Was Rafa Benitez right about Man United?

daftlad · 11-01-2009, 11:19

In his rant about Man United and Fergie in particular. I think he is spot on and said what most fans think, though most top clubs get generous decisions from referees

Longcol · 11-01-2009, 12:02

Personally think Benitez is cracking under the strain.

Top clubs will always appear to get more generous decisions because they are doing a lot more attacking (and are on telly more). As a rule bottom teams rarely get dodgy pens because they don't often get the ball in the opposition penalty box.

alankearn · 11-01-2009, 13:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longcol

Personally think Benitez is cracking under the strain.

Top clubs will always appear to get more generous decisions because they are doing a lot more attacking (and are on telly more). As a rule bottom teams rarely get dodgy pens because they don't often get the ball in the opposition penalty box.

I agree

And one of the reasons the top clubs do not give away as many penalties is because invertible they have better defenders who can defend without bringing down opposition players (ie. make the least mistakes).

Yakubu · 11-01-2009, 14:01

Hes bottled it, he knows Liverpool are`nt going to win the league too.

Thingything · 11-01-2009, 14:10

Can imagine Ferguson sat at home laughing his head off when he heard about it,wound up Benitez without saying bugger all
You can't beat the best and Ferguson is the best at mind games

daftlad · 11-01-2009, 14:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yakubu

Hes bottled it, he knows Liverpool are`nt going to win the league too.

agreed he has bottled it, especially with the tem he played yesterday against the mighty stoke, but he was right in the comments about fergie, i know fergie has been a good manager but he probably the most ungracious manager in defeat i know of

Thingything · 11-01-2009, 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by daftlad

agreed he has bottled it, especially with the tem he played yesterday against the mighty stoke, but he was right in the comments about fergie, i know fergie has been a good manager but he probably the most ungracious manager in defeat i know of

Think Wenger might beat him to that accolade

Whatif wewin · 11-01-2009, 17:43

I think he got it spot on.
I don't understand why he said it just before the match with Stoke though, it would have made more sense if Liverpool had beaten Stoke ... were a few more points clear.
Yes timing is paramount with these mind games.

plekhanov · 11-01-2009, 18:19

Well Duncan White (whomever he is) of the Telegraph who's actually investigated the substance of Rafa's epic whine certainly doesn't think so:

Quote:

Rafael Benitez's outburst made up of half-truth and disinformation
...
Leaving aside, for a moment, the accusation that Benitez has risen to Ferguson's bait, it is worth examining the validity of Benitez's various accusations. Disinformation and half-truth abound.

Charge 1 "We have seen players sent off at Old Trafford and we do not see our opponents sent off."

There has only been one player sent off at Old Trafford this season. In September, Middlesbrough's Emanuel Pogatetz was shown the red card after he went in two-footed on Rodrigo Possebon. The young Brazilian midfielder was lucky to avoid serious injury and both the Boro manager Gareth Southgate and Pogatetz apologised. There can be absolutely no dispute.

Two players have been sent off for the opposition at Anfield this season. Wigan's Luis Antonio Valencia was sent off for two bookings in October in a game that Liverpool won 3-2. His first caution was for encroaching on a free-kick. Here's what Steve Bruce said about it: "I just thought all the little decisions in the second half went Liverpool's way. It's difficult enough coming to Anfield, but you need some fairness and strength. Two minutes after Valencia was dismissed, [Nabil] El Zhar tackled Mario Melchiot in the same way and... nothing. That's what annoys us to."

The other player to be sent off at Anfield? Nemanja Vidic of Manchester United.

Hardly fits Benitez's conspiracy, does it?

Charge 2 "During the respect campaign, and this is a fact, Mr Ferguson was charged by the FA for improper conduct after comments made about Martin Atkinson and Keith Hackett. He was not punished. He is the only manager in the league that cannot be punished for these things."

Ferguson was charged for making some pretty pathetic and disparaging remarks about Atkinson after the FA Cup quarter-final defeat to Portsmouth in March.

Carlos Queiroz, his then assistant, was also charged. Both were later cleared by an independent commission, not the FA.

In regards Hackett, Ferguson accused him of being biased towards Chelsea after John Terry's red card against Manchester City was rescinded. Ferguson looked paranoid – the decision to send off Terry had been considered pretty harsh – and not a little self-interested as Terry was freed up to play United. And perhaps the FA's failure to punish Ferguson was a weakness.

But to suggest other managers get punished misses the mark. Everton's David Moyes has been fined £5,000, Phil Brown has been fined £1,000 and Roy Keane received no fine at all relating to charges of improper conduct. All were warned about their future conduct. Joe Kinnear has two charges outstanding.

While this might show that the Respect campaign is a sham, it does not suggest the FA are cracking down on anyone. Not a touchline ban to be seen.

Oh, except for Ferguson, who was given a two-game ban for abusing Mike Dean after a the 4-3 win over Hull in November. He also got a £10,000 fine. So he is the one manager who has been substantially punished by the FA this season.

Charge 3 "Then he was talking about the fixtures. Two years ago we were playing a lot of early kick-offs away on Saturdays when United were playing on Sundays – and we didn't say anything."

Ferguson's claims of an anti-United bias in the fixture schedule are laughable. But so is Benitez's counter-suggestion that United were favoured in the past. True, Liverpool did play five away fixtures in the early Saturday slot in the 2006-07 season, losing two, winning two and drawing one.

But then United also played five away games for the Saturday matinee audience. Again, Benitez seems to have his facts wrong. He is right that United played more Sunday games that season – nine to Liverpool's five – but they are hardly advantageous if you are playing in the middle of the following week.

Jose Mourinho used to complain that the English league disadvantaged its Champions League competitors by failing to move games that undermined preparation for big ties. But then all teams have been disadvantaged equally.

Few managers take on Ferguson and come off unscathed. Benitez's courage might be applauded if only his claims had more substance. Ferguson is petty and irrational, and he will wind you up until you crack.

As Rafa's claims about how he doesn't complain about fixtures:

Quote:

Benitez also broadened his complaint to the fixture schedule.

"I would like to ask the Premier League why is it that Liverpool always play the most fixtures away from home in an early kick-off, following an international break?" he said. "We had more than the top clubs last season and we have four already to prepare for this season. It's going to be very difficult for us to win the Premier League because the other teams are so strong, but I want our supporters to know that despite the disadvantages we have, we will fight all the way.

"We will fight to cope with our more difficult kick-off times and all the other decisions which are going against us."

A spokesman for the Premier League denied any bias against Liverpool. "We try to ensure dealings with all our member clubs, including the scheduling of fixtures, are as fair as possible," he said.

"We are disappointed to read Rafael Benitez's remarks in the media, especially as channels exist for every member club to raise any issues directly with the League."

It would seem that Gerrard is far from the only lying/self delusional hypocrite at Anfield.

The Manager · 11-01-2009, 19:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by daftlad

In his rant about Man United and Fergie in particular. I think he is spot on and said what most fans think, though most top clubs get generous decisions from referees

Yep i do agree with Rafa!

plekhanov · 11-01-2009, 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by masonsarmsfc

Yep i do agree with Rafa!

Good job ignoring my post which showed that Rafa was actually wrong.

Thingything · 11-01-2009, 21:35

Stoke 0 v 0 Liverpool
Man Utd 3 v 0 Chelsea
Who do you think had the happier weekend when he got home!!!
Rafa should concentrate on his team selection rather than having a dig at Fergie

MR BENN · 12-01-2009, 00:00

hes lost the plot and Sir Alex has got to him as he has with many before Benitez. remember Keegan .Wenger, Mourhino ,thewy have all tried to take fergie on with the mind games and all failed. Man Utd for the title.

Longcol · 12-01-2009, 00:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thingything

Stoke 0 v 0 Liverpool
Man Utd 3 v 0 Chelsea
Who do you think had the happier weekend when he got home!!!
Rafa should concentrate on his team selection rather than having a dig at Fergie

Memo to Benitez - Kuyt is as handy as a crack in a glass eye.

MR BENN · 12-01-2009, 01:20

as Fergie once put it -its sqeeky bum time . perfectly sums up Benitez

abbasinho · 12-01-2009, 08:08

Ferguson's got a bite all right, he's the master, Benitez and Wenger will never learn.

I don't think he was right to come out and have the rant like he did. Hilarious as it was he has put his team under even more pressure than were already under.

Man U's hammering of Chelsea yesterday was very ominous. I don't Liverpool would be capable of pulling a performance like that out of the bag.

sharpend · 12-01-2009, 09:06

I slightly disagree - sky sports news showed the entire interview and I reckon Benitez hasn't lost the plot
1. He was reading from a prepared script - although it was a staged interview -the interviewer didn't wind him up (SSN then showed the Keegan rant from a few years ago and it was just that - a rant)
2. After reading the "charges" - he dropped back into his normal 1 and 2 word answers
yes, no, maybe, of course

Whatif wewin · 12-01-2009, 14:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by plekhanov

Good job ignoring my post which showed that Rafa was actually wrong.

Your post proves nothing of the sort.
Rafa said nothing that we don't already know, whether he should have said it is another matter.

Ousetunes · 12-01-2009, 14:30

Maybe Benitez is worried because if Steve Gerrard were to be given a custodial sentence then his club would go into free-fall. Personally, I think Liverpool are an average outfit who happen to have the finest midfielder in the Premier League. When Gerrard doesn't play, Liverpool are useless.

Whilst there are parts of Benitez's outburst I can sympathise with, he omits the biggest thing Manchester United get away with day in, day out. And that is the raging pit-bull terrier Rooney who constantly projects forth a tirade of vulgar abuse at the officials during every single game, or becomes 'over physical' when he's lost the ball.

What a fine example this guy is.

But the fact is, Benitez has given Manchester United the finest team talk of the season and whether with Gerrard or without, I feel Liverpool will struggle to hold onto top position and Manchester United will be crowned Champions in May.

This weekend's results affecting these two sides give the impression that 'normal service is resumed'. Winners of the Premier League would normally be expected to take 3 points from places like the Britannia Stadium.

happyhippy · 12-01-2009, 14:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by plekhanov

Good job ignoring my post which showed that Rafa was actually wrong.

Not that this says that much, but Graham Poll agrees with Rafa. Whether that's a help or hinderance is a moot point.