Well I’ve had my rescue dog for 3 ½ months now. He’s fab in everyway apart from his dog aggression. I’m taking advice from a behaviourist/ trainer I have been training him in a set way to stop him going bonkers at other dogs. We are doing pretty well apart from I’m getting very disheartened with other dog owners and if I'll ever have a dog that is calm around other dogs.

I had him (a months work) so that he would walk on lead past another dogs (on leads) and sheep and ignore them, then this last week I’ve had three occasions when other dog owners just allow their dog to run at him (One was not the owners fault as the dog was deaf) Each time this happens it takes me right back to square one as he is unable to cope with dogs running at him and reverts back to his old behaviour which he then does next time he sees a dog. I think, he’s actually scared of other dogs and so attacks them before they can get him but being a large dog he can do a lot of damage. I’ve had to muzzle him for other dogs safety.

Now if I saw a dog on lead and with a muzzle on I would not be allowing my dog to run at it and the owner, I’m sure that’s common sense? I need to be around dogs so he sees them and gets used to them but I stay at distance from them so they are not tempted to run up.

Fingers crossed I’ll get there eventually. If not he’s going to have quite a boring life, muzzled and on lead for the next 10+ years. It’s just so disheartening, Is there anyone that has managed to crack this problem?

I do feel for you, having to cope with some of the idiot dog owners out there. When I had Staffies, I always put them on their leads if another dog was coming near them, because I knew they might not take too kindly to being sniffed and pawed at by other dogs.

The number of morons who saw us grab the dogs and stick them on their leads and just called out, "It's OK, he's friendly", was astounding.

I can't think of any advice to offer you, really, except for have you tried yours with a DAP collar?? They give out pheronomes which help the dog to calm down. I was very sceptical, but got a collar and a diffuser in desperation because my dog got so upset at the noise around bonfire night. To my surprise, they really did help, she didn't get nearly as stressed and it didn't last for nearly as long. She didn't panic and try and get under the sofa or chair and wasn't sitting panting for hours.

The cheapest I've found is PetMeds (http://www.petmeds.co.uk/nsearch.aspx?keywords=dap) (recommended by RainRescue), the price includes VAT and normal postal delivery.

I can't think of any advice to offer you, really, except for have you tried yours with a DAP collar?? They give out pheronomes which help the dog to calm down. I was very sceptical, but got a collar and a diffuser in desperation because my dog got so upset at the noise around bonfire night. To my surprise, they really did help, she didn't get nearly as stressed and it didn't last for nearly as long. She didn't panic and try and get under the sofa or chair and wasn't sitting panting for hours.

The cheapest I've found is PetMeds (http://www.petmeds.co.uk/nsearch.aspx?keywords=dap) (recommended by RainRescue), the price includes VAT and normal postal delivery.
How long does the dap collar last? and does it take a refill?

How long does the dap collar last? and does it take a refill?

The collar lasts about 4 weeks, and is impregnated so not refillable. The diffuser does take a refill, though, and they last 4 weeks as well.

It would work out very expensive if your dog needed one all the time, but they're great to help with short-term problems, ie: bonfire night noise, or just to help change behaviour.

I know they don't work for all dogs, because a friend of mine got a diffuser and it had no effect whatsoever on her dog.

Evei some people are just so ignorant where dogs are concerned, I have a few dogs myself :rolleyes: and its amazing how people let their dogs run up to my dogs when onlead shouting its ok he/she is friendly, well I'm sorry but several onlead dogs are a pack and they don't always enjoy being bounced into in that way.
When my dogs are offlead they are a lot better but even then I put them on the lead if an approaching dog is onlead... its really only polite.
God knows how they think its ok when they can see you being dragged about trying to control the situation that they created, I really do know how you feel :mad:

The collar lasts about 4 weeks, and is impregnated so not refillable. The diffuser does take a refill, though, and they last 4 weeks as well.

It would work out very expensive if your dog needed one all the time, but they're great to help with short-term problems, ie: bonfire night noise, or just to help change behaviour.

I know they don't work for all dogs, because a friend of mine got a diffuser and it had no effect whatsoever on her dog.

Thank you Dozey, I have been considering getting a diffuser for when I go out, the trouble is my dogs are rarely left alone, the older ones are as good as gold, so is the young puppy, but Kira my 8 month old is very reactive and destructive when I leave her alone...even though she is with the pup and they adore each other.
I went out for 2 and a half hours today to find poo and a shredded duvet, wee in the plastic bed and God knows how or why but wee in the food bowl.
Gawd that Kira will be the death of me yet :rolleyes:

Thanks for replies. I will have a look at the Dap collars, though he's that laid back when there is no dogs around he's almost asleep so I'm not sure if it they would be the answer, though I'm willing to give anything a shot!

tbh all the staffie owners I've come across have been great with controlling thier dog, it's the collie/ small terriers types that I'm having the most problems with! It's as though they have the attitude; it's a small dog it, can't do any damage to that big dog over there, but I'd be mortified if he bit them and no doubt I'd be the one who gets a ear bashing.

Thank you Dozey, I have been considering getting a diffuser for when I go out, the trouble is my dogs are rarely left alone, the older ones are as good as gold, so is the young puppy, but Kira my 8 month old is very reactive and destructive when I leave her alone...even though she is with the pup and they adore each other.
I went out for 2 and a half hours today to find poo and a shredded duvet, wee in the plastic bed and God knows how or why but wee in the food bowl.
Gawd that Kira will be the death of me yet :rolleyes:

How awful for you! Hopefully, it will be an age thing and she'll grow out of it, though a DAP collar may help for now!

The shredded duvet reminds of the most spectacular chew performed by the Staffie dog (we won't mention the shoes, watches, clock and three piece suite he demolished whilst teething).

We'd brought some shopping in and then got distracted chatting to the neighbours and went in for a cuppa, forgetting we'd left some stuff in chewing range.

When we got back, he'd chewed up a packet of 24 sanitary towels - the old fashioned kind, made with cotton wool! He'd tossed the chewed bits everywhere and the room looked like an amateur attempt at a Christmas grotto!! We didn't know whether to laugh or cry and certainly couldn't manage to muster up enough sternness to tell him off, it looked so funny :hihi:

PS I should have said the diffusers have to be plugged in to work, so I would assume you could just plug one in when you needed to, ie: just for the day you're going out, and then unplug it and put it away for the next time.

lol, thats a good chew and fast work!

My dog has a thing for bra's and socks I think he's telling me I need to put them on a hotter wash as he nicks them off the washing line :)

My Meg was a spectacular chewer as a young dog (she is over 14 now bless her) she has gone through at least three 3 piece suites a bit at a time, she has eaten a mattress, shoes galore, incalculable socks and pants...I came to the point where I used to actually re-stuff the chair or what ever it was and sew it up to make it last for longer :hihi:
The 2 most memorable things that she did was ...once I forgot and left a bag of compressed hay in the kitchen, well when I got home it was like walking into a barn, the hay filled the kitchen up to my knees, I just stood there for ages like this :o
The second thing that stands out was the time I had a brand new stair carpet fitted, it looked brilliant and I was really proud, the fitter went and I needed something from the shop, I was gone about 20 mins, came back and Meg had opened the door (she was the only one who did that) and got stuck into the new carpet, chewing a huge patch out...I patched it and it never looked nowhere near as good :sad:
2 Years ago she ate £30 from the pc table, how I have lived with her for 14 years I will never know :rolleyes:

We've had so many bad experiences with dogs attacking Ailsa we prefer to walk her where it's quiet - took her to Abbey Woods last weekend and this afternoon we've been in the woods at the back of Whirlow Park. She can run and play with her ball there and we dont have lots of unruly dogs annoying her- if we do see one over in the distance, we call her back and put her on the lead (because she is wary of other dogs now and occasionally tries to get the first nip if one comes too close). There are a very few dogs she feels comfortable being close to, but we dont get to see those too often

We don't have chewing problems thankfully- but the KONG is a great chew toy that you can fill with treats, cheese or peanut butter and that always kept her occupied- now, we don't need to use it but it was a life saver when she first came along

Havent had cause to use the DAP plug in but have had the feline equivalent and found one of the cheapest suppliers was www.nutrecare.com

Kongs are brilliant, my dog loves them. I have two so I can freeze one, so they last him a little longer. I normally fill it with a mixture of tuna, cheese spread (or pate), dog meat + biscuits/ kibble and occasionally a little peanut butter or scrambled egg.

Anyone got any other suggestions? Finding the right consistency is quite tough as it has to be sticky enough to make it an effort but not too stuffed! My dog tends to lick the contents out rather then chew it though, shame he does'nt have that approach with other dogs!

Molly's dream Kong has chopped up bits of dried black pudding and cubes of cheese with cream cheese to glue it all together. It took us a while to get it to the right stickiness but we think we're there now- it takes her a whole evening to get the contents out.

I know how you feel with the aggression and anxiety with other dogs Evei. Mol is wonderful with people big and small and the gentlest dog you could ever wish with tiny kittens, even when they scratch her face and she sits and cries to have their claws removed from her tear ducts. However, she gets really anxious with other dogs- the bigger and blacker the dog, the worse the anxiety, barking and anxiety based aggressive body language. We've got her as far as when we see other dogs we put her on the lead and walk her a few feet away from the path if we're going to pass directly then coaching her to sit calmly whilst they pass.

It's not ideal (in an ideal world she'd be able to walk up to other dogs with a waggy tail and say hello to them all) but then again I'm not responsible for her first year and there's nothing I can do to turn back time and go and change whatever happened to her in that time.

Molly sounds like a great big softie, I had'nt thought about black pudding though I know he likes it, so I'll give that a try.

I'm still pretty wary of my dog around little people though he walks past them fine I don't know whats in his past (he's 2 this month) so will stay wary I think! Better to be safe than sorry. Given the opportunity I think he would chase a cat but ignores them when told to.

To be honest he is doing really well, at the kennels he was wetting himself, backing up then throwing himself at the bars of the kennel at people when they walked past. Once we got him outside he was a big softy and is extremely well behaved. He'd been at the kennels for 4 months, the way he acted it was no wonder he stayed there for so long! I've never seen him revert back to anything like that behavour in the time I've had him. It's so sad really, he was a hand over case with another female dog he'd apparently lived with!

What kind of dog is yours Evei?

4 Months in the kennels is a long time, I think that it does "scar" some dogs they just cannot deal with all of the noise etc and become very defensive with other dogs.

I got Kira from the kennels and its taken several months of hard work to stop her barking (mostly stop her) at other dogs, and she was only 10-12 weeks and only been in there a week, they definitely do learn to bark in there, not wanting to put anyone off though not all react like that.

Molly has doggy friends that she loves to bits and who think she's the bee's knees too (as can be seen in this (http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=337296) thread) but that doesn't take away from the fact that new dogs are incredibly stressful to her.

I work on the principle of baby steps. Every walk that we have where I successfully predict when we're going to meet another dog and thereby prevent her from getting stressed by gently moving her from the situation is a good one and one that will hopefully lead to her not getting worked up in the first place.

I really wouldn't like to have to put her in a muzzle because it is likely to make her look even more scary than most people already think she is- German Shepherds seem to be the epitome of what 'scary dogs' look like to many people. She loves being able to get a fuss off people while we're out and it would be a real shame to stop her playing with her ball too. I would if I genuinely felt that I needed to, but I'd prefer to just have her under close enough control that I can put her back on a lead in good time when meeting other dogs.

He's a heinz, the vet reckons he is a mastiff/ lab/ tan collie cross with maybe some greyhound?!. Some people think he has staffy in him as he is quite sturdy, I haven't a clue but he's lovely! I think both of his parents must have been mixed too.

He's about the size of a male golden retreiver (28Kg) but short haired with rough medium hair around his neck and a big pink nose and pink paws (though they are pretty black now hes had lots of decent walks!) He's not a barky dog anymore- he was for the nights of the first month though!

I love GS they are beautiful dogs, only ever met realy well behaved ones!

How long does the dap collar last? and does it take a refill?


They last for up to 4 weeks and we couldn't get a refil when it ran out and had to buy a new collar

hi evei where are you based? i would be happy to help by walking with you even if its just passing to then eventually walking side by side nd msaye that would help him.

I know how you feel Evei, honestly I do! Eddy's not good with other dogs (sometimes he's fine other times he's not) and due to being a bit deaf tends to get kept onlead which makes him even worse!

If I see dogs approaching that are on leads, I will call Takara to me and if she isn't giving me the focus/attention I want then she goes on the lead so that she doesn't get the chance to run upto the other dog. To be fair though, she tends to avoid most dogs anyway!

I keep Eddy on the lead and when we see a dog, I get a treat ready, distract him, praise him as we go past and reward him for quiet. Unless, that is, the other owner lets their dog run right upto Eddy's face to sniff the treat I have next to his nose to distract him! I can understand it's difficult because I have treats but that's the only way I can distract my dog from situations he finds aversive.
They just laugh and say 'oh he's after the treat' or something similar... I wonder whether they'd still be laughing if Eddy took their dog's face off?? (He doesn't bite, btw, he just makes a lot of noise but as it's off putting to owners when they don't know my dog's intentions I don't let it happen).

I've had loads of dogs run straight upto Eddy and the owners say 'oh he's ok, he's friendly' I've said before 'yeah but he's not!!'. I wonder why sometimes they think I would be letting Takara say hello and not Eddy if I thought it was their dog that was the problem?! :huh:

Keep going hun, I made loads of progress with Eddy before he was attacked which set him back and then recently, just as Takara was getting comfortable with dogs onlead she was attacked whilst on the lead so now I have to start all over again with her. It's just part of having a dog and at least it reminds us how much we must love them!

Oh my sympathies, Josh is a pain. We have made some good progress, normally at home we pass two homes with dogs that come to the gate going bonkers and we can negotiate past them, he now looks to me if he had been good and asks for his titbit so I know he understands the behaviour I am asking of him.
However he is not 100% reliable, sometimes we can walk past dogs (he is on a lead obviously) and he doesnt turn a hair, but sometimes he will start with the tailraising prancing attitude, I can normally revert this back to good walking practice unless the other dog runs towards us, then its a case of controling the situation and hoping he is not going to go full on like he used to.

Like your dog he is very laid back to live with, welcomes visitors to the home, he loves people talking to him and fussing him when he is out, but he just hates them there dogs!
Mostly I choose quiet walks during the week where I know I can let him off for a bit safely and I wont meet too many other dog walkers but at weekends we go to Skeg as we have a caravan and he just has to behave when walking on the front,and meeting all manner of other dogs and some idiot owners- its a real challenge to say the least. But we are getting there, is his much better than he was. I think it is fear with him also but you would not think that if you saw him go! I think he has very few canine social skills, plenty of human interaction skills but how do you get a big gsd dog socialised, especially one with these tendancies.

I have come to the conclusion that it will never be cured just managed and there will sometimes be slip ups.

evie - I've read some of your threads from when you first got your dog, and he really sounds like he's a handful. It sounds like you're having the same troubles as Hunny's owners (a ridgeback cross I fostered a while ago)

It sounds like you're making good progress, and the only thing I can add is that you probably need to look at other situations besides those where you can see the problem (confusing, I know)

I recently fostered a little black dog who had the same problems as you're describing, and who's owner had resorted to muzzling him, then not as he couldn't defend himself from other dogs...

This little black dog seems to be about 90% Manchester Terrier, so already you're battling against his breeding trying to make him friendly with other dogs, which is why it's quite important to identify as much of your own dog's breeding as possible. Do you have any pics we can look at? Only when Hunny was rescued she was listed as a collie cross, and the vet thought she was too, but to anybody who's familiar with Rhodesian Ridgebacks can spot her as a cross immediately! We may be able to pick out other breeds for you which may have been overlooked previously

Anyway - going back to this Manc Terrier cross... He's a bossy little soul who's pretty much written his own rules at home, which was fine in the house, but when out walking he was a complete nightmare! When he came to stay here, he learned that dogs don't make rules in Strix's house! He learned to sit and wait for people to go through doors first, sit and wait for permission to eat dinner, and never to walk in front on walks. He wasn't allowed on the sofa (or upstairs for that matter), and was crated at night

You're probably thinking I'm off on another planet here, but once this dog had got used to looking to people for his cues for how to deal with situations indoors, he automatically became much easier to deal with outdoors! Okay, so he's never going to be the friendliest dog on the block, and he does forget himself sometimes, but at least now he's used to taking commands it's easy to regain control of him when he does forget himself

When he went back to his owner (with a few instructions and a bit of prompting during a visit) he's been easier to handle, as his owner now knows how to show him she's always in charge of him, and not the other way round as it was before ;)

What Stix has written makes so much sense,so many dogs dont have rules at home and I think they are the ones who end up in rescues more often than not.
Just one question Strix, how do you keep your hound from walking in front, Josh is pretty good now but still walks in front, not pulling though (bonus) I can get him to walk beside me but its a constant battle, are there any handy tips please!

the tried and tested method will drive both you and your dog nuts, but it works!

basically, whenever your dog gets in front, turn on your heel and walk in the opposite direction so they're already behind you! They'll immediately storm off in front again, but you turn again

it won't take your dog long before they stop and look to you to decide where they need to be!

Contraptions such as head collars or half checks are best if you're going down the restraint route, harnesses naturally giving your dog a head start on you before you've even set off. Hold the lead handle in one hand and control the lead by holding the middle of it in your other hand and to your hip (pretty much). You shouldn't need to drag your dog back, just a twist of the wrist should apply enough force to reinforce the command 'back'

However, if Josh is walking in front of you and he's a GSD, he's probably guarding you in some way, so you may need to assess other aspects of your relationship/interaction with him, and do remember that his breed will dictate that he guards, so your current walking arrangements may be as good as you can hope for ;)

I have a beagle who walks off lead (contrary all the advice in beagle books!), and I have to settle for constant vocal reminders to him not to wander too far ahead following a scent (as he does), or for him to return to me frequently if we're in an open space. He's not a breed meant to walk off a lead or under control (you never see them competing at obedience at Crufts ;) ), so I'm satisfied he's doing fantastically well against his breeding :)

The stuff your saying makes a lot of sense:) it's what we have been working on in the house the last couple of month such as the leader doorway stuff, though it's very hard to discipline him in the house as he is generally good (he goes to bed when told, walks behind, stays, doesn't come up when we have food, can be left with food, no longer barks, does not bark at people at the door, sits and stays for his dinner, you can take any toy or food off him, even bones without him giving you a second look, knows he's not allowed upstairs or on furniture and doesn’t even try) The two things we are working on are his sock nicking abilities and when he sits and growls at strangers when they first enter the house. It means that most of the discipline ends up being done out of the house, which is where he feels the most insecure.

His lead walking is now great, and he will run alongside me at a changing pace (we used the walking back and forth technique like you described, people must think I'm wappy :loopy: and I have been practising walking him off lead the last week which he can manage to do for about 3 minutes at the moment (with no distractions around). The thing is he's quite bright and now when I call him or put his lead on he stops and spends a moment looking for a dog, at this point he attention wavers, I've been doing it at random times to try and stop him associating it with dogs.

He plays on his own (at first he's only do this when he thought no one was watching him) and does a weird jumping/ stamping thing at his biscuit a bit like what cats do when they are playing with half dead mouse! He really thumps the ground when he does it. I've also noticed stationary dogs don't bother him just moving ones, if a dog stays still he stops and won't go for it.

I will try and put some pictures of him, I'd love to know what breeds he may be but everyone I ask has different views, even the RSPCA were not sure, they decided on a lab cross! :hihi:

well at least you're headed in the right direction :)

the trick with being at home is to create circumstances for random commands - as he has you well trained to open doors if he waits, etc ;) Now you have established patterns of behaviour, he doesn't need commands from you - so create command situations. If he sits to go through a door with you, send him to bed sometimes. Randomly call him over and tell him to sit - just coz you want him to

The pouncing thing sounds a lot like the Manc Terrier I looked after, and the alertness for other dogs sounds similar too. Brude isn't fussed on toys that aren't moving - he doesn't do retrieve as it's supposed to be done - he wants stuff to move as he's a hunter

The RSPCA aren't the best authority on dog breeds either ;) - daft though it may sound, pedigree show judges are probably the best people to spot characteristics - or owners who trawl through the kennel club website in search of familiar body parts!

OK, new to this photobucket thingy. Hope the links work.

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=damon2.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=Damon3.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=chew.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=Damon4.jpg

Give it your best guess!

Awww he's not what I imagined somehow, he's lovely :love: and lovely colours/markings.

tell you what - put that in a new thread and we can all have a guessing game :)

Well I think he has some staffy, some gundog and some sight hound in there.

Fun combination!! :lol:

How much does he rely on his nose Evie? Those paws are looking familiarly large!

He's a very sniffy dog! If I'd let him he would quite happily walk with his nose to the ground, He feet are large and quite spread out too, I noticed that when I first saw him and wondered if he was going to grow any bigger, but he should be now fully grown at his age :)

them sounds like beagle attributes! and that sleeping pose is SOOOOO Brude too! Except Brude's ears flop over his eyes like a sleep mask when he does that!

I'm sorry, but I think I may have to volunteer our services for socialising :D

I put the sniffing down to him being a male as I'm used to female dogs. I thought he looked a bit like some of the tan and white English foxhounds but decided against it as he has quite a heavy face, and like you said the ears are not right. I think he might be one of them dogs that could be anything, theres something familiar but you can't quite put your finger on it!

nope - I think you're on the button with the scent hound thing! he's even coloured like a scent hound

now where did he get that broad skull (staffie?) and that curling tail? ears could be staffy too - but over large as you'd expect if he's crossed with a dangly eared breed

PS - Holly was female, but being a beagle she was all nose too ;)

Got me thinking with the Beagle input, trail hounds are large sniffy and that type of colouring too.

Thank you Stix, I have done that with him but must be honest I gave it up!!! I was getting dizzy. Will give it another try though. How come some folk have these wonderful dogs that walk off the lead, dont cause havoc and mayhem and they dont even seem to do any training, and I have done training with him from little and he can still be a pillack (love him tho)

Just looked at the pictures, he is lovely--
Beagle possibly, the colouring on his back an leg is a bit beagly plus like you say the feet, labrador possibly, might have a bit of gsd in there -longer nose and sticky up ears, but some staff definately.
beaglabstaffion - (got the ion bit from alsation as gsd wouldnt fit)

Got me thinking with the Beagle input, trail hounds are large sniffy and that type of colouring too.
A trail hound is a cross breed too though - I think it's effectively a short coat lurcher, so a greyhound for speed crossed with something a bit more durable and with bigger feet to cope with the terrain - so foxhound

I'll have to go and check that now, won't I? :roll:

We met one at Edale a while ago

How come some folk have these wonderful dogs that walk off the lead, dont cause havoc and mayhem and they dont even seem to do any training, and I have done training with him from little and he can still be a pillack (love him tho)Because dogs have their own personalities ;)

OK, new to this photobucket thingy. Hope the links work.

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=damon2.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=Damon3.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=chew.jpg

http://s284.photobucket.com/albums/ll38/eelliso0/?action=view&current=Damon4.jpg

Give it your best guess!

Oh he is handsome! GSD/Lab/Collie mix, I reckon with some scent hound

He is lovely, but I would say that!

Interesting to hear what breeds you think he is, it has stumped everyone I know so he's got to be a mix of a mix! I still really want to try him at agility as I can get him to happily walk along fallen trees and sit/ stay on the stump, and jump small streams (though he's not keen on water, I don't think he had come across streams before) so I reckon it would be something he would enjoy. In a couple of months when I've got the off lead walking sorted I'll have to have a go somewhere when theres no doggies around!

I got a few strange looks today in the park I think people think I'm doing doggy dancing with him (I'm trying out left turns now)

I loved the piccy's of Medusa's GS with the little doggies.