First of all this is not intended to become a racist thread nor is my query racist in nature.
It's merely an observation I have seen and I'm curious if others have seen the same and if there is a reason for it.

This morning on my way into work I stopped a flow of traffic behind me to allow 2 girls of asian origin to cross the road because no one were letting them cross. They were about 14/15 yrs of age.

They crossed the road but didn't bother to look at me, smile or give a little wave of thanks for this even though it was clear I was blocking traffic behind me to allow them to cross.
Not so much a big deal, but a little thanks lets you know you're appreciated.

However I've noticed the same thing with drivers (men and women) of Asian origin when I let them into a line of traffic I get no thanks of any kind. Every time I let someone out of a minor road and onto a major road or turn or whatever, if they happen to be Asian in origin I don't get any thanks. Why?
Is it becuase I'm white? Is it because they're asian? Are they just shy? Or is it everyone that's doing this?

I'm always thankfull to drivers who are curtious to me whether driving or I'm wanting to cross. Hell I even thank people for stopping at a zebra crossing when I want to cross the road.
Now with the teenage girls you could say it's because they're teenagers and granted this could be the case with today's "I couldn't give a ****" youth. However I've allowed other youths to cross the road and nine times out of ten I get a thanks. Be they white, black, chinese etc

Like I say this is not meant to be a racist post and I don't want the biggots to start with their kick em out rants. It's merely an observation causing me to see a pattern.

Isn't this a wild generalisation you're making here? I find it hard to believe that you've let enough asians cross the road or get their car out of the junction in front of you to make this observation with any credibility. In statistical terms, your sample size isn't anywhere near big enough. :)

It could be a generalisation granted.
However it is something I have observed quite a lot and I do drive every day.

It doesn't stop me letting anyone into the road whether they're asian, black, white, green etc
However I noticed it a few times and since then I have just tried to give it a little more attention and it does seem to happen everytime.

I was wondering why?

How many times would you think I have to let someone out or cross the road to make an accurate judgement oh wise one?

I think we had the same discussion regarding people's behaviour being judged dependant on the type of car they were driving. For instance, Merc, Jag or BMW drivers never indicate, Rover drivers always use the middle lane of motorways irrespective of whether or not they need to.

It's all a matter of perception, you go out with the thought in your mind to notice the behaviour of a sub-set of drivers/pedestrians/whatever and sure enough you'll see examples to justify your pre-conception. You won't notice the behaviour of the same group acting outside of the pattern upon which you're focusing.

This is how generalisations occur, in my opinion.

First of all this is not intended to become a racist thread nor is my query racist in nature.
It's merely an observation I have seen and I'm curious if others have seen the same and if there is a reason for it.

This morning on my way into work I stopped a flow of traffic behind me to allow 2 girls of asian origin to cross the road because no one were letting them cross. They were about 14/15 yrs of age.

They crossed the road but didn't bother to look at me, smile or give a little wave of thanks for this even though it was clear I was blocking traffic behind me to allow them to cross.
Not so much a big deal, but a little thanks lets you know you're appreciated.




Hi DaBouncer
I was once watching one of those Trisha chat programs and there was an Asian man on having huge problems because his daughter 'smiled' at people...men (being the main concern). She'd been brought up here...
She was trying to get her father to understand that there was nothing wrong with smiling and being friendly.
He on the other hand was embarrassed and humiliated by her show of affection to strangers, he concidered it encouraging and slutty... He said where HE had been brought up, it just WAS NOT DONE! Only girls who were considered to be 'easy' would do such a thing!!!

I suppose in a country where there are multi cultures, we have to try to understand, not make judgements. And above all carry on regardless, being curtious in our own way.
Afterall, we've all seen programmes where britss have been to different countries and been frowned upon for having various parts of their bodies showing... Hair for instance!!

So keep being your Kind, Considerate Self DaBouncer, don't take other peoples behaviour to heart, just accept that it is not the same as yours. :)

I don't wave and say thankyou if cars stop to let me cross.

I agree about the type of car thing - I never let 4 wheel drivers out no matter how far they push their noses out. But thats just me being a git for the sake of it.

I do give way to pedestrians waiting to step out in the road especially if it annoys people queuing behind me ;)

This is a difficult one but i see where your coming from. I do a LOT of driving through Sheffield and sadly i have had similar experiences.

I always try to let other drivers out or let people cross the road and most of the time always get a thank you. To be honest the people in my experience old white men are normally the worst!!

I've been polite to a LOT of asians on the road and it is sad but some will not say thank you. Its most likely 50/50 that do thank me where other origins are more thankful.

Saying that once going through Attercliffe there was a car full of male asian teenagers with loud music wanting to come off the pavement and turn around and go the opposite way. When i let him through the drive stuck his thumb up and said "cheers mate". In this scenario the general view would be he would of sped off completly ignoring me but he was very polite and thankful.

Every origin/colour/whatever has its good and bad apples. Its only the bad apples people talk about.

If someone fails to wave or even acknowledge that I have specifically stopped to let them out/across, I rev and spin the wheels a bit. My way of saying F you. :hihi:

I can't say I have noticed any particular patern in regards to race though - and I easily do 60+ miles a day!

Max you might be right.
Maybe I'm now trying to see what I've thought and if someone does happen to thank me when I let them out and they're asian I might be missing it or not registering.

I shall do my best to keep a more open mind and see it from all sides.

Not2nite I will always let people out provided it's not going to cause an accident by me doing so regardless of ethnicity. And with regards to the Trisha programme, this is what I was curious about... is it an elders thing of some cultures that is passed down and not necessarily just ignorance for the sake of it.

Internetowl, I'm a conciencous (sp?) driver who happens to not try and be a git on the roads for the sake of it and I drive a 4x4 ;)

I don't want to get into the generalisations about whether a particular nationality don't acknowledge the fact that they have been given right of way, or whatever.

I think what happened this morning with the two girls ("about 14/15 yrs of age") would have occurred whatever race they were. Young people of that age do not drive, and are probably not aware that it is polite to acknowledge a driver who is letting them cross the road.

I never let 4 wheel drivers out no matter how far they push their noses out.

I'm soooooooo glad it's not just me who does this. Then again, I'm 4X4ist:D.



I think what happened this morning with the two girls ("about 14/15 yrs of age") would have occurred whatever race they were. Young people of that age do not drive, and are probably not aware that it is polite to acknowledge a driver who is letting them cross the road.

Common sense prevails.

Sometimes people say thanks. Sometimes they don't.

Does it really matter?

I've lived in asia and have to say that the culture of what is rude and polite is very different there. For example, in some countries there's not so much of a fixation on 'personal space' - ie, getting too close to someone standing in a lift or whatever. So some asians, especially if they are just visiting, will not have the same cultural norms as us and will not realise if they are being rude - just the same as watching westerners making cringing social faux pas in asia!


However if the girls you're talking about were 14/15 chances are they're just young rude British school kids! :hihi:

i don't drive so cannot comment, but I find a dilema when i am allowed to cross with my kids by drivers...do i wave, do I smile? On more than one occasion it has ended up as a mess of both so I just make sure we get across the road quickly so the driver can get on their way :blush:

Well to be honest, as a driver its always nice to get an acknowledgement whenever we allow a car to pull out, or a pedestrian to cross the road.

In my experience, I can pick out a particular ethnic group who are 'rude' so to speak.

I've even had old Somali women wave thanks for letting them cross the road, so I think its just down to individual's really, and whether they've had a bad day or not, or indeed whether they are generally grumpy etc.

I think as max said, its also a perception issue whereby if we tend to have an experience several times we can sometimes draw the wrong conclussions.

However now you've started this, I'm sure it will be picked up by Messiers Griffin & Co and will find its way into some party political manifesto! (only kidding)

Z

In my experience, I *cant* pick out a particular ethnic group who are 'rude' so to speak.

I remember going to one of the greek islands about 25 years ago and commenting to the taxi driver how polite and curtious the taxi drivers were... They always held up their hand to wave to foreign drivers etc.
He burst out laughing and explained that when someone showed you the palm of their hand it was the same as sticking 2 fingers up over here!

:blush: erm... I seem to remember smiling and 'waving' back a few times. Ooops.

DaBouncer,

Sorry if i'm repeating anyone here (I havne't read the whole lot). I find, again, not being racist, that asians IN GENERAL show their gratitude less.

This isn't to say they're not grateful, just that they don't show it the same way we do. I suppose this is probably a cultural thing. Even those brought up in England, who's parents were brought up in Asia, will still have Asian culture etc.

I think this is just that we English are, IN GENERAL very polite! lol You wouldn't think so with today's youth but, when I go to France, or speak to French friends they are forever telling me to quit with the 'merci'!

I was taught by a French teacher, and have experienced while being in France that the French say thankyou once and dinner time and that is enough. To keep on saying it just bugs them. I suppose this may be the same with Asians.

I don't know this is just my (possibly very inaccurate) theory!

However now you've started this, I'm sure it will be picked up by Messiers Griffin & Co and will find its way into some party political manifesto! (only kidding)

Z
I sincerely hope not.
I agree with you and think max is probably correct on this one.

Once you've noticed a pattern which probably doesn't exist as I have, then you start looking for it and ignore the rest - hence generalisation.
This thread was not meant to be this way inclined and I apologise to anyone who may be offended by it wholeheartedly.

I sincerely hope not.
I agree with you and think max is probably correct on this one.

Once you've noticed a pattern which probably doesn't exist as I have, then you start looking for it and ignore the rest - hence generalisation.
This thread was not meant to be this way inclined and I apologise to anyone who may be offended by it wholeheartedly.


Amen!

Its wierd how coincidences happen. I remember not so long ago I was thinking about taking a break to Iceland, all of a sudden I seem to notice loads of things on the television all about Iceland (adverts/holiday programs etc). I think these 'coincidences' occur all the time, its just that when its something we're thinking about, the coincidences tend to stand out.

Z

Another generalisation i guess but older ladies always acknowledge you when you stop to let them cross the road.
I think it is just a sign of the times, the older generation where taught good manners.
The yoof of today may be taught them but rarely use them, unless they can gain something from being polite, surleyness and ignorance is worn like a badge of honour by some younger folk.
To go back to the Asian question though, i remember a few years ago a young Asian family took over our local shop, and when i went in i'd give the usual cheery good morning and it would be ignored, never a thank you or please.
I mentioned it to my girlfriend at the time and she replied "well she always talks to me" we agreed it was a cultural thing as she'd only been in Britain a short time, and her husband was always chatty and polite.
Over the months thing improved though, so i'm sure it is just cultural differences and not ignorance.

I have to say that when people stop to let me across the road I always try to say thank you but sometimes it isn't an option. You're either concentrating on trying to dodge whatever traffic is coming the other way or on getting across the road as quickly as possible before another car comes round a corner etc. So - people might not always say thank you but they're not always being rude sometimes it's a matter of life preservation!

However I've allowed other youths to cross the road and nine times out of ten I get a thanks. Be they white, black, chinese etc



Didnt you say that it was mainly asians that do not give you thanks? As far as im aware, chinese people are asian are they not?

yo dudes i am an asian black white man.

is that actually possible?

Didnt you say that it was mainly asians that do not give you thanks? As far as im aware, chinese people are asian are they not?
If you want to split hairs about it and make a pointless suggestion then technically yes they are.
However for the purpose and ease of identification I differentiate.

However if it pleases you, define it how you like.

If you want to split hairs about it and make a pointless suggestion then technically yes they are.
However for the purpose and ease of identification I differentiate.

However if it pleases you, define it how you like.


How am I splitting hairs? Either they are asian or they are not. Theres no in between.

If you dont mean chinese people when you are referring to asians, then whoo are you referring to? Maybe you should tell us. :)

I think most people have enough brains to be able to understand the difference. It's plain to see I differentiated between Asian and Chinese (hence not people of chinese origin).

I personally don't think any more justification or clarification is required.

I think you're making an argument for the sake of one upmanship... quite pathetic really spyro.

I find that most asian drivers will acknowledge me if i let them in....Unless they're a taxi driver, then again i've never seen any taxi drivers thanking anyone regardless of their race!

Nor boy racers

Nor any car that gets let in at the outbound Mosborough bypass sliproad from the Prince of wales road roundabout.

So because I myself see chinese people as asian, it means I havent got enough brains to understand there is a difference?

No spyro, what it means is that I differeniated between generic Asian statement by pointing out that I don't put Chinese and people of Oriental origin under the same heading.

People with enough brains can understand therefore that no more clarification on my part is required.

whether you feel you have enough brains to understand the difference I was making is another matter and one quite frankly I couldn't care less about.

he is refering to pakistanis
Am I?
News to me!

I think if you ask enough people, they will all have had the same experience but the group in question will be different. Like me, I've had the same experience but with old people.

I think max hit the nail on the head.

yes bouncer u r reffering to pakis but the funny thing is u haven't got the balls to admit it.

i am pakistani and becuase of this post i will stick two fingers up at the next WHITE driver that lets me in!

u bloody idiot, get a life and go and drive in london then u will see who is rude

No actually you'll find I'm referring to Asians.
It has nothing to do with balls, how pathetic can you get.

I couldn't identify if the driver or young people were Pakistani, Indian, Kashmere, Maldivian or another ethnicity. Therefore they come under the one location... Asian.

I differentiate Chinese because I personally feel they have a different look to who I would describe as Asian.

Is that easier for your small mind to comprehend formetoknow :roll:

Unless they're a taxi driver, then again i've never seen any taxi drivers thanking anyone regardless of their race!

I've had thanks from a few taxis. None were being driven by white people.

I've also nearly been killed by taxis, driven by people of all races (God, I hate that word in this context).

We're all the same, yet we're all different:thumbsup:.

Somtimes we say thanks, somtimes we don't.

BFHD

i am pakistani and becuase of this post i will stick two fingers up at the next WHITE driver that lets me in!

OK. I won't let any Pakistani driver in in future (just in case you're the driver):D.



go and drive in london then u will see who is rude

Quite true. Worst place in England to drive. Even walking there is a nightmare.

I couldn't identify if the driver or young people were Pakistani, Indian, Kashmere, Maldivian or another ethnicity. Therefore they come under the one location... Asian.

I differentiate Chinese because I personally feel they have a different look to who I would describe as Asian.

formetoknow :roll:

You mean they all look the same to you? What is this different look you are referring to?

You mean they all look the same to you? What is this different look you are referring to?


I was going to say the same but you beat me to it.

"ooooh they all look the same to me" :loopy:

How am I splitting hairs? Either they are asian or they are not. Theres no in between.

If you dont mean chinese people when you are referring to asians, then whoo are you referring to? Maybe you should tell us. :)

Spyro, you're causing all sorts of problems here, you know who he's refering to...clearly middle eastern, it is the norm to phrase this group as asian- its not ideal because asian includes faireastern & russians but what other words to we have? You know that if was someone from china he'd refer to them as oriental....quit causing problems fella

Spyro, you're causing all sorts of problems here, you know who he's refering to...clearly middle eastern, it is the norm to phrase this group as asian- its not ideal because asian includes faireastern & russians but what other words to we have? You know that if was someone from china he'd refer to them as oriental....quit causing problems fella

And im going to take orders from you because????

And who says that using the word asian refers to those of middle east origin? Who are you to tell me who I should think of when I hear the word asian?

Google asian people in images and see what comes up.

http://images.google.co.uk/images?svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&q=asian+person

You mean they all look the same to you? What is this different look you are referring to?

why are you casusing problems? i can't tell which country people are from just by looking at them.......do all blondes come from sweden? this really shoundn't be an issue, we've established the group of people he has made an observation upon

I was going to say the same but you beat me to it.

"ooooh they all look the same to me" :loopy:

Sorry, but I feel the same as DaB. In my uni class there are about a dozen people whose colour is black. But, it's only after talking to them that I've found out some are British born but most of the others are from many different African nations.

Class DB and me as ignorant if you will, but stand an Englishman, an American, Canadian, Australian together and they will look the same.

Sorry, but I feel the same as DaB. In my uni class there are about a dozen people whose colour is black. But, it's only after talking to them that I've found out some are British born but most of the others are from many different African nations.

Class DB and me as ignorant if you will, but stand an Englishman, an American, Canadian, Australian together and they will look the same.


I hear what you are saying, however, my original point was the use of the word asian

And im going to take orders from you because????

And who says that using the word asian refers to those of middle east origin? Who are you to tell me who I should think of when I hear the word asian?

Google asian people in images and see what comes up.

Oh you really are very silly, take your teenager hat off and chillax

Google isn't a person, i don't care what IT thinks

Oh you really are very silly, take your teenager hat off and chillax

Google isn't a person, i don't care what IT thinks

I am merely voicing my opinion. just because you dont agree with what I say, doesnt mean you have to go off on one. Nothing wrong with debate.

I am merely voicing my opinion. just because you dont agree with what I say, doesnt mean you have to go off on one. Nothing wrong with debate.

Lose the attitude, dude :rolleyes:

You're not debating, you're making trouble.

To return to the thread - I'm embarrassed now cos I don't usually thank drivers who let me cross the road. It's not lack of manners, it's that I want to get across the road and get out of the car driver's way quickly. I don't want to inconvenience him too much, nor do I want to get hit by another car while my attention is taken up with waving at the first car driver. Phew!

Maybe I'll rethink this strategy now.

StarSparkle

Spyro, you're causing all sorts of problems here, you know who he's refering to...clearly middle eastern, it is the norm to phrase this group as asian- its not ideal because asian includes faireastern & russians but what other words to we have? You know that if was someone from china he'd refer to them as oriental....quit causing problems fella

The cause of the problem was the first post in this thread, not people trying to challenge the lazy use of language.

[QUOTE=max]I think we had the same discussion regarding people's behaviour being judged dependant on the type of car they were driving. For instance, Merc, Jag or BMW drivers never indicate, Rover drivers always use the middle lane of motorways irrespective of whether or not they need to.

I beg to differ max,I'm a B.M.W driver and i always use my indicators.....:thumbsup:

I am merely voicing my opinion. just because you dont agree with what I say, doesnt mean you have to go off on one. Nothing wrong with debate.

now you're being rediciulous. I was calling you silly because you said "why should i take orders from you?" exactly which orders was i giving you? i was just saying that i think you're causing problems, over the use of 1 word that most people have an understanding of in this context.

saying "why should i take orders from you?" isn't a grown up way to voice an opinion now is it?

the original title of the post states that this is NOT to be turned into a racial slanging match, however I remember hearing something that someone once said. I cant remember who...

"Im not racist, ive had 7 black people at my house"

"then if you are not racist, why do you feel the need to count them? did it start getting too much once it got to the 5 mark"

I think we had the same discussion regarding people's behaviour being judged dependant on the type of car they were driving. For instance, Merc, Jag or BMW drivers never indicate, Rover drivers always use the middle lane of motorways irrespective of whether or not they need to.

I beg to differ max,I'm a B.M.W driver and i always use my indicators.....:thumbsup:

And I drive a merc, my point was that people tend to generalise.

PS I'd never have guessed that you drive a bmw, err beamer.

MOD: Whilst I'm here: chill out people please.

the original title of the post states that this is NOT to be turned into a racial slanging match, however I remember hearing something that someone once said. I cant remember who...

"Im not racist, ive had 7 black people at my house"

"then if you are not racist, why do you feel the need to count them? did it start getting too much once it got to the 5 mark"

Spyro, please relax. people are only racist if they have a dislike against a race or somebody because of their race. Nobody is displaying these tendancies on here so racism really isn't an issue on this thread.

I really think you're being over pc, getting in a tiz about people's use of words that YOU don't like, come on fella.

(oh and i'm not ordering you about, i used the word please)

Im not arguing rocketpig, so ill be man enough to apologise if you feel im having a go at you.

One thing I would like to say however, is that when someone uses the term 'asian', I myself do not think middle eastern in particular. To me this also means oriental.

Im not arguing rocketpig, so ill be man enough to apologise if you feel im having a go at you.

One thing I would like to say however, is that when someone uses the term 'asian', I myself do not think middle eastern in particular. To me this also means oriental.

thanks, apology accepted.

Well i personally don't use the word asian to describe people with a middle eastern ethnicity, but i understand that when people use the term asian, they do mean this group, i think thats right in general- you can usually tell by context though. I don't think its wrong to use asian for this, its just daft. To me its middle easern or oriental.

Sorry, but I feel the same as DaB. In my uni class there are about a dozen people whose colour is black. But, it's only after talking to them that I've found out some are British born but most of the others are from many different African nations.

Class DB and me as ignorant if you will, but stand an Englishman, an American, Canadian, Australian together and they will look the same.
Thanks.
I was thinking the same here.

So spyro and TwoFour if you put someone of English, Scottish, Welsh, Irish, Canadian, French, German, American, Australian together you saying you could tell the difference.

It's a shame people like you who are just out to turn a topic of reasonable debate into an argumentative free for all.

Grow up!

DaBouncer, is it not alright for me to have a difference of opinion to you?

people are only racist if they have a dislike against a race or somebody because of their race. Nobody is displaying these tendancies on here so racism really isn't an issue on this thread.

I really think you're being over pc, getting in a tiz about people's use of words that YOU don't like, come on fella.

Language is the only way we have of communicating so be careful with it, or you might give the impression that you are racist.

IMO the thread starter knew very well what would happen by putting a title like that!

Maybe I should start a thread with this title

"I'm not trying to start an argument, but have you noticed how nearly all paedophiles are white males?"

..but that would be pointless

Thanks.
It's a shame people like you who are just out to turn a topic of reasonable debate into an argumentative free for all.
Grow up!

Sorry, please let me know in future which threads I am allowed to post to.

Thanks

TF

It's perfectly fine mate but you asking me to define Asian when I think the definition I gave was substantial for you to understand. Maybe I was wrong.

Someone said I was refering to people from Pakistan, well I wasn't because I didn't ask where their family heritage was from.
If Middle Eastern is more beneficial to you then OK, they were of middle eastern origin for your sake.

I've not been racist in any way, I'm not a racist person it was merely an observation. I apologised to those who may have been offended as it wasn't intended yet people think it's ok to pick a fight and start an argument.

It's a shame some users feel childish enough to do that... sad really (and no this isn't directed towards you Spyro)

There is nothing racist about the OP saying that in his experience, asian people don't acknowledge you stopping for them. DaBouncer has conceded that it might just be his perception that's the problem. Stop stirring!

Language is the only way we have of communicating so be careful with it, or you might give the impression that you are racist.

IMO the thread starter knew very well what would happen by putting a title like that!

Maybe I should start a thread with this title

"I'm not trying to start an argument, but have you noticed how nearly all paedophiles are white males?"

..but that would be pointless
It's small minded people that feel the need to bring thiis into a racist debate.
It was not ever intended be as such, but I appreciate that some idiots will try to turn it that way.

Am I not allowed to make an observation anymore?
If the people were white would you be making the same comments in this thread?

I made an observation (maybe a generalisation I don't know) but I wanted to ask a question to see if anyone else had noticed the same, or maybe they notice something different, maybe what I see as rude is not in some other cultures. However you think my post is unwarranted and in a racist fashion.

If it makes you sleep better at night then fine, think what you like I couldn't give a toss. I'm sure though however people have enough about them to see this post for what it is. And that's not racist.

are you referring to me Kathy? If so, then imnot stirring, just bringing the attention to something which I have an opinion on.

I have seen many of Dabouncers posts and he is a decent guy. It is rare for me to cross swords with him.

As you say, he has justified himself, and I see that.

yes bouncer u r reffering to pakis but the funny thing is u haven't got the balls to admit it.

i am pakistani and becuase of this post i will stick two fingers up at the next WHITE driver that lets me in!

u bloody idiot, get a life and go and drive in london then u will see who is rude

oh please do, if its a black ford focus that you do this to, you could well become part of my bumper

this is the only racist post on this thread, even worse it is insiting racial hatred.

.....and if i white person said "next time i see i middle eastern cross the road, i'll stick fingers up at him" there would be an absolute uproar

are you referring to me Kathy? If so, then imnot stirring, just bringing the attention to something which I have an opinion on.

I have seen many of Dabouncers posts and he is a decent guy. It is rare for me to cross swords with him.

As you say, he has justified himself, and I see that.

No love just talking more generally :)

Time to watch Doctors anyway lol

I dont drive so I cannot comment on road ettiquete, although I have been a passenger many times and understand what is being said in this thread, common courtesy isnt something which is too much too ask, and generally helps people have a better day (all in all - although I may be stretching this!).

If there is any prevelance of ethnic minorities not being polite to others whether it be in a car or as a pedestrian, I cannot imagine it is purely down to their ethnic origin. However, you never know how Asian people have been treated, particularly under the current oppressive political climate in society, which may explain certain individual's attitudes.

I would guess that there are many more "White Van Men (or Women!)" out there who have cut up both pedestrians and other drivers, and no-one would think twice about the colour of their skin - I would guess (again) that they are predominantly white.

What I saying is that politeness/rudeness isn't attirbutable to people because of their skin colour or ethnic origin/beliefs, its more likely to arise from their particular experiences in different situations. Without any stats though, its all simply conjecture.

It's small minded people that feel the need to bring thiis into a racist debate.
It was not ever intended be as such, but I appreciate that some idiots will try to turn it that way.

Am I not allowed to make an observation anymore?
If the people were white would you be making the same comments in this thread?

I made an observation (maybe a generalisation I don't know) but I wanted to ask a question to see if anyone else had noticed the same, or maybe they notice something different, maybe what I see as rude is not in some other cultures. However you think my post is unwarranted and in a racist fashion.

If it makes you sleep better at night then fine, think what you like I couldn't give a toss. I'm sure though however people have enough about them to see this post for what it is. And that's not racist.

Disappointing that the thread has moved away from the original post Dabouncer. I totally agree with your original post.

I have often found in my experience that Asian (not oriental!) generally do not acknowledge thanks for being let across or out at a junction or in fact do not generally let others out at a junction. I'm not saying all but a high percentage.

I like you dont think too much of it and often wondered whether there's a reason behind it that we dont know about.

Remember ppl that this is my observations and i will still let any car out at a junction regardless of driver colour (maybe a Blades sticker wont help you though!) :D

I dont drive so I cannot comment on road ettiquete, although I have been a passenger many times and understand what is being said in this thread, common courtesy isnt something which is too much too ask, and generally helps people have a better day (all in all - although I may be stretching this!).

If there is any prevelance of ethnic minorities not being polite to others whether it be in a car or as a pedestrian, I cannot imagine it is purely down to their ethnic origin. However, you never know how Asian people have been treated, particularly under the current oppressive political climate in society, which may explain certain individual's attitudes.

I would guess that there are many more "White Van Men (or Women!)" out there who have cut up both pedestrians and other drivers, and no-one would think twice about the colour of their skin - I would guess (again) that they are predominantly white.

What I am saying is that politeness/rudeness isn't attirbutable to people because of their skin colour or ethnic origin/beliefs, its more likely to arise from their particular experiences in different situations. Without any stats though, its all simply conjecture.

The problem is you can't tell by looking at someone whether they are British or from another country. If you are from another country chances are you will have been brought up with different manners and a different idea of what is rude.

I think it's important to be able to start threads like this without being accused of being racist - Max has made a good point about generalisations, and some people have provided some insight into some cultural differences which might explain some behaviours. Which is a good thing in my opinion. When I used to cycle to work and back in London, I used to ride through Upper Clapton, which is very heavily orthodox Jewish. For some reason, I used to find that orthodox Jewish drivers seemed a bit more reckless than most. But then, when you think about it, it was probably just that they were more identifiable as a group of people, whereas I probably tend not to look at your average white European as a "group", being one myself, and therefore am less likely to attribute certain behaviours to that "group".

If you never ask questions, how are you going to know the answers?

You mean they all look the same to you? What is this different look you are referring to?

He referred to Chinese looking different. Well if you and Spyro really haven't noticed, your eyes must be painted on!!!!!
Those of us not just here to pick a fight are all in agreement.

He referred to Chinese looking different. Well if you and Spyro really haven't noticed, your eyes must be painted on!!!!!
Those of us not just here to pick a fight are all in agreement.

Once again, how does me having a difference in opinion mean I am looking for a fight?

To be fair, DaBouncer, I thought your opening post was a little inflamatory.

I understood your point perfectly, but perhaps it could have been worded better?

Yes, I believe there are cultural differences in how people behave and what is seen as rude/impolite/acceptable behaviour. This issue could have been discussed better, I think, if it wasn't for an opening statement that appeared accusatory of the behaviour of a particular ethnic group.

Seeming to infer the behaviour of an entire group from a small number of examples can appear at best patronising and at worst discrimonatory. I doubt that this was the intention, but nonetheless (and quite rightly, I think) people are going to jump on you for it.

There are interesting articles about this issue. Sheffield University used to hand out leaflets about the differences in customs and 'polite' etc behaviour to students to try to raise awareness of the different cultural expectations of foreign students. There are indubitably differences in customs that we would all do well to learn more about.

I have no idea about whether Asian people are less likely to nod thanks when you let their cars out, but can tell you that plenty of white people fail to say thanks when you hold the door open for them...

Chicken Monkey x

If i were to say that in my experience, a lot of Asians drive Japanese cars, is that racist?

No.

On the same tokem I could say from what ive seen, a lot of white English people drive Fords? Is that racist?

No.

Its an observation, which is what DaBouncer had about those two girls crossing the road. I share his observation about receiving less gratitute from Asian drivers than British drivers. Am I being racist for sharing that observation?

No.

Its no different to me saying from what i've seen, old people are bad at driving or kids have no respect for their elders. It may seem like a generalisation, but if that is what I have seen, then that is my general observation. I'm not out to find exceptions to the rule either.

Spyro, you do seem to be holding the wooden spoon in this thread though (for stirring), making something out of nothing. Its needless provocation like this that has brought this country to the state of affairs it currently faces.

People are too scared to talk about, or even mention race for fear of inadvertedly using the incorrect term, offending somebody and then being branded something they're not and its bloody annoying.

I am a white british male. If someone calls me white, brit, european etc - I dont care, because they are all true. They may be generalising about me, but so what? Look past the colour of skin and to the person themselves.

Every colour, race, religion etc have their good and bad people. Dont think though that because one observation upon Asians driving manners is negative that we are being racist. Nobody is perfect, but some people need to think a little harder before needlessly drawing the race card out of the wallet - eh Spyro....

If someone lets me out, I thank them, irrespective of race or whatever... and if I let them out, I expect to be thanked likewise.

When I don't get thanked, I try not to get annoyed, I just pity the person who lacks in the manners department. It must be awful to be so wrapped up in your own world that you cant thank someone who does you a good deed.

Whos drawing the race card? I was merely asking DaBouncer what he meant by the term asian. Simple as. It all got a bit out of hand after that. This has been answered now. So now I know.

Every colour, race, religion etc have their good and bad people. Dont think though that because one observation upon Asians driving manners is negative that we are being racist. Nobody is perfect, but some people need to think a little harder before needlessly drawing the race card out of the wallet

Absolutely 100% agree. I work with an Indian guy, who happens to be my best mate at work. He complains of how easy it is to pull the racism card in this country.

He hates England. Not because some white people are racist, but because we are battered into believing that 50% of what we say about an ethnic minority is racist.

Yes, there are racists around. No, this thread is not racist.

When i see a person, whether he/she be black/white/brown/yellow/polka dot pink, I see A PERSON.

oh and as for being PC. Im probably the most NON PC person there is.

oh and as for being PC. Im probably the most NON PC
person there is.

your issue with the word 'asian' is one of the most overpc things i've seen on this forum

Yes, innocent threads like these only bring out the repressive tendandcies of those on the left for free speech.

I mean, the BNP being brought up... it's utter nonsense.

Sheffield is the standard-bearer for happy and fulfilled immigration in S Yorks, bringing the BNP up would be right in the W Yorks/Lancashire "M62 fault line" where things erupt constantly and the fabric of society which binds their citizens together seems almost dieased on occasions.

Surely not in Sheff, though.

people have no manners these days.

your issue with the word 'asian' is one of the most overpc things i've seen on this forum

Now come on Rocketpig. I dont care what he meant by the term asian. I just wanted him to clarify who he meant. Nothing more nothing less. It then turned into a debate.

weve just got a morroccan working in the CNC room where i work at work
and he must be the politist person in the whole factory tbh
always says please and thankyou etc

also knows all his numeracy and literacy to function with drill sizes, panel sizes and offsets too

Now come on Rocketpig. I dont care what he meant by the term asian. I just wanted him to clarify who he meant. Nothing more nothing less. It then turned into a debate.

yeah fair play...please accept my apology

lets be serious here for a second, the important thing is, was the rims spinning in the right direction?

ethnicity is used as an excuse these days.

Yes, innocent threads like these only bring out the repressive tendandcies of those on the left for free speech.


Balls, I'm one of the most left wing posters on this forum and I have been defending DaB throughout.

lets be serious here for a second, the important thing is, was the rims spinning in the right direction?


????????????? Explain please

Balls, I'm one of the most left wing posters on this forum and I have been defending DaB throughout.

Fair enough. I'm guilty of a gross generalisation. ;) unlike the person who started the thread.

Fair do's.

rims them things you see on wheels, shiny.
if you still dont know what im refering to, switch on a hip hop music channel, and some dude will be riding around, talking about his rims.

Merc, Jag or BMW drivers never indicate, Rover drivers always use the middle lane of motorways irrespective of whether or not they need to.


. they're not generalisations, it's fact:hihi: seriously, you do have a point but I always nod or wave out of courtesy. I think it is the new way these days. No manners:|

Now come on Rocketpig. I dont care what he meant by the term asian. I just wanted him to clarify who he meant. Nothing more nothing less. It then turned into a debate.
Spyro, I don't want to drag this up again but it's pretty plain to see that everyone knew what I meant when I used the term asian.
Maybe not everyone agreed it was the best term, and instead I could have used Middle Eastern... but never the less they knew what I meant and clarification was not necessary.

You on the other hand basically kept stirring to obtain a response you were more happy with. I don't believe you didn't understand to whom I was referring (especially since you noted that specifically said not oriental) but you wanted me to say something else.

Hence the reason you are seen as the one stirring the proverbial pot.
At the end of the day it's past now so lets move on.

Again for those who may have been offended, insensed or inflamed by my comments I apologise and maybe a better choice of words could have been used I grant you. However it's plain to see to most people that this thread was never intended to be racist, nor was it posted racist nor have I been racist in my comments.

I thank everyone for their input and observations also.

rims them things you see on wheels, shiny.
if you still dont know what im refering to, switch on a hip hop music channel, and some dude will be riding around, talking about his rims.

Thanks for the advice TopMan.....I use where possible Standard Spoken and written English............ I am suitably chastised, being from the Planet Zog, educated before 1964:hihi:

Fair enough. I'm guilty of a gross generalisation. ;) unlike the person who started the thread.

Fair do's.
........ :roll:..........

Can I just say DaBouncer. you say its me stirring, when in fact I am NOT the one that keeps bringing the subject back up.

they call us whatever they want. they have their own radio station fro heavens sake asian fm, if we had white fm there would be hell on

Can I just say DaBouncer. you say its me stirring, when in fact I am NOT the one that keeps bringing the subject back up.
Where did I say you were stirring? Who's bringing it back up?

Either way, so long as you're happy with the responses given we can all move on now. Agreed?

Yeah its alright DaBounder. I think I posted a while back saying that you have answered my initial query, yet people kept the subject going.

Seriously, I really didnt care who you meant when you used the term. I really was just asking.

Thats the last word from me :D

they call us whatever they want. they have their own radio station fro heavens sake asian fm, if we had white fm there would be hell on

Great comment :rolleyes: :loopy:

they call us whatever they want. they have their own radio station fro heavens sake asian fm, if we had white fm there would be hell on

Actually in most asian countries I've visited there's been at least one english radio station :confused:

i mean in the uk if we had white fm (literally called that) we would be accused for being racist!?

i mean in the uk if we had white fm (literally called that) we would be accused for being racist!?

Who would be doing this accusing?

asains. so pc these days i have a friend who is black and i know for a fact he uses his colour to his advantage to get out of situations.

Thanks for the advice TopMan.....I use where possible Standard Spoken and written English............ I am suitably chastised, being from the Planet Zog, educated before 1964:hihi:

Thats right Topman, Shoeshine has very elequant english

Get in (http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/science/media/Tony-Bridgett-fly-fishing-f.jpg)

:)

I'll tell you what IS racist - when job spots say "We particularly welcome applications from ethnic minorities"

Translate that to a job in the UK and it means you will get biased or preferential treatment because of your origin/race. That is NOT equal opportunities - the person who gets the job should be the best candidate, irrespective of their cultural background.

MOD: Please remember the title of this thread: Do NOT turn this into a racist slanging match please!
and not go off onto what is and isn't racist.

Max, so what relevance is spyro's recent pic postthen?

Max, so what relevance is spyro's recent pic postthen?

Dunno 'cos I get this message:

Access to this site is denied because it violates Outokumpu policy and is categorized as: "High Bandwidth;Entertainment".

Max, so what relevance is spyro's recent pic postthen?

It was a joke, and was aimed at lozxxx. Keep your hair on.

To be fair, DaBouncer, I thought your opening post was a little inflamatory.

I understood your point perfectly, but perhaps it could have been worded better?

Yes, I believe there are cultural differences in how people behave and what is seen as rude/impolite/acceptable behaviour. This issue could have been discussed better, I think, if it wasn't for an opening statement that appeared accusatory of the behaviour of a particular ethnic group.

Seeming to infer the behaviour of an entire group from a small number of examples can appear at best patronising and at worst discrimonatory. I doubt that this was the intention, but nonetheless (and quite rightly, I think) people are going to jump on you for it.

There are interesting articles about this issue. Sheffield University used to hand out leaflets about the differences in customs and 'polite' etc behaviour to students to try to raise awareness of the different cultural expectations of foreign students. There are indubitably differences in customs that we would all do well to learn more about.

I have no idea about whether Asian people are less likely to nod thanks when you let their cars out, but can tell you that plenty of white people fail to say thanks when you hold the door open for them...

Chicken Monkey x

I wish I'd said that.

MOD: Please remember the title of this thread: and not go off onto what is and isn't racist.

well what if that is part of the problem!!? he was asking our opinions

excuse me but i'm an asian girl who has just bought a new car. Majority of the time i give way to the cars i can, put my hand up to the drivers who give me away. don't think it has anything to do with colour though!

I'll tell you what IS racist - when job spots say "We particularly welcome applications from ethnic minorities"

Translate that to a job in the UK and it means you will get biased or preferential treatment because of your origin/race. That is NOT equal opportunities - the person who gets the job should be the best candidate, irrespective of their cultural background.

Catch 22 though, they have to say that asians or whoever are entitled to apply due to the equal opportunities laws, the same with inviting disabled people to apply for the same reason, just don't get me started on the fact that us disabled people don't even get a look in for jobs :rant:

Catch 22 though, they have to say that asians or whoever are entitled to apply due to the equal opportunities laws, the same with inviting disabled people to apply for the same reason, just don't get me started on the fact that us disabled people don't even get a look in for jobs :rant:

I just feel that it degrades and slants the process of applying for a job. Sadly its about quotas and I dread to think how much fiddling goes on just so a company can look 'ethical' - potentially at the expense of better candidates.

Dunno, whenever I let ppl out at junctions or across the road they never wave or smile or gesture etc. I dont let them out for thanks, I let them out just because I can...! If they say thanks, its cool.. if they don't, they just lack the common decency. I dont lose owt. ;)

I'll tell you what IS racist - when job spots say "We particularly welcome applications from ethnic minorities"

Translate that to a job in the UK and it means you will get biased or preferential treatment because of your origin/race. That is NOT equal opportunities - the person who gets the job should be the best candidate, irrespective of their cultural background.

Positive discrimination causes all sorts of gripes and for some good reasons. I wouldn't say it was racist, though as the intention is that the workforce of public authorities (council, police etc) represents the population they serve.

I just feel that it degrades and slants the process of applying for a job. Sadly its about quotas and I dread to think how much fiddling goes on just so a company can look 'ethical' - potentially at the expense of better candidates.

Quotas are by definition prejudicial to finding the best qualified person for the job.

Off topic. Political parties please take note. I will not vote for any party that has a candidate selection strategy based on anything but suitability for the job.

Political parties please take note. I will not vote for any party that has a candidate selection strategy based on anything but suitability for the job.

What about selection based on their politics? Are you excluding that too?

excuse me but i'm an asian girl who has just bought a new car. Majority of the time i give way to the cars i can, put my hand up to the drivers who give me away. don't think it has anything to do with colour though!

Not your fault my love.... I am sure you are a polite and courteous driver.... colour doesn't come into this.... only manners. Some white people are more ignorant than others.... so I have noticed on the road and I am white myself. :D

Positive discrimination causes all sorts of gripes and for some good reasons. I wouldn't say it was racist, though as the intention is that the workforce of public authorities (council, police etc) represents the population they serve.

There shouldn't be a need for any organisation to promote that it is welcoming of ethnic minorities. All they need to state is that they are an equal opportunities employer. It doesn't degrade the application process and the best candidate gets the job, which is fair.

Imagine the outcry if it said "We particularly welcome applications from ethnic MAJORITIES" If it isn't fair one way round, it isn't fair the other. Racist or not, it is wrong.

DaBouncer, I'm a teenager of 16, white however and I'd say thank you, give a wave or a thumbs up :thumbsup: would appreciate you letting me cross the road :)

Its not all teens :)