after our last visit to this pub....i would suggest every one avoid the place at all cost...................

..

as being all active members of Camra...and all of us working in respectable jobs.

beimg accused of pulling a picture of the wall and bending and breaking out of shape.....

even though none of our group were even near this so claimed picture near the time of damage....

being barred...from the pub without any chance to prove our unimpeachable record.....

this pub will no longer recieve our trade and i urge other real ale drinkers to head towards the FAT CAT, THE HARLIQUIN, BOTTOM WELLIE, RIVERSIDE.....and any other real ale pub around sheffield apart from the kelham Island tavern due to the complete pig headedness of he landlord.........

No, don't go to the "bottom wellie" ie Cask and Cutler, because that's my pub and I don't want to have to queue to get to the bar...go to the Barracks instead

i urge other real ale drinkers to head towards the FAT CAT

:lol: :gag:

Now I know this is a wind up.

Might I suggest that you go back during the day and have a chat with Lewis or Trevor. I'm sure if you explain what happened, then they will be more than reasonable.

This is one of my favourite pubs, and the landlord is one of the nicest people I've ever met.

Might I suggest that you go back during the day and have a chat with Lewis or Trevor. I'm sure if you explain what happened, then they will be more than reasonable.

This is one of my favourite pubs, and the landlord is one of the nicest people I've ever met.

spot on. trevor is a legend.

I was there as it happens. The chap involved was sober and tried explaining to the landlord that he didn't take the picture. He was calm and obviously upset at being accused. The landlord would hear nothing of it and just kept accusing him.
Trevor may be a legend, but he was completely in the wrong on this occasion.

after our last visit to this pub....i would suggest every one avoid the place at all cost...................

..

as being all active members of Camra...and all of us working in respectable jobs.

beimg accused of pulling a picture of the wall and bending and breaking out of shape.....

even though none of our group were even near this so claimed picture near the time of damage....

being barred...from the pub without any chance to prove our unimpeachable record.....

this pub will no longer recieve our trade and i urge other real ale drinkers to head towards the FAT CAT, THE HARLIQUIN, BOTTOM WELLIE, RIVERSIDE.....and any other real ale pub around sheffield apart from the kelham Island tavern due to the complete pig headedness of he landlord.........

Okay...

You were the only person in the toilet at the time the picture was smashed. That was evidence enough for us. I'm sure if you'd have been anywhere else you would have been asked to leave without being allowed to finish your drinks.

could the picture have been smashed before this gentleman went in?

Okay...

You were the only person in the toilet at the time the picture was smashed. That was evidence enough for us. I'm sure if you'd have been anywhere else you would have been asked to leave without being allowed to finish your drinks.

It would appear that you are replying as a gaffer / staff member and if this is the case, I'll will take heed of the original posters comments and avoid your place too.

If your willing to throw out and bar customers purley on what you believe and in the face of ignorance or aggression then fair enough.

I don't think I need to tell you that CAMRA members on the whole aren't generally distructive, irresponsable or irrational members of society.

However, you say "you were allowed to leave after finishing your drinks" like you were being reasonable and doing them a favour.

The person in question may have been a little peeved at being accused (and so would anyone in this situation) and was able to shelf this and wanted to continue the discussion in a rational manor.

By your own admission, you are willing to over-rule calm, rational and adult conversation with circumstantial evidence.

could the picture have been smashed before this gentleman went in?

indeed! how is knowing the picture was smashed after the chap left proof that he did it? :loopy: have they got cameras in there, or have a witness? :huh: think i might give the place a miss this weekend too, i dont want to run the risk of being accused of breaking anything :rolleyes:

Okay...

You were the only person in the toilet at the time the picture was smashed. That was evidence enough for us. I'm sure if you'd have been anywhere else you would have been asked to leave without being allowed to finish your drinks.

You did allow them to finish their drinks, but you DON'T know he broke the picture. It was quite disgraceful to be honest. I was talking to a couple of the chaps (not young lager louts, but respectable looking blokes), and a couple had travelled all the way from Darlington to sample the "best pub" in the country as they were avid real ale fans . They were quite frankly disgusted at your attitude, as was I.

indeed! how is knowing the picture was smashed after the chap left proof that he did it? :loopy: have they got cameras in there, or have a witness? :huh: think i might give the place a miss this weekend too, i dont want to run the risk of being accused of breaking anything :rolleyes:



I only go in there once a month at most, so they won't exactly be losing that much by losing mine and my friends custom. The attitude on that day to those chaps (mid afternoon by the way), and the attitude on here means that I'll give the other local real ale pubs my custom instead.
If you're going to accuse someone, at least have proof.

I only go in there once a month at most, so they won't exactly be losing that much by losing mine and my friends custom. The attitude on that day to those chaps (mid afternoon by the way), and the attitude on here means that I'll give the other local real ale pubs my custom instead.
If you're going to accuse someone, at least have proof.


we only drink there about once a month also, and im sure they can happily survive without my groups custom. But events like this (and the attitude that followed) have a way of putting people off a place, as individuals they might not miss us, but as a collective they will surely feel the damage of bad customer relations.

To be honest guys, i think the matter should just be let go, we know there was an incident and that the guy is no longer chairman at Camra (personally i think Dave is a good bloke, thats only my opinion for what its worth! Maybe he was caught on an off day?)

On a lighter and much happier note i'd like to wish Andy Cullen all the best as new chairman of the sheffield branch, i know that he posts on here very regularly and i'm sure that he'll do an excellent job, good luck Andy!

Well I will continue to drink there until I have my own reason not to.....

Well I will continue to drink there until I have my own reason not to.....

Exactly. I've been in there loads of times and never had a problem with the staff.

And yes, congrats Andy C! :thumbsup:

Yes many congratulations to Andy C. But just to clarify a few things regarding what happened.

1. The picture wasn't broken earlier in the day
2. There was only one person in the toilet at the time I heard the smash
3. On asking a customer it the smash had been in the front room or the kitchen I next checked the gents toilet
4. Another customer had entered the toilet and directed my attention to the broken glass.
5. The guy who had originally occupied the gents left and sat down with the group which we ejected.
6. I then had to screw the remaining bits of the frame off the wall (what was left of it had be pulled so far forward the frame had cracked and the glass smashed.

When the person in question was quizzed about what happened they first denied knowing anything about the incident, the said the picture 'fell off the wall' while he was in there (even the remaining frame had to be unscrewed from the wall).
On leaving one member of the group became very aggressive and started mouthing off to the staff behind the bar.

If someone entered your own home and without any premeditation started smashing up your possessions would you be very pleased. The group in question should be thankful they were asked to leave without the police being called.

The picture in question 'Forgotten Pubs of Sheffield' has provided many customers with a talking point over that past two years and it is a great shame to see it lost.

If that is the way certain people want to act after a few drinks all at the Kelham are quite glad to take their custom elsewhere

Thanks for the congratulations at me becoming Chairman of Sheffield & District CAMRA.

However I don't think this complaint really involves CAMRA and I wasn't at the pub at the time to witness it, I would suggest the most appropriate way of resolving it may be a private conversation between the people involved.

Yes many congratulations to Andy C. But just to clarify a few things regarding what happened.

1. The picture wasn't broken earlier in the day
2. There was only one person in the toilet at the time I heard the smash
3. On asking a customer it the smash had been in the front room or the kitchen I next checked the gents toilet
4. Another customer had entered the toilet and directed my attention to the broken glass.
5. The guy who had originally occupied the gents left and sat down with the group which we ejected.
6. I then had to screw the remaining bits of the frame off the wall (what was left of it had be pulled so far forward the frame had cracked and the glass smashed.

When the person in question was quizzed about what happened they first denied knowing anything about the incident, the said the picture 'fell off the wall' while he was in there (even the remaining frame had to be unscrewed from the wall).
On leaving one member of the group became very aggressive and started mouthing off to the staff behind the bar.

If someone entered your own home and without any premeditation started smashing up your possessions would you be very pleased. The group in question should be thankful they were asked to leave without the police being called.

The picture in question 'Forgotten Pubs of Sheffield' has provided many customers with a talking point over that past two years and it is a great shame to see it lost.

If that is the way certain people want to act after a few drinks all at the Kelham are quite glad to take their custom elsewhere


Different to how I remember it, but then again I was just observing, and not an interested party.

However when you say one of the group became abusive, I certainly remember the first person to raise his voice was a member of the barstaff, and the chap was only replying in kind. The chap who you say was abusive never swore, he was just trying to explain it wasn't a member of their group that had done it and they'd not be coming back.
You shouted after them that you'd be phoning other pubs so they wouldn't be let in. Disgraceful. And I know you followed out this threat as I was drinking in your local area last night and was talking to the barman of one of the pubs you phoned. They let them in as it happens, and said they were a decent group of blokes.

I could pick holes with half of what is written that I saw, which is why I do not believe the rest which I did not observe.
As a footnote, why did you not call the Police, as the chap actually mentioned that to you? Selective memory.

Seems like Mr Williams has caused a right storm!!

Purely out of interest (and also cos i'm a nosey git!), does anyone know if Lewis or Trevor were about when the "picturegate" incident took place?

I wouldn't be put off going by one small altercation to be honest, all the awards they've won over the last few years pretty much speak volumes for the hard work put in.

The picture in question 'Forgotten Pubs of Sheffield' has provided many customers with a talking point over that past two years and it is a great shame to see it lost.

This is a shame, I liked that picture. Maybe an opportunity to produce an up-to-date version with more sadly closed down boozers :mad:

sounds like a place I would like to go to to drink in. At least I know they don't tolerate drunken riff raff.

I'm not saying that the group were drunken OR riff raff at all..... but it is nice to know that IF there were DRR, they would get the boot and let the decent folk get about their drinking.

sounds like a place I would like to go to to drink in. At least I know they don't tolerate drunken riff raff.

I'm not saying that the group were drunken OR riff raff at all..... but it is nice to know that IF there were DRR, they would get the boot and let the decent folk get about their drinking.

But they tolerate me ;)