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Agent_C

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About Agent_C

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  • Birthday 16/10/1973
  1. The bike would have been long gone by the time that happened.
  2. A few weeks ago we were driving into a supermarket car park when we were undertaken by two young men on an expensive motorbike. They drove up to bike stand and started attacking a locked up motorbike with a bolt cutter in an attempt to steal it. My partner tried to block them in with our car and sounded the horn to attract attention. They got back on the bike and rode off, not before giving our car a kick. Meanwhile another member of the public had seen what was happening and spotted two police officers in a car. But they told her they couldn't give chase because the men were wearing helmets and they wouldn't be able to identify them (I always thought they couldn't give chase if they weren't wearing helmets). My partner then drove up to the police car to give them a description of the bike they'd ridden off on - they acknowledged him through the car window and then just drove off! Enough said really.
  3. There are plenty of places where you can read about what goes on in lap dancing clubs - even a whole book written about it: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Stripped-Bare-Reality-Lap-Dancing/dp/1905570325 https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2012/jun/18/lap-dancer-nadine-quashie-stringfellows https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2011/nov/10/truth-lap-dancer-clubs http://www.womenssupportproject.co.uk/userfiles/WSP%20-%20Adult%20entertainment%20or%20exploitation%20-%20final.pdf And there have been TV programmes that have shown what goes on inside a club. So I am perfectly entitled to have an opinion on the matter. Many people, for example, have strident opinions about football without ever having kicked a ball. I might question the validity of your opinions given that you later admit to getting a kick out of women pretending to enjoy showing you their sexual organs. ---------- Post added 08-07-2018 at 19:05 ---------- The problem is that SR and their like affects ALL women, because they perpetuate the myth that the most important things about women are their appearance and sexuality, that these are attributes that can be bought and sold, and that women are there to be leered at and be permanently sexually available. While this continues women's choices will continue to be narrowed, women will continue to be sexually harassed, and they will have more difficulty being taken seriously. So yes, there is I believe some responsibility on the women who choose this as their career choice, but I wouldn't expect most of them to think in such global terms as most of them feel they have to do it for the money - perhaps because ironically, they feel their only worth is in their body or sexuality. ---------- Post added 08-07-2018 at 19:09 ---------- Sadly, many men do think they can control women's actions and decisions, or at least attempt to. I don't know about SR but there are articles above that indicate that women (who are self employed in these clubs) make more money if they do 'private dances' and allow the punters to touch them, and the bouncers turn a blind eye. And they often don't earn as much as you'd think.
  4. First off there is plenty of ways to find out what happens inside a strip club without attending one - Google for example. I have addressed the point about models - it's not a sexualised industry and you can't use it as a comparison. There are far fewer male strip groups and you will not find a male strip club in every town like you do with female ones. The male strip group environment is certainly not one I would choose to inhabit but seems to be, from people I have spoken to, one where humour is the overriding factor rather than sexuality. Perhaps women just don't find the sight of a flaccid male member a turn on as much as the other way around? In any case currently we live in a society where men have power, sexual and otherwise, over women, so I don't see how you can make a comparison.
  5. I'm not sure that would happen. Part of the problem of having clubs such as Spearmint Rhino in Sheffield city centre is that it normalises strip clubs and the commodification of women. Makes it seem a legitimate part of a night out. And further reinforces the divide between the sexes. If they weren't there, far fewer would attend. Strip clubs have been banned in Iceland since 2010 and there is no evidence that it has forced clubs underground or caused danger to women. And who polices the legitimate strip clubs anyway? You never see bobbies on the beat anymore and seemingly have a hard time getting a response in person to a 999 call, so I hardly think the police have got time to attend Spearmint Rhino to check that none of the women are underage or being trafficked or coerced. ---------- Post added 01-07-2018 at 19:32 ---------- I wouldn't have thought many of them would have studied Marxist theory of false consciousness, no, but I imagine most of the women are young and will have less life experience. I wonder how many of them will look back in the future and regret what they did? ---------- Post added 01-07-2018 at 19:35 ---------- I would argue that it's very different! Last time I looked my job description didn't involve me displaying my vulva to strangers in return for payment... how can that be similar to a standard job? Even industries where people use their bodies, such as modelling (which isn't without its problems) doesn't generally require the participants to use their bodies in a highly sexualised manner. ---------- Post added 01-07-2018 at 19:37 ---------- Indeed, and no doubt the club owners are men. More incentive for the women to say they enjoy working there, and to do things they feel less comfortable with.
  6. There is a link - strip clubs promote inequality because the men attending have the power - the money - and the women are there to please them and to appear compliant and sexually available. The woman might think that they are in control but without the paying punters they wouldn't have a job. Normalising this view of women leads to men in the links above thinking they have the right to grope women.
  7. No, I think the main problem is with the patriarchal and unequal society we live in in which this has become normalised. The women believe they are empowering themselves by taking their clothes off but it is false consciousness - they are only 'empowered' within a narrow definition that has been shaped by the patriarchy, and yes, it does other women who choose not to participate no favours, but I doubt that is in the forefront of their minds. We have been brought up to compete with other women after all. ---------- Post added 26-06-2018 at 21:47 ---------- No, because the purpose of a beach is not for people to take their clothes off and behave in a sexual manner for money. I doubt most of the varieties of female bodies seen at the typical beach would be welcome in strip clubs anyway - only a narrowly-defined idea of what is beautiful (and youthful) will do. This saddens me because so many women these days seem to need validation from others for their appearance. I am proud of my body, because through eating well and exercising I have managed, despite a long term illness, to get to my mid 40s and be able to run for a bus and climb a hill without getting out of breath; I am proud of my body because it is strong and enables me to work and enjoy my hobbies. Not because it is sexually attractive to other people. Surely we should be teaching our daughters that they can be proud of and enjoy their bodies without needing the approval of others or to show them off to men? Surely in 2018 women are worth more than just being objects for men to leer over, or to display their genitals to strangers for money? Can't we aspire to more than that?
  8. Men just aren't objectified in the media anywhere near as much as women. It's become 'normal' to have semi naked pictures of teenage girls in daily newspapers, for example. That sort of daily objectification has been prevalent for decades, further exacerbating the inequality between the sexes.
  9. My point about commodification is that it affects ALL women, and that includes me (someone earlier seemed to be assuming that I was a man). It's not just a case of if you don't like it don't go. Strip clubs and the like reinforce the notion that women's bodies can be bought and sold and that a woman's main currency is her sexuality. That's irregardless of whether people choose to work there, enjoy it, etc. It's damaging to all women who want to be taken seriously for attributes other than their bodies. No wonder so many women report being sexually harassed - these clubs normalise the notion that women are there to be leered at and are sexually available. And in answer to the previous question, I wouldn't go and see a film if its main selling point was gratuitous sexual imagery, but I can't see how a sex scene as part of a storyline compares with a club where the main purpose is women stripping for money.
  10. This is spot on - this affects ALL women whether we choose to participate or support lap dancing clubs or not. The recent #metoo campaign showed just how many women have been the subject of sexual harassment and how far we have got to go to have a society where women are not viewed primarily for their sexual attributes. No-one's answered my question about whether you'd be happy for your female relatives to work in such an establishment so here's another: would you be happy for your wife, daughter etc to walk alone at night past a lap dancing club where sexually charged men are congregating?
  11. If I answer yes to that question then you will call me a prude; if I answer no then you will call me a hypocrite, so it is best not to answer! ---------- Post added 22-06-2018 at 17:57 ---------- You don't have to have seen something in the flesh, as it were, to be able to find out about it and have an opinion. There are plenty of testimonies online from former lap dancers. Of course the women who work there currently are going to be positive about it - they need to attract the business so they can keep their jobs. Fewer men would go there if they thought that the dancers might be underpaid, tired, bored, feeling exploited or worried where the next meal is coming from - it would spoil the fantasy that they are sexually available and interested in them.
  12. But that is exactly how strip clubs are marketed. They hardly advertise themselves as places where you can go and admire the human form in all its guises from an aesthetic point of view. Instead it's about the sexualisation of the female body. ---------- Post added 22-06-2018 at 08:35 ---------- No, I wouldn't choose to use my money to support commodification of women. Why does this matter to the argument? ---------- Post added 22-06-2018 at 08:37 ---------- It depends on your perspective - you come into contact with a greater range of bodily fluids working as a nurse! Would you rather tell people your daughter was a nurse, or a stripper?
  13. A great illustration of how the commodification of women's bodies encouraged by strip clubs and the like normalise the practice of judging and commenting on women's physical appearance. I'd ask all the men in favour of strip clubs to seriously consider whether they would be happy for their daughter, sister or mother to take her clothes off in public for men's sexual pleasure.
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