I've come into contact lately with people who are truly the very dregs of our society... almost sub-human.

It's not until you have this contact that you realise just how low some people can go, and that they are never going to come back.

What do we do with them?

Is there a case to lock them up and throw away the key or maybe even just exterminate them like vermin?

Originally posted by Tony
I've come into contact lately with people who are truly the very dregs of our society... almost sub-human.

It's not until you have this contact that you realise just how low some people can go, and that they are never going to come back.

What do we do with them?

Is there a case to lock them up and throw away the key or maybe even just exterminate them like vermin?

I have to disagree. I don't believe that Markham and T020 are that bad Tony although not everyones cup of tea. Give them a chance!:|

Surely, under the rules, this should be merged into the bnp thread?

No they weren't in the BNP Max.

Back to the OP tho' - I think it's a fair question when people are of no use to either society or themselves.

There are people out there who draw benefits, spend their life on crack / herion / etc, steal, beg, squat, and actually live in a fetid pit of their own excrement, vomit and urine.

The rest of us waste our time, effort and money chasing about after them sorting out the mess.

Tony! I take it you are talking about the general teenager!
Or the ones who go around doing as they please, damaging others property, Have mouths like dustbins and no respect!

No Derek, see the post above. I don't mean annoying oiks, I mean people who are THAT low.

Originally posted by Tony
No Derek, see the post above. I don't mean annoying oiks, I mean people who are THAT low.
I met a few like that In Fox Hill once.......Not very nice and as you say....the pieces get picked p by everyone else.......They should ship them all out onto an island and give them what they want in the way of drugs etc.......That way they are in charge of their own destiny.

Amazes me how they allow these types to have children as well....Maybe they should sterilise them when they get that far gone

They should all be round up and sent to live in Barnsley.

Oh wait - they already have been...........

Maybe they should sterilise them when they get that far gone

They used to do this in another country about 60 years ago.

We might not like 'em but they can live their life how they choose, just because you don't agree doesn't give you anymore right to this planet than them.

Originally posted by fnkysknky
We might not like 'em but they can live their life how they choose, just because you don't agree doesn't give you anymore right to this planet than them.

Yes, but the lowlifes to which Tony refers tend to get by in life living of the backs of normal working folk who pay their taxes etc to bail out these parasitic scumbags, who have no place in a normal society. Yep, drop em off on some far flung Scottish isle with a few basics and leave 'em to it. I'm sure they would love working hard to feed and house themselves rather than face the alternatives.

Originally posted by Tony


There are people out there who draw benefits, spend their life on crack / herion / etc, steal, beg, squat, and actually live in a fetid pit of their own excrement, vomit and urine.



You answer your own question. No one would live like this if they werent so mind numbingly crestfallen. Find out why there are people like this who live amongst us. People who were once like the rest of it but through some chance of bad fortune (a relationship that went badly wrong/ a horrible lack of self preservation) became lost in the beautiful maze of life. People who are SO hedonistic that they can destroy themselves are rare.
If we want any chance as human beings we need to support such people and not always be mindful of the cost as if they extract a huge amount of money from the system.
I cant believe that some on here would consider the form of extremism that has haunted europe for years. Why do we still spit on strangers - the past has really taught us nothing. Not everyone in Africa is starving but i assume most of us would be loathed to say that the starving in Africa are in some way complicite in their own hunger.

What I'm saying is that if you ascribe blame to people who lie in doorways in the blistering cold then you negate your own guilt. We, as a society, have to protect such souls - we have a duty to protect children and the sick and the lost. it is the measure of a civilised society - and one of our few redeeming features on the planet. Without our ability for compassion we are nothing more than a plague of people that are sucking the life out of the world in the foney name of progress.

Afterall, we all head for oblivion in our own way. so imagine that some peoples only shot at this beautiful life is so wretched as to be not really a life at all. No chance. I feel priverlaged to pay to help these people, which we can do several times over if we stopped making more lost souls by bombing and destroying strangers. No one would live like this through choice - so making it seem like the lifestyle of the lazy is wrong and unhelpful. All humans belong to a shared humanity.

Its easy to sweep the dust under the carpet. What is more challenging is to find out where the dust came from. Most dust falls from the skin of our own flesh.

Originally posted by miniminch
I have to disagree. I don't believe that Markham and T020 are that bad Tony although not everyones cup of tea. Give them a chance!:|

And there speaks a pillar of society no doubt:loopy:

On behalf of t020 and myself,.....thanks for the unwarranted capital initial letters.

national service

Originally posted by robbie
national service

How would that help?

Originally posted by Tony
I've come into contact lately with people who are truly the very dregs of our society... almost sub-human.

It's not until you have this contact that you realise just how low some people can go, and that they are never going to come back.

What do we do with them?

Is there a case to lock them up and throw away the key or maybe even just exterminate them like vermin?

Apart from endorsing what Fnky and Mini said, I would just like to add that this is about the stinkiest bait I have seen all week. Stinkier than a roquefort sandwich in a bisons crotch.

:gag:


exterminate them like vermin?

We could have gangs of militia roaming the streets and popping the waifs and strays, and dumping them in the ocean you mean?

No tony, trust me on this - there isn't a case to be made for either of those radical solutions.

Frankly, given the question you posed, I'm surprised you didn't mention enforced sterilisation, gypsies and the mentally ill as well.

Miniminch, for a change, I agree with you.

I strongly believe the vast majority of people are able to contribute to society and want to contribute but sometimes they end up on the fringes of society where it becomes impossible to do anything constructive not lease because of comments like the ones earlier in this thread.

I know people who are now pillars of society - who were once the worthless people referred to. Equally I know people who once were pillars of society who are now on the fringes of society.

Sometimes treating people with respect can make much more of a difference than tea and sympathy. Of course there are people who are offensive, nasty and really horrible - but are they inherently evil? Rarely. Don't forget, behaviour breeds behavour.

I'm not a soft liberal - on the contrary, I think one of the things lacking in society is a realisation that every action has its consequences. Young people in particlar think they can get away with everything (and the even sadder fact is - they can)! It seems to me that young people do not have to face the consequences of their actions and this is not helpful for them or society as a whole. I know we're not just talking about young people here but IMHO I think not having to face the consequences of one's actions is a significant factor in anti-social behaviour.

I know people who have freely elected to drop out of normal society, get by on dole, drink and drugs and get their kicks out of making as much trouble as they can.

It's not a path I concur with, and the do-gooders say, "Cut them some slack because they're the true down and outs of society." Believe me, this is utter b******s.

A chap I knew had every opportunity in life. His parents bought him a car and everything he needed to start his own business. He ran riot with his business cheque book - there was nothing in the bank - and had a pi$$ up with his friends. He also told me that there was no drug he hadn't tried at least once. He ultimately paid the price by doing time at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

This low life also stole my sleeping pills when I was going through a rough time with my divorce and sold them to his friends. I had only just picked up the prescription, so the bottle was full.

He has stolen cars, money - even off his family members, been on crimestoppers at least twice that I can recall. He hasn't done a day's work in 10 years and counting, and has no desire to either. He lives with his girlfriend who has 4 children and is expecting twins in the not too distant future. Not to worry though, as long as he has his dole, his drugs and his drink, he's happy.

Doesn't sound like life to me.

Originally posted by Tony
I've come into contact lately with people who are truly the very dregs of our society... almost sub-human.

It's not until you have this contact that you realise just how low some people can go, and that they are never going to come back.

What do we do with them?

Is there a case to lock them up and throw away the key or maybe even just exterminate them like vermin?

I could have told you the annual moderators' dinner dance was a bad idea from the start! :D

Originally posted by Hels
Miniminch, for a change, I agree with you.


I found myself saying that last week, and now I do again.
Come on Mini - say something really stupid, this is uncomfortable!

Originally posted by Tony
I've come into contact lately with people who are truly the very dregs of our society... almost sub-human.

It's not until you have this contact that you realise just how low some people can go, and that they are never going to come back.

What do we do with them?

Is there a case to lock them up and throw away the key or maybe even just exterminate them like vermin?

WOW!!

Do you have issues, or what....

Get some help:P


Whatever happened to "there but for the grace of god...".....



I'm actually tempted to report this thread to a moderator due to the disparaging genralisations/tone, but that would probably prove pointless, as it was started by a mod....

Originally posted by sccsux
I'm actually tempted to report this thread to a moderator due to the disparaging genralisations/tone, but that would probably prove pointless, as it was started by a mod....

Me too, just seems like trolling to me... suggesting that we start 'exterminating' people?!?!

Do us all a favour, go out, get laid. :rolleyes:

Well now perhaps I should explain further.

I wrote the original post as a genuine question rather than a rhetorical one so I don't have any problem with the sick, the elderly, the ill, the disabled, or even those who are dispossessed, or at a bad time in their life.

Yesterday I spent the afternoon removing squatters from a property. Let's say it was an eye opener.

The property used to be a doctors surgery and after having it previously boarded up on 3 separate occasions the last time we were there we spotted respectable looking 12 year old girls going in with bottles of cider and alchopops on a school day afternoon. We went in through a broken down door to take a look.

The ground floor was littered with syringes, foil and all the other paraphernalia of drugs. Then we started to notice human excrement all over the floors, in the sinks, inside the cupboards, on worktops, etc, then the vomit, then the urine.

Rather than chuck them out, we retreated and asked for help from the Council, Environmental Health, The Police, and Social Services.

Anyway, yesterday after a lot of organising we went to evict them and re secure the premises. In attendance were..
7 police officers
2 environmental health officers
2 people from our firm
A specialist cleaning firm
A boarding up company

In addition various people in various offices had been involved in preparing for the above, and over the next few days perhaps a dozen other people will spend their days cleaning up,.

2 males were removed and taken to the police station. One was mid 30's, one was early 40's, both were brothers. They both looked over 70. :|. The were maybe 9 stone, had no teeth, completely grey skin, no hair. That's what drug use does. The Police knew the brothers by name and both were habitual criminals and visitors to prison. They were also dealing, and probably supplying to those respectable 12 year old girls! You wonder where teenage street prostitutes come from now?

They were past any point of return regardless of any care and clearly had no life of any known sort, and were continuing the cycle and introducing others to it. They will be dead soon from their activities, but what about the others?

My conclusion yesterday was that they of absolutely no use to themselves to civilised society - quite the opposite. They are the living dead.

I don't know the answer, but I thought it was a fair question to ask.

It's an interesting question you have posed Tony, but are these people really the dregs of humanity. Apart from themselves many don't harm anyone else apart from the burglary etc and yes I agree that that is bad enough.

But would you say that these people are worse than say mass murderers such as the Wests, Sutcliffe or Shipman. If society can spend millions on letting these live in comparative luxury in prisons then how can we honestly say that these others aren't worth the effort of trying to help.

Yes sanman, they are the dregs. It is not possible to be lower than the 'animals' I witnessed yesterday. The authorities have attempted rehabilitation, but even spells in prison result in an immediate return to previous form

They are the ones you hear about and think 'ooo, nobody can be a completely lost cause' but yesterday I was forced to revise my generally liberal opinion on that matter.

I'm not proposing exterminating people simply for drug addiction, but you will understand that I posed a wider question based on detailed experience.

The real issue is,if these people had skills and were encouragd to use them,they would not be squatting in property and encouraging innocent girls to go down the life of crime route.
You have to start from the beginning and get some answers .
If these people werent funded by the state to sit around doing nothing all day, they would have to get themselves sorted and get out to work and earn a living like the rest of us.
If they need support with that,then that is fine.
I work for an organisation who provides support for people with difficulties to enable them to find work.They will not however want that unless they are forced to come off benefits and get out and work.This kind of culture actually fuels this kind of crime

Originally posted by Tony
[B]No they weren't in the BNP Max.

Back to the OP tho' - I think it's a fair question when people are of no use to either society or themselves.


Link does not work Tony - or is it just me?

i totally agree with you Tony. and as for the so called do gooders how would they feel if it was thier 12 year old daughters, would they still be thinking aww bless the poor sods they only need help they didnt mean to introduce drugs etc.. to her ??? hmmm i think not!
and alot of them do hurt other folks, when they are burgerling properties some dont just take stuff and go, they hurt people and alot of these poeple are defensless old people. when they mug on the street alot of them do unmerciless/ unesercery harm. i have even had a friend stabbed by a users dirty needle you cant imagine what he was going through for months while waiting blood test results to see if he had cought something nasty.

Litha

Originally posted by Draggletail
Link does not work Tony - or is it just me?
It wasn't intended to be a link, it was merely underlined.

Originally posted by Litha
i totally agree with you Tony. and as for the so called do gooders how would they feel if it was thier 12 year old daughters, would they still be thinking aww bless the poor sods they only need help they didnt mean to introduce drugs etc.. to her ??? hmmm i think not!
and alot of them do hurt other folks, when they are burgerling properties some dont just take stuff and go, they hurt people and alot of these poeple are defensless old people. when they mug on the street alot of them do unmerciless/ unesercery harm. i have even had a friend stabbed by a users dirty needle you cant imagine what he was going through for months while waiting blood test results to see if he had cought something nasty.

Litha

That doesn't answer the question posed though does it. What would you do with these people?

(btw your obviously a "fascist" as there are only 2 classes of people on this site apparently - "do gooders" and "fascists").

I find it very hard to beleive that you really believe that these people are less worthy of our help than someone like Harold Shipman (what's his latest score, something over 200). Let's not beat around any bushes here if he hadn't committed suicide he would have been offered any help he wnated/needed. I know that this is an extreme example but we have many killers in jail who get our help and some of them will be addicts. However I would guess that many addicts only harm themselves and their families yet you seem to advocate that these people are unworthy of being helped.

What makes these people more unworthy of help than let's say Fred West?

well just for the record i think anyone who is capable of hurting old people children animals etc.. should be shipped off to an island some where away from the rest of society. and if me not wanting to help someone that had hurt my kids/loved ones makes me a fascist then okies ill live with been called one.

Litha

Originally posted by Litha
well just for the record i think anyone who is capable of hurting old people children animals etc.. should be shipped off to an island some where away from the rest of society. and if me not wanting to help someone that had hurt my kids/loved ones makes me a fascist then okies ill live with been called one.

Litha

Look what happened last time we tried that approach, Australia!

I've been thinking hard about this.

I'm coming to the idea that we should put them in a warehouse / island / hole / wherever, away from everyone else and provide them have all the free drugs they want for as long as they want along with food and drink of any description.

They can then decide what to do.

I expect that the hole will require filling in after a week or so. :(

Well I am happy for them to be tax payer funded in a secure environment where they can be assisted back onto their feet - so long as that doesn't include the concept of 'doing time'.

I'm not suggesting prison. I just think some people should be protected from themselves, as well as society being protected from them.

Of course, we used to have such institutions, but in the name of progress :loopy: we no longer do. Perhaps the focus should have been shifted instead of them being closed down?

Originally posted by Litha
well just for the record i think anyone who is capable of hurting old people children animals etc.. should be shipped off to an island some where away from the rest of society. and if me not wanting to help someone that had hurt my kids/loved ones makes me a fascist then okies ill live with been called one.

Litha

What about ducking stools or bombfires? Isn't that how "society" used to deal with those on the fringes of it?

Originally posted by Tony
I've been thinking hard about this.

I'm coming to the idea that we should put them in a warehouse / island / hole / wherever, away from everyone else and provide them have all the free drugs they want for as long as they want along with food and drink of any description.

They can then decide what to do.

I expect that the hole will require filling in after a week or so. :(

Well either that, or it will become the venue du jour for stag parties, hen nights and hedonistic holidays.

--edit
It sounds like Ibiza to me