The end of the EU?

It takes a unanimous vote. They can exert some pressure, but you fail to understand (I dont believe you ever understand half the issues) that by giving tariff free access without expecting anything in return undermines the EU itself, which is rather more important to Germany than the car industry. They can still export at higher costs so will be less profitable, but financial services will be prevented from operating in the EU unless they are duly authorised, which means business will move there. You might not give a oss about financial services, but they are rather important to the UK. If the Uk wnats access then it should pay money for the privilege, just like Norway and Switzerland. I dont see the UK getting a better deal having left than it had before, that would make no sense.

You under estimate the importance the UK market is to the German motor vehicle industry and allowing them continued free access to the UK is the UK's biggest bargaining chip.

---------- Post added 08-12-2016 at 22:16 ----------

You are forgetting, as usual, how the EU works. In fact, you haven't got a clue how it works as you refer to 'Mickey Mouse EU nations'. Delusions of grandeur was the title of a recent article in the Dutch Financial Daily describing the predicament the Brits find themselves in. They were right.

 

Gentle reminder - Tata steel, without government support or Unions offering big incentives (including reducing workers' status), is profitable in the Netherlands. Odd that, isn't it?

The UK will have already started behind close door BREXIT negotiations with Germany and France. The UK only needs to negotiate with the main players, who in turn, will bring the water carrying EU nations onboard, with agreements settled behind close doors.

You under estimate the importance the UK market is to the German motor vehicle industry and allowing them continued free access to the UK is the UK's biggest bargaining chip.

 

---------- Post added 08-12-2016 at 22:16 ----------

 

The UK will have already started behind close door BREXIT negotiations with Germany and France. The UK only needs to negotiate with the main players, who in turn, will bring the water carrying EU nations onboard, with agreements settled behind close doors.

Oh will they? I am pleased you are au fait with these developments. Interesting thing is that Germany and France's respective national governments don't actually have a direct influence on their EU representation. So having a natter over tea and biscuits is all good and well, but it doesn't actually get the UK anywhere. Unfortunately for the UK the PM and her excellent team of 'did he really say that???' foreign secretaries (including the Brexit ones) think like you do and the rest of Europe doesn't.

In case you missed it: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/11/29/donald-tusk-accuses-british-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

Also, you appear to ignore the fact that TATA is happy to continue (profitably) operations in the Netherlands and yet is desperate to sell of UK assets?

That fact seems to be conveniently hidden under the kilts, of those still dreaming of Scottish Independence.

We'll see if the devolved governments will have the last laugh. The government's attorney general was quite poor during the Supreme Court hearings this week whereas the Scots and the Welsh made their cases very well. After what I have heard this week, I won't be surprised if the Supreme Court comes back to say that the devolved governments will need to give their consent to triggering Article 50. So not only will the PM not be able to use her Royal Prerogative, it seems a distinct possibility that Westminister won't be enough either. Roll on the New Year.

---------- Post added 08-12-2016 at 22:49 ----------

You under estimate the importance the UK market is to the German motor vehicle industry and allowing them continued free access to the UK is the UK's biggest bargaining chip.

You're overestimating the need of the automotive industry for the UK market. That is seriously insignificant when they will claim the much larger prize of taking the lion's share of the financial services sector from London to Frankfurt.

You are all so narrow minded in dismissing London that you forget that they effectively prop up this country economically.

 

Also, you appear to ignore the fact that TATA is happy to continue (profitably) operations in the Netherlands and yet is desperate to sell of UK assets?

Why did it commit to investing an extra £1 billion over ten years in its UK plants, then?

---------- Post added 08-12-2016 at 23:22 ----------

 

You're overestimating the need of the automotive industry for the UK market. That is seriously insignificant when they will claim the much larger prize of taking the lion's share of the financial services sector from London to Frankfurt.

 

You are all so narrow minded in dismissing London that you forget that they effectively prop up this country economically.

I'd save your breath. he will dismiss anything he doesnt understand and put his view down to common sense about what he knows of how things work.

Oh will they? I am pleased you are au fait with these developments. Interesting thing is that Germany and France's respective national governments don't actually have a direct influence on their EU representation. So having a natter over tea and biscuits is all good and well, but it doesn't actually get the UK anywhere. Unfortunately for the UK the PM and her excellent team of 'did he really say that???' foreign secretaries (including the Brexit ones) think like you do and the rest of Europe doesn't.

 

In case you missed it: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/11/29/donald-tusk-accuses-british-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

 

Also, you appear to ignore the fact that TATA is happy to continue (profitably) operations in the Netherlands and yet is desperate to sell of UK assets?

iI think your take on the situation is correct, I don't think Germany as a net contributor to EU will be the biggest problem. More likely it will be the net takers that will be resenting the UK as another net contributor leaving

Oh will they? I am pleased you are au fait with these developments. Interesting thing is that Germany and France's respective national governments don't actually have a direct influence on their EU representation. So having a natter over tea and biscuits is all good and well, but it doesn't actually get the UK anywhere. Unfortunately for the UK the PM and her excellent team of 'did he really say that???' foreign secretaries (including the Brexit ones) think like you do and the rest of Europe doesn't.

 

In case you missed it: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/11/29/donald-tusk-accuses-british-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

 

Also, you appear to ignore the fact that TATA is happy to continue (profitably) operations in the Netherlands and yet is desperate to sell of UK assets?

What does electricity cost in the Netherlands?

What does electricity cost in the Netherlands?

I'd say it is the same here. Been ten years now. It certainly isn't cheap and it won't be subsidised for TATA either.

TATA published parts of its strategic evaluation for the Dutch site and in it concluded that Hoogovens IJmuiden was a plant that was able to cope with the rigours of the steel market due to a high knowledge level and specialisation that could not be reproduced by Chinese manufacturers.

In other words, it is competing on added value rather than quantity and price.

---------- Post added 09-12-2016 at 10:59 ----------

Why did it commit to investing an extra £1 billion over ten years in its UK plants, then?

A business at that scale needs continuous investment. They probably reached the point where they can't justify the investments in the Wales plant any more.

 

A business at that scale needs continuous investment. They probably reached the point where they can't justify the investments in the Wales plant any more.

Not what they said yesterday. they tried to sell it, but situations change and now they no longer wish to and are commited to the business again.

Not what they said yesterday. they tried to sell it, but situations change and now they no longer wish to and are commited to the business again.

Happy to wait however long until it surfaces, as with Nissan (and others yet to be unveiled, no doubt).

This has No.10's fingers all over it, however many disclaimers the government's PR handlers circulate(-d back in early November).

 

Happy to wait however long until it surfaces, as with Nissan (and others yet to be unveiled, no doubt).

Maybe. I thought it was a good news for the UK so if government have managed to persuade them to stay all well and good. I wouldnt rather think it would be the government doing its job. Once we leave there will be more of it. You ccould also add in the fall in the £ makes it more competitive again.