Disgusting strike action on London underground.

There would inevitably be some additional costs from taking on temporary staff and a strike would still hurt any employer who benefitted from either the training or experience of their employees.

Strikes do occur and are sometimes successful in states where striking employees are no so protected. Sometimes however in these places the strikers are sacked.

 

For the employer, there's a hit from enduring the strike, a hit from caving in, and a hit from sacking the strikers. These are weighed up.

If you take away the employers right to sack people and take that hit, they're essentially powerless.

 

Police are already forbidden from striking by the way.

Yes I know the Police are, I said that in an earlier post, also pointed out that the police are the lowest paid of all the emergency services. Coincidence?

Do you have any examples of how it could work? Does it work like you suggest elsewhere with an similar economy (i.e not Nepal)

Until such time as they introduce driverless trains.

The tech is in use on (parts of) the London Underground already.

The unions kicked up such a stink that there now has to be someone on the train still 'monitoring' the system to make sure it doesn't break.

Yes I know the Police are, I said that in an earlier post, also pointed out that the police are the lowest paid of all the emergency services. Coincidence?

 

Do you have any examples of how it could work? Does it work like you suggest elsewhere with an similar economy (i.e not Nepal)

Before I comment on whether it's a coincidence.

Can you back up your assertion that the police are the lowest paid?

Before I comment on whether it's a coincidence.

Can you back up your assertion that the police are the lowest paid?

Starting salaries once qualified only as others are a bit hard to compare.

https://targetcareers.co.uk/career-sectors/public-sector-and-charity/252-how-much-will-i-earn-in-the-emergency-services

Ambulance technician - £22k

Firefighter - £22k

Police - £19k

Starting salaries once qualified only as others are a bit hard to compare.

https://targetcareers.co.uk/career-sectors/public-sector-and-charity/252-how-much-will-i-earn-in-the-emergency-services

 

Ambulance technician - £22k

Firefighter - £22k

Police - £19k

It says once qualified (after initial training) a police officer would be on £23,000.

It also states that they get extra pay for overtime and for working in the London area.

"These allowances can add a significant amount to your salary; for example, if you join the Metropolitan Police as a new police constable, you could receive around £6,687 in London weighting and allowances in addition to a basic salary of £22,668."

Therefore a new police constable could get just under £30,000 a year in London. Not too shabby.

...The issue really is how do you 'hurt' a company who you feel is treating the staff badly or changing something that they really shouldn't without totally buggering things up for millions of innocent people trying to go about their lives? Answers on a postcard...

In the case of transport workers: they don't strike but let everyone travel for free on the day of action.

It says once qualified (after initial training) a police officer would be on £23,000.

 

It also states that they get extra pay for overtime and for working in the London area.

 

"These allowances can add a significant amount to your salary; for example, if you join the Metropolitan Police as a new police constable, you could receive around £6,687 in London weighting and allowances in addition to a basic salary of £22,668."

 

Therefore a new police constable could get just under £30,000 a year in London. Not too shabby.

Yes thank you. I was going to respond, but now I only have to agree with you.

In addition, the lowest rank to work on an ambulance is Emergency care assistant, not technician and they start on £17k.

Therefore this point is invalidated.

Yes I know the Police are, I said that in an earlier post, also pointed out that the police are the lowest paid of all the emergency services. Coincidence?

And you have in fact succeeded in showing that allowing vital public sector workers to strike does not increase there pay and therefore does not need to be a protected action for them. Thanks.

It says once qualified (after initial training) a police officer would be on £23,000.

 

It also states that they get extra pay for overtime and for working in the London area.

 

"These allowances can add a significant amount to your salary; for example, if you join the Metropolitan Police as a new police constable, you could receive around £6,687 in London weighting and allowances in addition to a basic salary of £22,668."

 

Therefore a new police constable could get just under £30,000 a year in London. Not too shabby.

Firefighters and ambulance crew also get London weighting and overtime so that part is irrelevant. As is the bit about £30k not being too shabby, it's not but my comment was that Police earn less than their counterparts not that they don't earn enough or too much.

You are correct though that I did misread the Police salary part that it's £19k while in training and then up to £23k when initial training is complete. However, if you look at the other salary ranges of the ambulance and fire service then the police still earn less so I'm sticking by my point.

---------- Post added 09-01-2017 at 15:22 ----------

Yes thank you. I was going to respond, but now I only have to agree with you.

 

In addition, the lowest rank to work on an ambulance is Emergency care assistant, not technician and they start on £17k.

Oh come on...you could argue that the lowest emergency care person is the guy who cleans the ambulances but that would just be ridiculous.

Firefighters and ambulance crew also get London weighting and overtime so that part is irrelevant. As is the bit about £30k not being too shabby, it's not but my comment was that Police earn less than their counterparts not that they don't earn enough or too much.

 

You are correct though that I did misread the Police salary part that it's £19k while in training and then up to £23k when initial training is complete. However, if you look at the other salary ranges of the ambulance and fire service then the police still earn less so I'm sticking by my point.

https://www.metfriendly.org.uk/services/police-finance-information/police-pay/

Your original source is invalid for the pay range as it only mentions the pay for an Inspector.

Your narrative is that the police are paid less because they don't strike. This is false. You've demonstrated the reverse of what you intended and destroyed your own argument.

Vital public services do not need the right to strike without repercussions.

In fact nobody does.

 

Oh come on...you could argue that the lowest emergency care person is the guy who cleans the ambulances but that would just be ridiculous.

That person does not go out with the ambulance, the emergency care assistant does. For all I know he/she may also clean the ambulance.

Now if you wanted to counter me, you could use the starting pay of a PCSO, they are front line but they start on about £16-17k outside London.

But anyway starting pay is irrelevant as is maximum pay. What matters is average total career earnings+benefits. I think you'll find that the police do pretty well overall.

The tech is in use on (parts of) the London Underground already.

 

The unions kicked up such a stink that there now has to be someone on the train still 'monitoring' the system to make sure it doesn't break.

I expect that one day the drivers will go on strike and the trains will be switched to autopilot and the drivers won't be let back in. Didn't something similar happen with containerisation of our docks and the dockers union?

I expect that one day the drivers will go on strike and the trains will be switched to autopilot and the drivers won't be let back in. Didn't something similar happen with containerisation of our docks and the dockers union?

Once again, this would be exactly the approach I would take with bolshie unions, but it's illegal because of the legal protections applied to industrial action and unions. Which is why I ask that the law be changed.

Once again, this would be exactly the approach I would take with bolshie unions, but it's illegal because of the legal protections applied to industrial action and unions. Which is why I ask that the law be changed.

Redundancy isn't illegal.