Free Early Learning (Nursery care)

makapaka · 20-10-2011, 14:48

I wonder if someone could please help with some advice.

Our daughter turned 3 in August 2011 and has become eligible for Free Early Learning, which is the government funding for 15 hours free childcare.

We missed out on a place at our local school so enrolled our daughter in an approved private nursery local to us.

Now, after our daughter had been at nursery for a few weeks we received a letter from the nursery with a calculation showing that the value of our Free Early Learning support was £770 less than the cost of our daughter attending the nursery for a 51 week period (i.e. the value of the government funding was £770 less) and as such we would be required to pay the difference of c. £70 a month for her attendance.

I called and asked why this was the case and the lady explained that this was because the government funding only covered term time, i.e. a 38 week period, and not the full 51 week period. I said fine, and so if she only attends during term time does that mean there will be no additional charge?

Now this is the bit i'm unsure of...........the response I got was that we would get a 15% discount from the amount due if she only attends during term time, i.e 15% from £770.00 (£100ish), and that therefore we would still be required to pay c. £55 a month for her attendance.

What I can't understand is, if we get 15 free hours, and she is only attending for 15 hours, how can it be that whichever way you cook it we have to pay between £670 and £770 a year for her to attend?

Is this the norm at all nurseries?
Are we getting a raw deal?

Sorry for the long post but any advice would be appreciated.

SpeedDemon · 20-10-2011, 14:55

That's interesting - my daughter starts at the end of the month in a private nursery. I'm wondering if the same will apply to her...

jenz245 · 20-10-2011, 16:58

My daughter attends a private nursery and prior to her getting her "free" hours she couldn't choose to opt out and just attend term time but now she gets her "free" hours I don't pay for her term time as she isn't there.
If they advertise that they accept goverment funding I can't see how they can charge you for when she isn't there during the holidays as its basically pushing you into a corner.

indiechick · 20-10-2011, 19:04

At a lot of private nurseries they don't do term time only places. They only take children all year round. So you have to pay for the 52 weeks, even if she doesn't go.
Not at all unusual in private nurseries, ours is the same. I think some nurseries do offer term-time only places but you have to look around for those

It is annoying as we are in same boat. I work term time but have to pay all year round (so she will go in some days of holidays and I can do housework on those days freeing up weekends!)

sheza · 20-10-2011, 19:20

As the person has said above, many private nurseries do not offer term-time only places andthefore may still charge you for the place, even if you choose not to send your child during holidays. The theory been that they have to keep the place open for your child and could instead offer it to a child whom needs/wants year-round care. The other thing to consider (although im fairly sure this wouldnt equate to the amount you are still having to pay) is many nurseries, not only private ones, ask for additional amounts to cover meals and snacks, this can become quite costly and may explain the additional amount you are paying. If the nursery provides home cooked meals, it often isnt an option to opt out of them if your child is present at the mealtime and send a pack up instead.
Hope this helps.

Flutterbyes · 21-10-2011, 07:26

you don't have to use the FEL with a nursery!

some childminders can offer it as well.

I will have a read of the FEL criteria (as I offer it too) and come back to this.... as I am sure it is a requirement that a setting who is accredited has to offer the hours without top up fees....

*Peaches* · 21-10-2011, 09:30

My son goes to a private nursery from 9-3 3 days a week, they minus the FEL hours and I only pay for 3 hours a week which is £15. This is a term time only contract, he can go during the holidays but I have to pay for it. If I wanted to do it that way they'd add up the whole year, deduct the grant, and divide it between the 52 weeks and I'd pay that, to me it sounds like thats what they've done to you

indiechick · 21-10-2011, 10:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Peaches*

My son goes to a private nursery from 9-3 3 days a week, they minus the FEL hours and I only pay for 3 hours a week which is £15. This is a term time only contract, he can go during the holidays but I have to pay for it. If I wanted to do it that way they'd add up the whole year, deduct the grant, and divide it between the 52 weeks and I'd pay that, to me it sounds like thats what they've done to you

The posters child is only going for 15 hours and they said the nursery told them it was for a 51 week contract.

So to me it seems it is a nursery that only offers 51 week contracts

The figures add up for it being that too.

The nursery will have 12 weeks out of term time hours so 15 hours x 12 weeks x £4.30 (that's what my nursery charge and it's fairly typical so will use that)= £774. Divide that into 12 monthly payments = £64.50 and the 15% discount will bring that to the £55 a month they said they was quoted.

If poster isn't happy they best thing they can do is keep looking for a nursery that does do term time only contracts.

SpeedDemon · 21-10-2011, 11:02

I checked with my daughters nursery. She is fine to do term time only and I won't be billed for the rest of the time

indiechick · 21-10-2011, 11:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpeedDemon

I checked with my daughters nursery. She is fine to do term time only and I won't be billed for the rest of the time

Trust me to have a nursery that doesn't do term time

I won't move her though. She has been there since she was 7 months and I have only just changed to working term time only, and she likes it too much for me to change her.

jiristancl · 25-10-2011, 14:16

Hi I am a nursery manager, the FEL guidelines state:

No requirement for child to access additional hours (including outside of the 38 weekds) for a fee.

makapaka · 25-10-2011, 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiristancl

Hi I am a nursery manager, the FEL guidelines state:

No requirement for child to access additional hours (including outside of the 38 weekds) for a fee.

Thanks for all your replies. jiristacnl - what exactly does that mean then? If she doesn't go for more than 38 weeks there should be no fee?

jiristancl · 26-10-2011, 17:50

yep there not allowed to charge if you attend more then 38 weeks. At my nursery we only do term time for children who claim there fel, because we have to?

makapaka · 27-10-2011, 08:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiristancl

yep there not allowed to charge if you attend more then 38 weeks. At my nursery we only do term time for children who claim there fel, because we have to?

Thanks. What about if we only want her to attend during term time i.e 38 weeks. Can there be a charge in that situation?

Just to clarify it is a private nursery that she is attending.

indiechick · 27-10-2011, 09:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiristancl

yep there not allowed to charge if you attend more then 38 weeks. At my nursery we only do term time for children who claim there fel, because we have to?

I can't see this applying to all private nurseries, otherwise nurseries like the one my daughter goes to would not be allowed to only have 51 week contracts

They are all checked out by ofsted etc so if they really were not allowed to only do 51 week contracts they would have been pulled up on this by now

Flutterbyes · 28-10-2011, 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiristancl

Hi I am a nursery manager, the FEL guidelines state:

No requirement for child to access additional hours (including outside of the 38 weekds) for a fee.

that's what I thought but had not got round to looking.

providers who want to provide the FEL must agree to the criteria on of which has been written above. Basically if you only want to send your child term time only 15 hours a week the nursery can not charge you for the other 14 weeks of the year...

although what they can do is offer the funding in sessions... say morning and afternoon
8.30 till 11.30 and 12.30 till 3.30 if you want your child to attend the whole day then you have to pay for that hour in the middle... 11.30 till 12.30, very sneaky but I wonder if your nursery is charging and extortionate amount for this hour... you don't HAVE to have this hour but it means collecting and dropping child back at nursery...

ask for an appointment, go in and ask for a breakdown. why do they want to charge so much?

sheff@ · 28-10-2011, 21:59

Hi,
Private nurseries are allowed to charge for hours during the holiday periods and unfortunately there is no way out of it! Like previous posts have said many nurseries do offer term time only contracts but understandable you don't want to move due to her being so settled. They have to how ever provide an invoice which clearly states how many hours free entitlement you have used with how many hours your paying for this must be made clear. You can not be forced to pay for something I.e dinner during term time. It is a muddy area within the guidelines but it is allowed to happen as they are classed as a private business, I have brought this exact situation up with the council department and they are not breaking any guidelines unfortunately.