Anyone know details (facts) on this proposed on-the-spot fine thingy?

It would be hard to impose IMO.

Not every child misses school through wagging it.... sometimes the parents are ill and can't take them or whatever... charging them £100 for something that they can't help is wrong.

I believe it would be imposed if kids are caught out shopping with mum, or if kids are supposed to be in school but are on streets instead.

Kids on authorised absence would probably be exempt as long as they're not playing out/shopping when supposed to be off sick.

Anyone out there in the know?

i think its a rubbish idea

kids go off on truant when parents dont know, all the time

i may go off one day and mum not know about it but she would get the fine for me going out.!!

and the problem is the parent cant do anything about it!!

even if they drop there kid outside school gate the kid can just wander out at any time!

Stupid law made by stupid people!

A law obviously made by people who wish to cut down on truancy.

Don't you think that if you thought your parents were going to get clobbered for £100 every time you bunked-off you'd probably stop truanting for their sake.

The choice would be yours wouldn't it.

no

im not getting punished am i??

nothing they can do about it?

plus they have to treat me nice!! i choose there home!!

Originally posted by Fletch
no

im not getting punished am i??

nothing they can do about it?

plus they have to treat me nice!! i choose there home!!

Sorry Fletch, but I can't make sense of most of that.

You choose who's home? And why?

Whatever happened to doing as your parents tell you and having respect for their wishes?

You may not get punished right away but I'm sure they'll find a way when they're £100 worse off as a result of your bad behaviour matey. ;)

edit: Shouldn't this be in General Chit-Chat cos it's not really a Sheffield topic is it. ;)

Originally posted by markham You choose who's home? And why? [/B]

i choose my mums old peoples home for when she gets older! hehehe :evil:

if my mum gets fined, doesnt affect me!! does it?? mum may give me a telling off and a lot of jobs to do but i could go and do it again the next day and all they can do is take me back to school and fine my mum again, nothing against me again!! and if my mum was rich enough i could do it everyday!

And from the sound of it you probably would. :rolleyes:

Doesn't it bother you at all that you'd be causing your mum extra stress? Let's just say you do this again and again so that your mum keeps getting fined over and over? You'd be looking at a very lean Christmas and birthday, and you'd probably not get anything bought for you until you started behaving. It may not be you getting fined the £100 but it'll find a way to affect you in some form or another.

Think yourself lucky you're not living in the 20 years ago. You'd get a right battering from your folks for that kind of behaviour. ;)

Originally posted by Fletch
i choose my mums old peoples home for when she gets older! hehehe :evil:

if my mum gets fined, doesnt affect me!! does it?? mum may give me a telling off and a lot of jobs to do but i could go and do it again the next day and all they can do is take me back to school and fine my mum again, nothing against me again!! and if my mum was rich enough i could do it everyday!

I was expecting an intelligent debate.

God knows what you're doing getting involved.

fine ill sod off then

i was just putting it from my (school goers) point of view and how it would/nt affect me!!

im a teen who has many mates who play truant and dont get caught.

so fine
BYE

You're talking to a 14 yr old Markham. Go figure. :lol:

Point taken, I shouldn't have expected any other response should I.

However, any ADULTS out there who would end up paying the fine care to comment?:

Fletch, if your mum got a £100 fine, I am pretty sure that you would be in school every day so fast your feet wouldn't touch the ground whether you liked it or not :P

true but i could still walk out of my school as soon as i wanted to! whether she worked there or not!

i could walk out at lunch, break or any time during lessons.

Sounds like you have no respect for your mother, her wellbeing or any form of authority to me.

Would I be correct?

True Fletch, but after a £100 fine I suspect that your mum would find quite a few totally reliable ways of ensuring that you stayed in school. :evil:

Anybody got any suggestions for stopping Fletch wagging it?:twisted: :twisted:

Judging by his attitude I should think his school are chuffed when he's wagging it.

Looks to me like another sad example of the modern rebellious school kid.

'Can't touch me, I can do what I want so there!'

Bring back Corporal Punishment! That'd shake you right up Fletch mi old china!. ;)

I remember the school bobby when I was at school who would visit the 'repeat offenders'. Actually I liked school and can't imagine having to hide somewhere until hometime as exciting or character building. I'd rather sell copies of the Star on a street in town cos at least I'd get paid for it!

I just think it's about time the govt came up with schemes to address some of the problems we have in society today. Then again - some kids have both parents out working which to me isn't necessarily a good thing. Wonder how many of us would have strayed from the path if we didn't have our mums waiting for us when we got home!!!!!!!!!!!

I wagged it from school only twice the first time I went to the Colloseum (that doesn't look right) Pitsmoor to see Victor Mature in Samson & Delilha (that doesn't look right either, maybe everyone learned how to spell those when I was off) anyway, I was scared to come out of the pictures and was sure my dad would be there waiting for me, when he wasn't I was certain he would know I hadn't been to school by just looking at my face. The second time I was in the seniors and took the afternoon off to go the "El Mambo" coffee bar. I was petrified all the time I was in there everybody to my young eyes looked as if they were gangsters. I never went there or wagged it from school again it wasn't any fun and certainly not worth the fear of being found out. having a visit from the school bobby or even worse mom & dad getting a letter from Pop Gregory our headmaster.

Originally posted by Fletch
true but i could still walk out of my school as soon as i wanted to! whether she worked there or not!

i could walk out at lunch, break or any time during lessons.

That right there is the problem with the youth of today, no respect for anything other than themselves...

You sir, are clearly an idiot.... And I hope you fail all your exams and end up as a wage slave working for 2 quid an hour in McDonalds, cos that's all you'll ever be any good for without qualifications....

Can this fine also be imposed upon teachers who fancy a day off for an inch of snow??

Originally posted by t020
Can this fine also be imposed upon teachers who fancy a day off for an inch of snow??

A very immature comment (as expected), and has sod all to do with this thread.

I would be very interested to here your veiws on Fletch's comments though as you both appear to be from the opposite ends of the spectrum.

HAHAHA :lol:

As for fletch's comments, it would seem that his parent(s) have little or no control over him if he thinks that they wouldn't be able to stop him from truanting. I think parents should be fined for their truanting kids because ultimate responsibility lies with them to ensure their kids attend school in the first place. If their kids don't have enough respect for their own parents, then they deserve the fine for not bringing up their children properly.

A fine on parents for bad upbringing? :lol: Now that's one I've not heard before. Hehehehe

Originally posted by t020
HAHAHA :lol:

As for fletch's comments, it would seem that his parent(s) have little or no control over him if he thinks that they wouldn't be able to stop him from truanting. I think parents should be fined for their truanting kids because ultimate responsibility lies with them to ensure their kids attend school in the first place. If their kids don't have enough respect for their own parents, then they deserve the fine for not bringing up their children properly.

At last t020. I fully agree with you.

Well said.

No doubt now we'll get some replies such as........

HOW CAN POOR PEOPLE AFFORD THE FINE? and IT'S SOCIETY'S FAULT, and PARENTS CAN'T BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR KIDS ALL THE TIME.

As a parent i find many problems with this subject, what is an authorised absence?, at certain schools they give passes out when children get sent home from school, but what about a trip to the doctors, dentist, hospital etc.... if you have as much trouble getting through to the school by telephone as i do you would have to go to the doctors before getting through to them, and what if they turn round and say we have not had a message about them not being at school, this could happen if the fine started going to the school instead of the council, and how many people have to go in a roundabout way to get to doctors, dentists etc... because there is no direct public transport.
And when the school itself accepts some responsibility for keeping pupils in school and actually care about them and where they are then maybe it might work.

Interesting point there Playman.

Now that I think about it a teacher in our junior school once told us that the school was responsible for us for all the time we were in school and outside of school during school time unless of course we were under our parents supervision when we left the school grounds. Has this changed?

Does the proposed fine still go to the parent if the student leaves the school grounds and doesn't return at the required time during school hours?

Yes Fletch, school hours DOES include breaks and dinner time.

Surely if a student leaves the school grounds during school hours then any fine should go to the school for not keeping tabs on their students properly.

Here we go, school bashing again.

a. Once a pupil has registered in the morning they are the responsibility of the school as long as they stay on school premises. If they leave then the school contacts the parents and it becomes their responsibility.

b. The same goes for the afternoon.

c.If a kid doesn't turn up but the school has been contacted then they're the parents' responsibility.

d. If they don't turn up and the school hasn't been contacted then the parents are contacted by the school and it becomes the parents responsibility.

Either way, I should think the fine system would be enforced using a bit of nouce and investigation.

These points above are however flexible and the school will do all they can to assist the parents, but depending on the circumstances, the staff are not allowed to physically stop a kid running out in case the kid gets hurt and the parent sues (and yes, most would sue), if a kid is chased to bring them back and the kid runs onto the road or trips whilst being chased the parent will again probably sue.
So the school is in a no-win situation.
Its all down to the parent making sure that their kid is at school and stays there. And in return the school will do all they can to keep the kid there (and protect the kid from harm).
However, if a kid decides that they're going to do a runner and no one's going to stop them, them they'll run.

By the way, its not the school's fault that a parent can't make their kid attend school, or that a teacher isn't allowed to physically detain their kid at school.

Markham - are you SURE you're not a teacher?????? If not, is your wife?

No to both, but I just have a lot of respect for them, and no respect for parents who blame all their kids failings on school, and the teachers who probably give their kids the attention they never get at home because they consider their kids to be other people's problems.

Can we keep this to the TRUANCY FINE issue though eh?
Cheers

I thought the fine was aimed at the parents that fancy a nifty holiday in term time.
They take their kids away,depriving them of valuble learning time...in these cases,yes fine the ass of the parents.

School holidays are for going away,thats why they have six weeks in the summer.
Now we will hear people,saying...but we cant afford to take a holiday in the summer,I say tuff.


Moral,send your kids to school or pay up...simple

Right on tango2

And fine them for all their little sods other misdemeanours aswell.

The holiday companies are partly to blame then, cos they hike their prices up during the school holiday season, leaving families often unable to go, so the families are forced into a mentality that if they want to go on holiday, they can only go out of season when it's cheap....

Originally posted by markham
Here we go, school bashing again.

a. Once a pupil has registered in the morning they are the responsibility of the school as long as they stay on school premises. If they leave then the school contacts the parents and it becomes their responsibility.


..and if they leave and the school doesn't know they've left - then what?

Also, some other questions raised are:

When (at what age) does the child (rather than the parent) become responsible for their own actions?

How does the punishment/crime compare with other forms of law breaking for children eg. theft, shoplifting, vandalism, assault, murder?

Nomme

Originally posted by markham
Anyone know details (facts) on this proposed on-the-spot fine thingy?

Read above.

Thats what I was asking when I started this thread.

So, does anyone know the details?

a child becomes responsible for its own actions at the age of 10. because the are deemed to know what is right or wrong!!

BBC info on the fine (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/3491012.stm)

there you go!! that wasnt hard for me!! im 14!

now lets get started!!

Sounds like you have no respect for your mother, her wellbeing or any form of authority to me.

Would i be correct?

i love my mum and respect her fully!! so no you would not be right!!

Judging by his attitude I should think his school are chuffed when he's wagging it

i have never wagged a lesson or a class or a break lunch or anything. the worst i have done is be late, but i always had a valible reason!

Can this fine also be imposed upon teachers who fancy a day off for an inch of snow??

Yes it should be!! or they should not be paid!! we have to do work when we get a holiday but the teachers still havent finished marking our books bit we should have finished all our homework

A very immature comment (as expected), and has sod all to do with this thread.

it has everything to do with this thread! every working person on this forum i bet has had a false sicky!!

As for fletch's comments, it would seem that his parent(s) have little or no control over him if he thinks that they wouldn't be able to stop him from truanting. I think parents should be fined for their truanting kids because ultimate responsibility lies with them to ensure their kids attend school in the first place. If their kids don't have enough respect for their own parents, then they deserve the fine for not bringing up their children properly.

my mum has brought me up perfctly and probably how my nan brought up my mum! and its also part of the nature nurture thing. we all act different around different people, i do! peer preasure aswell!

if you have as much trouble getting through to the school by telephone as i do you would have to go to the doctors before getting through to them, and what if they turn round and say we have not had a message about them not being at school, this could happen if the fine started going to the school instead of the council

i have that same problem as well, if i am ill and my mum is at work i can never get thrugh to her if i ever need her!! and if i evr have a docters appointment i always have to go into school to hand iin a note! and then get a slip saying i can go out of school at a certain time on a certain day, and we have to know what time we are going to be back, which is sometimes unpredictable due to public transport and que time!

!
Surely if a student leaves the school grounds during school hours then any fine should go to the school for not keeping tabs on their students properly

a. Once a pupil has registered in the morning they are the responsibility of the school as long as they stay on school premises. If they leave then the school contacts the parents and it becomes their responsibility.

b. The same goes for the afternoon.

c.If a kid doesn't turn up but the school has been contacted then they're the parents' responsibility.

d. If they don't turn up and the school hasn't been contacted then the parents are contacted by the school and it becomes the parents responsibility.


so what happens when a kid leaves school and school doesnt know about it and the parents think the child is at school and nobody knows where the child is?? what happens then??


Its all down to the parent making sure that their kid is at school and stays there.

so the parent is supposed to stand out side school aand make sure the kid doesnt come out??

And in return the school will do all they can to keep the kid there (and protect the kid from harm).
However, if a kid decides that they're going to do a runner and no one's going to stop them, them they'll run.


but who is giong to stop them if ....

These points above are however flexible and the school will do all they can to assist the parents, but depending on the circumstances, the staff are not allowed to physically stop a kid running out in case the kid gets hurt and the parent sues (and yes, most would sue), if a kid is chased to bring them back and the kid runs onto the road or trips whilst being chased the parent will again probably sue.

????

there you go chew on that!!

i do not like people putting words into my mouth or presuming things about me when they do not know me have never met me or have no idea about my home or school life!!

i probably have many spelling mistakes in this post because i am not brilliant at typing so sorry for any mistakes ( it is not because i do not go to my english classes!)

Wrong, not every working person on this forum has had a false sickie.

As for finding the info, aren't you a clever boy.

And as for some people thinking you are one of those truanting little scumbags with no respect for parents or authority, that might have something to do with the wording of your earlier posts.

I think that maybe you are a decent kid who is speaking for his mates, and if this is so then well done. Do us a favour though Fletch, try to express yourself a little more clearly.

All my comments about you have been retracted.

Just want to clarify something though Fletch. I suppose you are already aware that school staff are not allowed to physically restrain a kid unless it is to stop that child from injuring someone else. Agreed? So knowing that, do you think that the staff have any powers to detain you physically should you, or your mates, decide to do a runner?

And if a member of staff did try to stop you, you struggled and kicked out, and in the process you got bruising to your arms, managed to break free, ran out of the building in a panic and got knocked down, don't you think the staff would be open to legal action by the kid's parents? The alternative being to not try to stop the kid at all other than verbally.

You're 14 and at school. What are your views on this scenario? How do YOU think the staff should handle it?

agreed

no i dont think they should have rights to detain u, unless you have physically abused someone. and if anything that is the wort thing for a teacher to do (detain someone alone in a room) all the kid has to do is say something like they have touched them and bye bye to that teachers career!


theres not much they could do. other than contact the parents probably the police

I agree Fletch, and that is why I think that ultimately it is between the kid and his/her parents to take the responsibility for school attendance, and between them take responsibility for the consequences (fine).

The way I see it, and the way you put it, it seems the school has no powers to make kids stay at school, whereas the parents do. After all these kids BELONG to the parents, not the school. The parents CAN punish them, the school CAN'T, and I think you'll agree that most streetwise kids know this and play on it.

Originally posted by t020
Markham - are you SURE you're not a teacher?????? If not, is your wife?

Thought I'd better make a point here t020.

If someone comes on here defending assylum seekers it doesn't mean they are one, or even know one personally.

Does that put your mind at rest, or do I have to give you my entire life's history and a list of all my family and friends' histories?