So, what's peoples opinion on this?

What is it all about?

It seems Britain are going to train some Libyan soldiers. Has Gadaffi had some threats?

What about the families of Lockerbie bombing victims and the years of sponsoring terrorism?

My sympathy goes out to the families of the Lockerbie victims; they were always going to come second to the opportunity to exploit another oil-rich Middle East country.

Gaddaffi has done well in abandoning his WMD programme. Given that Libya (along with Syria and Iran) would be another target fairly soon, his actions have probably prevented another disasterous regional conflict, and saved the lives of thousands of his civilians and British soldiers. While I do not approve of Gaddaffi's actions in the past, this is positive step for Libya, and a PR opportunity for Blair.

As for the Lockerbie horror, didn't the CIA point the finger at Syria as soon as Gaddaffi started to play ball?

Can I take this opportunity to remind you all that I wrote I DO NOT APPROVE OF GADDAFFI'S ACTIONS IN THE PAST, should any of you accuse me of being a Gaddaffi sympathiser.

My thanks to you all.

It's a fact of life that sooner or later the best way to remove an enemy is to create the situation where you can embrace him into your bosom.

It may stick in the throat, and it takes a big man /woman / nation to do it, but it is the only inevitable conclusion to restore peace and dignity and law and order to all.

Originally posted by Tony
It's a fact of life that sooner or later the best way to remove an enemy is to create the situation where you can embrace him into your bosom.

It may stick in the throat, and it takes a big man /woman / nation to do it, but it is the only inevitable conclusion to restore peace and dignity and law and order to all.

Completely agree Tony.

Always the best option (where possible) is to make your enemy in to your friend ... thus turning a negative in to a positive.

However ... make sure your enemy does not stab you in your own heart as you embrace him as a friend.

Although Gadaffi is willing to work with the west doesn't mean he has changed his true feelings towards them.

Et tu Brutus! Timendi causa est nescire.

Originally posted by Tony
Et tu Brutus! Timendi causa est nescire.

You could just as easily have said:

Sedit qui timuit ne non succederet.

Tony and MAX ... can we have translations in english please ... for the uneducated bumpkins amongst us (I mean me) !?

Originally posted by Jamie
Tony and MAX ... can we have translations in english please ... for the uneducated bumpkins amongst us (I mean me) !?

Google it Jamie. That's what I had to do as my Latin's about 30 years out of date.:D

Alternatively go here:

Latin motto page (http://hackensackhigh.org/~rcurtis/latinm.html)

I'll give you a clue - Seneca :)

Originally posted by max
Google it Jamie. That's what I had to do as my Latin's about 30 years out of date ...

Difficile est tenere quae acceperis nisi exerceas !!

Having said that ... I had better get back to practicing my own craft ... this forum is way too addictive.

True, too true ... on both counts. Non est ad astra mollis e terris via. :nod:

Originally posted by Tony
It's a fact of life that sooner or later the best way to remove an enemy is to create the situation where you can embrace him into your bosom.

It may stick in the throat, and it takes a big man /woman / nation to do it, but it is the only inevitable conclusion to restore peace and dignity and law and order to all.

Spot on 100%. Well done!

Gadaffi just hasn't got any standards has he? I wouldn't let a war criminal in my tent.

Cras amet qui nunquam amavit, quique amavet cras amet!

translation:
Let those who love now, who've never loved before:
let those who've always loved, now love the more

Originally posted by Tony
Et tu Brutus! Timendi causa est nescire.

Je ne compre pas!!!

Originally posted by Abdul


Gaddaffi has done well in abandoning his WMD programme. Given that Libya (along with Syria and Iran) would be another target fairly soon, his actions have probably prevented another disasterous regional conflict, and saved the lives of thousands of his civilians and British soldiers. While I do not approve of Gaddaffi's actions in the past, this is positive step for Libya, and a PR opportunity for Blair.


Is it not also a good argument in favour of the Iraq war? As you say, the fact that Gadaffi would be another target soon may have pressured him into doing the right thing when otherwise he would not have done.

Originally posted by slimsid2000
Is it not also a good argument in favour of the Iraq war? As you say, the fact that Gadaffi would be another target soon may have pressured him into doing the right thing when otherwise he would not have done.

Meh, Blair's always been in favour of the Iraq war no matter what any commission or whatever says, cos the daft bat's so far up George W Bush's arse he can't see the wood for the trees.

and they say Latin's a dead language. or did they say dead boring language, i can't remember?

I think we will see a return of Libya to the fold of Secular leaders pursuing anti-islamic policies.

Gadaffi will get guns, goons and gold for his oil and will be offered training both in miltary affiars, intelligence and industry as well.

Then we will let him and his successors conduct proxy wars against countries and groups we identify as having anti-western ideals whilst keeping him well supplied with the means for doing so.

Then, once Libya is looking dangerous again and nationalises all our lucrative civil engineering contracts and weapons factories, we will invade and do another smash and grab.

Plus ca change...

Originally posted by Phanerothyme

Plus ca change...

now this bit i do understand. part of the lyrics of a Rush song, right?

Originally posted by Killian
and they say Latin's a dead language. or did they say dead boring language, i can't remember?

Nullum saeculum magnis ingeniis clausum est, Baby! :thumbsup:

Originally posted by Tony
Nullum saeculum magnis ingeniis clausum est, Baby! :thumbsup:

yes, you are obviously very clever, Tony. Also patronising and very sad. in your own way you are equally as prejudiced as others you accuse on here.

Originally posted by Killian
now this bit i do understand. part of the lyrics of a Rush song, right?
quite possibly,but.

"plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose."

The more things change, the more they stay the same, is what I meant.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
quite possibly,but.

"plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose."

The more things change, the more they stay the same, is what I meant.

I remember it well. saw them twice in concert - Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson & Neil Peart - ah, those were the days!

Originally posted by Killian
yes, you are obviously very clever, Tony. Also patronising and very sad. in your own way you are equally as prejudiced as others you accuse on here.

I think that you don't really know me then. As for the Latin, it's a little bit of fun in the thread (my schoolboy Latin rusted away long ago), and the clue as to how to decipher it is only a few posts up. Noone else has a problem. Maybe if you think it's dead or dead boring you should study it a little just to be sure?

PS... I don't accuse you of being predjudiced - I just observe what people write and respond.

Originally posted by Tony
I think that you don't really know me then. As for the Latin, it's a little bit of fun in the thread (my schoolboy Latin rusted away long ago), and the clue as to how to decipher it is only a few posts up. Noone else has a problem. Maybe if you think it's dead or dead boring you should study it a little just to be sure?

i went to horticultural college for three years. finished first in our group all of those three years. and yes, Aesculus Hippocastanum is infinitely more boring than Horse Chesnut.

Ahhh... you're a little like the Berberis tonight then Killian :)

Originally posted by Tony
Ahhh... you're a little like the Berberis tonight then Killian :)

if you mean the variety Thunbergii, 'point' taken (sorry, don't know how to add a smiley yet).

Hehe, I wouldn't know and I had to drag Berberis from the depths of my memory too!

I suppose that if you have only ever had to learn Latin names by wrote, then you probably have never experienced it properly and I guess it would seem dead and boring.

It is actually quite a beautiful language, both written and spoken, and it provides quite an understanding into nearly all European languages, as they are all essentially derived from it.

Originally posted by Tony
Hehe, I wouldn't know and I had to drag Berberis from the depths of my memory too!

I suppose that if you have only ever had to learn Latin names by wrote, then you probably have never experienced it properly and I guess it would seem dead and boring.

It is actually quite a beautiful language, both written and spoken, and it provides quite an understanding into nearly all European languages, as they are all essentially derived from it.

yes, i know. I have Spanish relatives and speak a little Spanish, although I believe Catalan is more Latin based.

Originally posted by slimsid2000
Is it not also a good argument in favour of the Iraq war? As you say, the fact that Gadaffi would be another target soon may have pressured him into doing the right thing when otherwise he would not have done.

That's exactly what Geoff Hoon said :roll:

But the answer is still no - there were precious few 'good reasons' to invade Iraq. Given that relations with Libya and Britain were slowly beginning to thaw, Gaddaffi might have given up WMD regardless.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
I think we will see a return of Libya to the fold of Secular leaders pursuing anti-islamic policies.

Gadaffi will get guns, goons and gold for his oil and will be offered training both in miltary affiars, intelligence and industry as well.

Then we will let him and his successors conduct proxy wars against countries and groups we identify as having anti-western ideals whilst keeping him well supplied with the means for doing so.

Then, once Libya is looking dangerous again and nationalises all our lucrative civil engineering contracts and weapons factories, we will invade and do another smash and grab.

Plus ca change...

I've thought about this a lot...and came to the conclusion that while it's very likely that you wrote will come to pass, at least invasion, sanctions and civilian deaths have been delayed for a while :D

Interesting to note that the 'War on Terror' is high on the agenda of the British and Libyan govts, but not human rights of Libyan Civilians. As you say, 'He may be an SOB, but at least...'