Originally posted by Lickszz Old battleaxe Thatcher was too smart for Scargill and the miners suffered. Call that a caring union leader? Not in a million years. He was a liability to them. And a madman to boot. A Rich Madman.
Madman he may have been but history proved him right.
Thatch was using the police force as her own private army.
She was determined to punish the unions for bringing down Heath's government.
She had planned this for years as demonstrated by the un-natural stock piling of coal.
Scargill's mistake was despite having an original mandate from the membership for the strike he did not call for a further vote for continuation.
__________________ A "liberal do-gooder" is someone open to new ideas for progress, tolerant of others and who does good works. - KenH 1/12/05
Now if you look at it from another point of view..... The unions had too much power and were running the country, not the government of the day.
Wouldn’t any right thinking person think that untenable? Things had to change. Foolishly for his members, Arthur Scargill just made it easier and quicker.
Without Arthur Scargill, I daresay that we would still have a large and effective coal industry.
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Last edited by Tony; 26-02-2004 at 11:57.
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His choice should have been to develop a more sensible set of tactics. The Tories set a trap for him and he fell for it, hook, line and sinker.
Also, What does everyone make of the Roger Windsor situation. He was Scargills right hand man but he is said to have been an MI5 operative or some similar such spook.
Originally posted by Lickszz And a madman to boot. A Rich Madman.
A joke amongst ex-miners is that Scargill went into the strike with a small house and a big union...and came out of it with a big house and a small union!
Quote:
Originally posted by Max Thatch was using the police force as her own private army.
Not only did Thatcher use thugs from the Met to beat up the strikers, but the army was also used - soldiers wearing police uniforms!
So little surprise, if any, that Thatcher would have used MI5 in all this.
__________________ Max: Hey. He fell on the cab. He fell from up there, on the cab. I think he's dead. Vincent: Good guess. Max: You killed him? Vincent: No, I shot him. Bullets and the fall killed him.
Originally posted by Abdul
[b]A joke amongst ex-miners is that Scargill went into the strike with a small house and a big union...and came out of it with a big house and a small union!
Precisely, He's had a long and lucrative ride on the back of some naive, trusting miners.
I was only about 7 at the time of the miners strike, but to this day have some very strong memories as it hit my family hard cos my dad was a miner and so were other relatives. I remember having to get clothes tokens for new clothes and being sent over to my grand parents house for a hot meal as my parents couldn't afford to feed my brother and I. Oh, those were the days
When thatcher came into power on the back of the famous quote "labour isn't working " with 1.5 million out of work then when out of power with 5 million out of work ,she didn't do a bad job did she? In those days any young lad who wasn't quite bright could get a job in the steelworks ,the pit , the railways ,etc and come out drawing a decent wage there was no need for him to go burgling or pinching cars ,he could buy his own! The council estates were steady places to live on ,people knew that there was opportunity to move onto better estates as houses became available then she brought in the right to buy and all the good housing stock disappeared from public ownership .This meant the couple whose first council property was a flat were then stuck there instead of moving into a decent house? True,there were some things she sorted out that needed sorting out but a lot of our current problems can be laid at her feet!
Originally posted by mojoworking I'm confused Mo. You started this thread by telling us about all the commendable work you did on the picket lines during the miner's strike.
However, you appear to have no love for the Trade Unions in general and Arthur Scargill in particular.
What's the story?
No dark and devious reasons. It's just that being a man with plenty to say for himself I would have thought that he would have wanted to mark this day in some way.
I was 100% behind the miners for their sakes and for the future of our communities. I was often disturbed by the way the miners hung on to Arthurs every last work. I swear if he had told them to walk off Flamborough Head they would have done.
His style of delivery was Hitleresque, just watch the footage shown on BBC at the mo. If I'm honest I didn't warm to him on the occasions I met him. I found him a very cold fish even when he was amongst his allies.
Where do you deduce that I am no lover of the trade union movement? I have always been a fully paid up trade union member whenever I have been in employment. How many of you socialists on here can say that I wonder?
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Whether you think that you can, or that you can't, you are usually right.
Originally posted by Mo
Where do you deduce that I am no lover of the trade union movement? I have always been a fully paid up trade union member whenever I have been in employment. How many of you socialists on here can say that I wonder?
Perhaps I was jumping to conclusions. I noted your disillusionment with New Labour and assumed you'd thrown the baby out with the bath water.
Although closing of the mines ripped the heart out of numerous villages there were some beneficial spin offs.
Many miners went on to do better things which without losing their jobs they wouldn't have done. A friend of mine used his redundancy money to set up his own business and he's never looked back.
Women who had been content to take a back seat looking after baby and home were politicised and began to realise that they could influence events and make a difference to things around them. Many went on to further education or to work in the community.
__________________
Whether you think that you can, or that you can't, you are usually right.
It doesn't seem particularly implausible. I've seen police officers covering up their numbers in public order situations, and then getting away with things that they otherwise wouldn't.
It was sad, to witness a fascist dictatorial government's inability to deal with conflict in industrial relations. The Dictator Thatcher, who proved her real stupidity by aligning herself with General Pinochet. no less, (a while ago), and who was on the run from a war crimes court. This latter point having a bearing on the police baton charges and the street fighting which the strike brought. Not to mention the 'starve em out' attitude. A working men's strike and a government consisting of wealthy, landowners, industrial magnates et cetera, who have no empathy for 'workers' do not make comfortable bed partners. Aw reet lad.
Who is that French twerp using my name???
Originally posted by Callassa It was sad, to witness a fascist dictatorial government's inability to deal with conflict in industrial relations. The Dictator Thatcher, who proved her real stupidity by aligning herself with General Pinochet. no less, (a while ago), and who was on the run from a war crimes court. This latter point having a bearing on the police baton charges and the street fighting which the strike brought. Not to mention the 'starve em out' attitude. A working men's strike and a government consisting of wealthy, landowners, industrial magnates et cetera, who have no empathy for 'workers' do not make comfortable bed partners. Aw reet lad.
Well said! And as spook1210 reminded us, let's not forget the police who inflamed the situation by waving their bulging pay packets at the miners on the picket lines
If I remember the strike was about Arther Scargill saying there was a hit list to close the majority of the mines,which the then NCB and the government both said there was no such list.
So were have all the mines gone.
Before anyone say's they were not usable after the year long strike.which is the reason a lot of people, who know nothing about the strike or mining seem to believe.
I ask them this :-
Why were all most of the pits in Nottingham closed they worked?
