The Labour Party. All discussion here please

You are right with those last four words . Any comment on the things posted above ?

What, another Corbyn bashing piece in the Daily Mail? Gosh, you do surprise me...

What, another Corbyn bashing piece in the Daily Mail? Gosh, you do surprise me...

No the comments / questions on this forum . Stop being so outraged / defensive . And if that paper offends you so much , stop reading it

If he doesn't build subs the headline will be 'Corbyn puts thousands out of work.'

If he does build subs he'll be accused of being a hypocrite. So he can't win.

No he's a politician, compromises have to made - although with the nuclear thing if he was REALLY principled, he'd have binned the lot, instead he decided if he was in charge he'd cough all the money to keep the unions/daily mail happy then tell the world he wouldn't use them. But his followers (not him to be fair) build him up as this whiter than white, do no wrong, principled man of the people they leave him no room to get on with the grubby world of politics, which, quite frankly, he's not very good at.

Let's put if this way, if tony Blair put forward broadly the same set of policies, would you vote for him?

Get someone else in who can actually win and do a bit of good.

Let's not forget that he came within an ace of winning in 2017 after what had to be the most concerted and sustained campaign against him from both within and outside his own party.

If he survives this current onslaught he is well placed to win the next election for Labour.

And yes, compromises do have to be made and the only one that matters a jot at the moment is Brexit.

Let's not forget that he came within an ace of winning in 2017 after what had to be the most concerted and sustained campaign against him from both within and outside his own party.

 

If he survives this current onslaught he is well placed to win the next election for Labour.

 

And yes, compromises do have to be made and the only one that matters a jot at the moment is Brexit.

He came within an ace of winning against the current Conservative party.

Let that sink in.

He came within an ace of winning against the current Conservative party.

 

Let that sink in.

That says it all and I can say that as a tory voter

He came within an ace of winning against the current Conservative party.

 

No, he came within an ace of winning against the former Conservative Party which was confident, buoyant and going in for the kill on the back of high poll ratings.

The current Conservative Party is completely hamstrung by its commitment to a Brexit which is unachievable and riven by two factions whose aspirations are totally incompatible. It is almost certain that pre Brexit, in the immediate aftermath of a Corbyn victory there would have been a run on the pound but what more people need to realise is that now, a victory by a Corbyn-led Labour Party promising to immediately reverse Article 50 would probably give sterling the biggest boost ever seen in its history.

No he's a politician, compromises have to made - although with the nuclear thing if he was REALLY principled, he'd have binned the lot, instead he decided if he was in charge he'd cough all the money to keep the unions/daily mail happy then tell the world he wouldn't use them. But his followers (not him to be fair) build him up as this whiter than white, do no wrong, principled man of the people they leave him no room to get on with the grubby world of politics, which, quite frankly, he's not very good at.

 

Let's put if this way, if tony Blair put forward broadly the same set of policies, would you vote for him?

Yes I probably would, the policies are the thing, I would have loved Blair to put them forward, but Blair never did, did he? And never would. He preferred to align himself with Tories rather than the people. Then there's the question of whether I would trust Blair to try and follow them through? Probably not, after all what's in it for him...?

The problem with Corbyn's 'followers' though, is they rarely get the opportunity to discuss the policies, which they would be more than happy to do. They are too busy constantly being put into a position of having to put the record straight, and defend him against some ridiculous, even libellous lies and allegations deliberately cooked up in the media. One could almost imagine it was a deliberate ploy to stop his policies being discussed, and it seems to work.

Corbyn is a pragmatist, willing to discuss things to achieve the best outcome, and capable of compromise, but I have confidence that Corbyn will try his damnedest to do what he says he will do for the benefit of the people, who are the real strength of this country..

No, he came within an ace of winning against the former Conservative Party which was confident, buoyant and going in for the kill on the back of high poll ratings.

 

The current Conservative Party is completely hamstrung by its commitment to a Brexit which is unachievable and riven by two factions whose aspirations are totally incompatible. It is almost certain that pre Brexit, in the immediate aftermath of a Corbyn victory there would have been a run on the pound but what more people need to realise is that now, a victory by a Corbyn-led Labour Party promising to immediately reverse Article 50 would probably give sterling the biggest boost ever seen in its history.

Your recollection of the Tories at the last election differs from mine I recall May literally hiding away, open goal doesn't describe it. Anna might have point, the right wing press helped May alot - they helped get brexit. It makes sense to me for the Labour party to get someone more media savvy. Wont happen though.

Corbyn is in no better position to reverse brexit than May is - it's old Labour heartlands that voted for it in big numbers. Can he afford to blow them all off or is he confident that l-vote-labour-cos-me-dad-did is still prevalent in such communities?

And doesn't it go against his eurosceptic principles? Or is he pro brexit? It's hard to keep up!

Can he afford to blow them all off or is he confident that l-vote-labour-cos-me-dad-did is still prevalent in such communities?

 

And doesn't it go against his eurosceptic principles? Or is he pro brexit? It's hard to keep up!

What people tend to forget is that in most of those pro Brexit communities the majority of Labour supporters voted Remain. Yes, Corbyn will lose the 'conservative' traditional Labour supporters in some of these constituencies but they will be replaced by anti Brexit real Conservative voters as well as many Lib Dem and Green supporters voting tactically. The next election will be fought on Brexit and no other issue.

Corbyn's Euroscepticism comes from the left view that the EU is basically a capitalist club which it undoubtedly is. However, after years of Thatcher's, then Blair's deregulated, free market experiment, British workers' rights are being protected by the UK's membership of this 'capitalist club' which mitigates against the worst effects of the Conservative/New Labour unfettered capitalism. And in the absence of a European socialist revolution will remain so.

Corbyn's Euroscepticism is a tactical view rather than a core principle like his pacifism and his anti racism and shouldn't be set in stone.

Your recollection of the Tories at the last election differs from mine I recall May literally hiding away, open goal doesn't describe it. Anna might have point, the right wing press helped May alot - they helped get brexit. It makes sense to me for the Labour party to get someone more media savvy. Wont happen though.

 

Corbyn is in no better position to reverse brexit than May is - it's old Labour heartlands that voted for it in big numbers. Can he afford to blow them all off or is he confident that l-vote-labour-cos-me-dad-did is still prevalent in such communities?

 

And doesn't it go against his eurosceptic principles? Or is he pro brexit? It's hard to keep up!

How media savvy would you have to be to withstand the full force of the Establishment? Blair survived by being one of them, not by doing what was right.

The Establishment took down Michael Foot, Neil Kinnock and Ed Milliband in much the same way; slurs, ridicule, guilt by association, character assassination; they simply aren't going to let 'a man of the people' who threatens their cosy agenda and croneyism, win.

This is modern day democracy for you. Put all the power and influence in the same hands of the rich and influential, and what do you expect? They aren't going to give it up easily for the benefit of a nation of 'oiks.' Sure, they might let the odd Blair creature do their bidding for a change, just for appearances sake, but he will do nothing for the people.

I believe we are at a tipping point in the democratic process. The media, by and large, have given up any pretence of even handedness, and are simply the mouthpiece and PR machine of the Establishment, (which is why Corbyn has fought his campaigns largely online, and why he is predominantly more popular with the young.) However I, for one, object to having our governments elected by the likes of the Daily Mail.

The world has undergone a fundamental shift since the financial crash. The big money and the power are all going one way and not 'trickling down.' We are moving into uncharted and unstable new times with regards jobs, money, the environment, expectations and deep divisions in society. We need new ideas, new ways of doing things.

Bread and Circuses just doesn't cut it any more. If we lose the next election, I think we can give up hope of the ordinary men and women of this country (and the wider world,) ever getting a fair deal. 'Austerity,' and worse, will become the norm for most, and more and more will find themselves living off the crumbs from the table.

Robotics and AI will also radically change the way western societies function. Big news giants like The BBC, Guardian and virtually every university has banned right-wingers from even talking on their campuses. Then there is thousands of left-leaning political you-tube commentators peddling half-truths, selective info and stats to propel their Marxist agenda.