Stevie Wonder is apparently outraged at the way Eminem takes the **** out of Michael Jackson in his video.

Not wanting to sound insensitive and that, but how does he know? It's like a deaf person asking somebody to turn their music down, surely?

http://www.tonight.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2335381

It's probably down to the simple fact that somebody has sat there next to him whilst it was playing and described what was happening . . :loopy: :loopy:

I think Eminem should give up now, he's past his sell-by date. He was good, then he was a hypocrite, now he's taking the p*** out of other people to hit the headlines again, very sad.

I dont particularly like eminem but I find his **** taking amusing

Originally posted by Lestat
It's probably down to the simple fact that somebody has sat there next to him whilst it was playing and described what was happening . . :loopy: :loopy:

I think Eminem should give up now, he's past his sell-by date. He was good, then he was a hypocrite, now he's taking the p*** out of other people to hit the headlines again, very sad.
hear hear! its about time he cooled it, his songs are poop. not a big fan of britney but didnt think that was right either!

and hey dont diss Stevie hes ace!! what was that song he did with michael? just good friends?

I didnt diss Stevie at any point....superstitions a fave of mine

Im for anybody ripping the **** out of MJ or Britney full stop.

Originally posted by boyface
I didnt diss Stevie at any point....superstitions a fave of mine

Im for anybody ripping the **** out of MJ or Britney full stop.
you need a smacked bottom mate!

Michael Jackson clearly needs the **** taking out of him. Sorry but it's true - the guy has lost it. If he wasn't loaded he'd have been in a mental home (for his own good) a long while back.

Someone mentioned Eminem being a hypocrite ... can they illustrate this point further? I've always thought of him as brutally honest, and he's always taken the **** out of everyone he comes into contact with, even on his first album.

Originally posted by Agent Dan
Michael Jackson clearly needs the **** taking out of him. Sorry but it's true - the guy has lost it. If he wasn't loaded he'd have been in a mental home (for his own good) a long while back.

Someone mentioned Eminem being a hypocrite ... can they illustrate this point further? I've always thought of him as brutally honest, and he's always taken the **** out of everyone he comes into contact with, even on his first album.
Bit sad when ur whole music career is taking the P*** outta everyone.
And to have an opinion on MJ id suggest reading a couple of official books, even if ur not a fan - its interesting reading as to where hes coming from.
Obviously if he has done bad things and its not a rubbish/media/money making etc scheme then he does need to do time

Originally posted by Agent Dan


Someone mentioned Eminem being a hypocrite ... can they illustrate this point further? I've always thought of him as brutally honest

Quite easily:

He sings about being homophobic and how he hates fags etc then not long after he goes on stage with Elton John, sings a duet with him and even hugs him!

Thank you.

Originally posted by Lestat
Quite easily:

He sings about being homophobic and how he hates fags etc then not long after he goes on stage with Elton John, sings a duet with him and even hugs him!

Thank you.
homophobic people should be shot, thank you:clap:

Hmmm... the two of you? at once? I'm outnumbered... curses...

He has publically admitted his views on homosexuality were derived through ignorance, and anger at his father leaving his mother for another man.

There's a lot of comedians who have made enitre careers out of taking the **** - obviously - and eminem is a technically brilliant (lyrically and rhythmically) and funny rapper. So what if he pokes fun at easy targets... everyone else does...

His old stuff IS better however!

Whaaaaat! how dare Eminem do that !!!!!!

Perhaps his interesting life has come to such an abrupt halt in delivering up his previous ghosts and demons; so that now he is in such a qualifed position to offer therapy in humiliation of other peoples problems to make a fast Buck!
And yes I mean BUCK as in (cash)
M.Jackson has enough on his plate to worry about EmnM and hopefully he will laugh at the humerous side of it.................................... ok and then again maybe not.

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
And to have an opinion on MJ id suggest reading a couple of official books, even if ur not a fan - its interesting reading as to where hes coming from

I am a fan. And I know about his childhood, parents, etc. I still think he needs taking into care. I love his early work, but you can see in his music when he starts to lose it - e.g. the video where he dresses like Jesus and has all the children bowing and holding on to him. If I was a christian, that would have offended me.

Originally posted by Agent Dan
Hmmm... the two of you? at once? I'm outnumbered... curses...

He has publically admitted his views on homosexuality were derived through ignorance, and anger at his father leaving his mother for another man.

MJ also had a hard upbringing, alot more strenous than M&M's I think.

So what if he pokes fun at easy targets... everyone else does...

Like who? . . MJ has never poked fun at another artist in order to better himself. This just shows a weak artist in desperate times seeking publicity. Dont get me wrong, M&M was good! but he slipped up and went commercial looking for money.
His originality has gone, he's just another rapper now. MJ has always been original. It's this thats got him where he stands in pop music . . . . the king.

where he dressed like jesus - remember the is an artist not just a singer, he showing his feelings and how he wants to help the world. i dont overly like "heal the world" etc as music MUCH prefer off the wall, billie jean, the way you make me feel, human nature.................

He wasn't even being jesus! I didn't know Jesus wore white jeans and t-shirt with an expensive white versace shirt or whatever it was! would have been one trendy man! :P


Why do people insist on starting false rumours that escalate and cause all the problems they do?

i dont like the rap type bit in "black or white" it ruines the song.
have i jsut changed the subject?

Regardless of his feelings he is still saying 'i am jesus' which is regarded as blasphemy... the incident in question is his performance on the Brit awards - if you remember? And as for his upbringing I couldn't say who had the harder! It's like comparing the prince and the pauper.

Either way, I hardly think eminem is the first to take the **** out of MJ and he shouldn't be brought up so hard for it. he's taken the **** of britney, christina, most rappers, the government, bill clinton etc before and no-one batted an eyelid. So why is MJ such a shock?

And I re-iterate that I like MJ's music, just thinkhe needs sectioning before he hurts himself. Wouldn't you rather he went back to being the old michael???

Eminem is a tool for even calling himself a musician.

He insults and pokes fun at people that have more talent than him.

He never was good and never will be.

i think he wanted to be more like jesus in helping people

... anyone see the irony in that this thread proves the point..

"There's no such thing as bad publicity"...

Personally I hated Eminem when he started out but I actually have a grudging respect for his work nowadays... I don't like everything and the whole mick take (pun unintended) has been water off a ducks back to be honest.

... As for MJ himself... well let's be honest, he's not exactly a saint is he... all the accusations aside, he has massive oustanding unpaid debts all over the place and as for his children I seriously wonder how they'll turn out...

look at elvis's girl

The thing with Eminem is that when you watch his video's a high percentage of them are taking the p*** out of other people, other artists or politicians etc.
Other than 'Stan' when did he actually make a decent uncomical vid?

Also, Im getting abit tired of his blocked-nose voice! do something new!

Michael Jackson admits to having children sleeping over at his house. In his bedroom. What other 40 year old can you think of that would get away with this?? If you had a slightly weird 40 year old man living near you, would YOU let YOUR children sleep over at his house?

And I'm aware of the fact he's had a "hard upbringing", possibly sexually abused himself and never allowed a childhood. Sad, really sad, but does this excuse him having children over for "sleepovers"?

And I love how people sensationalise paedophilia, except when it's one of their favourite singers. Quick to see them "guilty until proven innocent" except when it's Michael Jackson.

As for reading books about him, why would I want to read OFFICIAL biographies about him that are purely to publicise him and show him in the light he WANTS to be shown in? I HAVE however read unauthorised biographies which clearly state that he has secret passageways that lead directly into his bedroom so that no one knows who goes in or out, and that cleaners have seen him naked in a jacuzzi with some of his little pals.

He disgusts me, I'm convinced he sexually abuses children and will be glad to see him go down. Unless his money can buy him out of it. Again.

Why does he get the benefit of the doubt when there's so much evidence against him, and Mr Average would have been burnt at the stake?

The poor children, that's what I say.

And further to my last, I think that that's what Eminem was trying to get across in his video, his contempt for a paedophile, and I for one applaud him for it.

Originally posted by BoroughGal
And further to my last, I think that that's what Eminem was trying to get across in his video, his contempt for a paedophile, and I for one applaud him for it.

tut. .tut:confused: so sad.

Originally posted by Lestat
tut. .tut:confused: so sad.

Sorry, sad in what way?

Sad because you are applauding someone who is kicking someone else whilst they are down. Sad because you think acting out to be a paedophile in a music video is right and proper. Sad because you think that making fun of someones appearance is more important to make a statement instead of just getting on with your business.

The thing is nobody knows yet if MJ is guilty. It's people like you who feed on the one-sided media garbage that is thrown at us every day and actually take it all in.

MJ admits to sleeping with children, did you hear him admit to having sex with them? do you really think someone of his fame and fortune would say that he slept with them for sex and watch his career die?

I've said this before in another post - In lots of Eastern countries children sleep in the same beds as adults usually because they are poor and there isn't proper accommodation available, some just like to sleep with relatives or friends. I was in India once and saw 3 young boys sleeping in the same bed with a friend of their father - NOTHING SEXUAL! just because their father wasn't there and he told them stories and looked after them.

Why is it that someone who openly admits to something like this, something he does for the love of the children rather than anything sexually abusive is labelled a paedophile?

Like before, there is no evidence yet, dont believe the media - make your own minds up when the case is over, until then dont be such tabloid junkies!

Originally posted by IanMitchell
Eminem is a tool for even calling himself a musician.

He insults and pokes fun at people that have more talent than him.

He never was good and never will be.

I agree 100% with all you say.

If we're talking about sad, I think it's really sad that Eminem so obviously wishes he were black.

Originally posted by mojoworking
If we're talking about sad, I think it's really sad that Eminem so obviously wishes he were black.

And Jackson wishes he was white.

I think you all make good points, and the two artists seem to be similar in many ways.

I think Eminem is tastless in his latest video, and it is a shame because it overshadows the good work he produces. It isn't really my type of music, but I have respect for him because he seems to be genuinly talented.

Micheal Jackson, I love his early work... as for him having a harder childhood than Eminem... boo hoo, having all that fame and money is so disturbing. His dad beating him.... I wish my dad would have beat me into millions like that. He was a very talented artist and will be loved forever, but he has lost it in so many ways.

I have respect for both artists, but Eminem should concentrate on making good music, and Jackson should probably be locked away... I believe he is innocent until proven guilty, but I find it hard to believe they would take someone so high profile to trial without being sure of a conviction... but you never know...

To answer some of your points....

I am aplauding an artist that , like many artists before him, uses satire to highlight a newsworthy story.

No. Michael Jackson has NOT yet been found guilty. Do you afford the same generosity to all paedophiles prior to their trial? Did you fight the West's corner prior to their trial??

The one thing we BOTH agree on is that MJ will NEVER admit to having sex with children. It WOULD ruin his career, and his life. He would deny it in the same way that all paedophiles do. He would say exactly what he HAS said, that he has them over for sleepovers.

MJ isn't in an Eastern country, nor is he poor, nor was he originally from this type of background. I don't suggest for a second that the parents of poor Eastern families are paedophiles. Circumstance dictates that they have to sleep together. But what is MJ's reasons for doing it???? His love of children??

I'm aware that he hasn't had a normal upbringing, but any "normal" 40 year old male would have to get over this in some way, NOT use children as therepy and have them sleep in his bedroom.

To answer your last point, I don't read the tabloids, and I'm certainly not a tabloid "junkie". And it is the equivelent of me telling you not to believe the MJ publicity machine.

Do you not think that his expensive grooming techniques are disgusting - a huge funfair in his back yard?? I go back to my original point. If you had a 40 year old man, living next door to you, who had children over for a sleepovers, what would you think? Be honest. Would you try to protect the children from what MAY be happening and call social services or the police?

It's fairly obvious you're a big fan of MJ - I agree his early music was very good. But don't let this blind you to what he MIGHT be. I can understand your comment about innocent until proven guilty - fair enough. But do you agree that there is a POSSIBILITY that he may have molested children in the past?? And if he is found guilty, are you going to believe it then?? Or will you continue to say he's innocent, just because you like him as an artist?

Hear hear! I think he needs counselling, at least, but you have to equate some of the blame to the parents of the kids who let MJ pay them to borrow their children for the night - I believe there was an 'out-of-court' settlement last time, was there not? For a guy who was claiming MJ assualted his kid? So money makes that ok does it?? Yeah right...

Originally posted by Agent Dan
Hear hear! I think he needs counselling, at least, but you have to equate some of the blame to the parents of the kids who let MJ pay them to borrow their children for the night - I believe there was an 'out-of-court' settlement last time, was there not? For a guy who was claiming MJ assualted his kid? So money makes that ok does it?? Yeah right...

Yep, I'd absolutely agree with you there. I ask a similar question to one earlier - if you'd got this strange 40 year old bloke who gives sweets to local kids (an analogy for having a fairground in his backyard), living near to you, would you let your children stay over at his house??

But then again - the same people that say he's innocent probably WOULD be starstruck enough and WOULD let their children stay there.

Any normal. loving parent wouldn't even take that risk - just in case.

To anwer some of your points too:


Originally posted by BoroughGal
To answer some of your points....

I am aplauding an artist that , like many artists before him, uses satire to highlight a newsworthy story.


No, it's just a publicity stunt, like every other commercial popstar has done in the past, except he's low enough to take the mick out of other artists.


The one thing we BOTH agree on is that MJ will NEVER admit to having sex with children. It WOULD ruin his career, and his life. He would deny it in the same way that all paedophiles do[/QUOTE]

So you are already calling him a paedophile, without a word been said in court, without a shred of evidence been shown!? . . hmmm. I'd hate you to be the judge in any case.

I don't suggest for a second that the parents of poor Eastern families are paedophiles. Circumstance dictates that they have to sleep together. But what is MJ's reasons for doing it???? His love of children??[/QUOTE]

Yes, it is ok to love children isn't it? I didn't know it was illegal. To have sex with underage children IS illegal, but to enjoy the company of youngsters, play games, have sleepovers, watch films, go on fairground rides . . . . ??? I'd say that was fun! I know he's 40 but in his mind he's a yougster, whats up with that, he's rich enough to live out his eccentricities so why the hell not?

Do you not think that his expensive grooming techniques are disgusting - a huge funfair in his back yard??[/QUOTE]

ok, so this makes David Beckham a paedophile too, he's just built a huge childrens play area in his back garden! hold on - and madonna too, oh and the king of Jordan too.

It's fairly obvious you're a big fan of MJ - I agree his early music was very good. But will you continue to say he's innocent, just because you like him as an artist? [/QUOTE]

No I wont, but I will not throw accusations around and call people paedophiles without knowing a thing, I dont like artists who use their 'talents' to slag off other artists in order to better themselves either.

Yes, it may have been a publicity stunt using satire - this sells records, and that is what any artist is in the industry for - to make money - much in the same way as MJ. No problems there then.

Do paedophiles usually admit or deny having sex with children - bearing in mind that they will lose everything? That doesn't mean (in the sentence you decided to quote) that I called MJ a paedophile. Although you're right, I do think he's guilty. And I may have said so elsewhere.

You say it's ok for a 40 year old man to love children. Yes. In context. You seriously think it's ok for a 40 year old man to love children, have sleepovers and play games? Yes, maybe for a father with his kids and their friends - but to have them then sleep in HIS BEDROOM???? What dad would do this? And besides, these generally aren't his kids or his kids friends. They are little starstruck fans. I honestly don't think that even you believe this is right. And people who are "young" in the head aren't necessarily safe to be around children.

He had a funfair before he ever had children (who, incidentally, have white skin and blonde hair - so therefore probably not even anything to do with him, genetically), David Beckham etc have built their childrens activities AROUND their children. They also don't have kids sleeping in their beds and making allegations of sexual abuse against them.

Paedophiles come from all walks of life you know, they can even take the guise of a celebrity that YOU happen to like.

I return to the question - if this male lived near you and your children, would YOU take action - presuming he didn't make music that you enjoy, that is...?

I like how you take a point I make and skip around it and then make it your idea! 'It is a publicity stunt using satire that sells records, no problems there then' YES there is a problem, a big problem - THE FACT THAT MJ DOESN'T HAVE TO BELITTLE OTHER PEOPLE OR THEIR PERSONAL PROBLEMS TO GET PUBLICITY!

Michael Jackson cant step out of his front door without the worlds press following him everywhere, clicking and pointing in his face, this is the kind of publicity Eminem would love but cant get, therefore he does what he knows best - takes the mick out of a huge pop icon!

2nd point - you said it yourself, MJ had a funfair before he ever had his own children, thats his own right! he's earned the money he spends on whatever he likes - whats it got to do with me, you or anyone else. So what if he bought a funfair??? what about people who buy Jet Aeroplanes! Is Richard Branson a paedophile? does he seduce kids with Virgin cola to his house where he then lets them listen to Virgin Radio and takes them to disneyland on Virgin trains!!!??? your arguement is a silly one. without any proof or evidence is it stupid to speculate.

You hate Jacko and thats fair enough, because he's different, he has a gift of making popular music. When someone is that popular worldwide they will always have others who hate them for it, no matter what the reasons, they'll always find something. Whether it's his skin colour or his shopping habits or his music . . . It's your decision to not like him, but to try and judge someone by only hearing one side of an arguement is not very clever.

Thirdly, if a male lived near me and had children over, I would go along with them. That is up to the parents, in the end the parents are to blame for not looking after their kids in the first place.

Very bored of this now... going round in circles. I'm not going to change your mind you you won't change mine.

So I suggest we leave this until after the trial.

Funny how people are offended by the Jacko references in the vid, but nobody is bothering to defend Paul Reubens who suffers the same fate in the vid. :confused:

Just something I was thinking about... also, when the allegations came out about Reubens, he not only lost his job, but his star on Hollywood Boulevard was removed... Jackson isn't really suffering much with a few gags about his is he?

Originally posted by Snook
Funny how people are offended by the Jacko references in the vid, but nobody is bothering to defend Paul Reubens who suffers the same fate in the vid. :confused:

Just something I was thinking about... also, when the allegations came out about Reubens, he not only lost his job, but his star on Hollywood Boulevard was removed... Jackson isn't really suffering much with a few gags about his is he?
whos reubens?

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
whos reubens?

Played Pee Wee Herman in all those films? His catchphase type thing was the weird laugh at Eminem does in the song. He also dresses up like him in the video.

pee wee who? :confused:

Erm, try google...

http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl=en&lr=&q=pee+wee+herman+rolling+stone

Here he is on the cover of Rolling Stone (A famous magazine, before you ask).

Originally posted by Snook
Erm, try google...

http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl=en&lr=&q=pee+wee+herman+rolling+stone

Here he is on the cover of Rolling Stone (A famous magazine, before you ask).
rolling stone - the mag that listed 4 of MJs songs in top 100 songs EVER????? yes ive heard of them.
my work coll just said herman is a rude thing

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
whos reubens?

Im with you Nat, I've never heard of him either, I think he'd just be happy for the publicity dont you!?:P

Originally posted by Lestat
Im with you Nat, I've never heard of him either, I think he'd just be happy for the publicity dont you!?:P

Jacko too probably... :D

That wouldn't be a disparaging remark about a celeb down on his luck now would it Lestat? ;)

Not sure about a rude thing there Nat, he was a children’s entertainer, popular throughout the world, and with a star on Hollywood Boulevard.

He's made about 30 movies and sold out Carnegie Hall with his live act. His first Pee Wee Herman film was directed by Tim Burton... His hit show started in 1986 with a huge budget of $325,000 per episode. He was defiantly a star, and not someone who would 'just be happy for the publicity'.

Surely you're just as outraged about Eminem making fun of him aren't you?

Originally posted by Snook
Surely you're just as outraged about Eminem making fun of him aren't you?

No, not really because I'm not a fan of his.

Never heard of him, but if it makes you feel better then ok, Eminem is a t****r for making fun of mr Herman or peewee or whatever he's called.:|

Originally posted by Lestat
No, not really because I'm not a fan of his.

Oooooh, ok. Sorry, I thought it was about Eminem having to 'belittle other people or their personal problems to get publicity', not sticking up for people you are a fan of...

Sorry, I was barking up the wrong tree, I'll leave it there then.

Originally posted by Snook
Oooooh, ok. Sorry, I thought it was about Eminem having to 'belittle other people or their personal problems to get publicity', not sticking up for people you are a fan of...



It is about Eminem belittling people and their personal problems! I am not saying it isn't:rolleyes: But Im highlighting the MJ scenario because Im a fan of his . . .what have I done wrong???? :confused:

Just because I don't point at every person he's had a go at doesn't mean I dont care. :)

What people have got to understand is getting reactions out of people is exactly what Eminem makes his money from. Every time someone goes "Oh my" at one of his songs it's publicity. He's been dissing people from the very start of his career.

Slating MJ was funny imo. Someone has to break all the seriousness in the Music Industry and add a bit of light hearted humor.

Originally posted by J-Blaze
Every time someone goes "Oh my" at one of his songs it's publicity. He's been dissing people from the very start of his career.

how can it make him money when we dont buy his music and turn over radio when hes on?

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
how can it make him money when we dont buy his music and turn over radio when hes on?

It doesn't work like that tho, for every person who turns their radio over there will be another turning it up, not because of his talent, but because of his reputation.

Remember, Frankie Goes To Hollywood were banned from Radio One, but still got to Number 1 with absolutely no airplay - the publicity the ban got them worked better than any amount of airplay ever would, and it's the same for eminem.

That said, I love eminem, saves me having to teach my younger brother new and interesting swear words

relax dont do it pick your nose and chew it? thats frankie init? i just think em is a wolly thats all, more of performer than a singer mmm each to their own i suppose

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
how can it make him money when we dont buy his music and turn over radio when hes on?

Natalie it's obvious you don't like Eminem but there are millions of kids buying his albums. He has so much money he can afford to slate people and pay the legal costs. It's all a bit of fun for him, you should see the funny side of some of his songs.

Originally posted by NatalieSheff
relax dont do it pick your nose and chew it? thats frankie init? i just think em is a wolly thats all, more of performer than a singer mmm each to their own i suppose

That's the one, can't stand eminem myself, something annoying about an 'artist' who mainly sells records to people who only buy it cos its got Parental Advisory Explicit Lyrics on the front.

But that's just me, it's not like it was in the old days, Doris Day, Bing Crosby, ahh them were the days....

Originally posted by limpetboy
That said, I love eminem, saves me having to teach my younger brother new and interesting swear words

Originally posted by limpetboy
That's the one, can't stand eminem myself

I am missing something ere or do these two posts totally contradict each other :confused: :suspect:

Keep taking the pills mate :hihi:

Originally posted by Deejay
I am missing something ere or do these two posts totally contradict each other :confused: :suspect:

Keep taking the pills mate :hihi:

Oh dear, who have i got as a housemate!

Read the first sentence properly you fool!!!!

Originally posted by limpetboy
Oh dear, who have i got as a housemate!
Read the first sentence properly you fool!!!!

Ahhhh... Erm... :blush:

Originally posted by Deejay
Ahhhh... Erm... :blush:

:loopy: :shakes: