subject to that law or not? Should a blanket "no hat or head coverings" rule mean people cannot wear the burqa or a turban?

 

There are no simple, straightforward answers to such questions as you pose, and you'll find people who are perfectly willing to argue both sides, with great vehemence.

 

 

Incidentally, did you know that in Arabic there is no word equivalent to "secular," which has often caused grief when the Arabs think that people are telling them they should have an anti-religious government. Obviously secular should not mean anti-religious; it should refer to things done which are simply not relevant to any religion, like how much money do we spend on building roads what's the most effective way to provide healthcare.

Agreed.

it is interesting you raising the Arabic point as not all Muslim countries have Sharia law, is that part of the same question though? I'm not sure?

Do religious people automatically make religious laws? Better leave that one for the time being, don't want to take my own thread O/T.

I'm just trying to ascertain if there is a uniform view or if different secularists have different levels of acceptance.

In that case your heading should read something along the lines of; 'How do secularists view secularism?'

However, sticking with the title of the thread (you already answered the question of what is secularism in your first sentence) here's the official answer;

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/secularism

In that case your heading should read something along the lines of; 'How do secularists view secularism?'

However, sticking with the title of the thread (you already answered the question of what is secularism in your first sentence) here's the official answer;

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/secularism

I know, I originally called it merely 'Secularism' but apparently that was too short so I hurriedly applied a prefix without really thinking .

Agreed.

 

it is interesting you raising the Arabic point as not all Muslim countries have Sharia law, is that part of the same question though? I'm not sure?

That wasn't particularly the reason I mentioned it, but it does point up a very sharp example of the problem a lot of people have with the very notion of "secularism;" to wit, a misguided belief that wanting a secular society means being against religion. It does not.

That wasn't particularly the reason I mentioned it, but it does point up a very sharp example of the problem a lot of people have with the very notion of "secularism;" to wit, a misguided belief that wanting a secular society means being against religion. It does not.

Like Turkey for example which has an approx 99% muslim population.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secularism_in_Turkey

The National Secular Society has a mere 7 thousand members, 3 thousand fewer than the Beano fan club; how do they get so much media attention with such a lowly position in public life/affairs?

The National Secular Society has a mere 7 thousand members, 3 thousand fewer than the Beano fan club; how do they get so much media attention with such a lowly position in public life/affairs?

Don't know, don't care, I'm not a member, that doesn't stop me being in favour of a secular society.

The National Secular Society has a mere 7 thousand members, 3 thousand fewer than the Beano fan club; how do they get so much media attention with such a lowly position in public life/affairs?

Which is completely irrelevant to the argument being made by secularists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

Don't know, don't care, I'm not a member, that doesn't stop me being in favour of a secular society.

Which is completely irrelevant to the argument being made by secularists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

It has been said that Britain is "culturally Christian" rather than overtly, or "properly" Christian, and I think thats about right, those that dont attend church(which is of course most people) know that Christian values broadly reflect their own; its not at the forefront of anyones mind, but most people are content to refer to Britain as a Christian country.

The NSS need to point me to the masses that are outraged that Britain is a Christian country, because I dont see them!

It has been said that Britain is "culturally Christian" rather than overtly, or "properly" Christian, and I think thats about right, those that dont attend church(which is of course most people) know that Christian values broadly reflect their own

"Christian values" derive from the Hammurabic Code of Law, and probably from other earlier codes of law that we don't now know about. It's therefore extremely likely that they would broadly reflect the values of the vast majority of the world!