Hello.
I have just read an archived artical on this site about becoming an driving instructor, this is an area i have much interest in as i love driving, meeting new people and want to earn a serious amount of money.

What i cant understand is that the person on that artical said that the high end earner's are on 30,000 a year?? i have a friend who is on 60-70,000 a year working for BSM ok he does 12 hours a day 5 days a week and 8 on saturday but still this is quite a difference from 30,000.

Also can someone explain why you cannot go straight into 40+ hours a week why do you have to build up? the reason for this is that if i was to do this i would want to earn what my friend does, i'm used to working that amount of hours anyway so that is not a problem.

Thanks for you help

Originally posted by Mr_Durden

i have a friend who is on 60-70,000 a year working for BSM ok he does 12 hours a day 5 days a week and 8 on saturday but still this is quite a difference from 30,000.

Thanks for you help

I think there is a bit of misinformation here. Based on the hours your friend works and allowing for 4 hours travelling time per day he will be earning roughly £50,000 gross per year. Out of this he will need to pay BSM his franchise fee which I believe is around 400 - 500 per week (It does include the car though). So as a (very) rough guide that will immediately halve his "earnings".

I think Saxon will bear me out with this one - Driving Instruction is being advertised to the hilt at the moment by training companies that need to recruit pupils and a lot of people see it as an easy way to make money.

This is a total misconception as most driving instructors are only charging between £17 and £22 per hour. Compare this with your local taxi driver who can make a lot more than this (my son paid £14 recently for a 15 minute ride from the town centre to home) without providing tuition and without forking out £3,000 + for the training in the first place.

If you want to earn a "serious" amount of money don't choose driving instruction. However, if you will be satisfied with a reasonable income and will gain pleasure from a fulfilling occupation after approx 2 years of training (if you pass first time round) then go for it.

My wife took the plunge and loves the job:)

OH, nearly forgot,

If you do decide to go for this there's a lot of good info here

http://www.ukdic.co.uk/forum/index.php

The adverts currently being run by The Instructor College really annoy me.

Yes £30k as a top line is achievable (but bear in mind thats before ALL your expenses - see below) but I'm sorry, I simply don't believe your friends claims of £60-70k, even at BSM's prices.

12 hours tuiton every day simply isn't possible when you factor in time spent travelling between pupils - even allowing for only 15 minutes between each pupil, you'd be looking at a 16.5 hour day, so he'd have to be starting at 7am to be finished for 11.30pm. Make it half an hour between pupils, and he'd never sleep so try to look behind what he's telling you. I also pity his pupils if thats the number of hours he's doing, as the last ones of the day are not getting the same quality as the first ones.

BSM (known in the trade as 'Blood Sucking Monsters' or 'Bring Some Money') charge £21.50 per hour in Sheffield, so taking the (unobtainable) figures you quoted, 68 hours at £21.50 = £1462 per week. BSM's franchise fee is currently approx £320 per week so gross income would be £1142 per week or just under £60k per annum. Also, doesn't he take holidays?

Granted BSM will pay his car insurance but however, out of that he's got to take:

Fuel (c£3 per hour = £204 per week)
Tax (would be paying 40% on those figures)
Pension (he is after all self employed)
Allowance for time off

so all in all I don't believe a word he says - sorry!!

Anyone doing more than 40-45 pupil hours per week is doing too much and at the end of the day, the pupil suffers.

As for qualifying to be a driving instructor, look at my post from some time ago about the route you have to take:-
There are 3 exams to pass.

1. Theory and Hazard Perception test
He can do this on his own. Just as the questions and answers are published for learner drivers, so they are for prospective driving instructors. However, unlike the learner theory test (and perhaps not unsurprisingly), it is much harder.

Learner drivers have to get at least 30 out of 35 questions right to pass the Theory Test. Prospective DI's have to answer 100 questions (not just about road signs etc but also about how people learn to drive) and have to get 85%. However, the questions are split into 4 groups of 25, and you have to get at least 85% in each section, not just overall. So if you get 100% in one section but 84% in another, you will still fail.

On the Hazard Perception, you have to get 57/75, whereas learners have to get 44/75.

Once you have passed the T&HPT, you then have 2 years to pass the other 2 tests.

2. Test of Driving Ability
This is another driving test on which you will be driving for one hour and only be allowed 6 minor driving faults in that time and no serious or dangerous faults. Compare that to the learner test where they are allowed 15 minor faults in 35 minutes.

You will cover all types of roads, including motorways, and have to do one of each reverse manoeuvre:-

Left reverse
Right reverse
Turn in the Road
Parallel Park

You are only allowed 3 attempts in total at this test, so if you fail 3, you cannot re-apply to be an ADI for two years.

Any decent driving instructor should be able to get you up to standard, and it will be far cheaper to take this route as you will only pay for the lessons you need rather than the lump sum memtioned above.

3. Test of Instructional Ability
This is where you must show a senior examiner from the DSA that you have the right attitude and ability to teach someone to drive using the prescribed formula as devised by the DSA. Once again, you only get 3 attempts.

For this you should use an ORDIT registered instructor and again pay by the hour.

This is the hardest of all the 3 tests and the drop out rate at this stage is very high. Of 100 people starting out to train as driving instructors, only about 15 will make it all the way through.

You may have been drawn by the adverts that state you can earn £30,000 a year. Yes you can but what the adverts don't tell you is that this is top line, and all your expenses have to come off this. So for example:
Fuel and other running costs about £6000
Advertising £2000 upwards
Telephone £500 upwards
Insurance £500
Sundry expenses (stationery, equipment, books, etc) £3000 upwards

You could of course go with a franchise from BSM, but they'll charge you about £310 a week for this.

All driving instructors are self-employed, so there is also the downside of this to consider:-
No sick pay.
No income when off work.
Your own taxes and NI to pay.
Annual accounts to prepare.
No pension unless you contribute yourself.
Long and unsociable hours 40 hours of teaching soon becomes 50/60 hours out of the house when you consider travelling time.

And of course, when you first start, you don't just walk into 40 hours a week - it takes months to get to that level so you need capital behind you and also the full support of your family.

You also need to have less than 5 points on your licence and be over 21. You will also be subject to a check by the DSA every few years to make sure you're up to standard and if you're not, you're out!

If you need any more info, feel free to PM me.


And finally, you can't walk into 40 hours per week because most driving schools don't have waiting lists that long. Bearing in mind that most pupils doing one hour a week with their instructor will be with them for between 6 and 9 months, who is going to wait that long for a space to come up? They'll go elsewhere.

Thanks for all you info on this it has been a great help, but i have to say i am more inclined to believe my mate!!

This is based on the fact that his pass rate is 98% passed myself 1st time with him as did my partner and a few friends.
I have seen where he lives and believe me you could not afford the house he lives in if you did not earn that sort of money (his wife does not work, 3 kids)

The hours that he works are true he starts at 07:30 finishes at 07:30. 07:30 - 16:00 Sat, the lesson prices round here are 25 pounds an hour 27 if you go to Windsor he wil only do a 2 hour lesson so that rules out a lot of travelling time between clients.

based on these figures even if you took 2 hours a day out of your time only doing 5 clients a day and 3 on saturday thats still

72,800 a year take off fuel at 204 a week thats 62,192 take off 300 a week for your franchise which after 1 year service is only 48 weeks is 47,792 with this you get free accident and sickness cover reduced RAC cover, suppor and help from BSM, your car which they buy, insure and maintain as well as giving you a spare just incase.

Now if you are smart you can easily get your earnings down to less than 30,000 a year so you'll only be paying 18% tax which is 24,600 adding back on the 17,792 that you lost for tax reasons is 42,392 clear money!! and i will not be paying for the coarse.

Also bear in mind that i took off 2 hours a day to get those figures that is 100% achievable

Senior Project Managers up london earn 70,000 a year plus car and benefits take off 40% tax is 28,000 so really becoming a driving instructor is a great career move for anyone who loves driving bearing in mind aswell that the car is yours for personal use.

The hours and service you give i think depend on the person at the end of the day i would love to just do 12 hours a day considering i do around 18 a day 5 days a week 4 hours of that are travelling a day and i work in the construction industry...

any thoughts on this would be great, and NO he does not take holiday.

Tell him to get a life before he kills himself..

lol, he doesn't do too bad considering he's been doing it 12 years.

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
becoming a driving instructor is a great career move for anyone who loves driving

You will do very little driving as an instructor - your pupils will do it all.

And lastly remember the quote "There are lies, damned lies and statistics"

I'm sorry but having been in the industry for some years now, I just don't believe him. Starting work at 7.30am and finishing at 7.30pm is not unusual but don't forget thats not 'working hours' - he has dead time travelling between pupils.

And I don't believe his pass rate either.

Sorry!

I'm not about to get into a debate about it with everyone, I know what I know, end of.

If i thought it would not incriminate him i'd give you his name so you could check for yourself.

I have no reason to lie or make this up i'm not trying to impress anyone, i have done my research and am choosing this as a career move the statistics are based on fact.
Go to the BSM website or the internet and do the home work.

You may already be in the job so ask around you could also consider the possiblity that he is a business man and knows his stuff, does not mean everyone else is the same.
as i said before those figures are worked out even though i took 2 hours a day off so there is your "Dead time"

Hello again.

Just to clarify what i already knew i thought i would share the information i have just been given and hopefully it will get people into the "**** i'm gonna do some homework" state!!

I have just been speaking to an advisor from Learn Direct about this subject and based on the figures that ii gave everyone in this post and his own knowledge the income i mentioned is 100,000% achieveable.

One thing that Driving Insructors should know is that not everyone has the same learning ability, you may have been in the game for years doesn't mean your good, or smart.

Hmmm.... methinks Mr_Durden might indeed be a troll - 5 posts and all on this subject.

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
I have just been speaking to an advisor from Learn Direct about this subject and based on the figures that ii gave everyone in this post and his own knowledge the income i mentioned is 100,000% achieveable.

WTF do Learn Direct know about it? Of course they'll tell you that 'on your figures' its obtainable - simple maths will tell you that! What I'm saying is that its NOT obtainable in the real world (or at least in these parts its not) unless you work all hours God sends. And thats not good for the pupils. I would think that anyone on the receiving end of the last lesson of the day really isn't getting their moneyworth.

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
One thing that Driving Insructors should know is that not everyone has the same learning ability, you may have been in the game for years doesn't mean your good, or smart.

Maybe not but I do know what I'm talking about, which is more than you do.

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
You may already be in the job so ask around you could also consider the possiblity that he is a business man and knows his stuff,

And so do I, which is more than you do. I wouldn't be running a multi-car school if I didn't.

Anyway, have the last word if you like - I'm happy in the knowledge that you're talking a load of twaddle so.........byeeee

Nice one Ken:clap: :hihi:

Originally posted by Mr_Durden

Senior Project Managers up london earn 70,000 a year plus car and benefits take off 40% tax is 28,000 so really becoming a driving instructor is a great career move for anyone who loves driving bearing in mind aswell that the car is yours for personal use.


I had to sign up just to say this, you really dont know what your on about, your trying to make out as though you know how to dodge the tax system etc, when you clearly dont even know how it works!

You would pay 40% tax on anything above say 30,000 a year, and you would pay the lower bracket on anything below that. So do your homework before you try and be the big man!!!

(PS those numbers may not be accurate, just used as an example)

I think everyone has just jumped on the band wagon to have thier little say...

What originally was a very good question has now turned into something totally argumentitive.

I dont doubt anyone on this site nor do i claim to know what i am talking about, what i have done is used simple maths, knowledge and fact to get to where i am..

I am a Tape & Joiner by trade which can bring you 20,000 - 100,000 a year if you can get the right work, try talking to some people that you can earn that sort of money and you get laughed at, especially from those that have been in the trade for years.
The trouble is, sometimes people do not have the ability to see outside of thier own lives and believe that because they have been doing it all the time, for years even, that they are full of knowledge and know whats what, in truth that is very little the case.
I spoke to my mate the other day about general stuff nothing in particular and asked him how many of his pupils failed last year? 1, year before that 1, year before that 2.
Now do i believe him? well you lot wouldn't and the fact that i know him, passed by him, (and partner, friends...) also the fact that he used to be an examiner owns a house worth about 350,000 makes everything that i have said a little more believable. I have no reason to disbelieve him, he has no reason to lie.

This is not about me having the last word at all, this is about a subject i have a lot of interest in and am doing my homework.

I could also tell you the structure of how he teaches, how every lesson for every pupil is exactly the same, his teaching methods do not require you to be focused 100% because once you have learnt the structure its all self explanatory... but you would not listen..

I could tell you how whenever we would go to the test centre to perform manouvers we would watch all of these minor companies come in and completely screw it up,? but how is this possible they are all driving instructors, simple they do not have a structure a formular, they are teaching how they have been taught not taking the time to better themselves.
3 people where on test the same day as me, i was the only one who passed.
No i am not bragging!! just trying to make some understand of the possibilties.

In truth when i first came to this site i thought everyone like me would have done some research, if i was in a job and someone told me i could earn 40 grand more i would want to know how, its not my fault you cant work 12 hours a day even if you could does not mean your pupils will suffer, like i said before 12 hours to me would be a nice short day compared to what i work now.

I dont care if you want to slag me off, i dont care if you dont believe me.. it just means that the less money you make!! the more i make! i'd rather you didn't beleive me.

P.s anethatist, your post does not make sense.

You mention that your friend has a £350k house near Windsor. I take it you mean the Windsor in Berkshire. If so, then you wouldn't get much more than a terrace or small bungalow for that sort of money:

3 bed bungalow in Windsor (http://www.findaproperty.com/agent.aspx?agentid=6352&opt=prop&pid=352809)

As a matter of interest, why pick on a Sheffield forum to show off your friend's good fortune?

Whatever, Mr_Durden:loopy:

Just to clarify he does not live in windsor and i am not showing off his good fortune mearly using it as an example, also i did not pick on this forum as you say, i came across it whilst doing research on Driving Instruction..

I will not be posting anymore on this site as clearly you are all not at the stage that we are down here, on the plus side of it i had a very indepth conversation with my mate and am looking forward to becoming an ADI and earning all that lovely money.

for those of you that still want to argue about this, just phone BSM dont bother talking to me.

Goodbye!!

Please make a note in your diary to let us know how you get on (if you qualify in the first place that is).

We look forward to hearing from you, I'm sure.

u wonna buy the books ? - I was one of the 85% who failed the pt III.

It was all down to bad luck on all three attempts tho.

I might have clinched it on the second go if i had avoided the articulated lorry and on the third go the 90 year old pedestrian was near to death when we hit her so i think the examiner was a bit harsh there.

Also - in the event of an accident they only approve of baring the victims chest for heart massage if she has stopped breathing - Very confusing cos my breathing got heavier and i offered to buy her a new school uniform.......and a new bike.

Anyways they all got compo and moved to Berkshire

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
Just to clarify he does not live in windsor and i am not showing off his good fortune mearly using it as an example, also i did not pick on this forum as you say, i came across it whilst doing research on Driving Instruction..

I will not be posting anymore on this site as clearly you are all not at the stage that we are down here, on the plus side of it i had a very indepth conversation with my mate and am looking forward to becoming an ADI and earning all that lovely money.

for those of you that still want to argue about this, just phone BSM dont bother talking to me.

Goodbye!!

Not post again, he'll never do it:heyhey:

As I'm sure Saxon will testify, it doesn't matter how good an instructor you are or how good your pupil is. Simple bad luck will play a part in more than one pupil's test for an instructor during a year, meaning a failure rate of 1 per year is highly suspect to any one who knows something about the business.

Saxon - any examiners you know that have 'good' days and 'bad' days :heyhey:

I speak from 2nd hand experience - my mom was a grade 6 driving instructor for 16 years.

Originally posted by Ginner
Saxon - any examiners you know that have 'good' days and 'bad' days :heyhey:
No coment:hihi:

Originally posted by Mr_Durden
the lesson prices round here are 25 pounds an hour 27 if you go to Windsor

:o

To be fair BSM are crap - I started learning with them and they totally sapped me of confidence and money! The instructor just didn't seem to care.

Just out of interest, is it normal practice for a driving school to charge you for the use of thier car whilst taking a test. This happened to me yesterday and it was unexpected.:(

Originally posted by slimsid2000
Just out of interest, is it normal practice for a driving school to charge you for the use of thier car whilst taking a test. This happened to me yesterday and it was unexpected.:(

Of course it is.

The driving instructor is running a business, and if you've got his/her car whilst you're doing a test, how else is he/she supposed to work?:loopy: