IMPORTANT NEWS...

As previously warned, Sheffield Forum is changing to new software - view the preview here

This is scheduled for Sunday 18th Nov. The forum will be closed and unavailable an extended period of time (24-36 hours) to allow for this major transition.

Please note that some private messages will not be transferred. Therefore we strongly urge you to take manual back-ups of any important messages now.
Sheffield Forum

Cycle Lane past station

Home > Sheffield > Sheffield News & Discussions

Reply To Topic
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
26-06-2018, 11:13   #21
Rhyno
Registered User
 
Joined: May 2018
Total Posts: 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin C View Post
Although there are many more considerate/intelligent cyclists who do slow down when passing this exit I'd definitely agree that there's still a serious accident risk here given the speed at which the more 'entitled' cyclists pass by.
This is the thing, in a nutshell.

Most pedestrians/cyclists/ car drivers rub along just fine together. The challenge is to try to reign in those in each category that think that the roads belong to them alone.
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 11:35   #22
RootsBooster
Registered User
RootsBooster's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Location: Something, something, danger zone?
Total Posts: 11,161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyno View Post
It would be quite silly to place multiple large lumps of Play Dough on a cycle path. The almondy smell would be unpleasant too.

Maybe better to return to the real world. What if the 200lb block of Play Dough was to be replaced by a child in a push chair? In such a circumstance, would you expect a cyclist to be in sufficient control of their vehicle that they would not plough into the child?
Your single child in a push chair would be easily avoidable. Unfortunately the cycle lanes tend to have numerous pedestrians wandering in all directions across them, making it much more of an obstacle course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyno View Post
City centres are shared spaces not race tracks for bikes, or cars.
I believe this is why we have footpaths, cycle paths and roads. Nobody should be racing (or travelling too fast to be in control of their vehicle), but that's not even possible anyway, if there's pedestrians all over the cycle paths.
_______
I tried getting blood out of a stone once, it was like trying to get a straight answer from a theist.

"No shoe can steal my secrets. They were just shoes" -Pilot
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 12:43   #23
barleycorn
Registered User
barleycorn's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2011
Total Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by teecee75 View Post
Pedestrians always have the right of way, phones or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RootsBooster View Post
What makes you so sure about that?
He's sort of right, but also very, very wrong. Right of way doesn't mean what many people think it does. Simply, it means you have the right to use a particular thoroughfare. For example, cars have right of way on motorways but not on footpaths, bikes have right of way on cycle paths but not motorways.
What we do operate is a system of give way and priority at junctions etc. You should always give way if it helps to avoid an incident.
In the case in hand where you have pedestrians in the cycle lane they do no have the right of way to be there, but if they are you do have to give way. You don't have the right to just plow into them.
_______
Reality is not based on definitions or word associations or quotes from a book. Reality is what you have after all the books have been put away and you keep your mouth shut. You don't need language to know reality. Anything that requires language to make itself known is not reality but the artifice of words, simply word associations, predicates on paper that can nowhere else be seen.

Last edited by barleycorn; 26-06-2018 at 12:45.
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 12:56   #24
Rhyno
Registered User
 
Joined: May 2018
Total Posts: 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by barleycorn View Post
He's sort of right, but also very, very wrong. Right of way doesn't mean what many people think it does. Simply, it means you have the right to use a particular thoroughfare. For example, cars have right of way on motorways but not on footpaths, bikes have right of way on cycle paths but not motorways.
What we do operate is a system of give way and priority at junctions etc. You should always give way if it helps to avoid an incident.
In the case in hand where you have pedestrians in the cycle lane they do no have the right of way to be there, but if they are you do have to give way. You don't have the right to just plow into them.
All of which is correct and sensible, apart from one detail. There is no law preventing pedestrians from being in a cycle lane. They have a perfect right to be there. Whether it is sensible, or reasonable for them to be there, is another matter.
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 13:42   #25
barleycorn
Registered User
barleycorn's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2011
Total Posts: 4,595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyno View Post
All of which is correct and sensible, apart from one detail. There is no law preventing pedestrians from being in a cycle lane. They have a perfect right to be there. Whether it is sensible, or reasonable for them to be there, is another matter.
That depends, cycle tracks may or may not have a right of way for pedestrians, it would depend upon the TRO. (HA 329)
_______
Reality is not based on definitions or word associations or quotes from a book. Reality is what you have after all the books have been put away and you keep your mouth shut. You don't need language to know reality. Anything that requires language to make itself known is not reality but the artifice of words, simply word associations, predicates on paper that can nowhere else be seen.

Last edited by barleycorn; 26-06-2018 at 13:44.
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 15:18   #26
fling
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: S12
Total Posts: 586
Quote:
Originally Posted by raganoonande View Post
What about the cyclists that fly past the doors at the back of the train station! It really shocks me sometimes, I've nearly been knocked flying as I've emerged out those doors near the tram stop! I mean surely it just takes a bit of common sense that there might actually be people coming out of there and that those on bikes should try and slow down or dismount for a couple of seconds! Really!
But surely a pedestrian emerging through the doors should also check to see if there any cyclists coming in much the same manner that a car driver should check to see if anything is coming when pulling out of a junction.
  Reply With Quote
26-06-2018, 16:06   #27
Annie Bynnol
Registered User
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Total Posts: 2,475
Quote:
Originally Posted by fling View Post
But surely a pedestrian emerging through the doors should also check to see if there any cyclists coming in much the same manner that a car driver should check to see if anything is coming when pulling out of a junction.
Trying to negotiate yourself, your family and your baggage through the doors, past other users and the smoking rail staff is hard enough without the unexpected presence on the footway of cyclists.

There is no visibility of the footway until you are on the footway. So even if you were pre-warned you would have to stop and look.

When walking out of the doors of any other building in Sheffield onto a fenced off 5' wide footpath you not expect cyclists at speed.
  Reply With Quote
27-06-2018, 07:47   #28
Cyclone
Registered User
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Wadlsey
Total Posts: 72,004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyno View Post
Then you need to ride with more care, remembering that it is you that is the danger, not the pedestrian. The pedestrian is simply a more vulnerable road user. Please treat them as such.

As you clearly need it, let me pass on a tip, based upon my 30 years of accident free driving and cycling. If you cannot stop within your field of vision, you are going too fast.
Clearly my cycling is fine, I haven't yet run into one of these idiot pedestrians who walk in the cycle lane.
That doesn't justify their behaviour though does it, which is what you're attempting to do.
Funny that you call them a 'road user' when I'm talking about an off road cycle lane though.
As you clearly need it, here's a tip. Don't jump to conclusions, it'll make you look (more) foolish.
_______
Ask yourself, what would Chuck Norris do?
Youtube videos, snowboarding, climbing, bad drivers.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmn...qpXEZMGnJHf3Wg
  Reply With Quote
27-06-2018, 09:11   #29
Resident
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Total Posts: 4,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone View Post
Pedestrians aren't supposed to use cycle lanes, and obviously I do pass them safely, but they're still a danger, because they're not supposed to be there at all.
Care to link us to the specific law in which pedestrians are not allowed in a cycle lane?

No?

The argument meant of 'pedestrians shouldn't be in cycle lanes, they're for cyclists' is the same as 'cyclists shouldn't be on the road, they're for cars'

And what do you say to that latter argument?

Hypocrisy thy name is Cyclone....
_______
As a child I had an imaginary friend, then I grew up and stopped going to church.
  Reply With Quote
27-06-2018, 10:50   #30
RootsBooster
Registered User
RootsBooster's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Location: Something, something, danger zone?
Total Posts: 11,161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resident View Post
Care to link us to the specific law in which pedestrians are not allowed in a cycle lane?

No?

The argument meant of 'pedestrians shouldn't be in cycle lanes, they're for cyclists' is the same as 'cyclists shouldn't be on the road, they're for cars'

And what do you say to that latter argument?

Hypocrisy thy name is Cyclone....
I think you're mistaking Cyclone's "shouldn't" for "mustn't"

To my knowledge he hasn't claimed or implied that pedestrians cannot or must not use cycle paths, merely that they should not.
_______
I tried getting blood out of a stone once, it was like trying to get a straight answer from a theist.

"No shoe can steal my secrets. They were just shoes" -Pilot
  Reply With Quote
27-06-2018, 11:03   #31
WalkleyIan
Registered User
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Walkley
Total Posts: 1,404
Quote:
Originally Posted by teecee75 View Post
Pedestrians always have the right of way, phones or not.
Good luck with that.

Just been waiting at a crossing by the University. 3 of us hear the ambulance coming. We decide despite having a green man, that stepping out in front of an ambulance on a call might not be the cleverest thing to do

Unfortunately, the 4th guy was fully wired into his earbuds looks up from the phone, see's the green and steps straight out in front of it. Emergency stop from the driver and I just hope anyone in the back was well strapped down.

And before you say "Chinese students" this was a white bloke in his 40s
  Reply With Quote
28-06-2018, 07:55   #32
Cyclone
Registered User
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Wadlsey
Total Posts: 72,004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Resident View Post
Care to link us to the specific law in which pedestrians are not allowed in a cycle lane?

No?
Care to not answer your strawman, you're right, I won't.
I didn't claim they "aren't allowed".
Quote:

The argument meant of 'pedestrians shouldn't be in cycle lanes, they're for cyclists' is the same as 'cyclists shouldn't be on the road, they're for cars'
It's not though is it. Roads are for vehicles, including cycles. Cycle lanes are for CYCLES, the clue is in the name.
Perhaps you call roads 'car lanes'? I imagine that gets some funny looks though.
Quote:

And what do you say to that latter argument?

Hypocrisy thy name is Cyclone....
Nope, no hypocrisy is there. Made yourself look quite silly though didn't you.

---------- Post added 28-06-2018 at 07:57 ----------

For what it's worth though, someone persistently walking along the length of the road (one which has traffic, not an abandoned country lane) would shortly be having a chat with a policeman wouldn't they.
_______
Ask yourself, what would Chuck Norris do?
Youtube videos, snowboarding, climbing, bad drivers.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmn...qpXEZMGnJHf3Wg
  Reply With Quote
28-06-2018, 15:11   #33
ShineOnLeith
Registered User
ShineOnLeith's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2018
Total Posts: 2
Yeah the clue is in the name much the same as it is in PEDESTRIAN area ie the Moor or Fargate and FOOTpath but we're still expected to look both ways when leaving a building in case of speeding cyclists. Us mere pedestrians have lost 3 bus stops behind Debenhams to accommodate a RARELY used cycle path.
  Reply With Quote
28-06-2018, 21:57   #34
WarPig
Registered User
WarPig's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Total Posts: 1,209
I cycle along the cycle lane across from the train station almost every day. The problem is that its not obviously clear that its a cycle lane, despite the block paving being a pinkish colour. Its also not entirely clear whether the pink part of the pavement is the cycle lane or the foot path. I know there are signs on posts along the route, but pedestrians are usually too busy talking or looking at the floor to notice the signs.

I just ride with a bit more care as I weave through the pedestrians who are walking in both the cycle lane and the foot path. its not difficult.
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 08:10   #35
Cyclone
Registered User
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Wadlsey
Total Posts: 72,004
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShineOnLeith View Post
Yeah the clue is in the name much the same as it is in PEDESTRIAN area ie the Moor or Fargate and FOOTpath but we're still expected to look both ways when leaving a building in case of speeding cyclists. Us mere pedestrians have lost 3 bus stops behind Debenhams to accommodate a RARELY used cycle path.
I'm not sure if you have a point, but whatever it is I didn't follow it.

I haven't made an argument for cycles on busy footpaths at speed, nor for more cycle lanes.
_______
Ask yourself, what would Chuck Norris do?
Youtube videos, snowboarding, climbing, bad drivers.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmn...qpXEZMGnJHf3Wg
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 09:27   #36
Resident
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Total Posts: 4,271
There's a simple solution. It's less than 100yrds.

Dismount and walk when it's busy
_______
As a child I had an imaginary friend, then I grew up and stopped going to church.
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 09:28   #37
Cyclone
Registered User
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Wadlsey
Total Posts: 72,004
Car drivers can't slow down to safely overtake for a few seconds, but you expect cyclists to dismount and walk.
_______
Ask yourself, what would Chuck Norris do?
Youtube videos, snowboarding, climbing, bad drivers.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmn...qpXEZMGnJHf3Wg
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 11:46   #38
Rhyno
Registered User
 
Joined: May 2018
Total Posts: 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone View Post
Car drivers can't slow down to safely overtake for a few seconds, but you expect cyclists to dismount and walk.
It might be the best way to avoid causing an accident.

That makes it a very sensible thing to do. It is only 100 yards, after all.
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 16:30   #39
Cyclone
Registered User
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2004
Location: Wadlsey
Total Posts: 72,004
I'm a motorists as well, duh, and when driving I find it possible to overtake safely. And a pedestrian, and when walking I find it possible to avoid walking in dedicated cycle lanes, or indeed the road.
_______
Ask yourself, what would Chuck Norris do?
Youtube videos, snowboarding, climbing, bad drivers.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmn...qpXEZMGnJHf3Wg
  Reply With Quote
29-06-2018, 21:28   #40
Annie Bynnol
Registered User
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Total Posts: 2,475
Is cycling permitted on the Granville Street footway outside the station (tram side)?
There are no signs at either end (on the Shrewsbury Road footway or the A61 ramp or on Park Square walkways) or signs on Granville Street indicating a shared or divided path.
  Reply With Quote
Reply To Topic

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 19:28.
POSTS ON THIS FORUM ARE NOT ACTIVELY MONITORED
Click "Report Post" under any post which may breach our terms of use.
©2002-2017 Sheffield Forum | Powered by vBulletin ©2018