My son is a (rock) drummer and uses the cellar to practise in. We've tried to build some soundproofing in using pallets & carpet/foam, but it's nowhere near effective enough for our next-door neighbour. Does anyone have any expertise in this area? We can't afford to have it done professionally, but could sink some money into it.

We bought him a practise kit, but he says it's cr*p ;)

Unless anyone knows better, I think it's bad news for you.

I live next to someone that used to run a recording + practice studio. He was always looking for ways to soundproof to stop complaints from his industrial and residential neighbours.

I wanted a drum kit for my basement and was looking for his advice. He has two young kids, so it's a little delicate.

His thoughts were that you can mask the treble of the cymbals, but that no matter what you do, taking out the bass of the bass drum / toms is near impossible. The ceiling of my basement is next door to the floor of his lounge, so the sound will just run straight across. He said I should get it anyway, then he could come and play with it, but that it would always be noisy.

In the end, I've gone for an electronic kit, which is quiet. However, if your son is in a band, it's not as easy to practice / gig with and isn't anywhere near as cool.

That said, things you could do include;

Beefing up your basement door. If it's noisy in the upper parts of your house, it will carry sideways from there.

Stuffing the bass drum with pillows / a duvet.

Buying practice pads - rubber pads that can be put on the drums to dampen them. Not so much fun, but a comprimise. A bit of basic sound proofing (foam stuck to the walls for example), might then be enough to take out the cymbal noise.

Good luck.

i can do you a nice line in some egg boxes, but it could take a while to get enough to do the whole room...

egg boxes were going to be my suggestion. You could also build an extra set of parition walls with either an air gap or sound proofing (foam/fibre glass) between them and the original wall.
Cork is excellent at absorbing sound, but very expensive.

I guess the problem is sound going sideways through into next doors cellar and diagonally through into whatever room they have above the cellar. So a partition wall on that side and a suspended ceiling should help. Build them out of the thick plasterboard and make minimal connections to the surface behind them.

My son is a (rock) drummer and uses the cellar to practise in. We've tried to build some soundproofing in using pallets & carpet/foam, but it's nowhere near effective enough for our next-door neighbour. Does anyone have any expertise in this area? We can't afford to have it done professionally, but could sink some money into it.

We bought him a practise kit, but he says it's cr*p ;)
Is it a terraced house? If so forget it, nothing short of a complete professional installation will stop the sound...vibration factor is another very expensive problem. Best to find a practice room for rent cheap....or use someone with deaf neighbours....

Tell us how much you can afford to spend and I can give you some suggestions. Also what's the ceiling height?

For the best sound proofing you're going to need to build another structure inside the current one (a false ceiling) and where they are connected they need to be of something that is going to effectively isolate the new plasterboard ceiling from the joists above - normally you'd use resilient bars. You can then improve on this design by adding accoustic insulation (mineral wool/accoustic mat/neoprene) before fitting the new plasterboard ceiling.

It all comes down to cost.

We are just adding three new band practise rooms to our setup in the basement. After doing a lot of reading and contemplating options we are applying 2pack foam (spray application-quite expensive) to an inch thickness then adding dot & dab plasterboarding over the top.

The foam itself creates a SOFT barrier (also adds the equivalent insulation of at least 75mm rockwool and creates a waterproof barrier and is class 1 fire retardent). The plasterboard on top adds in places an air gap but also a HARD surface.

To effectively reduce noise there has to be a mix of HARD & SOFT materials.
Also the doors are to be foamed inside and plasterboarded.

The foam creates a completely seamless barrier.
This will reduces the noise significantly. To decrease noise more then further soft/hard layers should be added.

Yep foam will work. Basically you need to isolate the interior so that no vibrations will travel through the structure - hence the resilient bars/channel. There's plenty of ways to do it but depends on space and money.

i have an egg box, if everyone here on the forum donates just 1 egg box that should be more than sufficient

that sounds interesting Nucad, what are the details?

I just looked up the foam.

Does the cellar still need sealing first or is the foam sufficient?

So long as its relatively dry the foam will do the whole job. (although the walls must be completely dried for application). Its about £18 per sq mtr installed or about £10 sq mtr DIY (although its not easy to apply and dries in around 30-60 seconds so its a no stopping for tea type install).

I will be applying my own as we have the correct breathing equipment and i have sprayed vehicles in the past so am confident about its application.

Without experience or CORRECT breathing equipment DO NOT D>I>Y. :thumbsup:

From someone else with a drum kit in the cellar of a terrace house just try and find a time when the neighbours are out!!

http://www.vicfirth.com/products/pads&mutes.html

Rather than soundproof the room which if it is a terraced house won't be very effective in my opinion try using these pads on the drums.

save your money, sell the practice kit, buy an electric pad kit... there are some very good ones about (ok they couple of grand but im sure you could get one cheaper option?)

So long as its relatively dry the foam will do the whole job. (although the walls must be completely dried for application). Its about £18 per sq mtr installed or about £10 sq mtr DIY (although its not easy to apply and dries in around 30-60 seconds so its a no stopping for tea type install).

I will be applying my own as we have the correct breathing equipment and i have sprayed vehicles in the past so am confident about its application.

Without experience or CORRECT breathing equipment DO NOT D>I>Y. :thumbsup:

Doesn't look too difficult to apply, does it need something beyond a normal dust filter mask in the way of breathing equipment?

How do you ensure that your walls are completely dry first, electric heater down in the cellar for a week?

Is it a terraced house? If so forget it, nothing short of a complete professional installation will stop the sound...vibration factor is another very expensive problem. Best to find a practice room for rent cheap....or use someone with deaf neighbours....

I have to agree. Absolutely nothing will be very effective except maybe a very expensive profesisonal installation. It just isn't fair on the neighbours to inflict this level of noise on them. A house mate of mine used to have a drum kit in the basement and my room was 3 floors above it - and the noise still used to do my head in. From the sitting room above the cellar, the TV was completely inaudible whatever volume it was turned up to.

Industrial de-humidifier and dry heat (normally electric).

You will need a dust & FUME mask suitably rated to British Standards. It should be a full face unit to prevent skin contamination.

You need to clean the solvents away from the air as the foam is a 2part chemical compound.
This is especially important as you are working in a very poorly ventilated space.

how do you know that soundproofing it was impossible though unless you tried?

A single layer of flooring isn't going to stop much, far less than a layer of damping material and a layer of plasterboard below the layer of flooring.

Eggboxes don't reduce sound or help with sound insulation. Their only possible function is to break up the line of a straight wall to reduce reverb if you are recording.

Do not put a decent drumkit in a cellar unless you are 100% sure the space is not damp. This means "above the damp proof course" or in a cellar which is heated and tanked. If you do put a drumkit in a normal cellar the wooden shells of the drums will become dull sounding and ruined forever as even a slight permanent dampness will pervade into the wooden fibres.
The result on the sound of the kit is it will loose it's sharp sound and all drums will sound like soggy thuds instead of sharp thumps.
Even taking a drumkit which has been in a cellar for a year and returning it to a centrally heated bedroom for months and putting new skins on doesn't bring the original sound back, they are ruined forever.

Industrial de-humidifier and dry heat (normally electric).

You will need a dust & FUME mask suitably rated to British Standards. It should be a full face unit to prevent skin contamination.

You need to clean the solvents away from the air as the foam is a 2part chemical compound.
This is especially important as you are working in a very poorly ventilated space.

sounds like having it done by professionals might be easiest. Unless you work at a good rate?

Won't be for a good while yet, I just fancy doing the cellar as a project, but the main rooms still to be done take priority.

Even the smallest of gaps will pass sound hence the single application of foam across the walls & ceiling. If plasterboard is then added you get a totally insulated air gap with nothing SOLID bridging the space. If this process is repeated again the sound is decreased further.

Just adding thicker foam or double plasterboard will make little difference as its the mixed surfaces that deaden sound.

If you want to wait a couple of weeks we will probably have completed ours and we will take DB readings before and after to actually monitor the effects during the layering process.

A friend of mine did his by boarding the walls and filling the space between with polystyrene chips, the sort of thing you get in packing cases.

Make him use muffled drum sticks and take the skins from his drums, save a fortune

A friend of mine did his by boarding the walls and filling the space between with polystyrene chips, the sort of thing you get in packing cases.
Well that is probably highly dangerous due to the cyanide which is given off if someone accidentally sets light to it with a tab end or while doing some diy.

It would be much safer to use fire retardent rockwool. The classic rock bar ceilings were clad with something like that which allowed them to continue having live music, without upsetting the neighbours.

They are an immense fire hazard take a few outside and light em you wont need petrol.

At least it will save the insurance company some money if it ever catches fire cos they wont be payingout.:o

A friend of mine did his by boarding the walls and filling the space between with polystyrene chips, the sort of thing you get in packing cases.

Well that's the cheapest suggestion (aside from the egg-boxes) :)

Thanks for all your input - still working on a reasonably priced solution.

read all of these , does any one have any up todate ides . im doing part of my garage out as a drum studio

Wow this is an old thread resurected.

Since this we have used the foam on numerous occasions.

The advice regarding soundproofing hasnt changed.

Theres a few simple rules.

--mix hard and soft surfaces ie foams, plasterboard, rubber etc

--add layers to improve until sufficient sound proofing achieved

--ensure there is true isolation of the room (ANYthing bridging the layers will decay the effect)

-- rent a room from me its done where required and generally doesnt matter as after 5 in the warehouse i dont have neighbours !!.

The walls are likely to end up needing to be around 9inches thick to achieve a decent sound reduction.

We used spray foam then dot and dab plasterboard (leaving air space where possible between) then more foam then plasterboard again then foam then carpets. Ideally also need a seperate door ie 2 doors with gap between and both doors with seals and foam applied.

I currently have 2 rooms available so if you choose the easy option give me a ring.

If you prefer to convert ring and i will come and look at how feasible this kind of install would be in the proposed space.

Also remember this once sealed you will get no air exchange and the heat build up is phenomenal in such a superheated space.
So you will need to factor in regular ventilation breaks

You need to make sure that you have a detached house a very long way from anybody else. If you haven't, or can't buy one, you'll just have to face up to the fact that you can't afford to play drums, and that any attempt by your neighbours to kill you will be entirely justified! :D

Well that is probably highly dangerous due to the cyanide which is given off if someone accidentally sets light to it with a tab end or while doing some diy.

It would be much safer to use fire retardent rockwool. The classic rock bar ceilings were clad with something like that which allowed them to continue having live music, without upsetting the neighbours.Polystyrene worms would breach building regulations. Still, it would be a quick death. :D

My son is a (rock) drummer and uses the cellar to practise in. We've tried to build some soundproofing in using pallets & carpet/foam, but it's nowhere near effective enough for our next-door neighbour. Does anyone have any expertise in this area? We can't afford to have it done professionally, but could sink some money into it.

We bought him a practise kit, but he says it's cr*p ;)

Pretty much what you want to do is is try get hold of some rockwool.

With a drum kit you have high frequency from the cymbals and lows from the bass drum to contend with.

See http://www.bobgolds.com/AbsorptionCoefficients.htm

For a general idea for thickness and density against sound reduction.

Don't forget about the ceiling too.

The best way to soundproof is to line the cellar with lead. Gold would do but is a bit dazzling !