Question to you ALL ...

If we as a country were going to war, who would you support?

There are some of us who stand for everything British, that all that is encompassed by the sovreignty. There are others, while considering themselves to be British, will fight for the cause of their own beliefs.

If a 3rd world war / holy war (gihad) were to break out, I would fight for MY country and what I believe in, but what has our country come to now? Going back to the 1st / 2nd world war, our families fought for their country, but if the same people were alive today would they feel that they fought to represent our nation as what it stood during those times, or as the nation that we protray ourselves to be today?

We as a great 1st world nation, embrace the diverse cultures that we come to recognise as part of our society, however when push comes to shove, would those foreign nations that have sought refuge within our country stand to fight for the COUNTRY or would they be inclined to fight for the beliefs of their ancestors? (i.e. their culture/heritage/religion)

It is my opinion that while those of asian dissent are happy to consider themselves as british nationals, they will fight for their rights, but does that incorporate OUR country and culture???

I would be interested to hear from those of you who hold an opinion towards this argument......

Why are you picking on asians? They already play cricket for our country why would war be any different?

If that holy war were being fought by a christian faith, eg Bush's forces in Iraq, would you still consider it your duty to fight?

I don't think any right minded person can answer your questions as there are insufficient facts upon which to base a decision.

Or are you asking people to say 'my country right or wrong'?

I call a spade an ablative kintetic geomorphological modification instrument as it happens

It's a very interesting question JJ has set. 100 years ago there wasn't as much cross-culturalism as there is now and migration was not as simple as today.

Most people in a country were most probably born and raised there, with all their ancestry and roots going back generations.

Yeah it's a very interesting question.

When i was in the states i would from time to time meet Indian guys who were SO PROUD to hold an British passport. Look at how Australia is still holding on to severity. Hong Kong is another ex-colony where the people have a huge amount of respect for England.

I am sure there are people who would not fight. But i would say many would be only too happy. Also (and i hesitate before saying this), most people who are in the army do it for a job, not as some form of nationalistic pride to protect their country. Nobody expects to fight if you are in the army, you may get called up and if you do you MUST fight or be kicked out. So another interesting question would be, if you were allowed to not fight without dishonour, how many English born people would also back out.

As a nation we are so good at knocking ourselves, we often forget what an amazing country we live in!

I TOTALLY agree with what jjrobbins has written - i think if we are mostly honest, how many of us have sat down in a pub with a mate and discussed this VERY topic :-)) at least he has got the balls to stand up and say what he thinks, whereas many other people wouldnt have done so. jjrobbins has taken the words as if right out of my mouth - i think that we should take a stand for what we believe in. However, i dont think that many people give a damn about our country anymore - its a case of grab what you can get financially in life and then depatriotise yourselves by moving to another country. Can't say i blame them, you pay 40% death tax to a government that cant even invest that money into a sound transportation/health infrastructure.

I might consider taking up a course in arabic - it might come in useful if i stick around in the future!!

Nationality is, ultimately, bull****.

These hypothetical wars, are in all likelihood, to be fought in the national interest. Why else fight a war? Remove nation states from that equation and your hypothetical war are in the interests of whom? No-one.

Nationality is a prison not a fortress.

There is no such thing as a bad peace
There is no such thing as a good war.
-Benjamin Franklin (i believe)

With you on that one Phanny, or as Dr Johnson so eloquently put it "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel".

I've lived on 3 continents and have family who have settled all around the world. The thrust of this thread seems to be that I should be willing to go to war against friends and relatives under any circumstances. I'd find that difficult, to say the least.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
Nationality is, ultimately, bull****.

These hypothetical wars, are in all likelihood, to be fought in the national interest. Why else fight a war? Remove nation states from that equation and your hypothetical war are in the interests of whom? No-one.

Nationality is a prison not a fortress.

There is no such thing as a bad peace
There is no such thing as a good war.
-Benjamin Franklin (i believe)
Theoretically.... then Phan. If Sweden became a super power and decided to invade the UK with thoughts of taking over the country. Would you fight to stop them?

No - you would find me rounded up in a camp with all the other pacifists, conscientious objectors, quakers et al who refused to fight, or as a refugee on my way to a better life in Albania.

As for Sweden becoming a superpower, well, it's a nice idea, but the sun set on the Swedish Empire 700 years ago when it included all of scandinavia, northern europe and a great swathe of Russia.

Ok... just curious!

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
I call a spade an ablative kintetic geomorphological modification instrument as it happens

Please dig a little deeper Phan. You might end up seeing macropods bounding toward the nearest banyan tree whilst listening to the kookaburra.(whose song sounds like human laughter).

As the Hippy adage said in the '60s during the Vietnam War:

'Fighting for peace is like f**king for virginity'.

I would only fight for what I believe is right. That's if I could be arsed.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
Nationality is, ultimately, bull****.

These hypothetical wars, are in all likelihood, to be fought in the national interest. Why else fight a war? Remove nation states from that equation and your hypothetical war are in the interests of whom? No-one.
Nationality is a prison not a fortress...

As William Lloyd Garrison (1805–1879) wrote:

‘ My country is the world; my countrymen are mankind.’

Prospectus of the Public Liberator, 1830.

Garrison was an abolishionist. For more than three decades, from the first issue of his weekly paper ‘Liberator’in 1831, until after the end of the Civil War in 1865 when the last issue was published, Garrison spoke out eloquently and passionately against slavery and for the rights of America's black inhabitants.

I concur.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
Nationality is, ultimately, bull****.

These hypothetical wars, are in all likelihood, to be fought in the national interest. Why else fight a war? Remove nation states from that equation and your hypothetical war are in the interests of whom? No-one.

Nationality is a prison not a fortress.



Right on.

Was just reading words to the same effect in Orwell's Homage to Catalonia - that nation states and their borders are just accidents of history and politics (and sometimes geography), and nearly always formed in the aftermath of land grabbing and bloodshed. Civilised people should try not to care too much about them.

Having said all that, I do believe that nations (or other groups) should have a right to defend themselves if threatened by invaders.