This is a true story told by a friend some weeks ago.

It went along the lines of....

Had a meal, the bill came to £50 and there were 5 of them. Simple - all chip in £10. However, the total chipped in was £45 and no one wasn't going to put in the missing fiver. In the end they decided to do a runner bearing in mind everyone still had plenty of money. One person in the group wasn't well placed to run out of the door and was lagged behind but still ran off. He was caught up and was tripped then kicked in by several waiters from the restaurant and ended up with £5 less in his wallet.

What would you have done in the same situation?

paid £5 Pretty cheap not to pay it dont you think? I usually give a tip though aswel. I have been a waitress once upon a time! :?

Nooooo ofcourse not!!!

If I were in that situation I would make everyone put in a pound and the next time I would be watching whos putting in what!

Originally posted by John
This is a true story told by a friend some weeks ago.

It went along the lines of....

Had a meal, the bill came to £50 and there were 5 of them. Simple - all chip in £10. However, the total chipped in was £45 and no one wasn't going to put in the missing fiver. In the end they decided to do a runner bearing in mind everyone still had plenty of money. One person in the group wasn't well placed to run out of the door and was lagged behind but still ran off. He was caught up and was tripped then kicked in by several waiters from the restaurant and ended up with £5 less in his wallet.

What would you have done in the same situation?

Your 'friends' ran off because they were greedy. 'Everyone still had plenty of money' you wrote.

In this case, your friend deserves the beating he got. If I was one of the waiters, I would have nicked his wallet too.

Then I'd come on to the Sheffield Forum and attempt to confess and justify my criminal actions.

Edited at the request of John - those who I thought were his friends are, in fact, not really his friends after all :?

Abby, no I am NOT justifying this crime.

Let me make it perfectly clear, they are no friends of mine - I only know 1 person from the party of the 5 and I have only met that guy once, more than 10 years ago. So iit safe to say he not a friend either.

The story was told to me and I said something in the restaurant favour not the side of the people who did the runner.

The response I got wasn't forthcoming. I'll tell you what I said later. I wanted to see what you would have done.

It's the sort of thing that people do when the're 17, skint and they think it's a laugh. When you grow up and have a bit of money and a few nice things you realise it's not big and it's not clever to nick things off people.

The restaurant game is risky (most businesses fail) and hard work. I think they were out of order doing a runner and deserved a kickin.

I dont think a kicking was deserved, but more detained for the police for theft would have been better.

By giving the guy a kicking, makes the restaurant no better than the theifs.

Fact: They should not have run off without paying (I have never even jumped a taxi, let alone a restaurant). For the sake of £5 I would rather have put the money in myself and told my so called mates where to go. At least then, they would be allowed in the restaurant agin.

Fact: The waiters shouldn't have hit anyone. They stepped outside the law in doing so and should be prosecuted.

2 wrongs don't make a right!!!

But if the police got involved you'd get a slow response, nothing would probably have happened, a year later you'd get a letter saying that they'd probably have had a fine or been bound over and they'd got away with it.

In this day and age, more and more people feel that it is useless involving the police as it won't achieve anything. The restaurant owners would feel that justice has been done - that person will not do that again, a lesson will have been learned and they got their money back. Done. Finished.

Perhaps if the police did their job better and more money was invested into crime prevention and there were more bobbies on the beat, then we'd redevelop a law abiding culture, but until then it's more a case of the People dealing with the crimes they can solve themselves.

It's a sad reflection on our culture that the question was asked in the first place. Theft is theft, see the thread on stealing money from an ATM. As for there being a need for more money for crime prevention I agree, but it shouldn't be going to the police it should be going to educate people in citizenship.

Originally posted by Classic Rock
But if the police got involved you'd get a slow response, nothing would probably have happened, a year later you'd get a letter saying that they'd probably have had a fine or been bound over and they'd got away with it.

In this day and age, more and more people feel that it is useless involving the police as it won't achieve anything. The restaurant owners would feel that justice has been done - that person will not do that again, a lesson will have been learned and they got their money back. Done. Finished.

Perhaps if the police did their job better and more money was invested into crime prevention and there were more bobbies on the beat, then we'd redevelop a law abiding culture, but until then it's more a case of the People dealing with the crimes they can solve themselves.
Couldn't agree more!

The fact is that when the police and courts continually let down decent citizens then people will eventually get fed up and start taking the law into their own hands. Whilst I don't think this is a good thing, I think it might be necessary to force a radical shake-up of our "justice" system.

I dont agree with that. Like I said two wrongs dont make a right.

They shouldn't have beaten anyone up. What if that person were to suffer a brain hemmorage, you lot would be singing a different tune.

If it was your relative you'd be wanting justice. They shouldn't have run off without paying, this is inexcusable. But it should be left to the authorities to sort out!

It's a sad reflection on our culture that the question was asked in the first place.

Meaning?

OK, my response was to tell the owner to call the police and I would gladly give names and addresses of the people who did a runner.

The response I got was "So you grass on your mate."

I replied with, "They are no mates of mine if they did that to me."

DaBouncer, you'd make a good policeman.

Originally posted by John
Meaning?

Meaning that we shouldn't need to ask people's opinion as to whether or not this action is right or wrong. In a civilised, educated, society mores and morals should be implicit and the need to explicitly define what is right an wrong is superflous. Unfortunately, the ideas of citizenship and responsibility are no longer practised by a large portion of society so questions as to whether or not you would, for instance, 'do a runner' are being constantly posed. There is no doubt necessary, it is theft and no right-minded person should consider it.

Similarly, the taking of the law into your own hands, as the waiters allegedly did, is also wrong but this is not an isolated event. See the debate on Tony Martin.

Sigh....I'm not asking if it right or wrong.

I'm asking what would you do if you were put in that position.

Originally posted by DaBouncer


Fact: The waiters shouldn't have hit anyone. They stepped outside the law in doing so and should be prosecuted.


Breaking the law...yes, but here it's somebody else who starts the trouble, so the thieves deserve a beating - and a mugging

See how I attempt to justify my criminal actions - strict liability? Hah! That's for leftwing socialists

Originally posted by Abby
Breaking the law...yes, but here it's somebody else who starts the trouble, so the thieves deserve a beating - and a mugging

See how I attempt to justify my criminal actions - strict liability? Hah! That's for leftwing socialists

I thought 'strict liability' was one for the hang 'em and flog 'em brigade.

As an aside, did anybody spot the irony at the tory conference where they cheered someone who suggested bringing back hanging and in the next breath cheered Tony Martin for killing someone. How illogical is that?

I might be wrong but I didn’t think you had to pay for a meal in a restaurant if you didn’t like it

So from the information in the story the waiters didn’t know why the group hadn’t paid the full amount
Putting the waiters in the wrong

If I was one of the group I would have called the police after the beating

I had a boyfriend years ago who used to joke in take-aways that he was going to pay and then run off without eating it

did it in Ibiza - only because i didnt have enough for a tip...

Originally posted by max
I thought 'strict liability' was one for the hang 'em and flog 'em brigade.

You got me on that one max, well spotted!

As an aside, did anybody spot the irony at the tory conference where they cheered someone who suggested bringing back hanging and in the next breath cheered Tony Martin for killing someone. How illogical is that?

Sorry, I don't understand what is illogical...they're all pro-death!

Personally, I think killing a criminal is a far better option than killing an unborn child, but that's another thread entirely

Originally posted by ROBERT
I might be wrong but I didn’t think you had to pay for a meal in a restaurant if you didn’t like it

So from the information in the story the waiters didn’t know why the group hadn’t paid the full amount
Putting the waiters in the wrong

If I was one of the group I would have called the police after the beating

Maybe, but did the group complain about the meal? It doesn't seem like they did. It appears they did a runner. The beating was justified, but illegal.

If in fact, the guy did a runner 'cos he simply didn't want to pay, then got duffed up, do you think he should have prosecuted the waiters? He'd be legally right, but not morally (oh dear, here comes another thread, let's hope max doesn't read this. Oh he won't - he never responds to my posts)

Originally posted by Abby
If in fact, the guy did a runner 'cos he simply didn't want to pay, then got duffed up, do you think he should have prosecuted the waiters? He'd be legally right, but not morally (oh dear, here comes another thread, let's hope max doesn't read this. Oh he won't - he never responds to my posts)

Um, didn't you just respond to a post of mine which was a response to a post of yours, which was a response .......

The beaten up person would be entitled to report it to the police and it would be they and the CPS who would decide to prosecute. He'd look a bit of a t**t though, wouldn't he?

Originally posted by max
Um, didn't you just respond to a post of mine which was a response to a post of yours, which was a response .......


yabba yabba...I was pulling your leg, 'cos you didn't respond to my early morning posts when we the only ones on the forum ;)

The beaten up person would be entitled to report it to the police and it would be they and the CPS who would decide to prosecute.

Quite right...the police are just the handymen and it's the CPS who prosecute...I'd love to know how they decide whether or not it's worth proceeding with a case...are they on any sort of commission based on the number of prosecutions made :?


He'd look a bit of a t**t though, wouldn't he?
yes, but the chance of some quick cash may cause him another rush of blood to the head

Heard the one about the CPS, the headmaster and the fish head? What was that all about and who decided to waste all that public money on the word of a delinquent and his 3 mates?

I think the same would probably happen in the case of our waiters and the beaten oaf, it may get to court but the judge would throw it out.

PS I'm not saying all your posts aren't gems deserving of responses but sometimes I have work to do.

be first to think, and first to the door!...i've done it before...its funny if you get away with it....Taxis too......if there's 2 of you, run in opposite directions. Good for the adrenalin

Originally posted by ROBERT
I might be wrong but I didn’t think you had to pay for a meal in a restaurant if you didn’t like it


You are.

Originally posted by ROBERT
I might be wrong but I didn’t think you had to pay for a meal in a restaurant if you didn’t like it

I think you still have to pay a proportion of the bill if you're dissatisfied with the meal. Can't remember the exact law, but it mentions it in the front section of Time Out eating and drinking guides, if anyone wants to check.

AFAIK in law, you are only required to pay what you though the meal was worth, and the menu prices are just a recommendation.

Of course, if you pay before you get your food (like lots of Cafes) then you don't have that option

If all my mates did a runner, I'd stay in the restaurant and give them the names and addresses of my 'friends', and suggest that we all pay them a visit. Purely a social call, natch.

That surely can't be true? I'm going to make sure I'm dissatisfied every time I go for a meal from now on then... And if I'm paying what I believe the meal is worth, it'll be worth a penny...

Originally posted by Sidla
That surely can't be true? I'm going to make sure I'm dissatisfied every time I go for a meal from now on then... And if I'm paying what I believe the meal is worth, it'll be worth a penny...

If you make sure you are dissatisfied, then why bother eating out at all, even if it is cheap? By definition, you won't enjoy a single meal.

If on the other hand, you are going to pretend to be dissatisfied, then that would be dishonest and the restaurant owners can give you a good kicking! :)

I would've payed the extra fiver and still given a tip though. I would just've made sure that my mates knew I was really annoyed with them. I'd get my own taxi home too.

Years ago in Milton Keynes I went for a meal with friends. We never received a bill and sat their for ages waiting to pay. So we got up and I said I'd go in search of our waiter who'd disappeared. Next minute I turned around and everyone had left me standing there alone. So I walked to the door and saw them frantically waving and running off in different directions. It took me a few seconds to cotton what was happening. Not wanting to get stuck with the bill for 6 people I followed. No one noticed we were gone. Holy S**t I legged it too. I tried to get them to come back with me and pay and they just laughed.
I felt terrible, (smirk), yes honestly ;)
I am a sinner.

I had a friend who used to work in (not sure if I should name it, ummm, nice cafe bar place in town) in the days when you paid after your meal there.

If a table she was serving legged it without paying the whole bill for the meal came out of her wages.

So like a £25 or something food and drink bill would be probably several nights' work for her!!

It was so unfair and she didn't stay there long.

Nowadays that same unnamed place you pay as you order.

It's for that reason I've never gone without paying - what if the poor waiter or waitress ends up paying for the meal that you and all your friends just enjoyed?

Ahhh s**t I feel terrible now for something I did over 10 years ago.

Originally posted by Sidla
That surely can't be true? I'm going to make sure I'm dissatisfied every time I go for a meal from now on then... And if I'm paying what I believe the meal is worth, it'll be worth a penny...

If you're going to do this, you have to leave your name and address so that they can take you to court.

You might also find that you weren't welcome back at those restaurants again...