Has anyone else heard about this?
The Bail Hostel in Norfolk Park, currently home to low risk offenders, is supposedly about to become a high-risk sex offenders hostel. Yet it is in immediate proximity to Norfolk Heritage Park, Norfolk Park (Talbot) Special School, and close on to All Saints School, which is about to become a sports academy with loads of sports provision for young people, not to mention the fact that it is right next to parts of Sheffield College...

I know that there is no 'safe' place to put this kind of institution, but I feel this would be inappropriate. There must be areas less close to vulnerable people? In particular, the special schools.

Can anyone confirm these plans?

Cosy

Originally posted by cosywolf
Are there no other areas less close to vulnerable people?

Of course there are, but there will be a huge kick-off if they try to put it anywhere "nice". Think of the house prices !

I thought the kids detention centre at Dore was being upgraded too - to house 'adults' who need supervision - is it on Limb Lane or sommat. We played football near there a few months ago and half our cars gone done during the game.

Originally posted by Internetowl
I thought the kids detention centre at Dore was being upgraded too - to house 'adults' who need supervision - is it on Limb Lane or sommat. We played football near there a few months ago and half our cars gone done during the game. There is a correctional facility on Limb Lane, but as far as I am aware the 'residents' there don't have access to the fields nearby.

Were you playing on the playing fields or in the HSBC grounds?

What exactly happened to the cars?

That is a secure unit. The kids are not allowed out. I've got a few mates who have worked there since it opened.

Originally posted by carcrash
That is a secure unit. The kids are not allowed out. I've got a few mates who have worked there since it opened. Thought so.

Internet owl, it would seem that if something occured with your cars it's very unlikely that it was anything to do with the correctional facility or it's occupants.

Originally posted by lalaland
Internet owl, it would seem that if something occured with your cars it's very unlikely that it was anything to do with the correctional facility or it's occupants.

Must be the locals then !

They're a nasty lot in Dore.

Or all the riff-raff from Totley who have traveled up to steel cars.

There are some very dodgy youths who hang around the bus shelter near the shops at the end of Totley Brook Road.

I have noticed that the corner of that road appears to be a hang out area for a large gang of youths.

Doesn't really bother me, but I have seem some people looking nervous at the bus stop when passing it before.

Wonder what's so appealing about standing outside the Spar?

They don't seem to cause any trouble though, so fair enough if they want to just knock about round there.

Slightly off topic, does anyone else think it slightly amusing with Tesco putting up a nice clean looking store band next to the grotty Spar?

Wonder how long Spar will last with that there?

It was the football pitches about halfway down Limb lane - not HSBC - damage was mainly a couple of broken windows, stereos gone, somebodies shoes from the people I know.

Problem is from the pitch you can't see the cars!

Originally posted by slimsid2000
Or all the riff-raff from Totley who have traveled up to steel cars.

There are some very dodgy youths who hang around the bus shelter near the shops at the end of Totley Brook Road.

no more dodgy than the inability to spell steal correctly. i suppose riff raff would not learn basic english.

Back to Norfolk Park, though...these would be DIRECTLY next to the new special school on one side and the Sheffield Hallam residences on the other. The new sports academy for All Saints School is directly across the road.
Cosy

Originally posted by cosywolf
Back to Norfolk Park, though...these are not secure premises. They are DIRECTLY next to the new special school on one side and the Sheffield Hallam residences on the other. The new sports academy for All Saints School is directly across the road. There are already problems with the current probationers in the park and up by Norfolk School, and when these are all men with a history of commiting sexual assaults, rape, etc?
This won't be a probationary facility for just anyone, but for HIGH RISK SEX OFFENDERS. Next to two schools and a student residence??? I know I'm repeating myself, but I'm in shock. In what world is this all right?

Cosy Have you raised your concerns to the correct authority?

I wasn't aware of this, but it does seem slightly worrying.

Unless i'v enot read the obvious, has this been publicised anywhere as i'm sure the fallout from an article would prevent such a hostel.

Any hostel that houses serial/high sex offenders is going to attract large amount of criticism/Serious though needs to be given to locating such a facilityt. I agree, next to a school is not the most ideal solution but where is ideal? I would think out in the country somewhere but then the country folk are going to cause uproar that a hostel is going to appear in their village.

The whole scenario needs to be looked at. Is this just a correctional facility or a hostel. The term hostel implies that a large number could be based there and sex offenders you would think, is one group that you would want to keep apart!

I cant believe what i'm hearing cosywolf :o
That would place my daughter within half a mile of high risk sex offenders with an awful lot of empy/private areas in between!
There will be four schools within half a mile of it. A student village next door.

I don't think anyone has thought this through :rant:
Do they not need planning permission of some kind? That building isn't exactly a secure unit is it.

I know loads of people are going to say i'm being too extreme but if this gets the go ahead, i'm going to get the hell out of here. There is no way i am going to spend the rest of my life panicking every time my daughter is 2 mins late!

I was talking to my brother the other day about how we used to be playing all over the Manor and Norfolk Park when we were 8 years old. Sadly, my daughter will never be able to talk about the same things.

I haven't heard about this, but I think, as people who live in the local area we do have a right to know.

If anyone has any information from an "official" source then please do post it here, or a link to it.

I have made enquiries myself and will post when I hear anything. So far I have contacted South Yorkshire Probation Service, asking them to read this thread and then confirm what their plans are for Norfolk Park.

Cosywolf can you tell me where you got this info from? my friend lives in this area and has two young daughters so we are obviously v. worried and would like to look into it further.

Thanks

The South Yorkshire Probation Service's email is bouncing. :rolleyes:

The Probation Service wont give you any joy Andy. Keep at the City Council and Radio's Sheffield & Hallam, as well as as many newspapers as you can contact. Look on the newspapers web sites for their email addy's.
The Sun would I imagine be interested.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/section/0,,23,00.html

Good luck and fight this right through to the bitter end.

Originally posted by owdlad


Good luck and fight this right through to the bitter end.

Thanks for your support - I would like to find out what the situation really is before I start fighting though.

But if necessery I will fight. I already have the support of two other Sheffield Forum members, and I am sure more will follow.

But first we need to know the truth? :confused:

How about trying to ring Rony Robbo this morning and ask him if he knows if it's true, this way it also let's others in the area know what's being planned. ;)

Originally posted by owdlad
How about trying to ring Rony Robbo

Well I am awaiting a reply from another Robbo ;)

I can't beleive they have having one there. it is in the middle of it all. just think all of the kids and ladies that will be about that area.

Just noticed where this Bail Hostel is (Norfolk Park Road): http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&X=436500.855085864&Y=386500.516581783&width=500&height=300&gride=&gridn=&srec=0&coordsys=gb&db=GB&addr1=&addr2=&addr3=&pc=&advanced=true&local=&localinfosel=&kw=&inmap=&table=&ovtype=&zm=0&scale=10000&down.x=186&down.y=4

Crikey.

The way I've heard it is through a reliable someone who goes to local meetings involving the bail hostel and other organisations in Norfolk Park.
I was told that it is info that is out there...i.e. I'm not giving away any secrets, but it's obviously not well known, as I spoke to several workers about it yesterday and they were unaware, which is slightly odd, and I haven't been around, so am out of the loop.
The word is that permission was given some 15 years ago by the then councillors, papers signed, etc. so it can't be backed out of despite the wholly inappropriate position.
I will not be taking this to the fight until I have all the answers I need confirming...I think a calm approach and some serious digging is required here. Then if it is 100% verified, I think the schools themselves, followed by the press, are my next step.
I won't be sorry if it's all a storm in a teacup, because yes, a hostel of this sort does have to go somewhere...but NOT next to a special school, secondary school, etc.
Cosy:suspect:

Originally posted by cosywolf
I will not be taking this to the fight until I have all the answers I need confirming...I think a calm approach and some serious digging is required here. Then if it is 100% verified, I think the schools themselves, followed by the press, are my next step.

Please do keep us up to date on developments Cosy - feel free to PM me if there's information you don't want to post here.

I would suggest Sheffield Hallam Uni and their Students Union should be on your list of contacts too.

Originally posted by Andy
I already have the support of two other Sheffield Forum members :confused:

Three

Ugh. So far, no news. Absolutely nothing. But I'm still looking. Anyone else had any luck? Unfortunately I'm away tomorrow until Tuesday, and I'd like to know something before I go.

Originally posted by Andy
The South Yorkshire Probation Service's email is bouncing. :rolleyes: I work with the South Yorkshire Probation lot quite a bit and they're a very friendly and helpful bunch, give them a call on 0114 2766911.

They may not be in a position to comment about this, but I am sure that if you are polite they can give you details of someone to speak to about this.

If this fails then use http://www.writetothem.com/ to contact your local MP stating how concerned you are, they will definately get back to you asap with some sort of answer.

And make sure you keep us informed, this is the kind of thing the Sheffield Forum users are good at getting behind if needed.

Thank you, lalaland, I'm on it. Just waiting for someone to get back to me.

Update: having spoken to Probation Services, I have been told I will need to write a letter to the Divisional Manager putting forward my questions.
I will try to do this soon. In the meantime, it may or may not be worth speaking to the current hostel manager. I'll try to do this as well, tho if anyone beats me to it, great. I'm kinda busy...
Cosy

Update:
A conversation with the hostel has shed this light upon the situation:
There will be a change of use most probably, but not within the next financial year (that is until April06). (they could not specify what kind of change)
Women will be moved out of the acommodation shortly as mixed-sex hostels are not a good idea
So not exactly a yes and not exactly a no.
Looks like we may have to wait and see.
Cosy

You local MP will still be able to help on this, they are very good at getting to the bottom of things like this and if you state how concerned you are I am sure they will write back asap with as much detail as they are permitted to give you.

Explain to the MP that you feel you are being kept in the dark about situations that are causing you concern and that your intention is not to cause trouble, but to be kept aware of changes in your area that will affect all.

If it's high risk I'm sure it's also high secure and the chances of anyone getting out of 5+ locked doors is incredibly unlikely, if not impossible. Try not to worry

Looks like we'll have to continue sniffing around then and keep to it. If theres going to be a change we don't want it just happening, and them moving women out shortly seems odd to me if things aren't changing in a more dangerous direction. :confused:

Originally posted by intooblivion
If it's high risk I'm sure it's also high secure and the chances of anyone getting out of 5+ locked doors is incredibly unlikely, if not impossible. Try not to worry If it's a hostel then the people staying there are able to leave the premises, unlike a prison. This means while leaving the premises the occupants of this place will pass by whatever grounds are near to them. IF they are sex offenders then it's possibley not the best move by whoever planned it out.

Originally posted by Andy
Well I am awaiting a reply from another Robbo ;)

Did someone mentioned my name? :smile:

Just got back from my holiday. Have now read the thread, and as I have an interest in Norfolk Park, I will investigate these rumours. Watch this space!

Red

PS We unexpectedly had some really glorious late October sun in Snowdonia, but after Tuesday, it rained.......of course!

Any more news yet ?

Originally posted by owdlad
Any more news yet ?

Please be a little more patient. I only made enquiries yesterday!

I have requested details of any planning applications, old or current, that may have been submitted in relation to the use of the bail hostel. I have also spoken to a senior officer of South Yorkshire Probation Service, and am awaiting an e-mail reply.

As soon as I have any concrete information, I will update this thread. As a local ward councillor, I recognise that speculation and conjecture is creating anxiety in local residents, as my ansaphone and e-mail, (in addition to this discussion thread), testifies.

I do not like to deal with rumours or heresay, so when I have some actual facts, I will post the information.

Red

Originally posted by redrobbo

I do not like to deal with rumours or heresay, so when I have some actual facts, I will post the information.


Thanks for looking into this, redrobbo. :thumbsup:

I feel the need to say baaaa a few times, and definitely to apologise to yourselves, and to Redrobbo for having this sprung on him so unexpectedly and suddenly, causing him even more work, and the rest of you so much concern.

It may be true, we still don't know, and plenty of people are now looking into it. I still hope it isn't. Please don't get worked up until we know whether there is actually something to get worked up over.

I came on here in great indignation firmly believing, as I had been told by an extremely reliable source, that this was not only very imminent, but was also common knowledge, and I was shocked that nothing was being done. (In my defense, I've been out of the loop for some time now, and clearly wouldn't know common knowledge if it bit me)

I have since found that far from being common knowledge, it came as a surprise to most people, and cannot even be confirmed. That will teach me to open my mouth before checking my facts, even if I trust my source.

So apologies to everyone, and a great big BAAAAAAAA and you have a wolf in very sheepish clothing here.

Hopefully the truth will out soon.

Cosy:blush:

No problems cosywolf. I know that your original post was done with the best of intentions, only for you to subsequently discover that no-one else appears to know anything about this alleged change of use of the bail hostel.

I have now received the first bit of information from the council's planning department:-

Planning consent was granted for the bail hostel in 1971. Planning permission would be required for any extensions, significant alterations, etc., but planning permission would not be required for changing the clientele to "sex offenders".

The original permission is archived and I am seeking a copy of it which should be available shortly. I want to check this to determine whether there are any particular restrictions on the use of the property. It is doubtful if there are, but I will respond further on this when I have the information.

I sent an e-mail to the South Yorkshire Probation Service yesterday, and followed that up with a telephone call to a senior probation officer today. I have been promised an e-mail reply, and will post information on this thread when I have received an official response.

Red

P.S. Glad to know you're getting back into the swing of things cosywolf. How's that big bonny baby of yours (no, not Mr cosywolf!)?

Update: I have this evening received the following e-mail......

"Dear Councillor,

Thank you for your email regarding Norfolk Park Approved Premises. I too am increasingly aware of a rumour that seems to be circulating regarding its 'change of use to a sex offender hostel' and indeed we have spoken to a few local residents who have contacted our Head Office. I can categorically state that there are no current plans for Norfolk Park to become a sole provision for sex offenders and to be honest I am not sure how this rumour transpired.

I can confirm that there are some discussions, at both a national and regional level, to change its use to a male hostel, as it is currently a mixed provision. However, we have no known time-scale for this and this is part of a regional development to have a regional women's hostel for the Yorkshire and Humberside Area - not in South Yorkshire I hasten to add.

I hope this goes some way to re-assure your constituents on this matter, and I would be more than happy to meet face to face with yourselves, along with residents if appropriate and if you feel it would be of further assistance. Do let me know if you have any further queries.
Regards,

Heather Harker
Chief Officer
South Yorkshire Probation Area"

I have replied to Heather thanking her for her assistance and quick response. I will not now pursue digging up archived planning consent.

In view of this firm denial I have received from the Chief Probation Officer herself, I believe we can now put this discussion thread to bed.

Red

Thanks for that Red, I agree it's better to let it rest. :thumbsup:

Thanks, Redrobbo. Great work.

Thank you for taking this up and easing our concerns redrobbo :thumbs:

Andy and Cosywolf: Thanks to you two too for your prompt actions.
It's nice to know you guys are around to help in times of need :)

Originally posted by nick2
Of course there are, but there will be a huge kick-off if they try to put it anywhere "nice". Think of the house prices ! There's always one of those God forsaken uninhabited islands off the Outer Hebrides :thumbsup:

Thanks Redrobbo and all. It is indeed good to know SF members can get to the bottom of things :thumbsup:

Cosywolf, you were right to bring it to our attention. :)

Thanks Redrobbo for sorting this, I will put my friends mind at ease. :D :thumbsup:

I have now arranged for Heather Harker, Chief Probation Officer for South Yorkshire, to speak on the work of the hostel at the Norfolk Park Tenant's & Resident's Association meeting during November.

Heather has also kindly accepted an invitation to speak at the Park/Heeley Area Panel public meeting in Norfolk Park in January.

Originally posted by redrobbo
I have now arranged for Heather Harker, Chief Probation Officer for South Yorkshire, to speak on the work of the hostel at the Norfolk Park Tenant's & Resident's Association meeting during November.


Hello Redrobbo :wave:

Can anyone attend this meeting, and if so please post details (or PM, as appropriate).

If not, then is it some kind of "closed shop"?

They used to be held at the social centre on the shops though of course thats gone now. I'm not sure where they are held now unfortunately and if on a week night I'd be at work anyway. :(

Originally posted by Andy
Hello Redrobbo :wave:

Can anyone attend this meeting, and if so please post details (or PM, as appropriate).

If not, then is it some kind of "closed shop"?

Hiya Andy -

Here's the information you requested.....

NORFOLK PARK TENANT'S & RESIDENT'S ASSOCIATION -

GENERAL MEETING

To be held at The Beacon (St Pauls and St Leonards Church) On Tuesday the 22nd of November starting at 7.00pm prompt. Light refreshments will be available. We have invited local Councillors, the Police, Sheffield City Council, North British Housing Association, Sheffield Wildlife Trust, Youth Services and other local groups. Representatives of Sheffield Homes will be attending.

Items for discussion will include (but not be limited to*) Neighbour and Youth Nuisance Issues. Proposed Youth Shelter. Youth Provision (or lack of). Estate Maintenance (footpaths, lighting etc).

All Welcome.

* Heather Harker, Chief Probation Officer for South Yorkshire, has now been added to the list to discuss the work of the Norfok Park Probation Approved Premises (otherwise known as the Bail Hostel).

N.B. I am unable to attend this meeting, and have tendered my apologies in advance. At least one ward councillor will be in attendance though.

Originally posted by redrobbo
Hiya Andy -

Here's the information you requested.....


Thanks for your prompt reply. I have every intention of attending this meeting.

Thanks RedRobbo, i'll be there as well.

I will also be there.

Sounds like a proper little Forum get-together.:suspect:

:D

Did anyone go to the meeting last night? I could only stop for an hour last night so missed half the agenda unfortunately...

They talked about the bail hostel. It is being changed to a single sex hostel but will not house any sex offenders.

The shops. There will be a consultation event on 1 December at the Beacon Church for people to give their views on the councils proposals to build new shops and facilities on norfolk Park.

Derelict maissonettes... (former Beldon site?). There is one owner that is preventing the council moving forward on demolishing the buildings. The council are having to take legal steps to move this forward.

I had to leave at 8 so missed wildlife, antisocial behaviour, police and a few other issues. Did anyone else go that could update me (or are minutes available?)

Originally posted by mrinvestigat
The shops. There will be a consultation event on 1 December at the Beacon Church for people to give their views on the councils proposals to build new shops and facilities on norfolk Park.


Does anyone have more details? This is an event I would like to attend as I feel the one thing that's wrong with this area is the lack of shops!

I have the flyer in my hand right now... it says

"Heart of Norfolk Park"

Consultation Event

Thursday 1st December at The Beacon (Junction of Fellbrigg Road and Park Grange Road)

The Exhibition will be open between 2pm and 7pm. Please call in and give your views and ideas.

Refreshments available

This is your opportunity to let us know what you think about the councils proposals to build new shops and facilities on Norfolk Park.

The architects, Gleesons, North British Housing Assoc, plus Trevor Thorn from Planning are expected to attend.

Originally posted by cosywolf

I know that there is no 'safe' place to put this kind of institution, but I feel this would be inappropriate. There must be areas less close to vulnerable people? In particular, the special schools.

Cosy


yes there is an excellent place to put these pervs in a prison in the middle of the moors miles away from anyone or do what they do in Vietnam put them infront of a firing squad

Originally posted by mrinvestigat
Did anyone go to the meeting last night? I could only stop for an hour last night so missed half the agenda unfortunately...



Wildlife: Updates on green spaces in the area: Guildford View Subway art and renovation projects completed, Jervis Lum bridge railings completed. Work on St Aidans playing field fencing, entrances and pathways in progress. Black Bank: fencing, entrance points and pathwork in progress, woodland path and viewpoint completed.
Youth Space: contentious. Residents near the proposed site unhappy about current problems and concerned that they will get worse. SWT and youth service say it is temporary and will only be done with support network of youth workers and police and will involve local people in monitoring the situation.

Anti-social behaviour: Anger with Council over problem tenants - asserted that the troublemakers get to stay in their homes while victims are moved out. Council stated they can re-look at the specific cases discussed.
Police - discussion about vehicle crime, call-out times and motorcycles. Motorcycles: they need to be able to identify culprits, then they can take bikes. Have taken 3 bikes from estate recently. Vehicle crime: many residents no longer reporting this, a call to continue reporting, or else crime numbers are not representative and less emphasis will be placed on this crime in this area.

Maintenance: Streetforce. Streetlights. They are doing their best, but are constrined by funding. Issues about paths to be discussed at a later date. Meeting ran out of time.

Hope that helps.:D

Isn't Talbot closing soon though ?