ncee   10 #1 Posted June 29, 2018 I have been looking for a used set of stainless cutlery in Kings pattern. In my searching I have noticed Arthur Price hollow handled knives have different markings and wonder if someone can enlighten me? I have seen 5 stars, 3 stars, 2 stars and another marked Arthur Price International with 0 stars. Do these markings signify different grades of quality in the blades or handles? Or do they use the same quality Sheffield steel blades in all their hollow handled knives? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
lazarus   68 #2 Posted June 29, 2018 (edited) They are all the same, the handles on the knives are all the same gauge, spoon and fork marked 18/8 are the best. Japanese cutlery is inferior to real Sheffield made items, I suppose Arthur Price are no different to other company's who import loads of Japanese, Korean and African items and just mark them with their own names. When I was in the industry Arthur Price didn't have a good name. If you want a bargain, go to Sheffield Scene on Surrey Street where you can buy a quality S/S place setting for under ten pounds. Edited June 29, 2018 by lazarus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
ncee   10 #3 Posted June 30, 2018 Thank you Lazarus. Apart from a general interest as to why the different star markings, I wanted to know the quality of the knife blades in a set of Arthur Price International 18/10 Stainless 50year guarantee cutlery. The knives in the set I am looking at are hollow handled. But are they made from Sheffield high carbon steel that will retain its edge for a lifetime? I think that's what you are saying, but want to be sure. I am unable to inspect the set personally for the same reason I cannot pop down to Sheffield Scene - I'm in Australia! I am very grateful for your help. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
lazarus   68 #4 Posted June 30, 2018 Thank you Lazarus. Apart from a general interest as to why the different star markings, I wanted to know the quality of the knife blades in a set of Arthur Price International 18/10 Stainless 50year guarantee cutlery. The knives in the set I am looking at are hollow handled. But are they made from Sheffield high carbon steel that will retain its edge for a lifetime? I think that's what you are saying, but want to be sure. I am unable to inspect the set personally for the same reason I cannot pop down to Sheffield Scene - I'm in Australia! I am very grateful for your help. I'm sure that no blades are made in Sheffield any more, the last manufacturer who produced 1st class blanks was Jessop and Smiths and they closed s few years ago, they all seem to be imported now, stainless steel does not retain its cutting edge mainly because of the steels makeup, you have to keep sharpening them, that's why there's so many serrated knives now but after saying that it's usually a very poor Serrate that's put on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
ncee   10 #5 Posted July 1, 2018 Thank you again Lazarus. This set I'm considering was manufactured between 1999 and 2007 when the Arthur Price International range was discontinued. The set was produced overseas, so I guess the blades would have been manufactured overseas rather than Sheffield blades being sent over for assembly and finishing. Question is are the blades now imported of equivalent quality higher carbon steel and retain the cutting edge? Surely they wouldn't put stainless steel blades into a hollow handle? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
lazarus   68 #6 Posted July 1, 2018 (edited) Thank you again Lazarus. This set I'm considering was manufactured between 1999 and 2007 when the Arthur Price International range was discontinued. The set was produced overseas, so I guess the blades would have been manufactured overseas rather than Sheffield blades being sent over for assembly and finishing. Question is are the blades now imported of equivalent quality higher carbon steel and retain the cutting edge? Surely they wouldn't put stainless steel blades into a hollow handle? Right, quality knives always had hollow handles, whether silver, EPNS or stainless, that's apart from Xylophone, Pearl, Stag, Wood etc., the blades are cemented together in a process called saurising, then they either go in a oven or through a a tank of hot water to start the cement to cure, it's not cement as you know it, the set you mention would have been produced in Japan then shipped to England and then the Arthur Price name will have been etched on the blades and perhaps roller marked on the spoon and fork. The blades are inferior to what was produced in Sheffield when Jessop and Smiths were forging them, towards the end of my working life I spent the last ten years at a firm called David Mellors and probably three years befor I left the had a black handled kitchen range of knives made in China, they were very well made in every respect but the only mark put on the blades was David Mellor, in doing this they were inferring they were made at the factory in Hathersage in Derbyshire, no mention of where these items were actually made. The items were bought by Mellors for up to $5 then sold for up to £60 each a very big mark up. Edited July 1, 2018 by lazarus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
gluedtopc   10 #7 Posted July 1, 2018 Right, quality knives always had hollow handles, whether silver, EPNS or stainless, that's apart from Xylophone, Pearl, Stag, Wood etc., the blades are cemented together in a process called saurising, then they either go in a oven or through a a tank of hot water to start the cement to cure, it's not cement as you know it, the set you mention would have been produced in Japan then shipped to England and then the Arthur Price name will have been etched on the blades and perhaps roller marked on the spoon and fork. The blades are inferior to what was produced in Sheffield when Jessop and Smiths were forging them, towards the end of my working life I spent the last ten years at a firm called David Mellors and probably three years befor I left the had a black handled kitchen range of knives made in China, they were very well made in every respect but the only mark put on the blades was David Mellor, in doing this they were inferring they were made at the factory in Hathersage in Derbyshire, no mention of where these items were actually made. The items were bought by Mellors for up to $5 then sold for up to £60 each a very big mark up. Surely there’s still a market for proper Sheffield cutlery, even if it’s quite costly? Is it a case of there’s no- one around any more with the necessary skills ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
ncee   10 #8 Posted July 2, 2018 Thanks Lazarus, So to summarize all the above, if I bought this set of Arthur Price International, I would get high carbon steel blade knives that would hold their cutting edge. However, it is likely that they would not hold their edge as well and may develop other problems (pitting, breakage?) when compared to the Sheffield produced blades. Is that a fair summary? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
lazarus   68 #9 Posted July 2, 2018 (edited) Surely there’s still a market for proper Sheffield cutlery, even if it’s quite costly? Is it a case of there’s no- one around any more with the necessary skills ? There is a market for good quality cutlery but you can count the makers on one hand, British Silverware, Carrs are just two of them but their work is expensive unfortunately.  ---------- Post added 02-07-2018 at 20:33 ----------  Thanks Lazarus, So to summarize all the above, if I bought this set of Arthur Price International, I would get high carbon steel blade knives that would hold their cutting edge. However, it is likely that they would not hold their edge as well and may develop other problems (pitting, breakage?) when compared to the Sheffield produced blades. Is that a fair summary? No stainless steel knife blades hold a cutting edge no matter how much they cost, they always need sharpening, they won't break and if you get some kind of pitting or what looks like rust spots that's because the blade has been scorched during the grinding process, this scorching alters the molecules that make up the steel and allows rust to form. Even cheap cutlery made in Sheffield can suffer scorching in grinding but good quality knife blades are very rarely scorched, I myself handled over 1.5 million knife blades in my time and not one was ever scorched by our grinding department. We could have a great chat face to face about cutlery. Edited July 2, 2018 by lazarus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
ncee   10 #10 Posted July 3, 2018 Right, quality knives always had hollow handles, whether silver, EPNS or stainless....  When you say quality knives, you mean knives with high carbon blades, don't you?  That is, no hollow handled knives would have stainless blades?  Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
lazarus   68 #11 Posted July 3, 2018 When you say quality knives, you mean knives with high carbon blades, don't you? That is, no hollow handled knives would have stainless blades?  Thanks I'm sorry but this is getting nowhere, ALL HOLLOW HANDLES KNIVES HAVE STAINLESS BLADES, I don't know the exact steel recipe for s/s blades but under. Electron microscope the foreign blades have a marked difference in their make up, it's the chrome content that gives s/s its unique properties. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
ncee   10 #12 Posted July 4, 2018 Yes, I now understand. I appreciate your time and patience Lazarus. Thank you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...