Hi everybody. I know there are often 'bus rants' on SF. I wondered if, rather than moaning about it and all telling our own tales of woe, we could actually DO something? I'm not sure what we could do, but some kind of group action boycott on certain routes? Those of us who could walk a portion of our journey could join in.
If anyone has any ideas I'd happily collate/organise this.
Also, is there anyone from the Green Party on here who might give me some ideas on how to do this?
I know that writing letters doesn't work as all you get is a standard one back.
Thanks for reading.

Every time you get off a bus, leave a rotting haddock stuffed down the seat behind you. The smell will get so bad the vehicle will have to be taken out of service and, if enough of us do it, First buses will eventually run out of buses and go bankrupt, leaving some other company free to take over their routes.

A sensible policy for a fairer transport system!

We should encourage our elected representatives to bring buses cback under state control so that they work for the needs of the travelling public rather than their shareholders.

Ta da!

We should encourage our elected representatives to bring buses cback under state control so that they work for the needs of the travelling public rather than their shareholders.

Ta da!

Nice idea Libertybell. Unlikely though, don't you agree? So, in the absence of that crazy dream becoming reality, any other ideas?

I think the Green Party have been trying to do something about the First (almost) monopoly in Sheffield - but it seems to have been going on for a long time. I wouldn't be surprised if council corruption is involved to be honest. Everyone knows that they are too expensice and running beyond capacity. And paying the drivers far too little.

Are there any First drivers on here? Have you got a union?

Can someone do something???

Yes, the drivers always get slated on here - and admittedly some drivers can be grumpy and unhelpful, but then so can everyone. The point is, it's not their fault. So that's why I wondered if we could arrange some kind of action?
You might have a point about corruption Jeerumba ....

Well come on everybody? Or are we all just happier moaning and complaining and not doing anything?
Maybe you feel there is nothing to be done?

I agree - this thread doesn't seem to have taken off does it? I'd been thinking of writing something like this myself. It seems to me that the forum could be a great place to start something, rather than just talk and whinge (although that's often quite entertaining too!)

There seem to be loads of bus-users on the Forum, and we've all got stories of standing at a bus stop forever, getting a bog standard reply to complaints etc etc

Has no-one got any advice or ideas? Has anyone spoken to the SYPTE and learned things they can pass on? Or any other sources?

I get an over 60s pass next June but it will not stop me using my car and boycotting buses. Listening to them go up and down my road I expect to see a trail of spare parts littering the road behind them. I know the appalling condition of the roads in Sheffield smash our cars to pieces and appreciate this happens to the buses which are running all day every day.

1, is it drivers fault theres so many roadworks everywhere ?
2 , can a bus driver "magic" his way thro traffic ? .... maybe they should give em all a blue light to put on top of their bus & a siren
3, the parents should be brought to public shame that allow their kids to throw bricks thro bus windows .... "haha what a funny game" ..... ask that old lady 1 hit when i was driving last week !!!!(the bus has to come out of service with broken windows)
4,perhaps the ignorant car users that drive & / or park in bus lanes/stops/lay-bys should take some blame too ...

consider all the fact before you blame drivers , those are only a few

plz remember too .... we only need to hear the bell once to pull up at a stop , not 10 times

I just don't catch the bus anymore....I drive. I know not everyone can do this but those who can either should do so. If you're going to drive try and car pool where possible as you can share costs this way. Both my wife and I work in town and driving works out cheaper for us and is less hassle.

plz remember too .... we only need to hear the bell once to pull up at a stop , not 10 times

You'd think so wouldn't you, but there have been a few occasions when I have pressed the bell and the driver hasn't stopped...but hey **** happens.

a bus cant get thro the same gap as a car , nor can we go "off route" without authorisation in case of any incident eg crash or fire ... even then it may not be possible ... (narrow roads , weight restrictions , low bridges etc) .... so when ur stood there wantin to give the next bus that turns up a right gobful .... its very VERY rarely his/her fault ..... dya seriously think we like being late or stuck in traffic anymore than a car/van/lorry/motorcycle or any other vehicle ..... SERIOUSLY ???????

if you moaners can do any better .....

CLICK HERE (http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/jobs/apply.php?item=000020) & prove it !!!!

I already have ....... I bought a car :D

Honestly, I'd rather crap in my hand and slap myself around the face than use one of those nasty rattling contraptions.

Hi everybody. I know there are often 'bus rants' on SF. I wondered if, rather than moaning about it and all telling our own tales of woe, we could actually DO something? I'm not sure what we could do, but some kind of group action boycott on certain routes? Those of us who could walk a portion of our journey could join in.
If anyone has any ideas I'd happily collate/organise this.
Also, is there anyone from the Green Party on here who might give me some ideas on how to do this?
I know that writing letters doesn't work as all you get is a standard one back.
Thanks for reading.


what's the actual beef? Is it the length of time it takes to get from a-b because of poor road conditions, the chopping and changing of routes; astronomical fares or all of it?

I think the Green Party have been trying to do something about the First (almost) monopoly in Sheffield - but it seems to have been going on for a long time. I wouldn't be surprised if council corruption is involved to be honest. Everyone knows that they are too expensice and running beyond capacity. And paying the drivers far too little.

Are there any First drivers on here? Have you got a union?

Can someone do something???

I really wouldnt bank on getting any support from drivers on here,as it doesnt seem to be the most driver friendly place in the world,,sad fact is you are more than likely in the minority due to the fact there are millions of happy customers as oposed to the thousands of unhappy ones,take away the ones that jump on the band wagon and theres not much left.

what's the actual beef? Is it the length of time it takes to get from a-b because of poor road conditions, the chopping and changing of routes; astronomical fares or all of it?

Fair point,most people dont have an actual genuine complaint as such,,just that people love to come on here and feel sorry for themselves.

Well come on everybody? Or are we all just happier moaning and complaining and not doing anything?
Maybe you feel there is nothing to be done?

Spot on there,they come they moan they go away until someone starts another bus thread and we all go round in a big circle.

Fair point,most people dont have an actual genuine complaint as such,,just that people love to come on here and feel sorry for themselves.

and drivers really help dont they this last couple of weeks i have heard more complaints about first(last) than ever before they should lose the contract and let a company who can provide a service take over .

Fair point,most people dont have an actual genuine complaint as such,,just that people love to come on here and feel sorry for themselves.

My complaints are genuine, when stood waiting for the 81, which often fails to turn up or is more than half an hour late. See my other posting related to this thread.

I am not concerned about traffic jams when sat on a bus or grumpy drivers for that matter.
When buying a worst Bus monthly bus pass I am entering into a contract with the bus company to provide a 'reasonable service' and, as I have said before, they aren't! :mad:

Most of the complaints come about from actions other than those of the driver that gets complained to. In my experience the influx of drivers is no better or worse than before, but the good ones tend to leave quickly, leaving the remainder. This lowers morale for the longer service drivers as they see the job being denigrated by the newer drivers not doing the job properly. Please note that I am not saying that newer driver necessarily means worse driver.

The F in Circle logo seems strangely appropriate in my view. There appears to be little supervision on the road. This leads to drivers being left to deal with situations themselves, without reference to what everyone else is doing.

I agree that buses get held up in traffic. What surprises me is that most bus timetables seem to be oblivious to the fact that it might tale longer to get into the city in the peak. I know if I were to drive into the city, I would give myself more time so why does the bus company ignore this?

As for the idea of protesting against "F in Circle", it would need to hit them in the pocket. Alternatively data on service unreliability could be passed to the traffic commissioner for action, but due to the area that they cover, there tends to be little monitoring.

Finally my biggest gripe is the way that they deal with complaints. On a good day you get a standard letter, I have had complaints not replied to. They appear not to be taken seriously. Mistakes happen, accidents happen, hold ups happen but the F management seem to be oblivious to how this affects passengers.

And relax.

Please please try and get this up and running. Boycott the buses for a day, no in fact a week.
Then the damn things won't hold me up at bus stops and I'll have a lot faster journey to work in my car.
Brilliant idea, go for it guys!!;)

Hi all and thanks for your comments, helpful or otherwise!

Firstly, can I say that contrary to opinions expressed on here, I am not particularly bothered about sitting in jams when on a bus, or as Glennis says, 'grumpy' bus drivers. The thing I object to is that we pay our money and then do not get a reasonable service. For this I do not hold the drivers responsible in any way. Occasionally, after waiting forty minutes for a 'ten minute or better' frequency bus I HAVE asked the driver, but when faced (usually) with a look of resignation I take my seat. And I hardly ever fail to thank them. So, this is not about the drivers.

It IS about First Bus ripping off its customers, and I would really love to set something up whereby we did boycott them. Even for a day a week, where people could walk part of their route. (Which I do on 2 of the four 'legs' of my journey to and from work).

It is also about the extortionate prices they charge on single tickets, which means that I pay the £3 per day, but actually only use two buses.

So, if anyone has any ideas, or, as Jeerumba said, any inside information on what can be done, I'd love to hear them.

If not, please let's keep this post from slagging off bus drivers because that's not what this is about.

Also, please, bus drivers, don't slag off the customers.

Thanks

I don't think a getting off a stop early would help, as Worst Mainline would still get the £1.10 minimum fare and wouldn't suffer economically.

However, it might be quite effective if people boycotted them between the hours of 9-5, say one day a week, when there are plenty of Stage Coach buses running.

And, phone in every complaint, so they are forced to acknowledge / record all complaints.

Instead of accepting a bog standard reply, get back in touch and say you are not interested in a bog standard reply or apology, but want an explanation to your question ''what actually went wrong''.

This should ruffle the feathers of management, if they value thier reputation, customer service ethic and profits!

It IS about First Bus ripping off its customers, and I would really love to set something up whereby we did boycott them. Even for a day a week, where people could walk part of their route. (Which I do on 2 of the four 'legs' of my journey to and from work).




I was going to suggest this.

If people object to the price rises then it's no good just grumbling and then continuing to take the bus.

Do you really need to take the bus, or could you walk instead? I used to get the bus but then decided to walk. Result? I'm fitter, have got more money in my pocket and have stopped giving First my money.

If it's too far to walk and you have to take the bus, find out how far you need to walk to the bus stop where it's then a cheaper fare to your destination. It might only be a 5 minute walk in some cases.

There may also be alternative operators on your route with cheaper fares.

How about we form an undercover mob to steal all the bus stops and move them down to really narrow side roads and country lanes?

Then the bus drivers will go the wrong way and get stuck, First will run out of buses to operate their services and eventually go out of business.

Or alternatively let's all invest in a pair of inflatable buttocks that, when blown up mean you take up two seats, so First can only carry half as many passengers as normal and thus have their revenue cut by 50%?

Or alternatively let's all invest in a pair of inflatable buttocks that, when blown up mean you take up two seats, so First can only carry half as many passengers as normal and thus have their revenue cut by 50%?

I already do this? :hihi:

Or alternatively let's all invest in a pair of inflatable buttocks that, when blown up mean you take up two seats, so First can only carry half as many passengers as normal and thus have their revenue cut by 50%?

let us know where to buy them and we'll give it a go :hihi:

How about we form an undercover mob to steal all the bus stops and move them down to really narrow side roads and country lanes?

Then the bus drivers will go the wrong way and get stuck, First will run out of buses to operate their services and eventually go out of business.

Don't say that otherwise some clever person will go do it LOL

I would not care how grumpy and rude bus drivers are I can ignore them.
As long as a bus turns up on time.
Since the change on this route (no 12 Hall Park Hill)we were told it would be better,no hold ups on ecclesall road, now the service has gone from a 12 minute service to a 30 minute service due to missing buses.
Since we have had all these missing buses I have noticed all our buses are now double deckers which we only had occasionally before, resulting in very uncomfortable journeys for the elderly,disabled,and mothers with prams and small children who cannot get up the stairs.
And as I have said on previous threads very hazardous.
As I see it First had no intention of giving us a 12 minute service that why all the double deckers have appeared.
Also road works is no excuse .The queue waiting at hillsborough the other day were stood waiting for the no12. for 30 minutes and while we were waiting 2. number 11 went passed and 2. Bradfield.went passed.

This should ruffle the feathers of management, if they value thier reputation, customer service ethic and profits!

It's quite plain that they don't value their reputation and they have no customer service ethic.

Of course they value their profits - but a better service means less profit, so there is no incentive to improve.

Put it down to Tony Blair's legacy, - short of a revolution I can't see things changing for the better....ever :D

I don't think we can blame Tony Blair for the parlous state of public transport. Look back to Thatcher - before her, we had nationalised buses, costing about 2p per journey. Ah well ....

Fair point,most people dont have an actual genuine complaint as such,,just that people love to come on here and feel sorry for themselves.

I think a lot of people give the buses a go. We know we should use the bus instead of the car, but the experience of being late due to full buses or missing buses becomes too much of a hassle. I just gave up and now drive to work again. I don't think people moan enough to be honest. I didn't bother complaining, I just gave up using the service because it honestly isn't good enough.

Honestly, I'd rather crap in my hand and slap myself around the face than use one of those nasty rattling contraptions.
:hihi: Sums it up nicely I think.

You really have no idea do you.

Boycott First and this is the result:

Profits drop and unprofitable routes are cut with Stagecoach taking on some of these routes. Cycle continues until Stagecoach are the dominant operator. They are already South Yorkshire's dominant operator. Your Stagecoach fares will then be the same as First's because there would be no or little competition.

Their customer service is really no better than First.

The busses were privatised not for the passenger BUT to make them a business that could stand on it's own two feet with out government subsidies like the trains get and busses were getting under the public sector. Anyone remember the bus grant? In this objective it has worked extremely well. As a business all the bus companies you see now in the UK stand up without being propped up.

Passengers came second and it has took until now for the situation to stabalise and the customer service standards from retail sectors to start filtering through. Yes they are not perfect but what is. They are improving though.

As for you thinking First are bad and it would better without them you should get real. Who ever is the dominant operator will charge the same levels on fares. As said Stagecoach are the dominant operator in South Yorkshire and as a result charge the same fare levels as First charge on all their routes outside of Sheffield.

I don't think we can blame Tony Blair for the parlous state of public transport. Look back to Thatcher - before her, we had nationalised buses, costing about 2p per journey. Ah well ....

But we can. Re-regulation of public transport was in his 1997 manifesto and when Nulabour got in who did he appoint ot oversee the transition ?..... John '2-jags' Prescott :hihi:

You have to wonder how much companies like First and Stagecoach etc. have contributed to Nulabour party funds over the last ten years, and how many politicians have invested in these companies' shares. Virtual monopolies are a pretty safe bet for your nest-egg.

I guess one possible action of last resort would be if you have been kept waiting for an unreasonable lengh of time for a bus would be to get on it but refuse to pay and instead ask for an unpaid fare slip which (apparently) they have to do by law.

This does not mean you can avoid payment altogether but they will then have to go to the trouble of chasing you up later on, not to mention the constant agro to the driver of having to issue such slips. Sooner or later the hastle to them (company rather than driver) will be so great (if enough people do it) that it will be easier to put on extra buses or avoaid unnesessary delays.

Really a bus company (especially a monopoly one) will take the line of least resistance and if it is less trouble to supply you with the buses than to face the consequences of not doing so then they will get the message. Hit them where it hurts - in the pocket.

Hi all and thanks for your comments, helpful or otherwise!

Firstly, can I say that contrary to opinions expressed on here, I am not particularly bothered about sitting in jams when on a bus, or as Glennis says, 'grumpy' bus drivers. The thing I object to is that we pay our money and then do not get a reasonable service. For this I do not hold the drivers responsible in any way. Occasionally, after waiting forty minutes for a 'ten minute or better' frequency bus I HAVE asked the driver, but when faced (usually) with a look of resignation I take my seat. And I hardly ever fail to thank them. So, this is not about the drivers.

It IS about First Bus ripping off its customers, and I would really love to set something up whereby we did boycott them. Even for a day a week, where people could walk part of their route. (Which I do on 2 of the four 'legs' of my journey to and from work).

It is also about the extortionate prices they charge on single tickets, which means that I pay the £3 per day, but actually only use two buses.

So, if anyone has any ideas, or, as Jeerumba said, any inside information on what can be done, I'd love to hear them.

If not, please let's keep this post from slagging off bus drivers because that's not what this is about.

Also, please, bus drivers, don't slag off the customers.

Thanks



Now that does seem a very reasonable beef to me and I do have some ideas and will drop you a PM shortly.

You really have no idea do you.

Boycott First and this is the result:

Profits drop and unprofitable routes are cut with Stagecoach taking on some of these routes. Cycle continues until Stagecoach are the dominant operator. They are already South Yorkshire's dominant operator. Your Stagecoach fares will then be the same as First's because there would be no or little competition.

Their customer service is really no better than First.

The busses were privatised not for the passenger BUT to make them a business that could stand on it's own two feet with out government subsidies like the trains get and busses were getting under the public sector. Anyone remember the bus grant? In this objective it has worked extremely well. As a business all the bus companies you see now in the UK stand up without being propped up.

Passengers came second and it has took until now for the situation to stabalise and the customer service standards from retail sectors to start filtering through. Yes they are not perfect but what is. They are improving though.

As for you thinking First are bad and it would better without them you should get real. Who ever is the dominant operator will charge the same levels on fares. As said Stagecoach are the dominant operator in South Yorkshire and as a result charge the same fare levels as First charge on all their routes outside of Sheffield.

But why are there so competetive routes in Sheffield. At one time (early 1990s) almost every route had at least two bus companies on it at peak times whereas now competition is more the exeption than the rule.

I think the early 1990s was the golden age of bus travel. True the vehicle quality was not always great but frequencies were much higher and there was a genuine spirit of competition between both firms and drivers rather than some kind of cosy duopoly where they more or less leave each other alone.

a bus cant get thro the same gap as a car , nor can we go "off route" without authorisation in case of any incident eg crash or fire ... even then it may not be possible ... (narrow roads , weight restrictions , low bridges etc) .... so when ur stood there wantin to give the next bus that turns up a right gobful .... its very VERY rarely his/her fault ..... dya seriously think we like being late or stuck in traffic anymore than a car/van/lorry/motorcycle or any other vehicle ..... SERIOUSLY ???????

I think this is a major issue. There should be much more flexibility when responding to things like high traffic levels and this would make a big difference.

I guess one possible action of last resort would be if you have been kept waiting for an unreasonable lengh of time for a bus would be to get on it but refuse to pay and instead ask for an unpaid fare slip which (apparently) they have to do by law.

This does not mean you can avoid payment altogether but they will then have to go to the trouble of chasing you up later on, not to mention the constant agro to the driver of having to issue such slips. Sooner or later the hastle to them (company rather than driver) will be so great (if enough people do it) that it will be easier to put on extra buses or avoaid unnesessary delays.

Really a bus company (especially a monopoly one) will take the line of least resistance and if it is less trouble to supply you with the buses than to face the consequences of not doing so then they will get the message. Hit them where it hurts - in the pocket.

For the record yet again the drivers do not carry unpaid fare slips anymore nor is there a law requiring them to be carried on the vehicle the requirement these days is no bus fare or valid pass no travel, this obviously does not apply in the case of a child.

I take it d71146 you are a bus driver?
If so, do you mind me asking what YOUR opinions are on First (if you work for them). I don't mean from the point of view of slagging off bus drivers/slagging off bus users. I mean do you think service levels are acceptable? Do you think First over stretch their resources and staff.

I don't think a getting off a stop early would help, as Worst Mainline would still get the £1.10 minimum fare and wouldn't suffer economically.

However, it might be quite effective if people boycotted them between the hours of 9-5, say one day a week, when there are plenty of Stage Coach buses running.

And, phone in every complaint, so they are forced to acknowledge / record all complaints.

Instead of accepting a bog standard reply, get back in touch and say you are not interested in a bog standard reply or apology, but want an explanation to your question ''what actually went wrong''.

This should ruffle the feathers of management, if they value thier reputation, customer service ethic and profits!


I think more people should do this. I always send in a written complaint every time something is amiss (especially back when they were raising fares every few months). And if I receive a standard reply I write again saying that I want a response that shows they've actually read my initial letter. In my experience their 'customer services' department get very shirty with you when you do this, which gives me enormous satisfaction. It's never really achieved too much (other than I get a personal response each time now - they must remember me!), but if everyone did it, they'd be inundated and might have to do something. I also write back if I don't agree with the explanation they've given me. During the fare increases a couple of years back, I was involved in some ongoing communication with them, got the usual drivel about constant fare hikes being needed to cover driver's pay rises, increased fuel and insurance costs, but managed to annoy them enough with letters that they did finally admit it was all profit driven to satisfy their shareholders. Obviously I knew this already, but getting them to cut out the BS and tell it like it is took time.

Incidentally, the top dog from First was on BBC Breakfast this morning because their profits are up 24% this year. The business reporter was a complete wuss though, asking him how it felt to be so successful, etc. It made me sick.

The only thing that will hit them is something that affects their profits. As a private company this is all they are interested in - First are not about providing a public service. Unfortunately with their monopoly in many parts of the city, it is impossible for many to vote with their feet. Maybe a letter writing campaign to Stagecoach asking them to put services on more routes in direct competition with First, and to extend services to evenings and Sundays? it has done wonders for First's prices on the orange route.

Or alternatively let's all invest in a pair of inflatable buttocks that, when blown up mean you take up two seats, so First can only carry half as many passengers as normal and thus have their revenue cut by 50%?

Everyone could wear one of those sumo suits you can buy :)

TAKE ACTION!!!! How can we at Winn Gardens.....we have NO bus!

This is following the landslip on Middlewood Road. The 57 is now diverted away from this area and the small Optare used by Stagecoach will not stop at the bus stops at the shops end of the estate.

This means that there are disabled and elderly who have to walk to and from the tram stop...OK in the summer, but in winter when it is cold and icy and the pathway is not well lit because of the overhanging trees....couple that with carrying heavy shopping and slippery wet leaves underfoot.....it is no fun.

And I have tried to do something constructive about it...got in touch with SYPTE, First and Stagecoach and all can't be asked....

SYPTE tell me that routes are tendered and applied for and diversions are sanctioned and implemented at their say so....and it does not include any provision for Winn Gardens.

First only uses the routes as supplied by SYPTE and will not run larger buses round the existing Stockarth Lane diversion. They also will not entertain running a small feeder bus to and from Winn Gardens/Hillsborough Interchange (IMHO because it won't make them loads of money).

Stagecoach also can only run routes as supplied by SYPTE but because it is a tram link it cannot use all the stops the 57 would do.

I have tried to reason with all 3 that this is an exceptional circumstance but no-one is wanting to provide a service to us. The simplest of solutions would be for the STL to stop at the one extra stop at either end of the route....thus dropping off passengers who will have just come from the Tram or picking up passengers to go to the tram....IT ISN'T ROCKET SCIENCE.:rant:

So if you have any constructive ways of getting us a bus please let me know :D

I guess one possible action of last resort would be if you have been kept waiting for an unreasonable lengh of time for a bus would be to get on it but refuse to pay and instead ask for an unpaid fare slip which (apparently) they have to do by law.

This does not mean you can avoid payment altogether but they will then have to go to the trouble of chasing you up later on, not to mention the constant agro to the driver of having to issue such slips. Sooner or later the hastle to them (company rather than driver) will be so great (if enough people do it) that it will be easier to put on extra buses or avoaid unnesessary delays.

Really a bus company (especially a monopoly one) will take the line of least resistance and if it is less trouble to supply you with the buses than to face the consequences of not doing so then they will get the message. Hit them where it hurts - in the pocket.
I dont know if you realise that by telling people what to do as regards to not paying and asking for an unpaid fare slip could result in the person being removed from the bus by the police....may also be proscecuted!!
Unpaid fare slims no longer exist and its simple...No money..No travel.
If they were to refuse to leave and an inspector boarded they could end up with a Standard Fare of £35...
Before you tell people what to do i suggest you take a good look at the conditions of carriage which is an act set by parliament.

stink bombs would dp the trick

i thinking of selling them on ebay lol

Some useful information can be found at www.bususers.org.uk
Maybe a Sheffield and District bus user forum group could be formed and that maybe once up and running try and find some of the bus service providers could come to meetings or some form of regular contract with them to review operations as seen from a customers view and get an insight into how the operators respond face to face!!

TAKE ACTION!!!! How can we at Winn Gardens.....we have NO bus!

This is following the landslip on Middlewood Road. The 57 is now diverted away from this area and the small Optare used by Stagecoach will not stop at the bus stops at the shops end of the estate.

This means that there are disabled and elderly who have to walk to and from the tram stop...OK in the summer, but in winter when it is cold and icy and the pathway is not well lit because of the overhanging trees....couple that with carrying heavy shopping and slippery wet leaves underfoot.....it is no fun.

And I have tried to do something constructive about it...got in touch with SYPTE, First and Stagecoach and all can't be asked....

SYPTE tell me that routes are tendered and applied for and diversions are sanctioned and implemented at their say so....and it does not include any provision for Winn Gardens.

First only uses the routes as supplied by SYPTE and will not run larger buses round the existing Stockarth Lane diversion. They also will not entertain running a small feeder bus to and from Winn Gardens/Hillsborough Interchange (IMHO because it won't make them loads of money).

Stagecoach also can only run routes as supplied by SYPTE but because it is a tram link it cannot use all the stops the 57 would do.

I have tried to reason with all 3 that this is an exceptional circumstance but no-one is wanting to provide a service to us. The simplest of solutions would be for the STL to stop at the one extra stop at either end of the route....thus dropping off passengers who will have just come from the Tram or picking up passengers to go to the tram....IT ISN'T ROCKET SCIENCE.:rant:

So if you have any constructive ways of getting us a bus please let me know :D

I think its more a case of red tape wins again,routes are very stricly gouverned and you cant just make one up,sadly thats the law all routes must be registered and aproved before any operator can even begin to supply a service.
I find the PTE response very interesting,sort of like a washing their hands of the whole afair.

All this comes at a time when it was announced today that the council will have more say over how operators run routes,,all when and good when even the PTE cant and wont resolve this one.

This council is to be the very same council that has families with children living in houses with no central heating,damp walls,mildew and good housing stock supplied to crack heads and other low forms of life.
Roads in a shocking state of repair,street lights not working,streets covered in filth and rubbish,so a minor problem such as a bus to middlewood would be a doddle,,,,,however if they cant manage any of the above then what chance do we have,,,,,,all I can say is good luck

TAKE ACTION!!!! How can we at Winn Gardens.....we have NO bus!

This is following the landslip on Middlewood Road. The 57 is now diverted away from this area and the small Optare used by Stagecoach will not stop at the bus stops at the shops end of the estate.

This means that there are disabled and elderly who have to walk to and from the tram stop...OK in the summer, but in winter when it is cold and icy and the pathway is not well lit because of the overhanging trees....couple that with carrying heavy shopping and slippery wet leaves underfoot.....it is no fun.

And I have tried to do something constructive about it...got in touch with SYPTE, First and Stagecoach and all can't be asked....

SYPTE tell me that routes are tendered and applied for and diversions are sanctioned and implemented at their say so....and it does not include any provision for Winn Gardens.

First only uses the routes as supplied by SYPTE and will not run larger buses round the existing Stockarth Lane diversion. They also will not entertain running a small feeder bus to and from Winn Gardens/Hillsborough Interchange (IMHO because it won't make them loads of money).

Stagecoach also can only run routes as supplied by SYPTE but because it is a tram link it cannot use all the stops the 57 would do.

I have tried to reason with all 3 that this is an exceptional circumstance but no-one is wanting to provide a service to us. The simplest of solutions would be for the STL to stop at the one extra stop at either end of the route....thus dropping off passengers who will have just come from the Tram or picking up passengers to go to the tram....IT ISN'T ROCKET SCIENCE.:rant:

So if you have any constructive ways of getting us a bus please let me know :D

Just a few pointers:

Walking will aid in keeping you fit and mobil.

Lobby your local counciler for better lighting facilities and to employ a full time minimum wage gritter for your safety (there are more than enough on benifits in this city)

As a rocket scientist as you obviously are. Have empathy for real problems in the world and not the vacum you obviously dwell in. people are been murdered in the world tonight as you sleep well and save.

Just a few pointers:

Walking will aid in keeping you fit and mobil.

Lobby your local counciler for better lighting facilities and to employ a full time minimum wage gritter for your safety (there are more than enough on benifits in this city)

As a rocket scientist as you obviously are. Have empathy for real problems in the world and not the vacum you obviously dwell in. people are been murdered in the world tonight as you sleep well and save.

Very helpful. Thanks for that Runningboard. Get back under your bridge.

Just a few pointers:

Walking will aid in keeping you fit and mobil.

Lobby your local counciler for better lighting facilities and to employ a full time minimum wage gritter for your safety (there are more than enough on benifits in this city)

As a rocket scientist as you obviously are. Have empathy for real problems in the world and not the vacum you obviously dwell in. people are been murdered in the world tonight as you sleep well and save.

And you are again?.....sorry :|

What are you on about......I don't live in a vacuum and with regret I cannot do anything about people being murdered across the world tonight as I sleep.....what the chuff has that got to do with the topic. Perhaps you should save your venom for the "you aren't doing anything whilst people are being murdered as you sleep" thread....:o there isn't one.....then why don't you toddle off and start one :hihi:

Oh and learn to spell young man, learn to spell!!!!

The tramlink route was amended as a result of the flooding to set down and pick up at a different bus stop on it's route that it does not use normally and was classed as an emergency amendment by VOSA.

Flooding was nature so is nothing to do with the bus companies. The SYPTE is the organisation you need to take this up with not the companies as a shuttle service would be classed as a social needs route and would fall in their remitt. All stops and routes are tightly controlled and cannot be altered just like that.

The companies are there to provide a service to the residents on the WHOLE 57/58 route not just Winn Gardens. The amount of people a route change would effect to just serve you is probably to many. The majority win in this case.

So Stagecoach (this forums best friend) doesn't want to know eh. Welcome to reality.

I think its more a case of red tape wins again,routes are very stricly gouverned and you cant just make one up,sadly thats the law all routes must be registered and aproved before any operator can even begin to supply a service.
I find the PTE response very interesting,sort of like a washing their hands of the whole afair.

All this comes at a time when it was announced today that the council will have more say over how operators run routes,,all when and good when even the PTE cant and wont resolve this one.

This council is to be the very same council that has families with children living in houses with no central heating,damp walls,mildew and good housing stock supplied to crack heads and other low forms of life.
Roads in a shocking state of repair,street lights not working,streets covered in filth and rubbish,so a minor problem such as a bus to middlewood would be a doddle,,,,,however if they cant manage any of the above then what chance do we have,,,,,,all I can say is good luck

Its not even about me making up a new route Volvo....the STL could easily just make an additional stop at the Winn Garden stops - it would add one stop at the beginning of the route and one at the end....no extra expense, no extra manning, no extra buses. But that is just too simple isn't it. :D

The companies are there to provide a service to the residents on the WHOLE 57/58 route not just Winn Gardens. The amount of people a route change would effect to just serve you is probably to many. The majority win in this case.

So Stagecoach (this forums best friend) doesn't want to know eh. Welcome to reality.

The person I spoke to at Stagecoach thought it was an excellent idea and saw the logic in what I was saying....he too approached the SYPTE and was told that an additional pickup could not be added because of the "blah blah blah" regulations etc.....

I did manage to negotiate with this chap that also the people further up by the Middlewood Tavern would have a long walk to and from tram and suggested it might be useful whilst the road is closed for there to be a pickup from that area...and indeed the bus now stops at the bottom of Stockarth Lane.

It's not a cast of Welcome to Reality....it's a case of finding simple but effective solutions to problems and in this case I have found with the exception of the man at Stagecoach that everyone thinks it is everyone else's problem and whilst such attitudes exist then the whole of the public transport network in South Yorkshire will be as bad as it is. :)

I don't think Stagecoach is the Forum's best friend - that's silly. We're not naive enough to believe that one bus company has a halo and the other one doesn't. We just want some REAL competition in Sheffield!

It is pretty much a monopoly at the moment - and surely that's the fault of whoever hands out the contracts (no doubt after a completely above board bidding process completely free from bribery or little chats on the fairway).

Thatcher and Blair can both be blamed (and rightly) but it's got to the be the local council in the end hasn't it?

I can't stand that the fact that shareholders are making money from the fact that I am waiting at a bus stop, watching buses sail past with 'Sorry not in service' written on the front. It stinks. This is a public service.

Thatcher and Blair can both be blamed (and rightly) but it's got to the be the local council in the end hasn't it?

I can't stand that the fact that shareholders are making money from the fact that I am waiting at a bus stop, watching buses sail past with 'Sorry not in service' written on the front. It stinks. This is a public service.

Where have you been???? With respect public transport hasn't been a public SERVICE for yonks.....it all comes down now to what routes are the most profitable and those who yield less profit are marginalised or even withdrawn....which is why the system is in such a mess......with First it comes down to PROFIT BEFORE PASSENGERS...nothing more, nothing less. :D

Buses are rubbish!!

It is pretty much a monopoly at the moment - and surely that's the fault of whoever hands out the contracts (no doubt after a completely above board bidding process completely free from bribery or little chats on the fairway).

Where are these comments about contracts coming from? The only city in Britain that operates bus franchises is London. Everywhere else buses are run on an independent commercial basis, the bus companies decide on a route they want to run that will make money and register it. The only regulations in force is that they run what they register and use safe vehicles.

The only services run under contract is where SYPTE have decided that there are gaps that need filling with additional services that might not be profitable but socially or economically essential for the community. These services are subsidised by SYPTE and put out to tender and the bus operator prepared to run the service for the lowest subsidy wins the contract. This is why on some First routes the evening and Sunday services are operated by Stagecoach or TM Travel, and why some areas have crazy little minibuses shuttling round under the 'rural-link' or 'local-link' banner.

Oh! Thanks for the information. Yes - perhaps I was thinking of London. But this is worse than I thought!
OK. (Deep breath). So can we complain to the SYPTE about the general service - eg some timetables being a pack of lies?
It's sad that, at 37 years old, I feel so out of touch for mentioning 'public' transport as though it were a public service!

And have you noticed how the police are getting younger... dribble dribble...

The only regulations in force is that they run what they register and use safe vehicles.

AndC - (I'm still waiting for my pm!) Who polices this? Because I think it's pretty plain that First (I can't say anything about Stagecoach because I don't live on their route) routinely advertise frequencies which are blatant lies.
Also, can yoiu (or any one out there) explain why at 7.30 am two or maybe three buses can come UP Abbeydale Road 'OUT OF SERVICE'. What's all that about? Or DOWN from Totley at 6pm 'OUT OF SERVICE'.

It's fascinating to learn how these firms operate and my original post was appealing for info ... so then we can try and do something.

Knowledge is power and all that ....

AndC - (I'm still waiting for my pm!) Who polices this? Because I think it's pretty plain that First (I can't say anything about Stagecoach because I don't live on their route) routinely advertise frequencies which are blatant lies.
Also, can yoiu (or any one out there) explain why at 7.30 am two or maybe three buses can come UP Abbeydale Road 'OUT OF SERVICE'. What's all that about? Or DOWN from Totley at 6pm 'OUT OF SERVICE'.

It's fascinating to learn how these firms operate and my original post was appealing for info ... so then we can try and do something.

Knowledge is power and all that ....


Why are they blatant lies? its of no use expecting to find out how the logistics of an operator work by way of this forum.
All you will find here is a total disregard for any form of reasoning,in the past reasons have been offered up as a way of discussion only to be shot down as total rubbish as people just refuse to listen.
Ive constanly said on this forum that people need to see the bigger picture regardless of who the operator is,until this happens people will not even be half way to understanding the current problems in the transport industry.

The buses will be out of service for a number of reasons,running back to depot for end of shift,running to an outer terminus to start a service,running to make an adjustment for a late or missing service,adjusting over to evening timetable,ect ect.....

Problems recently have got worse due to extreme traffic conditions,constantly changing road layouts,diversions late completion of roadworks,,sadly in todays society people want it all and they want it now,,alterations have been made to services and people expect to see instant results.
With any new service there will be teething problems,sadlt peoples views are that these problems are not acceptable as they believe everything should just click into place.

Buses will also go missing due to the fact that the PTE will now direct buses going for a layover at the interchange are returned to the garage,,that bus is the missing as the takeover driver must then go all the way to the garage to take it over and be adjusted accordingly,,,,this can result in a service being up to an hour late.

That is the fault of the PTE not the operator.

You will also find the PTE show favour to certain operators at the moment,I have seen this first hand,,,this however not an issue for PTE management but more the way of the little hittlers than stalk the interchange.

Its not even about me making up a new route Volvo....the STL could easily just make an additional stop at the Winn Garden stops - it would add one stop at the beginning of the route and one at the end....no extra expense, no extra manning, no extra buses. But that is just too simple isn't it. :D


As simple as it seams,,no its not that simple its the its the same lack of simplicity that is eating away at our transport system as we speak,,even addin an extra stop requires a process that is to be honest ridiculous beyond belief.
First for example were rquired by law to register the the current diversion as a new route in order to be allowed to run it,thus cancelling out the old route,once (if ever) the road repairs are ever done the whole process must be done again.
Even for STL to do as you say (logical yes) but the same process must be adhered to,fialing to do this has all sorts of legal implications for the operator,driver and even the passengers.

I don't think Stagecoach is the Forum's best friend - that's silly. We're not naive enough to believe that one bus company has a halo and the other one doesn't. We just want some REAL competition in Sheffield!

It is pretty much a monopoly at the moment - and surely that's the fault of whoever hands out the contracts (no doubt after a completely above board bidding process completely free from bribery or little chats on the fairway).

Thatcher and Blair can both be blamed (and rightly) but it's got to the be the local council in the end hasn't it?

I can't stand that the fact that shareholders are making money from the fact that I am waiting at a bus stop, watching buses sail past with 'Sorry not in service' written on the front. It stinks. This is a public service.

Its a business first and public transport second,this is the same for all operators no matter who they are,shareholders and massive bonus payouts to driectors are the order of the day.
Goverment intervention is unlikey to happen as a major form of resolve.
Imagine how much revenue is raised to government by operators on a national basis,road tax=millions employee icome tax=millions NI contributions=millions.

I don't think Stagecoach is the Forum's best friend - that's silly. We're not naive enough to believe that one bus company has a halo and the other one doesn't. We just want some REAL competition in Sheffield!

It is pretty much a monopoly at the moment - and surely that's the fault of whoever hands out the contracts (no doubt after a completely above board bidding process completely free from bribery or little chats on the fairway)..

The only 'contracts' given to run services are those that are unprofitable, but are still required. Bus companies compete for the tender from SYPTE, who provide funding for the service. The process is unfair, but not because of bribes etc. It's because a company can be running a service, turn round and say it's unprofitable, the SYPTE have no legal right to demand figures from the company to see how much it costs to run or how much money it brings in, so they put it out to tender, and often the same bus company wins the tender, because they are the only ones who know how much it costs to run the route, and so usually put the lowest 'bid' in. The process allows abuse because the companies may say it is unprofitable when it isn't in order to get the public funding on top of whatever profit they are making from the service.

Other than that, any bus company can run services. There is no 'contract' for the local area.

The problems discribed in this thread are all out of the operators hands.

The Inner Ring road works has affected every bus using Shalesmoor, Barnsley Road and Attercliffe Road for the last 2 years and still is, especially my 76 but that is life. It is this that is making the busses late, missing out and long journey times.

The regulations are what is causing the Winn Gardens problem but I say again why should Deepcar and Stocksbridge passengers suffer longer journeys just because of Winn Gardens problem. Oh and I'm pretty sure nature had a helping hand did it not.

As for de-regulation/re-regulation well that is a government issue not a bus company issue. Open your eyes to the bigger picture. It really is eye opening.

You will also then see the government has no intention of re-regulation of old. Possibly a London model on the cheap yes but then your taxes will rise to pay for it.
Personally we should try this model somewhere as a test then we would know one way or the other if it really works.

Thanks, all, these points make a lot of sense. It makes a change not just hearing about bus drivers but real INFORMATION. Even the buses running 'out of service' makes sense (whilst still being VERY annoying!)

Now, what about the operators advertising high frequency services but not delivering them? Can anyone shed anyy light on this.

It seems that there is not a lot we can do, apart from walk? Lucky if you live within walking distance of your destination?

Well come on everybody? Or are we all just happier moaning and complaining and not doing anything?
Maybe you feel there is nothing to be done?

I stoped using First Mainline about a year ago because, i have stated on various threads on SF, the timetable was a joke and when i complained about missing buses with specific examples i was virtually called a liar by their customer liason bloke.

Since then i bought a car, because the service was so unreliable and when i go for a pint i put myself out and only catch stagecoach.
Sometimes all you can do is talk with your money and be satisfied that you aren't giving them your hard earned cash for a poor service.
And because they have shown that they don't really care about customer service i don't think they give a flying toss if a few people boycott their bus routes.
It would take a huge number of people and a large amount of publicity on a regular basis to make this transport giant sit up and take notice.

I'm happy i don't use them anymore, but if you ever need support to organise any protest or publicity just PM me, i am at your service :)
Good luck.

[QUOTE=julado;2815040]Where have you been???? With respect public transport hasn't been a public SERVICE for yonks.....it all comes down now to what routes are the most profitable and those who yield less profit are marginalised or even withdrawn....which is why the system is in such a mess......with First it comes down to PROFIT BEFORE PASSENGERS...nothing more, nothing less. :D[/QUOTE

I often wonder if any 'Managers' at First ever reads any of these threads?

Well this forum is just full of these threads anyone forcast more bus bashing threads or people whinging tomorrow? :hihi:

The thing is though the bus companys always have the last laugh.

Oh look the fuel price has just gone up.... I wonder whats coming?

When the fuel price goes down, guess what never happens.

Believe the last thing on share holders minds, is happy customers.

If you ran a business where you were running a monopoly, what would be your goal? money or happy customers?

[QUOTE=samstar999;2815214] Also, can yoiu (or any one out there) explain why at 7.30 am two or maybe three buses can come UP Abbeydale Road 'OUT OF SERVICE'. What's all that about? Or DOWN from Totley at 6pm 'OUT OF SERVICE'. QUOTE]

Not sure which direction you mean when saying up and down but I would imagine at 7:30am buses are heading out from the depot ready to start the increased frequencies that run in the daytime for commuters and shoppers, and also heading out ready for the school services. At 6pm buses will be returning to the depot as the frequencies reduce in the evening as demand reduces, and I also imagine there are probably a number of drivers changing shifts at this time too. These will all be scheduled empty vehicle movements. Of course there will sometimes be the need to return buses to the depot unplanned for reasons such as defects, vandalism or simply traffic jams delaying the bus to the point where the driver runs out of working hours (there is a legal limit on the number of hours a driver is allowed to work without a break for reasons of public safety).

[QUOTE=samstar999;2815214]AndC - (I'm still waiting for my pm!) Who polices this? Because I think it's pretty plain that First (I can't say anything about Stagecoach because I don't live on their route) routinely advertise frequencies which are blatant lies. /QUOTE].

If a high percentage of buses are being cancelled, running early or running seriously late for reasons within the bus operator's control, then VOSA can take action. VOSA will also take action against operators with unacceptable maintanance standards or unsafe operating practices.

You can find out about VOSA at www.vosa.gov.uk. Remember though that proper evidence is required for them to do anything, not just vague anecdotal stuff.

The thing is though the bus companys always have the last laugh.

Oh look the fuel price has just gone up.... I wonder whats coming?

When the fuel price goes down, guess what never happens.

Believe the last thing on share holders minds, is happy customers.

If you ran a business where you were running a monopoly, what would be your goal? money or happy customers?

*coughs*

What about price changes due to the "increase in the price per barrell of oil", yet, the beggars admit that they have already bought oil in, in bulk at a very good price, far below the normal cost!

Where have you been???? With respect public transport hasn't been a public SERVICE for yonks.....it all comes down now to what routes are the most profitable and those who yield less profit are marginalised or even withdrawn....which is why the system is in such a mess......with First it comes down to PROFIT BEFORE PASSENGERS...nothing more, nothing less. :D

You should know that seen as we had that as in the quiz the other week lol.

And you are again?.....sorry :|

What are you on about......I don't live in a vacuum and with regret I cannot do anything about people being murdered across the world tonight as I sleep.....what the chuff has that got to do with the topic. Perhaps you should save your venom for the "you aren't doing anything whilst people are being murdered as you sleep" thread....:o there isn't one.....then why don't you toddle off and start one :hihi:

Oh and learn to spell young man, learn to spell!!!!

Perspective

While you rant on about your bus service you are wasting energy. The fact is the location is closed due to mother nature. It is under the councils control to ensure that repairs are undertaken. Not the bus companies, lobby them. It aint rocket science?! If you have a problem with a specific service provider go direct to the top, and good luck. Inteligence is not the ability to complain and whing but to interact with those in the position to do something about this. Obviously, you need directions within this area. Soory I cant help as you think I'm a young man with the in ability to spell. You are corrct on one point but then I do have the relevent paperwork to proof this.

If you dont understand any of the above move to an area that has a better public servic.

Very helpful. Thanks for that Runningboard. Get back under your bridge.

Yes I like to give advice but not every one likes it.So I'm off to the deaf group..anyone interested thread. I'll fit in just fine as my signe language is limited.

Perspective

While you rant on about your bus service you are wasting energy. The fact is the location is closed due to mother nature. It is under the councils control to ensure that repairs are undertaken. Not the bus companies, lobby them. It aint rocket science?! If you have a problem with a specific service provider go direct to the top, and good luck. Inteligence is not the ability to complain and whing but to interact with those in the position to do something about this. Obviously, you need directions within this area. Soory I cant help as you think I'm a young man with the in ability to spell. You are corrct on one point but then I do have the relevent paperwork to proof this.

If you dont understand any of the above move to an area that has a better public servic.

What are you on about. I need no directions from you about how to interest with businesses....the paperwork I have that tells me I am trained in trade union negotiation skills possibly gives me a small advantage....believe me I know how to contact, who to contact and at what level, how to interact, to compromise and ultimately to reach an amicable settlement.

As Volvo has said it appears to be a simple problem but the red tape of bureaucracy prevents a sensible solution.

Yes I like to give advice but not every one likes it.So I'm off to the deaf group..anyone interested thread. I'll fit in just fine as my signe language is limited.

And being the mother of a deaf son I also have quite a vocabulary in sign language....I don't see the relevance of your comment.

My daughter was asked to get off the bus last night at Herdings tramstop, because the bus driver terminated the service.

It was freezing cold, pitch black, no one around and she doesn't even know the area that well.

The worst thing was she had a weekly saver and the bus driver continued his journey around the estate to where she wanted to go.

Why couldn't he have let her sit on the bus for another two or three stops, or dropped her in a safer place?

This was a young women in her early twenties. Nice one mate.

I hope your wife / daughter gets greater consideration should the same thing happen to her.

My daughter was asked to get off the bus last night at Herdings tramstop, because the bus driver terminated the service.

It was freezing cold, pitch black, no one around and she doesn't even know the area that well.

The worst thing was she had a weekly saver and the bus driver continued his journey around the estate to where she wanted to go.

Why couldn't he have let her sit on the bus for another two or three stops, or dropped her in a safer place?

This was a young women in her early twenties. Nice one mate.

I hope your wife / daughter gets greater consideration should the same thing happen to her.

This really gets my goat with the 47/48 service. The 48 goes right past the depot at Olive Grove as part of it's route. So instead of terminating the service at Herdings to take the bus off for the day, why don't they go up to Herdings and then keep it in service until Olive Grove? That way additional passengers can use it up to that point. Same for first thing in the morning. If my dad has to come to my house first thing he has to stand at the stop on East Bank Road watching endless 47/48 buses going up to Herdings to start their day's service, but he can't catch most of them, even though they're going past exactly where he wants to go. It's madness. Surely even First can spot the potential for a bit of extra profit here?

This really gets my goat with the 47/48 service. The 48 goes right past the depot at Olive Grove as part of it's route. So instead of terminating the service at Herdings to take the bus off for the day, why don't they go up to Herdings and then keep it in service until Olive Grove? That way additional passengers can use it up to that point. Same for first thing in the morning. If my dad has to come to my house first thing he has to stand at the stop on East Bank Road watching endless 47/48 buses going up to Herdings to start their day's service, but he can't catch most of them, even though they're going past exactly where he wants to go. It's madness. Surely even First can spot the potential for a bit of extra profit here?

It does seem madness and dangereous in some instances. My daughter heard that they had booted a very elderly man off the bus the other week, what are they thinking about?

It would make sense for some of the out of service buses to run in service to the outer. That way the company could receive some Fuel Rebate (BSOG as its now called) for running the mileage and passengers would receive a better service. However the buses would have to run to the time and that could be an issue as empty running time is less and normally includes an allowance for recovery of any delays leaving depot.

we could walk

i think it'll be the bus company's rules that they have to kick people off at the terminus, the driver could risk getting sacked if he didnt. its not good, i know & he probably feels horrible for having to do it, but you cant really blame the driver.

What are you on about. I need no directions from you about how to interest with businesses....the paperwork I have that tells me I am trained in trade union negotiation skills possibly gives me a small advantage....believe me I know how to contact, who to contact and at what level, how to interact, to compromise and ultimately to reach an amicable settlement.

As Volvo has said it appears to be a simple problem but the red tape of bureaucracy prevents a sensible solution.

So why dont you put as much effort into the paperwork as you all do in the SF. I come across people on a daily basis that give up at the first rejection or reply they recieve from the powers in question.

So instead of taking it out on the frontline staff that do not make policy but are forced to follow insentative working procedure go direct.

Get off the soap box, stop shouting at the wrong people and be productive.

Use your training and conections or are you as all the other traid unionest. Your there for your own political and personal goals.

My daughter was asked to get off the bus last night at Herdings tramstop, because the bus driver terminated the service.

It was freezing cold, pitch black, no one around and she doesn't even know the area that well.

The worst thing was she had a weekly saver and the bus driver continued his journey around the estate to where she wanted to go.

Why couldn't he have let her sit on the bus for another two or three stops, or dropped her in a safer place?

This was a young women in her early twenties. Nice one mate.

I hope your wife / daughter gets greater consideration should the same thing happen to her.

just where are you people (if i may loosely use the term people) coming from with statements like that !!!!!
the driver at end of service is not REPEAT not insured to carry the public ...... if you were to drive (i have no idea if you do or not) do you drive without insurance ???? do you advocate other people drive without insurance ??????

So why dont you put as much effort into the paperwork as you all do in the SF. I come across people on a daily basis that give up at the first rejection or reply they recieve from the powers in question.

So instead of taking it out on the frontline staff that do not make policy but are forced to follow insentative working procedure go direct.

Get off the soap box, stop shouting at the wrong people and be productive.

Use your training and conections or are you as all the other traid unionest. Your there for your own political and personal goals.

How little you know me and how quick to criticise.....you are very aggressive aren't you.....I could be offended by the things you are saying but I will not ALLOW you to offend me thank you.

I am not on a soap box and I am not shouting. I am not taking it out on front line staff. I have merely made an assessment of the situation and approached those who I think may have been the best to help with a solution. One of my mottoes in life is.....Never accept a NO from someone not empowered to say YES.

However, since I made those enquiries I have had other issues concerning family to deal with - again dealing with the authorities and I might add here that I am almost at the end of a successful campaign to aid a disabled person get the benefits to which they are entitled.

And contrary to what you accuse me of....being there for my own political and personal goals....you are wrong. The things I do in life I do are also for the benefit of other people.

In a couple of weeks I will be able to devote more time to formulate my one woman personal campaign to help work out a solution for the elderly and disabled residents of the estate I live on.

And seeing as you are very quick to tell me to put more effort into the paperwork....are you helping out others less fortunate than yourself in any way. Perhaps we could swap strategies and ideas. :D

[QUOTE=julado;2821034]How little you know me and how quick to criticise.....you are very aggressive aren't you.....I could be offended by the things you are saying but I will not ALLOW you to offend me thank you.

I am not on a soap box and I am not shouting. I am not taking it out on front line staff. I have merely made an assessment of the situation and approached those who I think may have been the best to help with a solution. One of my mottoes in life is.....Never accept a NO from someone not empowered to say YES.

However, since I made those enquiries I have had other issues concerning family to deal with - again dealing with the authorities and I might add here that I am almost at the end of a successful campaign to aid a disabled person get the benefits to which they are entitled.

And contrary to what you accuse me of....being there for my own political and personal goals....you are wrong. The things I do in life I do are also for the benefit of other people.

In a couple of weeks I will be able to devote more time to formulate my one woman personal campaign to help work out a solution for the elderly and disabled residents of the estate I live on.

And seeing as you are very quick to tell me to put more effort into the paperwork....are you helping out others less fortunate than yourself in any way. Perhaps we could swap strategies and ideas. :D

As with most on the SF your anger is aimed at those who do a job regardles of what that is. The SF is a breading ground for those who want to whine to others that think the same and are not open to debate. So hear is the latest from T & G union.

News

Unite welcomes Local Transport bill
8 Nov 2007

Better Buses: the government is travelling in the right direction
After twenty years of deregulation of bus services, the government is right to return the provision of a vital public service to local democratic control and accountability, said Unite, Britain's largest union and the main union representing bus workers.

Welcoming the Local Transport bill, Jack Dromey, Unite deputy general secretary said the government is travelling in the right direction: "Deregulation failed the travelling public and bus workers pay a heavy price," he stressed.

"Buses are the backbone of public transport and most journeys are made by bus. Yet for 20 years the public had no say. In future, councils will be able to plan better bus services which are reliable and affordable. Better bus services will boost local economies and reduce congestion and pollution."

Welcoming the dialogue involving all stakeholders, Mr Dromey said the prospect of a 'bus passengers champion' was a novel idea which could add to the enhanced local accountability. He emphasised the need for the bus workers' interests to be fundamental to the future of the industry.

"Fair treatment of bus workers is key to the success of public transport. We welcome the protection in the bill of bus workers' rights," he added. "More progress is necessary, particularly putting in place a new settlement on pensions so that our members who serve the public well can enjoy security and dignity in retirement."

ENDS

Unite was formed on 1st May 2007 from a merger of amicus and the Transport and General Workers Union (T&G)

For further information please call the Unite Press Office on 020 7611 2550

Hope this helps you in you campain.

Just when we thought it couldnt get any worse,stagecoach now paln to go on strike

http://www.travelsy.proboards75.com/index.cgi?board=buses&action=display&thread=1194686797

mind you SF should get a good few threads out of this one,at least the transport industry is keeping you all busy,,,,its good to talk

Just when we thought it couldnt get any worse,stagecoach now paln to go on strike

http://www.travelsy.proboards75.com/index.cgi?board=buses&action=display&thread=1194686797

mind you SF should get a good few threads out of this one,at least the transport industry is keeping you all busy,,,,its good to talk

BT plug next Buzzby will be on the line.

Just when we thought it couldnt get any worse,stagecoach now paln to go on strike

http://www.travelsy.proboards75.com/index.cgi?board=buses&action=display&thread=1194686797

mind you SF should get a good few threads out of this one,at least the transport industry is keeping you all busy,,,,its good to talk

Hi Volvo....thank you for the linky....I have just registered on that forum.....I am sure if I put a thread on giving my concerns as a user re the Middlewood Road situation I might be able to get to people that could make that all important decision.

Will the strike include the trams?????

Thanks. :D

BT plug next Buzzby will be on the line.

You are showing your age :hihi:

The trams do not come under the stagecoach uk bus division of the company. They are light rail and I think it is south west trains division they come under. My friend works on trams and says nothing has been mentioned. As you know julado my dad works for stagecoach, so when i see him tomorrow i will find out what he knows.

Lets hope they break the strike if it goes ahead and the strikers loose a day's pay for nothing.

Have just read the thread that volvo sent the link to and from what i can gather it is just the stagecoach in yorkshire division of the company that are looking at striking. This covers I believe barnsley depot, rawmarsh depot, doncaster depot, shafton depot and huddersfield depot. It does not include stagecoach in sheffield or stagecoach in sheffield. The only services i can think off the top of my head that would be affected in the sheffield area are the 265 to barnsley as barnsley run quite a lot of the journeys on this route and the x92 from meadowhall to doncaster as i believe rawmarsh run this route.

Therefore I would believe that the trams won't be affected and neither will virgin trains as i believe stagecoach have a 49% share in virgin trains and god knows what midland mainline will be doing and if they will still strike when they change to stagecoach.

A lot of this stems from the way SYT was origionally privatised. It was sold as one large company rather than split up into several competing units which would have been better.

Despite deregulation and some competition SYT/Mainline/First have always been the dominant operator in Sheffield and this has allowed them to take customers for granted and provide often a second rate service.

Foxydebs.....you do realise that if the trams did join the buses on that day and you were successful on Monday....the first day you work you will be on strike :hihi:

Just when we thought it couldnt get any worse,stagecoach now paln to go on strike

http://www.travelsy.proboards75.com/index.cgi?board=buses&action=display&thread=1194686797

mind you SF should get a good few threads out of this one,at least the transport industry is keeping you all busy,,,,its good to talk
Interesting to hear their will be a strike by Stagecoach i wonder how many people will retract their claims that Stagecoach are the dog's boll#x? :hihi:

Foxydebs.....you do realise that if the trams did join the buses on that day and you were successful on Monday....the first day you work you will be on strike :hihi:

Lol, I got to have my interview this monday yet.

bit off the point .... luv the sig' foxy , intro urself to me 1 day on 47/48's lol

Interesting to hear their will be a strike by Stagecoach i wonder how many people will retract their claims that Stagecoach are the dog's boll#x? :hihi:


I have the common sense to understand that we would be in the same position as we already are with first ie:- late buses, missing buses, buses turning up in bunches, old buses on certain routes, if Stagecoach were the dominant operator in the Sheffield area. As the dominant operator it seems to be the norm to treat your passengers like rubbish. Are you a first employee as you always seem to be trying to run stagecoach down. Mind you from what I heard the other morning first drivers are leaving in droves, so that probably explains why services are missin, so we will have to hope the stagecoach strike doesnt come off.

well .... i recently passed my pcv test with first & am now in service & i may add enjoying driving busses , ok i may not be perfect but i try my best ..... if thats not good enough i can think of a few (finger-display) gestures that would show what i think to some users ..... i sure as hell hope you are perfect in everything you do ...... id love to follow 1 or 2 of you in ur jobs see how good you are lmao !!!

The only services i can think off the top of my head that would be affected in the sheffield area are the 265 to barnsley as barnsley run quite a lot of the journeys on this route and the x92 from meadowhall to doncaster as i believe rawmarsh run this route.

National Express route 560 to/from London?

if Stagecoach were the dominant operator in the Sheffield area. As the dominant operator it seems to be the norm to treat your passengers like rubbish.

Stagecoach appear to be the dominant operator in the Sheffield - London travel market. They now have the trains, there is their megabus coach service and it is Stagecoach drivers and vehicles on the National Express 560 service.

Stagecoach appear to be the dominant operator in the Sheffield - London travel market. They now have the trains, there is their megabus coach service and it is Stagecoach drivers and vehicles on the National Express 560 service.

Do stagecoach yorkshire busdrivers drive the trains no they don't so the trains will not be affected. Also stagecoach yorkshire only has a few drivers that work on megabus and national express contracts and they are on different rates of pay to bus drivers.

bit off the point .... luv the sig' foxy , intro urself to me 1 day on 47/48's lol


Take it you are an owl then? How will I know its you driving the bus I dont know what you look like.
If I get the job conducting on the trams am sure you will recognise me from uniform.

wear a big badge wi foxydebs clearly visible .... u will know me then lol

Do stagecoach yorkshire busdrivers drive the trains no they don't so the trains will not be affected. Also stagecoach yorkshire only has a few drivers that work on megabus and national express contracts and they are on different rates of pay to bus drivers.

The train drivers are employees of a Stagecoach company, the megabus operation is a Stagecoach one. I often travel National Express on the 560 route and the driver between Sheffield and Newport Pagnell services is always someone wearing a Stagecoach uniform - the address on the side of the coach is that of Stagecoach's Barnsley depot.

just where are you people (if i may loosely use the term people) coming from with statements like that !!!!!
the driver at end of service is not REPEAT not insured to carry the public ...... if you were to drive (i have no idea if you do or not) do you drive without insurance ???? do you advocate other people drive without insurance ??????

Why am I not a person, a fully paid up member of the human race?

Why shouldn't I not want my daughter to be left in a dark, lonely and deserted place, which she doesn't know very well, having lived up in Gleadless valley for only a week.

I am a member of the human race, a taxpayer, a British citizen .. so why do you say ''just where are you people (if i may loosely use the term people) coming from''

Am I not a person? ... who are you to call my membership of the human race into question?

You sound like a right idiot to me!

I forgot to mention that the driver on this particular bus let another man continue to sit on the bus, past Herdings tram stop. I wonder if he was insured for him?

It doesn't look good, does it?

Are First not self insured? Most big companies used to be, using an insurance manager to administer the claims.

just where are you people (if i may loosely use the term people) coming from with statements like that !!!!!
the driver at end of service is not REPEAT not insured to carry the public ...... if you were to drive (i have no idea if you do or not) do you drive without insurance ???? do you advocate other people drive without insurance ??????

I forgot to mention that the driver on this particular bus let another man continue to sit on the bus, past Herdings tram stop. I wonder if he was insured for him?

It doesn't look good, does it?

maybe this person was another employee who is "authorised" to be on the bus ...... & whether or not they are self insured is irrespective .... no driver is insured to carry passengers , fare paying or not when out of service , other than authorised people , by all means ring olive grove depot & check .
why is it that you try & blame the driver when the plain & simple facts stick out a mile .. she is an adult , why can she not plan a journey ahead so that she has suitable time to complete the journey in good time for heavens sake , why is it the drivers fault that she cannot perform this simple task ..... YOU (probably her too ) have access to a computer therefore at NO time are you without access to a simple thing like a timetable for this or any other bus service & they are freely available from a few places in town .
why blame a driver , why is it his fault ..... i re-iterate we are uninsured to carry unauthorised persons out of service ,check that by all means .

heres a present , just for you & ur daughter glennis

47/48 saturday (http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/timetables/timetable.php?day=2&source_id=2&service=47/48&routeid=1507647&operator=26&source=sp)

47/48 sunday (http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/timetables/timetable.php?day=3&source_id=2&service=47/48&routeid=1507647&operator=26&source=sp)

now how can you say bus drivers are unhelpful :)
hope ur printer works ;)

47/48 mon - fri (http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/timetables/timetable.php?day=1&source_id=2&service=47/48&routeid=1507647&operator=26&source=sp) couldnt get it to work on last post lol

no excuse for it to happen again now

You wait ages for a post from a bus driver, then there's three in a row.

(though to be fair, the first two were exactly ten minutes apart)

well well .... is that a sense of humour i see , careful ya dont get banned:hihi:

YOU (probably her too ) have access to a computer therefore at NO time are you without access to a simple thing like a timetable for this or any other bus service & they are freely available from a few places in town .
why blame a driver , why is it his fault ..... i re-iterate we are uninsured to carry unauthorised persons out of service ,check that by all means .


Sorry, but this does not wash does it? You say that timetables are freely available, online and on paper, which I do not dispute. BUT, the timetables are often works of fiction .... so not to be relied upon. Again, I am not blaming the drivers for this .... but why oh why can't Last Bus produce accurate and factual timetables, based on reality. I would much rather know that my bus was coming every half hour, and know that it was coming than to be told 'every ten minutes' and then regularly wait 30 - 40 minutes. Number 53 please step forward ......

We should encourage our elected representatives to bring buses cback under state control so that they work for the needs of the travelling public rather than their shareholders.

Ta da!

SPOT ON!
That is what has killed public transport. It will never recover until it is brought back under council control. Todays companies dont care about quality of service only profit. :thumbsup:

The train drivers are employees of a Stagecoach company, the megabus operation is a Stagecoach one. I often travel National Express on the 560 route and the driver between Sheffield and Newport Pagnell services is always someone wearing a Stagecoach uniform - the address on the side of the coach is that of Stagecoach's Barnsley depot.

All National express work is contracted out to bus/coach operators. The 560 you are correct is operated by stagecoach of Barnsley, The 240 Airport Service is operated by dunn line violia. Tm travel, Birmingham coach company, First, arriva and many other companies operate different services in the uk. As i understand National express own just 1 coach or they did a couple of years back.

Sorry, haven,t read all the posts.
Has anyone suggested all schools should provide their own busses at cost to parents. There are far too many ill behaved little oiks allowed on public transport! Either that or install cctv, identify the kids and heavily fine their 'guardians' [sure that would be a laugh in many cases].

47/48 mon - fri (http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/timetables/timetable.php?day=1&source_id=2&service=47/48&routeid=1507647&operator=26&source=sp) couldnt get it to work on last post lol

no excuse for it to happen again now

I have access to a computer, five days per week, my daughter does not at anytime.

She had only lived at Gleadless valley for less than a week, this was her second day back at work. She had not realised that some of the busues terminate at Herdings .. and its hardly well advertised, is it?

From now on she will only be getting on the 48, so no it shouldn't happen again.

More streetwise from now on.