What browser does everyone use?

After trying FF i have made everyone i know use it, its faster cleaner and just generally works nicer than IE :)

www.getfirefox.com

i suggest EVERYONE tries just to see if they like it :)

whats the main differences between both?

Security. Firefox isn't full of security holes as IE is. It's also a better browser with more features which I use all the time. IE is a bit crap really, use Firefox, you won't go back.

I downloaded Firefox yesterday after hearing several recommendations. All seems well so far, however, I joined Plusnet Broadband yesterday (am currently on dial up :-( ) and I'm not sure whether they like Firefox. So we'll see.

IE does the job for me and always has done, never had any problems. I havent tried FF, and dont plan to, it may be better I dont know, but IMO it if aint broken then why fix it.

What about "I use IE, and am NOT scared of the change?". Just because I choose to use IE (I have both browsers and others installed) doesn't mean the only reason I use it is through fear of changing!

Originally posted by trentboy2
.... I joined Plusnet Broadband yesterday (am currently on dial up :-( ) and I'm not sure whether they like Firefox. So we'll see. [/B]

I use Firefox with Force9 (the same company as plusnet) and have no problems so you should be fine.

I used to come under the category 'I use I.E but am afraid of change' thinking that I would get all sorts of conflicts/headaches by changing, but nothing could have been simpler. Anyone out there dithering - give it a go :thumbsup:

.....Wouldnt go back to using I.E.....

Firefox is faster (despite it still having the memory leak it did way back in Firebird 0.2) its leaner, cleaner, more customisable, and tabbed browsing so I have one browser window, but lots of pages open. Plus, I dont use windows, and FF runs nicely on BSD.

Joel

Originally posted by Joelc
Firefox is faster (despite it still having the memory leak it did way back in Firebird 0.2) its leaner, cleaner, more customisable, and tabbed browsing so I have one browser window, but lots of pages open. Plus, I dont use windows, and FF runs nicely on BSD.

Joel

When I have used Firefox for browsing and downloading, it's anything but fast. It takes much longer to load the first instance of it, the web pages load using image placeholders rather than the gradual loading used by IE (which means you can see things before the whole page has loaded), and also after a short while it begins to really use up RAM. I've had Firefox taking up over 100mb of my PC's RAM according to the XP Tasklist - it's anything but resource efficient and the longer you use it/the more you download before closing it, the more RAM it uses. IE on the other hand is much more efficient, and add a "shell" program to it like Avant browser and you get all the Firefox features (tabbed browsing, pop up/ad blocker, etc) and more.

Aye, its had a big memory leak for a long time. Especally if you have it open for a while. The other thing about firefox is that its properly web compliant, doesnt add spaces and bit in that shouldent be there like IE does.

Joel

So from what I'm hearing (good to have both sides of the coin by the way) IE is less secure but doesn't take as much Ram and Firefox is more secure but takes much more Ram than IE.

What about other browsers?

Opera here! (I try to like Firefox, but it just doesn't "feel" as slick, plus it takes about 100 extensions to get it anywhere like how I like it :))

For those people saying "why bother changing from IE?", remember that you can get infected with spyware and viruses just by visiting certain websites! You don't have to click to install anything, and being up to date on patches is no guarantee on safety, there are serious IE security issues that have existed (and been known about) for months that are not fixed...

Originally posted by spyro2000
IE does the job for me and always has done, never had any problems. I havent tried FF, and dont plan to, it may be better I dont know, but IMO it if aint broken then why fix it.

Exactly what MS say about IE, but they too fail to mention that it is actually broke. It's a bit like driving round in a car with no locks that doesn't need a key to start and saying it's never been stolen so it must be secure.

Originally posted by Lurch
It's a bit like driving round in a car with no locks that doesn't need a key to start and saying it's never been stolen so it must be secure.


Nice analogy there:thumbsup:;).

Originally posted by rich951
Opera here! (I try to like Firefox, but it just doesn't "feel" as slick, plus it takes about 100 extensions to get it anywhere like how I like it :))

For those people saying "why bother changing from IE?", remember that you can get infected with spyware and viruses just by visiting certain websites! You don't have to click to install anything, and being up to date on patches is no guarantee on safety, there are serious IE security issues that have existed (and been known about) for months that are not fixed...

Opera always seems bloated, with the mail and all the other crap, like nutscrape and the mozilla suite used to do.

Joel

Originally posted by Joelc
Opera always seems bloated, with the mail and all the other crap, like nutscrape and the mozilla suite used to do.

Joel
Bloated in terms of features maybe... I just did a comparison, 3.7MB to download Opera compared to 4.7MB for firefox (default Windows installations). I must admit I'd be happy without some of the features like mail as I never use them, but it would be pointless to worry about the megabyte of hd space they take up! :) You can also turn off all the toolbars so I wouldn't actually know what was there apart from the browser element without researching it... The real crunch point for me (that I totally forgot about earlier) is the cached rendering when you click Back - every other browser drives me mad with how slow it is!

An example of where Firefox annoys me: have three tabs running. Click on the first one. Then click on the third one. Close the current (third) one. Is there a way via the options to stop it then bringing up tab 2? (ie it doesn't remember the order you were viewing them in) This might seem trivial, but when there are a dozen things like this that Opera does "right", it suits me much better - and I realise it's my definition of "right"! ;) (the other two main ones, that you need an extension to have the focus on new tabs when you open them, and another extension to be able to move tabs around. Someone may find options to replicate this hidden away, but I spent a while looking and couldn't, which is a fault in itself if they are there!)

Opera all the way

loads pages faster than firefox / ie,
although isnt free the ads arent intrusive and i actually bought it anyway.
I agree with t020(didnt thought id ever say that :S ) and firefox loads pages really annoyingly.

Opera is currently using 22mb RAM, ive had it open since at least midday so no memory leaks there and I love the fact i get all my transfers sitting just there
<-------
(I download A LOT)

and the fully customisable interface is wonderful too.

One complaint: since version 8.0 my computer has had real issues with operas cache.
Every time it checks the cache it grinds to a halt for a few seconds.
Reducing cache to 5 mb helped but its a bit irritating (as I only browse a couple of sites regularly)

think it was something to do with defragging disk though so *shrug*

and the mail client incidentally is fantastic., and actually built into the browser (definately a plus) - id also like to remind firefox users that opera invented tabbed browsing (ok i might be making that up) but certainly does it much better!

Originally posted by spyro2000
IE does the job for me and always has done, never had any problems. I havent tried FF, and dont plan to, it may be better I dont know, but IMO it if aint broken then why fix it.

and thats why you have a thousand security holes letting dialers, hackers, viruses and other exploits through without having to click on them..............instead of installing firefox and having both to choose from (IE just incase a website doesnt like firefox) and having 1 or 2 problems / holes

Can we have an option for "I'd like to use Firefox, but it doesn't do the job for me so I still have to make do with IE most of the time"? (For more specifics, see my many posts here (http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43557))

Also, what about Safari? I use that a lot of the time now.

Don't suppose anyone reading this has access to the forum logs showing browser types (and other such info)? :) I'd be interested to see a break-down of how SF compares to other sites I know the stats for...

OK, just to throw a spanner in the works, Im using firefox for web development, konqueror on my main desktop at home, and on my old laptop with bugger all processor power I use elinks [http://elinks.or.cz/]

elinks is actually becoming more and more fun the more I learn about it. No chance of it taking on IE and the like though!

I use FF for web dev, as it renders pages properly, with do weird gaps, and no silly image spacing. I also like to have lynx installed for emergancies.

Joel

Another vote for Firefox here :thumbsup:
What memory leak are you all talking about? A new one on me :?
Mine is running at 53MB RAM at the min. Quite a lot, yes, but then again it's doing a lot of work.

rich591: The tabbed preferences you talk about are switched off by default for some reason in Firefox?
My Tips and Tricks (http://xthost.info/vidster9/HTML/tips&tricks.htm) page will explain how to enable this function :)
Originally posted by Lurch
Exactly what MS say about IE, but they too fail to mention that it is actually broke. It's a bit like driving round in a car with no locks that doesn't need a key to start and saying it's never been stolen so it must be secure.
Exactly! :thumbsup:
Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
and the mail client incidentally is fantastic., and actually built into the browser (definately a plus) - id also like to remind firefox users that opera invented tabbed browsing (ok i might be making that up) but certainly does it much better!
Can't agree with that i'm afraid :( See explanation above.

I would like to add that i do actually like Opera. I use it from time to time. It's just a pity it doesn't work properly on some forums. More ways to speed it up would be nice too :rolleyes:

Originally posted by vidster
Another vote for Firefox here :thumbsup:
What memory leak are you all talking about? A new one on me :?
Mine is running at 53MB RAM at the min. Quite a lot, yes, but then again it's doing a lot of work.


53mb is a lot for a browser anyway, but keep it open and keep browsing lots of sites and it just builds up and up. It's very inefficient.

53mb is a lot for a browser anyway, but keep it open and keep browsing lots of sites and it just builds up and up. It's very inefficient.



Does this go reset back to normal when you log off??

Originally posted by t020
53mb is a lot for a browser anyway, but keep it open and keep browsing lots of sites and it just builds up and up. It's very inefficient. I keep it open for at least 10 hours a day t020. I need to be accessable as much as possible on CbtTechs. I've never noticed Firefox go any higher than it is (although i don't make a point of checking).
And it flys for me when compared to IE :wink:

Originally posted by melthebell
and thats why you have a thousand security holes letting dialers, hackers, viruses and other exploits through without having to click on them..............instead of installing firefox and having both to choose from (IE just incase a website doesnt like firefox) and having 1 or 2 problems / holes

Nope, have never had a problem, haev got lots of software to protect against such things, and my net is on 24 hours a day. Dont see the problem really

Originally posted by vidster
I keep it open for at least 10 hours a day t020. I need to be accessable as much as possible on CbtTechs. I've never noticed Firefox go any higher than it is (although i don't make a point of checking).
And it flys for me when compared to IE :wink:

Do you use Windows XP? It seems the "memory leak" problem is more apparent with Windows. After a couple of hours browsing on my machine, Firefox easily tops 100mb, which is just ridiculous. When it uses this amount, even though I have 1gb RAM, the browser runs really slowly.

I usually keep Firefox running for days at a time. On this laptop with 512Mb, Firefox has been on for a good week now, it's using 117Mb and the machine is running as well as it normally does.

Originally posted by t020
Do you use Windows XP? It seems the "memory leak" problem is more apparent with Windows. After a couple of hours browsing on my machine, Firefox easily tops 100mb, which is just ridiculous. When it uses this amount, even though I have 1gb RAM, the browser runs really slowly.
I'm using XP pro at the min t020. It looks to me like Firefox works differently on different systems :?
Originally posted by spyro2000
Nope, have never had a problem, haev got lots of software to protect against such things
Is'nt that the same as using extentions with Firefox?
Originally posted by Lurch
it's using 117Mb and the machine is running as well as it normally does.
I'd be uninstalling Firefox if it was using that much RAM on my PC :(

I use IE, and am likely to continue to do so.

I have experimented with Firefox, and Opera, but never really took to them. I just prefer IE, and don't have problem with it.

With regards to the "Firefox doesn't have security holes" arguement...it does. Now that Firefox is rapidly becoming more widespread in use, attacks have begun exploiting the holes in the browser (the first ones were reported a few months back). In the past it was deemed safe because crackers and coders didn't see the point of exploiting script bugs in a browser that wouldn't create widespread problems. IE has always been a target becasue it was the default browser on PCs.

The more popular a piece of software becomes, the more inviting it is for coders to break.

But Firefox is open source.
Any flaws are found and fixed much faster than in Internet Explorer. It doesn't take a month for a patch to be released.

Nice to see everyones opinions on the matter

The ONLY reason i use IE is to open my email from MSN

You can also get some coding bits that you can put in FF to speed it up even more, cant remember where i got it from though :p

Originally posted by Beakerzoid
I use IE, and am likely to continue to do so.

I have experimented with Firefox, and Opera, but never really took to them. I just prefer IE, and don't have problem with it.

With regards to the "Firefox doesn't have security holes" arguement...it does. Now that Firefox is rapidly becoming more widespread in use, attacks have begun exploiting the holes in the browser (the first ones were reported a few months back). In the past it was deemed safe because crackers and coders didn't see the point of exploiting script bugs in a browser that wouldn't create widespread problems. IE has always been a target becasue it was the default browser on PCs.
.
yes it does, all software has holes, the point is, firefox has a few holes, IE has hundreds....i know which id prefer to use :)
and i know about that exploit in firefox which can get details off banking sites when an infected site is opened at the same time.....not that possible tbh and still way less dodgy than a lot of IEs holes and weaknesses

Originally posted by spyro2000
Nope, have never had a problem, haev got lots of software to protect against such things, and my net is on 24 hours a day. Dont see the problem really

you have software to protect against most things, the point with holes is they let people and software through that you dont know about, so you cant be 100% sure you are safe.

and installing hundreds of bits of software to stop leaks and holes that firefox on its own doesnt let through is is a bit ridiculous really :)

even the fbi (i think it was) a while ago advised against using IE

Originally posted by melthebell
yes it does, all software has holes, the point is, firefox has a few holes, IE has hundreds....i know which id prefer to use :)


No, the point is that Firefox has a few holes *discovered so far*, IE has hundreds *discovered so far*. Now that Firefox is becoming increasingly popular, get ready for more and more holes to be discovered by the hackers.

i have firefox open 6 hours a night, all day saturdays and sundays, not sure how much resources it uses, but i only really get slow down when using azureous......its only really then when i minimise / maximise firefox it takes a while to do its thing

just had a look in task manager, tells me firefox is using 35mb?? i think, first time ive used the memory usage section in there
and thats with azureous going too

Originally posted by t020
No, the point is that Firefox has a few holes *discovered so far*, IE has hundreds *discovered so far*. Now that Firefox is becoming increasingly popular, get ready for more and more holes to be discovered by the hackers.
and IE will go up too, its not one way you know
and just because hackers might look more for them in firefox cos its becoming more popular DOESNT mean theyll find any, it depends on how well made the software is, you cant find holes in something without holes.
plus as already been said, firefox is open source which allows holes to be plugged quicker than IE's

Originally posted by melthebell
and IE will go up too, its not one way you know
and just because hackers might look more for them in firefox cos its becoming more popular DOESNT mean theyll find any, it depends on how well made the software is, you cant find holes in something without holes.
plus as already been said, firefox is open source which allows holes to be plugged quicker than IE's

Time will tell, but judging by the memory leak issue that some people experience the software can't be that well made. I suspect the holes in IE are probably all discovered now too.

Originally posted by t020
I suspect the holes in IE are probably all discovered now too. :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: I never had you down as a comedien t020 :hihi: :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:

Just think... No more critical updates from M$

I think somebody asked what the usage figures were for each browser. According to this article (http://www.infoworld.com/article/05/07/14/HNfirefoxgains_1.html), Firefox is gaining on IE but still only has 8.71% compared to 86.56%.

Originally posted by DanSumption
I think somebody asked what the usage figures were for each browser. According to this article (http://www.infoworld.com/article/05/07/14/HNfirefoxgains_1.html), Firefox is gaining on IE but still only has 8.71% compared to 86.56%.

cos idiots still think............ooh firefox has a couple of issues, better stick with IE (forgetting that IE has a milion more issues)

Have a look at this link (http://secunia.com/product/11/#advisories), which lists IE vulnerabilities, and see how many of them are listed as "unpatched" (uncluding some going back to 2003!). Most of them aren't *that* serious, but this is just the vulnerabilities known to this one security company. Bear in mind that ActiveX issues can allow your computer to be affected just by visiting a website (you don't have to download anything, run anything, click on anything or agree to any options), and I don't think it's over-paranoid to be a little worried. Granted, a good firewall/antivirus/antispyware setup will help with most of these, but would it not be nice to not *need* all these things with a properly written system?

Remember that the best spyware programs wouldn't be the ones that distracted you with annoying popups, they would be the ones that just sat there silently, passing your credit cards on to someone. One good thing about the spyware explosion is that rather than people making malicious programs to destroy computers, the market economy means they are better off writing exploits to generate advertising or control machines for spam! Anyone who has used computers a few years will think back to the days of viruses which for example wiped your hard drive the instant you got them :)

Fireworks is indeed not a perfect alternative, but it's an awful lot better - you can honestly say you are happy with IE having 30% of 67 vulnerabilities currently unpatched? For anyone saying that it's purely its lack of use that means its lack of attacks, think about Apache vs IIS. There has been a long history of open-source coders fixing issues within hours, whereas Microsoft generally takes several weeks (they talk about the long delays in this article (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1825805,00.asp).

Personally, I absolutely avoid using anything which doesn't support tabbed browsing. I also use Opera for the nicest browsing "experience" I've tried.

Originally posted by rich951
Have a look at this link (http://secunia.com/product/11/#advisories), which lists IE vulnerabilities, and see how many of them are listed as "unpatched" (uncluding some going back to 2003!). Most of them aren't *that* serious, but this is just the vulnerabilities known to this one security company. Bear in mind that ActiveX issues can allow your computer to be affected just by visiting a website (you don't have to download anything, run anything, click on anything or agree to any options), and I don't think it's over-paranoid to be a little worried. Granted, a good firewall/antivirus/antispyware setup will help with most of these, but would it not be nice to not *need* all these things with a properly written system?



zactly
im security concious and have all the right gear, but when i was using IE i got a dialler, got past my firewall AND AV un noticed, i only noticed when my dial up connection stopped and re dialed, i looked and the number had changed.......took ages to get off and messed up my connection for a time...........all by just visiting a site and helpful IE with its active x shall run automatically attitude let it through unhindered, not chosen by me, thats the main reason i went straight to firefox cos active x doesnt run automatically, also easier to enable / disable java / javascript

Originally posted by rich951
Anyone who has used computers a few years will think back to the days of viruses which for example wiped your hard drive the instant you got them :)

Oooohh, what fun!

Installing SW from 7 floppy disks, 10 mins later, dead PC:thumbsup:.

Originally posted by melthebell
cos idiots still think............ooh firefox has a couple of issues, better stick with IE (forgetting that IE has a milion more issues)
Most "idiots" actually think "Firefox? IE? What the hell are you talking about, is that some kind of secret code? I just use the stuff on my computer".

Then there are a small number of "idiots", such as myself, who as I've already explained would like to use Firefox more but would be unable to visit some of their favourite sites if they did so.

Originally posted by DanSumption
Most "idiots" actually think "Firefox? IE? What the hell are you talking about, is that some kind of secret code? I just use the stuff on my computer".

Then there are a small number of "idiots", such as myself, who as I've already explained would like to use Firefox more but would be unable to visit some of their favourite sites if they did so.

then you use IE for the "few" sites you cant use it on, a fews better than all :)

personally i aint found that many i need to access but cant with firefox

IE is the only browser that does [b[not[/b] support 8-bit transparency in 24bit png files.

So a design like this http://www.madmanners.co.uk/newpublichtml/ works well in opera and FF, but looks ****e in IE.

I do wish the people at IE would catch up with the rest of the world.

Ho Hum.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
IE is the only browser that does not support 8-bit transparency in 24bit png files.
I know, it's a pain in the arse. On this site (http://www.allsum.com/) I had to use a transparent GIF, anti-aliased for an average grey, which means that on half the pages you get bits of grey halo around the logo, all because of IE.

(I also had to double up the bottom gradient, so that it doesn't float away from the main content in IE)

nothing worse than things floating away..................specially those damn helium balloons if you let go :mad:

Just to share a little Firefox tip, as an example of why it's better than IE (not *just* tabbed browsing and security, although those should be enough! ;))

Go to any page with a search box, eg google, imdb or even the SF thread search! Right click on the search box, select "Add a keyword for this search", give it a name (it creates a bookmark) and a shortcut key - in this example "s". Then next time you want to search the site, just type "s internet explorer security" in the address bar and it will go straight there... It's like having the equivalent of an IE google toolbar for loads of different sites, without taking up any screen space.

Apologies to those who knew this already, I'm just trying to sway the undecided! There's lots of other useful features like this, so no, not every web browser is the same! I'd also like to plug firefox's "View in IE" extension (https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=35&application=firefox) which lets you follow a link in an IE popup window if you need to use it.

Originally posted by rich951
[B]Just to share a little Firefox tip, as an example of why it's better than IE (not *just* tabbed browsing and security, although those should be enough! ;))

I haven't actually got to grips with tabbed browsing yet - I don't understand the benefits - and I have looked in 'help'
I seem to be missing the point.
I feel a little stupid.....:blush:

Originally posted by rich951
I'd also like to plug firefox's "View in IE" extension (https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=35&application=firefox) which lets you follow a link in an IE popup window if you need to use it.


I've been doing this for ages (RE ViewInIe extension). Not had to use it myself (so far) though.

It's a slightly personal thing. I like to separate my web browsing from the other stuff I do, as I always have several pages open at once (for example, right now I have 14 tabs in Opera, and four in Firefox). I don't like having my taskbar swamped by millions of web browser windows (it's "double height" already and still pretty full). It's nice and easy to flick between them and see the names of all the pages rather than just a couple of letters. I also like the way you can do things like "open in background tab" in Opera, to set a page downloading while you finish reading the current one. You can also have say two or three firefox windows, each with a set of tabs in about a particular subject.

Maybe I just open a lot more webpages than you! :)

Originally posted by Draggletail
I haven't actually got to grips with tabbed browsing yet - I don't understand the benefits - and I have looked in 'help'
I seem to be missing the point.
I feel a little stupid.....:blush:

I suggest the latest version of Tab Mix (http://www.extensionsmirror.nl/index.php?showtopic=2291) Draggletail :wink:

Originally posted by DanSumption
I know, it's a pain in the arse. On this site (http://www.allsum.com/) I had to use a transparent GIF, anti-aliased for an average grey, which means that on half the pages you get bits of grey halo around the logo, all because of IE.

(I also had to double up the bottom gradient, so that it doesn't float away from the main content in IE)

Its an arse and no mistake.

However, coming back to this prompted me to see if I could find a workaround - and of course there is one.

I have no doubt it works, but can someone explain what it does - http://koivi.com/ie-png-transparency/

thx

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
I have no doubt it works, but can someone explain what it does - http://koivi.com/ie-png-transparency/

thx

It apparently re-directs the .png rendering to DirectX, so you don't get the naaaasty side-effects. I still haven't got it working. Apparently IE7 will support pngs properly...

<utterance type="sarcy">yay!</utterance>

iv nevarealy botherd much IE seems to work fine

Which is better and why?

personal preferance

i prefer firefox

does firefox help prevent against pop-ups, adware, spyware, trojens, etc as soon as you download it or do you have to install add-ins for it?

It has a pop up blocker already installed.

Spybot & ad-aware will help against spyware.

if you'd have asked this a month ago, i would have said ie, becuase it was what was default browser in windows and so i just did the same as alot of others and just used that.

now i prefer firefox.

I've been learning abit of the old web design and ie just doesn't display things according to standards. Firefox appears to be much more consistent. I do like how firefox constantly checks for updates so you know you've got the most up to date that mozilla have on offer aswell.

The best thing about Firefox/Mozilla is this plug in...

StumbleUpon (http://www.stumbleupon.com/)

I really can't recommend it enough. You'll never be bored again :D

K-Meleon (http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/) Same engine as Firefox, but without all the bloat...have a look and give it a try, if you like a fast browser that is user configurable then this will be for you.
If you like the IE engine based browser then have a look at GreenBrowser (http://www.morequick.com/indexen.htm)

Having tried Firefox on a couple of occassions, I hate to say it but the FF fanboys are all on crack IMO and don't know what they're on about.

IE > Firefox.

4 posts above reccomend Firefox (5 including this one.). 1 post from Rich going for IE, and once again proving that he hasnt got a clue.

And also a blatant use of the word "fanboy" in such a fanboyesque statement without the slightest trace of irony...

Has he ever explained why? (Without it descending to insinuations of substance abuse or similar)

4 posts above reccomend Firefox (5 including this one.). 1 post from Rich going for IE, and once again proving that he hasnt got a clue.

Please lay off the personal jibes. The comment above adds little to the discussion.

And Rich - you crtainly know how to wind people up. I've already asked you today to chill out, so I'm asking again now. Don't be rude to people, and they won't be rude back.

Thanks.

Please lay off the personal jibes. The comment above adds little to the discussion.

And Rich - you crtainly know how to wind people up. I've already asked you today to chill out, so I'm asking again now. Don't be rude to people, and they won't be rude back.

Thanks.

I was adding my reccomendation for Firefox over IE, and pointing out that Richs 'opinion' had little to no validity. When he can come up with a post containing a valid argument for his proplem with firefox/sony/whoever or whatever hes got a bee in his bonnet about today, Ill lay off him. If he cant handle the replies he knows hes going to get, he shouldnt put finger to keyboard in the first place.

I was adding my reccomendation for Firefox over IE, and pointing out that Richs 'opinion' had little to no validity. When he can come up with a post containing a valid argument for his proplem with firefox/sony/whoever or whatever hes got a bee in his bonnet about today, Ill lay off him. If he cant handle the replies he knows hes going to get, he shouldnt put finger to keyboard in the first place.

And you call ME out for trolling?! :rolleyes:

Grow up.

Joe, I'm sorry about this.. But I don't see why I should take crap from the likes of HIM just because I prefer IE over his precious Firefox.

That's my own opinion, FFS my Grandad and Great Grandad fought both World Wars between them to get me the right to have that opinion, so I'll be damned if I'm changing it because somebody else doesn't like it.

I use neither............. as I use Avant browser

And you call ME out for trolling?! :rolleyes:

Grow up.

You see Rich, this is exactly my point. You make a post that has no valid argument to back it up, you get pulled up on that, and given the opportunity to make your point and back up your opinion with facts. But instead, you spit the dummy out and throw out the insults. Im not the one who needs to grow up here.

You see Rich, this is exactly my point. You make a post that has no valid argument to back it up, you get pulled up on that, and given the opportunity to make your point and back up your opinion with facts. But instead, you spit the dummy out and throw out the insults. Im not the one who needs to grow up here.

I give up.

Why would i even bother explaining when YOU have already decided I'm wrong anyway?! Tell me, just WHAT is the f***ing point?!

And you call ME out for trolling?! :rolleyes:

Grow up.

Joe, I'm sorry about this.. But I don't see why I should take crap from the likes of HIM just because I prefer IE over his precious Firefox.

'the likes of HIM'. Meaning what, exactly?

That's my own opinion, FFS my Grandad and Great Grandad fought both World Wars between them to get me the right to have that opinion, so I'll be damned if I'm changing it because somebody else doesn't like it.

So did mine, and my family are fighting in the 'war' in iraq right now. So whats your point? Ive got the right to an opinion just as much as you have, and Im voicing that opinion now.

As stated before, back up your opinion with a balanced, reasonable argument, instead of 'firefox users are all crackhead fanboys' or whatever it was you came up with originally, and youll **** off a lot less people, and maybe even gain some resepct for your opinions in the process. But until you can enter a debate without resorting to personal insults, and dummy spitting, thats not going to happen.

Personal opinion: Opera > Firefox > IE

Is it sad that I'm excited about Opera coming out on DS? :)

Oh and Rich, just because someone else has a different opinion than you and prefers Firefox does not make them a "fanboy on crack". There are plenty of legitimate reasons to use it. IE7 is getting pretty good though.

Hope everyone has updated their Firefox after the latest security issues!

I use neither............. as I use Avant browser

Avant's rendering engine, is actually Internet Explorer. Avant is built on top of the IE engine, removing it from direct competition with M$.

I've noticed that Firefox definately brings web pages up faster & life seems easier with it for me.
If you need to do an online antivirus, spy & malware scan, some of the popular ones don't seem to work with Firefox, so IE is good to have as well.
Rom

Mod Note: Threads merged. Please remember to search before posting a new topic. Thanks.

I recently changed from FireFox to K-Meleon on the recommendation of Savannah2.
It's even faster :)

K-Meleon is an extremely fast, customizable, lightweight web browser for the win32 (Windows) platform based on the Gecko layout engine (the rendering engine of Mozilla). K-Meleon is free, open source software released under the GNU General Public License.
http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/

ive tried firefox twice now! i just cant stand it, even though everone loves it.
i just wish IE had some of the extra addons that firefox does, like adsense earnings counter etc.
i like the look of it, but its nothing to take me away from IE.

Right I am going to take a look at this K-Meleon now.
See you on the other side... :)

Right I am going to take a look at this K-Meleon now.
See you on the other side... :)

It sounds like something from Dr Who, I am bored, and might as well go see what all the fuss is about :thumbsup:

Wooo Hooo! I am liking.

Savannah, Draggles - how can I import my bookmarks? Can't seem to work it out.

'Layers'

:)

K-Meleon will embed your IE Favorites automatically when you activate the IE Favorites plugin.
Also load the the K-Meleon loader into startup.....very fast startup :thumbsup:

Firefox is simply great whose prime feature has been security. It does not let any unwanted pop-up emerge while browsing and can play any multimedia content just like IE. Thanx Mozilla!

K-Meleon will embed your IE Favorites automatically when you activate the IE Favorites plugin.
Also load the the K-Meleon loader into startup.....very fast startup :thumbsup:

I don't have any favourites in IE as I only ever use FF... :(
I guess I can import my bookmarks into IE then import them into KM.
Will have a butchers tomorrow.

I've sorted it, and found where to change it to my default browser :)

Also load the the K-Meleon loader into startup.....very fast startup :thumbsup:

Don't seem to able to find how to do this.

Yet another reason to switch to Firefox (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/09/18/ie_flaw_warnings_grow/) (critical flaws in Internet Explorer - nothing new there then).


A simpler solution, at least until Microsoft releases a patch, might be to use Firefox, Opera or all any other alternative browser.

I've been trying IE 7 . Can't say i'm impressed with it . It's just a poor attempt to copy firefox . So it's still firefox FtW :)

i use fire fox and sometimes the one i got off bt i used to use IE but i cant be botherd with it anymore

I recently changed from FireFox to K-Meleon on the recommendation of Savannah2.
It's even faster :)


http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/

Which still uses the same rendering engine as Fire Fox ;)

plus, with it being open source, its even more open to Flaws and attacks than IE, since people can download the code, and check through it for flaws and bugs, and then exploit them...

Which still uses the same rendering engine as Fire Fox ;)

plus, with it being open source, its even more open to Flaws and attacks than IE, since people can download the code, and check through it for flaws and bugs, and then exploit them...

Yes it still uses the same rendering engine has Firefox, just not the bloat.
Firefox is open source too.

I use IE but not because I'm scared. It works, it's free, it's there already, the whole web is designed for it....

Why not use it?

B

The thing with browers a super amazing one will come out like Fire Fox then a few months or even weeks some else say Microsoft will make improvements and realize an even better brower... in the last 12 months it been:

Fire Fox out did IE but then IE out done Fire Fox and now Opera as out done them both...

The so called 'Best Brower' is forever changing within the above big three and is prob best to stick with personal taste rather then media hype

I use IE but not because I'm scared. It works, it's free, it's there already, the whole web is designed for it....

Why not use it?

B

Because there are better browsers that are also free ;) Just dump it (http://www.benefit-from-it.com/index.php?fa=securityTips.dumpIE), infact I have removed it from XP.:thumbsup:

I am still enjoying my K-Meleon! :)

Firefox is simply great whose prime feature has been security. It does not let any unwanted pop-up emerge while browsing and can play any multimedia content just like IE. Thanx Mozilla!Actually a short while ago Firefox was the least secure browser. Opera as usual was the most secure. That's one feature that FF has been unable to nick from Opera.

Opera as usual doesn't get mentioned much even though it is light years ahead of the other browsers. Opera is to FF/IE as XP is to win 3.1 or OSX is to OS7.x.
FF's 'nifty' reatures are usually a poor copy of something Opera has had for years.
Some reasons why Opera is superior.
Zooming web pages. Tiny text on a high res, big monitor, just zoom in and the entire page gets bigger without the layout breaking like in it does in FF or IE. Easier to do as well.
Very, very customisable. If you don't want it get rid of it or put it somewhere else. Bookmarks/Panels can go on left or right or off.
Everything is built in. No need to search thru loads of crappy extensions to find odd one that is actually useful. FF is aimed at geeks who use Linux..:P
Undos. Close a tab by mistake. Cntrl+ Z brings it back and the one b4 that and the one b4.....
Mouse gestures. I notice Apple have copied that too for some of it's video editing software.
Save to note.
Easy to manage bookmarks.
Panels
Waaay more secure than all the other browsers. There's a site which lists all browsers' current security issues, but cannot remember it offhand.
Fit to window.
Search in Page.
The real killer feature is - I'm working on computer and decide to call it a day and I have 20 tabs open in Opera. I close it down and turn computer off. Next day I fire Opera up and all my tabs are there and all the pages I visited b4 hand. And if you are concered about privacy/security you can disable/customise this feature, but after using this one single feature any other browser is infuriating to use. Even if you have a power cut and computder dies, you don't lose the pages you had open in Opera. This means all the pages I frequently use i simply leave open constantly. I just counted how many tabs I currentlyhave open and it's 61! That was a shock, been doing some research and may need to do some cleaning out, but its so quick and easy to get around you didn't realise how many there are. 60+ pages uses a bit more memory than a more sensible no, but still only a fraction of what Photoshop uses so no big deal.
True full screen view and with the handy keyboard shortcuts or mouse gestures you don't even need the navigation toolbars. Z for backwards and X for forwards is soooo much easier/faster than using a clunky mouse.
Much better printing [and preview] of webpages.

My only criticism is that nowadays the default Opera view comes without much of the useful interface on show. Probably so as not to scare off IE/FF users. But a quick delve into Appearence [Shift+F12] and you can add or remove what ever you want to see/hide, changing the look/skin is incredibly easy too.
You also have to tell it to pretend to be IE for those sites designed by cretins. It'll usually work fine anyway, but this is why it doesn't appear to be as widely used as it is. About the only thing I've found that is an issue is the BBC's real Player interface. And apart from testing websites that's the only time I ever use IE.

I started using Firefox about a year to 18 months ago and I love it! The extensions (especially the web developer's toolbar) are brilliant!

However, after Firefox decided to act up on my machine at home, I started using Opera and it too is fantastic.

I use Firefox at work for developing and Opera at home for surfing. I never use Internet Explorer.

I use many browsers, but find myself using IE when clicking the new mail link in MSN messenger, can't seem to avoid this even when my default is set otherwise.

Re FIREFOX memory leak, if you run a memory optimizer in the system tray it usually deals with this problem fairly well. Not all of them do but the one I use seems to clean up the excess memory usage...

I have 1GB of RAM and dont find this a problem though....in fact even with 10 tabbed windows open in FF, there is no problem with speed at all on my machine. It rates 10/10 for me now....

OPERA, used to be dedicated user but its lack of support for rich txt editing is very annoying, especially if you use Ebay and want to edit auctions, you cannot do this except in raw html mode...same with rich text email on a webmail system, no support to edit rich text...I binned OPERA purely for that reason, but lets hope they address that problem.....

IE6....again used to use by default but now just annoying me, as it do has issues with rich text editing with Ebay, it supports it, but can also have some real annoying little glitches particularly when working with a webmail system like Fastmail in rich text mode......

VIVA LA FIREFOX

Just taking a step back from the "which browser is best" argument for now I would like to mention some points which seem to have been overlooked.

Starting from the premise that the Web is becoming the new desktop, what with applications like google mail, flickr, hell, even this forum, it seems reasonable to expect browsers to improve over time and become more suited to modern needs.

We've already come a long way from the early days, and with technologies like AJAX we are pushing farther forward. However there are still a lot of web standards that have a specification, deserve to be implemented and could enhance the web for all.

For instance. Scalable Vector Graphics is a xml based image format, perfect for embedding straight into html, saving time space and probably adding a lot to a page. Except IE doesn't support SVG, and IE7 wont, so it's relegated to other applications, even though it was designed for the web.

IE6 was released in August 2001, over 5 years ago, and version 7 is due out shortly. IE6 effectively won the browser wars between them and netscape back in 2001, and whilst IE had market dominance the only new features I can think of are security related. With Firefox now at 27.3% ( as per http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp ) the browser war is building up again, hence the forthcoming IE7.

In short IE is lacking, it is behind the modern standards, and it is likely to stay that way. I remember being shocked that IE6 didn't support the alpha channel of PNG images, also MS would not like Office to possibly work on the web, because someone will make it, efforts are already underway. With standards such as XForms in the offing then the dream of Browser as Platform is getting closer to reality, but who will support the XForms standards, or CSS3, or SVG? Well, not MS for IE7.

Does this matter?

If a web designer makes a web site they have to pay attention to who uses which browser and check the experience in those browsers the designer is bothered about. Standards are there to make this easy, but let's face facts, if you follow standards that aren't supported and the resulting web site doesn't work for 70% of users then you don't deserved to get paid.

So there is a limiting factor placed on web sites by the least capable popular browser, currently IE. That's right, I'm talking about the lowest common denominator problem.

If I only had to make websites which worked in Opera and Firefox my customers would be seeing results much more pleasing (and probably cheaper) than what they do at the moment, and that 5 years MS spent doing nothing wouldn't have mattered.

We would be 5 years ahead of where we are now.

So, dear reader, when you choose your browser, if you do, think on this.

If you want websites that look better and do more, don't use IE, use something else, for me? Ah, go on!

http://www.mozilla.com/
http://www.opera.com/

Opera is to FF/IE as XP is to win 3.1

Ah.

Bloated to ^%&%:hihi:

Ah.

Bloated to ^%&%:hihi:Ah but it isn't.
Opera is smaller to download than the other browsers, very efficient and feature rich. And unlike OSs you simply use what functions you need.
So it is actualy anything but bloated. It's been around for a long time and gains more [useful] features and is smaller than it used to be.
Another way Opera is in contrast to the usual way of doing things.

So it is actualy anything but bloated. It's been around for a long time and gains more [useful] features and is smaller than it used to be.

The fact that Opera includes an email client makes it bloated (IMO):).

The fact that Opera includes an email client makes it bloated (IMO):).
It's not there if you don't want it to be and even with it, it's still more svelte than the opposition.
Firefox and Thunderbird, or IE and Outlook take up even more room and seeing as you need an email app anyway, if you choose to use Opera's then you reduce bloatware.
Have you even used Opera and it's features.

downloaded the fox this afternoon....very impressed :)

Firefox and Thunderbird, or IE and Outlook take up even more room and seeing as you need an email app anyway, if you choose to use Opera's then you reduce bloatware.

I like a browser to be a browser. Nothing more, nothing less:).


Have you even used Opera and it's features.

Yep.

Been using it since v7.something or other (when it was paid for product - complete with ads in the free version - and to think, I paid to remove the ads - then it becomes free:rolleyes:).

Still gets a little use for cross browser compatibility checks (along with IE 4, 5 & 5.5 and Konqueror):thumbsup:.


I just don't personally think it's all that good. Nor do I particularly like it:).

I like a browser to be a browser. Nothing more, nothing less:)..I use it a Browser. Nothing more nothing less. So why fuss?
Most people only use a fraction of any programmes capabilities it's little churlish to complain about facilities that other people find very useful.
Most people only use 20% of many programmes features, but everyone uses a slightly different 20%. Most people also have no idea how to use many programmes even ones they use daily, as so many features are not obvious until shown. Even on the most user friendly programmes.
Many of the features in Opera that I use all the time, do not even exist in the other browsers, so they are not even worth considering as browsers.
I find IE and FF slow, difficult and crippled in functionality and hence rather infuriating to use.

I just don't personally think it's all that good. Nor do I particularly like it. Out of curiosity, did you know about all the features I mentioned above that Opera does. Have you tried them.
Heck, I've been using Photoshop for 12 years, I still find new things all the time. They keep sneaking stuff in!

I run both I.E and Firefox. I am an Internet moron. I prefer Firefox, to be honest. It's faster, without a doubt, compared with IE.

From an "internet dunce". :)

I find IE and FF slow, difficult and crippled in functionality and hence rather infuriating to use.

In your opinion;).


Out of curiosity, did you know about all the features I mentioned above that Opera does. Have you tried them.
Heck, I've been using Photoshop for 12 years, I still find new things all the time. They keep sneaking stuff in!


I knew of most of them.

No, I haven't tried them, and I won't be either (as I said, I only use it for checking my sites function the same in the majority of browsers).

All can be replicated by extensions for FF (should I feel the need - which I don't for the most part).

In your opinion;).
It's not an opinion if I say FF + IE lack features compared to Opera, when they in fact they do and extensions do not make up for all of the differences.

No, I haven't tried them, and I won't be either Well, that's informative. Nice to see you are so open minded!
I always find it's better to give an opinion on something I actually have experience of and not something I've have already decided is of no use.

Thank god you don't design software, we'd probably still be using command lines. 'We don't need any of that GUI nonsense, there's nothing wrong with green text anyway, it works for me!':P

I use firefox for all of my browsing. Its interface grabbed me straight away, aswell as closing all those security holes microsoft left open.
I like to keep all my activex controlls under wraps aswell, which firefox does perfectly.

I'm so going to get flamed for this but never mind...

I use IE6 (& 7 on my dev machine) and I like it.

In support, I have both Firefox & Opera installed on my dev machine (I build web apps in my spare time), and I only use them to test pages. For various reasons, including speed, looks & features, I prefer IE.

Also saying that, in 9 years of using PCs (8 of them with internet access), I am yet to get a spyware / virus infection on any of my machines.

For 70% of people (using the person above's stats), IE does what they want and they're happy, myself included.

Do any other browsers other than Firefox and SeaMonkey have anything like ******* (http://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/1865/)? It's the single most useful thing after the web developer toolbar (https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/60/). Firefox is still winning in this house.

The extension for mouse gestures, which I used to use a lot in opera, is not very good, but I think the other extensions more than make up for it.

Also I think it is fair to say that the Opera Mail Client is idiosyncratic at best.

dosxuk, if you develop web sites, you will find the link in Phanerothyme's post really useful.

Another security hole found in IE: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/5365296.stm

It's not an opinion if I say FF + IE lack features compared to Opera

Yes it is:P.

You think Opera has features that FF lacks. Whereas (as a browser) FF lacks nothing. Anything else is merely prettification:thumbsup:.


Well, that's informative. Nice to see you are so open minded!

As I said... I only use it (Opera) to test my work is displayed in the majority of browsers.


Thank god you don't design software

I do (on occasion) and have been doing so since 1987:thumbsup:.

I'll just interrupt the my 'browser's better than your browser' debate to ask if anyone's tried Torpark yet??

http://torpark.nfshost.com/


.

dosxuk, if you develop web sites, you will find the link in Phanerothyme's post really useful.
Yup, I use the IE version of the toolbar quite a bit

Yup, I use the IE version of the toolbar quite a bit
IE has a web developers toolbar? Linky linky please (could be handy)

Something that would enable you to edit the css live in browser like the WDT, would make all those dumb IE6 fixes a whole lot easier to do.

Web Developers Toolbar (in beta but I've not had any problems - it's supposed to be released properly when IE7 is released): http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=e59c3964-672d-4511-bb3e-2d5e1db91038&displaylang=en

I also use the IE Web Developer Accessories, which are very helpful for seeing code created by Javascript. Select a block of text, right click, View Partial Source to see the DOM tree of that code. Says it's for IE5 only, but I've not had any problems with it on IE6/7

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/ie6/previous/webaccess/webdevaccess.mspx

Yes it is:P.
You think Opera has features that FF lacks. Whereas (as a browser) FF lacks nothing. Anything else is merely prettification:thumbsup:.
You are being disingenuous. If Opera as a feature that FF doesn't it is not an opinion, it is a fact. Whether it is useful is an opinion. They are two different things. And as you don't even bother to try out the features how do you know it's useful or not? The features in Opera I rate aren't prettification as you put it. They save me time, a lot of time. Using FF or IE is like wading thru treacle after doing the 100m sprint. And I do know how to use them.
Do you use Win 3.1 or Mac OS6 as according to your logic, XP or OSX are nothing more than prettification either.

If a browser is simply something to look at web pages all browsers lack nothing. Do you drive the cheapest most utilitarian car that is available, as that will get you to work and back or the kids to school. And cars differ far, far less in practical functionality than software does.

I'd really hate to use software you work on, if you have the apply the same close minded logic. Though do you design the interface or specify features or do you hack code. Why not give us some examples of any interfaces you have designed.

I am yet to get a spyware / virus infection on any of my machines. - That a dangerious thing to say because a virus does not always show itself on the system.

For example, dialer - if you have a dialer virus on your computer and a narrow band internet connection your computer could be phoneing expensive lines without your knowleged - it happen to myself and a parent that I know.

You may have a virus that -lets other people read your computer and get your credit card details and stuff.

The above two are examples of viruses that you can get without any knowledge.

You serious?? I can get them with absolutely no idea?? :hihi: :hihi:

1) Dialer app... a) I use broadband - none of my computers have a modem so no possibility of them dialing. b) When you get the phone bill you normally get quite a good idea thats somethings amiss c) If people are using dial up - disconnect the modem when you are not using it. It protects against most of this type of dialler, and protects the modem from lighting strikes / power surges.

2) Keylogger... a) FIREWALL b) Logging c) Randomly checking what connections my machine is making & what data is being sent (normally as part of my work - I'm a software engineer and do a lot of work on network communications) d) Playing with the Windows API as much as I do, I know a lot of the backdoors, and how to close them / monitor them for abuse.

With sensible precautions 90% of malware can be avoided. With more precautions and lots of knowledge 99.99% of malware can be avoided. The 0.01% that can get though will be pretty obvious when it does. Honey traps are cool :D I also acknowledge I'm not an average user and that other less geeky knowledgable people will have more difficulty in avoiding malware than I do.

You serious?? I can get them with absolutely no idea?? :hihi: :hihi:

1) Dialer app... a) I use broadband - none of my computers have a modem so no possibility of them dialing. b) When you get the phone bill you normally get quite a good idea thats somethings amiss c) If people are using dial up - disconnect the modem when you are not using it. It protects against most of this type of dialler, and protects the modem from lighting strikes / power surges.

2) Keylogger... a) FIREWALL b) Logging c) Randomly checking what connections my machine is making & what data is being sent (normally as part of my work - I'm a software engineer and do a lot of work on network communications) d) Playing with the Windows API as much as I do, I know a lot of the backdoors, and how to close them / monitor them for abuse.

With sensible precautions 90% of malware can be avoided. With more precautions and lots of knowledge 99.99% of malware can be avoided. The 0.01% that can get though will be pretty obvious when it does. Honey traps are cool :D I also acknowledge I'm not an average user and that other less geeky knowledgable people will have more difficulty in avoiding malware than I do.


So you are using protection....

I do not wish to get personal but you should have said that your taking action instead of simply saying that I do not use an anti verious

Toby

I use IE but not because I'm scared. It works, it's free, it's there already, the whole web is designed for it....

Why not use it?

B

When was the last time you did a full system scan?
If you've been using Internet Explorer for any length of time it is highly likely that your computer has picked up quite a bit of Spyware that you are not aware of.
If you use Firefox or my personal favourite Opera you won't pick up nearly as much spyware as IE.

Opera's integrated e-mail is great as it saves you needing to open up Thunderbird or Outlook express. This means you can be alerted via a chosen sound file when you have incoming e-mail whenever you have Opera open... I've used it for 2 years and it works a treat!
Opera all the way for security and speed, I occasionally use Firefox as a secondary browser
but Opera is much the slicker of the two.

firefox every time

Dont forget that your a lest risk if you don't use a Windows GUI i.e Linux :) as most computer viruses are aimed for Windows...

i use the internet explorer 7 and its far better as its integrated so for exaple i can type an address into my computer and it will open a window instead of needing to click the little icon everytime i use it and also FF is just IE with a different front end with all the security problems of IE6 and more!

I just downloaded a KDE file manager and browser application it like a combined application is really good... I know it only my view but I think it one of the best that I have used.

The application is called Konqueror... if I could only send you a screen shot.

It is the best 'mistake' that i have made in a long time :)

What version of IE are we referring to?

Anyway, you can configure IE in the "advanced" tab.

Plus for those that have a legit XP, IE7 is actually rather tight on security.

You should put IE7 in the poll choice as personally i see IE7 seperate from IE6: its just much better.

Though FF is a great browser, aye. However iv noticed a few problems with it. If ur viewing a site and has a mix of code-language like CSS and HTML the format isn't always totally accurate, though this wouldnt bug the average user -just me, im sort of a perfectionist.

In response to that issue i had with FF i went and downloaded Avant's broswer. It uses the IE core, but has relatively more security. Though i dont use Avant anymore due to my recent installation of IE7. It was in use for preference over IE6.

So you are using protection....

I do not wish to get personal but you should have said that your taking action instead of simply saying that I do not use an anti verious

Toby

I actually said
Also saying that, in 9 years of using PCs (8 of them with internet access), I am yet to get a spyware / virus infection on any of my machines.


I don't use an anti verious, or even any anti virus software. I do run checks every 6 months or so to be sure, but I don't have any scanning software running contiuously. I'm not quite sure how you managed to infer from my post that I do not take any precautions against malware. If this was the case and I did take no precautions, I would not be in a position to state what I did. Most of the precautions I take can be followed by anyone and will protect them from the most common forms of malware.

dosxuk,

Dont be a donut, by time you get the phone bill it too late. I was using dialup as an example... I did not say you had dial up

FF is just IE with a different front end with all the security problems of IE6 and more!

No it's not.

FF uses the Mozilla rendering engine for displaying web documents, which is completely different to the IE core.

Crazy Browser for me, it is tabbed and you can use IE Spell with a right click.

Crazy Browser for me, it is tabbed and you can use IE Spell with a right click.


Of all the add on browsers for IE, I personaly like GreenBrowser (http://www.morequick.com/indexen.htm)

Of all the add on browsers for IE, I personaly like GreenBrowser (http://www.morequick.com/indexen.htm)
Thanks for the tip. I downloaded GreenBrowser, it is nice and fast and I like it but I miss the spell checker?

Hang on, spell checker works when I click the right button. Hooray.

Though FF is a great browser, aye. However iv noticed a few problems with it. If ur viewing a site and has a mix of code-language like CSS and HTML the format isn't always totally accurate, though this wouldnt bug the average user -just me, im sort of a perfectionist.

I think you'll find that it's IE that displays the code wrong. Firefox, Opera and Netscape render code correctly as defined by the W3C guidelines. IE (as ANY web developer will tell you), is wrong.

Actually, most of the differences are caused by different interpretations of the guidelines rather than a disregard for them. Yes, IE has got several things wrong, especially in the earlier versions. I still prefer to design for IE as some of the extensions are very very useful, then downgrade it to FF/Opera. I just wish IE hurry up and support min/max-height!

some of the extensions are very very useful

Though not standards compliant.

Which is why I work from the opposite end of the scale (design for the mozilla engine, then fix for IE - if required):thumbsup:.

Most of the extensions are standards compliant though. Look at AJAX (specifically the xmlhttprequest object). The original ActiveX implentation meets with all current standards. Now FF supports it differently, in another standards compliant method.

Though not standards compliant.

Which is why I work from the opposite end of the scale (design for the mozilla engine, then fix for IE - if required):thumbsup:.

Best way to work. No point writing code for a non-standards compliant browser :)

Just use a Strict doctype and go from there.

I prefer to design for my audience. I have a web application which is used by about 30 people. Of these, 2 of them don't use IE. One uses konquerer and the other firefox. The rest all use versions of IE. Therefore, the app is designed around IE's feature set, and a warning is produced if anyone tries to log in with a different browser [it doesn't stop them though - I've successfully logged in with my nokia phone] stating that the browser they are using is not supported by the application.

98% of the code passes the W3C validation parsers, from memory most of the errors are caused by the use of align="absmiddle". From testing with firefox, I have removed all of the functional errors, but I am not going to spend a week sorting minor display errors out for 8% of my users. At the end of the day, for FF users it doesn't look quite as nice, but it still works.

Strict doctypes don't help all that much either, as the main issues between the current versions of IE and FF are through different interpretations of the specs, with both browsers being compliant but creating a different output.

On the other hand, for publicly facing websites, I pay more attention to Firefox, and will try and fix all display issues, but with IE the by far most likely browser to visit, I don't really care which browser is wrong or not. Until the IE market share goes below 50%, I will definately continue to design for IE, then fix for FF. Who are we designing for? The people who visit the websites, or the browser manufacturers?

Google Chrome!

I've used Internet Explorer for years with NO problems, I have tried other browsers such as Firefox, and always have come back to IE.

Firefox and Google V IE and Bing

No contest - Firefox!

I second rich951 The stats on browsers in SF would be very intresting.

I've used Internet Explorer for years with NO problems, I have tried other browsers such as Firefox, and always have come back to IE.
Me too.....

I've used Internet Explorer for years with NO problems, I have tried other browsers such as Firefox, and always have come back to IE.

Why does this not surprise me :hihi:

It's back to horses for courses - if you are happy with your browser then stick with it - if not, get something better. or like the famous supermarket advert says:

"Try something new today!" - just found this - will have to rewrite my comment on Opera (but I don't use it for social networking!):

http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/which-browser-most-secure

I have to say that IE9 causes problems with certain websites and I find myself constantly hitting the little 'broken page' link in the address bar to get IE to emulate IE8, so I can work on websites.

Very strange...