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09-01-2017, 14:03   #21
tinfoilhat
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Originally Posted by Bob Arctor View Post
I think standards of journalism are generally on the slide, the Guardian is often pretty dire these days, the odd good bit of investigative stuff aside, e.g. phone hacking. The Washington Post story looks like very sloppy journalism but there is a difference between failing to corroborate your source and wilfully making stuff up; although neither is acceptable the latter is worse.
The british press on the whole are an abonination who wouldnt know a fact if it slapped them in the face. Its mainly opinion dressed as fact and even when there are facts then they'll wilfully misrepresent things like ONS statistics. Scum in the main with very few exceptions.
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09-01-2017, 14:16   #22
Hots on
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I'm more concerned with the increasing amount black-on-white attacks we're seeing; these black people doing the assaults have been whipped up by the Anti-Trump, and thinly veiled white-people-are-the-devil narrative that emanates from Black Lives Matter, Michelle Obama, Jesse Jackson and the whole left wing media.
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09-01-2017, 19:21   #23
Bob Arctor
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Originally Posted by Hots on View Post
I'm more concerned with the increasing amount black-on-white attacks we're seeing; these black people doing the assaults have been whipped up by the Anti-Trump, and thinly veiled white-people-are-the-devil narrative that emanates from Black Lives Matter, Michelle Obama, Jesse Jackson and the whole left wing media.
Which attacks are these?
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09-01-2017, 19:22   #24
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Originally Posted by Hots on View Post
I'm more concerned with the increasing amount black-on-white attacks we're seeing; these black people doing the assaults have been whipped up by the Anti-Trump, and thinly veiled white-people-are-the-devil narrative that emanates from Black Lives Matter, Michelle Obama, Jesse Jackson and the whole left wing media.
Left wing media ?

In the US ?

Congratulations.

You're even more gullible than I originally feared
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09-01-2017, 21:25   #25
Obelix
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Originally Posted by Bob Arctor View Post
The far-right 'news' website Breitbart has completely made up a story about a mob setting fire to Germany's oldest church while chanting "Allahu Akbar"

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ortmund-church

It's important to know this if either you come across a Breitbart article that you might otherwise assume was true, or if other people cite Breitbart as a source of information that has influenced their opinion. They make things up to whip up hatred against Muslims and migrants, and there is a clear parallel between this and anti-Jewish propaganda in the 1930s. Beware.
Does anyone actually think Breitbart are real? I always assumed that they were regarded like the stories in the Sunday Sport...
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09-01-2017, 21:30   #26
horribleblob
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Originally Posted by Obelix View Post
Does anyone actually think Breitbart are real? I always assumed that they were regarded like the stories in the Sunday Sport...
I don't know for sure, but, listening to phone-in radio, I would say that, yes, there are some that swallow it (even if, just to confirm their mindset).
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09-01-2017, 23:05   #27
flamingjimmy
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Originally Posted by mafya View Post
After prayer I say Allahu Akbar while thumbing my prayer beads a certain number of times, I'm not doing it in a terrorist context I'm doing it as part of my worship.
I think the media has a lot to answer for in regards to spreading disinformation regarding muslims....
To be fair I think it's the few muslims that shout Allahu Akbar before they murder people and/or blow themselves up that caused that particular misunderstanding, not so much the media. Surely you don't want the media to cover up what they all shout? Or should the media for balance sake show some nice Muslims saying it whenever they show some nasty ones doing it?



---------- Post added 09-01-2017 at 23:09 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelix View Post
Does anyone actually think Breitbart are real?
Yes, millions of people probably. I think you're being a little naive about how much people are willing to suspend any and all skepticism when a 'news' source says what they want to hear.
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10-01-2017, 23:57   #28
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Bickering and assorted nonsense removed. If you have an issue with this address it to the helpdesk. Keep it civil please.
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11-01-2017, 18:05   #29
the_bloke
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Originally Posted by flamingjimmy View Post
I think you're being a little naive about how much people are willing to suspend any and all skepticism when a 'news' source says what they want to hear.
See the current fake news around Trump and the Russians as an example. The whole theory that's been heavily reported by sources such as Buzzfeed is progressively being shot down in flames due to wild inaccuracies of the facts. Even the editor of Buzzfeed is now questioning it. It's not stopping seas of anti Trump people believing it though, because they desperately want to believe it.
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11-01-2017, 18:08   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hots on View Post
I'm more concerned with the increasing amount black-on-white attacks we're seeing; these black people doing the assaults have been whipped up by the Anti-Trump, and thinly veiled white-people-are-the-devil narrative that emanates from Black Lives Matter, Michelle Obama, Jesse Jackson and the whole left wing media.
Presumably you have lots of evidence from reputable sources to substantiate this claim?
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11-01-2017, 18:24   #31
LeMaquis
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Originally Posted by the_bloke View Post
See the current fake news around Trump and the Russians as an example. The whole theory that's been heavily reported by sources such as Buzzfeed is progressively being shot down in flames due to wild inaccuracies of the facts. Even the editor of Buzzfeed is now questioning it. It's not stopping seas of anti Trump people believing it though, because they desperately want to believe it.
Trump spent years denying that Obama had been born in the USA. What comes around etc.
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11-01-2017, 18:30   #32
the_bloke
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Originally Posted by LeMaquis View Post
Trump spent years denying that Obama had been born in the USA. What comes around etc.
So is 'Fake News' only bad when it's about certain subjects or people? As it sounds like you are suggesting it's fine about Trump as he deserves it, surely it's bad when it's about anyone or anything, especially considering it clearly has a political motive to discredit the subject?
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11-01-2017, 18:33   #33
LeMaquis
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Originally Posted by the_bloke View Post
So is 'Fake News' only bad when it's about certain subjects or people? As it sounds like you are suggesting it's fine about Trump as he deserves it, surely it's bad when it's about anyone or anything, especially considering it clearly has a political motive to discredit the subject?
You're claiming the stories about Trump are being shot down in flames but have provided no evidence. Maybe like Trump you can dish it out but can't take it. Which is called hypocrisy.
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11-01-2017, 18:46   #34
the_bloke
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Originally Posted by LeMaquis View Post
You're claiming the stories about Trump are being shot down in flames but have provided no evidence. Maybe like Trump you can dish it out but can't take it. Which is called hypocrisy.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/10/b...ssia.html?_r=0

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics...howers-dossier

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ossier/512771/

http://nypost.com/2017/01/10/buzzfee...o-a-new-level/

'There is literally no evidence on offer in these memos or from BuzzFeed that any single sentence in these documents is factual or true. What’s more, we know most major news organizations in America had seen them and despite their well-known institutional antipathy toward Trump, had chosen not to publish them or even make reference to them after efforts to substantiate their charges had failed.'

What sort of evidence do you want?
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11-01-2017, 18:53   #35
tinfoilhat
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Originally Posted by the_bloke View Post
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/10/b...ssia.html?_r=0

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics...howers-dossier

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ossier/512771/

http://nypost.com/2017/01/10/buzzfee...o-a-new-level/

'There is literally no evidence on offer in these memos or from BuzzFeed that any single sentence in these documents is factual or true. What’s more, we know most major news organizations in America had seen them and despite their well-known institutional antipathy toward Trump, had chosen not to publish them or even make reference to them after efforts to substantiate their charges had failed.'

What sort of evidence do you want?
I saw a quote from the daily telegraph on the bbc website confirming theyd seen the dosier but couldnt prove or disprove its contents. Its all from "unamed intelligence sources".
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11-01-2017, 19:04   #36
the_bloke
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Originally Posted by tinfoilhat View Post
I saw a quote from the daily telegraph on the bbc website confirming theyd seen the dosier but couldnt prove or disprove its contents. Its all from "unamed intelligence sources".
It seems no one can prove anything in it. It's been floating around for months, apparently information from a 'retired British spy' paid for by the Republicans which has subsequently been offered and rejected by every news outlet in the US. Even now the papers won't print it for fear of being sued.

Michael Cohen, Trump's lawyer, has already denied he has been to Prague as alleged in the documentation.

It's okay though, it's about Trump so it's fine. Apparently. I don't care about Trump one jot but it's plainly a fallacy to assume that fake news only exists from pro-right sources.
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11-01-2017, 21:49   #37
Bob Arctor
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Originally Posted by the_bloke View Post
It seems no one can prove anything in it. It's been floating around for months, apparently information from a 'retired British spy' paid for by the Republicans which has subsequently been offered and rejected by every news outlet in the US. Even now the papers won't print it for fear of being sued.

Michael Cohen, Trump's lawyer, has already denied he has been to Prague as alleged in the documentation.

It's okay though, it's about Trump so it's fine. Apparently. I don't care about Trump one jot but it's plainly a fallacy to assume that fake news only exists from pro-right sources.
There is actually a difference between publishing a document containing unsubstantiated allegations and fake news, providing the publisher makes clear the unsubstantiated nature of the allegations. I still think it's very dubious but it's not fake news in the way that the Breitbart story I linked to is. If buzzfeed had written about a dossier that doesn't exist or lied about the content of the dossier that would be fake news.
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11-01-2017, 22:26   #38
saunaman
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Guido and Zero hedge have some good links regarding this story .
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11-01-2017, 22:40   #39
LeMaquis
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Originally Posted by the_bloke View Post
'There is literally no evidence on offer in these memos or from BuzzFeed that any single sentence in these documents is factual or true. What’s more, we know most major news organizations in America had seen them and despite their well-known institutional antipathy toward Trump, had chosen not to publish them or even make reference to them after efforts to substantiate their charges had failed.'

What sort of evidence do you want?
A lack of evidence that they're true does not mean they've been disproved. Some of the news organisations that didn't publish them months ago chose not to do so because they were pro-Trump. At the moment the allegations are there to be proven or disproved but they have not been shot down in flames as you have claimed.
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12-01-2017, 08:32   #40
sgtkate
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Originally Posted by tinfoilhat View Post
I saw a quote from the daily telegraph on the bbc website confirming theyd seen the dosier but couldnt prove or disprove its contents. Its all from "unamed intelligence sources".
I was going to say it's not from Buzzfeed for heavens sake! They just ran the story. The info has come from a British Intelligence agent on many articles I've seen, who has 'given reliable information before many times so is considered a reliable source'.

However, it's also been said there are things in the report that the public has seen that are glaringly incorrect such as people not going to places reported, however, this is the reports of the data and NOT the actual data itself if that makes sense. Perfectly likely and possible that Buzzfeed and others have tried to make it look more juicy than it really is simply to generate 'buzz', hence the name.

And no, of course all fake news that pretends to be real isn't ok, but you do have to admire the utter hypocrisy of Trump who has lived off faked news for his entire campaign and now suddenly thinks it's the worst thing on earth. All his opponents have to do is just shut up and let him talk himself into his own grave of hilarity and irony.
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