Hi people,
For the first time I took my wheelchair on a bus yesterday. But it wasnt as easy as everyone told me it would be.

When the bus came i asked the driver if he could get the ramp out and he said "How much does it weigh?" so I said "I have no idea but Im only 6stone"

He then said "Im sorry I cant, the wheelchair is too heavy" so my sister ended up lifting the wheelchair up which isnt very light.

Now am I the only one who can see something wrong with this? Whats the point of having a wheelchair ramp which cant hold wheelchairs?

Sounds to me like he couldn't be bothered. If you can remeber the route number and time of the bus you should raise a complaint with the operator. They will be able to track who was driving it.

Bloody disgusting - Bet this was what comes before second buses weren't it.

I cant remember what time just that it was a 88 bus, the one that runs every 10mins

Im not from Sheffield but if you can remember roughly they may be able to track it as drivers stay on the same route for a few hours. If nothing else you maybe able to get a free buspass.

Next time keep your ticket, it has the bus details on it.

Next time keep your ticket, it has the bus details on it.

That'd be just absolutely disgraceful if there was to be a next time. :mad: :rant:

A Free bus pass ?????? The driver needs to be sacked and fined for refusing to help, saying the wheelchair was too heavy to use the ramp. This driver was just too lazy and obnoxious. Get the incident reported, also write to the star about it, it is absolutely disgusting that anyone could behave that way, and is a slur on the bus companies name.

What kind of chair do you have, blue dragon? I believe scooter types aren't allowed on the bus for some reason.

Anyway, If I were you I should take your complaint to the company and also to the passenger transport executive. If you were in a normal wheelchair and their were no restrictions on it you have been treated disgracefully.

Im not from Sheffield but if you can remember roughly they may be able to track it as drivers stay on the same route for a few hours. If nothing else you maybe able to get a free buspass.

Mobility bus passes allow free access to buses and trams anyway- as essential public transport users.

you def need to complain - this is a form of discrimination which goes against the disability discrimination act. also, go to the local press! people like that need to be named and shamed! if i'd been a passenger and heard what the driver said, i'd have come over and stood up to him too.

i'm just sorry you had to go thrugh this

Its a normal electric wheelchair.

ROTTEN SWINES get your complaint sent off to watchdog or similar, maybe MR Robinson could help? he's from the bbc !!( come on roney we know you are out there ????) there is not enough provision for the less fortunate than able bodied people and for this driver to utter these words is beyond contempt.... sincerest hopes that this idiot never stops at your stop again !!! what a /'#=+_)(*&^%$£"! grr!:suspect:

so my sister ended up lifting the wheelchair up which isnt very light.

For all those slagging off the bus driver, health and safety rules may be in place to prevent him lifting above a certain weight. My workplace rules say I cannot lift more than something like 15Kg.

The bus driver is just that - he's a driver, not a lifter. What would happen if he lifted something and damaged his back preventing him from driving the bus - especially if the bus was holding up traffic?

Perhaps looking into the matter before jumping to conclusions would be a good idea.

I thought the whole point of a ramp was so that no-one had to lift the chair.

For all those slagging off the bus driver, health and safety rules may be in place to prevent him lifting above a certain weight. My workplace rules say I cannot lift more than something like 15Kg.

The bus driver is just that - he's a driver, not a lifter. What would happen if he lifted something and damaged his back preventing him from driving the bus - especially if the bus was holding up traffic?

Perhaps looking into the matter before jumping to conclusions would be a good idea.

If the driver lowers the ramp the wheelchair user can use that to get onto the bus, thus making it unnesecary for any one to lift anything onto the bus. Thats the whole point of the ramp!

If the driver lowers the ramp the wheelchair user can use that to get onto the bus, thus making it unnesecary for any one to lift anything onto the bus. Thats the whole point of the ramp!

exactly! what I understand from the op is that the driver was saying the ramp couldn't take the weight - which sounds like "i can't be arsed to get out and lower it" to me.

For all those slagging off the bus driver, health and safety rules may be in place to prevent him lifting above a certain weight. My workplace rules say I cannot lift more than something like 15Kg.

The bus driver is just that - he's a driver, not a lifter. What would happen if he lifted something and damaged his back preventing him from driving the bus - especially if the bus was holding up traffic?

Perhaps looking into the matter before jumping to conclusions would be a good idea.


He is also a public servant, driving a public service vehicle, and should be non - discriminatory, polite and helpful to people wishing to board his vehicle. He was not expected to bodily lift the wheelchair and person onto the bus, but watched as a young woman had to, just because he was too damned lazy to lower the ramp. What would he have done if the young lady had an accident struggling with the wheelchair? would he have just driven off and left them? What a plonker, he deserves to be fined for discrimination and his licence taken off him GGGGGGGRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:

Somebody I know tried to get on a bus in her electric wheelchair. She was on her own, and the driver told her that he couldn't put the ramp down because of "Health and Safety", so she'd have to do it herself!!

How the blazes she was supposed to do that, when she was confined to a wheelchair, is beyond me.

The wheelchair ramps just seem to be a PR exercise, so First Buses can claim they are not being discriminatory against people with disabilities. I can't remember ever actually seeing anybody in a wheelchair on a bus.

Dozy

I've seen people in wheelchairs been helped onto yorkshire terrier buses - the yorkshire terrier bus drivers seem a lot nicer and are keen to help.

By the way, Blue Dragon, are you aware of Sheffield Community Transport?

http://www.sheffieldct.co.uk/Pages/About%20Us.htm

They do a range of services for people who can't manage normal buses - they have those wheelchair lifts at the back, so it makes life very easy.

There's regular services to various places, like Meadowhell, Morrisons, and town (that's for North Sheffield), where they go round and pick up lots of people. That costs 40p each way, and you can take an escort, who also only pays 40p. You have to register, but that costs nothing.

They also do a service more like a taxi, where you book just for yourself, and it costs more, but still cheaper than a taxi.

Dozy

you def need to complain - this is a form of discrimination which goes against the disability discrimination act.

Sadly, public transport is not yet covered by the DDA. Because disabled people don't need to use public transport, right? Er...

Another example of the barriers that many people face, which never occur to the sorts who brand disabled people on benefits "workshy". If you can't afford a car (with any costly adaptations you might need), and can't get on the bus either, how are you meant to get to work, exactly?

Sadly, public transport is not yet covered by the DDA. Because disabled people don't need to use public transport, right? Er...

Another example of the barriers that many people face, which never occur to the sorts who brand disabled people on benefits "workshy". If you can't afford a car (with any costly adaptations you might need), and can't get on the bus either, how are you meant to get to work, exactly?



Uuuuuummmmmmmmm :huh: Why are public service vehicles fitted with ramps, if disabled people don't use buses? :huh: I think you will find that they are just as guilty in this case, of discrimination, just as anyone else would be. The discrimination of disabled persons act, covers everything and everyone that discriminates against them. Also this driver is guilty of an offence under H&S legislation, in that he failed to make safe, access to his workplace (Vehicle). I would throw the book at this plonker and send out a message to all bus drivers that this type of behaviour/attitude towards disabled people or anyone else for that fact, is not acceptable.

Uuuuuummmmmmmmm :huh: Why are public service vehicles fitted with ramps, if disabled people don't use buses? :huh: I think you will find that they are just as guilty in this case, of discrimination, just as anyone else would be. The discrimination of disabled persons act, covers everything and everyone that discriminates against them. Also this driver is guilty of an offence under H&S legislation, in that he failed to make safe, access to his workplace (Vehicle). I would throw the book at this plonker and send out a message to all bus drivers that this type of behaviour/attitude towards disabled people or anyone else for that fact, is not acceptable.

Sorry, I was being sarcastic, something I'm, um, meant to have given up :)

Anyway, I wish you were right, but you're not, at least not wholly. The DDA's cover of public transport is being introduced, but very very slowly.

Have a look at this link http://www.dptac.gov.uk/door-to-door/03/05.htm

It gives you some of the timescales:

All trains must be accessible by..... 2020!

All buses by ...... 2016/17!

Now I've had some waits for trains in my time, but 13 years????

Sorry, I was being sarcastic, something I'm, um, meant to have given up :)

Anyway, I wish you were right, but you're not, at least not wholly. The DDA's cover of public transport is being introduced, but very very slowly.

Have a look at this link http://www.dptac.gov.uk/door-to-door/03/05.htm

It gives you some of the timescales:

All trains must be accessible by..... 2020!

All buses by ...... 2016/17!

Now I've had some waits for trains in my time, but 13 years????



I am right na na na na naaaaa :hihi: :hihi:
Sheffields buses are relatively new ...... Read this bit you left out of your post :hihi: :hihi:

DDA Part 5 - public transport
This section gives the Government powers to make accessibility regulations for all land based public transport vehicles, these are specifically listed as Taxis, Rail and Public Service Vehicles (buses and coaches).

The Government decided to set different technical regulations for each form of transport, as there is no single solution that could be used to make all forms of transport accessible to disabled people. For example completely different solutions are needed to make taxis and trains accessible.

Because of the differences in the vehicles and differing levels of difficulty in making each form of transport accessible, the government set different timetables for each type of vehicle to become fully accessible. This was also to give those who make and operate vehicles enough time to make the necessary changes to vehicles and designs.

Buses and Coaches - The Public Service Vehicle Accessibility Regulations (PSVAR)19
The following are dates by which Public Service Vehicles must be accessible to disabled people.
They are only for vehicles used on local or schedules services which can carry more than 22 passengers.

31 December 2000:
New full size single deck buses over 7.5 tonnes and new double deck buses must be accessible to disabled people including wheelchair users.:suspect:

31 December 2000: New buses weighing up to 7.5 tonnes and new coaches must have improved access for ambulant and sensory impaired passengers.:suspect:

1 January 2005: New buses weighing up to 7.5 tonnes and new coaches must be wheelchair accessible.:suspect:

This my friend is why that particular bus had ramps on, and also, why some buses 'Kneel down'.:suspect:

And Sheffield buses run on local scheduled services.:)

I am right na na na na naaaaa :hihi: :hihi:
Sheffields buses are relatively new ...... Read this bit you left out of your post :hihi: :hihi:

DDA Part 5 - public transport
This section gives the Government powers to make accessibility regulations for all land based public transport vehicles, these are specifically listed as Taxis, Rail and Public Service Vehicles (buses and coaches).

The Government decided to set different technical regulations for each form of transport, as there is no single solution that could be used to make all forms of transport accessible to disabled people. For example completely different solutions are needed to make taxis and trains accessible.

Because of the differences in the vehicles and differing levels of difficulty in making each form of transport accessible, the government set different timetables for each type of vehicle to become fully accessible. This was also to give those who make and operate vehicles enough time to make the necessary changes to vehicles and designs.

Buses and Coaches - The Public Service Vehicle Accessibility Regulations (PSVAR)19
The following are dates by which Public Service Vehicles must be accessible to disabled people.
They are only for vehicles used on local or schedules services which can carry more than 22 passengers.

31 December 2000:
New full size single deck buses over 7.5 tonnes and new double deck buses must be accessible to disabled people including wheelchair users.:suspect:

31 December 2000: New buses weighing up to 7.5 tonnes and new coaches must have improved access for ambulant and sensory impaired passengers.:suspect:

1 January 2005: New buses weighing up to 7.5 tonnes and new coaches must be wheelchair accessible.:suspect:

This my friend is why that particular bus had ramps on, and also, why some buses 'Kneel down'.:suspect:

And Sheffield buses run on local scheduled services.:)

Ooh, well I hope you are right. Has anyone tested this yet? I would be very interested to know. Cheers Pooch1.

Ooh, well I hope you are right. Has anyone tested this yet? I would be very interested to know. Cheers Pooch1.

It hasn't been tested yet, not that I am aware of anyway, But I reckon that The_Blue_Dragon would have good cause to test it. It wasn't me it happened to, but I am still seething to think that some bus driver could be so callous.

Perhaps First can enquire as to the technology used on certain routes of the Dublin bus service. The driver presses a lever, an alarm sounds and the ramp automatically rotates through approx. 220 deg and there you go, Grand!

Hi, dragon, sorry to hear you have had difficulties.

Firstly, can I point out that the 10-mins 88 is, IIRC a Stagecoach bus... (not First)

Secondly, my advice would be the same, whichever company it was that a passenger had a problem with.

a) take the route number, date, time, and location, and direction of travel,
b) if you possibly can, get the fleet number (or reg plate number) of the bus,
c) contact the company, and let them know the above details, and what the problem was.

you can't do much more than that, 'til the (thankfully small) minority of awkward and unhelpful drivers have been educated in customer service and start putting it into practice.

you'll just have to keep dogging at the companies, I'm afraid.

I’m a disability rights worker at the Law Centre and I was looking at some of this legislation the other day. It’s pretty complex but the bottom line is that if the bus has a ramp fitted, it’s for wheelchair access and it’s a “reasonable adjustment” to their normal practice to use the ramp to let you on the bus.

Here’s a link to some help on the Disability Rights commission’s website: http://www.drc-gb.org/your_rights/services_and_transport/what_to_do_if_you_are_discrimi.aspx.

If you want more help, then do contact me at the Law Centre
.

Hi people,
For the first time I took my wheelchair on a bus yesterday. But it wasnt as easy as everyone told me it would be.

When the bus came i asked the driver if he could get the ramp out and he said "How much does it weigh?" so I said "I have no idea but Im only 6stone"

He then said "Im sorry I cant, the wheelchair is too heavy" so my sister ended up lifting the wheelchair up which isnt very light.

Now am I the only one who can see something wrong with this? Whats the point of having a wheelchair ramp which cant hold wheelchairs?

I use the 88 every day to go and come home from work.
In their defence I have never seen a driver refuse to pull up the ramp for a wheel chair and I have seen one or two get on.
This sounds like a particular driver problem and he/she wants reporting asap.
The driver in question needs "re-training" at the very least.

I dont see what point of having ramps on the normal bus's as most drivers dont know how they work or come out with health and safety excuses but there isnt enough room on the buses anyway. I have a mobility scooter and always use the trams they are way better equiped and the people who work on the trams seem very polite aswell and always willing to help unless I run them over by accident lol.

I dont see what point of having ramps on the normal bus's as most drivers dont know how they work or come out with health and safety excuses but there isnt enough room on the buses anyway. I have a mobility scooter and always use the trams they are way better equiped and the people who work on the trams seem very polite aswell and always willing to help unless I run them over by accident lol.

At the moment, in South Yorkshire, you aren't permitted to take scootas onto buses, not even the ramped buses. Currently, it's only manual or electric wheelchiars that are permitted.

Most drivers, whether First or Stageecoach are trained in the putting the ramp out, it's just that a hardcore minority will refuse to do so.

At the moment, in South Yorkshire, you aren't permitted to take scootas onto buses, not even the ramped buses. Currently, it's only manual or electric wheelchiars that are permitted.

Most drivers, whether First or Stageecoach are trained in the putting the ramp out, it's just that a hardcore minority will refuse to do so.

I know you cant take scooters on I was on about wheelchairs its pretty common from what I hear that not many people get let on buses cos of excuses to do with health and saftey and things like that or best one is the ramps broke. My point about trams was I think they are safer in every aspect theres more room and easier to get on and off. On buses they only put them on cos they had to by law but the main buses I dont feel are suited to wheelchairs where trams are.

I know you cant take scooters on I was on about wheelchairs its pretty common from what I hear that not many people get let on buses cos of excuses to do with health and saftey and things like that or best one is the ramps broke. My point about trams was I think they are safer in every aspect theres more room and easier to get on and off. On buses they only put them on cos they had to by law but the main buses I dont feel are suited to wheelchairs where trams are.

Yes, but trams being better suited isn't a great deal of consolation for those of us who aren't anywhere near a tram stop!

I think buses are perfectly suited to wheelchairs - if the drivers are willing to be a little helpful (which they always have been to me and my ma in law). I don't think idle/disinterested/untrained drivers should be able to block people in wheelchairs from using what is supposed to be public transport. They are members of the public, too.

I don't know if it's still true but when I was attending clinics in Nottinghamshire the ambulance wouldn't allow my scooter on board as they said it was against regulations.

I havn't read the whole thread, but next time (If there is a next time which they shouldnt be!!!) if your on a first bus (Like a 53 bus) if the driver refuses. If youre which someone get them to do it. On the ramp theres a little 'ring pull' kind of thing, you just pull that up. And the ramp will come out! I've done that plenty of times, when my sisters been refused for the driver to lower the bus, she has a pram and we asked him to lower the bus a little as my newborn niece would be upside down trying to get it on. He said he couldn't so I pulled out the ramp. My niece got on board safe. I put the ramp back, then paid. The bus driver wasn't impressed. But stuff em!

:)

I havn't read the whole thread, but next time (If there is a next time which they shouldnt be!!!) if your on a first bus (Like a 53 bus) if the driver refuses. If youre which someone get them to do it. On the ramp theres a little 'ring pull' kind of thing, you just pull that up. And the ramp will come out! I've done that plenty of times, when my sisters been refused for the driver to lower the bus, she has a pram and we asked him to lower the bus a little as my newborn niece would be upside down trying to get it on. He said he couldn't so I pulled out the ramp. My niece got on board safe. I put the ramp back, then paid. The bus driver wasn't impressed. But stuff em!

:)

there are legal difficulties though gina, about a member of the public (MOP) deploying the wheelchair ramp, for a couple of reasons,

firstly, there's supposed to be "training" in safe operation, in deploying the ramp, which involves things like "kinetic lifting" that is, bending and moving in such a way that you do not damage your back. Many MOPS havent had this sort of training, even for something as simple as "flapping" the ramp out from its housing.

secondly, the driver is insured by his employers in case he injures himself or other people during the deployment and use of the ramp. An MOP is not insured. If an MOP deploys it, then there are problems with the insurance, eg who would be liable in the event of a claim, after an acccident.

There should be no more than a couple of drivers now (if any!!) who have not recieved ramp training, so ther is no excuse for them not getting out of their cab, and doing their job, and deploying the ramp for a disabled person, lie a wheelchair user, or, if necessary, a parent with a pram.

I totally understand where you are coming from but sometimes when the bus driver is just been a you know, it's just easier to do it yourself. We did make a complain about it though, and we got told as we didn't still have our tickets, there was nothing that could be done. (We bought day savers on another bus) but even having the time we got on, and the route, where we got on ect. Nothing could be done. I think that drivers could be a little more on the nicer side than being complete you know whats.

If they have all received ramp training then why don't they do it? It baffles me.

:)

I totally understand where you are coming from but sometimes when the bus driver is just been a you know, it's just easier to do it yourself. We did make a complain about it though, and we got told as we didn't still have our tickets, there was nothing that could be done. (We bought day savers on another bus) but even having the time we got on, and the route, where we got on ect. Nothing could be done. I think that drivers could be a little more on the nicer side than being complete you know whats.

If they have all received ramp training then why don't they do it? It baffles me.

:)

Whether they do or don't (and of course they should when possible, especially for wheelchair users), PLEASE don't do it yourself. As PT says, you'll not be insured against possible injury or damage to the chair.

I totally understand where you are coming from but sometimes when the bus driver is just been a you know, it's just easier to do it yourself. We did make a complain about it though, and we got told as we didn't still have our tickets, there was nothing that could be done. (We bought day savers on another bus) but even having the time we got on, and the route, where we got on ect. Nothing could be done. I think that drivers could be a little more on the nicer side than being complete you know whats.

If they have all received ramp training then why don't they do it? It baffles me.

:)

that response from the bus company is not strictly accurate. the bus company CAN trace the bus you travelled on, even without the ticket, so don't let that put you off taking a problem up with the bus company.

It's a gnats more difficult to trace the bus without the fleet number (which will be on the ticket you are issued), but if you can give the bus company the route number, direction of travel, which stop you boarded at, and the time of the incident, then they can locate which bus it was, and, with a time, they can tie a particular driver to the bus then (or narrow it down to no more than one or two drivers who it could possibly be.)

Lately (She knocks on wood :lol: ) "bad" incidents for me have, fortunately been quite thin on the ground. The drivers I have travelled with, over the last few days have been pleasant, helpful, and have deployed the ramp, no problems.

The only problem I encountered was the other evening, when some prat steadfastly refused to stand up, and move out of the wheelchair area, meaning that I could not get into the wh'ch area, and was stuck, in the aisle for about three stops. but that was not the driver's fault, it was the fault of the pig-ignorant passenger, who would not move. He seemed to believe that the seat had his name on it, or something, I think...

I can't remember ever actually seeing anybody in a wheelchair on a bus.

Dozy

I've been on a bus in a wheelchair. It was a few years ago and it was the type that lowered down to allow the wheelchair on.

Trouble is, there was a pole right through the wheelchair space, and when I pressed the button to get off and then tried to manouevre out past the pole, the driver failed to wait for me to get off and drove onto the next stop.

I was then stranded in a manual wheelchair too far from home to get back on my own. :rant:

My husband uses a wheelchair and our experience on the buses are not good either. We had no trouble getting on but once on it was a nightmare! The space for the wheelchair was not adequate and his chair stuck out in the aisle. We were in the way all the time. Every time we went round a corner his chair tipped over. There was nothing to hold the chair down! My arms were coming out of the sockets by the time we reached our stop and then we had to get home!! A nightmare. We haven't been on a bus since : (