On lambs that is! It's all spring lamb now, which surely means lambs that have only lived a few months. I want to eat animals that have at least had a summer jumping around in the fields, ie last year's lambs but they're not lamb anymore - (over a year old). What do I ask for at the butchers?

By European Meat Trade definition:

Lamb is from sheep 'less than 1 year old'.
Sheep meat from animals older than that is Mutton.

Previously people would have said mutton was from sheep over 2 years old but fashions change.

"Lamb" has sacrificed flavour for tenderness.
Mutton needs longer handling, preparation and cooking times but gives a much richer flavour with more depth than lamb.

Any 'good' butcher will be able to get you some mutton, but if you are struggling then look towards the Halal shops.

thanks cgk - but there must be a difference between a sheep that is just over a year old and one that's 6 or 7 say - that's what I'd really classify as mutton.

It is the curse of economics that limits the time a farmer is prepared to keep an animal feeding before slaughter.

Will the extra rearing costs be (more than) compensated by a higher-value product? Not usually the case here, I'm afraid.

The Organic producers are offering more mutton these days and are probably the source of the older meat of maybe up to 3 years old. But most of it will be around 2 year-old.

I guess that to get older meat you are going to have to look for a wool sheep and stick it in your boot!:D

Back to naming: a sheep between 1 and 2 years old (in its second spring) is known as a hogget.

Originally posted by silverfish
On lambs that is! It's all spring lamb now, which surely means lambs that have only lived a few months. I want to eat animals that have at least had a summer jumping around in the fields, ie last year's lambs but they're not lamb anymore - (over a year old). What do I ask for at the butchers?

do you eat chicken? i ask this as most chickens you buy in the shops are only around 10 weeks old when they are slaughtered and prepared. if you are wanting to know the lamb has had a time jumping around surely you would want the same for the chickens:suspect: :loopy: :hihi:

Originally posted by savbaby
do you eat chicken? i ask this as most chickens you buy in the shops are only around 10 weeks old when they are slaughtered and prepared. if you are wanting to know the lamb has had a time jumping around surely you would want the same for the chickens:suspect: :loopy: :hihi:

and free range at that

I do only buy free range/organic chicken, but with lamb I decided that wasn't so important as I know sheep in this country - especially the ones on the hills are just left to get on with being sheepish. I used to eat duck ont he same principle until I found out they were all kept indoors with no pond. No more duck for me!

What sort of reaction would I get if I went to a butchers and asked for hogget?

Why not try Quorn? ;) No sleepless nights then!

I shot a Quorn one...damn thing took three bearers to bring it back to The Towers. We hung it for a few weeks to mature the taste but it wasn't quite the same as lamb. ;)

I have to say that as I've got older I've toyed with the idea of becoming a vegetarian more and more. The problem is that I really, really enjoy the taste of mutton and pork, especially. I know this makes me a terrible person...

I try and get free range / organic meat nowadays but don't always. Perhaps I need to start making some major efforts to learn to love the taste of cauliflower instead.

Joe

Originally posted by Kristian
Why not try Quorn? ;) No sleepless nights then!

Quorn uses battery eggs though!

Originally posted by JoeP
The problem is that I really, really enjoy the taste of mutton and pork, especially.


But sadly it doesn't seem to taste anything like it used to. These days most supermarket meat, except whole chicken of course, appears to be butchered [ie cut up into joints] immediately after slaughter, and then either chilled or frozen. When I was a lad [ :rolleyes: ] we bought our meat from the Co-Op butchers and the carcases were mostly butchered on the premises after being properly hung in cool conditions for a few days.

It was fascinating to watch the butcher unhook half a pig from the rail and set about it with a very sharp knife, - wanting a particular joint could often involve a wait of ten minutes or more.

My mother was fussy about meat in that she insisted on home-killed because it hadn't been frozen, unlike the New Zealand lamb or Argentine beef. Her father had been a butcher and she always maintained freezing meat spoiled the taste and texture.

I don't eat processed stuff if I can avoid it. Thanks for the battery eggs reminder too, flyingfish.

I have been veggie in the past (and tend to vegan apart from my lamb habit). Surely humans who've evolved in these islands have also evolved to eat animals and vegetables, I just don't want to be harder on the animals than needed.

Originally posted by Greybeard


My mother was fussy about meat in that she insisted on home-killed because it hadn't been frozen, unlike the New Zealand lamb or Argentine beef. Her father had been a butcher and she always maintained freezing meat spoiled the taste and texture.

I'll second that! You can still get decent meat in the Castle market though.....better than the supermarket rubbish anyway.

How does knowing the 'meats' lifestyle before consumption change anything?

Your eating meat....it was once a living thing, surely wether it lived in lush fields and skipped merrily to its death...... or not, is just to ease the guilt?

I know this isn't a debate thread....I just find it interesting, the methods people use to make them feel better about it.

Do you therefore think that if the meat lived that bit longer, and had felt the damp lush grass beneath its hooves....it deserves to be eaten more than the 6 week old lamb? or just that 'at least it had a bit of a life...before I chewed'?

Again..I just find it interesting...

Originally posted by theflyingfish
Quorn uses battery eggs though!
Well, according to Mrs Draggletail, and she should know, :roll: they don't anymore...... can't give you a proper ref. though.....
Google it to check? :)

Originally posted by beansforyou
How does knowing the 'meats' lifestyle before consumption change anything?

Your eating meat....it was once a living thing, surely wether it lived in lush fields and skipped merrily to its death...... or not, is just to ease the guilt?

I know this isn't a debate thread....I just find it interesting, the methods people use to make them feel better about it.

Do you therefore think that if the meat lived that bit longer, and had felt the damp lush grass beneath its hooves....it deserves to be eaten more than the 6 week old lamb? or just that 'at least it had a bit of a life...before I chewed'?

Again..I just find it interesting...
I don't know - I think it is quite simple. It is the difference between contributing to an industry that perpetuates cruelty to animals (often with poor working conditions for the people in the industry) to one that isn't. For instance in buying battery hens does one want to perpetuate an industry where then hens have thier beaks chopped off to prevent them plucking out their own feathers in distress. And apart from anything else free range meat tastes better - if you are at all concerned about quality ingredients and food (most people in this country, sadly are not - they want cheap choice, regardless of the quality), then free range is better.

Similarly, people are concerned about where other goods they buy come from - like wouldn't want to buy goods that are produced by child or expolitative labour.

It is about considering the consequences of your actions and trying to be a responsbible consumer - not about assuaging guilt, I think.

If you were presented with two plates of meat, one which was produced by an animal in a tiny dark box and one which was produced in a field, do you honestly belive there is no moral choice to be made?

Originally posted by Draggletail
Well, according to Mrs Draggletail, and she should know, :roll: they don't anymore...... can't give you a proper ref. though.....
Google it to check? :)

Since early 2000 the Quorn™ deli and ingredients ranges have been approved by the Vegetarian Society since the albumin used as a binder in its manufacture has been changed in those ranges from a non free range to a free range egg source. However at present the ranges of ready meals, burgers, sausages etc still use eggs from a non free range source."

From: http://www.quorndon-mag.org.uk/archive/_recipies/

Also, using the Quorn website, you will find some products where its states "Suitable for vegetarians" and some that do not.

Originally posted by theflyingfish
If you were presented with two plates of meat, one which was produced by an animal in a tiny dark box and one which was produced in a field, do you honestly belive there is no moral choice to be made?

I can see the political & palatable reasons behind making more of a fuss about what you eat...it is the 'ooh I can't eat a baby lamb..I want to eat one thats had a bit of a life first' idea I can't grasp....once it's dead, it's dead, its not going to thank you for letting it live for a couple of months first.


I've gone through my vegetarian phase, as many people do, and hats off to those who keep to it. I used to know a guy who would almost end up crying if he was offered a cheese sandwich because it might have non-veggie cheese on....but mention that his pint has fish bones in it and he suddenly became deaf (as well as dumb :D )

Originally posted by cgksheff
Since early 2000 the Quorn™ deli and ingredients ranges have been approved by the Vegetarian Society since the albumin used as a binder in its manufacture has been changed in those ranges from a non free range to a free range egg source. However at present the ranges of ready meals, burgers, sausages etc still use eggs from a non free range source."

From: http://www.quorndon-mag.org.uk/archive/_recipies/

Also, using the Quorn website, you will find some products where its states "Suitable for vegetarians" and some that do not.

Thanks for bringing this to our attention CGK! I SHALL NOT be purchasing Quorn again! :rant: How dare they use battery eggs in a supposedly veggie product? :rant: :rant: :rant:

Its all lamb because they get to slaughter it earlier than mutton so they make money faster basically thats all. Animals are breed and slaughered the same now its modern farming. Its a shame cos the meat gets a nice flavour and texture over time.

u used to find that alot of indian curry was mutton based in fact a lot of eastern food is geared more to mutton & goat than lamb. it is mainly western pallattes that ask for a tenderer(is that a word) type of meat.
lots eat lamb so shy all the aggro over veal?