I cannot bear the easy way in which Forum members refer to people as Scum or Scummers or any variety thereof.

I think it is dreadful to describe a fellow human being in this way. Furthermore it does not allow for any knowledge or consideration of the background detail in anyone's life.

It is a word of hideous negativity and it degrades the person who uses it as a term of insult very much more than it does the person to whom it is applied

She doesnt go to work so she must be scum (but maybe she is the victim of domestic violence or sexual abuse and has had all the stuffing knocked out of her, is she still scum then? How do you know that hasnt happen to her?)

He broke into a car so he must be scum (but maybe he was bullied into doing it by a very aggressive man with a big knife who said he would cut him badly if he didnt get him that radio? How do you know that hasnt happened to him?)

I am not making excuses for everyone who claims benefit or commits crime, although someone will now say I am - stands back and waits to read it in the next post - what I am saying is that you cannot condemn people and use words like "scum" when you dont know the full story.

Maybe you watch a soap opera and maybe you see one of your favourite characters commit a crime. This is someone you like and you can see why they have been driven to it and you hope in the ensuing court case that they get off (and yes I know that is a fantasy and not real) - maybe you would feel the same about the people you call scum if you knew their story as well as the TV characters

I would like to suggest that the word is banned from the site

whatever you find at the top, that is the scum.

and what you find at the bottom is the slag.

I can think of many, many more offensive words to call fellow human beings.

A filmy layer of extraneous or impure matter that forms on or rises to the surface of a liquid or body of water.
The refuse or dross of molten metals.
Refuse or worthless matter.
Slang. One, such as a person or an element of society, that is regarded as despicable or worthless.

algae, crust, dross, film, froth, impurities, residue, scruff, spume, waste,

Back to Belles question, if it is the right word to use in the circumstances then I dont see a problem with it.

oops, I voted incorrectly, I voted Yes, from the title of the thread as I thought it was an acceptable word but the poll asks the opposite.

You do make good points however.

I know you have put this post on because of the benefits thread and the word scum has been used a lot in there. I've used it myself in referral to what other people were referring to.

I would only use it in certain contexts.

For e.g.



She doesnt go to work so she must be scum (but maybe she is the victim of domestic violence or sexual abuse and has had all the stuffing knocked out of her, is she still scum then? How do you know that hasnt happen to her?)

No she isn't, that is true, but the person abusing her is scum imo



He broke into a car so he must be scum (but maybe he was bullied into doing it by a very aggressive man with a big knife who said he would cut him badly if he didnt get him that radio? How do you know that hasnt happened to him?)

and again the person bullying is the scum here.


I appreciate you don't like the use, but banning it is extreme. It's all getting PC again.

I've met people like this and the sad fact is that there really are people around who act in such a way that they really are ...well...scum. Usually because they don't know better.

Interestingly it is in the dictionary as a slang word and isn't taboo.


http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=scum

I wasnt being PC

I was being honest

How is it being PC?

Do any of you even know what PC means?

I didnt say it was taboo either, what I was saying is that it is a word that really pains me

I cannot bear that anyone can be dismissed by such a word, and most definitely cannot bear that whole groups of people are so called, as a collective

I wonder if it is a local thing

Steelblade says it a lot and no-one has ever commented

Maybe in Sheffield it doesnt have the power to shock because it is more commonly used whereas to me I hadnt really come across it and so it horrifies me

Originally posted by Belle
I wasnt being PC



My apologies.

It's just that these days, we can't seem to say anything without offending someone as it's not deemed to be politically correct or someone finds it offensive.

I remember when certain phrases used to be used all the time but can't be used these days as it offends, or classes people into groups, or it's being racist etc.

I understand it personally offends you, I think it is a commonly used word round here as I don't notice it that much.

Certain words offend me, but I can't do much about it.

Originally posted by Foxxx
My apologies.

It's just that these days, we can't seem to say anything without offending someone as it's not deemed to be politically correct or someone finds it offensive.


Isn't that better than offending someone?


I remember when certain phrases used to be used all the time but can't be used these days as it offends, or classes people into groups, or it's being racist etc.

Yes, we have moved on from the Bernard Manning world where being offensive about someone because of their colour was called humour and was acceptable.


Certain words offend me, but I can't do much about it.

Isn't that the point of this thread? Here is someone finding something offensive and is willing to do something about it.

I can't agree with Belle that we should ban it but I do agree that those who use the term to describe people less fortunate than themselves are in fact showing themselves as intolerant.

Grrr I didn't look at the wording either - just the title of the thread so I voted incorrectly too. It's not a very accurate poll now:(

I can change the vote to reflect the true meaning if you want, which way did you vote?

Edit: Im not offended by the word Scum, I prefer the term "Sub-Human Scum" anyway :P It generally reflects the mentality of people we are dealing with usually. For instance, the M25 Rapist

For the love of god, Belle. Dont be so ridiculous.

Every human being must have some good points, hopes, fears, abilities and vulnerabilities. But that's not something you're going to think about while they're kicking your head in down town on a Friday night, or selling your stolen jewellery to pay for drugs.

I'm sure when people on the forum refer to someone as scum they recognise that these people are human, but they are just trying to point out that they have some highly undesirable anti-social trait or behaviour. I have no problem with certain people (individuals mind) described as scum. It's just a subjective, emotionally charged word.

not really offended by it, but its an ugly word. then again, every one is entitled to say wot they wnt, better than calling someone somethng else worse. anyway, sum canbe use in the right circumstances, ian huntley is scum for instance

Why has the title been amended so that the semi-colon is now a comma? In actual fact, it should be a dash anyway, but this kind of change is pedantic in any case. Whats wrong with: "Is the word scum acceptable?"? Or is that too simple?

As for whether or not is it acceptable, what other words can you use to describe criminals or the underclasses? This thread is another example of Political Correctness gone mad. If another word was used for the same purpose, it would only gather the same stigma over time.

Originally posted by t020
Why has the title been amended so that the semi-colon is now a comma? In actual fact, it should be a dash anyway, but this kind of change is pedantic in any case. Whats wrong with: "Is the word scum acceptable?"? Or is that too simple?


I know it was techinically english and correct, but it just looked strange on the forum display.

Originally posted by t020
This thread is another example of Political Correctness gone mad.

Change the proverbial, mate.

Belle, I don't think banning words is a good idea. We might take a wrong turn and end up burning books.

Besides, you know exactly where you are with people who have got nothing better to moan about than "dole scum" etc.

Scum, the lot of 'em.

Originally posted by t020
Why has the title been amended so that the semi-colon is now a comma? In actual fact, it should be a dash anyway


It you require that the punctuation be correct, then it should either be a colon or a dash.

But who really cares?

The underclasses t020? Please clarify who these 'scum' are.

Originally posted by markham
The underclasses t020? Please clarify who these 'scum' are.

Yes ,i would love to hear this one myself,though i expect its going to be more of his inane drivel about our upbringing and his important station in life

Maybe it's not the word 'scum' that is the issue ... but people's apathy and uncaring attitudes to themselves and to their fellow human beings.

People who don't care about themselves ... usually don't care about other people.

If you're calling other people 'scum' ... the chances are that 'really deep deep down' ... that's all you think / feel about yourself too ('scum').

I totally agree with what you're saying Belle.

However, I voted for "no", I don't find the term offensive. When most people say things, especially when they say things about people they know very little about, they don't tend to think about what they really mean, nor do they really care if they can see the full picture or not. There's no excuse for it, and most people do it, so taking offense at something people don't really know too much about is not really going to get anybody anywhere.

But I agree, the term 'scum' is over-used. I wish people would think before they speak more too, but I can't see it happening so I may as well accept that.

Originally posted by Sam Miguel
It you require that the punctuation be correct, then it should either be a colon or a dash.

But who really cares?

Whoever edited the title of this thread obviously cares (though they don't care too much about the punctuation of the English language).

Originally posted by markham
The underclasses t020? Please clarify who these 'scum' are.

Benefits scroungers, criminal rings, etc. "Scum" is a good term to describe what these types are. It would only be another word if it wasn't "scum", so why make a fuss over it?

Good old predictable t020.

Originally posted by Sidla
Good old predictable t020.


Oh I'm sorry, maybe I should borrow the same PC hat you lot all constantly wear with such pride... here goes....

"Scum" is an awful term to describe human beings. How can people do such a terrible thing? The people that they describe as being "scum" are good people - it is just society that has forced them into a life of crime or fraudulant benefit claims because they're too lazy to work for a living and would rather sponge of people who do work. Sorry, not lazy..... "energetically challenged". These people should not be labelled "scum" - they should be labelled "Saints" because of all the good they do to society (such as thieving, killing, drug dealing, stealing tax funds from those who *really* need it, etc). The real "scum" are those who use the term "scum" - far more serious a crime than joy riding or robbing old ladies.

Jeffrey Archer.......criminal but upper class. So the upper class can be the underclass at the same time.

Upperclass 'scum'. Interesting concept, what?!

And probably lots of these about as well.

What an odd thread.

Scum is an ace word.

I'll go you one further - we should tattoo it onto the foreheads of all the kiddie fiddlers, rapists and violent criminals of the world.

Then we'd all know who was who.

;)

NM

PS - Are me and t020 the only two people on here who aren't trying to get laid by impressing everyone by how "right on" we are?

Originally posted by Nicholarse
What an odd thread.

Scum is an ace word.

I'll go you one further - we should tattoo it onto the foreheads of all the kiddie fiddlers, rapists and violent criminals of the world.

Then we'd all know who was who.

;)

NM

Hear, hear.

Let common sense once again prevail, and lets be gone of this ludicrous and over sensitive, lefty, politically correct tripe that has been the downfall of society since the 1960s.

Everybody take note!!!!!!

I agree 100% with t020.

Using the word 'scum' is a damn sight better than the alternative words we could use, and is probably only used as a brief expression of our disgust for most of the criminal element.

Sorry but using the word 'people' seems out of place, when the victims are 'people' as well.

Originally posted by t020
Hear, hear.

Let common sense once again prevail, and lets be gone of this ludicrous and over sensitive, lefty, politically correct tripe that has been the downfall of society since the 1960s.
Can you do some research into what 'lefties' actually are. I think you'll find most "politically correct tripe" is actually very much central. I'm very intrigued why people like yourself see being politically correct as being a weakness. Do you have no respect for anyone else besides yourself?

Originally posted by Sidla
Can you do some research into what 'lefties' actually are. I think you'll find most "politically correct tripe" is actually very much central. I'm very intrigued why people like yourself see being politically correct as being a weakness. Do you have no respect for anyone else besides yourself?

I have no respect for those who I define as "scum" - i.e. the criminal underclass. Why should I??

As markham suggests, its about time more thought and attention was turned towards the victims of these "scum" rather than whether or not we hurt the feelings of those that scourge our society.

I think the tem "scum" is fair enough in some cases - For instance, I reckon Antoni Imiela qualifies quite nicely for scum status.

I think it's a little unfair to label the unemployed as scum though. And the "underclass"? You have look at why there is an underclass in the first place. Not everyone has the power to change their situation at will. It's easy for those in a more fortunate situation to casually call those who are less fortunate than themselves "scum" but please at least try to think about it first.

I guess it's the same old rubbish - those who are insecure, desire status or enjoy one-upmanship are always the first to point the finger at others and label them in a derogatory manner simply because it makes them feel better about themselves.

Sad. But then there's an awful lot of sad people around who can't see outside of their own immediate sphere of existence.

PS I think the poll should have an "it depends" option - because that's how I'd vote...

Not getting at you here Sidla, but although I have no prejudices against races, sexual orientations, religions or disabilities, even I find it hard to speak my mind lately without fear of putting my foot in it and offending someone because I wasn't PC.

And because of this I feel that my freedom of speech is being curtailed.

One wrong word, and someone, somewhere, has a case against me.

At least calling all criminals 'scum', no matter what their race, creed, orientation or gender does at least equalise them all.

I've just typed that lot and now it doesn't make sense!!
:loopy:

The problem with Political Correctness is that it does not allow debate. It's censorship pure and simple.

If you are in the right you should be able to argue your point using logic.

If you are in the wrong you can stop the discussion by crying out that you are offended or whatever.

Political correctness and other people being offended DEEPLY OFFENDS ME!!!

So lets have discussion not censorship.

NM

Originally posted by markham
Not getting at you here Sidla, but although I have no prejudices against races, sexual orientations, religions or disabilities, even I find it hard to speak my mind lately without fear of putting my foot in it and offending someone because I wasn't PC.

And because of this I feel that my freedom of speech is being curtailed.

One wrong word, and someone, somewhere, has a case against me.

At least calling all criminals 'scum', no matter what their race, creed, orientation or gender does at least equalise them all.

I've just typed that lot and now it doesn't make sense!!
:loopy:
Doesn't make sense to me either. But anyhow, here's my opinions.

People these days are too judgemental. You have no idea what is going through people's minds when they commit crime, no matter what the crime is, wether it's theft, assault, rape, murder or anything else more severe. These people may have had a tough childhood which caused deep psychological problems. It may have been a spur of the moment thing like the Tony Martin case for example, he lost his temper so pulled the trigger. Even serial killers must have some reason for doing what they do, although I find it hard to imagine what would make anyone go to such lengths.

Until you become a criminal yourself you will never know what has made you stoop to that level, how can you? It may be that you're just pure evil, but I believe that must be rare because I don't believe anyone can be born evil.

I'm not excusing the actions of criminals, but I just wish that people would try and understand what causes people to commit crime, rather than just pushing them aside and labeling them 'scum'.

Originally posted by t020
The people that they describe as being "scum" are good people - it is just society that has forced them into a life of crime or fraudulant benefit claims because they're too lazy to work for a living and would rather sponge of people who do work. There are also many genuine hardworking people who for no fault of there own have landed on the dole.
Are these scum by any chance T020.:|

Exactly Nicholarse.

And lets all carry on using our own expressive words without the fear of them causing offense to someone just because THEY don't like that word. As long as they aren't ......ist expressions.

I'm short(ish) in stature, but I am definitely not offended by the words titchy, short, minimal, tiny, microscopic or low-slung.

I'm also bald(ish), but we won't go into that!

Originally posted by Sidla
Tony Martin case for example, he lost his temper so pulled the trigger

It could be argued that he was being robbed by so called scum and therefore protecting himself from so called scum

Originally posted by Mike
PS I think the poll should have an "it depends" option - because that's how I'd vote...

ive put it in, seems like a good idea for those who dont view the world in colour instead of black and white, discussion instead of YES/NO (etc. etc.)

Originally posted by mega_monty
It could be argued that he was being robbed by so called scum and therefore protecting himself from so called scum
That depends who's doing the calling.

You have just decriminalised Hitler, Pol Pot, Mussillini, Vlad the Impaler and Saddam Hussein. We've gone and misunderstood their motives. The world should now apologise for hating them so much.

Originally posted by Jamie
Maybe it's not the word 'scum' that is the issue ... but people's apathy and uncaring attitudes to themselves and to their fellow human beings.

People who don't care about themselves ... usually don't care about other people.

If you're calling other people 'scum' ... the chances are that 'really deep deep down' ... that's all you think / feel about yourself too ('scum').

Jamie strikes the ferrous lignin affixer on the impact absorbtion area with the lever-amplified mass impacting tool.

Originally posted by Belle
I cannot bear the easy way in which Forum members refer to people as Scum or Scummers or any variety thereof.
I would like to suggest that the word is banned from the site

Typical leftie..... doesn't agree with it so ban it. Bet you campaigned against the use of 'black spots', 'gollywogs' and 'black bin liners' too.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
Jamie strikes the ferrous lignin affixer on the impact absorbtion area with the lever-amplified mass impacting tool. Errr Eh ? If your trying to say something, say it.

Originally posted by Mo
Typical leftie..... doesn't agree with it so ban it. Bet you campaigned against the use of 'black spots', 'gollywogs' and 'black bin liners' too.
Yet another misuse of the word 'leftie'. I suggest you go and live in an extreme left wing communist country for a few years and come back and tell us if they have any sense of political correctness. If you survive that is.

Originally posted by Cycleracer
Errr Eh ? If your trying to say something, say it.
sorry,
was just trying to excel myself.

Jamie hit the nail on the head.

Originally posted by markham
You have just decriminalised Hitler, Pol Pot, Mussillini, Vlad the Impaler and Saddam Hussein. We've gone and misunderstood their motives. The world should now apologise for hating them so much.
Do you understand why Hitler did what he did? Maybe if you'd have lived Hitler's life you'd have acted in exactly the same way.

Originally posted by Nicholarse
What an odd thread.

Scum is an ace word.

I'll go you one further - we should tattoo it onto the foreheads of all the kiddie fiddlers, rapists and violent criminals of the world.

Then we'd all know who was who.

;)

NM

PS - Are me and t020 the only two people on here who aren't trying to get laid by impressing everyone by how "right on" we are?

Oooh - hark at the "shock jock".

Originally posted by t020
Oh I'm sorry, maybe I should borrow the same PC hat you lot all constantly wear with such pride...

"You lot"? It seems to me that only a tiny minority of forum members get tagged with the dreaded "PC" label. Everyone else is happy with the little Englander / my home is my castle / wouldn't want em moving in next door / "hang em high" mentality.

Your downfall, T020, is that you constantly position yourself just to the right of the tabloid-guzzling moral majority, thus alienating just about everyone.

A man on the edge - I like that, keep it up!

Originally posted by MichaelTravis
"You lot"? It seems to me that only a tiny minority of forum members get tagged with the dreaded "PC" label. Everyone else is happy with the little Englander / my home is my castle / wouldn't want em moving in next door / "hang em high" mentality.

Your downfall, T020, is that you constantly position yourself just to the right of the tabloid-guzzling moral majority, thus alienating just about everyone.

A man on the edge - I like that, keep it up!

Wrong Michael, didn't you know the rest of us are 'racists'

Well I don't know about you Mo, but a hell of a lot of people round here seem to display those tendencies. I'm the first to admit that nothing is black and white though (pardon the pun).

Originally posted by Sidla
Do you understand why Hitler did what he did? Maybe if you'd have lived Hitler's life you'd have acted in exactly the same way.

Yes, I know full well about Hitler and his upbringing, but if that is an excuse for his actions then there must be several thousand Hitlers in the world right now and if they ever get into power I suppose we must forgive them their sins and when they have us all gassed and incinerated we must just shrug our shoulders and say, "Poor lamb. He had a rough childhood you know".

In truth he was a very intelligent man, who was shrewd enough to know what he was doing and this is reflected in the fact that he chose to kill himself rather than face justice. This in itself shows that he knew he was doing wrong throughout.

In conclusion he was a power crazed murderer with a chip on his shoulder who was proved, ultimately, to be a cringing coward.

And that is how the world, in particular, the Jews, Gypsies, Slavs and Homosexuals will remember him. And rightly so.

I've thought about this quite a lot recently, with reference to the German cannibal and other recent news stories. I've come to the conclusion that anyone of us could be born with these "proclivities", but that we have to rein them in or else be held accountable for our actions. That's what the law is for, and without it, society would break down.

However, by calling for the death penalty and suggesting that criminals should have "scum" tatooed on their foreheads etc, we are in a way being dragged down to a criminal level ourselves and are hardly advancing human civilisation or understanding.

I'm not saying Hitler was right, nor am I excusing his actions. I'm simply saying that we should understand that had he lead a different life he would almost certainly not turned out the way he did.

Originally posted by MichaelTravis
I've thought about this quite a lot recently, with reference to the German cannibal and other recent news stories. I've come to the conclusion that anyone of us could be born with these "proclivities", but that we have to rein them in or else be held accountable for our actions. That's what the law is for, and without it, society would break down.

However, by calling for the death penalty and suggesting that criminals should have "scum" tatooed on their foreheads etc, we are in a way being dragged down to a criminal level ourselves and are hardly advancing human civilisation or understanding.
This is spot on. Trying to understand the way people behave the way they do is surely more productive than branding anyone who steps outside the law 'scum' and spitting at them in the street.

Yes, appreciate this Sidla, that is a valid point.

What I'm trying to say here is that in his adult life he was independent and intelligent enough to make his own decisions.

He was fully aware of what he was doing, and his military strategies proved this, so I think it stands to reason that a mature, intelligent adult such as him should not still be acting like a spoilt child who knows no better.

I was bullied incessantly as a kid because I was small, it upset me a lot, but I am not going around hating, or worse, killing tall people. I forgot about it all as soon as the bullies went away. And I'm not half as intelligent as Hitler was.

Originally posted by markham
Yes, appreciate this Sidla, that is a valid point.

What I'm trying to say here is that in his adult life he was independent and intelligent enough to make his own decisions.

He was fully aware of what he was doing, and his military strategies proved this, so I think it stands to reason that a mature, intelligent adult such as him should not still be acting like a spoilt child who knows no better.
But maybe his mind had been twisted into thinking that he needed do the things he did. It's not as if he woke up one morning and suddenly decided to murder all the Jews in Germany, it was the result of long-term hatred towards Jews and that must have started somewhere.

I was bullied incessantly as a kid because I was small, it upset me a lot, but I am not going around hating, or worse, killing tall people. I forgot about it all as soon as the bullies went away. And I'm not half as intelligent as Hitler was.
Of course not, but maybe you're mentally stronger than Hitler was. He may have been intelligent, but that doesn't mean he was always thinking rationally.

I agree with Jamie - it says far more about the person using the word than it does about those they are describing

Oh yeah - why don't we censor all words with negative aspects and banish them from the dictionary, and from now on only use good words to describe people (no matter what they've done). Peace and flowers all round....

Originally posted by t020
Oh yeah - why don't we censor all words with negative aspects and banish them from the dictionary, and from now on only use good words to describe people (no matter what they've done). Peace and flowers all round....

Let's not censor them, let's just be aware that the words we use say something about the people using them, and don't be surprised if you get pulled up on it.

Anyway, what's so funny about peace, love and understanding?

Gosh that got you all energised didnt it!

I didnt really want the word banned, I really wanted what I got - a discussion

And funnily enough, most people said just what I thought they would.

I still dont get the politically correct references

I didnt say that anyone else was offended by the word, I didnt say dont use the word because criminals and unemployed benefit recipients and drug takers might be offended, I said that it was ME that didnt like it

And still dont

A few more people are now going in my iggy box

Thanks for the contributions

- and I hope T020 noticed that I tried to make the title fit the format that he and I joke about, but obviously failed because as he noted, it was rewritten for me

Excellent thread Belle. Certainly got some of us fired up. Me included!

That's what the forum's all about.

That's one four letter word I won't be using again on here!

Be bloody boring if we ALL agreed, eh? :thumbsup:

Top thread!!! It's nice to see everybody's views!


I was reading in the Mail today about some mass murderer/rapist (can't remember the name), who had comitted some brutal acts. But the article was actually about the man's history. He was a German immigrant who came to Britain as a child in the fifties, where he was teased for his origins (allegedly, the first thing he heard said to him in England was "you Nazi *******"). He was constantly beaten up by his father, had many brief hetero and homosexual relationships (for which his father disowned him), and he was abandoned by his whole family when he was convicted. He'd spent his adult life pretty much homeless, and resorted to selling drugs to make aliving.

Based on your opinions on this thread, would you say that the man in question was scum, or a victim, both or neither? Could it be that we have to treat individual cases as individual, rather than classifying?

Originally posted by Funky Dave
Based on your opinions on this thread, would you say that the man in question was scum, or a victim, both or neither? Could it be that we have to treat individual cases as individual, rather than classifying?
Both, depending on the definition of scum. Of course we have to treat cases individually.

Originally posted by Cycleracer
There are also many genuine hardworking people who for no fault of there own have landed on the dole.
Are these scum by any chance T020.:|

I don't think that is what T020 is saying. When the discussions were going on in referrence to 'dole scrounging scum', I believe the type of people being talked about are people who abuse the system by refusing to work, not people on the dole in general.

You are correct, people do lose their jobs and claim benefit while they get another, but there's a huge difference, they get another job as they work and are willing to work for a living and contribute to the country, whatever the job is.

I think scum is quite a harsh word but it is commonly used to describe a certain group of people, who chose to live in such a way, that they are 'scummy'. They don't work, they claim every benefit under the sun, and then do things like dumping rubbish in the streets and gardens so that the council will pay for a rubbish amnesty to clear it for free, while other citizens of this country pay to hire a skip. In my opinion this is a scummy way to live, leaving crap everywhere for their kids to play in. I think this is the type of person, and for the record this could be any colour or shape of person, but they live this way. Alot of people are blind to it and don't know it goes on as they don't live in these areas. I don't think it is hard to put rubbish in a bin once a week and get it cleared by the bin men personally, but these people don't seem to be able to do this, leaving rotting food everywhere and old sofas etc.
Maybe this is not their fault as they don't know any better.
I think instead of saying 'this is a scummy way to live', people just say these people are 'scum'.

Originally posted by Jamie
Maybe it's not the word 'scum' that is the issue ... but people's apathy and uncaring attitudes to themselves and to their fellow human beings.

People who don't care about themselves ... usually don't care about other people.

If you're calling other people 'scum' ... the chances are that 'really deep deep down' ... that's all you think / feel about yourself too ('scum').

Maybe in some cases, but I disagree in general.

I know plenty of people who are perfectly normal, law abiding citizens, who pay their taxes blah blah etc etc who do use the word scum to describe people who are non law abiding, non working and perfectly able bodied, and generally don't know how to live in a civilised way. They refer to these people as scum as this is their opinion of this type of person. They are perfectly happy with themselves, in themselves and care very much about people and their society.

Incidently, I hope you all realise this works the other way round, because the so-called 'underclass' call middle england people (working class, middle class, whatever) and upperclass (well anyone with money) scum. Is it acceptable for them to call people who work for their money scum??

Right on Foxxx.
We each have our own opinions of who disgust us and who we think qualify to be called S***.

I personally consider litter droppers, vandals, animal/child abusers and those who indulge in any form of anti-social behaviour to be as bad as any dole scrounger, whether they are hard working professionals/business people or not. Therefore all the aforementioned, are in my eyes just S***. (be they lower, middle or upper class)

Promised not to use the word S*** again some time ago:? :wink:

Yes foxxx ... I agree it works both ways (like most things) ...

I also believe all people have intrinsic value ... just by virtue of just being human.

It seems almost arrogant to me ... when people consider another human being 'scum' because they don't live up to their own ideals or social status etc ...

What about people who have money and power but don't have the anti-social behaviour ... yet are just plain greedy and corrupt and out for themselves and don't give a rats ass about anyone else or who they rip-off to get where they wanna get.

That's fine is it ?

My point is ... financial and social status is no indication of virtue or character.

Finally ... the last point I made is an extension of the following:

What you do to other people ... you also do to yourself.

That is not to say it's a good idea to let 'scummy doleys' (or anyone else) take advantage of you in any way.

Originally posted by jackthedog
For the love of god, Belle. Dont be so ridiculous.

How is it that the people who are so quick to label someone as "scum" are usually the very people who fail to see the irony in the fact that they believe this?. In order to hold such blatanly ignorant ideas surely you become that which you detest... raw nerve....projection....hypocrisy isnt a very attractive character trait is it?. Walk a mile in thier shoes before applying a standard you so obviousley fall short of .

ok i voted yes instead of no. sorri, didnt read the title properly.

Originally posted by SatanInHeels
ok i voted yes instead of no. sorri, didnt read the title properly.

Ive changed the totals to reflect your preferred vote.

Originally posted by SatanInHeels
ok i voted yes instead of no. sorri, didnt read the title properly.


Yet another thread title and poll question that are contradictory.

Belle you sneaky ****! Just because you feel offended by 'scum' doesn't mean you have to trick me into voting yes when I clearly meant no!

Modified the title.

I have heard people called Scum BAGS which is even worse, a thief, mugger, rapist, kick peoples heads in, Murderer, any kind of criminal, they are all scumbags!:evil: :evil: :evil:

a long an interesting thread.

It'd be really nice if we could see inside peoples heads. Then we could look at the mass murderer or the person claiming unemployment benefit fraudulantly and see why.

But we can't.

So, they are not living up to the ideals of society, nor conforming to the rules that society creates (laws) to protect itself.

We could label them in many ways, murderer, criminal, pervert... These are just classifications to determine what group of actions their transgretion against us fell in. Murderer is a pretty specific definition. Scum is a very high level definition that includes many of the more specific definitions. It includes more people even than the label criminal.

It is an unpleasant word, it's emotive, it's describes a group of people we'd really rather didn't exist. (To be clear, i'd rather that they were all nice people rather than they all disappeared of the face of the earth tomorrow).

Personally I think scum is far too 'soft' a word to be used to describe people falling into Hitlers group. I really don't care how screwed up his childhood and his mind were. Every person must be responsible for their own actions, there are no excuses, or no-one can be held responsible for anything and society collapses.

God what a thread!!

I'm sharing Nicholarse and t020's views here mainly; we cant keep cushioning the bad of this world in PC and do-gooder-ness (if there is such a word!).

I try not to offend people and seldom do, but its getting steadily harder to string together a wholly acceptable sentence these days.

I will call, or refer to people as scum if I think that they are. In doing that, I accept that people can and will make assumptions about me and will class me as something.

Next it'll be 'Yuppies' that people are objecting to.

yeah inclined to agree here, i think bad people are scum. quite simple really.

I always think the word "scum" is a fairly mild derogative term. I usually associate it with vandals, muggers, dole cheats etc.

A much stronger term is required when referring to child molesters, rapists etc

I agree with Belle and with Jamie also. It is an unpleasant word, one that says more about those that use it than those who it's used about.
The predictable knee-jerk responses about 'PC' - apparently from people who didn't actually read what Belle had posted - which was opinion. I think it was Jamie who said that the problem is arrogance. People who bandy this word around to describe their fellow human beings are staggeringly arrogant.
Cycleracer too made a useful point, t020, about the unemployed - are they all scum t020? Or just the ones you don't like?
It strikes me time and time again that there are many people on the Forum who labour under the misguided impression that the poor, criminals,sex offenders,asylum seekers etc are somehow another species. Words like 'scum' serve to bolster that illusion. The truth is that we are all human beings and all have an intrinsic worth and value because we are human.
I don't like people cheating the DSS or robbing old ladies any more than the next man. I see the 'scum' as people who might do bad things and not as bad people. All humanity is precious and capable of good as well as bad.

I have heard people called Scum BAGS which is even worse, a thief, mugger, rapist, kick peoples heads in, Murderer, any kind of criminal, they are all scumbags!:evil: :evil: :evil:

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Hey, easy on the non-workers, I'm not working at the moment, but I'm not claiming benefits, I don't need too......and Belle, I think banning the word scum is a little overboard, there are "scum" out there, deal with it.

Hey, easy on the non-workers, I'm not working at the moment, but I'm not claiming benefits, I don't need too......and Belle, I think banning the word scum is a little overboard, there are "scum" out there, deal with it.

Belle didn't mention banning anything Harleykim.

Belle mentioned at the end of her first thread "I would like to suggest that the word is banned from this site" Halibut

Fair play Harleykim; I didn't spot that. I'll get my coat.....

:hihi: Lol. Belle, have you not experienced scum ever? There must be 1 time when you have thought to yourself "scum", because of something you have seen?

scum can be used in an offensive manner. & i use it in such a way when i think the occasion merits it

Belle last posted on the forum in July '05 so don't expect a reply any day soon.

Oh............:blush:

I know that when used in a slapdash way it can come across very strong. But you are disregarding how heartily sick people are of everyday abuse and criminality. It makes people's lives a misery. You are making excuses for people who can be psychopathic in their contempt for humanity, and dismissing the experiences of those on the recieving end. In comparison, use of one word is fairly mild. This is an example of how PC is counterproductive. You are actually feeding the vengeance people feel. The use of a strong descriptive word is an expression of how much people have had to take and they've had enough.

Most people who are aggressive, thieving, anti-social, ignorant do actually have a choice. They may have grown up in nightmare surroundings but they are still responsible for the decisions they make. People should be held responsible for their decisions. I grew up in an abusive family on a trashy estate. I know what the view is from the 'inside'. I chose to take advantage of the opportunities I was given. And I saw how the *scum* elements chose not to. Most of the *scum* behaved the way they did because they wanted to. They chose to throw away a free education, they chose not to bother looking for a job. They chose to manufacture babies they didn't give a s**t about. Nobody forced them to shout and threaten other people. Nobody forced anbody to take heroin. Education, advice, contraception, were all freely available. Even when times are hard and mental distress and trauma are a problem, help is there (if a bit stretched). Free will is what makes us human, or something...

Political Correctness is infantilising and counterproductive. At university I met the stratum of 'leftie do-gooders' who did not seem to see the poor as adult human beings, but pitiable creatures who could do no wrong. Many people who don't like prejudice and want to help society have their heads screwed on and are not the 'PC' police. Others are condescending and remove any sense of adult agency from people who are aggressors and in full charge of their faculties. Your point is about more than a word. You're trying to gag people's frustration at the uncivil society we live in. They will find another way of expressing it. I don't like innocent people being persecuted. But people who stab, shoot, hit, spit, shout, steal, intimidate, and destroy are not innocent. If they don't want to be called scum they might try behaving like a civilised human being.

Sorry, just woken up. I didn't realise the thread was 7 pages long and a hundred years old. I'll go back to bed.