07 May 2007
MuayThai means more by Arjarn Mick Mullaney

To the Thai’s MuayThai means so much more than what we see in the ring. I know that Thai culture may sometimes seem illogical to us in the west, but it is a complicated Martial discipline which is intertwined with a deeper philosophy and encompasses much more than physical effort. Nak Muay (Thai-Boxers) should also be an example to those around them on how to live a life of significance.

read the full article at http://www.wickercamp.blogspot.com

wow. Never knew that blog existed.

Cheers for that!

wow. Never knew that blog existed.

Cheers for that!

It's new! (I posted about it here - http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=201861&page=4)

Spread the word and link to it from your sites. Hopefully Arjarn Mick Mullaney will be posting regularly on there.

Marvellous marvellous stuff

About time Mr. Mullaney put his wise words down! :)

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Wow, First time I've seen that too!

looks great

(I think it mentions stussonics on there about one of the Beginner
classes )

Yeah I saw that on the blog site.
I'm not sure who Rizla is but he's certainly done the gym proud with the site he's put together, and I'm thinking he was maybe in the Wednesday Beginner class as he's practically quoted me word for word, just glad he chose to use those words as oppose to some utter rubbish I was spouting ;)

Rizla, did you put this site together? I thought Mick/Trix
did it, they seem to be updating quote regularly.

Who are yo Rizla? do you train at wicker? what class?

Rizla, did you put this site together? I thought Mick/Trix
did it, they seem to be updating quote regularly.

Who are yo Rizla? do you train at wicker? what class?

Ah, so many questions! Yeah, i set up the actual blog - most of the posting has been done by Mick and Trix I am pleased to say and hopefully we'll benefit from their wise and useful posts.

Who am i? stussonicos knows now. i' don't live in sheffield and new to wicker so most of you 'regulars' at wicker won't know me. After visiting Arjarn Mick Mullaney and seeing the setup at wicker camp i realised that Sheffield is home to a great traditional Muay Thai camp!

hope to get to know you all soon.

Did you train at Master A's in Manchester before this?

Did you train at Master A's in Manchester before this?

No, i have been to master A's gym once.

Yeah I saw that on the blog site.
I'm not sure who Rizla is but he's certainly done the gym proud with the site he's put together, and I'm thinking he was maybe in the Wednesday Beginner class as he's practically quoted me word for word, just glad he chose to use those words as oppose to some utter rubbish I was spouting ;)

Got some more memorable quotes this week. Hope to use them when appropriate. lol.

If any Wicker Camp veterans have any pictures, videos etc which you'd like to appear on the blog, please contact me.

Ha ha. I'm gonna start getting all worried and apprehensive about what I say in my classes now, people that know me know I'm used to babbling on a bit and tend to waste time stating the bleeding obvious.

Aboiut the old video's, I might have a think about that and get one to you, just for old times sake and all.

See you soon

Got some more memorable quotes this week. Hope to use them when appropriate. lol.

If any Wicker Camp veterans have any pictures, videos etc which you'd like to appear on the blog, please contact me.


Videos of my fights?.... I'm not sure if you have software to convert from 8mm tape to digital :hihi:

Ha ha. I'm gonna start getting all worried and apprehensive about what I say in my classes now, people that know me know I'm used to babbling on a bit and tend to waste time stating the bleeding obvious.

Aboiut the old video's, I might have a think about that and get one to you, just for old times sake and all.

See you soon

Cheers - look forward to getting some good quality clips. btw, quote of the week was about callusses on the shin are 'actually quite nice'. hehe.

Videos of my fights?.... I'm not sure if you have software to convert from 8mm tape to digital :hihi:

DVD would be preferred choice. But I can convert from VHS and other analogue sources although will take a bit longer.

stuss,

Do you know when Imran is fighting the Thai for the Golden belt in liverpool?

Yeah Imran is fighting this weekend, Sunday. The show is in Liverpool.
And I'll have you know I have had 'some' fights since DVD's were introduced, not many but some ;)

Yeah Imran is fighting this weekend, Sunday. The show is in Liverpool.
And I'll have you know I have had 'some' fights since DVD's were introduced, not many but some ;)

For details of Imran's fight:

http://wickercamp.blogspot.com/2007/05/imran-khan-vs-rung.html

Also, check out a fantastic new article by Arjarn Mick - One World, one MuayThai - http://wickercamp.blogspot.com

See you tomorrow!

For details of Imran's fight:

http://wickercamp.blogspot.com/2007/05/imran-khan-vs-rung.html




Yeah I've seen that, it's great.

But I was asking about Imran's next fight in Liverpool against a
current World Muay Thai Council Champion and Ratchadamnern Champion.

This will no doubt be Imran biggest fight yet!
and his opponent is probably one of the highest ranked thaiboxers
ever to set foot in the UK.

Yeah I've seen that, it's great.

But I was asking about Imran's next fight in Liverpool against a
current World Muay Thai Council Champion and Ratchadamnern Champion.

This will no doubt be Imran biggest fight yet!
and his opponent is probably one of the highest ranked thaiboxers
ever to set foot in the UK.

i know you were asking about that fight - Mick mentions it in the link i sent ' "fight Seangatit (Boo) Sasiprapa for a World Title in Liverpool on the 20th May, only 4 weeks after the Sheffield show"

more details about the liverpool show will be on the blog tomorrow.

Videos of my fights?.... I'm not sure if you have software to convert from 8mm tape to digital :hihi:And I'll have you know I have had 'some' fights since DVD's were introduced, not many but some ;)
Haha! You pair of old farts :hihi:









Like I can talk! :P

These blogs are great reading - thanks :)

Don't suppose anyone knows how busy the evening bag classes are?

Seeing as the price for private lessons has just gone up to a ridiculous £28 per hour (was £15 a couple of years ago, and there hasn't been much changes to justify such an increase - so much for being non-profit eh?), I think I'm going to start doing the bag classes.

Don't suppose anyone knows how busy the evening bag classes are?

Seeing as the price for private lessons has just gone up to a ridiculous £28 per hour (was £15 a couple of years ago, and there hasn't been much changes to justify such an increase - so much for being non-profit eh?), I think I'm going to start doing the bag classes.


Bloody hell, £28 per hour as seriously put me off from going to a private lesson. However, I suspect they have massive rental costs as there location is still considered to be the centre of town.

I've been told that the bag classes are pretty busy yeah but they have only just started so maybe they will pick up even more.

I've got to ask you Gaz B and Honestjoe69 how much you realistically expect to be paying for private tuition?
It's not like anyone having private lessons at Wicker Camp is taught by a second rate instructor, all the instructors there have fought and trained in Thailand, your been trained by world, european, british, english and area champions - where esle can you possibly expect to get private tuition of that calibre, especially at that price - if there are 4 people in a lesson thats £7.50, you can't even buy food for 2 people at McDonalds for that, think you guys need to have a look around at what other reputable Muay Thai gyms are charging for standard training let alone private tuition.
Private lessosn haven't been £15 for nearly 6 years, not much of an increase I don't think.
The money you are paying goes to paying for rental costs, electricity, heating, the up keep of the gym, the cost of ensuring pads and equipment are available and then making sure the instructor is paid expenses for teaching in the first place - I'd hardly call this ridculous, you show me there's lots of profit to be had and iI'll pull a rabbit out of my a55.

Although I supppose if you find it too expensive either 'slum it' in the evening classes or find another world champion thai boxer in South Yorkshire that will train you for less.

They were £15 when I started 3 years ago, which was fine. Then it was £20, which I suppose was OK. Then £25, then £28.

I've been told that the bag classes are pretty busy yeah but they have only just started so maybe they will pick up even more.

I've got to ask you Gaz B and Honestjoe69 how much you realistically expect to be paying for private tuition?
It's not like anyone having private lessons at Wicker Camp is taught by a second rate instructor, all the instructors there have fought and trained in Thailand, your been trained by world, european, british, english and area champions - where esle can you possibly expect to get private tuition of that calibre, especially at that price - if there are 4 people in a lesson thats £7.50, you can't even buy food for 2 people at McDonalds for that, think you guys need to have a look around at what other reputable Muay Thai gyms are charging for standard training let alone private tuition.
Private lessosn haven't been £15 for nearly 6 years, not much of an increase I don't think.
The money you are paying goes to paying for rental costs, electricity, heating, the up keep of the gym, the cost of ensuring pads and equipment are available and then making sure the instructor is paid expenses for teaching in the first place - I'd hardly call this ridculous, you show me there's lots of profit to be had and iI'll pull a rabbit out of my a55.

Although I supppose if you find it too expensive either 'slum it' in the evening classes or find another world champion thai boxer in South Yorkshire that will train you for less.

Good point and well argued!

I would say though for £7.50 you can buy a small bargin bucket from KFC that can easily satisfy two people :hihi:

Ha, Lightweight, I can polish off at least 6 pieces of chicken, 2 fries and a chicken gravy to myself (only on treat day, obviously).

Seeing as the price for private lessons has just gone up

Can you train during the day Gaz? Find another two people and I'll share a private lesson with you!

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Can you train during the day Gaz? Find another two people and I'll share a private lesson with you!

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I wish I could! But I work the standard 9 - 5 Monday to Friday... and I can never be bothered on a weekend!

I used to be able to nip out of work to train on a Friday afternoon for a couple of hours when I worked in Sheffield but I work in Rotherham now :(

if any muay thai newbies are interested in sharing the cost of some private lessons on a friday (from 7:30 i think) in the not too distant future, drop me a pm - i'd like to have a few privates before joining the mixed beginners class as mon and wed aren't too clever for me.

Rizla, did you put this site together? I thought Mick/Trix
did it, they seem to be updating quote regularly.

Who are yo Rizla? do you train at wicker? what class?

fb - i'm also interested in knowing who you are - do you fight/train/instruct at wicker currently?

p.s. details of Imran's fight on sunday have been posted on the blog as promised.

The money you are paying goes to paying for rental costs, electricity, heating, the up keep of the gym, the cost of ensuring pads and equipment are available and then making sure the instructor is paid expenses for teaching in the first place - I'd hardly call this ridculous, you show me there's lots of profit to be had and iI'll pull a rabbit out of my a55.

Although I supppose if you find it too expensive either 'slum it' in the evening classes or find another world champion thai boxer in South Yorkshire that will train you for less.

At my local fitness centre/gym, a former pro-boxer (western boxing that is) who had just 13 fights in his entire career and who you won't have heard of charges £30/hour for private boxing lessons - so as Stussonicos states £28 to be trained by Muay Thai champions is a bargain!

At my local fitness centre/gym, a former pro-boxer (western boxing that is) who had just 13 fights in his entire career and who you won't have heard of charges £30/hour for private boxing lessons - so as Stussonicos states £28 to be trained by Muay Thai champions is a bargain!

In all honesty, it is not unheard of for a Muay thai/ kickboxing champion to have only had about 12-13 fights before having won a title wether british european or even world.
Professional combat sports are all about the ticket sales these days.

To be honest I don't think it's about how many fights a fighters has had, if you've had 6 fightes against good opponents (progress from the first opponenet to the last a high flyer on the scene) and won all those bouts then you might get a shot at a title, and if it's against a credible opponent that that's fine - but there are some titles/belt out there that aren't worth the flattend ash tray they embossed onto.

Not sure about the kickboxing scene but I've never heard of a Thai Boxer winning a european or world title with such a small amount of experience and I can vouch for the fact that not one of the european or world champions at Wicker Camp have had such an easy ride.
You've got to wonder how worth while these titles are that are fought for by (let's face it) near enough novices and also which clown of a promoter is allowing it to happen.

West

In all honesty, it is not unheard of for a Muay thai/ kickboxing champion to have only had about 12-13 fights before having won a title wether british european or even world.
Professional combat sports are all about the ticket sales these days.

hi chefkicker, The example i gave was of a western boxer (i.e. fisticuffs only!) and he only ever fought for a local area title...and still charges £30/hr!

hi chefkicker, The example i gave was of a western boxer (i.e. fisticuffs only!) and he only ever fought for a local area title...and still charges £30/hr!

Hi Rizla
Fisticuffs only or not , people who box professionally do that! I.E. at a decent level they are full time athletes. An area title in Pro Boxing is 10x3 mins. I.E no small feat even though it is fists only. Professional boxers train 2-3 times per day. Then on top of that they are expected to sell at least 50 tickets to get onto the show.
Personal trainers these days charge pretty much what they want.

It is all about demand and supply. If people are willing to pay £28 per hour for a private lesson at wicker camp, then wicker camp have the right to charge what they want. If people wont pay that much then they wont have the private lesson simple as that.

One again demand and supply. In most boxing gyms they only charge £1 or £2 a session. Some people come to us from boxing and ask how much it is and I say £4 a session. Some of them have thought it was expensive but then when they first start training with us they realise they havent even been taught to stand properly let alone shown how to do combinations etc.
We had one guy who was about to box his first amateur bout who didnt know how to position his feet and how to put more power into a right cross!!!

Hi Rizla
Fisticuffs only or not , people who box professionally do that! I.E. at a decent level they are full time athletes. An area title in Pro Boxing is 10x3 mins. I.E no small feat even though it is fists only. Professional boxers train 2-3 times per day.

very true...i can't imagine anyone saying about mike tyson at the top of his game that he's not a bad fighter but only uses his hands!

In most boxing gyms they only charge £1 or £2 a session
Really? Where would they be then? Was that 2007 or 1997

I'm not suprised people paying £1 or £2 a session didn't know how to do anything. Doesn't sound like they were at a gym at all. Maybe a mate's garage with a punch bag :hihi:

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When I train at St.Vincents amateur boxing gym it's only a quid.

At my local fitness centre/gym, a former pro-boxer (western boxing that is) who had just 13 fights in his entire career and who you won't have heard of charges £30/hour for private boxing lessons - so as Stussonicos states £28 to be trained by Muay Thai champions is a bargain!

My point was that Wicker Camp is meant to be a non-profit organisation.

My point was that Wicker Camp is meant to be a non-profit organisation
Heaven's sake! Non profit or not, there are still gas and electricity bills to be paid; rent; council tax; equipment, repairs, business fee's to be covered, other miscellaneous expenses; and a wage to support the person without whom there would be no gym. I'm sure there are other necessary expenses I haven't mentioned.
I find it improbable that St. Vincents is a swish, state of the art gymnasium with extensive facilities, run by staff members who earn a living from the incomings. (Neither is Wicker Camp.) Stay there and quit complaining if you think it is the best value for money. Cheers!

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When I train at St.Vincents amateur boxing gym it's only a quid.
My point was that Wicker Camp is meant to be a non-profit organisation.

Heaven's sake! Non profit or not, there are still gas and electricity bills to be paid; rent; council tax; equipment, repairs, business fee's to be covered, other miscellaneous expenses; and a wage to support the person without whom there would be no gym. I'm sure there are other necessary expenses I haven't mentioned.
St. Vincents must be a sh*thole run completely by volunteers and charitable donations. Stay there and quit complaining if you think it is the best value for money. Cheers!
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I think this discussion is disintegrating quite fast.

GazB - you are unhappy with the current prices for lessons at Wicker Camp. Why not contact Mick or Trix and ask them about the prices? I'm sure they would happily provide a breakdown of costs involved in running a large gym, close to the city centre, and importantly they will be able to provide justification for recent price increases.

Henrietta - I can understand your frustration as we have gone round in circles with this post. But as a responsible person (whom i assume is associated with Wicker Camp, there is no need to say St. Vincents 'must be a sh**thole' although I doubt facilities will rival Wicker.Remember, MuayThai means more and we don't need name-calling and unecessary rivalry between different clubs. There seems to be too much of that in Sheffield from what I can gather from this forum!

Anvil/Chefkicker - my point about 'fisticuffs' was completely misunderstood and i can't be bothered to explain any further.

Henrietta - there is no need to say St. Vincents 'must be a sh**thole'
Point taken, post edited, swearwords removed - hopefully point still remains :)

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I think also some people are missing the point; as far as I am aware, the people doing private instruction (apart from the odd Mick or Trix lesson) aren't employed by Wicker Camp, and those people have a right to make a living from their trade.

Wicker Camp is basically the classes and all the extra support that is given to those wanting to fight; private lessons may fall under the aegis of Wicker Camp because of where they are and who run them, but they are basically a seperate issue.

It is a question of cost, of course, but you know the tutors who give private lessons there are good and focussed: Mick wouldn't accept less. And the Wicker Camp core business is run to a non-profit model.

Ade

..people doing private instruction.. aren't employed by Wicker Camp.. they are basically a seperate issue.
Sorry Ade as I understand it, you might be slightly off there - the fee for private lessons is not decided by the instructors. No the teachers do not receive a wage as such from Wicker Camp, but they are renumerated for their personal time and commitment when teaching private lessons within the gym

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Obviously I missed the abuse towards me!

I love Wicker a hell of a lot more than any other place I've trained and I'm only frustrated because I'm disappointed that I can't train as much as I'd like to.

Henrietta - Chill out eh?

Imran Khan beat 'Boo' yesterday by a 5 round points victory
Congratualtions to all at Wicker Camp!

This was a great victory for a Sheffield lad!

Obviously I missed the abuse towards me!

Henrietta - Chill out eh?

Pardon?

And you have missed no abuse, all that was written is still there for you to read freely yourself. Cheers!

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I think GazB is trying to be a gentlmen about this and Henrietta is looking for fight :rant:
:hihi:

I think GazB is trying to be a gentlmen about this and Henrietta is looking for fight :rant:
:hihi:

It's a sorry state of affairs when 2 people that love the same club can't discuss things maturely isn't it. Oh well, I did try!

I think GazB is trying to be a gentlmen about this and Henrietta is looking for a fight!

Me, look for a fight? Never! ;) :P

I was simply making a point that being told to 'chill out' was both patronising and unnecessary. To 'chill out', one would need to be wound up which I have not yet been. I have however been somewhat irritated by petty complaining about something both inevitable, and typical, of any business.

I am openly willing to continue to 'maturely discuss' any other reasons you may have for feeling 'frustrated you cannot train as much as you'd like to', but quite frankly - claiming that private fee's are overpriced and unjustified are not ones that the gym can be held realistically responsible for. Cheers!

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Me, look for a fight? Never! ;) :P

I was simply making a point that being told to 'chill out' was both patronising and unnecessary. To 'chill out', one would need to be wound up which I have not yet been. I have however been somewhat irritated by petty complaining about something both inevitable, and typical, of any business.

I am openly willing to continue to 'maturely discuss' any other reasons you may have for feeling 'frustrated you cannot train as much as you'd like to', but quite frankly - claiming that private fee's are overpriced and unjustified are not ones that the gym can be held realistically responsible for. Cheers!

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I think you need to chill out sweet heart :loopy:

I'm just thankful Gaz B had the foresight to go and alter what he'd originally written in his words of wisdom to henrietta.

I'm just thankful Gaz B had the foresight to go and alter what he'd originally written in his words of wisdom to henrietta.

:)

I figured why wind up someone that's already easily wound up!

Anyway, I'm off to the bag class tonight if anyone's there!

I think you need to chill out sweet heart :loopy:

Intelligent contributions always welcome, so feel free whenever you are ready 'honestjoe' :P

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I figured why wind up someone that's already easily wound up!
Righto Gaz :roll:

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:)

I figured why wind up someone that's already easily wound up!

Anyway, I'm off to the bag class tonight if anyone's there!

Yes, I'll see you tonight!

I was gonna do the IA class aswell but I've got a few errands
to do so I can only make it to the bagwork at 8pm
(I'm sure that will be enough for me)

It'll be good to see you Gaz, what do you look like?

(I'm the short, fat, bald, spotty one, doing everything incorrectly
and quickly running out of stamina:hihi: )

Yes, I'll see you tonight!

I was gonna do the IA class aswell but I've got a few errands
to do so I can only make it to the bagwork at 8pm
(I'm sure that will be enough for me)

It'll be good to see you Gaz, what do you look like?

(I'm the short, fat, bald, spotty one, doing everything incorrectly
and quickly running out of stamina:hihi: )

Erm.. I'll have a black vest on and my white Thai boxing shorts that have a big yellow diamond on them. Black gloves with streaks of white :thumbsup:

Me, look for a fight? Never! ;) :P
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I think we should wind up Henrietta as much as possible
and then put her in the ring with Chuck liddell:P

and then put her in the ring with Chuck liddell
He wouldn't touch me, maaaaaan :P

Plus he would be rendered helpless after being captivated by my infinite beauty :hihi:

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Didn't make it down to the bag class last night so I hope you weren't looking out for me! I'll be down tomorrow night for sure.

He wouldn't touch me, maaaaaan :P

Plus he would be rendered helpless after being captivated by my infinite beauty :hihi:

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Been on the old wine again? ;)

Been on the old wine again? ;)
Haha! :roll:

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He wouldn't touch me, maaaaaan :P

Plus he would be rendered helpless after being captivated by my infinite beauty :hihi:

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I'm sure you were a stunner in your younger days (cough)

Didn't make it down to the bag class last night so I hope you weren't looking out for me! I'll be down tomorrow night for sure.




I did'nt make it either. Gutted! was really looking forward
to a good workout:(

I think I might try for thur bagwork next

what techniques are needed for the B1-2 grading pls?

Hi Ceej

Notr sure whether you've taken a grading beofre but I think your question is 'what techniques do I need to be able to demonstrate in order to grade from B1 to B2'? If this is correct then along with the stamina, flexibility and exercises you will need to be able to demonstrate an understanding of the following techniques and the associated block/parry/counter;

Jab & Cross
Push Kick
Leg Kick
Bandai Kick
Long Knee
Clinch Knee
Side Elbow

Obviously the instuctor that takes you for your round of padwork will determin which techniques you do and how many and also what blocks/counters you will demonstrate.

If you need anything else just ask.

W

Thanks W :thumbsup:

I miss working on the pads, I go on the bags everyday of the week and it get's boring!

I know just what you mean, I've never been a big fan of bag work, I find it hard to get motivated and really lack the momentum and enthusiasm that I get when working with a padman, and to be honest I find my technique suffers sometimes due to the shape/filling of certain bags.

I find you work much harder when on the pads, especially if you've got an experienced pad man who is willing to push you.

I know just what you mean, I've never been a big fan of bag work, I find it hard to get motivated and really lack the momentum and enthusiasm that I get when working with a padman, and to be honest I find my technique suffers sometimes due to the shape/filling of certain bags.

I find you work much harder when on the pads, especially if you've got an experienced pad man who is willing to push you.

If I've had a good clean break from the bags for a few days, I go back on and can actually be bothered.. but doing it daily is just too repetitive.

But I'm just not fit enough to survive a pad onslaught from Chris haha. I can run 12Km/hour for 45 minutes solid, but one 3 minute round that entails heaps of 40 kicks at a time and I'm destroyed!

I'd agree that there is no substitute for thai padwork(assuming you are with decent partner) because it's about as close to a real fight as you can get when the padman is making you defend/evade, counter etc!

However, I believe bagwork has its place too. Repitition of a particular
technique (bandai or leg for example) 100's per round will definitely
affect your speed/power.
I personally, don't throw long combinations during bagwork, (with exception of boxing, where you can put together a whole string of shots together).
With Kicks or knees I normally limit myself to 1 or 2 techniques.
Another exception would be to do a continuous blitz of say a bandai,
keeping the bag inclined at an angle with the frequency/power of the kicks.

Highlights from the Octagon Show 2007 now online:

www.wickercamp.blogspot.com

www.youtube.com/rizla67

Rizla, do you have any more clips of Imran's altest fight in liverpool yet?

I can't wait to see that fight!

Rizla, do you have any more clips of Imran's altest fight in liverpool yet?

I can't wait to see that fight!

the video's not available yet. of course when i do get it it'll be on the blog.

www.wickercamp.blogpost.com

I know just what you mean, I've never been a big fan of bag work, I find it hard to get motivated and really lack the momentum and enthusiasm that I get when working with a padman, and to be honest I find my technique suffers sometimes due to the shape/filling of certain bags.

I find you work much harder when on the pads, especially if you've got an experienced pad man who is willing to push you.

Personally i do find that during bagwork is is easy to hang back and take it easy.
Different training drills for the bags include "two on one" bagwork or "sprint training" on the bags.

supc

:|I think this discussion is disintegrating quite fast.

GazB - you are unhappy with the current prices for lessons at Wicker Camp. Why not contact Mick or Trix and ask them about the prices? I'm sure they would happily provide a breakdown of costs involved in running a large gym, close to the city centre, and importantly they will be able to provide justification for recent price increases.

Henrietta - I can understand your frustration as we have gone round in circles with this post. But as a responsible person (whom i assume is associated with Wicker Camp, there is no need to say St. Vincents 'must be a sh**thole' although I doubt facilities will rival Wicker.Remember, MuayThai means more and we don't need name-calling and unecessary rivalry between different clubs. There seems to be too much of that in Sheffield from what I can gather from this forum!

Anvil/Chefkicker - my point about 'fisticuffs' was completely misunderstood and i can't be bothered to explain any further.

sup every one