Can we start laughing at Leeds United yet? [Archive]

BasilRathbon

12-03-2008, 11:10

It's been a while but the stench of failure is starting to drift over from Elland Road again. Last night they were beaten 2-1 at home by the mighty Cheltenham Town, who have just completed the double over them. Now this may not seem that significant but less than 10 years ago, when Leeds were one of the Premiership giants, Cheltenham weren't even in the football league!

The result leaves Leeds outside the play off places and, even in the unlikely event of them getting back the 15 points they were deducted, they wouldn't be in an automatic promotion place. Add to that their records in the cups where they've been knocked out at the first hurdle by such giants as Hereford United and Bury and the fact that their manager quit to become Kevin Keegan's secretary, it's been a pretty poor season for them.

When you consider that, less than 12 months after going into administration to avoid paying their bills, they've spent millions on transfer fees and wages this season, doesn't it bring joy to one's heart to see them failing so miserably yet again?

Can we start laughing yet? :hihi:

scottf

12-03-2008, 11:18

i think that unless they go up this year they are going to be in serious financial trouble!!!

WhiteHawk

12-03-2008, 11:21

Were we supposed to stop laughing at them at some point?

:D:D

not wanted

12-03-2008, 11:27

Full hysteria won't kick in for me until it is mathematically impossible for them to get in to the play offs.

Grandad.Malky

12-03-2008, 11:36

Were we supposed to stop laughing at them at some point?

:D:D

:hihi::hihi:

I cant see any of our ex- players making the usually trip up the MI for the foreseeable future.

:hihi::hihi:

Keep on laughing, I am sure they would be if the roles were reversed.

Robbie Loving

12-03-2008, 15:21

i think that unless they go up this year they are going to be in serious financial trouble!!!

Na afraid not scott, their crowds are now back, minimal debts and not many high earners on the wage bill.

The club are quite financially sound since they dwindled millions of out of the taxmand and other sources.

sharpend

12-03-2008, 16:01

not many high earners on the wage bill.

thats true, I read somewhere that when they had a goalkeeping crisis at the start of the season, they had to get "permission" from the league to sign a goalkeeper.

If Ken Bates is involved, don't count on anything until the ink is dry on the end of season tables. Apparently, the match day program has the "real" league table in every week...

Heyesey

12-03-2008, 17:17

Apparently, the match day program has the "real" league table in every week...

Is that the one with Leeds not even in it?

They broke league rules, and consequently had no right to their share back, but they were allowed it under condition of a 15-point penalty. If he goes ahead with his court case, and it's decided that the League had no right to make that exemption, they'll just have to withdraw it, and have a league with no Leeds in.

Robbie Loving

12-03-2008, 19:09

thats true, I read somewhere that when they had a goalkeeping crisis at the start of the season, they had to get "permission" from the league to sign a goalkeeper.

I believe this was more to do with a transfer embargo than anything else to be honest,

They broke league rules, and consequently had no right to their share back, but they were allowed it under condition of a 15-point penalty.

They also signed an agreement stating they wouldn't take legal proceedings, which they started the next following day. The club is a disgrace to football, and how they managed to get one team in support of their case I shall never know.

JFKvsNixon

12-03-2008, 19:17

I believe this was more to do with a transfer embargo than anything else to be honest,

They also signed an agreement stating they wouldn't take legal proceedings, which they started the next following day. The club is a disgrace to football, and how they managed to get one team in support of their case I shall never know.

Leeds are a disgrace. Always have been, always will be. Wise and Poyet have always a heros of mine, and since they have conspired with Ken Bates to destroy the club they have grown in my estimation.

Chelsea to agent 'Ken Bates', time to come home soon mission almost accomplished.

Heyesey

12-03-2008, 21:13

... how they managed to get one team in support of their case I shall never know.

They didn't. They claimed Barnsley were supporting them, and about half an hour later Barnsley said "like hell we are."

happyhippy

13-03-2008, 00:10

Were we supposed to stop laughing at them at some point?

:D:D

Just what I was thinking!

sharpend

13-03-2008, 07:42

Is that the one with Leeds not even in it?

They broke league rules, and consequently had no right to their share back, but they were allowed it under condition of a 15-point penalty. If he goes ahead with his court case, and it's decided that the League had no right to make that exemption, they'll just have to withdraw it, and have a league with no Leeds in.

No its the one where Ken Bates does his Mohammed Al-Fayed impression. Protesting in the face of all rational and logical proof that the sun will rise tomorrow shining purple....

(Leeds without the 15 points deduction...)

Which raises another point - the league tables will soon need an "explanation guide" with 3 (I think) teams being deducted points for various reasons

Swami Dhyan

20-03-2008, 10:08

Oh dear. What has it come to when folk start taking the Mickey out of a once great club...(:hihi::hihi::hihi:). I think you're all awful!

bladesman123

21-03-2008, 16:19

Paul2412

23-03-2008, 15:57

No matter what the rivalry in Sheffield. We can all sing...

We all hate Leeds scum :-)

barmyowls

25-03-2008, 00:18

i DID NOT know leeds had a team:hihi::hihi:

happyhippy

25-03-2008, 00:27

i DID NOT know leeds had a team:hihi::hihi:

They do.

Farsley Celtic.

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 10:51

Best keep that laughter on ice for a few more weeks.....

Edited to add: Is this not yet another thread about 'you're not famous anymore Leeds United'. You lot down here have a serious obsession with us. I'd see a shrink.

Grandad.Malky

25-03-2008, 11:11

WhiteHawk

25-03-2008, 11:42

Edited to add: Is this not yet another thread about 'you're not famous anymore Leeds United'. You lot down here have a serious obsession with us. I'd see a shrink.
Thats because you all think you're the greatest club in the world so we just like to see you languishing in League One. You even sing about being European Champions despite never having won the European Cup! And you still sing songs about how much you hate Man U & Chelsea :huh:

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 12:06

Thats because you all think you're the greatest club in the world so we just like to see you languishing in League One. You even sing about being European Champions despite never having won the European Cup! And you still sing songs about how much you hate Man U & Chelsea :huh:

Just to wind you up, so it obviously works.

And yes, a small amount of our support are obsessed with Man U and Chelsea, just like you are with us really.

It's funny isn't it how we're in Division One but probably get more column inches than the rest of the Yorkshire sides put together. I can understand why you're all left with such an inferior feeling.

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 12:07

Can you book me in to see the shrink?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6x4Hyphv6bY

Is that meant to impress me?

scottf

25-03-2008, 12:54

It's funny isn't it how we're in Division One but probably get more column inches than the rest of the Yorkshire sides put together. I can understand why you're all left with such an inferior feeling.

but the thing is- you don't anymore- maybe at the beginning of the season where your manager was winning you games and making up the gap but now he has deserted you and you have slipped down the league so now your trying to grab a playoff spot its all gone quiet hasn't it?

just another team living on there former glores a generation ago thats going to quietly be forgotton, just like nottingham forest.

Grandad.Malky

25-03-2008, 13:03

Is that meant to impress me?

Not really but if you but "Leeds scum" into Youtube there 109 videos now that’s impressive, it looks like that shrink you recommended is going to be busy

WhiteHawk

25-03-2008, 13:29

Just to wind you up, so it obviously works.

And yes, a small amount of our support are obsessed with Man U and Chelsea, just like you are with us really.

It's funny isn't it how we're in Division One but probably get more column inches than the rest of the Yorkshire sides put together. I can understand why you're all left with such an inferior feeling.
Not sure if you're aware of this but Leeds & Sheffield are both in Yorkshire and the gulf between Sheff Utd/Wednesday/Leeds isn't really all that much so theres bound to be a rivalry no matter what division you're in. Man U & Chelsea are in a completely different class to you though and you'll probably never be in the same class as them again.

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 14:05

Not really but if you but "Leeds scum" into Youtube there 109 videos now that’s impressive, it looks like that shrink you recommended is going to be busy

Listen, I've had Leeds scum shouted at me for years now, and you know what, I can't say it ever worried me. In fact, I wear it as a badge of honour. If the rest of the world think we're scum, then so be it. As long as you all hate us I'm happy. It means we're doing something right.

And as for the rivalries, there isn't one Yorkshire club that comes anywhere near Leeds. Yes, some of you might be a division above us, but rivals? Never. You ask any fan of Man U, Chelsea etc which one team they'd have back in the Premier league and it would be Leeds every time. Why? Because we draw the big game crowds, we're the team everybody loves to hate.

scottf

25-03-2008, 14:14

Because we draw the big game crowds,

did you see elland road on saturday- it was empty!!! lol!

Grandad.Malky

25-03-2008, 14:20

we're the team everybody loves to hate.

Whatever floats your boat? :roll:

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 14:28

did you see elland road on saturday- it was empty!!! lol!

Yep, 20000 for a Sky game on a Saturday tea time vs Walsall is embarrassing isn't it? :loopy:

If you would like to talk attendances this season there will only be one winner.

WYEXILE

25-03-2008, 14:28

Whatever floats your boat? :roll:

Hey, you're the one that keeps telling me that the whole country thinks we're scum. Who am I to argue?

scottf

26-03-2008, 09:48

Yep, 20000 for a Sky game on a Saturday tea time vs Walsall is embarrassing isn't it? :loopy:

If you would like to talk attendances this season there will only be one winner.

Yeah- over easter weekend- it was embarrasing!

well i just had a look and it was fine wasn;t it when you were winning games 25+ . . evem 30k but as soon as you started loosing and then wise jumped ship you were back down to 20k- granted thats great for a division 3 side but nothing like the MASSIVE club you seem to claim to be.

WYEXILE

26-03-2008, 13:04

scottf

26-03-2008, 13:51

Surprise suprise, the obsession continues. The thread that will never die rears its head again.

On the subject of attendances, I would say an average of 25000 is more than any Div 3 team could ever hope for. Plus, the fact that it is the highest in Yorkshire proves we are without a doubt the biggest club in this great county.

Thank you.

you you denote you are the 'biggest' club in yorkshire on the fact that you had a few glory supporters when you were near the top- and now you have slipped into mid table- your back to 20k?

not what id call the 'biggest' club but if it makes you smile at night when your crying into your division 3 (remember that- 3!) shirt ;)

boboskins

26-03-2008, 13:52

igm1

26-03-2008, 14:08

Plus the fact Leeds is a one club city

Thank god for that, imagine if there were two of them! :o

Baz1

26-03-2008, 20:00

.

Can we start laughing yet? :hihi:
Yes- especially when Poyet and Wise moved and in came MaCallister.

websters gue

28-03-2008, 13:49

I should think you are the biggest club in Yorkshire with a catchment area of around
one million and only one league club.Leeds fans always go on about them being the
biggest club in Yorkshire,so what; I don't support a team because of of their size.I support Sheffield United because my old man and his old man supported them and this is the case for most geniune football fans.What gets me about Leeds is that the majority of f***wits
in towns throughout Yorkshire support Leeds(often to the detriment of their home town club)using the excuse that they are a Yorkshire club.I've met em in Barnsley,Donny,Hull
Rotherham,York etc and they are all ready to snigger when I tell them who I support.
You can always catch em out though by asking em a few question.
1.Which Yorkshire club has the best record attendance.(Leeds come 4th)
2.Who was your manager before Howard Wilkinson.(never ceases to amaze me how many so called Leeds fans over the age of forty get this wrong)
3.Who was your manager before David O'Leary.(never ceases to amaze me how many so
called Leeds fans over the age of thirty get this wrong)
I've met a few geniune Leeds fans and they have been honest and level headed when it comes
to talking about the games that we've been involved in over the years and its the case
with most proper fans,its just the hangers on that get me,but ask them a few simple
questions about their allegiance to Yorkshire's number one laughing stock and you'll easily
find em out

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 11:35

scottf

31-03-2008, 11:55

i would say its more about pity and hilarity at leeds at the minute :D :D

BasilRathbon

31-03-2008, 11:55

What gets me about Leeds is that the majority of f***wits in towns throughout Yorkshire support Leeds(often to the detriment of their home town club)using the excuse that they are a Yorkshire club.I've met em in Barnsley,Donny,Hull, Rotherham,York etc and they are all ready to snigger when I tell them who I support.

Actually, that's an interesting point. I can remember back in the 1990s "fairweather" fans of Leeds from places like Hull, Donny, Scunny, etc. Now the likes of Hull and Donny are becoming bigger clubs than Leeds United I suspect the drift of fairweather fans is going the other way.

BTW, congratulations to Leeds on managing to hold the mighty Brighton & Hove Albion to a 0-0 draw at the weekend. Though I can't help feeling that for a club that pays such vast transfer fees and wages, being midtable and below the likes of Southend and Walsall must be humiliating........

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 12:23

i would say its more about pity and hilarity at leeds at the minute :D :D

I don't see any hilarity on this thread. Only twisted bitterness.

scottf

31-03-2008, 12:24

I don't see any hilarity on this thread. Only twisted bitterness.

Twisted bitterness?

ah what? you lot? haahaahhaa- your arragance really does know no bounds!

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 12:27

Actually, that's an interesting point. I can remember back in the 1990s "fairweather" fans of Leeds from places like Hull, Donny, Scunny, etc. Now the likes of Hull and Donny are becoming bigger clubs than Leeds United I suspect the drift of fairweather fans is going the other way.

BTW, congratulations to Leeds on managing to hold the mighty Brighton & Hove Albion to a 0-0 draw at the weekend. Though I can't help feeling that for a club that pays such vast transfer fees and wages, being midtable and below the likes of Southend and Walsall must be humiliating........

Humiliating? Can't say I give it a second thought really. To say we started the season on -15 points I think most Leeds fans would have happily have settled for this position had we been offered it at the start of the season.

And it would seem the tide is turning as promotion chasing Hull City managed to get a whopping 500 more than Leeds through the turnstiles on Saturday.

LUFC, Yorkshires number 1.

scottf

31-03-2008, 12:39

Actually- LUFC- yorkshires number 6 as the tables stand pal.

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 12:43

Actually- LUFC- yorkshires number 6 as the tables stand pal.

We'd be Yorkshire's number 1 even if we were non league. The rest of the county is a joke.

scottf

31-03-2008, 12:49

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 13:03

haahaa- thats classic, you have ken bates in charge who publishes the 'real' league in the programme every week, who refuses to let any player wear the shirt number 15 and doesn;t have a page 15 in the programme and you call us a joke??

Its pathetic which just about right for that sad, sorry, lot up at elland road. your finally when you belong- the arse end of the league- long may it continue :D :D haahaahaa!!

What's pathetic is the obsession people on this forum have with LUFC. Take a look on any Leeds forum and you won't see a mention of either of the Sheffield teams. Guess why, because you mean nothing to us.

Edited to add: The blue and white side of Sheffield will be joining us next season (if we don't get promoted) and I would guess the red and white side will be as well before long now they have that buffoon in cahrge.

scottf

31-03-2008, 13:05

What's pathetic is the obsession people on this forum have with LUFC. Take a look on any Leeds forum and you won't see a mention of either of the Sheffield teams. Guess why, because you mean nothing to us.

actually pal- its you that keeps on bringing this to the top, i guess its just because everyone else has forgotten about leeds united (who) nowdays -aawwww bless. you miss being in the top 2 leagues.

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 13:35

Not obsessed. I just like to have the last word.

BasilRathbon

31-03-2008, 13:56

Not obsessed. I just like to have the last word.

Funnily enough, so do I. :P

And for the record, I'm the thread starter and I don't support a Sheffield club - I'm actually a Hereford United fan (remember? We knocked Leeds out of the FA Cup this season!).
My dislike of Leeds United largely stems from the combination of arrogance, dirty play, cheating and dislikeable characters associated with the club. Like most other fans I see Leeds' current humiliations as evidence of karma and hugely entertaining.

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 13:58

Funnily enough, so do I. :P

And for the record, I'm the thread starter and I don't support a Sheffield club - I'm actually a Hereford United fan (remember? We knocked Leeds out of the FA Cup this season!).
My dislike of Leeds United largely stems from the combination of arrogance, dirty play, cheating and dislikeable characters associated with the club. Like most other fans I see Leeds' current humiliations as evidence of karma and hugely entertaining.

Pretty much where my love of the club stems from.....

scottf

31-03-2008, 14:06

just like the FA then ;)

websters gue

31-03-2008, 15:12

Jealousy and envy,obsession,twisted bitterness,all a bit rich coming from a Leeds fan.
You lot are never shy when it comes to reminding Man Utd about Munich.
Leeds United are the patron saint of bitterness.

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 15:15

Not me. I would never revel in the death of another.

scottf

31-03-2008, 15:32

Not me. I would never revel in the death of another.

Pity your fellow supporters can't do the same isn't it.

WYEXILE

31-03-2008, 15:42

Pity your fellow supporters can't do the same isn't it.

Yes, because I'm responsible for every other Leeds fan and their behaviour.

scottf

31-03-2008, 15:43

Yes, because I'm responsible for every other Leeds fan and their behaviour.

can you please point out where i actually said you were?

websters gue

31-03-2008, 15:50

Hang on a minute.You clearly stated that your love of the club stems from its arrogance,dirty play,cheating and the DISLIKEABLE charactors associated with the the club.

taxman

01-04-2008, 20:42

Were Leeds playing tonight by any chance?

Just asking, I was watching Man Utd beating Roma away in the European Cup Quarter Finals and forgot that there may have been Division 3 fixtures being played

Zimily

01-04-2008, 21:48

Yes they were - Donny Rovers. Leeds Won :(

DynoDon

01-04-2008, 22:26

Leeds were battered though. Hitting the woodwork twice, two goals off the line, a one-on-one missed. It was just that sort of night for Rovers.

The Leeds players won't be looking forward to Rovers in the play-offs. The fans are quite likely to think themselves Champions of Europe again so the fall will be more spectacular.

Woodbine

02-04-2008, 12:43

The ironic thing is that since wise left to join newcastle their season has faded badly otherwise they would have probably got promotion.

BasilRathbon

08-04-2008, 09:21

Just when you thought it had gone quiet, more hilarity from the deluded clowns that run Leeds United.

"Leeds United chief executive Shaun Harvey has defended the club's decision not to renew their commentary deal with BBC Radio Leeds.

From next season BBC Radio Leeds will no longer be able to broadcast league matches, meaning fans cannot hear the games on a normal FM or AM radio.

"We do not feel Radio Leeds' offer valued the club correctly," Harvey told BBC Radio Leeds.

"We're in the top 10 clubs in the country, we want that to be reflected." "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/leeds_united/7334562.stm

Leeds United are currently 50th in the league pyramid.:hihi::hihi::hihi:

bladesman123

08-04-2008, 10:13

"We're in the top 10 clubs in the country, we want that to be reflected."

Leeds United are currently 50th in the league pyramid.:hihi::hihi::hihi:

This is one of the most hilarious things iv heard in a long time :hihi::hihi::hihi:

scottf

08-04-2008, 10:26

haahaa- they bring it on themselves don't they!!!

sooooo funny :D :D

plekhanov

08-04-2008, 10:55

They aren't even in the top 10 by attendance, by what possible standard is this Harvey bloke judging Leed's status?

Baz1

08-04-2008, 12:27

The ironic thing is that since wise left to join newcastle their season has faded badly otherwise they would have probably got promotion.

I think it began to fade when Poyet joined Spurs and Wise realised his ambitions lay elsewhere- together they were a team, when one left, the other followed suit.

plekhanov

08-04-2008, 12:38

Perhaps he means the debt league, anyone know where Leeds stand in that at the moment?

WYEXILE

08-04-2008, 13:32

Debt free, but don't own our ground so it's not all rosy.

And no, we're not in the top 10 attendance wise, but we are 15th out of 92 which isn't bad for a Div 3 club.

scottf

08-04-2008, 14:10

They only just scrap into the top 5 in yorkshire???

Hull
Blades
Barnsley
Wednesday
L**ds

WYEXILE

08-04-2008, 14:15

They only just scrap into the top 5 in yorkshire???

Hull - 17512 (average)
Blades - 24989
Barnsley - 11192
Wednesday - 20751
Super Leeds Pride of Yorkshire - 25894

There you go.

scottf

08-04-2008, 14:21

thats attendances? thats not what make you a big sucessful team?

surely league position is??

so therefore-

Hull
Blades
barnsley
Wednesday
L**ds

end of pal.

If attendances got you points then you might be getting somewhere, but as newcastle can testify- you get jack ****.

so your still stuck in division 3.

WYEXILE

08-04-2008, 14:24

scottf

08-04-2008, 14:28

Whatever way you dress it up though, we are still the most popular and well supported team in the county.

Pal.

ok PAL, you can't argue the figures and at the moment you are the most well supported team in the county, but the most popular???

Your hated more than osama bin laden!!!!!

;)

WYEXILE

08-04-2008, 14:30

ok PAL, you can't argue the figures and at the moment you are the most well supported team in the county, but the most popular???

Your hated more than osama bin laden!!!!!

;)

In the western world maybe. But I hazard a guess bin laden has more supporters in the east.

plekhanov

08-04-2008, 15:39

I was answering a question from a previous poster who said we didn't scrape into the top ten in terms of attendance. My point was that we do make 15th, which is pretty good for a team in div 3.

League position does show we're 5th placed in Yorkshire, you are correct. But hopefully this will be put right in the next couple of years.

Whatever way you dress it up though, we are still the most popular and well supported team in the county.

Pal.
Indeed, successful teams like ManU, Arsenal and Chelsea are obviously widely hated by jealous fans of lesser teams but Leeds seem to be almost universally loathed despite their comedic lack of success which I suppose is an achievement of a kind.

WYEXILE

08-04-2008, 17:21

plekhanov

08-04-2008, 17:41

Comedic lack of recent success.
So you still count 1992 as recent?

WYEXILE

09-04-2008, 08:10

I count 65 to 75 as recent. Got to milk all the success you've had for what it's worth.

How far do the Sheffield teams have to go back?

BasilRathbon

09-04-2008, 09:21

Indeed, successful teams like ManU, Arsenal and Chelsea are obviously widely hated by jealous fans of lesser teams but Leeds seem to be almost universally loathed despite their comedic lack of success which I suppose is an achievement of a kind.

Much of that stems from the Revie era and their brutal, cynical style of play.

People often blame the influx of foreign players for such deplorable traits as off the ball fouls, abusing the match officials and diving, but the truth is that all these were introduced to the game by Revie's Leeds United. And they still wonder why every true football fan (not just Sheffield ones) loathes them? :rolleyes:

WYEXILE

09-04-2008, 12:47

Much of that stems from the Revie era and their brutal, cynical style of play.

People often blame the influx of foreign players for such deplorable traits as off the ball fouls, abusing the match officials and diving, but the truth is that all these were introduced to the game by Revie's Leeds United. And they still wonder why every true football fan (not just Sheffield ones) loathes them? :rolleyes:

But people forget that they also played some of the most breathtaking football to be seen in that or any era.

What Don Revie did with that side was nothing short of a miracle. To take a team from a Rugby league town who were languishing in the 2nd division to one of the top 3 teams in Europe. He also provided the blue print for how football teams are run now.

They were no more cycnical than the Chelsea's, Manchester City's or many other teams of that era. The thing people resented is that they pushed the rules as far as they could be pushed in order to gain a competitive advantage. That's not cheating.

plekhanov

09-04-2008, 12:52

They were no more cycnical than the Chelsea's, Manchester City's or many other teams of that era. The thing people resented is that they pushed the rules as far as they could be pushed in order to gain a competitive advantage. That's not cheating.
Actually it is, playing unfairly and against the spirit (even if you might be technically within the latter of the law) of the game is cheating.

WYEXILE

11-04-2008, 13:31

Cheating - As listed in the dictoinary

To violate rules deliberately, as in a game: was accused of cheating at cards.

Doesn't say anything about playing to the rules.

not wanted

18-04-2008, 11:52

Looks like it is going to take 4 weeks for a decision on their appeal. If they get the 15 points back it is going to bugger up the play offs.

taxman

18-04-2008, 17:44

Just announced on Look North that they'll make their decision on 1st of May

Ally68

18-04-2008, 17:47

I can't really see them giving the points back. It would make the whole season a joke and it would affect far too many teams.

Or is it just wishful thing...:hihi:

happyhippy

18-04-2008, 17:52

Just announced on Look North that they'll make their decision on 1st of May

They actually said the decision will be released by May 1. Whichever way, it won't be before next weekend's fixtures. It's a shambles.

not wanted

18-04-2008, 18:10

If it goes against them do you think cuddly ken will leave it there?

nexus_

24-04-2008, 22:06

If it goes against them do you think cuddly ken will leave it there?

I don't see why he would - it might be more likely to be based on whether Leeds go up than over the arbitration. Playoffs or auto it doesn't really matter as long as they go back up. Especially from a business perspective!

nexus_

24-04-2008, 22:08

They actually said the decision will be released by May 1. Whichever way, it won't be before next weekend's fixtures. It's a shambles.

To be fair the shambles is really the fact that the FL (Football League) allowed it to get this far - fortnight before the end of the season? What a mess.

This whole thing should have been settled before Xmas but the FL didn't allow the arbitration till they had no real choice. Whichever way it goes there will be a loser or losers, but the FL must take the blame for allowing this to drag on like they did.

BasilRathbon

25-04-2008, 09:32

To be fair the shambles is really the fact that the FL (Football League) allowed it to get this far - fortnight before the end of the season? What a mess.

This whole thing should have been settled before Xmas but the FL didn't allow the arbitration till they had no real choice. Whichever way it goes there will be a loser or losers, but the FL must take the blame for allowing this to drag on like they did.

And if they give Leeds any points at all back it will prompt other clubs who've been deducted points such as Bournemouth and Luton to take similar action and complete mess up the relegation as well as the promotion issue.

The only sensible way to nip this in the bud is not just to refuse to give Leeds points back but to actually increase the points deduction to ensure they finish outside the play offs. Otherwise every time a club gets points deducted they'll just launch endless appeals and legal actions and make a mockery of the Football League and its rules.

nexus_

25-04-2008, 11:50

And if they give Leeds any points at all back it will prompt other clubs who've been deducted points such as Bournemouth and Luton to take similar action and complete mess up the relegation as well as the promotion issue.

The only sensible way to nip this in the bud is not just to refuse to give Leeds points back but to actually increase the points deduction to ensure they finish outside the play offs. Otherwise every time a club gets points deducted they'll just launch endless appeals and legal actions and make a mockery of the Football League and its rules.

Ah Basil, since I'm sure from your previous posts you are not as daft as the above one makes you sound I can only assume you are trying to make me bite. But for the sake of clarity I will.

Leeds were deducted 10 points for going into admin LAST season, the deduction this season was not for going into administration. In fact it was because the FL decided to take them - the arbitration is SUPPOSED to clarify why the points were taken, what rules was broken (which has never been detailed) and whether it was justified. The 10 point deduction for going into administration last season still stands, as it will for any other club that goes into admin.

Luton (& co) have no chance of getting their points back since they broke a documented rule - this season Leeds were punished for breaking an unknown and unspecified rule - slightly different scenarios!

The legal issue might arise from other clubs at the top of the league. But then they are appealing because Leeds were given back the points they rightfully won?

Grandad.Malky

25-04-2008, 12:00

The only sensible way to nip this in the bud is not just to refuse to give Leeds points back but to actually increase the points deduction to ensure they finish outside the play offs.

I like it…….a bit like a parking fine, pay up or we double the fine, then again I am just a bit biased :D, and while we are on about rules how did Wednesday get away with their minimal punishment.

scottf

25-04-2008, 12:23

no, i think its too late to give them the points back, the Fa will be sued by all the affected clubs if they do that.

The more likely outcome is that they give leeds some money.

WYEXILE

26-04-2008, 17:09

Wembley here we come!!!!!!!

bladesman123

26-04-2008, 17:31

if leeds get points back then the league will have been bastardized

daftlad

26-04-2008, 19:10

nexus_

26-04-2008, 20:12

It does reek of a rather bad smell though if Master Bates was in charge of the club when it went into liquidation, therefore meaning the club was skint, then he was the one that bought it back. Very strange dealings Papa Smurf

I agree - strange, odd and very suspicious. But it was not Bates' say, he didn't choose who to sell the club to, it was KPMGs. Whatever went on was legal, and if it wasn't is probably the fault of the administrators.

You'd think they'd be rules about this.....

taxman

01-05-2008, 15:15

The decision is to be announced at 5pm according to the BBC

Ally68

01-05-2008, 16:03

No points to be given back to Leeds.

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_3505082,00.html

happyhippy

01-05-2008, 16:27

Oh dear. What a shame. Never mind.

Ally68

01-05-2008, 16:28

Oh dear. What a shame. Never mind.

Just what I thought. ;)

Mr Sheffield

01-05-2008, 16:35

Justice has been done, proves that clubs that cheat can`t get away with it!

Robbie Loving

01-05-2008, 16:42

Justice has been done, proves that clubs that cheat can`t get away with it!

Can't always get away it......

Don't forget Leeds still got away with going into admin last season when it was confirmed they would be relegated.

Plain Talker

01-05-2008, 17:10

Justice has been done, proves that clubs that cheat can`t get away with it!

Unless they are West Ham....

Mr Sheffield

01-05-2008, 17:43

yeah forgot about that, but they have a secret weapon and he`s called Trevor Brooking!:hihi:

BasilRathbon

02-05-2008, 08:00

For once I agree with the Leeds United statement; the finding is totally unjust. Instead of just leaving it as a mere 15 point fine, the Football League should have increased the penalty for Leeds' many dodgy dealings by enough points to place them in the relegation zone. After all, if clubs appeal against red cards, suspensions can be increased for "frivolous" appeals, so why not increase point deductions for frivolous appeals as well.

In the meantime, if you'd like to have a good giggle at Leeds fans' reaction to the decision, have a look at the 606 mesage board! :hihi:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/F10027394?thread=5400816

mholey

02-05-2008, 09:09

We'll see how smug you all look when we cruise through the playoffs this year, and then embarass your cherished Blades and Owls. Everyone hates us, but we don't care, we love it. Even with a 15 point defecit we have battled hard all season and STILL made playoffs. Do Wednesday and United have this kind of passion and fight? No, didn't think so.

Keep on hating all you lot, you have until next season to enjoy your gloating.

Grandad.Malky

02-05-2008, 09:18

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vLKq_9vLOvs

BasilRathbon

02-05-2008, 09:21

mholey

02-05-2008, 09:22

I'm actually a Hereford United fan. Remind me again who knocked your beloved Leeds United out of the FA Cup? :hihi:

Which year.....*stalling*

Robbie Loving

06-05-2008, 10:35

Do Wednesday and United have this kind of passion and fight?

Is this the fight and passion that got you relegated to League One?

BasilRathbon

06-05-2008, 10:51

So now it's in Carlisle's hands to do the football world a favour, beat Leeds in the play-offs and keep them down where they belong. Come on you Cumbrians!

bladesman123

06-05-2008, 11:15

Is this the fight and passion that got you relegated to League One?

:hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

NEKRO138

06-05-2008, 11:43

Is this the fight and passion that got you relegated to League One?

Or the fight and passion that saw Wednesday get back out of League One and United into the Premiership? Haha!

Seriously, I wouldn't be bawling about Leeds' fight and passion until you get through the play offs Leeds fans!

WYEXILE

14-05-2008, 17:11

Would this be the same fight and passion that have seen Wednesday become bottom of the Championship scrappers that survived by the skin of their teeth, or the Sheffield United team who went up into the premier league and came straight back down?

mholey

15-05-2008, 20:45

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Next stop Wembley. Doncaster don't have a cat in hells chance. Best team in Yorkshire are BACK!!! The sleeping giant has stirred from his slumber.

Now, I formally request you to all start slagging the mighty Leeds off and saying we are rubbish. We love people having digs at us. The Jealous rants of 99% of other supporters in the country cos we are the biggest club in the region, with the best history, best ground, most support, and better prospects than the non-achievers of Wedenesday/United/Barnsley/Donny etc.

Have a go at us boys and girls, tell us how deluded we are, please do. 15 p;oint defecit, haha, a club like Leeds laughs in the face of the FA's punishments. We are fighters, no-one can hold us down.

Biggest team in Yorkshire. FACT.

WYEXILE

16-05-2008, 07:08

I'd hold on to that laughter for at least another week boys and girls.........

Ally68

25-05-2008, 16:06

OK, Now we can laugh mwhahahahahahah!

:hihi:

Donny Lad

25-05-2008, 16:13

Mr Sheffield

25-05-2008, 16:24

:hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

Bayern Blade

25-05-2008, 16:30

Brilliant Donny!! I ******* hate l++ds !

Agent Gypo

25-05-2008, 16:42

What have cordless kettles and the Championship got in common?

No Leeds.

happyhippy

25-05-2008, 16:44

WhiteHawk

25-05-2008, 16:50

Enjoy

http://leedsunited.ytmnd.com/

barmyowls

25-05-2008, 17:03

YESSSSSSSSS we can start laffin at LEEDS NOW!!:hihi::hihi::hihi:

happyhippy

25-05-2008, 17:09

Enjoy

http://leedsunited.ytmnd.com/

So simple, and so good!

taxman

25-05-2008, 17:19

Yes, we can all start laughing

Again! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLKq_9vLOvs&feature=related)

Grandad.Malky

25-05-2008, 17:38

:hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:I could go on but you get the idea, apparently we are only allowed 8 smiles but on this occasion it’s hardly seems enough.

exmrbd

25-05-2008, 17:46

Enjoy

http://leedsunited.ytmnd.com/

LMAO , thats great :hihi::hihi::hihi:

Must e-mail that to people :D

Bayern Blade

25-05-2008, 18:55

Keep on hating all you lot, you have until next season to enjoy your gloating.

Care to explain that view ? :hihi:

Bayern Blade

25-05-2008, 18:58

Next stop Wembley. Doncaster don't have a cat in hells chance. Best team in Yorkshire are BACK!!! The sleeping giant has stirred from his slumber.

Have a go at us boys and girls, tell us how deluded we are, please do. 15 p;oint defecit, haha, a club like Leeds laughs in the face of the FA's punishments. We are fighters, no-one can hold us down.

Biggest team in Yorkshire. FACT.

Priceless,absolutely priceless ! Slumbering giant my ****! More like a coma !!

Grandad.Malky

25-05-2008, 19:09

It’s the smug attitude of people like mholey that makes them universally loathed.

exmrbd

25-05-2008, 19:23

Another Link to make us laugh :D:D:D:D:D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WW0xntj7Dlk

bladesman123

25-05-2008, 20:15

at the end of the season i perdicted that it would be a leeds donny final and that donny would win, wish id have put a bet on now

Ally68

25-05-2008, 20:22

Send your sympathy to the Yorkshire Evening Post (http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/leedsunited/LEEDS-UNITED-Send-your-sympathy.4118755.jp)

:hihi: :hihi:

pitsmoorlad

25-05-2008, 20:42

Now I've not posted much in the last few months as I don't care for the childish bickering between Owls and Blades fans.
But on this occasion I feel I must express my opinion
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
HAHA HAHA HOHO HA HA HEEEHEEEEHEEEEEHHEEEEEE
(pause for breath and to wipe eyes)
HEEEEEHEEEEEHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HOHOHOH HEEEEEE HAHA
YIPPPPPEEEEEEEEEE.

teebee

25-05-2008, 21:07

i have to admit i was crying along with the leeds fans when the match ended................
although my tears were injected with extreme bursts of laughter.

barnie41

25-05-2008, 21:36

Zimily

25-05-2008, 22:59

45, 000 singing it large before the match. Nothig in the 2nd half. Leeds didn't show on the pitch, off the pitch they were arrogant, then went missing whe their team needed them.

If they needed any confirmation of what their level is - they just got it.

Hope they enjoy league 1, while South Yorkshire parties all season with them:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banan a::banana::banana:

To be honest (as a Donny fan) they should've scored late on in the second half. We were not holding the ball as we should have and gave them too many oportunites. Although I'm blooming well happy they didn't take their chances :)

steveb2007

25-05-2008, 23:31

Dirty Leeds = :hihi: :hihi: :hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

exmrbd

25-05-2008, 23:31

I hope this link works its a photo to make you laugh :hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w193/sheffieldposh/862362332-soccer-coca-cola-football.jpg

geocol

25-05-2008, 23:45

Now I've not posted much in the last few months as I don't care for the childish bickering between Owls and Blades fans.
But on this occasion I feel I must express my opinion
.
.

More is the pity. Your humour has been missed.

Perhaps this event might induce some more of your song rewording capabilities, for us all to appreciate.

KJ_VENOM

26-05-2008, 00:14

Send your sympathy to the Yorkshire Evening Post (http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/leedsunited/LEEDS-UNITED-Send-your-sympathy.4118755.jp)

:hihi: :hihi:

All about Leeds (spit). Is Doncaster not also in Yorkshire?

Mr Sheffield

26-05-2008, 01:01

All about Leeds (spit). Is Doncaster not also in Yorkshire?

I know is awful, the paper should be renamed the Leeds evening post!

WhiteHawk

26-05-2008, 11:34

Got a special treat for you all;
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leedscry2802.gif
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds2296.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds3803.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds5955.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds6886.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds7112.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leeds8982.png
http://xs127.xs.to/xs127/08210/leedscry136.png

45, 000 singing it large before the match. Nothig in the 2nd half. Leeds didn't show on the pitch, off the pitch they were arrogant, then went missing whe their team needed them.

If they needed any confirmation of what their level is - they just got it.

Hope they enjoy league 1, while South Yorkshire parties all season with them:banana:
Did you see that huge section of Leeds fans in the Donny end? I would have loved to have seen them at the end of the game :D:D
I hope this link works its a photo to make you laugh :hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w193/sheffieldposh/862362332-soccer-coca-cola-football.jpg
Brilliant.

bladesman123

26-05-2008, 12:46

http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/video.aspx?VideoPath=LEED/sadfans.wmv&VideoID=18670&ArticleID=4118873

surfinjim

26-05-2008, 12:46

From the Leeds Evening Post (sorry the Yorkshire Post!)

GUTTED!!! For a big club like us this is devastating!!!!!!! We're too good for League 1! I've been going on about us going up since we fluked it at Carlisle, I haven't answered my phone or texts today, just know everyones gonna rub my nose in it!
Scott

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! HA!

Jim

rubydazzler

26-05-2008, 13:14

I've just mailed this to their Editor

You recently sent me some vouchers to encourage me to purchase your paper. I notice that you only seem to have sections on your website for Leeds, Dewsbury and Wakefield. Also you're running a thread to commisserate with Leeds fans about them losing, it's all very sad, forgive me for laughing hysterically! Where's the thread to congratulate Donnie Rovers, aren't they in Yorkshire too?

On this poor showing, I can't see that buying your paper would be much advantage to me. Perhaps you should change your name to the Leeds Evening Post? Along with the TV prog, Look Leeds.

Best wishes with your marketing campaign

rubydazzler
I wonder if I'll get a reply? :)

exmrbd

26-05-2008, 13:22

I've just mailed this to their Editor

Quote:
You recently sent me some vouchers to encourage me to purchase your paper. I notice that you only seem to have sections on your website for Leeds, Dewsbury and Wakefield. Also you're running a thread to commisserate with Leeds fans about them losing, it's all very sad, forgive me for laughing hysterically! Where's the thread to congratulate Donnie Rovers, aren't they in Yorkshire too?

On this poor showing, I can't see that buying your paper would be much advantage to me. Perhaps you should change your name to the Leeds Evening Post? Along with the TV prog, Look Leeds.

Best wishes with your marketing campaign

rubydazzler

I wonder if I'll get a reply? :)

What a great idea :D

May I borrow your bit you wrote and send it in as well :D

Ally68

26-05-2008, 13:30

Good on you Ruby!

It really is a disgrace to call it the Yorkshire Evening Post. The have a whole section dedicated to L**ds which is seperate to the other football section. I typed in Doncaster Rovers in their site search and came up with the latest result being the last league encounter with L**ds when they drew 1-1!!!

ARRRRGGGHHHH!!!!! And they wonder why people hate them so much!

rubydazzler

26-05-2008, 13:49

You are very welcome to take it, but I'm sure you'll be able to improve on it anyway ... I did it in a bit of a red mist .... :P

I can't believe they can be so partisan towards Leeds UFC .. and then try to sell the rest of us their scabby paper! :rant:

KJ_VENOM

26-05-2008, 14:51

http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/video.aspx?VideoPath=LEED/sadfans.wmv&VideoID=18670&ArticleID=4118873

Funniest thing i've seen in ages :D

geocol

26-05-2008, 15:11

Are these grapes sour !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A36485030

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A36486309

Bladesman

26-05-2008, 15:54

Are these grapes sour !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A36485030

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A36486309

wow L**ds fans really come out with some utter crap! lol

jossyboy

26-05-2008, 16:11

ha ha ha, i bloody hate leeds i do thats one thing owls and blades can agree on

happyhippy

26-05-2008, 16:30

I've just mailed this to their Editor

I wonder if I'll get a reply? :)

Top notch, Ruby!

Logic3

26-05-2008, 17:02

http://www.instantimagehosting.com/storage/leeds.gif

:hihi:

F. Sidebottom

26-05-2008, 17:17

Marching home together.

Back to lowly League one, nah na na na na na. :hihi:

daftlad

26-05-2008, 17:55

Altogether now!

Lets all laugh at Leeds
Lets all laugh at Leeds
nah nah nah nah
nah nah nah nah

Romario

26-05-2008, 17:55

All Owls & Blades, however intense the rivalry is, how passionate we get about getting one over on each other, slagging each other to the hilt, lets get together & laugh at Leeds. Well done Donny Rovers for silencing the media, especially Radio 5 who were bigging up Leeds & expecting them to win & it was all talk of them!! Up your BBC !!
4 Yorkshire teams in the Championship & all from South Yorks :)
They're just a small team in the sticks!!

geocol

26-05-2008, 18:06

You're a bit late, mate.

There's been one going for a few weeks.

http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=318988

Beware, what goes around comes round.

Wednesday were lucky to get out of league 1 via play offs three years ago.

Might not be next time round, if that is where we end up in twelve month's time, which is more than a possibility unless problems within the club are sorted out.

But, well done to Donny, and I wish them well next season as long it is not at Wednesday's expense.

Romario

26-05-2008, 18:23

yeh, well as i posted i saw 1 thread grr, delete it or whatever!!
well i guess it came around when we were there last time, so it's going around this time hehe!

If we don't learn from mistakes & this happens again, it would a disgrace. But thats what our board are & as soon as they are under 100% new ownership, the better, but thats another thread i guess!!

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 07:27

rubydazzler

27-05-2008, 07:50

I only moved to Sheffield a fortnight ago. I had no idea either Sheffield team hated us so much.
It's not just us, you know :)

They're the Gordon Brown of football, everyone hates them, no-one quite knows why ... :hihi:

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 07:54

It's not just us, you know :)

They're the Gordon Brown of football, everyone hates them, no-one quite knows why ... :hihi:

I know, it's odd. When we were winning things I could understand it. There's always a painful jealousy that people feel, which is why everyone hates Man Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool. Although oddly nobody seems to dislike Arsenal. But I'd have thought that now we've disappeared into irrelevant obscurity everyone would've had a quick point and giggle at us and forgotten about the whole thing, as has happened with Millwall. But evidently the Owls and Blades feel otherwise. And the Bradford fans, although that's just funny as they seem to forget they're in a division below us!

rubydazzler

27-05-2008, 08:01

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 08:20

I know, it's odd. When we were winning things I could understand it. There's always a painful jealousy that people feel, which is why everyone hates Man Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool. Although oddly nobody seems to dislike Arsenal. But I'd have thought that now we've disappeared into irrelevant obscurity everyone would've had a quick point and giggle at us and forgotten about the whole thing, as has happened with Millwall. But evidently the Owls and Blades feel otherwise. And the Bradford fans, although that's just funny as they seem to forget they're in a division below us!

There are a number of reasons Sheffield fans hate Leeds so much.

Not just because they are local.

And not just because they are very arrogant - they've spent as many years of the last 25 out of the top flight as all the other 'big clubs' in the region, yet they still try to tell us they are the regions only massive club.

For me it's primarily down to regional TV coverage. An example being Look North (I mean Look Leeds) who have always had a huge fixation with Leeds United. When Leeds won promotion to the old League one in 1990, Look Leeds featured it for 25 minutes of the 30 on that evenings show, and then had 2 minutes about Sheffield United, who'd also won promotion to the top flight. Yorskshire TV famously decided not to show Wednesday lifting the League Cup in 1991 and showed War of the Monster Trucks instead - all other TV regions stayed with the League Cup Final. It's gone on for years, and it's the same now as it has ever been. It's this kind of Leeds bias on the media, and the delusion that 50,000 regular football fans in Sheffield are less important than 30,000 regular fans in Leeds, that makes me hate Leeds so much.

That and the fact that you are all dirty. :hihi:

But I can assure you it's not down to jealousy.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 08:22

It's not odd really, there are good reasons for it. As a fan, you won't be able to see why, I suppose.

Well I understand our supporters had something of a reputation during the Revie years for being a set of thugs, which was before my time, but I've not seen much since I've been going to see Leeds (since around 95) that would cause so much hatred. The invasion against Ipswich last season was uncalled for, but a very small minority that were heavily condemned by both the club and all of the 'real' fans. Prior to that, the only major problem event I recall was the UEFA Cup semi-final against Galatasary, in which two of our fans were murdered, hardly our fault!

But despite drastic improvement, it seems the hate never stops. Even the football league are inventing new rules as they go along to stop us getting promoted!

You mention ManU, not everyone hates them, they have a wide fan base, but even their fans hate you ... look on YouTube and see the numerous clips of them chanting ... sorry! :)

I know they hate us, that's understandable. It's the whole War of the Roses thing, the most successful team in Lancashire and the most successful team in Yorkshire (even though no longer the best). But I was under the impression everyone hated them. Partly for their never-ending success, partly because of a succession of easily hatable players (Keane, Ronaldo etc) and partly for starting the trend of putting football to the back of the business plan to shift more merchandise. And also mainly because every away ground I go the home fans start a rousing chorus of "if you hate Man U stand up".

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 08:31

But despite drastic improvement, it seems the hate never stops. Even the football league are inventing new rules as they go along to stop us getting promoted!

No, the football league imposed rules to punish you for ripping off the public and local business - i.e. going into administration, walking away from your debts (including debts to the tax man), and starting again under the same owners.

And you deserved it.

And that's another reason why the public hates Leeds.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 08:39

There are a number of reasons Sheffield fans hate Leeds so much.

Not just because they are local.

And not just because they are very arrogant - they've spent as many years of the last 25 out of the top flight as all the other 'big clubs' in the region, yet they still try to tell us they are the regions only massive club.

We just seem to have extreme fluctuations. We never seem to spend more than a season or two in mid-table. We're either battling it out at the top or scrapping it out in the bottom few places, as shown by this graph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Leeds_United_League_Position.jpg). So yes, the other Yorkshire teams may have had decent spells in the top flight, but in the last 40 years we've won 3 leagues, finished 2nd five times, won the FA Cup, been runner-up 3 times, won the UEFA Cup twice and been runner-up and semi-finalist the the European Cup/Champions League. Which is far more successful than any other Yorkshire team. That isn't arrogance, that's just a list.

For me it's primarily down to regional TV coverage. An example being Look North (I mean Look Leeds) who have always had a huge fixation with Leeds United. When Leeds won promotion to the old League one in 1990, Look Leeds featured it for 25 minutes of the 30 on that evenings show, and then had 2 minutes about Sheffield United, who'd also won promotion to the top flight. Yorskshire TV famously decided not to show Wednesday lifting the League Cup in 1991 and showed War of the Monster Trucks instead - all other TV regions stayed with the League Cup Final. It's gone on for years, and it's the same now as it has ever been. It's this kind of Leeds bias on the media, and the delusion that 50,000 regular football fans in Sheffield are less important than 30,000 regular fans in Leeds, that makes me hate Leeds so much.

That and the fact that you are all dirty. :hihi:

But I can assure you it's not down to jealousy.

But TV will never make anyone happy. It used to annoy me 8 years ago when we were good and playing the most attractive football in the country that we would get shunted down the list on MOTD behind MU, Arsenal and Liverpool, irresective of scores or quality of football.

Also, coverage of Leeds is just interesting. Not necessarily in a good way, but surely even you lot must take great pleasure from watching yet another article about Ken and his dodgy offshore bank accounts and our ever-quickening descent into oblivion? :)

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 08:43

No, the football league imposed rules to punish you for ripping off the public and local business - i.e. going into administration, walking away from your debts (including debts to the tax man), and starting again under the same owners.

And you deserved it.

And that's another reason why the public hates Leeds.

What we did was completely wrong and scandalous (although perfectly legal). I accept that completely, and think what Ken did was a disgrace. However, he was exploiting a loophole that I think most businessmen in the same position would. And more importantly, and the reason why we object so much, is that this was a magic rule invented just for us. In the British legal system you can't bring in a new law and then prosecute people who committed the crime prior to the law. But there was no rule in the book that said a 15 point penalty would be imposed if administration went through a roundabout dodgy (albeit legal) route, until after we'd done it. And therein lies the problem. We accepted the 10 point penalty without question, we knew the law and it was fair and applied to all other teams. This one was invented just for us, for something that had already taken place. Which is just as wrong.

BasilRathbon

27-05-2008, 09:13

Now as the person who started this thread a little over two months ago, I do think that we should show a little sympathy to those Leeds fans currently in the pits of depression. I'm a Hereford Utd fan and know from first hand experience just how bad it feels to fail in the play offs, for all the effort across a 46 game season to prove worthless as your team falls so tantalisingly at the final hurdle. Perhaps it's time to show a touch of warmth and humanity and commiserrate with....ah, sorry....just can't keep it up any longer....wooooooohaahhhaahhaahaaahhaahhaaahhahhaa ahaaaaa!
:hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi:

WYEXILE

27-05-2008, 10:13

Ally68

27-05-2008, 10:15

WYEXILE

27-05-2008, 10:20

Nope, the situation was much worse after we lost to Watford. It was clear Blackwell had lost the dressing room and we were still deep in debt. At the end of the day Mawhinney and his cronies at the football league got what they wanted this season, but next season it's a different matter (until they invent another rule we broke).

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 10:39

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 10:39

No pit of depression here. Had a top weekend in London, got to visit the new Wembley stadium. Was part of an amazing support (Doncaster were embarrasing, couldn't even sell their allocation). Yes, it's disapppointing that we didn't go up but if you had offered me the play off final at the start of the season I'd have taken it being -15 at the start. The signs are already there for a succesful tilt at the Div 1 title next season (new players signing, existing ones extending contracts). Onwards and upwards as they say.

My main concern is our inability to score of late. If Freedman doesn't retire he'll at least go back to Palace. After a decent haul this season Beckford may well go up a division, and Kandol and Constantine are useless. Beckford played well under Wise's long-ball style but has looked weak since McAllister brought this short on-the-ground style. We spent a lot of the game on Sunday with the ball in the Doncaster third but really never once looked like scoring. Apart from Howson's shot that went just over the bar we never even came close. Dougie seems to think that he's not allowed to shoot unless he's beaten at least 3 players first, whether it's necessary or not, and Beckford just looks uncomfortable with the ball at his feet, chancing shots from 25 yards whenever he gets possession. If we can get some decent strikers over the summer then I'd say we're in with a decent shout, but we really need someone prolific who can make space in the box and get decent shots in.

boboskins

27-05-2008, 10:39

At the end of the day Mawhinney and his cronies at the football league got what they wanted this season, but next season it's a different matter (until they invent another rule we broke).

Or maybe for something like this due to those supporters with a justified reputation

Leeds United to face F.A. investigation

LEEDS United are set to be at the centre of a Football Association probe following allegations made by several members of the Doncaster Rovers playing staff on Sunday afternoon. It is thought that around 10 Leeds supporters spat on the Rovers' players as they walked between the Leeds and Doncaster fans to go and collect their trophy. It is thought that the incident wasn't caught by the SKY SPORTS television cameras, although the camera clearly thought a distressed United fan trying to take a swipe at Doncaster Captain Brian Stock, who was leading his side up the hundreds of steps to collect their winners medals and trophy.

It is thought that the club could face a £15,000 fine and a possible reduction in matchday ticket allocations next season should the F.A. find the club's fans guilty.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 10:43

Or maybe for something like this due to those supporters with a justified reputation

Leeds United to face F.A. investigation

LEEDS United are set to be at the centre of a Football Association probe following allegations made by several members of the Doncaster Rovers playing staff on Sunday afternoon. It is thought that around 10 Leeds supporters spat on the Rovers' players as they walked between the Leeds and Doncaster fans to go and collect their trophy. It is thought that the incident wasn't caught by the SKY SPORTS television cameras, although the camera clearly thought a distressed United fan trying to take a swipe at Doncaster Captain Brian Stock, who was leading his side up the hundreds of steps to collect their winners medals and trophy.

It is thought that the club could face a £15,000 fine and a possible reduction in matchday ticket allocations next season should the F.A. find the club's fans guilty.

So of around 45,000 fans, ten of them were tits. And therefore the other 44,990 who were well behaved and accepted defeat by the better team gracefully must also be tits?

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 10:44

We just seem to have extreme fluctuations. We never seem to spend more than a season or two in mid-table. We're either battling it out at the top or scrapping it out in the bottom few places, as shown by this graph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Leeds_United_League_Position.jpg). So yes, the other Yorkshire teams may have had decent spells in the top flight, but in the last 40 years we've won 3 leagues, finished 2nd five times, won the FA Cup, been runner-up 3 times, won the UEFA Cup twice and been runner-up and semi-finalist the the European Cup/Champions League. Which is far more successful than any other Yorkshire team. That isn't arrogance, that's just a list.

I'd check on Wikipedia if you want to start quoting history. You've won less top league titles and less cup trophies than Wednesday. And nobody gets anything for coming second. And no one is interested in winning the old second division - that's just best of a bad bunch. You only get recognition for winning the top league - something you've done once in 30 years and only 3 times overall - less than Wednesday.

So that's a list which shows why you've no reason to be either arrogant or even proud, yet you still all are. which is why we hate you.

But TV will never make anyone happy. It used to annoy me 8 years ago when we were good and playing the most attractive football in the country that we would get shunted down the list on MOTD behind MU, Arsenal and Liverpool, irresective of scores or quality of football.

Also, coverage of Leeds is just interesting. Not necessarily in a good way, but surely even you lot must take great pleasure from watching yet another article about Ken and his dodgy offshore bank accounts and our ever-quickening descent into oblivion? :)

'the most attractive football in the country' :huh::hihi: No arrogance there then!!

Ally68

27-05-2008, 10:52

Most successful clubs overall (1888 - present)
Team-Domestic-European-Worldwide-Total
English Football Champions FA Cup League Cup Charity Shield European Cup Cup Winners' Cup UEFA Cup Inter-Cities Fairs Cup European Super Cup Intercontinental Cup

Liverpool 18 7 7 15 5 - 3 - 3 - 58
Manchester United 17 11 2 16 3 1 - - 1 1 52
Arsenal 13 10 2 12 - 1 - 1 - - 39
Everton 9 5 - 9 - 1 - - - - 24
Aston Villa 7 7 5 1 1 - - - 1 - 22
Sunderland 6 2 - 1 - - - - - - 9
Newcastle United 4 6 - 1 - - - 1 - - 12
Sheffield Wednesday 4 3 1 1 - - - - - - 9
Blackburn Rovers 3 6 1 1 - - - - - - 11
Chelsea 3 4 4 3 - 2 - - 1 - 17
Wolverhampton Wanderers 3 4 2 4 - - - - - - 13
Leeds United 3 1 1 2 - - - 2 - - 9
Huddersfield Town 3 1 - 1 - - - - - - 5
Tottenham Hotspur 2 8 4 7 - 1 2 - - - 24
Manchester City 2 4 2 3 - 1 - - - - 12
Portsmouth 2 2 - 2 - - - - - - 6
Preston North End 2 2 - - - - - - - - 4
Derby County 2 1 - 1 - - - - - - 4
Burnley 2 1 - 2 - - - - - - 5
West Bromwich Albion 1 5 1 2 - - - - - - 9
Sheffield United 1 4 - - - - - - - - 5
Nottingham Forest 1 2 4 1 2 - - - 1 - 11
Ipswich Town 1 1 - - - - 1 - - - 3
Wanderers - 5 - - - - - - - - 5
Bolton Wanderers - 4 - 1 - - - - - - 5
West Ham United - 3 - 1 - 1 - - - - 5

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 11:06

I'd check on Wikipedia if you want to start quoting history. You've won less top league titles and less cup trophies than Wednesday. And nobody gets anything for coming second. And no one is interested in winning the old second division - that's just best of a bad bunch. You only get recognition for winning the top league - something you've done once in 30 years and only 3 times overall - less than Wednesday.

So that's a list which shows why you've no reason to be either arrogant or even proud, yet you still all are. which is why we hate you.

Since the war Wednesday have one the league cup once. And that's it. It's 68 years since Wednesday won the league. Since the beginning of time Wednesday are the most successful team in Yorkshire. But as far as the memory of the vast majority of fans goes back, that isn't the case. And I never mentioned the old second division. Besides which, SW have won that five times anyway, which I think is more than us.

'the most attractive football in the country' :huh::hihi: No arrogance there then!!

At our best we were magnificent. Granted we weren't always at our best, and had a tendancy to bottle things, hence never winning anything. But you don't put 6 past Besiktas, 4 past Anderlecht, 3 past then Spanish champions Deportivo and beat Milan and Lazio without playing some very nice football. It was quick, pacy and clever, and not dissimilar to the Arsenal team of five years ago (although not as good, I wouldn't try to convince anyone that we were a patch to watch on Henry, Bergkamp and Pires at their best).

SimpyTimpy

27-05-2008, 11:11

I know, it's odd. When we were winning things I could understand it. There's always a painful jealousy that people feel, which is why everyone hates Man Utd, Chelsea and Liverpool. Although oddly nobody seems to dislike Arsenal. But I'd have thought that now we've disappeared into irrelevant obscurity everyone would've had a quick point and giggle at us and forgotten about the whole thing, as has happened with Millwall. But evidently the Owls and Blades feel otherwise. And the Bradford fans, although that's just funny as they seem to forget they're in a division below us!

As a Manchester United fan who dislikes Leeds United strongly I can assure you the hatred doesn't stem from jealousy. My hatred for Leeds comes from the complete lack of morals your support has, the chants regarding the Munich disaster, the death of Matt Busby and various other chants leave many people disgusted.

The fact that Leeds still consider themselves to be one of the top teams in the country, when infact they're in the 3rd league in England (for another season too).

You argue Leeds deserved to be promoted this season which I disagree with. Your performances this season merited you with an oppourtunity to gain promotion through the playoffs in which you played poor and expected things to be handed to you.

Leeds have a great fanbase, but you wont be watching Leeds in Europe for the next 10 years at least - there's plenty of other clubs with a similar amount of support who are in a much better position than you, and even they struggle for Europe (see Newcastle).

So to cut it short, the arrogance, vulgarity and blind optimism of Leeds fans is why EVERY club in the country dislikes your fans, but in all honesty - unless you get a lucky draw in the FA or League cup, we wont be seeing you at Old Trafford any time soon :)

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 11:29

Since the war Wednesday have one the league cup once. And that's it. It's 68 years since Wednesday won the league. Since the beginning of time Wednesday are the most successful team in Yorkshire. But as far as the memory of the vast majority of fans goes back, that isn't the case. And I never mentioned the old second division. Besides which, SW have won that five times anyway, which I think is more than us.

At our best we were magnificent. Granted we weren't always at our best, and had a tendancy to bottle things, hence never winning anything. But you don't put 6 past Besiktas, 4 past Anderlecht, 3 past then Spanish champions Deportivo and beat Milan and Lazio without playing some very nice football. It was quick, pacy and clever, and not dissimilar to the Arsenal team of five years ago (although not as good, I wouldn't try to convince anyone that we were a patch to watch on Henry, Bergkamp and Pires at their best).

So basically you want to pick out who has been most successful historically based on a time line that YOU dictate?

And you wonder why you are called arrogant.

1991 was the last time you won anything. Only one year later than Wednesday last won a major trophy, so over the last 20 years we are even.

And Sheffield United were the last team in the Premiership if you want history to be judged over the last 5 years.

And Doncaster and Barnsley are in a league above you if you want history to be based on an even smaller scale.

But you only want that one window where you actually can manipulate the stats in your favour. Arrogant.

And I can honestly say, you were never EVER magnificent. All teams have good spells. You may have had a few in a few games. But that is all.

Talk about deluded.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 11:31

As a Manchester United fan who dislikes Leeds United strongly I can assure you the hatred doesn't stem from jealousy. My hatred for Leeds comes from the complete lack of morals your support has, the chants regarding the Munich disaster, the death of Matt Busby and various other chants leave many people disgusted.

The fact that Leeds still consider themselves to be one of the top teams in the country, when infact they're in the 3rd league in England (for another season too).

You argue Leeds deserved to be promoted this season which I disagree with. Your performances this season merited you with an oppourtunity to gain promotion through the playoffs in which you played poor and expected things to be handed to you.

Leeds have a great fanbase, but you wont be watching Leeds in Europe for the next 10 years at least - there's plenty of other clubs with a similar amount of support who are in a much better position than you, and even they struggle for Europe (see Newcastle).

So to cut it short, the arrogance, vulgarity and blind optimism of Leeds fans is why EVERY club in the country dislikes your fans, but in all honesty - unless you get a lucky draw in the FA or League cup, we wont be seeing you at Old Trafford any time soon :)

I've been going to Elland Road for 15 years and heard no such chants. I very much doubt that, for 99% of our fans, we would find anything remotely funny about the death of any opposition players or staff, irrespective of how strong the rivalry was.

We didn't deserve to win the playoffs because we were beaten fairly by a team that outplayed us on the day. We were diabolical in the first leg of the semi, mostly fantastic in the return game, but weak in the final and we didn't deserve to win the game. But I think we deserve promotion based on the fact we amassed 91 points this season. But that's another matter, and I'm sure anyone who isn't a Leeds fan will blindly insist that the clearly wrong punishment given to us should stand, if for no other reason than it kept us down.

We think we're big because we have massive attendaces for a League 1 side. This may or may not be an accurate figure on which to judge things. I don't think we're that blindly optimistic. I for one expected us to lose on Sunday, because that's just what we do, get to the last hurdle (or near the last hurdle) and fall. Since I've been watching Leeds we've finished 3rd or 4th in the league a few times, lost a league cup final, lost two playoff finals and two major European semi-finals. It's what we do, we're very good at nearly winning things and very bad at winning things.

It is very, very frustrating that there is a very small minority of Leeds 'fans' who see fit to act disgracefully wherever they go, and leave the endless thousands of the rest of us who just want to support the team and watch some football getting tarnished with some dirty arrogant thugs brush that, frankly, the vast, vast majority of supporters are not deserving of.

I don't expect, nor do I expect anyone else to believe, Leeds to be playing in Europe anytime soon. We now pretty much have to start from scratch. What we need to hope for is that our history and name will allow us to attract a better class of player than the average team in our division. Not that we have much to spend. Now that for the first time in an eternity we are debt-free, we can set about rebuilding from the ground up and hopefully secure a top-two spot next year (because I don't think we'll ever win a play-off final, it requires an on-the-day nerve that we seem to be lacking).

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 11:39

So basically you want to pick out who has been most successful historically based on a time line that YOU dictate?

And you wonder why you are called arrogant.

1991 was the last time you won anything. Only one year later than Wednesday last won a major trophy, so over the last 20 years we are even.

And Sheffield United were the last team in the Premiership if you want history to be judged over the last 5 years.

And Doncaster and Barnsley are in a league above you if you want history to be based on an even smaller scale.

But you only want that one window where you actually can manipulate the stats in your favour. Arrogant.

I'd say living memory was a reasonable time-scale. Nobody's saying we're any good anymore. We're an embarrassment to ourselves and a laughing stock to everyone else. And rightly so.

Besides, as you're well aware one can skew stats any way they like. And yes, I'm guilty of it. If I were to clutch at straws, I could say that the stats were misrepresentative as two of your league titles and two of your FA Cup titles came before Leeds United ever existed as a football club.

And I can honestly say, you were never EVER magnificent. All teams have good spells. You may have had a few in a few games. But that is all.

Talk about deluded.

Except in this instance I'm not the one who's deluded. I'm well aware that for most of the 90s and all of the last 7 years our football has been mediocre at best, and usually several grades below mediocre. But for a brief two-year spell at the start of the decade we played lovely, flair-filled football. And I say this as someone who actually watched all the games during that period, which I sincerely doubt you did, and yet you see fit to dismiss it despite having no knowledge of the subject.

BasilRathbon

27-05-2008, 11:57

It is very, very frustrating that there is a very small minority of Leeds 'fans' who see fit to act disgracefully wherever they go, and leave the endless thousands of the rest of us who just want to support the team and watch some football getting tarnished with some dirty arrogant thugs brush that, frankly, the vast, vast majority of supporters are not deserving of.

Except it's not really a small minority, is it? In the case of Leeds, it's a sizeable minority - here's a couple of examples of the behaviour of typical Leeds fans; one about attacking opposition fans in wheelchairs;
http://www.halifaxcourier.co.uk/news/Leeds-United-thugs-attacked-disabled.3648545.jp

and another about how they reacted to the Bradford fire tragedy in 1985 in the way only Leeds fans know how - by going to a game at Bradford's temporary home at Odsal and trying to burn that ground down as well!
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/football-league/why-leeds-no-longer-have-place-in-mccalls-affections-599719.html

And lest you think all that's in the past, cast your mind back only as far as last week, when, while queueing for play off final tickets, the Leeds fans decided to start fighting each other!
http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/video-and-audio/Fans-slate-Leeds-United-ticket.4106809.jp

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 12:23

But of the hundreds of thousands of supporters, and of the 30,000 or so that attend fixtures regularly, there are a couple of hundred of the so-called 'hardcore' that see fit to tarnish the name of the club by any means possible. Over 99% of our supporters fully condemn this behaviour and hate these 'supporters' just as much as, if not more, than the fans of any team that has come under fire from them. They are not representative of the vast, vast majority of our fanbase and it's sad that they are the ones on which we are judged. Still, it could be worse, I could support Roma :)

SimpyTimpy

27-05-2008, 12:53

I suppose the biggest problem then is the fact that those so called 'minority' fans seem to shout the loudest.

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 12:56

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 13:00

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 13:04

I love this post.

This is up there with:

"I didn't trip, I meant to fall on my face deliberately on purpose."

and

"No, I'm not fired, I quit"

and

"No, you're dumped, I dumped you 10 minutes ago but I didn't tell you, and I didn't really want to go out with you in the first place"

So if you were the firm outsiders in the league (IIRC Ladbrokes were offering 800/1 on us winning the league at the start of the season, with the next lowest team being 100/1 or something), and had a choice between the expected battle at the bottom, or losing the play-off final which would you choose? That we lost on Sunday was obviously disappointing, but there are very few people who last August thought we stood a chance of finishing in the top half, let alone the top six.

But since it seems that in your eyes anything we achieve is through luck or irrelevance or cheating or something, evidently this is an unwinnable battle.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 13:12

I think that regardless of how Zomoniac tries to paint a lovely picture of Leeds (as you'd expect - I paint a lovely picture of Wednesday although I know it's not necessarily true), the bottom line is that SO MANY people hate Leeds that we can't all be wrong.

If it were just a few local rivals then maybe that would be understandable, but everyone hates Leeds, for a multitude of reasons, and no amount of PR is going to change the fact that they are universally despised. So you really are wasting your time Zomoniac.

That may be so, but the point I'm trying to make is that just because a couple of hundred of our so-called supporters see fit to start riots and mock tragedies, it isn't really fair to assume the generalisation that all Leeds fans are thugs. Most of us just want to watch some football.

Prior to moving to Sheffield I always had a soft spot for Wednesday. They were the team most people at my school supported, and I always got the impression the Wednesday were the pleasant team where families would take their kids for a day out and United were the team that attracted the tattooed skinheads. But after spending Sunday in the pub with my Leeds shirt on I was shocked at the hostility I got from Wednesday fans who were shouting out abuse and supporting Doncaster for no other reason than to see us lose. I'm sort of amused that some people are so sad they'll go out of their way to watch a game with a team they don't support just to abuse them, not really caring about the game, but also somewhat saddened that I have to suffer this because a few sad losers occassionally sing songs about a fire or a plane crash.

F. Sidebottom

27-05-2008, 13:12

So if you were the firm outsiders in the league (IIRC Ladbrokes were offering 800/1 on us winning the league at the start of the season, with the next lowest team being 100/1 or something), and had a choice between the expected battle at the bottom, or losing the play-off final which would you choose? That we lost on Sunday was obviously disappointing, but there are very few people who last August thought we stood a chance of finishing in the top half, let alone the top six.

But since it seems that in your eyes anything we achieve is through luck or irrelevance or cheating or something, evidently this is an unwinnable battle.

I think if you look back on WYEXILE's many other posts over the course of this season, you'll see he predicts on many occasions that Leeds would get promoted, and also that they would easliy despatch with Donny.

They didn't.

And has he come and admitted that he was badly wrong and they failed?

No, he tries to paint a picture that is almost along the lines of losing the play off final being his ideal outcome.

Zomoniac

27-05-2008, 13:21

I think if you look back on WYEXILE's many other posts over the course of this season, you'll see he predicts on many occasions that Leeds would get promoted, and also that they would easliy despatch with Donny.

They didn't.

And has he come and admitted that he was badly wrong and they failed?

No, he tries to paint a picture that is almost along the lines of losing the play off final being his ideal outcome.

I'm a n00b here, so I can't comment on him. At the start of the season before the first ball had been kicked I thought there was a very real chance of us going down if we didn't have our deduction overturned. Come Christmas when we'd take 51 points from a possible 60 (even though were were only on 36) and were one point off the top, I thought it was an absolute given that we would walk the league and finish top by miles. Then after a terrible run when we were down to 9th and 6 points off the play-offs at the end of February I didn't think we had a hope in hell of a top 6 finish.

So my view, and I think it is shared by most of us, is that it's gutting we didn't make it up, but all things considered we should be impressed with what we did accomplish this season.

WYEXILE

27-05-2008, 16:33

WhiteHawk

27-05-2008, 18:13

Anyone see Look Leeds tonight? They spent more time focusing on Rob Douglas' tackle that stopped a second goal and the chance they had after about 3 minutes than they did on showing Doncaster!! They replayed the tackle more times than the Donny goal!!!!

I'd check on Wikipedia if you want to start quoting history. You've won less top league titles and less cup trophies than Wednesday. And nobody gets anything for coming second. And no one is interested in winning the old second division - that's just best of a bad bunch. You only get recognition for winning the top league - something you've done once in 30 years and only 3 times overall - less than Wednesday.

So that's a list which shows why you've no reason to be either arrogant or even proud, yet you still all are. which is why we hate you.

'the most attractive football in the country' :huh::hihi: No arrogance there then!!
Thats one thing that gets me about Leeds fans. They haven't really won much at all and they include finishing 2nd in their honours list!!!!

We haven't won much I admit but we've won the FA Cup more times than them, 4 for us and only 1 for Leeds I believe. You also made a very good point in another post about them only picking a certain period of time on which to show how much more succesful they were than the rest of Yorkshire, like you say, the last 5 years, most of Yorkshire has been better than them.
And also mainly because every away ground I go the home fans start a rousing chorus of "if you hate Man U stand up".
Seriously? I've been to about 60 away games in the last 6 years or so and I must say, I can't ever recall hearing anyone sing "Stand up if you hate Man U"

Grandad.Malky

27-05-2008, 18:38

Seriously? I've been to about 60 away games in the last 6 years or so and I must say, I can't ever recall hearing anyone sing "Stand up if you hate Man U"

I have got to agree with you but I have heard many a rendition of Leeds scum. :D

WhiteHawk

27-05-2008, 18:53

I have got to agree with you but I have heard many a rendition of Leeds scum. :D
I've definitely heard that many, many times!! :D:D

Grandad.Malky

27-05-2008, 19:03

At any away game you are almost guaranteed a rendition of. Wednesday …t, Leeds scum, Oh happy days, how long to the start of the new season.

Frank Sidney

27-05-2008, 19:21

I can't congratulate Donny. They hate both Sheffield teams.

WhiteHawk

27-05-2008, 19:22

You get that at Bramall Lane every game aswell, its a great chant!! Far too long till the start of the season though :(

bladebloke

27-05-2008, 19:31

I can't congratulate Donny. They hate both Sheffield teams.

i'd congratulate the taliban if they beat dirty leeds.

happyhippy

27-05-2008, 20:00

Seriously? I've been to about 60 away games in the last 6 years or so and I must say, I can't ever recall hearing anyone sing "Stand up if you hate Man U"

I haven't either.

plekhanov

27-05-2008, 21:52

I only moved to Sheffield a fortnight ago. I had no idea either Sheffield team hated us so much. I'm somewhat flattered, in much the same way that I was in Bradford, that you all feel so strongly about Leeds, when really don't care about you lot. Maybe you're all just jealous that at some point we've won things.
In my experience Leeds are hated pretty much everywhere and not just by fans of 'smaller' clubs, Redcafe for example have a 'Leedswatch (http://www.redcafe.net/f7/leedswatch-2007-a-166340/index14.html)' thread stickied to the top of the general football forum purely so United fans can laugh at Leeds. That never happened when clubs of similar stature such as Forest and Wednesday when they took a trip down to the 3rd division.

Leeds are hated beyond anything which simple local rivalry and 'jealously' can explain and so far as I can tell it's simply because the behaviour of Leeds FC and it's fans positively invites loathing.

Although that all seems a long, long time ago now, and now we're a bit rubbish. (although we did get 91 points and therefore did deserve to go up, and anyone who disagrees clearly doesn't have a clue).
Yeah it was so unfair the way the rules were applied to you despite your boards pitiful attempts to find a loophole :roll:

plekhanov

27-05-2008, 22:09

But TV will never make anyone happy. It used to annoy me 8 years ago when we were good and playing the most attractive football in the country that we would get shunted down the list on MOTD behind MU, Arsenal and Liverpool, irresective of scores or quality of football.
Too true the joyless United of Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskaer... and Arsenal of such dull journeymen as Henry, Pires, Bergkamp, Lungberg... just didn't approach the breathtaking attacking football of Smith, Bowyer, Viduka.. :loopy:

Talk about delusional arrogance.

rubydazzler

27-05-2008, 22:23

Now come on guys, the lad's only defending his team ... it's just a pity that he's chosen the wrong team and the wrong forum to do it ...

He's Sheffield now, so he might in time learn the error of his ways and even become a Blade ... like all right minded people should be :P

*runs and hides before the wrath of the Wendy is called down upon her defenceless head :hihi:

taxman

27-05-2008, 23:41

I have nothing to say on this matter.....but these people (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7guAX9xMbxs)do :hihi:

OK it goes on for nearly 6 minutes but you get the gist

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 07:14

Yeah it was so unfair the way the rules were applied to you despite your boards pitiful attempts to find a loophole :roll:

But it wasn't a rule though, was it. The docking of ten points last season was a rule. The 'rule' to dock 15 points if the FA don't like the way you came out of administration was magically invented just after we came out of administration.

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 07:17

Thats one thing that gets me about Leeds fans. They haven't really won much at all and they include finishing 2nd in their honours list!!!!

When you're firm outsiders and go into a tournament expecting ridicule and finish 2nd or are a semi-finalist I think it's an achievement. It might not put silverware in the cabinet, but it's something to look back on fondly. Do Wednesday fans consider the 1993 season, losing both cup finals (and beating United in the semi) to be a dismal failure, or an achievement that sadly lacked the end product?

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 07:28

Too true the joyless United of Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskaer... and Arsenal of such dull journeymen as Henry, Pires, Bergkamp, Lungberg... just didn't approach the breathtaking attacking football of Smith, Bowyer, Viduka.. :loopy:

Talk about delusional arrogance.

Just because none of them have gone on to do anything of merit since leaving doesn't mean they weren't great with us. We beat Man Utd, and Arsenal, and Chelsea, and Liverpool, and were the last English team in the Champions League, and looked on target to win the league but bottled it at the last minute like we always do.

But we didn't win anything, and we are dirty Leeds scum, therefore Kewell, Ferdinand, Radebe, Dacourt, Batty et al are obviously talentless hacks. In much the same way as Waddle, Hirst, Carbone, di Canio and Walker.

I'm not really the one who's delusional, since you appear to be of the mind that we are the worst team in history, worthy of nothing and would play better football if all our players were replaced with heroin addicts who are all dead.

BasilRathbon

28-05-2008, 09:52

But it wasn't a rule though, was it. The docking of ten points last season was a rule. The 'rule' to dock 15 points if the FA don't like the way you came out of administration was magically invented just after we came out of administration.

Have you ever considered a career as a labour party spin doctor? You're starting to sound like a small child wailing "Waarrghh! It's not fair" over and over again.

Actually Leeds got away remarkably lightly. Here's an impartial explanation of why Leeds were deducted the 15 points, taken from http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/05/01/why_the_leeds_verdict_was_fair.html;

"On May 4 last year Leeds called in the administrators and announced that the club would be sold to a group of companies headed by Ken Bates. They were immediately docked 10 points, ensuring relegation to League One, where they were headed in any case.

After a summer of financial turmoil, the Football League granted Leeds permission to play in League One this season, but only with an additional 15-point deduction. The penalty was a result of the club operating other than under the Football League's well-established rules on insolvency while a transfer of League membership was made to the legal entity (owner: Ken Bates) to which the club now belonged."

Leeds agreed to the 15 point penalty at the time; so why, once having accepted it as fair, did they decide to appeal against it? Furthermore, other clubs found guilty of financial dodgy dealings have received worse penalties; in the 1990s Swindon Town were relegated two divisions and in 2007 Boston United (who went into administration at the same time as Leeds) were relegated from the Football League two levels down to The Conference North.

It would seem therefore that Leeds got away remarkably lightly and should actually have been demoted to League Two rather than be allowed to start the season in League One.

Perhaps, as a punishment for all the disruption and frivolous legal action they've undertaken this season, Leeds should be given a more serious penalty for the 2008/9 - I suggest a deduction of around 30 points would be fair.

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 10:43

Have you ever considered a career as a labour party spin doctor? You're starting to sound like a small child wailing "Waarrghh! It's not fair" over and over again.

Actually Leeds got away remarkably lightly. Here's an impartial explanation of why Leeds were deducted the 15 points, taken from http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/05/01/why_the_leeds_verdict_was_fair.html;

"On May 4 last year Leeds called in the administrators and announced that the club would be sold to a group of companies headed by Ken Bates. They were immediately docked 10 points, ensuring relegation to League One, where they were headed in any case.

After a summer of financial turmoil, the Football League granted Leeds permission to play in League One this season, but only with an additional 15-point deduction. The penalty was a result of the club operating other than under the Football League's well-established rules on insolvency while a transfer of League membership was made to the legal entity (owner: Ken Bates) to which the club now belonged."

Leeds agreed to the 15 point penalty at the time; so why, once having accepted it as fair, did they decide to appeal against it? Furthermore, other clubs found guilty of financial dodgy dealings have received worse penalties; in the 1990s Swindon Town were relegated two divisions and in 2007 Boston United (who went into administration at the same time as Leeds) were relegated from the Football League two levels down to The Conference North.

It would seem therefore that Leeds got away remarkably lightly and should actually have been demoted to League Two rather than be allowed to start the season in League One.

Perhaps, as a punishment for all the disruption and frivolous legal action they've undertaken this season, Leeds should be given a more serious penalty for the 2008/9 - I suggest a deduction of around 30 points would be fair.

If said rules are "well established", why is there a different penalty imposed every time the rule is broken? If it's actually in the rule book, then I don't believe a penalty would not be associated in it. If what we did is in the book and it is stated we should drop down two divisions, then that's exactly what should've happened. I do not wish to sound like a "small child wailing", but if what we did was akin to that of Boston then why were we not relegated two divisions. Because it's being made up as they go along. Which is what my problem is.

The reason we accepted the penalty is, as you well know, that the league decided to approach us the day before the first match of the season to say "you're starting on -15, object and we won't let you play". Sounds like blackmail, really. We were given no choice whatsoever if the club were to continue.

If this had happened to your club you would feel exactly the same way. I don't mind when we are penalised in accordance with the book. I don't mind that we went down two divisions because we weren't good enough, and I don't mind that a superior Doncaster team beat us. I wouldn't mind a 15 point penalty if anywhere it said that what happened should be punished with a 15 point penalty. But then I really can't win here, can I? I'm guessing you think we lost the 73 CWC final fairly as well?

geocol

28-05-2008, 11:51

…
, therefore Kewell, Ferdinand, Radebe, Dacourt, Batty et al are obviously talentless hacks.

Radebe was also very talented at feigning injury, and Batty very talented at crippling opposition players… remember a certain quarter final appearance at Hillsborough?

I can't congratulate Donny. They hate both Sheffield teams.
It’s true. We experience “hate” from Barnsley, Doncaster and Rotherham, teams that we have generally wanted to do well in the past when they were in lower leagues to us, but they still hate us and accuse us of being arrogant - probably in a similar way to that Zomoniac feels about our reaction to Leeds.

I think the situation was highlighted during the 1992/93 campaign.
Leeds fans were wishing us good luck againmst Kaiserslautern; but we couldn't do the same to them against Stuttgart and Rangers.

But, I still can't bring myself to gloat about Leeds staying down at the moment; I'm still relieved we had the luck (and the astute management of Mr Sturrock) and managed to get up back up through the play offs, three years ago... TODAY if anyone has forgotten. Never has a barrel of Arkells and the bottles of Veuve Cliquot waiting at the Avon hotel for us after the game, tasted as good.

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 12:43

Radebe was also very talented at feigning injury, and Batty very talented at crippling opposition players… remember a certain quarter final appearance at Hillsborough?

First time I've ever heard someone accuse Radebe of being a cheat. And yes Batty made some hard challenges, probably excessive at times. You'll be hard pushed to find a good holding midfielder who isn't a little reckless occassionally. Keane and Veira were the best in the business but as crippling as they came. But yes, he made a bad challenge once. Doesn't take anything away from his talents. di Canio shoved a referee over. Doesn't mean that he wasn't a great player.

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 12:49

It’s true. We experience “hate” from Barnsley, Doncaster and Rotherham, teams that we have generally wanted to do well in the past when they were in lower leagues to us, but they still hate us and accuse us of being arrogant - probably in a similar way to that Zomoniac feels about our reaction to Leeds.

I think the situation was highlighted during the 1992/93 campaign.
Leeds fans were wishing us good luck againmst Kaiserslautern; but we couldn't do the same to them against Stuttgart and Rangers.

But, I still can't bring myself to gloat about Leeds staying down at the moment; I'm still relieved we had the luck (and the astute management of Mr Sturrock) and managed to get up back up through the play offs, three years ago... TODAY if anyone has forgotten. Never has a barrel of Arkells and the bottles of Veuve Cliquot waiting at the Avon hotel for us after the game, tasted as good.

There we go, this is a nice post! It actually put a smile on my face for the first time in this thread. I have always in the past (prior to yesterday!) wished the best for Wednesday. As has been mentioned previously at my school (in Featherstone) the support was split pretty much 50/50 between Man Utd (so not proper supporters then) and Sheffield Wednesday, and I always sided with the Wednesday fans so have something of a soft spot for them. There was me and a couple of other people supporting Leeds, but very few.

I just find it somewhat unfair that I can walk the streets of Sheffield in a Leeds shirt and everyone thinks that I'm a dirty scumbag just waiting to start a riot or break a chair over someone's head or burn their house down or impregnate their mother just because I support the team of my hometown that has a fanbase of which <0.1% are complete and utter losers. Apparently a few of them were at it again in some pubs in London on Saturday night before the final. And believe me, I hate them too.

geocol

28-05-2008, 13:40

I just find it somewhat unfair that I can walk the streets of Sheffield in a Leeds shirt and everyone thinks that I'm a dirty scumbag just waiting to start a riot or break a chair over someone's head or burn their house down or impregnate their mother just because I support the team of my hometown that has a fanbase of which <0.1% are complete and utter losers. Apparently a few of them were at it again in some pubs in London on Saturday night before the final. And believe me, I hate them too.

In other words, a bit like being German when you have been born since 1945, and you're tarred with the same brush as generations before.

Having the past rammed down their throats for sixty odd years, has started to make some of the youinger intelligent members of their society, rebel now (and hate the Dutch because of all the past taunts).

Something, that I guess, you've got to live with for a while :)

geocol

28-05-2008, 13:41

First time I've ever heard someone accuse Radebe of being a cheat.
I was surpsied at that too, but on the last occasion I saw him he felt it necessary to keep falling down in his own half, each time the opposition mounted a serious attack!

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 13:49

In other words, a bit like being German when you have been born since 1945, and you're tarred with the same brush as generations before.

Having the past rammed down their throats for sixty odd years, has started to make some of the youinger intelligent members of their society, rebel now (and hate the Dutch because of all the past taunts).

Something, that I guess, you've got to live with for a while :)

Quite, very frustrating being 25 years younger than the 'fans' who would demolish towns before and after matches in the 70s and still be assumed to be a violent good-for-nothing goon. I'm just wondering if it'll ever stop!

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 13:55

I was surpsied at that too, but on the last occasion I saw him he felt it necessary to keep falling down in his own half, each time the opposition mounted a serious attack!

Maybe he just can't stand up :)

He did score for us in a UEFA Cup game against one of the teams from one of those cities where the teams have weird names (it was Dynamo Moscow or Partizan Belgrade) where he slipped and fell unchallenged as a corner came in, just fell over his own feet, the ball bounced towards him and he scored an overhead kick whilst sitting on his backside! And he did once play the last 74 minutes of a game for us against Man Utd in goal, and didn't concede till the 72nd minute, so presumably pretty good at diving :)

geocol

28-05-2008, 13:58

Quite, very frustrating being 25 years younger than the 'fans' who would demolish towns before and after matches in the 70s and still be assumed to be a violent good-for-nothing goon. I'm just wondering if it'll ever stop!
Probably not while memories from the past are still personally there, amongst those taunting you..

I suppose my own "dislike" of Leeds originated from as a 13 year old on the terraces at Elland Road, receiving in those days what was termed as a "good kicking" from a group of youths considerably older than me.

That was early 66, at the time a generally unknown experience, at least a year before such events became more commonplace and regular elsewhere.

Bt the time a similar thing happened at the feet of Mancs some 22 months later, I was starting to get used to it, and by the time some Hammers took a disliking to me after a suspiciously offside looking 87th minute equaliser, my athletics track training enabled an escape, but from then on I didn't wear colours away.

Considerable credit to you though, for coming on here to defend your corner.
Hope that one day, you put all this experience behind you and get to like Sheffield!

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 14:14

Probably not while memories from the past are still personally there, amongst those taunting you..

I suppose my own "dislike" of Leeds originated from as a 13 year old on the terraces at Elland Road, receiving in those days what was termed as a "good kicking" from a group of youths considerably older than me.

That was early 66, at the time a generally unknown experience, at least a year before such events became more commonplace and regular elsewhere.

Bt the time a similar thing happened at the feet of Mancs some 22 months later, I was starting to get used to it, and by the time some Hammers took a disliking to me after a suspiciously offside looking 87th minute equaliser, my athletics track training saved the day.

Considerable credit to you though, for coming on here to defend your corner.
Hope that one day, you put all this experience behind you and get to like Sheffield!

Thanks, though defending my corner is proving harder than I'd anticipated. I thought it would be a case of "hello, I support Leeds, we used to be good but fail, now we're rubbish and fail even more, you let me happily support my team and I'll do the same to you", but clearly I was naive in my thinking. It was easy when I lived in Bradford when I got the endless "aaaaaah, you're s**t", as it was always counter-able with "yes but we're (at least) a division above you". Sadly that's no longer applicable :)

I've been going to watch Leeds for around 12-13 years now, and I've worn my Leeds shirt to Hillsbrough, Old Trafford, Valley Parade and numerous other 'hostile' grounds to us, and I've never in my life witnessed any violence at or around a game. I've had a few sarcy remarks outside grounds, but I've never seen anyone throw a punch. Maybe I've just been lucky. Certainly there were punches thrown at Portman Road last year, but I wasn't there.

My knowledge of major violence at Leeds matches during my years of attendance stretch to two games, one on the giving end (Ipswich, where some of our 'fans' threw missiles at disabled opposition fans), and one on the receiving end (Galatasaray, where two of our fans were murdered by the opposition supporters), so I find it hard to understand where all this pure hate comes from.

plekhanov

28-05-2008, 15:06

Just because none of them have gone on to do anything of merit since leaving doesn't mean they weren't great with us. We beat Man Utd, and Arsenal, and Chelsea, and Liverpool, and were the last English team in the Champions League, and looked on target to win the league but bottled it at the last minute like we always do.

Ferdinand, Radebe, Dacourt, Batty et al are obviously talentless hacks. In much the same way as Waddle, Hirst, Carbone, di Canio and Walker.
Sorry but did you just cite Batty, Dacourt and Radebe in an attempt to substantiate your bizarre claim that Leeds played 'the most attractive football in the country' :loopy:

I'm not really the one who's delusional, since you appear to be of the mind that we are the worst team in history, worthy of nothing and would play better football if all our players were replaced with heroin addicts who are all dead.
I never said any such thing, why don't you try responding to what people actually post instead of strawmen of your own invention.

Zomoniac

28-05-2008, 17:42

Sorry but did you just cite Batty, Dacourt and Radebe in an attempt to substantiate your bizarre claim that Leeds played 'the most attractive football in the country' :loopy:

I never said any such thing, why don't you try responding to what people actually post instead of strawmen of your own invention.

I LOVE the way you accuse me of not "responding to what people actually post" and then mysteriously omit Kewell from the list of players I gave! And yes, I did cite those players. Batty was a great tackler and great player of through balls. Dacourt was a similar player.

I admit my 'the most attractive football in the country' comment may have been a bit flippant, but I certainly stand by us being the second most attractive behind the brilliant Arsenal team (of the Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Viera and Petit era). This was before Chelsea bought a new team and Liverpool got some half-decent players, and at the time Manchester United weren't playing attractive football, they were winning by grinding out results with a solid team, and a lot of the time relied on Solskjaer and/or Sheringham to win them matches with last-minute goals (yes, I'm well aware we've won most of our matches this season with last-minute goals!), not dissimilar to Chelsea of late. They certainly weren't playing the lovely, fast passing game the current team is.

Yes, I know we didn't win anything, but I just can't understand your resistance to my claim that maybe, just maybe, a team that finished in the Premiership top 5 for five straight years (three consecutive years inside the top 4, sadly before the 4th place CL spot was awarded) and reached two consecutive European semi-finals might actually have been a half-decent side.

WhiteHawk

28-05-2008, 17:57

I have nothing to say on this matter.....but these people (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7guAX9xMbxs)do :hihi:

OK it goes on for nearly 6 minutes but you get the gist
Brilliant!! :D:D Haven't got a clue what the other bit they're singing is though, all I can make out is the 'F' Off bit!!

Do you reckon we could set a world record by getting them to sing that at every single ground in the country at the same time?

rubydazzler

28-05-2008, 18:11

Brilliant!! :D:D Haven't got a clue what the other bit they're singing is though, all I can make out is the 'F' Off bit!!
Do you really not know? There's enough clips of different ManU supporters singing it on YouTube, just listen to some others:D My personal fave is the one with the bald guy in black leading the chant ... he's just so enthusiastic about it!

This one! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfhsWTDFF2w

WhiteHawk

28-05-2008, 18:17

Yeh I got it now after seeing it mentioned in the comments and stuff!

plekhanov

28-05-2008, 22:14

I LOVE the way you accuse me of not "responding to what people actually post" and then mysteriously omit Kewell from the list of players I gave! And yes, I did cite those players. Batty was a great tackler and great player of through balls. Dacourt was a similar player.
Of course I didn't mention him as unlike the others you listed he was capable of playing attractive football so it's wasn't laughable for you to cite him, Batty and Dacourt however, well they may have been reasonably effective in their way but exciting players of attractive football they most certainly were not.

I admit my 'the most attractive football in the country' comment may have been a bit flippant, but I certainly stand by us being the second most attractive behind the brilliant Arsenal team (of the Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Viera and Petit era). This was before Chelsea bought a new team and Liverpool got some half-decent players, and at the time Manchester United weren't playing attractive football, they were winning by grinding out results with a solid team, and a lot of the time relied on Solskjaer and/or Sheringham to win them matches with last-minute goals (yes, I'm well aware we've won most of our matches this season with last-minute goals!), not dissimilar to Chelsea of late. They certainly weren't playing the lovely, fast passing game the current team is.
What complete rubbish United in 01-02 did anything but 'grind out results with a solid team' they were top scorers in the league with 87 and after having lost Stam were anything but solid. They were nothing like Chelsea and if anything suffered from being excessively free flowing, a criticism which certainly can't be made of Chelsea.

Yes, I know we didn't win anything, but I just can't understand your resistance to my claim that maybe, just maybe, a team that finished in the Premiership top 5 for five straight years (three consecutive years inside the top 4, sadly before the 4th place CL spot was awarded) and reached two consecutive European semi-finals might actually have been a half-decent side.
Once again why can't you respond to what people actually post? I never said Leeds weren't a decent side back then, what I did say is that your claim that Leeds played 'the most attractive football in the country' ' 8 years ago' was complete rubbish as at that time both United and Arsenal had teams packed full of creative players playing brilliant football.

mholey

29-05-2008, 00:08

.

Yeah it was so unfair the way the rules were applied to you despite your boards pitiful attempts to find a loophole :roll:

Do you blame the club for looking for a way round our punishment? There is NO OTHER CLUB IN THE WORLD who would lie down and not attempt to get away with it.

mholey

29-05-2008, 00:13

Of course I didn't mention him as unlike the others you listed he was capable of playing attractive football so it's wasn't laughable for you to cite him, Batty and Dacourt however, well they may have been reasonably effective in their way but exciting players of attractive football they most certainly were not.

.

I disagree, Batty was very entertaining to watch. I love hard tacklers and people who played at pace. Batty was also an excellent passer of the ball.

However, thats the past. The present is not so attractive.

But we are still the Biggest team in Europe, of that let there be no doubt.

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 07:29

But we are still the Biggest team in Europe, of that let there be no doubt.

I will defend Leeds to the bitter end, but that's just a stupid thing to say. Unless you mean all our players are too fat :)

F. Sidebottom

29-05-2008, 08:07

I disagree, Batty was very entertaining to watch. I love hard tacklers and people who played at pace. Batty was also an excellent passer of the ball.

However, thats the past. The present is not so attractive.

But we are still the Biggest team in Europe, of that let there be no doubt.

And so aholey brings us right back round to the starting argument - Leeds fans are unbelievabley (if not ridiculously) arrogant to the point of delusional.

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 08:17

And so aholey brings us right back round to the starting argument - Leeds fans are unbelievabley (if not ridiculously) arrogant to the point of delusional.

No, that one Leeds fan is. Read my above post.

Leeds are a big team with a substantial global fanbase and as a club are much bigger than the teams around us. I would imagine (although I'm in no way stating this as fact) that in terms of fanbase and global name recognition, we are the biggest team outside the Premiership. But I don't believe most fans are in any way deluded enough to think that we are bigger than Man Utd, Liverpool, Barcelona, Real and the big Italian teams.

F. Sidebottom

29-05-2008, 09:05

No, that one Leeds fan is. Read my above post.

Leeds are a big team with a substantial global fanbase and as a club are much bigger than the teams around us. I would imagine (although I'm in no way stating this as fact) that in terms of fanbase and global name recognition, we are the biggest team outside the Premiership. But I don't believe most fans are in any way deluded enough to think that we are bigger than Man Utd, Liverpool, Barcelona, Real and the big Italian teams.

Once again another thread littered with arrogance.

If you are such a big club with such a big fan base, why was your average attendance two seasons ago just over 21,000? A lot less than both Sheffield teams?

You aren't anywhere near as big a club as you make out.

And as for global fanbase - don't make me laugh! (do you have any proof?).

BasilRathbon

29-05-2008, 09:07

No, that one Leeds fan is. Read my above post.

Leeds are a big team with a substantial global fanbase and as a club are much bigger than the teams around us. I would imagine (although I'm in no way stating this as fact) that in terms of fanbase and global name recognition, we are the biggest team outside the Premiership. But I don't believe most fans are in any way deluded enough to think that we are bigger than Man Utd, Liverpool, Barcelona, Real and the big Italian teams.

It's just a thought, but have Leeds considered asking Man Utd if they can be their "nursery" team? It's quite a common concept in other European countries; one of the big league giants "adopts" a little club in one of the bottom divisions and allows them to field their youth and reserve team players in return for having first option on any promising youngsters the nursery club produces.

And if you ask Man Utd and they turn you down, you could ask other bigger local clubs like Sheffield United or Man City, for example.

F. Sidebottom

29-05-2008, 09:29

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 09:32

Once again another thread littered with arrogance.

If you are such a big club with such a big fan base, why was your average attendance two seasons ago just over 21,000? A lot less than both Sheffield teams?

You aren't anywhere near as big a club as you make out.

And as for global fanbase - don't make me laugh! (do you have any proof?).

Our average all-time attendance is 25,634 (correct up to May 2006).

We are 10th. The top 10 are:

Man Utd (36,885)
Liverpool (33,773)
Spurs (33,437)
Arsenal (32,213)
Chelsea (31,322)
Newcastle (31,038)
Everton (31,023)
Man City (28,631)
Villa (27,992)
Leeds (25,634)

Wednesday are 13th with 21,285 and United are 18th with 18,939. Note how we are the ONLY team on that list not in the Premiership, as I stated. And, as a side note, the only team on that list from Yorkshire...

I can't find the stats for two years ago, but I'll take your word for it and I don't know the cause, although I suspect it was because we were still charging £40 a ticket at that point to watch a Championship team, which is stupid. Even the current £20 I think is a bit much for the quality of teams we're playing (and the quality of team we are, to be fair!). That isn't an excuse, but it's an educated guess as, assuming your stat is actually correct, I can't think of another reason why a team playing well in the Championship (we made the play-off final that year - and got humiliated) would attract 4,500 less people on average than the current team playing in League One.

But for this season, our average attendance is 25,720. Sheffield United's is 25,631 and Wednesday's is 21,410. So despite being a division below, we are still averaging better than both Sheffield teams, and have a substantially higher historical average than either of them.

As for the global fanbase, I've looked quickly for proof and have come up with nothing, so I shall gladly retract that comment as being misinformed speculation on my part until I can find something.

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 09:37

It's just a thought, but have Leeds considered asking Man Utd if they can be their "nursery" team? It's quite a common concept in other European countries; one of the big league giants "adopts" a little club in one of the bottom divisions and allows them to field their youth and reserve team players in return for having first option on any promising youngsters the nursery club produces.

It's an interesting idea. I like it in principal, although we could never do it with Man Utd, there would be major fan objection (because, sadly, many of us won't put our prejudices behind us even if it means better football on our part). But I think that Ken might be a bit big for his boots in this regard, I don't think his (or the club as a whole's) ego would allow us to effectively become somebody else's reserve team.

And if you ask Man Utd and they turn you down, you could ask other bigger local clubs like Sheffield United or Man City, for example.

That's a poor attempt at trolling, I shall not rise to your bait :)

geocol

29-05-2008, 10:40

And as for global fanbase - don't make me laugh! (do you have any proof?).

I think you might find the words "Leeds United", still etched into doors or scrawled on walls of cells certainly in Paris and Prague, and probably some other places to.

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 10:43

I think you might find the words "Leeds United", still etched into doors or scrawled on walls of cells certainly in Paris and Prague, and probably some other places to.

LOL! Can't argue with that :)

F. Sidebottom

29-05-2008, 10:59

Our average all-time attendance is 25,634 (correct up to May 2006).

We are 10th. The top 10 are:

Man Utd (36,885)
Liverpool (33,773)
Spurs (33,437)
Arsenal (32,213)
Chelsea (31,322)
Newcastle (31,038)
Everton (31,023)
Man City (28,631)
Villa (27,992)
Leeds (25,634)

Wednesday are 13th with 21,285 and United are 18th with 18,939. Note how we are the ONLY team on that list not in the Premiership, as I stated. And, as a side note, the only team on that list from Yorkshire...

I can't find the stats for two years ago, but I'll take your word for it and I don't know the cause, although I suspect it was because we were still charging £40 a ticket at that point to watch a Championship team, which is stupid. Even the current £20 I think is a bit much for the quality of teams we're playing (and the quality of team we are, to be fair!). That isn't an excuse, but it's an educated guess as, assuming your stat is actually correct, I can't think of another reason why a team playing well in the Championship (we made the play-off final that year - and got humiliated) would attract 4,500 less people on average than the current team playing in League One.

But for this season, our average attendance is 25,720. Sheffield United's is 25,631 and Wednesday's is 21,410. So despite being a division below, we are still averaging better than both Sheffield teams, and have a substantially higher historical average than either of them.

As for the global fanbase, I've looked quickly for proof and have come up with nothing, so I shall gladly retract that comment as being misinformed speculation on my part until I can find something.

Some interesting stats in there, but they are misleading.

These figures will include Wednesday and United attendences from the 1800's as we were amongst the first teams to play league football - and for all that time attendences were low.

And try telling a Man U fan that Spurs are almost as big as them. Or an Arsenal fan that Spurs ARE bigger than them due to all time average attendance. It simply doesn't ring true.

It doesn't paint a picture of what the situation is like in recent history - which is the main indicator.

You've also argued the point that the season before last you had low attendences due to £40 tickets. We can all argue reasons for lower attendences - Wednesday lost a lot due to the introduction of photo id on all season tickets, and anger at the Chairman.

Overall, I still disagree that you are the biggest club in the region or outside the Premiership.

geocol

29-05-2008, 10:59

I just find it somewhat unfair that I can walk the streets of Sheffield in a Leeds shirt and everyone thinks that I'm….. waiting to start a riot or …..burn their house down or impregnate their mother ... etc.

In other words, a bit like being German when you have been born since 1945, and you're tarred with the same brush as generations before.

On reflection Billy Bremner was probably more feared and created a greater degree of genocide than Heinrich Himmler, and I must admit Jack Charlton was more successful in the air than Hermann Goering.

BasilRathbon

29-05-2008, 11:03

On reflection Billy Bremner was probably more feared and created a greater degree of genocide than Heinrich Himmler, and I must admit Jack Charlton was more successful in the air than Hermann Goering.

That's as maybe, but if Josef Goebbels and Norman Hunter had had a fight in the car park after the game, who'd have won?

geocol

29-05-2008, 11:34

That's as maybe, but if Josef Goebbels and Norman Hunter had had a fight in the car park after the game, who'd have won?

On their own most def. Norman, but with their followers it would have been interesting indeed.
The brown shirts v the Whites. That woud have been quite a contest for the spectators - no, sorry surviviors!.

The other question is which force created the most fear and hatred amongst the normally extremely welcoming citizens of the aforementioned Prague

Those seeking Heidrich's killers in 1942, or Leeds United's followers in 2001!

Zomoniac

29-05-2008, 12:10

Some interesting stats in there, but they are misleading.

These figures will include Wednesday and United attendences from the 1800's as we were amongst the first teams to play league football - and for all that time attendences were low.

They're by no means to be taken as gospel, just a rough indication of consistency. Both Sheffield teams have much higher total attendances than Leeds, as you'd expect given they've been around 50 years longer.

And try telling a Man U fan that Spurs are almost as big as them. Or an Arsenal fan that Spurs ARE bigger than them due to all time average attendance. It simply doesn't ring true.

Quite. Although isn't the MU being huge thing relatively new? Until they started winning the Premiership I don't think they were selling out the stadium, and Old Trafford didn't expand beyond 40,000 capacity until about 1995.

It doesn't paint a picture of what the situation is like in recent history - which is the main indicator.

Funny that, when I said we were more successful than either Sheffield team 'in recent history', you laid into me for using a favourably selective timeline. And when the all-time stat works in our favour, you go and do exactly the same thing.

You've also argued the point that the season before last you had low attendences due to £40 tickets. We can all argue reasons for lower attendences - Wednesday lost a lot due to the introduction of photo id on all season tickets, and anger at the Chairman.

I never said otherwise. I merely stated it as the reason why for one season we had an abnormally low attendance.

Overall, I still disagree that you are the biggest club in the region or outside the Premiership.

Given that neither Leeds nor either Sheffield team has won anything of note over the last 15 years, and all attendance figures are very close, and it's impossible to prove either way, I suggest we simply agree to disagree on this matter.