Should chimps smoke cigarettes?

References:

Feili at China's Zhengzhou zoo (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3611666.stm)

Charlie at the Bloemfontein Zoo in South Africa (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7504304/)

Chimp's should be allowed to smoke, otherwise you will infringe their Human rights. :heyhey:

Lordy, NO! On the other hand, they are intelligent creatures and who knows what else they'll pick up from watching people.

Some of the bears at the San Francisco zoo wave and hold out their paws, begging for treats from zoo visitors. Despite signs asking people NOT to feed them, they still throw them peanuts, popcorn, sandwiches etc.

:) Sierra

Of course chimps should be allowed to smoke , provided that :-

They are confined in a far corner of the zoo , in case other chimps keel over from passive chimp smoking.

Are not allowed indoors , even in cold and rainy weather as smoke has been proved to damage cage bars. If they catch pneumonia or pleuresy , it's their own silly fault.

Pay some way or another for the cigarettes , so the taxes thus gathered could go towards animal hospitals. Chimps could be employed as baby-sitters to obnoxious children or trained to deliver newspapers.

Other animals are trained to wave their hands and say , " Oh , must you ? Really ! " whenever they see a chimp lighting up.

It's sad when human beings inflict their unhealthy habits on other animals, but, well, 'monkey see, monkey do' as the old saying goes.

I think they should be weaned off the habit - perhaps we can also apply the same techniques to the idiots who throw the cigarettes in?

Sierra, the bear thing is also to be found in the wilderness areas - bears start coming down to people because people have previously given them treats. What then happens is the bears DON'T get treats, get peeved and take a chunk out of someone.

Finally, I remember reading somewhere that many moons ago when the military were looking at using dolphins to plant mines on ships (yes, they do some weird **** in military la-la land) they thought about taking a carrot / stick approach to the dolphns by getting them addicted to drugs to help in the training process. Whether they did it or not I don't know.

Joe

Originally posted by JoePritchard
Finally, I remember reading somewhere that many moons ago when the military were looking at using dolphins to plant mines on ships (yes, they do some weird **** in military la-la land) they thought about taking a carrot / stick approach to the dolphns by getting them addicted to drugs to help in the training process. Whether they did it or not I don't know.

Joe

What sick ***** think these things up? :rant: I cannot believe it could even cross someone's mind to get a dolphin addicted to drugs :loopy: I knew about the alleged planting of mines on ships by dolphins, that's bad enough, but to use drugs is so sick. It's like killing a unicorn or something. Unbelievable

StarSparkle - sickened and saddened

No they shouldn't.... but then neither should humans. :cool:

It's strange no-one's mentioned another act of cruelty perpetrated against chimps.
Do you remember all those adverts for tea featuring chimps ? I'm sure in one of them the chimps were seen stuffing themselves with all kinds of undesirable food , prior to drinkimg gallons of caffeine-infected tea -----and then joking and grinning about it !
Whoever made those adverts and made the chimps eat and drink such stuff should be hounded down and placed in a cage so the rest of us could laugh and jeer at them.
I dread to think how much was consumed at rehearsals.
Anyone interested in starting a Chimps Liberation Front ?

Why is it not ok to let chimps in zoos smoke, but it is ok to keep chimps in zoos? Shouldn't chimps be in the wild, and not confined behind bars?

Originally posted by Fareast
Anyone interested in starting a Chimps Liberation Front ?

As long as we call it the Coalition for the Liberation of Itinerate Tree-dwellers - or C.L.I.T. for short :hihi:

(I'd like to thank Jay and Silent Bob for this quote ;) )

Well ,yes , I agree , all chimps should be set free.

But......any found smoking , after being let loose , should be put back in a zoo immediately where they can't cause distress to lions , tigers ......etc....etc....The quicker these vile and unnatural habits amongst chimps is stamped out , the better for all concerned.

The Bonobo Chimp [smaller than the Common species and our closest genetic relative] appears to show the mental ability of a four year old human child, cognition and a degree of self-awareness. They are the only primates, aside from ourselves, that engage in recreational sex. Their preferred coital position, apparently being what is known, in common parlance, as the 'missionary '. Each to their own, one might say. Both species of Chimpanzee have proved capable of mastering the rudiments of human language, although the Common variety is only slightly in advance of the Deputy Prime Minister in terms of syntax, and sorting shapes and colours etc.

With this in mind, why not ask the Chimps? What about a bit of freedom of choice, without this nannying moralism? Perhaps there is an underclass of bone-idle, surly and resentful Chimps who favour Lambert and Butler, working class Chimps who go for the tang of Park Drive, and a sophisticated, lower primate bourgeoise who shun tobacco? How will we ever know unless we ask?

Perhaps, when Blair and his Roundheads are re-elected, they might concentrate upon this burning, pressing issue [as they did with Fox-hunting] rather than minor matters like immigration, crime etc? Just an idea.

As long as they pay for them!

We all know those friends who always tap you up for a "spare fag" when ever you're out!

If they can pop down the offy for a pack of 20 lambert and butler on their own and pay with their money, good luck to them!

Could be quite useful I think. "Chimpy, are you off to odbins? You couldn't pick us up a cream egg and 4 cans of special brew could ya?"

Originally posted by timo
The Bonobo Chimp [smaller than the Common species and our closest genetic relative]

I hate to take a wiz on your fire but the chimpanzee is our closest relative.

I recently saw a BBC documentary about the “Cradle of life” or something like that and they said what if we had evolved from the Bonobo, would we be more peaceful?

This is directly from the World Conservation Union http://www.iucn.org/

The Chimpanzee (Pan troglodytes) is man's closest relative. Their numbers have plummeted due to habitat destruction, trapping, disease (chimpanzees are susceptible to many human infectious diseases) and, most recently, the bushmeat trade and ebola outbreak. The species faces imminent extinction unless urgent action is taken to reverse this trend.
© IUCN

What worries me in letting smoking chimps roam freely in the wild is that they could well have a bad influence on other members of the Ape family. How long would it be before Orang-Utans were flying through the jungle having a little puff ?
If Labour do get in this must be one of Tony's priority areas.
I don't think he'll replace Mr. Prescott with a chimp , even a well-spoken one , but , and it's a big "butt" , if he does do , then we can only wish John well and thank him for all he has done for the country.

Serapis,
I've seen contrary evidence in the Cambridge Encyclopedia of Evolution by Steve Jones et al. Mind you, you could be right. At any rate, I agree with you re 'offy' errands. LOL.

timo,

Pah, I dont think this science lark isn't going to take off!!

lol

Originally posted by StarSparkle
What sick ***** think these things up? :rant: I cannot believe it could even cross someone's mind to get a dolphin addicted to drugs :loopy: I knew about the alleged planting of mines on ships by dolphins, that's bad enough, but to use drugs is so sick. It's like killing a unicorn or something. Unbelievable

StarSparkle - sickened and saddened

wasnt it in ww2 though? I mean death was a way of life then so you can hardly expect people to worry about animal welfare in that kind of situation.

Nowadays it would be a different matter I would think. They dont still do this do they?

Originally posted by nightrider
wasnt it in ww2 though? I mean death was a way of life then so you can hardly expect people to worry about animal welfare in that kind of situation.

Nowadays it would be a different matter I would think. They dont still do this do they?

It makes no difference when it happened - some things are simply wrong.

It takes a very sick mind to think up something like deliberately getting dolphins addicted to heroin. Particularly so as dolphins are reckoned to be highly intelligent animals and have always been thought to have a 'special bond' with humans.

It's the total corruption of innocence - as I said, it's like killing a unicorn.

It's a spiritual thing.

StarSparkle

Originally posted by nightrider
wasnt it in ww2 though? I mean death was a way of life then so you can hardly expect people to worry about animal welfare in that kind of situation.

Nowadays it would be a different matter I would think. They dont still do this do they?

It was actually contemplated for the Cold War - they also trained them to act as 'Dive Mates' for divers. I'd like to think that the Dolphins concerned simply went AWOL....:)

In many ways the behaviour of military and scientific planners got worse after WW2.

http://www.mongabay.com/external/dolphins_warfare.htm

Today they use them for more 'defensive' duties - warning against terrorists, etc. And it wasn't just the US, but the Russians as well.

Joe

Originally posted by StarSparkle
Particularly so as dolphins are reckoned to be highly intelligent animals and have always been thought to have a 'special bond' with humans.


They can't be that clever if they can't find their way out of a tuna net.

Originally posted by nick2
They can't be that clever if they can't find their way out of a tuna net.

Ummm....Nick2, could you?

I certainly couldn't!

:)

Originally posted by StarSparkle
It makes no difference when it happened - some things are simply wrong.



The war needed to be won at all costs. If we can kill millions of humans, I think we can afford to sacrifice a few dolphins. Remember many humans were conscripted and had no choice. So why shouldnt we conscript dolphins?

I think killing is wrong. But if I was in ww2 I would have killed because of the desperation of the situation. Sometimes you have to ignore what is morally wrong and do it anyway for the greater good. I think ww2 was such a scenario.

Originally posted by JoePritchard
Ummm....Nick2, could you?

I certainly couldn't!

:)

Um, me neither! There was a movie made in the seventies about a scientist who trains dolphins to speak.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/day_of_the_dolphin/about.php

Of course the US military learns of this and has sinister plans for them.

And Joe, you're right about bears. We've camped at Yosemite and they recommend double bagging garbage and placing it in "bear proof" receptacles, but the bears still figure out how to get into them. I've only ever seen bears in a zoo, but have seen what they did to a car whose occupants had left food inside.

I think people feed them at the zoo because they look so darned cute, waving and holding out their paws!

:) Sierra

Originally posted by nightrider
The war needed to be won at all costs. If we can kill millions of humans, I think we can afford to sacrifice a few dolphins. Remember many humans were conscripted and had no choice. So why shouldnt we conscript dolphins?

I think killing is wrong. But if I was in ww2 I would have killed because of the desperation of the situation. Sometimes you have to ignore what is morally wrong and do it anyway for the greater good. I think ww2 was such a scenario.

"What benefits a man if he gains a whole world, but loses his own soul?"

That says it all for me.

StarSparkle