View Full Version : Setting up a web site


5star
24-11-2004, 16:49
If anyone can help me modify my website I would be really grateful.
I already have a site www.fivestartreatment.com but it is very basic, and I'm finding it difficult to modify with GIFs and Flash etc.
My Domain is at Bizland.com. It's American, and the Toll-free calling on their helpline isn't free from the UK, so I don't know what to do.
I have plenty of software to create the animations etc, but I can't seem to be able to apply them.
Please help.
:help:
Please speak to me via my email, which is fivestar4you@aol.com

Bikertec
29-11-2004, 00:15
It already looks good to me or as someone already helped you. 8)

bellis
29-11-2004, 01:19
that is a very good site belive me ive seen a few very good:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

cczmark
29-11-2004, 09:40
To change your site you need HTML editing software. One of the best professional ones is called Dreamweaver but there are plenty of free and shareware ones one the web. Look on www.download.com and www.tucows.com.

Once you have made the changes to your site you need to FTP (File Transfer Protocol) the files up to the public website area.

You should have been given an FTP address of your site e.g. ftp.mywebsite.com and a username & password by the compnay that hosts your site. Use FTP sofware such as WS_FTP to upload your new/updated files. Make sure you keep a local copy of all your original files in case you stuff up.....happens to us all.

Agent Gypo
29-11-2004, 15:48
I had problems opening it in my browser. Are the images large files? Could do with scaling them down and maybe removing the animation.

Jamie
29-11-2004, 16:16
I disagree with some of the other posters on this thread who say the site looks good (yes, I know it's subjective).

My opnion is that it looks a bit tacky, sorry, but that's my honest opinion. The general look / feel of the site is not professional.

I'd recommend either asking someone to help you create a new nice looking site OR learning how to make one yourself.

Good luck!

Jamie.

ps. The links for "Indian Head Massage" and "Reflexology" take you off-site (may not be a good idea).

Agent Gypo
29-11-2004, 16:41
Have to agree. The general appearance of the site is appalling.

Bikertec
29-11-2004, 19:46
Originally posted by Agent Gypo
Have to agree. The general appearance of the site is appalling. But this person has done it them selfs which I think they have done a good job give them a break there not professional web builders.8)

Ant
29-11-2004, 21:37
But this person has done it them selfs which I think they have done a good job give them a break there not professional web builders.

But it's been posted onto an "Ask An Expert" section, so at which level would you expect it be judged? The guy doesn't want an "Ah, that's nice for a beginner - well done mate" opinion. He's asking the advice of experts concerning modification of the site using gifs and flash. My site would be ripped apart if I asked how it could be improved in this section.

My input (and I am just a novice myself) is that the logo is way too big, and a little tacky looking (though it looks fine above the shopfront), the "health and beauty" and the eye image makes it look like an ebay category. Personally, I'd design a new logo instead of the eye, smarten up the title, and stick the "health and beauty" in unobtrusive italics inder the main title. Check out other websites to see how the experts do it. A bit of plagarising seldom goes amiss. :)

Jamie
29-11-2004, 23:19
Originally posted by Bikertec
But this person has done it them selfs which I think they have done a good job give them a break there not professional web builders.8)

If what you have is sub-standard, you don't really want to hear "oh, that looks nice, bla bla bla" ...

Much better to know it's not good and then you're able to take real steps to improve it ... rather than deluding yourself in some fantasy land thinking you have something that rocks.

My advice would be:

1) Look at other sites.

2) Sketch out some designs on paper.

3) Then choose:

a) Develop the site yourself (photoshop / dreamweaver).
OR
b) Get someone to do it for you.
OR perhaps ...
c) Get someone to make a web-page template for you, and use that for each page of your site (you'll still need to learn how to use dreamweaver (which is nice IMHO)).

Making it look very good will probably require a serious investment of time and energy to acquire to appropriate skills ... is it worth it !?




Hmmm ... actually just re-read the first post and the guy is only asking how to modify his GIFs ...

You need to get the GIF from your harddrive to your webspace. This is usually done with a FTP client (try google for 'FTP client').

Good luck.

boldfish
30-11-2004, 07:33
It does look like a home built site and has lots of fundamental problems.

It could be rebuilt by a professional in less than a day.

would be worth paying someone to do it properly.

but then I would say that...

:hihi:

BoldFish Accessible Web Design (http://www.boldfish.co.uk)

asgmedia
30-11-2004, 10:09
Just contact me for a makeover of your website.

www.asgmedia.co.uk
asgmedia@hotmail.com

Narcosis
30-11-2004, 19:26
Just looking at your source code tells me that some one has done your web site for you.

They have made a right balls up of the coding as well as the design. Then that is what you get for self taught web designers.

Particular interest was given to the coding, for the Flash Movies. Lots of coding, but where are all the Flash movies?

As for the gif animation, well they went out with the dinosaurs. No good designer would think of putting that crap on a Business web site.

My advice is pay for a professional web site. You are starting a business; do not scare off your potential clients with that web site.

If you can not afford the price of a Pro web designer. Then go to University and seek out Students on their third or Fourth year multimedia courses that will help you for peanuts. They just want their CV and portfolio to look good.

Also, any one who wants to do you web site, check their work. Not one or four web sites but at least six. Other wise you will be swamped by cowboy web designers.

I have done a BSc degree in multimedia and i am for ever coming across cowboy web site designers.
My last advice, is to check to see if they also have done a course in college or University. If they have, get them to show you their portfolio of their work. If they have not got one or have not done a course on multimedia. F**k them off.

Jamie
30-11-2004, 19:44
Originally posted by Narcosis
If they have not got one or have not done a course on multimedia. F**k them off.

I don't agree.

Self-taught IT professionals are often more skilled and knowledgeable than ones who've just done courses.

Judge on proven ability not qualifications.

Narcosis
30-11-2004, 19:51
Originally posted by Jamie
I don't agree.

Self-taught IT professionals are often more skilled and knowledgeable than ones who've just done courses.

Judge on proven ability not qualifications.



More often. lol

May be you could give examples to prove this wild statement of yours.

boldfish
01-12-2004, 08:59
Originally posted by Narcosis
More often. lol

May be you could give examples to prove this wild statement of yours.

Yours is just as wild.

Good web design is not exclusive to course taught designers. There are good and bad designers from both sides of the argument.

caveat emptor.

Narcosis
01-12-2004, 10:42
Originally posted by boldfish
Yours is just as wild.

Good web design is not exclusive to course taught designers. There are good and bad designers from both sides of the argument.

caveat emptor.

If you read CAREFULLY what i say, you will notice i never say Good web design was exclusive to course taught designers. I actually imply that the majority of web sites that are crap are designed by self taught designers. Majority implies not every one.

Also again, i gave advice if you read what i say; I will repeat myself for you. Check the work from ANYONE that offers work. ANYONE means course taught or self taught.
I also say that if they have done a course check their portfolio and if they have not got one get rid of them. So I am actually being unfair to those who have done a course as well. Am I not!

So you see i did give a fair comment on all designers, regardless of how they got their skills.

The fact remains that while i agree there are bad web designers on both sides. I will repeat what i said. The majority of self taught web designers are not skilled as those coming out of University or College. You only have to look at that web site coding & design that kicked started this post.

Yes i also agree experience is better than some coming out of Courses, but they are rare.

Think about it, would you be happy with a doctor who taught himself his profession in neuro surgery from magazines purchased from W H Smiths.

Or would you be happy with some one just leaving University with a doctors Degree!


A good example why you should always look for skilled people is the Labour Party. Look at the here today gone tomorrow politicians, a majority with no political skill and look what they are doing to our country.

I rest my case.

Jamie
01-12-2004, 10:55
Originally posted by Narcosis
More often. lol

May be you could give examples to prove this wild statement of yours.

Yes ...

www.jamiewoodhouse.co.uk
www.gbatools.com
www.gbaart.com

I developed the games, the tools, and the websites (including gfx).

100% self taught, worked out how to do stuff myself, developed my own procedures, methods and ways of working ... based on what's required and what works best.

Going through this (self taught) process enables you to more fully understand basic underlaying principles of what you're doing. Hope that makes sense. I mean it gives you a better 'grasp' of the subject at hand.

Of course, everything has advantages and disadvantages ...

People who are self-taught may find it hard to find work, because a company will place more value on a qualification than on actual ability to do the work.

Narcosis
01-12-2004, 11:23
Jamie


Read my last comment it should clarify what i said.


Though you gave yourself as an example, i actually asked if you could provide some examples of self taught GOOD WEB DESIGNERS.

I presume that the fact you can not, implies your having a hard proving your statement.

I will make things easier for you.
Can you provide web sites done by self taught designers better than these examples.


http://www.derbauer.de/
http://www.seoleuna.com

Jamie
01-12-2004, 11:41
Dear Narcosis,

I believe my vision is failing me (too many hours on the PC!). Please refer me to the post where you asked me to provide examples of GOOD WEB DESIGNERS.

Originally posted by Narcosis
Read my last comment it should clarify what i said.


Though you gave yourself as an example, i actually asked if you could provide some examples of self taught GOOD WEB DESIGNERS.

Actually you asked for examples proving the wild statement of mine ...

Originally posted by Narcosis
May be you could give examples to prove this wild statement of yours.

My 'wild statement' being ...

Originally posted by Jamie
Self-taught IT professionals are often more skilled and knowledgeable than ones who've just done courses.

So the emphasis being on IT professionals and not GOOD WEB DESIGNERS as you say.

Thanks.

nomme
01-12-2004, 12:07
Originally posted by Narcosis

I will make things easier for you.
Can you provide web sites done by self taught designers better than these examples.


http://www.derbauer.de/
http://www.seoleuna.com

http://www.seoleuna.com/ - that site is awful.
I'm using firefox and the text is too small too read (even when I increase the font.)

IMHO any site that boasts "Best viewed with 'blah' browser" on the front page may as well be saying they are clueless about web design.

Nomme

Narcosis
01-12-2004, 12:15
LOL, your Funny Jamie

You need to read from the beginning of the posts. Instead of reading backwards through the posts.

Let me make things clear for you.


I said “May be you could give examples to prove this wild statement of yours”.

This is what you call an answer, to the wild statement that you said in the previous post to mine. (On page one). Which was:

“Self-taught IT professionals are often more skilled and knowledgeable” (lets remember all posts are talking about web design, except Jamie)


I then get the next post from you providing your examples. LOL

You don’t provide any examples of good web design. Just one web site, which is yours. The web site that doesn’t not offer web design services ( laughing while curled up on the floor). Yet this is what all of us are talking about (except you).

I see how it is confusing for you.

Now this is what all the conversations is about, web design. Not IT services which is what confuses you. Hence why i said read from the start.

Now lets remember Jamie what was the original post about. I will remind you.

“If anyone can help me modify my website I would be really grateful”

So what is the confusion you are having here. Lack of sleep you think.

No it’s the lack of communication skills and reading skills and having a grasp on the English language.


You obviously were self taught

sccsux
01-12-2004, 12:53
Originally posted by nomme
http://www.seoleuna.com/ - that site is awful.

IMHO any site that boasts "Best viewed with 'blah' browser" on the front page may as well be saying they are clueless about web design.

Nomme


Phew.

Glad it isn't just me who thinks this site is poorly designed, and it uses frames... (wasn't too keen on the other one either - to be instantly greeted with flash is not very accessible

Hmmmm. Who was it said "gif's went out with the dinosaurs"..... Ahh yes, narcosis (probably in a heavy state of).

I am 75% self taught (back in the early 80s there were no programming courses available) and 25% course taught. I'd go with self taught being the better option (providing samples of work are available - whether live of proto-type)!


To asgmedia:

Tell me you are having a laugh with your offer to redesign this persons website? Your website page makes reeferences to images stored locally which is neither use nor ornament. At least make sure your own site is fully functional before offering your services publicly)!

Jamie
01-12-2004, 12:57
Originally posted by nomme
http://www.seoleuna.com/ - that site is awful.
I'm using firefox and the text is too small too read (even when I increase the font.)

IMHO any site that boasts "Best viewed with 'blah' browser" on the front page may as well be saying they are clueless about web design.

Nomme

I'm using firefox too nomme and I agree ... that site is pretty awful.

IMO a good website is simple / elegant ... and a bad website is cluttered / complex / has too many flashy graphics.

But then I guess it depends on who your target audience is ...

Narcosis
01-12-2004, 12:59
Originally posted by nomme
http://www.seoleuna.com/ - that site is awful.
I'm using firefox and the text is too small too read (even when I increase the font.)

IMHO any site that boasts "Best viewed with 'blah' browser" on the front page may as well be saying they are clueless about web design.

Nomme
Another 1 comes out from the wood work!

You Obviously do not know about browsers reaction to HTML coding.

If you did you will know that a web site viewed in Firefox, Netscape, Explorer and the rest out their. Will show a different result in each of them. Some differ very little.

The reason why Firefox may show a bigger difference, is due to the (only) 8 million internet users that use firefox.
Here check the facts out...
http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/

Explorer has the worlds market, over 100,000,000 users.
So i hope you see why web designers, do not really give a hoot what firefox does to their HTML coding.

The fact is, fire fox is a good browser. It just hasn't got enough viewers to justify altering HTML codes.

As for the web site (http://www.seoleuna.com) being crap LOL.
Well if you use firefox. Then i can well understand why web designers are not bothering in altering their codes.

your opinion on the web site, though interesting. Really is worthless. You are not a designer or coder other wise you would of known that web sites alter in all browsers. :}

So why bother?

Jamie
01-12-2004, 13:02
I really think that the more you say Narcosis ... the more you are making a fool out of yourself.

Narcosis
01-12-2004, 13:13
Originally posted by Jamie
I really think that the more you say Narcosis ... the more you are making a fool out of yourself.




They were not my web sites. I gave you examples of web sites that won Awards from Adobe. :}

Some thing that is obvious you will never win. lol

Liquid
01-12-2004, 13:41
I have read most the comments and i agree with what Narcosis has to say.
About the browsers, and being careful of web wanabee designers.

Though Broadband will soon reach the 1 gig speed. The static web design of Just HTML and a few flashy things will go.

Most people who i know that self teach them selves, don't have time to keep up with the rapid expansion of change. I know that XML is the big thing, and XML will push back HTML to just a few tags.

I did not notice one web site from any one on this post who has XML in their coding. HHmmm. That says a lot.

Sounds like you are all falling behind.

nomme
01-12-2004, 13:47
Originally posted by Narcosis
They were not my web sites. I gave you examples of web sites that won Awards from Adobe. :}


Really? You got a link for that?

Good web designers design accessible web pages for the web - not for any particular browser. If you know anything at all about web design you should know that.

Nomme

boldfish
01-12-2004, 13:50
Narcosis,

how are you qualified to decide on good or bad web design?

how are you qualified to judge a web site as being by a self-taught designer or by a course taught designer?

Are you sure you can tell the difference?

what about these sites:
http://cssvault.com/index.php

most of these were by designers that taught themselves about CSS.

does that mean they don't know what they are doing?

most of the renaissance artists we admire were self taught - self taught art/web design is not the same as selft taught doctoring, but I'd prefer to see a doctor that takes time to learn new techniques after they've left medical school than one that thinks that all he needs to know came on the course.

ho hum.

;o)

boldfish
01-12-2004, 13:53
Originally posted by Liquid

I did not notice one web site from any one on this post who has XML in their coding. HHmmm. That says a lot.

]

if you knew anything about XML you would know that your browser won't show you it - it has to be transformed into html before you can see it in your browser so how do you know that there's no XML behind the sites you mention?

Liquid
01-12-2004, 14:14
In defense of Narcosis.


He is right about the browsers.
Why alter code for a browser that no one hardly uses.
He gave a link to prove his remarks.
I design web sites and Firefox is not on my agenda because no one hardly uses it within the UK. So why waste valuable time and clients time and money in sorting code out that looks nice in Firefox!

Only 8million users use firefox. Firefox web site say this, not Narcosis.
Firefox browser is also seriously risky to use. Now before i start getting you all upset like Narcosis seems to have.
Email Firefox and ask how vulnerable is their browser malicious attacks, like microsoft is with virus and hackers.
They will surprise you on their honesty.

Check out microsoft web statement on Firefox. They wont risk putting out miss information with out getting hammered in the courts in the US.
The fact is all hackers, Virus senders have their eyes on Microsoft. Firefox is such a small time player that no one bothers them, YET.

I noticed that the other web example narcosis gives does work on
Firefox.
Now that web site for its design is Fantastic. The best i have seen in years.

Martin_s
01-12-2004, 14:21
On the topic of Firefox... You might want to check the news... I think you'll find there's been a resurgence recently for Mozilla based browsers...

Additionally, with it having gone into a full stable release recently it's not as buggy as some suggest. Of course as it gains in popularity there will be more and more exploits found and attacked as it becomes more and more "worthwhile" for crackers, etc... So, the "safety" point is a moot one really.

I'm not arguing one way or the other over what's good/bad... but designing text to fit for both browsers is a basic issue... it's not like trying to making Javascript cross browser compatible...

sccsux
01-12-2004, 15:43
The flaw in narcosis's argument RE Internet Explorer vs Mozilla compliant browsers is simply that Mozilla based browsers are standards compliant, whereas IE is not.

If a website is designed for a specific browser then it is not accessible, which could (technically) land you in court due to non-accessibility to all legislation (try viewing websites which rely of Flash, Java etc using a text or a TTS engined browser ).

You'll also find that IE is the only browser not to abide by the standards laid down by the World Wide Web Consortium (http://www.w3.org/).

Also, being self taught, allows us to be educated in the latest technologies available, rather than relying on out of date information being given as gospel as is the case in most of our educational institutions today.

With more & more business going the Open Source route (Linux, Unix, Xenix et al) University Graduates are going to be leaving Uni with qualifications that are quickly going to become obsolete & the Uni's are still propogating the M$ myth.

Phanerothyme
02-12-2004, 11:53
Originally posted by Narcosis
Just looking at your source code tells me that some one has done your web site for you.

They have made a right balls up of the coding as well as the design. Then that is what you get for self taught web designers.

Narcosis - read the source code again - no-one has written it.

So your theory on self taught web designers is where?

For the record, we interviewed 15 people for a web developer position, and about 10 of them had degrees in related comp media subjects. None of the graduates were offered the position because:
a) they had underdeveloped social and client facing skills
b)their salary expectations were unrealistic
c)their "thinking on the spot" skills were mostly embarassing (one even mentioned that "my mum said...") and they always tended towards the obvious.
d)half of them were also trying to run their own bedroom web design outfit.

The guy we took on eventually was not a graduate, but a computer enthusiast and photgrapher. His skills were entirely self taught and tended towards the back office end of things. He was enthusiastic and interested - all the graduates behaved as if we owed them a job at £20k or something...

JoeP
02-12-2004, 12:19
Originally posted by Narcosis
Jamie


Read my last comment it should clarify what i said.


Though you gave yourself as an example, i actually asked if you could provide some examples of self taught GOOD WEB DESIGNERS.

I presume that the fact you can not, implies your having a hard proving your statement.

I will make things easier for you.
Can you provide web sites done by self taught designers better than these examples.


http://www.derbauer.de/
http://www.seoleuna.com

Define Good.

My design skills are less than adequate - that's why typically I work with designers. I'm mainly a database bod, rather than a web designer, and tend to work with web designers on professional projects. But one hallmark of good design is that it :

Meets the business / user's needs.
Meets a budget.
Works within the technological and legal constraints applied - (e.g. standards compliant, meets issues around disability)

But most importantly DOES THE JOB!

Too many 'beautiful sites' don't actually do the job they were designed to do.

I'm currently working on using XML / XSLT for a small site I'm doing as part of my 'Project Sheffield' work. The reason I'm doing it is that it's a learning experience for me (I've used XML / XSLT in several business projects for data transfer and transformation, but never for a web site before) and partially because it seems the best way to do the job.

Similarly, we used CSS rather than tables to set up most of www.marketingmixers.com although I've used tables on several other sites I've written - mainly reflecting the tools used to do the sites rather than any religious fervour to do things in a particular way.

In terms of standards compliance - yes, I'll strive to meet them, but again I have to admit to being keener in getting the job completed rather than testing against every browser under teh sun. And if I meet some standards, it's possible to break IE - most of my clients will get VERY upset if 85% of browsres can't see their site because I've adhered to standards.

I know that's arse about face but blame Bill not me...:)

Joe

Jamie
02-12-2004, 12:21
Another thing that needs pointing out which perhaps reflects upon Narcosis' credibility is the following:

On this post: http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?postid=224954#post224954

The user Liquid signs himself as Narcosis (well spotted nomme). I also felt it was a bit sus that a new user would suddenly appear and start defending Narcosis on this very thread (Liquid's very first post).

So it does seem that Narcosis and Liquid are the same person. However I may be wrong. Decide for yourself.

Nothing he (Narcosis) has said to me has really merited a response and I certainly wouldn't waste my breath (well ... fingers typing) on him.

nomme
02-12-2004, 12:32
Originally posted by JoePritchard
And if I meet some standards, it's possible to break IE - most of my clients will get VERY upset if 85% of browsres can't see their site because I've adhered to standards.

I know that's arse about face but blame Bill not me...:)

Joe

Oh that's interesting. Can you give some examples perhaps?

Nomme

JoeP
02-12-2004, 13:14
Originally posted by nomme
Oh that's interesting. Can you give some examples perhaps?

Nomme

Hiya,

IE6 is getting closer to standards compliance, but earlier ones were a bit pantsy in places, especially with CSS.

http://archive.webstandards.org/css/winie/

A lot of the issues used to be with non-English / Western character set renderings.

Having said that, IE is amazingly forgiving about HTML that validator programs will throw out, and it does allow you to get a lot done. But it has it's quirks.

I admit it - I write to suit IE then look things over in Netscape / Mozilla. If it works, I'm happy. :)

Joe

sparklesista
02-12-2004, 13:24
Is this the same thread I just posted on a minute ago? :? :huh:

JoeP
02-12-2004, 13:29
Originally posted by sparklesista
Is this the same thread I just posted on a minute ago? :? :huh:

Nope, this is Geek Central :D

Jamie
02-12-2004, 13:38
Originally posted by sparklesista
Is this the same thread I just posted on a minute ago? :? :huh:

Nope, but both threads were started by the same user asking for help. This one just kinda degnerated ...

Actually, the site you did sparklesista (on the other thread) is a prime example of good website design that we could all learn from ...

sparklesista
02-12-2004, 13:45
Originally posted by Jamie
Nope, but both threads were started by the same user asking for help. This one just kinda degnerated ...

Actually, the site you did sparklesista (on the other thread) is a prime example of good website design that we could all learn from ...

Really?!? I did the site myself but I have been told by a couple of people that my web design is crap!

Ahhh well, each to their own!

Any further comments on what would improve it's look would be a great help though :D

nomme
02-12-2004, 13:47
Originally posted by JoePritchard
Hiya,

IE6 is getting closer to standards compliance, but earlier ones were a bit pantsy in places, especially with CSS.

http://archive.webstandards.org/css/winie/

A lot of the issues used to be with non-English / Western character set renderings.

Having said that, IE is amazingly forgiving about HTML that validator programs will throw out, and it does allow you to get a lot done. But it has it's quirks.

I admit it - I write to suit IE then look things over in Netscape / Mozilla. If it works, I'm happy. :)

Joe

Yes, IE is 'amazingly forgiving' which unfortunately only encourages sloppy coding.

In terms of web development you should have a gander at Firefox if only for the web developer toolbar extension.

Read web developers comments about it here:
https://update.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?application=firefox&id=60&vid=645&page=comments

Nomme

Jamie
02-12-2004, 13:49
Originally posted by sparklesista
Any further comments on what would improve it's look would be a great help though :D

Yeah no problemo ... more naked ladies please !!!!

:clap:

(actually the site really is fine sparklesista)

JoeP
02-12-2004, 14:07
Originally posted by nomme
Yes, IE is 'amazingly forgiving' which unfortunately only encourages sloppy coding.

In terms of web development you should have a gander at Firefox if only for the web developer toolbar extension.

Read web developers comments about it here:
https://update.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?application=firefox&id=60&vid=645&page=comments

Nomme

Yes, that's down as an RSN project (Real Soon Now!!)

I could really make use of the DOM aspects of Firefox.

Joe

ncrossland
02-12-2004, 14:13
Originally posted by JoePritchard
I admit it - I write to suit IE then look things over in Netscape / Mozilla. If it works, I'm happy. :)


Thought I'd chime in - its a debate where there is no right or wrong way of doing it (except my way, which is, of course, the best and correct ;) )

I tend to code initially for Firefox, because it is (more) standards compliant.

I then bugfix to make it look right in IE.

Using the IE7 script (http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/) goes a long way to helping, since most of the non-standards compliant things that IE5/6 does are fixed by it - meaning I have nice compliant code which looks good in Firefox and IE. A side effect being it nearly always looks right in Safari, Netscape (6+) and Opera, who are more standards compliant than IE.

Since I use Firefox as my primary browser, it makes sense to me to fully support it.

For a long time I coded for IE, and then hacked away to make it work in other browsers. I think my way now is much more efficient.

It's very rare now that I use tables for layout purposes, after mastering CSS and knowing how to work round a lot of its restrictions. Which, by the way, is self taught, since CSS was virtually unheard of when I did my degree in multimedia graphics. :cool:

Just my 2p.

boldfish
02-12-2004, 15:52
Originally posted by ncrossland

I tend to code initially for Firefox, because it is (more) standards compliant.

I then bugfix to make it look right in IE.

I find that Firefox is a bit forgiving of unclosed tags, whereas Opera won't let any typo's escape. So I tend towards previewing in Firefox, with regular checks in Opera. Usually IE then just requires a few tweaks to account for it's quirks (like needing all elements to have layout - dimension).

design for standards, not for browsers. what will you do with your broken designs when IE becomes more standard compliant?

;o)

boldfish
02-12-2004, 15:57
There seem to be a fair number of web people on this forum.

Brighton has it's own local web mailing list and get togethers.

http://brightonnewmedia.org/


Is there something similar for Sheffield?

if not who would be interested in

a) starting a local new media group
b) joining a local new media group

?

wendy
02-12-2004, 16:56
Have any of you guys noticed that the original poster of this thread has now reposted on Sheffield Chat I think he/she has got lost in all the jargon and to be honest they are not the only one! You lost me a long time back!:confused:

JoeP
02-12-2004, 17:12
Originally posted by wendy
Have any of you guys noticed that the original poster of this thread has now reposted on Sheffield Chat I think he/she has got lost in all the jargon and to be honest they are not the only one! You lost me a long time back!:confused:

Yup....

I actually mailed the original poster pretty quickly after they posted, but didn't hear back from them.

Forum threads have this habit of getting lost like this!

Joe

5star
03-12-2004, 10:52
Yes Wendy, i am getting lost with all the jargon.

And Joe, I have been replying but none of my messages seem to be displayed.
This is why I'm trying again. If this doesn't work, then I'll send PM's instead.

5star
03-12-2004, 10:52
Yippee. It's readable.

JoeP
03-12-2004, 11:04
Hi 5star,

hehehe....

Marvels of modern technology!

Fortunately most of the jargon should never impinge on you. It's just when geeks gather together we're compelled by Union Rules to talk only in fluent gibberish...:)

Joe

5star
03-12-2004, 11:12
Hi Joe.
Yes, I understand. I just wish I DID understand the jargon of modern technology. :confused:

I have been trying to get information from the domain provider in respect of my website (I use the word 'website' in the loosest possible term), but they kept sending me jargon; ie:
I have checked both these sites http://www.anim-fx.com and http://www.coffeecup.com . Anim Fix is the software for creating flash animations, banners, and text effects with Flash templates etc while Coffecup offers many tools for FTP uploading, Website editing, Image editing etc. However SiteDelux is a completely different online based web editing software and is not associated with Coffeecup or Anim Fix. SiteDelux is an online template based website designing software. The pages created with SiteDelux can't be edited with any other web designing software like FrontPage, Dreamweaver, Coffeeup, etc

All I wanted to know was how to soup-up my site!