This time on West Street, on the corner opposite Creator where the book shop used to be.

Opened at lightening speed! Were being invaded, lol!

I noticed this on my way in today.....they're everywhere. I dont like it.

I'd have preferred it to stay as a bookshop. All of them on West Street (Blackwells, the second hand one, and now Applebaums) have closed within a fairly short space of time and been replaced by yet more cafes, bars and eateries (or in Blackwells case, by an empty shop again at the moment). West St. used to be interesting to walk down... now there's nothing much to go there for as far as I'm concerned.

The closure of bookshops is more to do with amazon.co.uk than Subway.

Don't inner city professionals read books then ?

At least its better than another takeaway- its good healthy food!! (says as he has just got back to work after devouring a foot long steak melt--mmmmmmmm)

Originally posted by scottf
At least its better than another takeaway- its good healthy food!! (says as he has just got back to work after devouring a foot long steak melt--mmmmmmmm) Since when is plastic healthy ?
Originally posted by boyface
I noticed this on my way in today.....they're everywhere. I dont like it. I don't either, either Subway or starbucks can go and kiss my you-know-what

Originally posted by scottf
At least its better than another takeaway- its good healthy food!! (says as he has just got back to work after devouring a foot long steak melt--mmmmmmmm)

If it's that healthy for you it should be a breeze for you to walk the 2 mins to the one on Devonshire Street, or 5 mins to the one in Orchard square, shouldn't it?

I think 2 in the city centre is 2 too many, nevermind more appearing.

I trust that the people who were so anti-Starbucks will muster their might against SubWay as well... ;)

I've eaten at a SubWay in Leeds and wasn't impressed. I think I'll be staying with my usual sandwich suppliers for a while yet.

It's a shame to see the bookshop go - I used to like having a browse 'cos you could occasionally find a few bargains there.

Joe

What is weird is that if you go into a Sub-Way in the US (or a Starbucks) the quality of both the food and the service is so much better than what you get in this country.

Originally posted by skyfitsboy
This time on West Street, on the corner opposite Creator where the book shop used to be.

Opened at lightening speed! Were being invaded, lol!

I was strolling along West Street yesterday evening, and suddenly this bright green and yellow Subway sign assaulted my eyes! :gag: Aarrgghh! Where did it suddenly come from? How did it materialise that fast?! :suspect:

It was an empty shop just the other day.....

I've nothing particularly against Subway, but I'd rather have the bookshop back.....

StarSparkle

Originally posted by Captain_Scarlet
Since when is plastic healthy ?
I don't either, either Subway or starbucks can go and kiss my you-know-what

I don't think you're supposed to eat the container it comes in!

Three Subways is hardly an invasion. Manchester has TEN in the city centre, one is just a two minute walk from the other!

But, they open until well after midnight and at weekends and I'd much rather have a sandwich than a burger or a greasy kebab.

Originally posted by Captain_Scarlet
Since when is plastic healthy ?


whats plastic about it? each ingredient is fresh and its all made to order on the premises?

Originally posted by scottf
whats plastic about it? each ingredient is fresh and its all made to order on the premises?

Their range of great sarsess (sauces) will be not so freshly made I'd imagine. I haven't actually tried a subway sandwich yet. But i can only imagine the amount of sugar/salt goes into them. Thats the american way. I'd much sooner have something of local origination from an independant sandwich shop.

Well the nice thing about the new Subway is that it is next door but one to the best coffee / sandwich shop in town... Café Moco!

Now you can pop into your local high quality independent trader with the funky interior in the full knowledge that you are enjoying ignoring the junk in subway just a couple of doors away.

Oh yes... Moco is cheaper too. :clap:

I had my first Subway experience on Saturday. Me and my co-diner ordered two sarnies, both the same, but one was soggy and the other unbearably dry. How do they manage it - that's a rare skill indeed!

It took a very long time for them to actually make our lunch too... it felt like we'd been there for days. I shall avoid it in future.

'Cos if you think about it, we don't make the sandwiches, you do!!

Originally posted by scottf
whats plastic about it? each ingredient is fresh and its all made to order on the premises? No that's a traditional sarny shop, like Supa Snax, Mr B's or whatever,

Subway put ckiddies plastic stuff in the sandwiches, that's why they taste like shhhh.
don't understand how they can sell a small sarnie for more than 2 quid, when all of the local long established sandwich shop which offer far superior sandwiches do so cheaply and in larger amount (especially Mr B's Chesterfield Rd with the Large breadcake larger than an average human hand).

End of the day, Subway serve shhh food and only fools go there

The opening of new Subways must stop !

Subway has just taken over where McDonalds is failing. Everybody wants to eat "healthy" nowadays, so along comes Subway with its "fresh" food and *kapow* a booming business. Mind you, I will admit to eating in there but made a decision not to again after seeing the "freshly baked bread" being unpacked out of boxes. Ooops.

tis also cannibalistic capitalism

they (being starbucks or subway or insert american owned multinational franchise here) buy up as many places in a small area as possible.
Its monopolising but more creative. because the franchises even compete with each other for trade. So we get the signs/ adverts drilled into our minds because we see them every 50metres, then have to choose which we prefer.

What happens is the best franchise will hold all the customers, the others will fold/flag, the company makes huge profits regardless, and brand association becomes second nature

efficient, evil capitalism

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu

efficient, evil capitalism

I don't quite know why really, but I was quite taken-aback yesterday evening at the speed with which Subway appeared on West Street. I think it was the ruthless efficiency I found rather off-putting.

StarSparkle

its quite worrying.

I was so proud of sheffield for being a starbucks/subway free city

then in the space of about a year we now have 2 starbucks and 3 subways in the centre.

:(

Subway, McDonalds, Burger King, Pizza Hut!! Why waste the air fare, I might just as well stay home. One thing though, your franchises don't have the quality of ours. Subway particularly serve excellent food at very reasonable prices. They are not dry or soggy and not smothered in salt or oil. How you have them is up to you. People who serve you in restaurants here treat you with respect and friendliness, and not like its a big favour.

each ingredient is fresh and its all made to order on the premises?


i used to work at subway and the food isnt very fresh - breads frozen and re cooked also contains lots of e numbers as are teh cookies muffin and do nuts the salad we were told to use untill it turned noticably brown

Originally posted by buck
Subway, McDonalds, Burger King, Pizza Hut!! Why waste the air fare, I might just as well stay home. One thing though, your franchises don't have the quality of ours. Subway particularly serve excellent food at very reasonable prices. They are not dry or soggy and not smothered in salt or oil. How you have them is up to you. People who serve you in restaurants here treat you with respect and friendliness, and not like its a big favour.


they still use morally corrupt marketing methods.

'When deep space exploration ramps up, it will be the corporations that name everything: the IBM stellar-sphere, the Microsoft galaxy, the planet Starbucks.'fight club

What are morally corrupt marketing methods? Is that,like, making money? Maybe we should all eat free tofu donated to us by a benificent government, and all live in the projects.No profit no loss no life. If you don't like what they sell you don't have to eat it. Its called freedom.

I like Subway and am personally glad we now have them in Sheffield. They make gorgeous sandwiches!

Originally posted by CathS
I like Subway and am personally glad we now have them in Sheffield. They make gorgeous sandwiches!

I couldnt agree more - best takeaway food i've had in ages

It's sort of like 'Invasion of the Body Snatchers' - a shop closes one evening in the presence of a spore from one of these places and then the following day is infected and wakes up as SubWay, etc. :)

I can happily handle one Starbucks, one SUbWay (if we have to). If you look at the methodology of the companies though it does appear to be almost Darwinian to it's own offspring - survival of the fittest franchise. The speed with which a retailing unit can have it's usage changed to become a fast foodery is breathtaking. I assume that it's also just as fast to close it down.

West Street seems to be becoming populated with food and drink places of varying sorts. Is this some sort of Council policy?

Joe

Originally posted by JoePritchard
West Street seems to be becoming populated with food and drink places of varying sorts. Is this some sort of Council policy?


I would think the council have hiked the rents up to the point that only high-turnover, low-quality, fast-food establisments can aford to be there, like Nondos.

I can't remember the last time I went for a pint on West Street, it has nothing that appeals to me anymore, London Road has become my favourite place for a night out.

Dear me folks - it's just a sandwich shop or a coffee shop for that matter. The opening of Subway on West Street has been dubbed "ruthlessly efficient", and call me the evil capitalist if you wish but I don't think that's such a bad thing. Ever heard of a little thing called 'Project Management'? Just because a lot of small business ventures take weeks to open their marketplace doesn't mean it's good business acumen.

Large multi-national chains are planned, built (or in this case refurbished) and opened for business with great speed. Why? Because its simply not profitable to have a building sitting empty and earning you no money. Those wanting to dabble their hand at a small business venture would benefit from taking note of this!

To those of you who "wish it had remained a bookshop": did you buy many books in there or did you, like all sensible people, choose to buy from Amazon or Waterstones if they offered the same book cheaper? Why pay more? Stop harking back to a small, one-off book store that never paid its way and ultimately went into receivership! Maybe it was the fact Amazon, Waterstones or Blackwells put them out of business but conversely it could have been a poor line of overpriced books. Remember the golden rule of business, "If you can't compete then you don't deserve to survive!"

Its a common misconception that one-off small businesses can't survive in this day and age. This is rubbish! It's the small businesses that can't compete that don't survive. A classic example (and one that's close to my heart) is Byrnes & Son in Clitheroe, Lancs. They have been selling wine for decades. Are they successful? Highly, because of their wide range of choice and close relationship with the viticulteurs. Have they felt the need to expand? No, they're happy ensuring a single marketplace runs efficiently. Do they have competition? Right next door, but they can hold their own.

Starbucks, Tescos, Subway, Walmart et al - now successful businesses started by budding entrepreneurs. Do you not see the irony in that they all started out life as small business ventures that ultimately were successful?
Take Tesco for example: six years ago they were a failing brand, a dieing brand. But they turned it around! They identified who their products would appeal to, what these people wanted and delivered it at a price that would suit. Call that "ruthlessly efficient"? I call that sound business practice.

Originally posted by JonJParr
Dear me folks - it's just a sandwich shop or a coffee shop for that matter. The opening of Subway on West Street has been dubbed "ruthlessly efficient", and call me the evil capitalist if you wish but I don't think that's such a bad thing. Ever heard of a little thing called 'Project Management'? Just because a lot of small business ventures take weeks to open their marketplace doesn't mean it's good business acumen.

Large multi-national chains are planned, built (or in this case refurbished) and opened for business with great speed. Why? Because its simply not profitable to have a building sitting empty and earning you no money. Those wanting to dabble their hand at a small business venture would benefit from taking note of this!

To those of you who "wish it had remained a bookshop": did you buy many books in there or did you, like all sensible people, choose to buy from Amazon or Waterstones if they offered the same book cheaper? Why pay more? Stop harking back to a small, one-off book store that never paid its way and ultimately went into receivership! Maybe it was the fact Amazon, Waterstones or Blackwells put them out of business but conversely it could have been a poor line of overpriced books. Remember the golden rule of business, "If you can't compete then you don't deserve to survive!".

Starbucks, Tescos, Subway, Walmart et al - now successful businesses started by budding entrepreneurs. Do you not see the irony in that they all started out life as small business ventures that ultimately were successful?
Take Tesco for example: six years ago they were a failing branding, a dieing brand. But they turned it around! They identified who their products would appeal to, what these people wanted and delivered it at a price that would suit. Call that "ruthlessly efficient"? I call that sound business practice.

This is all true so long as the businesses in question use ethical practices throughout. I can't believe that this is the case of these large multinational companies. They are the companies which can afford to operate sustainably, to offer their workers at all levels a fair deal, to source ethical supplies etc but they never will when they can avoid these to improve the bottom line. $$$ The pressure is on the government (or governments) to regulate these companies heavily. This survival of the fittest approach has a possible conclusion: survival of no one.

It would be naive to think that small businesses are any less exploitative of their workers than their large multinational counterparts. For example, Starbucks in 2003 were named in Fortune as one of 100 of the best companies to work for. Large doesn't necessarily mean diminished sense of social responsibility! Conversely small doesn't necessarily mean increased sense of social responsibility!

Originally posted by JonJParr
It would be naive to think that small businesses are any less exploitative of their workers than their large multinational counterparts. For example, Starbucks in 2003 were named in Fortune as one of 100 of the best companies to work for. Large doesn't necessarily mean diminished sense of social responsibility! Conversely small doesn't necessarily mean increased sense of social responsibility!

Indeed, which is why there needs to be more government regulation of all businesses. Why should any company bother using sustainable methods (getting your veg in a paper bag)when it is cheaper to use non sustainable ones (non biodegradable plastic bag) for example. It is on these issues there should be definite regulations imposed by the government.
Another example is trans fatty acids - a byproduct in the production of hydrogenated vegetable oils (marg). Trans fatty acids do not occur naturally. These have actually been clinically proven to cause heart disease but unbelievably they are still allowed in foods. They are only used because they are cheap. Thus these companies profit at the expense of our health.

Originally posted by JoePritchard


West Street seems to be becoming populated with food and drink places of varying sorts. Is this some sort of Council policy?

Joe

I don't think so, just look at the Starbucks that opened opposite the Winter Gardens, that didn't even wait for planning permission and nothing was done about it.....since then these kind of outlets have sprung up all over Sheffield


Originally posted by JonJParr
For example, Starbucks in 2003 were named in Fortune as one of 100 of the best companies to work for.

You can take this with a pinch of salt as well. Who actually voted them that?....and even if it were true...best company to work "for", doesn't equal best company to work next to/in the same town as/in competition with.

JonJParr - I don't have problems with the speed at which subway opened, I have issues with the type of business that these companies run.

As I've explained earlier cannibalistic marketing disregards even the owner of the particular franchise stores - and because the wages are pretty much standardised, it pushes the workers to do more than their moneysworth so that their shop keeps open.

I also have a problem with amazon.co.uk - it again uses unethical marketing methods. It has completely swamped the market, and buys books in huge amounts, so as discounts can be slapped on here and there.

Wonderful idea, maybe, but all it does is steadily reduces the choice that the consumer has.
the UK actually has laws etc. in place to stop the most aggresive of these marketing schemes, as we dont quite run a free market economy, but soon enough we will all be eating at SubWay, drinking at Starbucks, then shopping at Gap, buying some Nike shoes, going home and watching TV sponsored by Reebok, and finally sleeping in our comfortable Coca Cola themed bed.

Not because we want to, but because we will have no choice in the matter.

This doesnt sound like a "free" market to me.
*shrug*

*edit*
www.syps.me.uk/misc/star3.gif My contribution to the "starbucks empire"

Originally posted by JonJParr


To those of you who "wish it had remained a bookshop": did you buy many books in there or did you, like all sensible people, choose to buy from Amazon or Waterstones if they offered the same book cheaper? Why pay more? Stop harking back to a small, one-off book store that never paid its way and ultimately went into receivership! Maybe it was the fact Amazon, Waterstones or Blackwells put them out of business but conversely it could have been a poor line of overpriced books. Remember the golden rule of business, "If you can't compete then you don't deserve to survive!"



Well actually yes, I did buy lots of books in there. Secondly they were a remainder bookshop so the prices were reduced anyway, so they were probably cheaper than Amazon and certainly cheaper than Waterstones. And thirdly they haven't completely gone into receivership, as Applebaum's still has its branch in Broomhill, and so does Blackwells. It just means it's a longer walk to get to it.

Facts? Never let them get in the way of a good post, eh?

Originally posted by metalman
Well actually yes, I did buy lots of books in there. Secondly they were a remainder bookshop so the prices were reduced anyway, so they were probably cheaper than Amazon and certainly cheaper than Waterstones. And thirdly they haven't completely gone into receivership, as Applebaum's still has its branch in Broomhill, and so does Blackwells. It just means it's a longer walk to get to it.

Facts? Never let them get in the way of a good post, eh?

One fact that cannot be argued away is the fact that the business could not compete and thus did not survive. And whilst we're on the topic of fact checking "probably cheaper than Amazon" is hardly going to convince me. Seems like anything but fact!

So, quoting you (with a bit of me thrown in): "Facts? Never let them get in the way of a mediocre post, eh?"

ps (to Carl_Malibu): I don't get why buying in bulk is unethical, economies of scale are a good thing!

Metalman, did Applebaums actually go into recievership. I am related to the propritor by marriage and I feel this was not exactly the case.

What it does mean that no matter what happened to Applebaums, another local community service has been squeezed out.

Originally posted by BoppinBruce
Metalman, did Applebaums actually go into recievership. I am related to the propritor by marriage and I feel this was not exactly the case.

What it does mean that no matter what happened to Applebaums, another local community service has been squeezed out.

It's hardly a "community service" - it's a business !! The proprietor was hardly giving books away after all!

it is unethical because it forces smaller, local businesses into liquidation

now, I am no economist but I'm pretty sure that taking the bulk of the money away from the local community and distributing it throughout the higher echelons of businessmanship in the uk, and mostly the us, is pretty detrimental on our local economy.

as I said earlier, it ultimately removes our right to a choice of where to buy

eventually a few select companies will monopolise everything, if you want to see an advanced case look to the US - Nike university campuses, Disney towns, Grass Roots log cabins
people start associating the brand with what it is sponsoring.

To look here in the UK, check out the O2 music festival, virgin download festival, sound control secret gigs, etc.
The music takes second place to the brand, and we associate the brand with the music, and smaller companies cant compete with such huge sponsorship details because they dont have the capital, and thus lose out, shut down, and we have even less choice.

I would prefer to spend a couple of extra quid on a book and get personal service, a small friendly shop and the knowledge that I am helping out the local economy.

I find it amazing although interesting how a large franchise opening a sandwich shop can open up into such a debate!

By Community service I meant that the books would be placed asaide for you, and in some cases delivered. Of cos I know it's a business, and has to make money to succeed, but the service it gave over and above this is something difficult to find in this day and age.

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
it is unethical because it forces smaller, local businesses into liquidation

now, I am no economist but I'm pretty sure that taking the bulk of the money away from the local community and distributing it throughout the higher echelons of businessmanship in the uk, and mostly the us, is pretty detrimental on our local economy.

as I said earlier, it ultimately removes our right to a choice of where to buy

eventually a few select companies will monopolise everything, if you want to see an advanced case look to the US - Nike university campuses, Disney towns, Grass Roots log cabins
people start associating the brand with what it is sponsoring.

To look here in the UK, check out the O2 music festival, virgin download festival, sound control secret gigs, etc.
The music takes second place to the brand, and we associate the brand with the music, and smaller companies cant compete with such huge sponsorship details because they dont have the capital, and thus lose out, shut down, and we have even less choice.

I would prefer to spend a couple of extra quid on a book and get personal service, a small friendly shop and the knowledge that I am helping out the local economy.

Member of the communist party Carl?

It's called competition, and the best survive. You'll argue that they don't, but the customer decides what's best. If the customer decides price is best, the place with the best prices wins out, if they decide service is best, the place with the best service wins out.

As for your arguement about choice at Amazon... there are hundreds of books I've not been able to acquire anywhere BUT amazon, either .com, .fr, .de or .au.

And if they buy books in bulk and make huge discounts to the prices, what's wrong with that. The consumer wins out, and I couldn't really care less about the small bookshop fighting to compete on a corner in some city somewhere. I'd rather order it cheap from amazon than spend twice as much on the high street.

I find it amazing although interesting how a large franchise opening a sandwich shop can open up into such a debate!

Ooops, not finished....

I personally have no problem with these large franchises over the small local shops. My own feelings although maybe not factually correct, is that many with a sucsessful local shop will want to open another whic agin rolls on. As long as no one company holds all the cards then large franchises will simply compete resulting in lower prices (may not always happen)

I've personally never had a subway but look forward to seeing what its all about

Originally posted by BoppinBruce
By Community service I meant that the books would be placed asaide for you, and in some cases delivered. Of cos I know it's a business, and has to make money to succeed, but the service it gave over and above this is something difficult to find in this day and age.

I hate to point out the blindingly obvious Bruce but Waterstones will place books aside for you and Amazon do delivery. Additionally they are able to pass on savings to their customers through strongly formed partnerships with publishers. If Amazon's such an 'evil' company then why do they plough the majority of their profit back into the company itself?
I think it's a myth that it's hard to find good customer service these days; you only have to look at retailers like M&S and Waitrose to realise that. Whilst realising that someone somewhere will have had a bad experience with the aforementioned companies for most of us this is not the case.

Originally posted by Hook


It's called competition, and the best survive. You'll argue that they don't, but the customer decides what's best. If the customer decides price is best, the place with the best prices wins out, if they decide service is best, the place with the best service wins out.



Unfortunately the consumer is not all that intelligent. They do not decide what is best for the country/economy on the whole, they only decide what is best for them. This idea may well have been subliminally put there by the kind of aggressive marketing that is used by large companies. They employ psychologists/marketeers to manipulate the consumer by making us all THINK that a particular brand is superior for whatever reason.

Thank you JonJParr for pointing out the blindingly obvious, but I see that to get the same service you have used two companies where it was once possible to get from one. And a local one t'boot.

Originally posted by Hook
Member of the communist party Carl?

I'd rather order it cheap from amazon than spend twice as much on the high street.

Precisely! I refuse to believe that we buy books to satisfy some inner moral quest; we buy the book to read it and hopefully for the lowest price. I must state emphatically that, in my opinion, those who go out of their way to buy at a higher price from a retailer just because they're a small business must be extremely misguided (and that's putting it politely).

Originally posted by BoppinBruce
Thank you JonJParr for pointing out the blindingly obvious, but I see that to get the same service you have used two companies where it was once possible to get from one. And a local one t'boot.

Well, if the small retailer has to put a book aside for you then they obviously don't have enough stock and another person will be disappointed when they arrive to purchase it also. In all the years I have been purchasing from Amazon they've never told me an item was out of stock - oh yes and they deliver it for me too!

Originally posted by JonJParr
Precisely! I refuse to believe that we buy books to satisfy some inner moral quest; we buy the book to read it and hopefully for the lowest price. I must state emphatically that, in my opinion, those who go out of their way to buy at a higher price from a retailer just because they're a small business must be extremely misguided (and that's putting it politely).

But if the customer values having that small business available to them, and are aware that they use it or lose it, then it's a rational decision to spend there rather than buy cheaper elsewhere, and not misguided at all.

isnt it fun to live in a world where to call someone "communist" can be seen as derogetary, or vaguely insulting.

I'm not politically aligned in any way, thank you very much.
Less of the attempts at "humour" please.

i have personally had bad experiences with amazon, but i will use them as a last resort, yes.

surely even hardcore capitalists such as yourselves should be offended that the capital is taken away from our country?

and tim rutter is correct.

Customers are stupid. Yes its insulting to be called stupid but thats how we are seen.
That is why aggresive marketing works, it is relying on brand association and the customers lack of brainpower to see past that.

back on subject I challenge anybody who calls themselves a coffee drinker to drink a "frappyblaschmuck" or whatever they call their coffee nowadays, from starbucks, and try a simple white coffee from pollards (up the hill from the yorkshire grey)
or if you want something a little more "extravegant" go to FOB just up from the cathederal and try some of their coffees.

I pay there for the people who serve me, who know me, where the staff turnover is low and they dont have faces like a smacked *rse, and they know me and talk to me and dont serve me "coffee" that tastes like its been round the sewage systems a few times.

Whoa chaps - we seem to have moved onto a full scale debate on the book trade here! I certainly wouldn't go out of my way to buy a book that was more expensive just because it was from a small retailer, and I wasn't saying that. When I bought a book from Applebaum's it was because I couldn't find it anywhere else or because it was cheaper there than anywhere else. I've bought books from Amazon too, and eBay, and literally hundreds of other places. If the Moonies had a book sale I'd probably buy them from them if they had something I wanted at the right price.

But all this is beside the point. All I said in my original post was that I was sorry to see Applebaum's go, and I found it rather sad that three bookshops in a small stretch of one street had all closed down within a relatively short space of time. The reason I find that regrettable is that since I came to Sheffield, the entire character of West Street has changed completely - as Joe said, virtually every other premises now is a bar, pub, restaurant and so on, and in my view that makes it a much less interesting street to go down. When I first came here you could walk down West St. on Saturday afternoon and it was a bustling, thriving street full of people. Go down there now, and especially during the summer when all the students are away, and it's virtually deserted. Personally I think it all started when West St. was one of those places that was cordoned off for months during the building of the tram system - I think, like Hillsborough, it's never really been the same place since. People stopped going there then, and never went back afterwards. And that may be why it now doesn't attract the same sort of people that it did, and so the type of shops that used to be there have lost all their trade and closed down, and been replaced by ones that are more in keeping with the current passers-by - and that probably includes Subway. It doesn't worry me particularly that it's them - it won't affect me because I won't be going in there, nor have I ever been into any branch of Subway, or Starbucks for that matter, and it doesn't matter how many of them they cram into the town centre, I still won't because they don't sell anything I want. Applebaum's did, so I'm sad to see it go.

Incidentally Boppin Bruce, it wasn't me that said that Applebaum's had gone into receivership, it was Jon Parr - I said they hadn't done so. At least not yet - I hope their shop in Broomhill keeps going.

Originally posted by metalman
It doesn't worry me particularly that it's (Subway) - it won't affect me because I won't be going in there, nor have I ever been into any branch of Subway, or Starbucks for that matter, and it doesn't matter how many of them they cram into the town centre, I still won't because they don't sell anything I want. Applebaum's did, so I'm sad to see it go.

But the more they cram in there, with their economies of scale and huge marketing budgets, means the harder it is for smaller, independent retailers to compete, and more will close, so eventually you won't have any choice but Subway or Starbucks.

I love the smell of ignorance in the morning!

To correct a few 'facts' that have been posted:

Subway are Canadian, and still owned by the two brothers who started selling sub-sandwiches out of their township.

It is not a company, but a franchisor. All the subways in Sheffield are owned by a Sheffield guy.

Originally posted by RPG
I love the smell of ignorance in the morning!

To correct a few 'facts' that have been posted:

Subway are Canadian, and still owned by the two brothers who started selling sub-sandwiches out of their township.

It is not a company, but a franchisor. All the subways in Sheffield are owned by a Sheffield guy.

Erm, they are a franchisor, that's true, but are in fact, American, started by two friends, Fred DeLuca and Peter Buck in Bridgport, Connecticut in 1965.

See http://www.subway.com for the whole heart-warming story.

Originally posted by RPG
I love the smell of ignorance in the morning!

To correct a few 'facts' that have been posted:

Subway are Canadian, and still owned by the two brothers who started selling sub-sandwiches out of their township.

It is not a company, but a franchisor. All the subways in Sheffield are owned by a Sheffield guy.

Yes, but isn't it franchised for a reason? Basically this takes away the risk from the company subway themselves but they still reap the profits. Also, they can "back up" the business financially to make it compete with competitors but without total cash input.

Also, as a franchise it is owned by the individual who has taken out the franchise. I'm not sure how this works in the UK but the reason it was done like this throughout the US was so the franchise was eligible for government funding as the individual owns it.

So in effect subway get some shmuck to take on the cost, then get the government to fund it, then if it's successful they get cash back from the franchise, but if it's not they walk away with minimal loss.

indeed and that point reverts back to what i said about cannibalistic marketing

lots of shops open in a small space, they all compete against each other, so small profits for them, but the company itself is having lots of stock bought all the same = gains for the company, losses for the franchises

Amazon and Subway use 2 completly different business models. You can't compare them.

Amazon has a huge warehouse and can therefore store millions of books which is impossible in a bookstore. Both offer different levels of service. I generally buy off Amazon but last weekend I stumbled across a great bookshop in Liverpool and bought 3 books full price because I would probably never have stumbled across them online.

Anyway amazon allows a phenomenon called the Long Tail http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.10/tail.html

i.e. they can have millions of books and even if they only sell a few copies a year it doesn't matter to them, they don't have to just stock the big sellers.

Subway is a chain of sandwich shops who (despite being hated by some) at least produce fresh sandwiches. Would you rather eat a pre-packaged sandwich from a fridge in a newsagents that contains rubbish ingredients or something fresh?

However, the fabric of our towns and cities is being destoyed by these chains. We are becoming a nation where every town looks the same.

I will try to find the report, but it says that locally run businesses stimulate the local economy more than chain business where generally the profits are repatriated by head office (either in a big city or abroad). The local town therefore loses out on subsidiary jobs (lawyers, accountants, local food processors, farmers etc.etc)..

I'm not sure about franchises though - and where the profit goes.

At the end of the day though, consumer choice. If people want uniformity then they are being given it. Unfortunately it may be too late when they start complaining that everything is the same as the skills will have been lost to do anything about it.

i wasnt attempting to compare amazon and subway - though amazon are doing a good job at destroying local bookshops.

and subways definition of "fresh" is ambiguous to say the least..

processed meat, processed cheese, salad that just DOESNT taste right, and plastic bread.

I noticed an american posted earlier and said the quality in the US was better, though I beg to differ, I propose that in general the quality of US food from chains or local stores is lower than the UK - but thats a different point entirely

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
I noticed an american posted earlier and said the quality in the US was better, though I beg to differ, I propose that in general the quality of US food from chains or local stores is lower than the UK - but thats a different point entirely

An interesting point of contention Carl - what are you basing this differing opinion on?

Incidentally the names Alasdair - I keep looking around when I see people calling me Carl.
(heh)

Have you ever witnessed a herschey(sp?) bar? the American idea of "chocolate" is laughable even by UK standards.

Having friends in the US who have come over to the UK and eaten out, at fast food outlets and restaurants have all commented on the uniformly better quality of the food.

That is what I base my opinion on

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
i wasnt attempting to compare amazon and subway - though amazon are doing a good job at destroying local bookshops.

and subways definition of "fresh" is ambiguous to say the least..

processed meat, processed cheese, salad that just DOESNT taste right, and plastic bread.

I noticed an american posted earlier and said the quality in the US was better, though I beg to differ, I propose that in general the quality of US food from chains or local stores is lower than the UK - but thats a different point entirely

Sorry I didn't mean to type fresh. I meant freshly prepared. I agree with you. The ingredients shippped in from god knows where. I just had a sandwich from Relish on West St. Now they try to buy local ingredients and buy from local suppliers.

I vote with my feet abd pocket and choose this rather than Subway because I actually care about my local economy. Lots of people don't unfortunately. But then I shop from New Roots/Beanies and Just Natural in Crookes and sometimes pop into Co-op for certain items. I don't feel the need to go to a large supermarket.

As for Amazon, I agree somewhat. But I think that shops will have to change and adapt. I thnk there may be a crisis on the high street as rents are too high and we will see people going to the net for goods. But I believe there will always be a place for some human interaction and knowledge that you just can't get on the net.

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
Incidentally the names Alasdair - I keep looking around when I see people calling me Carl.
(heh)

Have you ever witnessed a herschey(sp?) bar? the American idea of "chocolate" is laughable even by UK standards.

Having friends in the US who have come over to the UK and eaten out, at fast food outlets and restaurants have all commented on the uniformly better quality of the food.

That is what I base my opinion on

Hershey chocolate is very bitter isn't it? Across Europe, Hershey's chocolate is highly unpopular because of its low cocoa content, waxy texture and chemical flavour. Indeed a lot of Europeans do not believe Hershey chocolate to be 'chocolate' in the strictest sense but more as cocoa-flavoured vegetable oils. Sounds disgusting when you think of it like that!

(Ref: http://www.answers.com/topic/hershey-foods-corporation-1)

I think I do have to on the whole agree with you Alasdair. From visiting American supermarkets whilst on holiday in the US the vegetables and fruit are not at all appealing (they're all waxed and shiny). It does seem that on the whole US food is fast food (ie. burgers, french fries, tacos etc). At least in the UK we have food retailers that still retain a passion for the produce they use (see Pret). Having said all this we do pay more for what we buy!

Though we seem to be at opposite ends of the political spectrum and I may not hold the same views as you Alasdair (aka Carl_Malibu) I thoroughly enjoy your posts.

Jon

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
I noticed an american posted earlier and said the quality in the US was better, though I beg to differ, I propose that in general the quality of US food from chains or local stores is lower than the UK - but thats a different point entirely

Thats not been my experience, especially with fast food, if people in the US carried-on like they do in KFC or Burger King in this country they would be fired on the spot. But thats just the problem, it's the English interpretation of "customer service", it's slow, it's rude, it's generally the bare minimum that they can get away with. SubWay in the US is a great sandwich shop, the salad is crispy, the bread is fresh, the choice is vast. I won't bother going to one in the UK as I know I will be dissapointed.

I also found the fresh fruit/veg and meat in US supermarkets to be far superior to in the UK, the furit and veg usually had little sprinklers over it to keep it cool and fresh !

cheers for that jon - and its good to have a discussion where points arent ignored and are argued through fully.

the spirit of argument!

</off topic>

Nick maybe the sprinklers are a last attempt to wash off the pesticides ;)

Well, this afternoon I was walking down West Street from the University towards town, and saw a group of 4 Subway peons heading towards me, clutching a tray of free sandwiches and leaflets.

Hastily managing to avoid the proffered goodies, and resisting the temptation to utter any witticisms, I reflected on my good fortune when a SECOND wave came at me!

By now I'm thinking - cunning...lull you in to a false sense of security and then hit you with the old one-tw. But you have to get up early to catch me out like that....

THREE GROUPS! Dodged group 2, only to confront group 3. By now I'm feeling like the guy in 'Airplane' who deals with the Monks who are begging on the airport concourse.

Finally, a couple of stragglers wander past. Four waves.....

All within 2 minutes / 100 yards.

Now....here's a good question. On leaving the shop there are TWO directions - left and right. And TWO sides of the road. Why not...and here's the staggeringly good idea that I formulated and that anyone from SubWay can use for free...why not have people going in different directions and on different sides of the road?

Just a thought.... :)

Oh...and who the heck was serving customers? Or are SubWay staff cloned in vats in the back?

Joe

Subway is well overpriced.

Also the hot sandwiches are microwaved and never live up to the promise on the posters!

I fail to understand how you are able to form an ongoing opinion from a couple of weeks vacation, probably in some excessively tourist area like Orlando. My experience of American food comes from 38 years residency. Here in New England sea food , especially lobsters are first rate, if we shine up our veggies to present them so what. Tomatoes, Peppers are much larger and juicier than Britain. Our fast food franchises have to perform or fail. They are often in direct competition with each other in adjacent locations, especially in the gasoline alleys of most towns. Americans travel long distances and don't care to search off highway for unidentified restaurants. They know the names they like and find them easier when they are grouped together.
There are several family restaurant chains which are not considered fast food places, and where the food is good and plentiful. Friendly's, Bob Evans, Applebees, Boston Market, etc.
I'll allow that Cadbury is much better than Hershey, so I guess that gives you the right to condemn us all. Get a life!

Originally posted by buck
Tomatoes, Peppers are much larger and juicier than Britain.

Probably because they're genetically modified and covered in pesticides/herbicides/artificial fertilisers etc etc. These all leach into the waterways and cause environmental damage, not to mention the alledged toll they take on the male sperm count...

And anyway, size isn't everything.

Originally posted by tim_rutter
Probably because they're genetically modified and covered in pesticides/herbicides/artificial fertilisers etc etc.

and what we eat in this country isn't ?

America is much, much bigger than the UK, they have lots more farm land than we do, who do you think uses the more intensive farming methods ?

Originally posted by nick2
America is much, much bigger than the UK, they have lots more farm land than we do, who do you think uses the more intensive farming methods ? The USA ...

wow this debate is constantly changing!

Sorry for bringing up the US thing :S

Originally posted by nick2
and what we eat in this country isn't ?

America is much, much bigger than the UK, they have lots more farm land than we do, who do you think uses the more intensive farming methods ?

They do. They have much more relaxed laws on GM foods for example. And if what I've read is to be believed treatment of livestock is appauling. Its the free market thing again - if it increases productivity they'll do it.

There Has Been 9 opened in newcastle in the last year, it really is taking the P.

I really think we are bieng invaded, still better than a kebab when drunk!

Originally posted by tim_rutter
They do. They have much more relaxed laws on GM foods for example. And if what I've read is to be believed treatment of livestock is appauling. Its the free market thing again - if it increases productivity they'll do it.

But they only do it in response to consumer demand, we want cheap food, and the only way to get it as cheap as we want it is to intensive farm. People (in general, before eveyone starts with the "I only eat organic fairtrade food thats been hand reared in Kent") would rather pay £1 for intensive farmed beef than £5 for something a bit more natural.

We actually buy more and more food for less money each year, the fact that you can get a chicken for less than £3 that grew to adulthood in half the time it normally takes and has no taste is our fault, not the farmers, if we didn't buy it they wouldn't produce it.

Originally posted by nick2
But they only do it in response to consumer demand, we want cheap food, and the only way to get it as cheap as we want it is to intensive farm. People (in general, before eveyone starts with the "I only eat organic fairtrade food thats been hand reared in Kent") would rather pay £1 for intensive farmed beef than £5 for something a bit more natural.

We actually buy more and more food for less money each year, the fact that you can get a chicken for less than £3 that grew to adulthood in half the time it normally takes and has no taste is our fault, not the farmers, if we didn't buy it they wouldn't produce it.

Well again we return the point of consumer stupidity. They (we) cannot be trusted to purchase goods with anything other than our own needs in mind and it is therefore the job of the government to manage the power and control the methods of these companies by regulating them significantly. The free market will only ever produce wealth in the hands of a few and in general a reduced standard of living.

My two cents...

GM food is as much tied up in the issue of our 'convenience culture' as in the issue of cost, as pointed out by nick2 and others.

Western society has reached a point where we're so used to having everything we want, when we want it, that farmers, retailers, etc etc are fighting a constant battle to keep up with demand.

I remember a time (and I'm 20, so it's not even that long ago, showing just how quickly this has spiralled) when fruit and veg was seasonal, and you literally could not get certain items during certain months of the year. Now you can get a bunch of grapes or a couple of mangoes or whatever in the middle of winter! And they're 3 times the size of what they used to be!!

Originally posted by LisaO
My two cents...

GM food is as much tied up in the issue of our 'convenience culture' as in the issue of cost, as pointed out by nick2 and others.

Western society has reached a point where we're so used to having everything we want, when we want it, that farmers, retailers, etc etc are fighting a constant battle to keep up with demand.

I remember a time (and I'm 20, so it's not even that long ago, showing just how quickly this has spiralled) when fruit and veg was seasonal, and you literally could not get certain items during certain months of the year. Now you can get a bunch of grapes or a couple of mangoes or whatever in the middle of winter! And they're 3 times the size of what they used to be!!


This enormous demand you speak of doesn't explain the presence of grain mountains.

Originally posted by LisaO
I remember a time (and I'm 20, so it's not even that long ago, showing just how quickly this has spiralled) when fruit and veg was seasonal, and you literally could not get certain items during certain months of the year.

I thought that a couple of weeks ago as the M&S advert was saying "these arn't just summer fruits", I thought, no their not, it's not even summer yet and bluberries arn't even flowering let alone fruiting.

Originally posted by tim_rutter
This enormous demand you speak of doesn't explain the presence of grain mountains.

I am familiar with these, having lived in Australia for 19 years and with family in the 'outback' I have seen some corkers.

Quite simply, they exist because no-one eats bread anymore because apparently carbs are evil :)

Originally posted by LisaO
I am familiar with these, having lived in Australia for 19 years and with family in the 'outback' I have seen some corkers.

Quite simply, they exist because no-one eats bread anymore because apparently carbs are evil :)

Apart from people who go to subway...:D

Originally posted by tim_rutter
Apart from people who go to subway...:D

And who said this topic had drifted?

A very seamless segue there back to Subway :)

Originally posted by LisaO
And who said this topic had drifted?

A very seamless segue there back to Subway :)

Thats how real conversations work, you drift on and off the topic, they way you have to stay rigidly on-topic on forums seems very un-natural to me, it's not like when your out you say "sorry, we're talking about football at the moment, and only football, we will start a new conversation about women in a moment".

Originally posted by nick2
Thats how real conversations work, you drift on and off the topic, they way you have to stay rigidly on-topic on forums seems very un-natural to me, it's not like when your out you say "sorry, we're talking about football at the moment, and only football, we will start a new conversation about women in a moment".

I agree it can seem a little wierd particularly having just eaten in subway (just trying to stay on topic).

Originally posted by tim_rutter
Well again we return the point of consumer stupidity. They (we) cannot be trusted to purchase goods with anything other than our own needs in mind and it is therefore the job of the government to manage the power and control the methods of these companies by regulating them significantly. The free market will only ever produce wealth in the hands of a few and in general a reduced standard of living.
:o

Wow, that's a lot of power you want to transfer from the "individual" to the "government".

I seem to remember another thread not so long back where you were arguing something very different altogether.

:suspect:

I'm glad you have such a clear view of when the gov't are and aren't doing things in our best interests.

;)

I remember when I was a lil girl being so amazed at how my mum and her friends could sit around our kitchen table chatting for hours and just drifting from one topic to the next. I used to think that they drew up a list each time they got together, detailing all the topics they were going to cover that day :)

Of course now my friends and I are exactly the same! But you're right, who knows where a convo may go. Yesterday I had a 40 min convo with a guy from work that started out about Big Brother and ended with a discussion of Australia's immigration policy. Go figure!

Originally posted by foo_fighter
:o

Wow, that's a lot of power you want to transfer from the "individual" to the "government".

I seem to remember another thread not so long back where you were arguing something very different altogether.

:suspect:

I'm glad you have such a clear view of when the gov't are and aren't doing things in our best interests.

;)

The correct government of course. Thanks for getting that other thread closed by the way, lets hope you can hold back a bit on this one.

Originally posted by LisaO
Yesterday I had a 40 min convo with a guy from work that started out about Big Brother and ended with a discussion of Australia's immigration policy. Go figure!

Last night I started a conversation with the other half about how you get the filling in canelloni which ended-up being an argument about what was there before the big bang.

Originally posted by tim_rutter
The correct government of course. Thanks for getting that other thread closed by the way, lets hope you can hold back a bit on this one.
:confused:

The closing of that other thread had nothing to do with me (I don't even know why it was closed).



Anyway, back on track, who elected you to decide what "the correct government" is, or what the rest of us should or shouldn't buy.

Your vitriol on this thread is yet another example of your conceit, only tim_rutter knows what's best for all the rest of us poor misguided souls.

:loopy:

Originally posted by nick2
Last night I started a conversation with the other half about how you get the filling in canelloni which ended-up being an argument about what was there before the big bang.

How do you get the filling in canelloni?

Originally posted by nick2
Last night I started a conversation with the other half about how you get the filling in canelloni which ended-up being an argument about what was there before the big bang.

Now that is digression!

Originally posted by tim_rutter
How do you get the filling in canelloni?

Torn between trying to decide whether you were asking hypothetically or do actually want to know how to stuff cannelloni, I thought I'd err on the side of good will!

You use a teaspoon. Spoon it into one end until it reaches halfway, then fill in the rest from the other side.

Originally posted by LisaO
Torn between trying to decide whether you were asking hypothetically or do actually want to know how to stuff cannelloni, I thought I'd err on the side of good will!

You use a teaspoon. Spoon it into one end until it reaches halfway, then fill in the rest from the other side.

Thanks for the info! I think they should sell cannelloni in subway. :)

So Tim, you're all concerned about what we poor Americans have on our produce. When it's cold winter out there in Wincobank, and you're enjoying nice summer veggies and fruit, guess where it might be coming from.

Originally posted by buck
So Tim, you're all concerned about what we poor Americans have on our produce. When it's cold winter out there in Wincobank, and you're enjoying nice summer veggies and fruit, guess where it might be coming from.

The US? Which is in the same hemisphere as the UK so is just as cold at the same time of year?

Originally posted by LisaO
The US? Which is in the same hemisphere as the UK so is just as cold at the same time of year?

Texas in Winter is a lot hotter than England, it's nearer to the equator you see.

Originally posted by nick2
Texas in Winter is a lot hotter than England, it's nearer to the equator you see.


EVERYWHERE in Winter is a lot hotter than England!!

Lol, I was just being a smart arse...he'd said 'summer fruits' and...I don't know...there was a point in there somewhere :) It's Friday afternoon, my brain is foggy!!

Originally posted by LisaO
...my brain is foggy!!
...as Manchester on a cold December morning.

:hihi:

Think Florida, California, New Mexico, etc. = nice and warm. :)

As long as you're closer to the equator, the hemisphere doesn't matter (well, it does to seasons, but that's not what we were on about).

Sorry, it's Friday evening, and it's my turn to be a smart arse.

;)

:)

yer cant get a pork sarnie from subway can ya? or bacon, egg and beans for that matter! end of story!

subway best watch out maccy Ds have plans 4 em from september...

may i just say that all of the subways in sheffield are all owned by one person who is probbly local

have you read the thread? Just about everyone is aware that they are a franchise

What gets me about Subway and the ilk is that I can go to France and get cheap tasty and fresh produce without any fancy frills. Here you get overprocessed rubbish or overpriced rubbish.

Why can't we buy basic, decently priced fresh sandwiches?

Shock, Horror - the prices of sandwiches in this Subway are more expensive than the one 200 yards away! (Unless they've also upped the prices in that one when the new one opened).

Anyone who enjoys food should shun this horrid place for the vastly superior Relish sandwich shop across the road.

Subway sandwiches are vile.

I used to get my sarnies from the sandwich shop at the bottom of West Street, that was joined onto the barbers next door. I did wonder how hygenic that was but the sarnies were big and cheap so I ignored it. If you had a chicken sarnie you got about 2 chicken breats in there.

Woah whats everyones problem.

Its just another takeaway in the city centre, the food is 10x more fresh and healthy than most the takeaways on west/division street. and it offers a unique type of food for those opening times.

If the fact that one exists in this large city upsets u that much then you need to get out more!

(ducks for cover)

Originally posted by superted666
.

If the fact that one exists in this large city upsets u that much then you need to get out more!

(ducks for cover)

You're missing the point, "ONE" doesn't exist.

Okay then three.

Supply wouldnt be increasing if there isnt demand. Its good business for the city.

simple

I would lay out the argument to counter what you just said, but I can't really see the point, seeing as you've obviously just read the last few posts and not the thread in it's entirety.

There's no point in doing the whole thread again for your benefit just because you can't be bothered to read it.

Read it before posting thanks

my post was more aimed at the first few posts where people took offense to a shop.

I must just add - i like subways but i totally get where you guys are coming from when you bang on about local shops are better
once my dad had gone into sheffield city for a meeting and he bought me back a cheese sandwhich from some bakery (never heard of it) and yes it was easily the best sandwhich i have ever eaten.
i do have a ***** load of subway coupons though which means i can get a sandwhich and drink for 1.20

And that is exactly what you should be wary of!

Sandwich coupons are the work of the devil!

Originally posted by Tony
Sandwich coupons are the work of the devil!

So is the lunch deal in Boots that encourages you to have a bag of crips or a mars bar, not that I need encouraging.

Originally posted by Twiglet
Shock, Horror - the prices of sandwiches in this Subway are more expensive than the one 200 yards away! (Unless they've also upped the prices in that one when the new one opened).


Awww, Twiglet, I love your avatar! It's SO cute! :thumbsup:

StarSparkle

Originally posted by StarSparkle
Awww, Twiglet, I love your avatar! It's SO cute! :thumbsup:

StarSparkle

Hehe aw thanks, only if you watch it long enough for it to blink though! :D

I first went into Subway (in Leeds) with open mind having bought the marketing that they served fresh and healthy products. After eating the sandwich I realised that it was neither fresh nor healthy. Anyone who eats well will be able to *taste* that Subway sarnies are processed garbage.

I loved this part of Sheffield for the fact that it shunned corporates (used to have a toasted ciabatta in Moco every day). Fair enough if the council wants to make a buck and charge high rents to rich US franchises but why do the good folk of our fair city have to spend their money on this crap to further boost the coffers of faceless corporations in Seattle (or wherever). Why not spend your money at Moco (a locally-owned business) and watch your cash recirculate and stimulate Sheffield.

Companies like these don't give a toss about food: Marketing and Profit are their two goals even if they poison the f**k out of you in the process.

E-Man
p.s. did you know that Coca-Cola are not a drinks manufacturer as most people assume - they subcontract all their manufacturing and their only activities are marketing their brand for profit.

Seems every one has a different oppinion whats good in the UK/US.

My oppinion of whats better in the UK is.......

Chocolate
Bread
Butter
Pastries
Cheeses
Picture Frames
Lamp Shades.


All the rest...... US I guess.

Originally posted by scottf
whats plastic about it? each ingredient is fresh and its all made to order on the premises?

I have to say I agree with this defence.

On the whole I think people see the god-awful neon signs etc. and sometimes assume the Subway is say like McDonald's and the like. Not *really* the case at all. Have to say I personally have never been overly impressed with their stuff .. but definitely on the harsh side to label their sandwiches as "plastic".

For once, their food tends to look WORSE on the posters than it is in reality (Old Ronald McDonald could do with taking a leaf of Subway's book on that score! .. or better still shut down altogether ;-) ..)

So yeah, overall I'd prefer a bookshop too anyday, but Subway ain't as bad as they might seem.

I don't mind Starbucks so much, as at least they sell a vaguely quality product - granted it's overpriced, and it's a shame that consumers prefer heavily branded ubiquity over small independant shops, but anti-brand hysteria aside, you can see how they got where they got.
Subway on the other hand is terrible IMO. Maybe it's because I'm vegetarian and therefore I have virtually no choice, but the one time I visited, I was served a blander less satisfying product than any of the other sandwich retailers I've ever visited. Maybe if you are an omnivore it's great, but for vegetarians - roobish.

Originally posted by poppins
Seems every one has a different oppinion whats good in the UK/US.

My oppinion of whats better in the UK is.......

Chocolate
Bread
Butter
Pastries
Cheeses
Picture Frames
Lamp Shades.


All the rest...... US I guess.

Erm...

Waistlines? Bigger ain't always better...:hihi:

Why on Earth did they have to close the BookShop! - it was like the cheapest book place in Sheffield

Cant get why anyone would open up a subway there without doing some kind of interest survery in the first place anyway


For Cheap and Verrry tasty food
----------------------------------------------
Boots

For not so tasty but ok stuff
--------------------------------------------
Tesco Extra

For junk food with your mates
----------------------------------------------
Cavendish, and all the other places

..for all the rest, West Street has something to cater for it

Why on earth do we need a sarnie shop , and a cheap quality one at that ruining that part of the city

I would not worry to much about Subway, they are quite worried. They have not made anywhere near the turnover they have expected and have far to much staff.

With the likes of Shops such as Relish, Luchstop and Moca next door. They don't stand a change to break even. Goto
Subway, they try Relish oposite and you will see what I mean, they really did pick the wrong location !!

Haven't ploughed through the rest of the thread, so I dunno whether this has been mentioned already, but ISTR that in Eric Schlosser's Fast Food Nation (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0141006870/sumptionorg-21) he says Subway have the highest franchisee charge and some of the most restrictive practices of all the fast food companies, in which case perhaps it's not surprising if, as Nextwave says, they are struggling (I think Schlosser also mentioned that a lot of Subways in the USA have closed because franchisees can't make a viable business given the excessive charges). The book was written about four years ago, so things may well have changed since.

Well the first and last time I had a Subway was actually in America and it was absolubtley vile!:gag: I asked for a tiny blob of mayo and what I got was a huge amount of sauce that you could just about see a sprig of lettuce hanging out! Eeugg!
I'v never fancied one since! Olive Garden anyday!!:thumbsup:

Subway is killing it's 'Sub Club' promotion due to counterfeiters! :(

http://forums.invisionpower.com/%5C%22http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ct--counterfeitingsub0602jun02,1,3295481.story?coll=ny-basketball-headlines&ctrack=1&cset=true\%22

Originally posted by Hook
Subway is killing it's 'Sub Club' promotion due to counterfeiters! :(

http://forums.invisionpower.com/%5C%22http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ct--counterfeitingsub0602jun02,1,3295481.story?coll=ny-basketball-headlines&ctrack=1&cset=true\%22

I'm afraid the link doesn't work!

But who would go to all that effort just to get a rubber chicken sandwich, its not even totally free you have to buy a cup of post-mix fizzy drink to get it.

Originally posted by Twiglet
I'm afraid the link doesn't work!

But who would go to all that effort just to get a rubber chicken sandwich, its not even totally free you have to buy a cup of post-mix fizzy drink to get it.

Sorry, there's a bug in the latest alpha version of the IPB software which screws up the links.

The actual url is:

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ct--counterfeitingsub0602jun02,1,3295481.story?coll=ny-basketball-headlines&ctrack=1&cset=true

Originally posted by tim_rutter
Their range of great sarsess (sauces) will be not so freshly made I'd imagine. I haven't actually tried a subway sandwich yet. But i can only imagine the amount of sugar/salt goes into them. Thats the american way. I'd much sooner have something of local origination from an independant sandwich shop.

Quite on the contrary. In north america subway has recently been at the forefront of offering healthy fast food and is advertised quite heavily as such. It's thought their push into the 'health' market has been responsible for companies like McDonalds, Wendys and Burger King having to start offering more healthly options on their menus.

Hmm, now I'm jonesing for a Subway Turkey Bacon wrap!!

I think that three in a city center is too many specially in such a small city center. not to mention ecclesall road ( where I worked...(notice the use of past tense)).
I think the manager is a nasty man as well. . More small independantly run sandwich shops are needed, like woodys on hunter's bar. but having said that, i do like the meatballs. mmmm

Went to Matlock Bath this afternoon on the way back from Alton Towers, it appears Subway can't survive everywhere, since the one there has disappeared! :clap:

Think it was that delightful lady songstress Petula Clarke -often abbreviated to Pet -who lifted our hearts with her laconic rendition of Don't Sleep in the Subway Darling.
This was in the days before those "attitude wristbands"and her message reminded us about the downtrodden folk who spend their nights in the discomfort of our city subways.A theme also
voiced by the protesting duo Flanagan and Allen in their iconic
masterpiece Underneath the Arches.
It's sad to hear that another subway is to open as all the evidence suggests that these subterranean passageways are so often peopled by druggers,muggers and buggers if the local
newspaper is anything to go by.
Think I'll confine my shopping to Meadowhall and Tesco Home
Delivery in the present climate.

i havent got my 2 pence with my to add to this converison
so i'll be quiet

Originally posted by BAZZO
Think it was that delightful lady songstress Petula Clarke -often abbreviated to Pet -who lifted our hearts with her laconic rendition of Don't Sleep in the Subway Darling.
This was in the days before those "attitude wristbands"and her message reminded us about the downtrodden folk who spend their nights in the discomfort of our city subways.A theme also
voiced by the protesting duo Flanagan and Allen in their iconic
masterpiece Underneath the Arches.
It's sad to hear that another subway is to open as all the evidence suggests that these subterranean passageways are so often peopled by druggers,muggers and buggers if the local
newspaper is anything to go by.
Think I'll confine my shopping to Meadowhall and Tesco Home
Delivery in the present climate.

:confused: :loopy: :suspect:

I hope you're trying to be funny! ;)

Cant stand subway! Its all so plastic and nasty! blergh! I feel sick just thinking about it. :gag:

Greggs is the way forward! :clap:

Originally posted by Captain_Scarlet
End of the day, Subway serve shhh food and only fools go there

The opening of new Subways must stop !

Is this some form of new predjudice? "Subway Extreemism"?

I personally dont like subway, but i would'nt go as far as calling everyone who goes there a fool!?

Originally posted by Avalon
I personally dont like subway, but i would'nt go as far as calling everyone who goes there a fool!?
Watchoo talking about foool?

Originally posted by DanSumption
Watchoo talking about foool?

:confused: :confused: Y'Waht?

Originally posted by Avalon
Greggs is the way forward! :clap:

Urrgh, no, I dread to think what meat they put in their "pastys" but it aint from any farmyard animal I know, and everything is so greasy.

Originally posted by nick2
Urrgh, no, I dread to think what meat they put in their "pastys" but it aint from any farmyard animal I know, and everything is so greasy.

Their sasuage rolls are covered in grease....but their sandwitches are ok...

Originally posted by Avalon
Their sasuage rolls are covered in grease....but their sandwitches are ok...

Buy they do that horrible "cheese savory" stuff, that's cheese and other things mashed together, it looks like cat sick.

Greggs are great, proper north east thing, always cheer me up when feeling homesick!

Subways, just another patch of americanisation on lil' ol' england!" They could have at least called it underground or tube or even..SUPERTRAM!

That's the spirit Geordie Carl!!! We were brought up on Greggs in the toon!

"ana sossige roll for t' babbie"

Originally posted by mjlacey21
That's the spirit Geordie Carl!!! We were brought up on Greggs in the toon!

Aye, all them 16 yr old mothers feeding their 2 bairns called harvey cheese pasties, but cry when its too hot so the mother replies "its hot man yer F***IN divvy" quality!!!!

ahhhh - the memories are bringing a tear to my eye.

Originally posted by Geordiecarl
Greggs are great, proper north east thing, always cheer me up when feeling homesick!

Subways, just another patch of americanisation on lil' ol' england!" They could have at least called it underground or tube or even..SUPERTRAM!

I think greggs are heading far too rapidly down the american fast food chain route. They are a far cry from the typical local bakery that they claim to be. Where are the racks of freshly baked bread behind the counter?

I do however, remember a time when they sold chilli pasties. They were fantastic.

Ah, but they were our typical local bakery years back before Sheffield had even heard of them and that's how us Geordies will remember it!

yeah, at least theres still more greggs than subways in toon! Speaking of which its nearly dinner time and i think ill have something from greggs, they do stuff up here that they dont do down there you know, like chicken tikka wraps and cheese and bacon baguettes (cold though)

I had a cheese and onion pasty at 8.45am for my breakfast! Dirty girl!

Originally posted by mjlacey21
I had a cheese and onion pasty at 8.45am for my breakfast! Dirty girl!

I know!

Originally posted by Avalon
:confused: :confused: Y'Waht?
I ain't getting on no plane.

Originally posted by DanSumption
I ain't getting on no plane.

Whatever

Quit Your Jibba Jabba

Originally posted by mjlacey21
Ah, but they were our typical local bakery years back before Sheffield had even heard of them and that's how us Geordies will remember it!

I too am a geordie! Lost the accent a bit tho.

Originally posted by Geordiecarl
Quit Your Jibba Jabba

Fair doos.

Originally posted by Geordiecarl
Greggs are great, proper north east thing, always cheer me up when feeling homesick!

Errr, they're a Leeds firm from what I understand. :confused:

Maybe they moved?

Is that the Leeds in Tyneside?

http://www.greggs.co.uk/about_us/history/


Trust me - I went to school in Gosforth

no way man. As a fellow Geordie I can assure you they were founded on Tyneside in the 1930's :)

http://www.greggs.co.uk/about_us/history/

gah! beat me to it Marie ;)

The pasty I had for brekkie made me lightening quick!

Yup, seems that Greggs have a number of regional divisions - so Greggs head office is in Newcastle but "Greggs of Yorkshire" is based in Leeds.

But is just an expansion from the North East...were it was founded

Man, I never thought Id get protective over greggs :)

Fair enough. We once did some work for them and their head office (for what we did) was definately in Leeds, hence my point.

Anyway, I don't see how regional bias makes them anything other than purveyors of rancid gunk filled garbage. ;)

Originally posted by mjlacey21
Is that the Leeds in Tyneside?

http://www.greggs.co.uk/about_us/history/


Trust me - I went to school in Gosforth

So Did The Pet shop boys and alan shearer!!!!

Shearer went to my school and I used to work in the pub Neil (or Nigel?) Tennant was a regular at.

Gossie crew!


and Subway is really bad

Mod: Ahem... back on topic please.

I was making a point about Subway...

Yeah, Brian Robson went to my school, i wonder if he eats subways? Is there any one else famous who went to your school who may eat subways, as there is even a subway on gossy high st, not as good a bagelicious where all the tyneside trendies can have ha healthy northumbrian goats cheese bagel, but dont worry its NOT the new greggs!

I always got the bus through Gosforth on the way to the match...isnt there a shop called "big baps" or "powdery baps" or something

Always made me giggle when I was 14 like.

Mod: For the last time... back on topic.

I notice the Subway on West Street was doing a roaring trade on Friday night. They should make it into a much bigger building so that all the posers can get it and free up some of the space taken up in the "trendy" bars.

Originally posted by robbie
What gets me about Subway and the ilk is that I can go to France and get cheap tasty and fresh produce without any fancy frills. Here you get overprocessed rubbish or overpriced rubbish.

Why can't we buy basic, decently priced fresh sandwiches?

You can. Try e.g. Relish on west street!

I like subway I go there quite often when i go out shopping. The nearist one to me is In Ilford and there is now 2 in Ilford. I like subway because they do nice sanwhiches and it makes a change from burger king mc donalds ect. I don't like $tarbucks because it is over priced and not worth it. We have two nice coffee bars in wanstead. Nice Croissant (French) and Gioberti's(Italian) Much better than $tarbucks

Subway epitomises all that is wrong with American corporate culture. When Marx proposed that capitalism was essentially unsustainable because simple economics dictated an ever-increasing disparity between the rich and the poor, which would lead to civilization collapsing, he couldn't have predicted globalisation, and he couldn't have predicted that those in charge would be so retarded.

What's the novelty? 'Eat Fresh'??!! THERE'S A F***ING sandwich shop over the road, you bozos. It's been making sandwiches fresh for years. No logo, no annoying t**t on television espousing some life-coaching rhetoric about how he used to be a lardarse.
The problem is that we in the western world are constantly being bombarded with adverts for chains that may not offer the best food/product, but represent consistency. Hence Pizza Hut is always full, but the nice Italian restaurant opposite is struggling for customers. etc. etc.

Yes. Relish is the best sandwich shop in the city. Props too to Spoilt for Choice and Woody's. And Scott's Pantry.

well mcdonalds is closing down on the moor me thinks it will be back when or if the retail quarter gets built

Originally posted by ormester
well mcdonalds is closing down on the moor me thinks it will be back when or if the retail quarter gets built

That McDonalds is actually so much better than the one next to HMV. Shame. I refuse to go into the one next to HMV anymore >_<

wow this topics been dragged back up. weird

Originally posted by Carl_Malibu
wow this topics been dragged back up. weird

I know...imagine how I feel writing in-depth commentary on last year's news...
Although I do feel there are too many of em. Especially that one on Eccy road. Blow it up. (in no way an incitement of snack-fundamentalist terrorism)

Originally posted by RPG
I love the smell of ignorance in the morning!

To correct a few 'facts' that have been posted:

Subway are Canadian, and still owned by the two brothers who started selling sub-sandwiches out of their township.

It is not a company, but a franchisor. All the subways in Sheffield are owned by a Sheffield guy.

Glad you pointed that out RPG.... If it was supasnax or any of the small sheffield sandwich shops that had expanded in this way (using of course the full range of consumer blackmail and extortion tecninques and deploying the commercials of mass destruction that the very finest mad scientist minds can think of) then probably most sheffield people would consider them as heroes of enterprise.

Every large business started small, they grew by giving the customer what they want. Some win some lose, i personally dont see any point in rewarding failure.

disagree high street is far better mcdonalds if any