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17-05-2018, 11:38   #1
tinfoilhat
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I've not called it a mega thread as I genuinely don't think it will last that long. I've looked at the squad and it's got a bit of promise but there are still the same old mistakes - square pegs in round holes (walker) and players short of form and fitness (welbeck). There are plenty of concerns but he key thing for me as the lack of variety. There's not much difference in Ali or lingard, there's less difference between dier and Henderson - two players who will play sideways rather than forward, which result in the likes of Ali coming back to fetch the ball leaving Kane insolated - I can see it all now. Wilshire and shelvey - for all their faults give a different option and look to pass it forward and we have Livermore ahead of those two.

Now I'm less of a "glass half empty" sort of person and more "glass has fallen off the table and smashed to pieces and there's water everywhere" sort of person but I see two 0-0 and a loss to Belgium.
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17-05-2018, 13:04   #2
Longcol
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Looking at the squad it seems almost certain he's looking at playing 3 at the back plus 2 wing backs, 3 in midfield and 2 up front - and agree with tinfoilhat - far too much sideways passing - although that seems to have been the case of just about every England team for a good 30 years or more.
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17-05-2018, 13:09   #3
parkydave
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Yes tend to agree with you two on this but lets hope we can stay in competition to knock outs . Midfield tends to look a bit crab type , Henderson and Dier together I hope not . Thought Shelvey would have had a look in .
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17-05-2018, 13:36   #4
MAC33
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From the squad,my best team

Pickford,Walker,Stones,Cahill and Delph - defence

Henderson and Lindgard - central midfield

Rashford and Sterling out wide.

Ali and Kane up front

I see that team being too attacking for Southgate and Dier will be added to central midfield.



His team will be Pickford,Walker,Stones,Cahill,Delph

Dier,Henderson,Ali

Lindgard,Kane,Sterling
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20-05-2018, 12:36   #5
Longcol
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Worrying that even the best options seem short of players who could be called international class, and totally bereft of anyone who could be considered world class.
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20-05-2018, 19:58   #6
MAC33
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Foden of Man.City might have been worth a gamble.

His ball skills are pretty amazing and he definitely has the X factor.

Rashford seems to have gone downhill if anything. His ball control of late his major weakness.

With their sheer pace and stamina England are always a threat.

Loftus Cheek worth a place in the first eleven,possibly.
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20-05-2018, 20:53   #7
Longcol
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAC33 View Post
Foden of Man.City might have been worth a gamble.

His ball skills are pretty amazing and he definitely has the X factor.

Rashford seems to have gone downhill if anything. His ball control of late his major weakness.

With their sheer pace and stamina England are always a threat.

Loftus Cheek worth a place in the first eleven,possibly.
None of them are anywhere near proven international class though.

About all we can boast today is we're not as bad as Scotland.
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20-05-2018, 21:52   #8
hackey lad
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I don't follow the premiership but watched a bit of cup final yesterday and got to say from what I saw , Ashley Young ought to learn how to cross a ball properly
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21-05-2018, 00:54   #9
Longcol
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I don't follow the premiership but watched a bit of cup final yesterday and got to say from what I saw , Ashley Young ought to learn how to cross a ball properly
He was as handy as a crack in a glass eye.
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21-05-2018, 09:07   #10
Harrystottle
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Shelvey is unlucky not to be going, Welbeck is definitely lucky to be going!

It's an OK squad. I'm glad Southgate isn't taking people well past their best, picking them on what they used to be, and I'm glad he's not taking anybody who is carrying an injury. We've had enough of that in the past.
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22-05-2018, 20:05   #11
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they've got no chance. Even less than in previous tournaments and even though it is not in some far-flung part of the world and at least partially in Europe so it is like a semi home advantage rather than when it is in Brazil or South Africa or somewhere like that. They've got steadily even worse over decades. They're no-hopers.

Last edited by blake; 22-05-2018 at 20:11.
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23-05-2018, 09:53   #12
parkydave
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come on Blake stop beating around the bush what do you think our chances are. It would be nice if we could progress though to give us something to watch later in tournament but doubts are setting in .
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23-05-2018, 11:32   #13
blake
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200-1 to win the tournament
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23-05-2018, 12:39   #14
MAC33
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I would have taken Demajay Gray of Leicester - he has tons of flair and pace.

Redmond could have added a bit of the same to the central midfield.

Foden of Man.City has supreme technique and can unlock the tight defences with his ability to beat a player.

This England squad are a little less stereotyped and younger than in previous years.

Best bet is if Sterling is on his game. He has the ability to unlock defences - but his final ball and finishing at times are woeful.

The margins between winning the tournament and say last 16 are actually really,really small.

With a bit of luck and Sterling beating his fullback England can go far.

Lindgard will likely play on the other flank and he's probably England's second most likely player to unlock defences.
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23-05-2018, 13:28   #15
blake
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The margins between winning the tournament and say last 16 are actually really,really small.

I don't think so. It is not like the Euros where total rank outsiders, like Greece and Denmark have won it.

anybody can reach the last 16, but no team who isn't one of the very top favourites has ever won the World Cup.

Almost no team who isn't one of the top favourites has ever even got to the final.
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23-05-2018, 14:58   #16
tinfoilhat
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They'll line up something like this for the first match. He will definitely go 3 at the back

Pickford
Walker stones/Cahill macguire

Trippier/Trent Arnold dier Henderson rose

Ali/lingard Kane sterling

Lots of width but a bottle neck in midfield, which is where we will fail to win games.

That could well change - I'm not sure Southgate knows his best 11 or anywhere close to it, mainly because of lack of options generally. This will probably result in bitty, disjointed play but to be fair the England team have played like they've met in the car park for the first time before more or less every match in the past 15 years.
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23-05-2018, 14:58   #17
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Now roony ( spell check suggests rookie) has gone at least we have some sort of a chance of getting past the first set of hurdles, his performance last time was a disgrace.
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23-05-2018, 15:50   #18
Longcol
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAC33 View Post

The margins between winning the tournament and say last 16 are actually really,really small.
In the last 9 tournaments (since more than 16 teams taking part in the finals) 42 different countries have reached the last 16 but only 6 different countries have gone on to win it.

I'd say that makes the difference between winning the tournament and reaching the last 16 pretty large.

---------- Post added 23-05-2018 at 16:04 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by blake View Post
The margins between winning the tournament and say last 16 are actually really,really small.

I don't think so. It is not like the Euros where total rank outsiders, like Greece and Denmark have won it.

anybody can reach the last 16, but no team who isn't one of the very top favourites has ever won the World Cup.

Almost no team who isn't one of the top favourites has ever even got to the final.
Correct - since England won in 1966 only 3 teams who'd never reached a final previously have got to the final - Holland, France and Spain.
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23-05-2018, 16:46   #19
tinfoilhat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Longcol View Post
In the last 9 tournaments (since more than 16 teams taking part in the finals) 42 different countries have reached the last 16 but only 6 different countries have gone on to win it.

I'd say that makes the difference between winning the tournament and reaching the last 16 pretty large.

---------- Post added 23-05-2018 at 16:04 ----------



Correct - since England won in 1966 only 3 teams who'd never reached a final previously have got to the final - Holland, France and Spain.
Indeed, there have only been 9 different runners up since the inception of the world cup.
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23-05-2018, 17:14   #20
blake
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there has never been a totally unlikely World Cup finalist that was a no-hoper long-shot to win the tournament and who everybody thought before the tournament started, that they were just making the numbers, like Denmark and Greece were total outsiders when they won their Euros.

even unlikely SEMI-finalists in the World Cup are quite rare, who were not one of the tournament favourites to begin with, and who did not enjoy home advantage. However they are not totally unknown and there has been a few, although not in the most recent tournaments :

unlikely World Cup semi finalists

2002 : Turkey
1998 : Croatia
1994 : Bulgaria
1986 : Belgium
1974 : Poland

that is not too many at all, considering there have been a total of 48 World Cup semi finalists or top 4 finishers since 1966, only FIVE of them have been rank outsiders, who almost nobody expected to get that far.

South Korea in 2002 don't count as a rank outsider the way those five listed above do. They had home advantage.
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