My son who is 3 and half years old, has been very strange the last 2 yrs or so at doing things. These include the following:

*A nightmare to potty/toilet train.
*Has no sensation when he has a wee or a poo (as every morning he is wet and he doesnt feel it).
*Just stairs at me when am talking to him as if he doesnt understand what i am saying.
*He does dress/undress himself but has to do it in an order, so shoes off (if he has any on) trousers off, pull - up off, clean nappy on, t-shirt off, trousers on, socks off, top on (this is when he gets changed for bed) If we ask him to take tshirt off before nappy he screams and crys saying no!
*can colour in but pencils need to be in colour order before he is happy to colour in.
*lose interest very quickly even with new toys.
*He throws a tantrum out of the blue, for no reason at all.
*He does need to go to speech therapy, so talking not that clever.
*For as an example, gets his cup, brings it to me and doesnt actually say what he wants, as if he has forgotten the word untill I say whats wrong.
*bangs/hits himself mainly on his head when he can't get the things done what he wants to get done
* he was slow at crawling and sitting that was 10mths old, and walking he was walking just last yr in april (22mths)

This is just some of the things that I have to put up with all day every day. Now I also have a 15mth daughter, who is totally different, shes into everything and nothing like what my son was at that age.
My mother in law has him for one night about once a mth and she works in a care home, she sees people with these sort of disabilitys everyday. She said to me on saturday that she thinks my son (toby) could have Autism, shes noticed it for about a year but didnt want to upset me by telling me what she thinks.
Now reading some info on Autism on the internet, I am now thinking that he does have Autism.

Is there any parent out there who has a child with this problem?

Like I say the things what are mentioned above is only some of the things he does.

Please help, as I will take him to the docs after xmas, or I might wait till he has a speech therapy appointment on 12th jan.

I have two children(nephews) in my family who have forms of autism. The first is 11 years old and the second is 3. Although I can't say whether your son has autism or not he does share a lot of behavoural traits that they do. What I will say is that it took them a long time for them to be diagnosed and a lot of stamping of feet for them to be seen by the relative people. As with a lot of things you will have to stand your ground at keep on at people to get appointments, but once you get seen and sorted there is a wealth of help and support.

I hope all goes well for you and you get the help and advice that you need.

I don't have children in the autistic spectrum but your son sounds like some of the children I have worked with over the 17 years I've worked in childcare.
Repetitive behaviours with patterns, orders or rules are often significant.
Hitting his head is another behaviour I'd note as quite possibly linked.

The rest of it could be normal variations on behaviour in children in the age range, but also possibly not as speech, facial expressions, eye contact and the need/requirement to communicate or the lack of all those could be another indicator.

It's a good thing to remember that the autistic spectrum is very broad. Most people who live with autism are male and most men show some autistic tendencies apparently. Some are living, breathing geniuses and some have a far more insular life, bordering on catatonic. The majority of people I know and individuals I have worked with who do have autism or autistic tendencies have been on the terrifyingly bright side - so it's not all doom and gloom I promise :)
There are even aspects which will only manifest as some social difficulty and even that can be ironed out with some sensible approaches to make more pleasant and easy.
See your doctor or HV or both as soon as you can. Language experts will not necessarily be able to help and it would be poor form to take their advice, if it were wrong, at this stage.
You might also like to know that there are groups in Sheffield, of parents whose children have any needs and some specifically for autism. You'll probably find a great deal of information, support and practical advice from those.
The only start I have for you there is Ray Of Hope, who cover all families who have children with any needs.
There are one or two forummers who may well be able to help you with greater inside knowledge too so keep an eye on the thread in case they post at some point.
I hope it all goes well.

Hi Staylor,

Sorry your having these worries, i think the best thing you can do for your son, is to seek a referal to Reygate, lots of things you have said about your lad could well point in the direction of Autism, but there are so many conditions that overlap.

IMO i would not wait until you see the speech threapist, as they arent always qualified enough to offer and opinion, go and see your GP with a list of your concerns.

Like Menz says seeking a referal can be a long drawn out process, but speaking from personal experiance, the sooner you are seen by the right type of professionals the better, lots of early interventions can really help young children on the spectrum and the sooner this help is recieved the better.

Hope this helps

What's he like around other people?

My son who is 3 and half years old, has been very strange the last 2 yrs or so at doing things. These include the following:

*A nightmare to potty/toilet train.
*Has no sensation when he has a wee or a poo (as every morning he is wet and he doesnt feel it).
*Just stairs at me when am talking to him as if he doesnt understand what i am saying.
*He does dress/undress himself but has to do it in an order, so shoes off (if he has any on) trousers off, pull - up off, clean nappy on, t-shirt off, trousers on, socks off, top on (this is when he gets changed for bed) If we ask him to take tshirt off before nappy he screams and crys saying no!
*can colour in but pencils need to be in colour order before he is happy to colour in.
*lose interest very quickly even with new toys.
*He throws a tantrum out of the blue, for no reason at all.
*He does need to go to speech therapy, so talking not that clever.
*For as an example, gets his cup, brings it to me and doesnt actually say what he wants, as if he has forgotten the word untill I say whats wrong.
*bangs/hits himself mainly on his head when he can't get the things done what he wants to get done
* he was slow at crawling and sitting that was 10mths old, and walking he was walking just last yr in april (22mths)

This is just some of the things that I have to put up with all day every day. Now I also have a 15mth daughter, who is totally different, shes into everything and nothing like what my son was at that age.
My mother in law has him for one night about once a mth and she works in a care home, she sees people with these sort of disabilitys everyday. She said to me on saturday that she thinks my son (toby) could have Autism, shes noticed it for about a year but didnt want to upset me by telling me what she thinks.
Now reading some info on Autism on the internet, I am now thinking that he does have Autism.

Is there any parent out there who has a child with this problem?

Like I say the things what are mentioned above is only some of the things he does.

Please help, as I will take him to the docs after xmas, or I might wait till he has a speech therapy appointment on 12th jan.

Please request a referal to Dr Sue Gentle at Ryegate childrens centre, they cann assess him and start a program to help your son gain confidence and self esteem, its good to have diagnosis before he starts school, its worth while looking into as its better to kbnow than not.

Hi
I agree that seeing your GP to request an assessment from a professional is the way to go. You may have a quite few hoops to jump through (or it may be a straight forward process) but it certainly sounds as though you have some legitimate concerns about your son's development. From reading various threads there seem to be quite a number of people on here who have children on the autistic spectrum (me included) so you won't be alone if your son does turn out to be on the autistic spectrum.
Good luck!

My son is 5 and very, very naughty. He screams, swears, throws things, hits his older brother, likes to play alone, pulls weird faces when you try to explain his bad behaviour to him then just rolls his eyes and stares blankly at the ceiling or something. Theres lots of other things but some are just normal "boy" reactions. I have a 7 year old and a 1 year old (all boys) that are totally different. My eldest is a typical boy but the middle 1 is just out of control, i have tried everything possible but nothing works, and school can't cope with him either. They have tried him with a support worker but no joy so when hes really bad he gets sent home. I have been asked on a number of occasions if he has autism or ADHD, I no some signs of autism n don't think he has that but not sure what ADHD is! I am ringing the health visitor tomorrow to see what she suggests.
If anyone has any suggestions i would appreciate them, thanks

hi i have adhd myself, as does my 5 year old and it all sounds very similar, you need to see either your gp or your health visitor, either way you need a refferal to ryegate childrens centre, or to the community paed who will assess him first and then refer him onto the correct panel for assessment - which will also be ryegate, I also have an older lad with autism who also does the things you describe, particularly the facial gurning when you are trying to talk to him about stuff, and the isolated play, i have attached what are classed as syptoms of both for info, but please get him refferred and asssessed, i also have aspergers syndrome - which is high functioning autism - and i say to everyone, please get them assessed, its a lonely life being on the outside when you don't know why...

ADHD is an ongoing behavior disorder typically diagnosed at age five or six, though the symptoms have usually been observed much earlier than this age. The three key symptoms are hyperactivity, impulsivity, and inattention. These symptoms typically interfere with the child's functioning in social and academic settings. The diagnostic criteria were outlined in 1994 in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Health (DSM-IV; American Psychiatric Association). To meet the diagnostic criteria, these symptoms, exemplified below, must have been present for at least six months.

ADHD symptom - inattention

The child:

often fails to give attention to details or makes careless mistakes in schoolwork, work, or other activities;
often has difficulty sustaining attention in tasks or play activities;
often does not seem to listen when spoken to directly;
often does not follow through on instructions and fails to finish schoolwork, chores, or duties (in adults, this includes duties in the workplace) - not due to oppositional behavior or failure to understand instructions;
often has difficulty organizing tasks and activities;
often avoids, dislikes, or is reluctant to engage in tasks that require sustained mental effort (such as schoolwork or homework);
often loses things necessary for tasks or activities (for example, toys, school assignments, pencils, books, or tools);
is often easily distracted by extraneous stimuli;
is often forgetful in daily activities.
ADHD symptom - hyperactivity

The child:

often fidgets with hands or feet or squirms in seat;
often leaves his or her seat in the classroom or in other situations in which remaining seated is expected;
often runs about or climbs excessively in situations in which it is inappropriate;
often has difficulty playing or engaging in leisure activities quietly;
often talks excessively.
ADHD symptom - impulsivity

The child:

often blurts out answers before the questions have been completed;
often experiences difficulty awaiting turn;
often interrupts or intrudes on others (for example, butts into conversations or games).
One can see why there is an age limitation on these behaviors being defined as "abnormal," as the majority of them are typical of much younger children. But in the non-ADHD child, these behaviors are typically outgrown. And, of course, there are a variety of other conditions in which these symptoms occur but are not ADHD.

my middle son can be very aggressive due to his frustration level, everything has to take a step back, routines have to be fixed, even when hes bellowing remain calm, we continually say, ds, that isnt appropriate behaviour , try it this way instead, lots of rewards and praise when he does get something right, lots of positive reinforcement.

The FWA also offer a parenting course for children with adhd.

The current Diagnosis and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-Fourth Edition, Treatment Revision (DSM-IV-TR) identifies three features that are associated with autism:

impairment in social interaction,
communication, and
behavior.
Impairment in social interaction

First, patients with autism fail to develop normal personal interactions in virtually every setting. This means that affected persons fail to form the normal social contacts that are such an important part of human development. This impairment may be so severe that it even affects the bonding between a mother and an infant. It is important to note that, contrary to popular belief, many, if not most, autistic persons are capable of showing affection and do demonstrate affection and do bond with their mothers or other caregivers. However, the ways in which autistic individuals demonstrate affection and bonding may differ greatly from the ways in which others do so. Their limited socialization may erroneously lead parents and pediatricians away from considering the diagnosis of autism. As the child develops, interaction with others continues to be abnormal. Affected behaviors can include eye contact, facial expressions, and body postures. There is usually an inability to develop normal peer and sibling relationships and the child often seems isolated. There may be little or no joy or interest in normal age-appropriate activities. Affected children or adults do not seek out peers for play or other social interactions. In severe cases, they may not even be aware of the presence of other individuals.

Communication

Communication is usually severely impaired in autistic persons. What the individual understands (receptive language) as well as what is actually spoken by the individual (expressive language) is significantly delayed or nonexistent. Deficits in language comprehension include the inability to understand simple directions, questions, or commands. There may be an absence of dramatic or pretend play and these children may not be able to engage in simple age-appropriate childhood games such as Simon Says or Hide-and-Go-Seek. Adults may continue to engage in playing with games that are for young children.

Autistic individuals who do speak may be unable to initiate or participate in a two-way conversation (reciprocal). Frequently the way in which an autistic person speaks is perceived as unusual. Their speech may seem to lack the normal emotion and sound flat or monotonous. The sentences are often very immature: "want water" instead of "I want some water please." Those with autism often repeat words or phrases that are spoken to them. For example, you might say "look at the airplane!" and the child or adult may respond "at airplane," without any knowledge of what was said. This repetition is known as echolalia. Memorization and recitation of songs, stories, commercials, or even entire scripts is not uncommon. While many feel this is a sign of intelligence, the autistic person usually does not appear to understand any of the content in his or her speech. For more, please read the Autism and Communication article.

Autistic persons often exhibit a variety of repetitive, abnormal behaviors. There may also be a hypersensitivity to sensory input through vision, hearing, or touch (tactile). As a result, there may be an extreme intolerance to loud noises or crowds, visual stimulation, or things that are felt. Birthday parties and other celebrations can be disastrous for some of these individuals. Tags on clothing may be perceived as painful. Sticky fingers, playing with modeling clay, eating birthday cake or other foods, or walking barefoot across the grass can be unbearable. On the other hand, there may be an underdeveloped (hyposensitivity) response to the same type of stimulation. This individual may use abnormal means to experience visual, auditory, or tactile (touch) input. This person may head bang, scratch until blood is drawn, scream instead of speaking in a normal tone, or bring everything into close visual range. He or she might also touch an object, image or other people thoroughly just to experience the sensory input.

Autistic children and adults are often tied to routine and many everyday tasks may be ritualistic. Something as simple as a bath may only be accomplished after the precise amount of water is in the tub, the temperature is exact, the same soap is in its assigned spot and even the same towel is in the same place. Any break in the routine can provoke a severe reaction in the individual and place a tremendous strain on the adult trying to work with them.

There may also be non-purposeful repetition of actions or behaviors. Persistent rocking, teeth grinding, hair or finger twirling, hand flapping and walking on tiptoe are not uncommon. Frequently, there is a preoccupation with a very limited interest or a specific plaything. A child or adult may continually play with only one type of toy. The child may line up all the dolls or cars and the adult line up their clothes or toiletries, for example, and repeatedly and systematically perform the same action on each one. Any attempt to disrupt the person may result in extreme reactions on the part of the autistic individual, including tantrums or direct physical attack. Objects that spin, open and close, or perform some other action can hold an extreme fascination. My son could sit for hours with an upside down car spinning the wheels.

The current Diagnosis and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders-Fourth Edition, Treatment Revision (DSM-IV-TR) identifies three features that are associated with autism:

impairment in social interaction,
communication, and
behavior.
Impairment in social interaction

First, patients with autism fail to develop normal personal interactions in virtually every setting. This means that affected persons fail to form the normal social contacts that are such an important part of human development. This impairment may be so severe that it even affects the bonding between a mother and an infant. It is important to note that, contrary to popular belief, many, if not most, autistic persons are capable of showing affection and do demonstrate affection and do bond with their mothers or other caregivers. However, the ways in which autistic individuals demonstrate affection and bonding may differ greatly from the ways in which others do so. Their limited socialization may erroneously lead parents and pediatricians away from considering the diagnosis of autism. As the child develops, interaction with others continues to be abnormal. Affected behaviors can include eye contact, facial expressions, and body postures. There is usually an inability to develop normal peer and sibling relationships and the child often seems isolated. There may be little or no joy or interest in normal age-appropriate activities. Affected children or adults do not seek out peers for play or other social interactions. In severe cases, they may not even be aware of the presence of other individuals.

Communication

Communication is usually severely impaired in autistic persons. What the individual understands (receptive language) as well as what is actually spoken by the individual (expressive language) is significantly delayed or nonexistent. Deficits in language comprehension include the inability to understand simple directions, questions, or commands. There may be an absence of dramatic or pretend play and these children may not be able to engage in simple age-appropriate childhood games such as Simon Says or Hide-and-Go-Seek. Adults may continue to engage in playing with games that are for young children.

Autistic individuals who do speak may be unable to initiate or participate in a two-way conversation (reciprocal). Frequently the way in which an autistic person speaks is perceived as unusual. Their speech may seem to lack the normal emotion and sound flat or monotonous. The sentences are often very immature: "want water" instead of "I want some water please." Those with autism often repeat words or phrases that are spoken to them. For example, you might say "look at the airplane!" and the child or adult may respond "at airplane," without any knowledge of what was said. This repetition is known as echolalia. Memorization and recitation of songs, stories, commercials, or even entire scripts is not uncommon. While many feel this is a sign of intelligence, the autistic person usually does not appear to understand any of the content in his or her speech. For more, please read the Autism and Communication article.

Autistic persons often exhibit a variety of repetitive, abnormal behaviors. There may also be a hypersensitivity to sensory input through vision, hearing, or touch (tactile). As a result, there may be an extreme intolerance to loud noises or crowds, visual stimulation, or things that are felt. Birthday parties and other celebrations can be disastrous for some of these individuals. Tags on clothing may be perceived as painful. Sticky fingers, playing with modeling clay, eating birthday cake or other foods, or walking barefoot across the grass can be unbearable. On the other hand, there may be an underdeveloped (hyposensitivity) response to the same type of stimulation. This individual may use abnormal means to experience visual, auditory, or tactile (touch) input. This person may head bang, scratch until blood is drawn, scream instead of speaking in a normal tone, or bring everything into close visual range. He or she might also touch an object, image or other people thoroughly just to experience the sensory input.

Autistic children and adults are often tied to routine and many everyday tasks may be ritualistic. Something as simple as a bath may only be accomplished after the precise amount of water is in the tub, the temperature is exact, the same soap is in its assigned spot and even the same towel is in the same place. Any break in the routine can provoke a severe reaction in the individual and place a tremendous strain on the adult trying to work with them.

There may also be non-purposeful repetition of actions or behaviors. Persistent rocking, teeth grinding, hair or finger twirling, hand flapping and walking on tiptoe are not uncommon. Frequently, there is a preoccupation with a very limited interest or a specific plaything. A child or adult may continually play with only one type of toy. The child may line up all the dolls or cars and the adult line up their clothes or toiletries, for example, and repeatedly and systematically perform the same action on each one. Any attempt to disrupt the person may result in extreme reactions on the part of the autistic individual, including tantrums or direct physical attack. Objects that spin, open and close, or perform some other action can hold an extreme fascination. If left alone, an autistic person may sit for hours turning off and on a light switch, twirling a spinning toy, or stacking nesting objects. Some individuals can also have an inappropriate bonding to specific objects and become hysterical without that piece of string, paper clip, or wad of paper.

get refered as eejay says try and get to ryegate hopefully to see Dr Sue Gentle but don't let it go as some doctors think parents are over reacting ! just insist on a referal.

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