Hi all,

The road my office is on has always been double yellows up until about a week ago when they re-surfaced it.

Now, the council havent got round to repainting the double yellows yet - but the (small) no parking sign is still there.

So, question is - is it still no parking or do no yellow lines mean until they get round to re-doing them you can park there?

Does there physically have to be the lines there for traffic wardens etc to enforce it or not?

anybody know?

Cheers

Saifa

I believe that if the signs displaying the fact that it is no parking are visible then it is still applicable - that is, the enforcement remains.

Motorists have tried wriggling out of paying fines when they've parked on yellow lines that have been hidden underneath autumn leaves. In the cases I've heard of, they've still had to pay the fine as the signs were still visible.

My advice would be to not risk it.

There is no need for there to be double yellows if there are "urban clearway" signs like this one (http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/sign063.htm) (doesn't have to have the times etc bit) or like this (http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/sign061.htm) or this (http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/sign062.htm) . Those signs are the equivalent of double yellows, so if they still remain then it's still illegal to park there. :)

HTH
Steve

Originally posted by Saifa
... but the (small) no parking sign is still there.

I think you've answered your own question. Size of the sign is in no way representative of its relevance!

:)

If there are no double yellow lines in situ then the 'no parking' cannot be enforced. Lines must be in place.

Originally posted by the_rudeboy
If there are no double yellow lines in situ then the 'no parking' cannot be enforced. Lines must be in place.

A lot of people do park where the yellow lines used to be which got me thinking maybe this is the case RB, and as far as I know no-ones got a ticket yet.

But is this because its unenforceable or just cos Mr Warden aint been down our way lately?

Originally posted by Saifa


But is this because its unenforceable or just cos Mr Warden aint been down our way lately?

No lines.....no ticket. The lines are what indicates the area is 'no parking'. Additional signs indicate the exact type of restriction (ie. no parking at any time or no parking between specific times)

I believed that too rudeboy, and also if there are double yellow lines they have to have the line across the end (at the end of the road/restriction) joining them together to make them legal.

I remember seeing an old chap on the telly going around his local area, specifically parking in such places as double yellows with no line at the end, parts that had been re-surfaced but had not been repainted, and worn out lines etc. He got tickets for it and went to court, but always won. His point if I remember rightly, was to show that the council highways dept wasn't doing their jobs properly.

Not that I would suggest anyone risk it tho :shakes:

Correct Colorado....they must have the end bar marking too.

I would park there.....no hesitation.

If there are proper no parking signs then it is illegal to park there and you will be prosecuted if spotted.

Motorways (and dual carriageways - excluding designated parking lay-bys) are urban clearways (i.e. have the signs I showed in my post above) - they don't have double yellow lines tho - try parking there and see how well you're recieved ;)

You do not need double yellows to enforce a 'no parking' area.

I agree tho, if there aren't any signs and the yellow lines aren't painted properly, you are meant to be able to 'get away' with it if any attempt at prosecution occurs.

If it helps clear up the matter - its a side road, not a main or dual carriageway. the first half of it has always been dble yellows (the bit by the office) and the farthest half hasn't.

Sign is one of these "no parking between 9 and 5" jobs, but the yellow lines that accompanied it have been for the most part been removed by the re-surfacing.

It all comes down to the work car park being "permit only" :( and too many folk driving in.

Its in Huddersfield btw so I think you all can appreciate that I dont have much of a choice but to drive mesen from Hillsboro..

If there are signs, you can't park ther legally AIUI. Lines or no lines - there IS a parking restriction there and that's that. Sorry! :|

Rats!!!

Oh well, I suppose the walk will do me good. :D

Originally posted by SupraSteve

You do not need double yellows to enforce a 'no parking' area.


I agree.....but only on a 'Clearway'. Clearway signs are displayed at the beginning of any clearway and again when leaving the clearway. Clearways do not require double yellows. The road in question isn't a clearway otherwise it wouldn't have had double yellows in the first place.

No parking CANNOT be enforced if the lines are not present. If there are no lines how do you know the extent of the area you cannot park on? Signs or no signs.
The traffic Order will have very specific details of the area where parking is prohibited (ie so many metres from so & so junnction to outside houe number whatever) and that is what the yellow lines indicate.

Thats how i understand it anyway.

The no parking signs have the clearway symbol on them.

Originally posted by SupraSteve
The no parking signs have the clearway symbol on them.

Incorrect.......its a different symbol.
The clearway symbol is no. 642 (blue circle with red cross)
The symbol on 'no parking' signs is no. 636 (blue circle with one red line)

ok I was calling both signs the same thing, but it is the same result - you can't park there. :P

Originally posted by the_rudeboy
I agree.....but only on a 'Clearway'. Clearway signs are displayed at the beginning of any clearway and again when leaving the clearway. Clearways do not require double yellows. The road in question isn't a clearway otherwise it wouldn't have had double yellows in the first place.

No parking CANNOT be enforced if the lines are not present. If there are no lines how do you know the extent of the area you cannot park on? Signs or no signs.
The traffic Order will have very specific details of the area where parking is prohibited (ie so many metres from so & so junnction to outside houe number whatever) and that is what the yellow lines indicate.

Thats how i understand it anyway.

got to agree,technically the line has to be visible i.e not under street filth but this is debateable. the end of the lines also has to be clear, someone challenged a council by photographing all the illegal yellow lines in one city.

I guess try it and see, or call the council responible and ask (and if the answer is in your favour get it in writing for when you inevitably get a ticket from a friendly warden). ;)

It's probably not worth worrying about anyway, no doubt the lines will be back within the week. :|

Originally posted by SupraSteve
or call the council responible and ask

I did.......thats where i got my info.

Just a point on this one.

If the original yellow lines where only on a short length of the road, - i.e. 20mtrs or so,- and the sign applied to this length when the lines were there, then surely now that the lines aren't there then the sign must surely apply to the whole length of the road now.

By this, I mean that if people are liable to ticketing for parking where the lines were, then anyone parking anywhere on that road is now likely to get a ticket where they wouldn't have before. The sign doesn't signify how far along the road the parking ban covers.

I think the sign is a reinforcement of double yellows, and in this case there are no double yellows for the sign to reinforce so the sign has no value.

Originally posted by saxon51
Just a point on this one.

If the original yellow lines where only on a short length of the road, - i.e. 20mtrs or so,- and the sign applied to this length when the lines were there, then surely now that the lines aren't there then the sign must surely apply to the whole length of the road now.

By this, I mean that if people are liable to ticketing for parking where the lines were, then anyone parking anywhere on that road is now likely to get a ticket where they wouldn't have before. The sign doesn't signify how far along the road the parking ban covers.

I think the sign is a reinforcement of double yellows, and in this case there are no double yellows for the sign to reinforce so the sign has no value.

I think that sums it up.
The lines indicate the area of restriction.....no lines, no restriction.

ok! theres a sign and that sign relates to no parking on double yellow lines:if there are no double yellow lines then the sign becomes void.you cant tell someone they cant park in a particular place because it has double yellow lines if there aint any.there is a loophole in the law here people.

Originally posted by dlee
ok! theres a sign and that sign relates to no parking on double yellow lines:if there are no double yellow lines then the sign becomes void.you cant tell someone they cant park in a particular place because it has double yellow lines if there aint any.there is a loophole in the law here people.

As i understand it under the current regulations double yellow lines do not require the additional signing. Signs are only erected if the parking restriction is anything other than 'At Any Time'.

Previously, both the lines & signs were required to enforce the parking restriction. Obviously there are still many roads that still have both.

So whichever way you look at it.....if there aren't any lines then the restriction cannot be enforced.