I got a parking ticket 8 months ago whilst parked at staples car park in town.
I wrote to them disputing their claim that I was over the aloud time and received a letter stating that it was not sufficient grounds to cancel the charge and I must pay the £100 fine.
The last I heard from Excel was 6 months ago after I’d written another letter appealing their decision, so assumed they were no longer interested and had accepted the appeal.
I've just received a demand from a debt collection agency who are now trying to recover the unpaid excel parking fine.

I am certain I was not over the permitted time and would like to know what my rights are and what are the best steps to take. I intend to write to them again and dispute the fine but would like to know if anyone has had similar problems with this company.

Any help, info or advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Stu

Welcome to the Forum Stu!! :thumbsup:

Not sure if you've come to the right place though...I'd go straight to my local Citizens Advice Bureau for info on this!!

I know the car park you refer to - you only get 1 hour and they are 'pretty keen' the wardens there too!!

You didn't return later the same day did you - sometimes return is prohibited within an certain period of time...maybe it was that!!

Which Debt Collection agency is it?

The reason I ask is that some are easier to deal with than others.

Typically, a Debt Colection company will not listen to you - they want their money for their client. Even if you actually get Excell to agree you then have to get that through to the Debt Collection agency.

Keep records of all your discussions with both parties - I've made the mistake in the past of expecting something to go away after 6 or 7 months and it doesn't.

You will also find that the fine will go up with costs being attached. If you don't pay, they might take you to the small claims court and if the court finds in their favour (which they usually do in these cases) then you'll have additional costs AND possibly a CCJ against your name.

Be very, very careful here. For #100 I'd be tempted to bite the bullet and pay, or go to the CAB and take it from there.

Joe

Hmm, this is an interesting one.

Excel are a private company, and any 'fines' that they give have little if any legal standing I would have thought. They are basically a more sophisticated wheel clamping operation.

The 'offence' took place on private land and as such it is a private matter.

I assume that they haven't taken it to court? If not, they have no legal right to collect the debt, though that doesn't stop them from harassing you with 'debt collectors'.

I think if I were you I would suggest that they take me to court, and let a magistrate decide. I don't think that they will bother going that far somehow.

My advice would be to check the registered address of both Excell and the debt recovery company. If they are the same, it's possibly a scare tactic to make you pay. A company I used to work for did this; debts weren't passed to a collection agency at all, simply a different letterhead was used.

Either way, I wouldn't risk ignoring the letter. Write them another letter clearly marked 'complaint', and request resopnse within 7 days; let us know how you get on! :thumbsup:

........ and don't forget.

Use "recorded delivery" for all letters.

I'd get some legal advice from somewhere, Citezen's advice at least. If they keep writing to you, how do they know your address? if you gave it, then that's fine, but if you didn't then they got it via your registration number. Did they have the required authorisation for this?

I was under the impression (could be very wrong tho)that only the police and authorised official agencies could access such information. Are excell such an authorised body? I thought they were a private "for profit" kinda outfit.

I'd hate to think any tom, dick, or harry could find out where I live from my registration number. Surely that means people can assess if you are at home, or a long way from home, in which case, why are the country's criminals not using this method for burglarys? It'd make sense! (don't go getting any ideas anyone)

Good luck, dont give in, post us on how you get on.

Originally posted by grinboy

I'd hate to think any tom, dick, or harry could find out where I live from my registration number.

I hate to disappoint you, grinboy, but all it takes is:

- Form V888
- "reasonable cause"
- £2.50

:)

Yep, that's the trick. For £2.50 they can then track you down. A lot of these parking restrictions mention "by parking here you are entering a contract to pay". I think there was a case where the parking company got a judge to rule that the act of parking constituted entering a contract. Hence a lot of the warning signs now display that wording.
Get yourself down CAB with all your paperwork.
Were you actually in Staples/Mothercare for a whole hour? If you were using their car park to visit other businesses then they may well bring that up and I suspect you'll be fined irrespective of the time limit.

Originally posted by cgksheff
I hate to disappoint you, grinboy, but all it takes is:

- Form V888
- "reasonable cause"
- £2.50

:)

A lot of big companies have access to this info on line now! A motor insurer I used to work for had this access for tracing the details of cars involved in accidents with their customers.

Cheers all for your replies

I've spoken to a solicitor who advised me that the debt recovery agency have absolutely no powers what so ever at this point, so not to worry about them and concentrate on excel. This would only change with a court order.

He suggested writing to them explaining once again that I disagree with their decision and I'm not going to pay their fine.
Oh and also to tell them that this is between myself and Excel, not the debt recovery people (and they are - C.A.R.S.Ltd Creditlink Account Recovery Solutions Ltd)

If excel want to take me to court then that would be welcomed by me as like Tony said I doubt they will bother to go that far. If they do then the court is generally in my favour as it's up to them to prove I was in the wrong and not for me to disprove it. At the end of the day it's their word against mine. Without cold hard evidence they will struggle.

Have posted my letter today so will let you all know how I get on.

Thanks again for all the comments. ;)

Originally posted by britstu


If excel want to take me to court then that would be welcomed by me as like Tony said I doubt they will bother to go that far. If they do then the court is generally in my favour as it's up to them to prove I was in the wrong and not for me to disprove it. At the end of the day it's their word against mine. Without cold hard evidence they will struggle.


They have a car park attendant who will provide evidence against you.
At the least, his word.
Possibly supported by his notebook with recorded times.
There may be CCTV evidence, but they will only use that if it shows that you stayed over the time OR if you left the site to go elswhere!

Originally posted by cgksheff

Possibly supported by his notebook with recorded times.
There may be CCTV evidence,

They don't use notebooks, they type your registration into a handheld recorder - this is date/timestamped.

Doubt they'd still have tapes from so long ago.

The parking inspector type people in Edinburgh wander round with digital cameras and photograph "offending" vehicles in situ. Excel may have done the same.
Think you've done the right thing in getting your solicitor involved. I'd suspect they may just drop it now.

Originally posted by Knoxville
They don't use notebooks, they type your registration into a handheld recorder - this is date/timestamped.

Doubt they'd still have tapes from so long ago.

I think they do this but what is stopping them from writing it down on a piece of paper and then entering it into the hand held device at a later time.
Do they get commision from each penalties? Do they have a quota of issuing so many tickets?

I've also heard that digital evidence is inadmissible in court as it can be easily manipulated. You only have to look into fashion magazines to see examples of this.

Britstu,

Have a read of Item 3 on this page (http://www.parkingticket.co.uk/ca.html) about a person winning against Excel.

Thanks cgksheff

I'd seen a copy of the original article but not that page.
The fight goes on..

Anyone anything else to add to this thread?

I received a ticket from Excel Parking Services in the summer for returning to Staples car park within two hours of being first spotted by their parking attendent.

I appealed, attaching copies of the receipts from the transactions from Staples timed at almost two hours apart on the basis that I hadn't realised the restriction was in force, small print on the signs blah blah. They wrote back saying tough, pay up. Which I did, in the form of a cheque for £40.

Only thing was, I was away on hol in Devon/Somerset (festival then camping) when the 'tough, pay up' letter arrived. I sent the cheque off on my return, but apparently the time for paying £40 had elapsed and they now wanted £100.

I wrote back saying I was away on hol, be grateful for your £40, I sent it as soon as I could. They wrote back saying send us your airline tickets and we'll think about it. I wrote back saying I was on hol in the UK and didn't realise that I should have postponed my holiday whilst ever there was an outstanding appeal to Excel Parking Services.

They wrote back saying send us an extra £60 immediately or we'll take you to court and want a further £50 in solicitors' fees and £30 in court fees.

I wrote back saying fine, see you in court, you've already had more than enough from me considering the 'crime' I committed: provably, what I did was to make two trips to Staples within two hours. It's not like I was hogging a parking space for hours. £40 seems like punishment enough for failing to read the small print on those little signs.

So, where we're at now is that they pester me with Final Demands and talk of Debt Collecting Agencies and Court Procedures. Water off a duck's back, I'll see them in court np if they can really be bothered to take it that far.

Anyone else had dealings with them?

SHShef, I take it you won't be using Staples any more as a result of this incident? And I assume you've written to their manager and head office to tell them why?

If you go twice in one day you must be a loyal customer. :|

D'you know, I did think of doing that. I kinda didn't bother 'cos I figured that a) it would blow over quickly (wrong) and b) they'd say it's nothing to do with them, the car park is under separate management and only outside their store by co-incidence.

Fact remains, I DID transgress the parking regulations, albeit unwittingly.

If it drags on tho, I may well follow your advice, Andy. It's getting boring now, I must have had ten letters from Excel and they're obviously not giving up. I figure that the person who sends me the letters is on commission (yes, seriously) and if pestering people mercilessly results in a cheque for £60 plopping on their mat every now and again, then it's a hounding that's worthwhile.

Time will tell what they're intending to do next. I did mention in one of my letters that if they persist in hounding me I'd take the matter up with the local press, my MP, my local councillor and anyone else (relevant or not) who I could think of.

£100 for being away on holiday when the letter arrives to say that the (very reasonable, in my opinion) appeal has been declined is rather steep. Not to say verging on extortionate.

Well I got lots of letters from different debt collection agencies telling me I must pay up or else.... Or else what? I ignored them all and was advised by my solicitor to only deal with Excell as it had nothing to do with any of the debt collection agencies. They have no powers unless excell have taken me to court and wone.
They just passed me on to the next agency giving me empty threats. Eventually I recieved a letter from the agency saying that I would be passed on to Excell again for them to get the money out of me. That was about six months ago now and I've heard nothing from them.
I think they've finally seen sence and have realised that they don't have a leg to stand on if it goes to court.

Don't give in to their empty threats.

Stu

Ahah. That's interesting, and what I suspected, thank you Stu.

I don't expect them to pursue this properly (ie, thru the courts) because I suspect they're on shaky ground and they must think so too, 'else they'd have already started proceedings.

I have no intention in giving in, but I bet a lot do just to shut them up.

Cheers!

:thumbsup:

My pleasure SHsheff

I'm sure a lot of folk get scared when they receive a threatening letter from any debt collection agency, and like you say, they just give in to the empty threats.
I'd just like to point out that the debt collectors only have power if you have already been taken to court and lost the case. In my own case I was happy for excell to take me to court as the odds were stacked in my favour as it's up to them to prove I was in the wrong. My word against theirs.
You can probably get free legal advice through your house insurance. It might be worth giving them a call for your own piece of mind.

Keep up the fight

Stu

I can remember reading or seeing something somewhere once (possibly Watchdog) saying that if you are fined for parking on private land (in a car park) the owners of the land have to prove that they suffered a loss by you parking there longer than the allocated time.

If this is indeed the case, if there were other parking spaces available at the time, then they haven't suffered a loss because prospective "customers" (yes I realise we're talking about free car parks) could still park.

Like I said, not sure of the details and legal advice is really your only option if they try to pursue the claim.

I'd also be interested if anyone could clarify the above. Am I correct or have I made it up in my head? :)

Hi everyone
In regard to Excel parking I dont come from Sheffield, but I parked on a car park in Stockport last June 2005 I parked in a disabled place although I had no blue badge I am still disabled and needed to get a motorised scooter out of my car, the parking space was marked disabled but was a good distance away from the shops I paid and displayed a ticket.
On returning to my car i noticed the ticket and as soon as i got home I emailed excel to tell them my story, I got only an email back telling me they had received my email and they would contact me!!!
Today 13/06/06I received a letter telling me to pay £40 before 21st if i dont it will go up to £100 and then to court.
I am blinking disgusted A WHOLE YEAR to sent a letter that according to them they didnt know they had untill they did their audit !!!

I am happy to fight this I know I shouldnt have parked on disable space but 1. it was miles from the shop 2. I am disabled 3. I paid and displayed......
ok what do you all think I should do, remeber we are talking about this happening a YEAR ago this is their first contact with me......
Daisy
xx

"Parking Charge Notices" from private car park operators
by Murdo Maguire — last modified 2007-01-12 14:28
I recently parked in the private "shoppers"car park of a well known chain store on the King's Road in London making a substantial number of purchases which are shown on my store card statement with them. On returning to my car an official looking document marked "Parking Charge Notice" had been affixed to my windscreen. The ticket stated that parking was only allowed for one hour and a penalty parking charge of £100 was now due. As a gesture of goodwill this would be reduced to £40 if I paid the parking company concerned within 14 days. My neighbour said this might be a scam but I called customer services at the store and they said it was genuine. I don't want to be prosecuted. Can you advise what I should do?
Official parking tickets can only be issued by the police, traffic wardens and local authority parking attendants. The police and traffic wardens issue Fixed Penalty Notices (FPNs) which can be enforced through the criminal justice system while local authority parking attendants can issue Penalty Charge Notices (PCNs) which are enforced through the civil courts.
Your official looking Parking Charge Notices (which sometimes appear as Penalty Control Notices) are unknown to British law and appear to be an attempt by parking companies to pass off as the similarly named council issued Penalty Charge Notices.
Depending on the wording they may be illegal and should always be challenged. The company concerned is usually hoping for easy money if sufficient numbers will be gulled into paying up. Their recourse to law would be in bringing a civil action for trespass and their so-called Parking Charge Notice is a dubious attempt to persuade you to accept an invitation to settle out of court.
You should challenge them on the basis that the signage warning of the offence was wholly insufficient and you were not adequately warned of the penalty. Given that few (if any) companies will send a representative on the off chance of winning such a case that should be the last you should hear from them.
In your particular case I would also suggest sending a copy of the correspondence along with a copy of your store card statement and a covering letter explaining what happened to the store manager and complaining in the strongest terms. You should receive a favourable reply. Private parking arrangements and enforcement are an attempt by stores to limit rogue parking by people going elsewhere and are not designed by stores to impede genuine shoppers such as yourself.

I received a parking charge notice from Excel Parking for allegedly over-staying at Stadium Retail Park, Wembley, Middx. I use this car park occasionally but do not have recollection of the specific date. O have now received 'Notice of Intended Legal Action' from Graham White solicitors for settlement of £130 within 7 days or else the POSSIBILITY of court action. Should I pay up?
This Graham White Solicitors are unconnected with the company that the Law Society have registered. Instead the name is a front for Roxburghe Debt Collectors and they should not be using it. The Graham White concerned l was an employee of Hackney Council who seems to have licensed his name to them to use which is a breach of Law Society regulations and he has now been removed from the Law Society register.
The "charge" is alleged under contract law and you have committed no offence. What you have is an "invoice" from a private parking company who allege you have breached their terms and conditions by parking and/or overstaying on one of the sites they manage. It has no status in law.
The reality is that they will almost certainly not be able to enforce against you and will not seek to do so. Instead they will use debt collectors who will endlessly threaten imminent litigation, references to credit agencies, personal visits, bailiffs and the sky falling on your head.
In fact they can only enforce it in law by bringing litigation in a civil court against the driver and proving a breach of prominently displayed terms and conditions. You have no responsibility to tell them who was driving (even if it was you).

i used to work at cars and trust me they will say anything to you to get you to pay these so called debts all i advise is that you let them they will threat all sort of things however i can tell you that these process are for only a few of the clients they work on behalf of and unless u signed an agreement with the car park you have nothing to worry about x

The advice is simple.......

IGNORE!!

you will recieve a few letters in the post,some even a different colour,but they al amount to the same,bluff and bluster.After a few letters they WILL go away.
Do not contact them and make yourself a 'hooked fish'.

Ignore!!!

They have NO legal basis at all.

Maybe the way to beat the credit crunch is to put letters on windscreens asking for money,but then you wouldnt pay me would you? So dont pay them either.
Ignore!
go to www.pepipoo.com for further free info on these jokers.

I had the same problem about three years ago - I apparently overstayed by 3 minutes! I argued on the basis that it was in fact only one hour - they stated the one hour included entering the car park and not from parking your vehicle up and they refused my appeal. I ignored them after that and after a few letters, which got bolder and brighter in colour they gave up!

Hi there! Picking the thread up again ;) I've received aparking ticket from Excel as well for staying too long at the Staples carpark. I have to admit that I did stay a bit longer, but £60!! It's just too much!

From all your post it seems that you should just ignore all the letters. I've scanned lots of other forums and all seem to agree: ignore and you'll win!! Any of you actually taken to court? Does anyone know of anybody being taken to court? I wouldn't stand a chance in court as I did stay longer than 1 hour. But then, the sign was very high and not easy to read for somebody shorter than 3ft.

You're under 3ft tall :confused: :confused:

haha, typo: I meant 13 ;)

Under 13ft tall? I suppose most of us are...

Have a look at this

http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/news/scottish-news/2008/10/26/law-expert-tickets-from-private-parking-wardens-can-be-binned-78057-20839989/

In particular

"But one lawyer claim ticketed drivers may have no obligation to stump up.

Graham Walker, a Glasgow-based road traffic law specialist, said: "I frequently get calls from people who have been stung by what I would call a parking scam.

"I don't think a sheriff would uphold this as a proper debt should they try to sue recovery of it. I'd put these notices in the bin and defend any small claims action."

The statements are made with Scottish law in mind (which differs slightly from english law) but the principal in England should be very much the same

Also have a look at this

http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/OAP-92-car-clamp-fury.4634702.jp

Which maybe goes someway to explaining how Excel are No. 61 in the Top 100 companies listed by Pre-Tax Profit according to the Star - pre-tax profits of £611,000 in 2007

http://editorial.jpress.co.uk/4206383/STB-14-11-07-006-E001.pdf