Melanie
15-09-2005, 09:10 PM
We have just dropped the ceiling in our off shot kitchen. The kitchen has a chimney breast in it, which has been removed above ceiling level.
However, the next door neighbour's chimney is still there above ceiling level but below their ceiling, half of it has been removed. The chimney stack above has been left unsupported. The neighbours have lived in the house for 19 years and bought the house in that condition, we have now brought it to their attention but they aren't bothered about sorting it out.
We are concerned that their chimney stack will eventually fall down. Thing is, legally we can't touch it because it isn't ours but it might fall through our ceiling in the future.
Does anyone know if there is anyone we can call to come out and inspect the situation with a view to forcing them to face up their responsibility and make it safe?!
Could the council help?
http://www.sheffield.gov.uk/index.asp?pgid=19153
Stronghands
17-09-2005, 05:57 PM
Hi
This sort of problem would be covered by Party Wall legislation. Even if they were to do the work they would have to inform you first. Party walls are covered by special rules - precisely because of your type of concerns and these types of problems.
Ignorance is bliss - you are no longer ignorant and have lost your state of bliss! It may fall down - it may not. Have you checkd right under the lowest course of briks - are there any types of brackets - gallow type or inverted L?
These sort of disputes drive a wedge between neighbours. I woul dtake photographs of the structure inside and outside including the internal areas in your kitchen etc. This shows that all is well on your side. You fall into that grey area that you have worked on their party wall which has been stable for 19 years.
If their above ceiling chimney collapsed they - or at least their insurance company would take a pop at you. However, if your works were carried out correctly under the guidance of the local buliding planning and control (not sure if you did this as they should have contacted your neighbours correctly).
Andy posted a good first start - have a look at that.
Your neighbours will not want the expense or the disruption of making good the chimney stack. Neither of you will want the nightmare and dange of a collapsed chimney - this thing will consist of hundreds of bricks and possibly weigh a good few tonnes.
If you or your neighbour were to sell your house - this should be picked up (and should have been picked up) by a structural engineer during a pre-purchase structural survey. Have they been considering some building work themselves? This may be a great time to do the lot in a oner! Explain the benefits to them by doing it. Perhaps there is additional pointing etc which could be done. Also if they do come to sell the propery it will have to be done - thus delying the sale of their house and the knock-on effect on their new property - perhaps losing a sale outright or the house of their dreams. Though at 19 years I can see them pretty wee rooted. Sell them the benefits. If you quickly become impatient and start blazing at them - they will dig their heels in. alternativley if you formalise they will have to do any necessary work - your relationship with them may or may not suffer and you may or may not care!
I'm pretty sure that if you went to your local building control (as given by Andy) you could explain you do not want to go formalise this yet with your neighbours as you are mindful of long-term disputes. They would look at photographs and perhaps decide there and then.
You could have another friendly chat with your neighbour - have you encouraged them to take a look themselves. Show them a few artciles (from the wen) on collapsed chimneys and see if you can get them to see reason. Could you get the builder who did yours to have a word with them and give them a fair idea of price? Reinforce to them that it is not that you want them to needlessly suffer the disruption or expense of repairs. It is because it has affected your piece of mind and is risking life, limb and property.
If they are still not interested you could either send them a copy of a letter stating what you have discovered, what the opinions of competent people are ie your builder etc and that if anything happens or the situation worsens you will pursue this matter through the courts. Explain to your neighbours that you will be sending the letter as you have been advised by your solicitor.
You could also twist their arm a little more by stating that as they have been made aware of the potential structural defect on this party wall they will be responsible and accountable for any subsequestial losses you suffer including but not limited to life, limb, property, contents and consequential losses.
I know ho I would do all this from the start - it would be friendly, helpful though concerned and looking for resolution.
If the wall was to collapse you also know about it and would have to live with the
If you were to formalise it - the matter would be taken out of your hands.
Hope it goes well.