ok - go easy on me guys (and gals) ;)

I had to run in and run out on this one, and didn't have more than a couple of mins with each subject, and they were for the most part awful fidgets, and the lady supervising them is used to a different photographer's methods....

... My equipment was a Nokia N73, settings 'sport' and 'multi-shot' - unzoomed, just cropped later for tidying. No photoshopping

Any tips from anybody which I could implement on a similarly time-squeezed session in the near future?

Strix's photo shoot! (http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e393/SFStrix/RainRescue%20Dogs/)

Click the images for a description (if you want any background info)

:confused: A lot of these aren't sharp. Since the background IS sharp you're either focussed on the back wall or the shutter speed is too slow to catch the dog/cat moving. The perspective looks very wide-angle so I'd guess you're in close - maybe too close to focus. You need to get further back and zoom in. Focus on the beast not the back wall and make sure you're using a fast enough shutter speed to catch the action.

My tip would be to use a camera next time!

^^^ what he said

Also, some of the Dogs look like Cats. Definitely something up with the camera :P

Thanks guys :)

My canon A30 camera doesn't have a sport setting, so the N73 was the better choice in that respect (though my next purchase is going to have to be suitable for taking dog snaps :D ), and you're very right - you can't get enough distance away from many of the dogs when you have your back against a kennel grille!

I've had to compensate for some very bouncy dogs by taking shots from a greater distance away, then doing some severe crops to remove the resultant excess background, but this also gives me a reduction in picture quality doesn't it?

Do you think I should put it in to Nokia for repair then Grissom? ;)

The Nokia is fine, just maybe not best suited to the situation/task :)

You could ask the photo group if someone would be willing help out, in fact I have offered to help out before but wasn't taken up on the offer.

It's not easy, shooting dogs in kennels - I did it for a website project last year and while the dogs at least were in focus I wasn't wild about the results. Best thing is to get them to play some sort of game with the kennel staff and shoot as many as poss with a shutter speed that's fast enough to catch them.

If the kennel space is small and you can't get far enough back you might be better trying to shoot them in the exercise yard/field/whatever rather than in the kennel itself.

Indeed, my preferred way of shooting dogs (never quite feels right saying 'shooting dogs'!) is to take them to a park and play with a ball or something.

Gets much nicer pictures of the dog being itself. :thumbsup:

Much more fun than people pics :)

Much more fun than people pics :)

Hmm - depends who the people are and whether or not they're wearing any more clothes than the dogs! :D

Hmm - depends who the people are and whether or not they're wearing any more clothes than the dogs! :D

I'll stick to enjoying other people's photos of such loverlies :)

Thanks guys :)My canon A30 camera doesn't have a sport setting, so the N73 was the better choice in that respect
You certainly do not need a sport setting. And as the A30 has manual [very unusual for compacts], that's way better than auto exposure for this sort of thing. Manual isn't tricky either esp. with digital. You will definitely get better results with the A30 than any phone camera. You just need to have a play with camera.

basically the sport feature gives a faster shutter speed, as dogs often don't sit still, and move pretty rapidly

I've taken lots of very smudged looking shots with the A30 :(

Unfortunately, the Spring Street kennels don't have exercise space at all :(

Dafoot - it really is a stressful environment, so we try to be careful who we put in that situation - but thanks for the offer :)

basically the sport feature gives a faster shutter speed, as dogs often don't sit still, and move pretty rapidly

I've taken lots of very smudged looking shots with the A30 :(

The sports feature does not give you a faster shutter speed than you can use on manual. It's just that it biases auto exposure to higher shutter speeds. You simply set a high shutter speed using manual and then choose an aperture to give correct exposure. Very simply and in fact more likely to give correct exposure than auto with a moving subject.

If you get stumped I can always show you sometime.

thanks jezzy :)

I've just double checked, and I can only adjust 'exposure compensation', 'white balance', 'colour tone' & 'light sensitivity' manually on the N73

On the A30... hmm, set to 'M' for manual and is it ISO setting that I alter? How does the ISO thing work? :confused: Do I want a high or a low number?

A higher ISO setting makes the camera more sensitive to light but usually at the expense of picture quality - at very high settings you get 'noise' - speckles in the dark areas.

ISO works together with shutter speed and aperture to control exposure. If you set say ISO 400 and get a correct exposure at F8 and 1/125 sec then moving the shutter speed to 1/250 will give you a darker picture. You can compensate for that by opening the aperture to F5.6. These changes are referred to as 'stops' (for historical reasons) and each stop halves or doubles the amount of light reaching the sensor (or film). Doubling or halving the shutter speed is one stop, opening the aperture from F8 to F5.6 is one stop. Apertures are effectively an area and go in a square law series like: 1.0, 1.4, 2.0, 2.8, 4.0, 5.6, 8.0, 11, 16, 22, 32.... each stop is root 2 times the last and lets thru half as much light as the previous. Low numbers let thru more light, high numbers 'stop the lens down' and let thru less light. Doubling or halving the ISO rating has the same effect as shutter speed.

So.,.. if you have problems with movement then go for a high ISO setting - maybe 800 or 1600, a fast shutter speed - 1/250 or 1/500 and set the aperture to give the correct exposure. If you can't get the exposure correct then you'll have to slow the shutter speed or increase the ISO until you can get correct exposure at the maximum aperture (minimum F number) the camera has.

It's a bit complex at first but basically you have three things all working to set the exposure tho having different side effects.

To add to Imp's explanation, when I try to explain it to people I try to use the 'fire triangle'. You know the one with heat, fuel and oxygen on each side showing how if you have all three you get fire.

Replace the labels with ISO, aperture and shutter speed. That seems to help some people understand the relationship.

To add to Imp's explanation, when I try to explain it to people I try to use the 'fire triangle'. You know the one with heat, fuel and oxygen on each side showing how if you have all three you get fire.

Replace the labels with ISO, aperture and shutter speed. That seems to help some people understand the relationship.

Aperture = Quantity of Light
Shutter Speed = Duration of Light

Here is a link to the triangle idea.
http://www.miketurner-photography.co.uk/take_better_pictures.htm
It can be very complicated initially,but soon becomes almost 2nd nature.
A simple free programme called irfan view will give you all the info on each shot so that comparisons of different settings can be shown.

I've just double checked, and I can only adjust 'exposure compensation', 'white balance', 'colour tone' & 'light sensitivity' manually on the N73That's why you should use the Canon. :D

On the A30... hmm, set to 'M' for manual and is it ISO setting that I alter? How does the ISO thing work? :confused: Do I want a high or a low number?
ISO has nothing to do with Manual, Sports Setting, Portrait setting etc. It simply controls how sensitive the film or nowadays the sensor is.
So if it's dark or indoors you will need a larger ISO than when it is very sunny. The larger the ISO the poorer the quality as the Imp pointed out, but and this is a big but, you may get a more grainy pic with a high ISO but it may well be much sharper/more in focus and that is normally far more important.

Shutter speed controls sharpness, fast shuter speed, sharper pic, low shutter speed, more blurred/shakey pic.
1/500th is fast, 1/20th is slow and 1/4 is very slow.

Aperture controls how much is in focus. So a large Aperture like F2.8 has less in focus than the smaller f8 Though with a compact cameras/phones, the amount in focus is usually very large anyway, so less of an issue. So you can get away with larger apertures most of the time.


I'd actually say it wasn't very complicated to understand, I can normally show someone the basics of photography/using a camera manually in 5-10mins. It sounds much fiddlier when written down.

To underline what the Imp said, set a fastish shutter speed 1/250th-1/500th etc and then set an aperture that makes image look good on screen.
If even at the widest aperture [say f2.8/f4] image is still dark, then increase the ISO to a larger no. until picture looks good.

ok - so I can seen the set up on the display tells me an f value - so I'm assuming there is somewhere can alter this - though I've not found where yet :(

I've found something called 'exposure' which displays in the 1/xxx format - is that what I need to alter?

This group's great! thanks guys :)

....I've found something called 'exposure' which displays in the 1/xxx format - is that what I need to alter?...
That will be the shutter speed.

If you look at this shot of your camera display
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/A30/ZMANUAL_01.JPG

1/20 th is shutter speed and a quite slow one
F2.8 is the Aperture and a fast one, so focus more carefully
ISO50 is the sensitivity and quite low, but best quality
The 's' in a quartercircle is the the highest quality saving of the file and
'L' is the largest file size, You should always shoot at Suoerfine and Large for best quality. You can easily make it smaller for web afterwards,but if you have a nice shot, you cannot make it bigger so easily later. You alter file sizes/quality in settings.

The flower means you can take close ups, but not long distance, the bulb graphic,means the colour seting is for indoors, you should have it set to AWB [auto white balance] and let camera decide what's best.
And the bolt of lightning crossed out means flash is off.
Hope this helps.

Note - In Manual capture mode, you can set the shutter speed and aperture settings independently of each other. (Although there's only two options for the aperture, f/2.8 and f/8.0.) The LCD monitor reflects approximately what the exposure will look like, giving you a pretty good idea of the result of your settings.
So f2.8 is what you 'll probably need indoors

thanks guys :)

I think I need a sit down and tinker tomorrow morning

Just trying to find out if my services are required this week or not

Unfortunately my 'model' has just had a very busy weekend trotting round greeting all the kids he could find at Albert Dock, and bombing round the beach snuffling seaweed and bunnies, so I'm not sure how much movement I'll get out of him for a practice :hihi:

hmmm, what's the difference between the M setting and the P setting?

I've just run out a full set of batteries faffing with settings but haven't yet got something which isn't fuzzy :(

multishot isn't working with the flash on, so with it off, and in room light it's coming out bleugh

I'll try again in daylight I think :? (when the batteries have recharged :suspect: )

M is manual - you set both shutter speed and aperture yourself, and P is program - the camera sets both for you. (P is also known as 'Professional' mode :hihi:)

I've found my instruction book - but I think it's still going to be a case of playing about until I find a useable setting :?

I only get the choice of two set apertures 2.8 or 8 I think - and 8 was displaying as WAY too dark

... I only get the choice of two set apertures 2.8 or 8 I think - and 8 was displaying as WAY too dark

F2.8 is the way to go - it will allow you to use faster shutter speeds. Do you know what sort of shutter speeds and ISO ratings you can achieve?

ISO only goes to 400 200 100 50

I think this is the shutter speed: 1/1500 to 15"

So far I'm finding most of my pics a bit grainier than I'd like - but it's a dull day so don't quite know what to do about that :(

flash won't work on multishot, and I've got the light options set to automatic rather than selecting cloudy

Set the ISO to 400 and if you have an aperture priority mode (probably labelled 'A') try that with the aperture set to F2.8. That will give you the fastest shutter speed the camera can manage in the light conditions.

If you don't have an 'A' mode use manual, again set ISO400, F2.8 and then twiddle the shutter speed till you get correct exposure.

If your shutter speed gets to 1/250 or faster you might try knocking the ISO down to 200 as that will improve the image quality (less grain/noise).

If you're really struggling you can sometimes get away with underexposing by 1 stop and then lightening the image in Photoshop or whatever, but you'll get a little bit more image degradation by doing that.

If you don't have an 'A' mode use manual, again set ISO400, F2.8 and then twiddle the shutter speed till you get correct exposure. oh cool - that's what I was doing :thumbsup:


If your shutter speed gets to 1/250 or faster you might try knocking the ISO down to 200 as that will improve the image quality (less grain/noise)Ahhh - looks like that may have been where I was going wrong ;)

Thanks again :)