Hi, i was just wondering what the general opinion of sheffield's young people was??

Be more specific, and you'll get a better response :thumbsup:

How young? Compared to who? Why do you want to know?

Originally posted by CMcKayle
Hi, i was just wondering what the general opinion of sheffield's young people was??

There opinion about what,

Tattoed babies?
Hitler's Germany?

Generally about young poeple aged about 11 - 21?
I mean, what do you think of their life styles, attitudes?
Do you thin young people deserve an equal say, what do you think of the youth parliament? anything really. What do you think of the politics involving young people, what is your general perception of young people?

Originally posted by CMcKayle
Generally about young poeple aged about 11 - 21?
I mean, what do you think of their life styles, attitudes?
Do you thin young people deserve an equal say, what do you think of the youth parliament? anything really. I thhink they should have a say in matters that affect them, but perhaps not in eg: the facilities in retirement homes.

Tell us more about this youth parliament.

The youth parliament is a nation-wide empowerment structure, aimed at bringing governance to young people....more info at

http://www.ukyouthparliament.org.uk/

Some interesting stuff on there. The transport stuff really affects my family, but not in Sheffield.

YP are bad mouthed, spit lots, have no respect, drink too much, no nothing of contraception, grow up too fast, are ignorant, annoying, dont stand up for old ladies on bus, are intimidating in crowds.........
on the other hand, they can be the funniest, uplifting, cute and sweet little people ever and its ace watching them grow and develop into young people. once in a while they shock you too, but in a nice way

such a stereotypical view natalie I'm 18 I dont spit I'm not bad mouthed I make space for elderly people on buses/trams/trains (without any gratitude I might add!)

The young people you seem to be thinking of are those normally found in burberry caps with their socks tucked over their adidas tousers wearing nike shox and leaving argos after just buying some new elizabeth duke jewelry

Originally posted by damo
I make space for elderly people on buses/trams/trains (without any gratitude I might add!)



That's a good point! I've often wondered, how do old people expect young ones to "show some respect" when many of them don't themselves? ^_~

Young people are scoundrels.

I had only been gone for 2 weeks, and they had stolen my shoes.

I agree with damo, i'm also 18, and i'm polite, don't spit, i have respect and repect others, i don't drink,or take drugs, am fully aware of contraception, i'm not ignorant, granted, i can be annoying, and i suppose i have grown up too fast, in the sense that i have the job of representing 46000 young people at a national level, and as i'm sure you understand, thos carries a lot of stress, i jugle this with a full-time job, so i can pay non-dependant council tax and rent, i'm nationally known for my work...the list goes on...that aint a bad thing! Unfortunately, in todays society, all young people are tarred with the same brush, i've seen people cross the road, simply because i'm there, the media plays a big part in this, as they are more eager to show the bad side of young people, over a 2-page spread, rather than shw the young person that has just recieved an award, for example.... generally, today's young people have been labelled as the cause to most trouble, as we are easiest to blame, and with hanging around in groups outside a lit shop, in winter at 9pm, now seen as anti-social behaviour, goodness knows what next! i mean, whats the alternative hanging around in a unlit park, with alll kinds of people out there, laws like this need to look beyond diverting the problem, and concentrate on fixing it! To add insult to injury, any young person that can't prove ther over 18 (in some parts of sheffield) after 9pm, will be escorted home! i mean, come on! they couldn't do this to any other age group, there'd be an uproar, yet it seems ok to infringe on a young person's human rights!

The impression of young people being badly behaved comes from a small section of that part of society, but they're very loud, very visible and meet people's stereotypes - that's why the rest get a bum deal.

Many of the rights demanded by young people traditionally go with social responsibilities - and it's probably difficult for your typical 15 year old to deliver on paying taxes, etc. :)

And as for hanging around unlit parks - er.....what's wrong with home? What's wrong with getting together with friends at soemone's house and doing whatever floats your boat? Why not form social clubs? Pursue hobbies? Continue with your education at home? For crying out loud, if all else fails watch TV and join the Sheffield Forum! :)

And why should a shop keeper be expected to put up with having folks hanging around in his establishment at 9pm on a winter's evening? A group of older people hanging around like that would be equally suspect.

It's not the job of law-makers to provide means of stopping people getting bored. That's one of those responsibilities I mentioned above that everyone needs to be able to do for themselves. It's the job of law-makers, as they see it and working under a perceived or actul societal mandate, to put laws in place that allow the majority to get on with their lives without worry or hassle.

Having said that, I appreciate that young people sometiems get hard done by in the media and society as a whole. As do blacks, gays, poor people, right wingers, left wingers, refugees, asylum seekers, etc.

Joe

The thing is, if young people want to go somewhere, where do they go? the Pub, a bar? no. they feel more comfortable outside with their friends... and with there being practically nothing out there for young people to take part in, that doesn't cost them a weeks pocket money, ect then hanging around in a group is probably the safest and best thing they can do. have you considered their situation at home? it could be that it' impossible for them to stay in every night, with their mates, or maybe going out is a form of relief?

You find me a group of young people that can secure money for a social club, oer even know what it involves, (will it be an open or closed club, will they need their crb checks, ect) unfortunately, money is a hard thing for young people to get.

And fair do's, a shop keeper shouldn't have the burden of a group of people hanging outside his shop, i was merely using that as an example, but if a group of young peole were stood under a street lampdoing nothing, and someone decided to complain, they would have to leave.. it makes you wonder, do peope remember being young? i mean, hings have changed so much, but never has there been such predudice and discrimination towards young people.

You're right, it's not the jobs of the law makers, but as i mentioned above, there's virtually no youth provision, and with sheffield futures and connexions constantly making cuts, it ain't getting any better. What are we to do? yes, lets all sit in front of a tv, or in fact, do wt i'm doing, and join sheffield forum!

Originally posted by damo
such a stereotypical view natalie I'm 18 I dont spit I'm not bad mouthed I make space for elderly people on buses/trams/trains (without any gratitude I might add!)

The young people you seem to be thinking of are those normally found in burberry caps with their socks tucked over their adidas tousers wearing nike shox and leaving argos after just buying some new elizabeth duke jewelry

did you read all the way through natalies post. She put two different views, you've just responded to the first.

I think that "Youth" has never been as enjoyable as it is cracked up to be in adverts, the media and public perception. I didn't have a bad time as a youth, but adulthood has been far more enjoyable, more money, power, freedom, privacy, respect. It is as if it is one of the last taboos, where you are not allowed to mention that being under 21 is rubbish.

Originally posted by CMcKayle
The thing is, if young people want to go somewhere, where do they go? the Pub, a bar? no. they feel more comfortable outside with their friends... and with there being practically nothing out there for young people to take part in, that doesn't cost them a weeks pocket money, ect then hanging around in a group is probably the safest and best thing they can do. have you considered their situation at home? it could be that it' impossible for them to stay in every night, with their mates, or maybe going out is a form of relief?

<SNIP>

You're right, it's not the jobs of the law makers, but as i mentioned above, there's virtually no youth provision, and with sheffield futures and connexions constantly making cuts, it ain't getting any better. What are we to do? yes, lets all sit in front of a tv, or in fact, do wt i'm doing, and join sheffield forum!

Of course it's not possible for them to stay in every night, and having been involved in volunteer work that involved young people I know the problems in terms of finance, CRB checks, etc.

But many young people ARE involved in youth groups, many DO stay at home or go to friends houses, and there's nothing wrong with occasionally watching TV and playing with computers.

Young people, like the rest of us, do not have a God-given right to be entertained by society. If I want to go to the cinema, I go and I pay. If I want to go and play sports, whatever, I go and I play and pay. It's not easy - I appreciate that - but given that the vast majority DON'T find it necessary to hang around on street corners and quite a few DO get involved in youth groups, etc. then the opportunities are there. If I get bored, I do something about it - even when skint, without transport and if necessary without anyone else to do stuff with.

Perhaps what's needed is a little more application from some people and a little less of the 'poor us, we're an opressed minority'?

Joe

CMcKayle is exactly why we shouldn't have this younger parliments, because all of the members are those people that are full of too many oppinions about everything and can talk for England and never get a point accross or make any sense!

I've gone through my entire teens (well almost, I'm 20 in a few months) without ever hanging around on the streets :P what did I do to spend my spare time?

I made sure I passed my GCSE's by actually attending school and studying a little at home, I spent time at my friends house, or them at mine... 3/4 way battles on games on the Playstation and N64... collected Warhammer models (maybe you think it's sad, but its a hobby!), read books, went to the cinema, went to town with friends...

y'know its pretty easy for the youth of today to do lots of things besides hang on streets scaring old people and drinking white lightning :P

my views on the youth of sheffield is exactly the same as my views on the adults in sheffield... theres a lot of nobheads about, but thankfully there's some decent ones about too :)

Ok xafier...


So what you're saying is there should be no governance for young people? Rubbish!
It's true, i do have opinions, but mine are created and backed by thousands of young people, as i hold regular surgeries with my electorate. Aside from the fact that you've decided to label the whole youth parliament as 'full of those people with opinions' shows you're ignorance. Whats the point in havin a youth parliament without an opinion!

Fair do's to what you said, as i never hanged around on the streets, i don't drink, and passed my GCSE's with an excellent attendance record. However, understand that young people are involved in many different sutuations, and have very different perceptions. I read books, play on my ps2, have a stable job, and volunteer all of my spare time to the youth parliament.

At no point have i said that all young people hang about and drink, but a minority do, and they deserve a say too.

To finish, i'd just like to say, young people are exactly that, young people, but they don't have the same rights, and are often seen as a problem. You may or may not agree, but having attended the hundereds of meetings i have, i knwo it to be the case.

Unfair to say that all young people are yobs.

What age do you class as young people? Under 18s??

If so, I certainly don't fit the yobbish description that people have described on this thread.

Hi Everyone,

My Name is Alex Farrow and I am Youth Memeber of Parliament for Stroud and the Cotswolds and am on the UK Youth Parliament Procedures group or then "Management Team."

I think the reason so many people have negative perceptions of young people is because of the stereotype the national media has built up. According to them we are all, alcholhics, druggies, and thugs, who all have no education and get in fights all the time. Honestly...! Get a grip! This isn't true at all.

People assume this is true and it's about time people started forming opinions for themselves instead of being helpless sheep who take the media's word as gospell.

The Media doesn't show what a difference the UK Youth parliament has made in its small 4 years of existance or all the charity and voluntary work that young people undertake. But there are also millions who do just keep their heads down - stay out of trouble, go to school, play on the playstation.

Young people are too quickly critisised but why don't many adults take a look at their own lives first. It was mentioned somewhere on here about young people not standing up for old ladies on buses. You can't tell me that all buses are full up exclusivly with young people. Adults don't do that either.

When thinking about young people think about the good sides and don't tar us all with the same brush. Adults are not all the same so why are young people treated all the same?

Originally posted by CMcKayle
Aside from the fact that you've decided to label the whole youth parliament as 'full of those people with opinions' shows you're ignorance. Whats the point in havin a youth parliament without an opinion!

The actual government is full of people with oppinions too, and they're all backstabbing arse's whose oppinions totally don't match the majority of the country...

I'm sure your youth party does do some good things, but you cant change society, theres always going to be youths that fit into the good catagory, and always going to be rebels...

no matter how many facilities your provide, you wont get rid of all the badass kids on the streets, its part of society... we live on earth, no matter how hard anyone tries we aint gonna get peace on earth because all humans have a tendency to be evil or nasty or just not nice at times.

I think the best thing thats started changing in the last few years for youths is the big increase and boost in support for apprenticeships and for "under-achievers" at school to do days out at college or training schemes for vocational things like plumbing, building etc...

I do believe its time the government realised that not every individual wants to sit through 11 years of school being told what they MUST learn... I think the choices in year 9 should be moved earlier, gives kids a choice to mix and match a lot more to what they want... if you can learn the things you want wont you be more inclined to turn up to school?

hold on, when did we say that we thought all young people were undereducated alcoholic drugies.

If you want to fight against the stereotype you see being applied, you need to find the people who believe it.
Most people on this forum are fairly intelligent, cynical towards the media and more than capable of forming their own opinions.
There are problems with 'todays' young, but probably no more (albeit different) problems to the ones 20 or 40 years ago.
There are also clearly problems with other groups in our society. Afterall, problem children grow up into problem adults.

There are also a few points which just seem 'wrong' to me. You say that groups of children can be moved on as if this is somehow wrong. But the police have the power to ask any group of people over a certain size to move on. It's not something targetted at a specific age group.
And if an area has a specific problem then why is it the wrong approach to enforce a curfue?

There are many more options for leisure time open to todays children than there used to be, so if hanging around outside a shop is the only thing a group can find to do then they need to take a look at why.

Allow me to re-iterate....

We 'adults' don't treat all young people the same.

Quite a few of us are too clued up to believe all we see / read / hear from the media.

The media will provide you with bite-sized pieces of whatever truth they want you to hear. The media has it's own agenda - sometimes pro-government, sometimes anti-government, frequently anti-American, frequently politically correct.

Don't expect to get any good coverage from the media if you're doing anything that in anyway threatens the existing status-quo. Many groups and individuals have found this out the hard way and will continue to do so.

To facilitate change in this country you need to do it one mind at a time, starting with your own constituency and then working out from there.

Come on here and tell us what you do - names and packdrills - and don't just feel you have to defend yourselves all the time.

Joe

Originally posted by xafier
I do believe its time the government realised that not every individual wants to sit through 11 years of school being told what they MUST learn... I think the choices in year 9 should be moved earlier, gives kids a choice to mix and match a lot more to what they want... if you can learn the things you want wont you be more inclined to turn up to school?


The problem is what subjects would be mandatory study? What would be the long-term impact of allowing children to drop subjects like science, foreign language, history, geography, english, mathematics etc?

I absolutely detested some of these subjects, but had I been allowed to drop any of them at an earlier stage, I think it would have been severely detrimental to my education.

Originally posted by Agent Gypo
What would be the long-term impact of allowing children to drop subjects like science, foreign language, history, geography, english, mathematics etc?

Foreign language = droppable... how many people can remember more than a few phrases they learnt in secondary school?

history = droppable... i didnt pick it in year 9 for my choices, if i want to learn history I'll pick up a book, but most of it is boring as hell..

geography = ditto the above, you need to learn to read a map, other than that... whats useful?

maths and english are definitly important, no doubt about it, if a child is really struggling only core bits of science are relevant...

Originally posted by xafier
history = droppable... i didnt pick it in year 9 for my choices, if i want to learn history I'll pick up a book, but most of it is boring as hell..



:o

As a history a-level and possible history university student I have to argue with that.

Understanding and learning about the past is important.

Originally posted by xafier
Foreign language = droppable... how many people can remember more than a few phrases they learnt in secondary school?


I think this would only serve to make younger people more ignorant.

Geography isn't just about reading a map. I've never taken the subject further since school, but was always fascinated by how the earth was formed, and it's destructive power.

I had a love/hate thing with history; loved learning about the past, hated the emphasis on numbers and statistics and my evil teacher. Isn't there a quote that goes something like 'those who forget the past are destined to repeat it'?

Personally, I don't see any benefit from allowing children to drop subjects before year 9.

Originally posted by Elyndys
That's a good point! I've often wondered, how do old people expect young ones to "show some respect" when many of them don't themselves? ^_~

Good point i've noticed that myself in many old folk, also i could be considered old myself, but seen many old people push ahead of young people in the shops, quess they think being older gives them the right of way.

Originally posted by CMcKayle
The youth parliament is a nation-wide empowerment structure, aimed at bringing governance to young people....more info at

http://www.ukyouthparliament.org.uk/

Also, didn't get to read the whole thing but i'm sure the young parliament thing will go over big in the uk as i'm sure it's very liberal, should be a bigger hit in sheffield.

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
YP are bad mouthed, spit lots, have no respect, drink too much, no nothing of contraception, grow up too fast, are ignorant, annoying, dont stand up for old ladies on bus, are intimidating in crowds.........
on the other hand, they can be the funniest, uplifting, cute and sweet little people ever and its ace watching them grow and develop into young people. once in a while they shock you too, but in a nice way

My opinions exactly.

Yeah poppins, should be a big hit, but isn't publicly, there is no coverage for things like this, and with sheffield futures having to cover our costs, is unlikely to change

Originally posted by Agent Gypo
The problem is what subjects would be mandatory study? What would be the long-term impact of allowing children to drop subjects like science, foreign language, history, geography, english, mathematics etc?

I absolutely detested some of these subjects, but had I been allowed to drop any of them at an earlier stage, I think it would have been severely detrimental to my education.

Alternative curriculum provision is offered at some schools. Ideally, all children - and indeed adults - should have a well rounded curriculum, which would give everyone opportunity and choice for the life they have ahead of them. Because that is fundementally what it is all about.

However, and this is from my point of view as a teacher, what, honestly, is the point of subjecting certain children to 11 years of what is, ultimately, failure? Rightly or wrongly, I see kids everyday struggling with subjects that they have no interest in, no skill at or desire to learn about it. And for some, they do this day in day out, only to leave school with a handful of GCSE "G" grades at best.

Alternative curriculum provision can enable kids who are not necessarily academic to still be successful, in that if they learn a trade for 3 days of the week, and study the more practical elements of maths, english and science (Because, let's face it and as much as it pains me to say it, some people think subjects like maths bear no relevance to their lives). It doesn't necessarily have to be conducted in a classroom for it to be education.

Oh yeah, and for the record, I actually LIKE kids. Yeah, they can be infuriating, and rude at times. But who can't?

Watching them grow, forming their own opinions and become their own person is brilliant. Sounds cheesy, but it's true.

I love teaching them.

Ssshhhh... Don't tell anyone that. Us teachers have a rep to protect.

Originally posted by ANGELUS
My opinions exactly.
:D i like it when people actually read all of my post! cheers honey!

who cares what were like, let young people be young while they still can.

older people only winge, cos the time has past them by.

yes we are not all in the same boat, cos i am not a chav etc.

but respect has to be given from boths parties dont you think!

its easy to say give up your seat on the bus, but when you do, they dont appreciate nothing! The whole my generation did this for you. rubbish :loopy:

so why bother is moto.....:rant:

go ahead...bring on the criticism :rolleyes:

i was brought up to say Ps and Qs and give up seats, open doors to old and/or pregnant people. i usually get a thankyou and a shocked look, but if i dont, ill say "THANK YOU" very loud and it usually reminds them. same as when i drive, if i let someone out and dont get a thanks ill give a wave and mouth thankyou - some with t****r after:D
but i see what you mean, no one seems to say it anymore and oldies walk with their head down a lot. i always say hi to people on my way to work in barnsley from my car park - restores faith a bit i hope, that us young ones arent all buggers

is stealing cars and mugging old ladies just part of being young then? something we should just laugh off.
I don't think so, it wasn't acceptable when I was young, it's not acceptable now. Young people are still responsible for their actions.

its not all YP, i think the muggings and TWOKing its mostly done by 19+ . i could be wrong, i only speak to Barnsley coppers and have the odd sheff cop in family.
Has anyone got the figures?
Parliment sounds a good idea, but we have to remember they are KIDS and should be playing and hanging (not in large groups though;) )
what happened to all the youths groups and army cadets and scouts they had when i was young (not that long ago)????
kids need something to do, or they just loiter on corners.

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
what happened to all the youths groups and army cadets and scouts they had when i was young (not that long ago)????
kids need something to do, or they just loiter on corners.

They're still going, just the membership has fallen :P

I was part of the cubs etc. but never went to Scouts.

Two very good postings from NatlalieSheff & Steelcitybab, and both make valid points, of course older people moan about younger ones being ignorant intollerant etc etc. That is exactly as it has always been, and always will be, if they can't be intolerant when they are young they have nothing to look back on when they grow older.
Cyclone, there has always been crime, and there always will be. I am not sure if it's better or worse now than it used to be. There were no go areas in Sheffield in the 40s,50s & 60s so things haven't change that much.
Be kind to the younger generation..thay have to pick the nursing home you are going to be put into :)

I didn't say that there hadn't always been crime, nor that it had increased/descreased or that younger people committed a larger portion of it.
Although I think there may be more recorded instances of joy riding by 14 year old children than there were 50 years ago.

Still doesn't mean that they shouldn't be held responsible for it, nor should it be acceptable.

My point was that everyone should care what they are like. There are boundaries that being young does not excuse. Most young people are probably well within these boundaries, but to pretend there is not a problem with the ones who aren't does nothing to address the problem.

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
YP are bad mouthed, spit lots, have no respect, drink too much, no nothing of contraception, grow up too fast, are ignorant, annoying, dont stand up for old ladies on bus, are intimidating in crowds.........

So are a lot of the 30+ yobs crawling through Sheffield City Centre on Friday and Saturday night who have all drunk a skinful! Hang on though, I'm stereotyping aren't I? Works both ways doesn't it? I've many a time been forced to listen to old people moan about how "the youth of today have no respect". My advice to them: "It's not all that respectful to air these views in their presence!"

Originally posted by JonJParr
So are a lot of the 30+ yobs crawling through Sheffield City Centre on Friday and Saturday night who have all drunk a skinful!
dont even get me started on those types of people :D huh!

Originally posted by Cyclone
I didn't say that there hadn't always been crime, nor that it had increased/descreased or that younger people committed a larger portion of it.
Although I think there may be more recorded instances of joy riding by 14 year old children than there were 50 years ago.

maybe there are more cars nowadays? and more tv that shows kids how to do things and get away with it? thats a whole other thread about the good and bad of TV.
maybe we should look to parents more and definately schools

parents, I say punish the parents equally with the scrotes.

i know kids dont come with books etc... and noone is perfect (except will smith!) but i agree parents should also be held responsible for their childs actions until they are 16. If the parents id having trouble there is plenty of help about. I know some kids just are little buggers that need a good slap, but we cant use this excuse/reason for all of them - can we??
i hear there are parenting courses you can go on, saying that - my parents didnt go on one and im ok. but i suppose life is different nowadays to then?

Originally posted by IanMitchell
They're still going, just the membership has fallen :P

I was part of the cubs etc. but never went to Scouts.

I used to be in the Boys Brigade when I was a lad. And I left it after quite a few years (6?) because the weekly meeting descended from a worthwhile group with badges and learning about first aid, discipline, drill and a limited amount of other stuff and quite a bit of excercise and athletics, into 2 hours of five-a-side football in the church hall.

22 years later, I realise that the reason for this was the limited skills of the leaders, to control a big group of pubescent lads. In earlier times we often used to play things like volleyball, british bulldog, heading tennis and murderball. I understand that murderball is now illegal, or at least frowned upon, as it is so extremely rough, that it has caused serious injury and fatalities in the armed services, where they used to play it.

God only knows what they are allowed to do in this day and age, it can't be half as much fun as those great times.

my mans mum was a scout leader and she lived just past woodseats i wonder if she was yours?