Advice please on turning from Rutland Road to Penistone Road

Markings aren't there on Google Maps, have they been painted recently?

The markings are there

The key is the LACK of a marking separating the nearside two lanes to make it clear which lane traffic entering from Rutlend Way should take.

It would be a confusing junction if the road was marked in 3 lanes all the way across

If you look on google maps, there are two trucks stopped at those lights - as there are no lane markings on the road in front of them, by the same principle could they both not cut each other up on the basis that it's one big lane?

Well anyone could cut anyone up if they choose to road markings or not. Its only a short break in road markings for a junction which is pretty common, and for drivers on Penistone Road the road layout is not changing, it was already 3 lanes and continues to be three lanes - nothing to cause any confusion there.

Markings aren't there on Google Maps, have they been painted recently?

Squiggs beat me to it but yes the markings are on Penistone road and yes you can see them on google streetview.

I am surprised that a few white dashes have not been put down to show drivers on Rutland Road where they can go, then again some people would ignore them anyway/not understand what they mean and then still argue they were correct when its pointed out to them.

Can someone shed some light on the following ;

 

at the bottom of Rutland Rd past the Wickes... when you turn left onto Penistone Rd..

 

The road changes from 2 lanes on rutland rd to 3 then 100m laters 4 on Penistone rd.

 

so from rutland rd can you tell me if you was in lane 1 on Rutland Rd which lane should you go in to on Penistone Rd without having to indicate a lane change...

 

also same for lane 2....

 

Thanks

I use this route everyday and see so many people confused over the lanes.....if your in the left lane on the bottom of Rutland you can go into either lane 1 or 2 on penistone road, this leaves the right lane on Rutland to go into lane 3 then 4 on pristine road.

Hope this helps

I would assume the left hand lane on Rutland Road would have to stay in lane 1, and the right lane on Rutland Road would get priority of the middle or the 3rd lane as the 3rd lane is also a turning lane - on itself back onto Langsett Road.

I'd agree with that.

---------- Post added 21-11-2017 at 20:06 ----------

Left hand lane for first 2 lanes and right hand lane for last 2 lanes on penistone rd

There are only 3 lanes at that point, not 4.

---------- Post added 21-11-2017 at 20:09 ----------

The road markings on Penistone Road show that if joining from the inside lane of Rutland road then either the inside or middle lane of Pensitone Road are to be used - note the missing white line dividing lane one and two, yet it is present for lane three - for the dimwitted this means outside lane is for joining lane three only.

 

99% of driver realise this and ive never seen anyone doing anything else, maybe they need some definite lane markings to help incompetent 1%.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.3913552,-1.4802002,3a,75y,205.87h,80.2t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCzf6jSGv_Y3AvTaaoCC1OQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

This view?

You think makes it clear that RR lane 1 can be used to go to PR lanes 1/2, and RR L2 = PR L3?

I can see why you might think that was correct, but I think this is an opinion, not particularly supported by any highway code or legislation.

---------- Post added 21-11-2017 at 20:10 ----------

That's fine, because it'll be the one making the illegal manoeuvre into a different lane whilst going through a junction that will be found at fault.

 

Looking on Google maps, street view, technically as the last poster said (something about being a dimwit, the 1% that can't have a decent conversation) there aren't any white lines as you join, just a double wide left hand lane and a right had lane which are clearly split with white lines.

 

So it only becomes a three lanes again further down the road where the bus stop is.

 

So the left hand lane traffic is staying in the left hand lane, and the right in the right, as there are only two divided lanes as you turn left.

Looking from overhead though it appears that the white lines are just really badly worn and faded.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Rutland+Rd,+Sheffield+S3+9PR/@53.3917848,-1.4794318,122a,35y,205.87h,45t/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x4879786300694861:0x282cff0d026f90a!8m2!3d53.3949034!4d-1.4737234

To the point of not being visible between lanes 1/2.

---------- Post added 21-11-2017 at 20:13 ----------

Complete BS.

You only ever indicate if its likely to cause another user to change their course.

No, you simply shouldn't maneuver if it will result in another driver having to change course or speed.

You should indicate if there is anyone who will be interested.

You should not indicate if there's no one (including pedestrians and cyclists) to indicate to.

The markings are there

 

The key is the LACK of a marking separating the nearside two lanes to make it clear which lane traffic entering from Rutlend Way should take.

 

It would be a confusing junction if the road was marked in 3 lanes all the way across

My interpretation of that (presumably deliberate) lack of separation of the nearside two lanes is the opposite of yours. Road markings are generally missing where people from a side road would otherwise cross them. It is my understanding that you shouldn't cross road markings while going through a junction.

This is best view i can get, just before the white lines separating lane 1 and 2 start again.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.3910867,-1.4801839,3a,75y,325.7h,59.7t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4Pz3Ku-T9RPIiA8TVSp_0A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

White line is purposefully missing separating lane one and two, so joining traffic should in effect treat it as two lanes, meaning outside lane on Rutland must joining the outside lane on Penistone.

If Traffic in the outside lane of Rutland Road were supposed to go into either lane 2 or 3 then the markings would be the other way around, ie no white lines between lane 2 and 3.

Its a 2 lane junction meeting a 3 lane road so one lane must go into two lanes, it may not be as clear to see in person, looking at streetview makes it pretty clear.

My interpretation of that (presumably deliberate) lack of separation of the nearside two lanes is the opposite of yours. Road markings are generally missing where people from a side road would otherwise cross them. It is my understanding that you shouldn't cross road markings while going through a junction.

That would mean that you couldn't turn right out of most junctions.

Here's the response from SCC's Transport Planning people:

Morning Bob

Thank you for your enquiry regarding the junction of Rutland Road/Penistone Road.

We have checked this junction and have notified Streetsahead to assess the maintenance levels as we believe that some road markings have suffered from fading and need relining.

It is apparent that lane 3 (offside) on Penistone Road is for the right turn to Infirmary Road and that the lane marking between this and lane 2 (centre lane) should extend back into the junction, such that any vehicle emerging from lane 2 (offside lane) of Rutland Road would have to cross this lane line to enter lane 3 of Penistone Road.

Both lanes on Rutland Road are clearly marked as left hand lanes and any driver emerging should be aware that they might be turning left alongside another vehicle. In the absence of contrary information, a driver should keep to the same traffic lane as they are in, so lane 1 to lane 1 and lane 2 to lane 2. People in lane 2 then have the option to move to lane 3.

We are aware that there is a heavy left turn traffic movement from Penistone Road into Rutland Road. Also that a lot of drivers, travelling ahead, change from lane 2 to lane 1 as they leave the junction and this is responsible for the lane markings being constantly worn.

We do not have any plans to install additional road markings at this junction but as above will ask Streetsahead to maintain existing lines as soon as possible.

They've immediately got it wrong, lane 3 on PR is not for a right turn to IR. There is a separate 4th lane that appears about 25 metres beyond the junction which is the right turn filter lane. Lane 3 on PR at the point of RR and slightly beyond is marked for ahead and right by arrows on the road.

They've immediately got it wrong, lane 3 on PR is not for a right turn to IR. There is a separate 4th lane that appears about 25 metres beyond the junction which is the right turn filter lane. Lane 3 on PR at the point of RR and slightly beyond is marked for ahead and right by arrows on the road.

I took it as meaning you need to take lane 3 if you want (shortly after) to go to Infirmary Lane via lane 4. Obviously one can go ahead in lane 3 also.

It goes on though

"Both lanes on Rutland Road are clearly marked as left hand lanes"

Do they mean left turn lanes? There is no such thing as a marking for a left hand lane. But the fact that they're both left turn lanes isn't in question, it's which lane is the correct one to enter on PR.

---------- Post added 22-11-2017 at 14:16 ----------

This does seem clear though

" In the absence of contrary information, a driver should keep to the same traffic lane as they are in, so lane 1 to lane 1 and lane 2 to lane 2. People in lane 2 then have the option to move to lane 3."

Here's the response from SCC's Transport Planning people:

 

Morning Bob

 

Thank you for your enquiry regarding the junction of Rutland Road/Penistone Road.

 

We have checked this junction and have notified Streetsahead to assess the maintenance levels as we believe that some road markings have suffered from fading and need relining.

 

It is apparent that lane 3 (offside) on Penistone Road is for the right turn to Infirmary Road and that the lane marking between this and lane 2 (centre lane) should extend back into the junction, such that any vehicle emerging from lane 2 (offside lane) of Rutland Road would have to cross this lane line to enter lane 3 of Penistone Road.

 

Both lanes on Rutland Road are clearly marked as left hand lanes and any driver emerging should be aware that they might be turning left alongside another vehicle. In the absence of contrary information, a driver should keep to the same traffic lane as they are in, so lane 1 to lane 1 and lane 2 to lane 2. People in lane 2 then have the option to move to lane 3.

 

We are aware that there is a heavy left turn traffic movement from Penistone Road into Rutland Road. Also that a lot of drivers, travelling ahead, change from lane 2 to lane 1 as they leave the junction and this is responsible for the lane markings being constantly worn.

 

We do not have any plans to install additional road markings at this junction but as above will ask Streetsahead to maintain existing lines as soon as possible.

Id be happy to be proved wrong however that answer doesn't really make any sense, simple fact is for drivers emerging from Rutland road they are only two marked lanes not three.

If you had never seen the junction before and were driving it for the first time the road markings show what lanes drivers can use.