According to some sources, it would appear that this week's number single is likely to be Mark Ronson's cover of the Smiths marvellous 1987 track Stop Me If You've Heard This One Before.

The jury's still out for me as to whether I like Mark's rendition of this classic tune, but it would certainly be interesting to see a Smiths song sitting atop the singles chart 20 years after they split. Am I right in also thinking it would be the first ever Smiths song to reach the top spot?

My hope is that the generation who are presently downloading Mark Ronson's version will be intrigued into discovering what the original, breath-taking version sounds like and will go on to either download or purchase Strangeways, Here We Come, surely the Smiths' most underrated album?

My dream may yet be realised: a top forty of Smiths and Beatles songs (with the green light on its way allowing people to download Beatles tracks legally).

A serious Smiths reappraisal is long overdue IMO. Ronson claims to be a latecomer when it came to discovering the Smiths but admits he was blown away when he heard Stop Me... and inparticularly Marr's jangly instrumental breaks in the song (which Ronson claims sounds like 12 harpists playing in unison).

So, to anyone wishing to open a new chapter in their musical knowledge, go buy Strangeways, then Meat Is Murder, then Louder Than Bombs (a good compilation), then The Queen Is Dead, then the Singles Collection, then The Smiths, Rank (live - Marr is devastating) and Hatful Of Hollow.

Then come back to me and tell me what you think!

I personally don't think that much of Ronson's stuff. Love the Smiths though. I do think they get quite enough praise already. Ronson got loads of stick off Smiths fans about his cover - he wrote this to one of them:



LETTER TO A SMITHS FAN

(i wrote this as a response to a message from a respectful yet disgruntled smith fan, i thought i would post it for any who cared to read it though)


let me start by saying "stop me if you think you've heard this one before" (the original) is probably my favourite song of all time. i have been obsessed by it from the first time i heard it. i was late to discover The Smiths (partly due to the obsessive and covetous nature of my friends that were huge fans), so "strangeways here we come" was the first album of theirs that i bought and had for my own. i was blown away and while it played on my stereo speakers for the first time, my bedroom was transformed into the magical realm of morrissey and marr (and rourke and joyce, of course). at that age, guitar was my main instrument, and johnny marr's guitar arrangements were the most beautiful i had ever heard. the instrumental sections of "stop me if you think you've heard this one before" sounded like 15 angels armed with six-strings, twelve-strings and harpsichords and the way andy rourke's bassline danced in between him made me dizzy. THEN, when morrissey delivered some of the most vivid, brutal and devastating lyrics i had ever heard disguised in the most beautiful sung melody i had EVER heard, i was completely f**ked up (everyone has their own opinion on how ironic his intentions were, i don't pretend to know that).

anyway, skip ahead 8 years, i'm dj'ing in some of the most grimy (yet geniunely music-loving) hip-hop clubs in dowtown new york, and i try to widen my audience's horizons as much as i can get away with. i figure out ways to drop some of my favourite "not hip-hop" tracks into my sets without getting shot at. to sandwich a classic Clash tune between eric b and rakim and epmd is not easy. to try and play the smiths is even harder. on some nights, i could get away with playing "how soon is now?" with the run dmc "it's like that" instrumental underneath it and could feel the crowd become intoxicated with hearing this music for the first time. other nights, i would completely lose the crowd when trying to teach them something new (note that this is way before the "mash-up" era aswell, people were not as accustomed to juxtaposed genres). but much in the same way grandmaster flash and kool herc found ways to drop the Rolling Stones in the playgrounds of the South Bronx, i was obsessed with figuring out a way to drop these tunes that i loved and opening up the dancefloor to all good music.

last year, when i came up with the breakbeat-based cover of "just" (by radiohead) and played it out for the first time, i realised that all of the sudden hip-hop kids, baggie kids, indie kids, funk heads, etc... could all get down to this classic song instantly. so i started f**king around with more and more of these "versions", mainly because i enjoyed seeing people enjoy them, and, because Radiohead themselves validated my cover, i didn't feel in fear of disrespecting the original artists.

when i recorded the original demo of "stop me if you think you've heard this one before" with my friend (the singer) daniel merriweather, the first thing i did was send it to morrissey and marr immediately, before i put the strings on it or anything, i needed to know if they would be alright with it, basically like a kid showing his parents his finger painting for their approval. it took a long time to hear back from them, but when i found out that morrissey liked it and especially liked daniel's vocal, you can imagine how i felt (johnny marr approved it aswell, but i don't know his exact thoughts): the man who co-wrote my favourite song of all time gave blessing to this new interpretation.

i'll add, i can't understand the people who have a problem with the "r&b" interpretation. first off, rhythmn and blues gave birth to ALL other forms of contemporary music. more relatedly, morrissey and marr famously met for the first time (in morrissey's house) and bonded over their shared love of that music. and during the making of "strangeways...", every night they would listen to northern soul records before retiring to bed. "r&b" has become a dirty word nowadays, soiled by the cookie-cutter crap records that come out and because of the lack of love, musicianship and geniuneness that go into making them. i would like to think that the records that i make are trying to restore some sort of respect to the genre, albums like amy winehouse's "back to black" or nikka costa's "like a feather". "stop me..." is probably the most musically involved number i have ever been a part of, i even scrapped the entire first orchestra arrangement and recording because i felt it wasn't emotional enough for the song. there are 26 real humans playing on the song, the only thing not 100% live and real is the drum beat (but that needs to exist as the hip-hop element of the song).

i didn't have any inkling that this cover was going to get so big. when i started it, i didn't even have a record deal. anyway, now that it is, the grumblings have understandably surfaced. i understand many hold the original song to be sacred, to them i can only say ignore mine and enjoy the version that you always have. but remember your heroes esteem and condone this homage, and that an entire section of the population who never knew and would never know this song will now discover what you all have known for so long, that stephen patrick morrissey and johnny marr wrote some of the most beautiful songs that ever were.

this is not an apology but a way of showing respect for people who love the Smiths like i do

thank you
mark

Hmmm - great job of justifying himself :|

I just can't help feeling that to mess around with these classic tracks is a sort of sacriledge. I can't approve of it - it's feels wrong through and through to me.

ok, it gets the original artist's music across to a new generation who might not otherwise have been exposed to it - but call me an elitist if you will, but if these kids had anything about them, they'd have discovered the Smiths for themselves. It's not exactly like they're obscure or anything.

Anyone that knows anything about music knows all about Johnny Marr's jangly guitars....

Why does everything have to be spoon-fed to people these days?

StarSparkle

Haven't heard Ronson's track, but if you want a more modern-sounding cover of a Smiths track, I recommend Schneider TM's "The Light 3000" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4UMpEHa_Ns) (a cover of "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out".)

Haven't heard Ronson's track, but if you want a more modern-sounding cover of a Smiths track, I recommend Schneider TM's "The Light 3000" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4UMpEHa_Ns) (a cover of "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out".)

Ahhhhhhh - I'm in REAL pain....

StarSparkle

I quite like what Mark Ronson does with older tracks - he's just done 'Golden skans' (admittedly not old at all) with a little bit of 'in the Air tonight' mixed in on Jo Whiley.

As I say with all cover versions, you like the version of a song you hear first usually. (see cover version thread) but i think he's very good at what he does, definitely the best at it. I like his version of 'Just' Radiohead even though that is one of my favourite songs ever!

Smiths... reminds me so much of being in sixth form. I bought Meat is Murder originally as I was a vegetarian,the album came out when I was 13 - all within the same year... admittedly just more for the cover at the time. :hihi:

i also heard him on Jo Whily today, and thought Daniel Merriweather was great!

I love the MOrrissey cover, but then I haven't heard the original :blush:

im just downloading Ronson's album - looks promising!

:)

I've heard the Ronson version. It's pretty damn good.

I've heard the Ronson version. It's pretty damn good.


No it isn't. It's a shocking travesty. Some songs should be banned from ever being covered and this should include the entire Smiths back catalogue.

There's a Smiths tribute album that's just been released.

http://www.amazon.com/Tribute-Smiths-Stop-You-Think/dp/B000LRZ0K2/sr=1-3/qid=1172137610/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/102-4310260-9012902?ie=UTF8&s=music

No it isn't. It's a shocking travesty. Some songs should be banned from ever being covered and this should include the entire Smiths back catalogue.

Absolutely 100% with you, PuressenceUK. Good man :thumbsup:

StarSparkle

Absolutely 100% with you, PuressenceUK. Good man :thumbsup:

StarSparkle

As a fellow Manics fan I knew you'd have some common sense on this one!

Mark Ronson is an amazingly talented musician, performer and producer and has worked with the likes of Amy Winehouse, Christina Aguilera, Lily Allen and Robbie Williams and his new track is great.

A serious Smiths reappraisal is long overdue IMO.
It is? How could they possibly held in higher regard than they already are?

The critics have always loved the Smiths and people have never stopped listening to and being obsessed with them. Go to an indie night these days and you'll most likely hear them, I play them pretty much every week (often more than once) at Planet of Sound and they are still one of the most likely bands to get people up and dancing and they're also one of the more requested bands (though I do wish people would request something other than 'this charming man' more often).

Oh and Mark Ronson's cover is awful, I've nothing against covers even of songs I love when they actually do something interesting with the song, Ronson's take on Stop Me however is completely unnecessary it sheds no knew light on the material and is simply a by the numbers cover in Ronson's genre.

Mark Ronson is an amazingly talented musician, performer and producer and has worked with the likes of Amy Winehouse, Christina Aguilera, Lily Allen and Robbie Williams and his new track is great.
Is this post supposed to be a joke or something? We're talking about somebody messing with a song by one of the greatest bands of all time and you go and cite the perpetrator having worked with Robbie Williams and Christina ****ing Aguilera as evidence of his worthiness :gag:

It is? How could they possibly held in higher regard than they already are?

The critics have always loved the Smiths and people have never stopped listening to and being obsessed with them. Go to an indie night these days and you'll most likely hear them, I play them pretty much every week (often more than once) at Planet of Sound and they are still one of the most likely bands to get people up and dancing and they're also one of the more requested bands (though I do wish people would request something other than 'this charming man' more often).





Fair point, plekhanov.

And if it were me at one your gigs, I'd request either Sweet And Tender Hooligan, London or You Just Haven't Earned It Yet, Baby.

Cheers!

Ousetunes

Is this post supposed to be a joke or something? We're talking about somebody messing with a song by one of the greatest bands of all time and you go and cite the perpetrator having worked with Robbie Williams and Christina ****ing Aguilera as evidence of his worthiness :gag:

LOL! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: Spot-on

This may be the one and only post of yours I've ever agreed with (ok, along with your post above :P ), but you're bang on the nail with this one :thumbsup:

StarSparkle

Is this post supposed to be a joke or something? We're talking about somebody messing with a song by one of the greatest bands of all time and you go and cite the perpetrator having worked with Robbie Williams and Christina ****ing Aguilera as evidence of his worthiness :gag:

This is you opinion, and my post was mine. Hes a talented musician!

Fair point, plekhanov.

And if it were me at one your gigs, I'd request either Sweet And Tender Hooligan, London or You Just Haven't Earned It Yet, Baby.

Cheers!

Ousetunes
Good choices, people so often seem to neglect their harder edged stuff, 'Sweet & Tender Hooligan' has long been my older brother who was kind enough to get me into the Smiths favourite tune by them but it rarely seems to get requested, of course I don't let that stop me playing it.

This is you opinion, and my post was mine. Hes a talented musician!
Lots of people have got talent, it's what they choose to do with it that matters and Ronson's choice in this case is contemptible.

Would i be right in saying the Smiths cover was not originally by the Smiths anyway?

Would i be right in saying the Smiths cover was not originally by the Smiths anyway?
No you'd be about as wrong as it's possible to be.

All the Smiths singles were original material as were all their proper album tracks. They may have done a few covers for b-sides but the only one I recall is 'Golden Lights' which is one of the weakest tracks they ever released.

I'm sure someone told me that, my mistake!

In his 'letter' it is unclear whether he had any direct contact with morrissey or marr over their approval of this track. I personally don't mind if people do cover versions. Ronson should be shot simply on the grounds that he's made a dumbed down, 'for the masses' version of a work of dizzying genius. listen here. (http://myspace.com/markronson)

To my mind you supposed to do a cover version to add something to the original, by Ronson own admission he thought the original was near perfection. What he manages to do is suck some of the original life out of it.

I am looking forward to the new CD 'Stock, Aitken and Waterman do Stravinsky!'

I like the Mark Ronson version a lot, I even downloaded it. I also like the original and already had that one.

The Mark Ronson version also samples the Supremes - You Keep Me Hangin' On , perhaps a more classic and better remembered song than The Smiths Stop Me.

The combination of the two tracks works brilliantly.

I like the Mark Ronson version a lot, I even downloaded it. I also like the original and already had that one.

The Mark Ronson version also samples the Supremes - You Keep Me Hangin' On , perhaps a more classic and better remembered song than The Smiths Stop Me.

The combination of the two tracks works brilliantly.

Indeed, why completely destroy one song when you can totally mess up two classics? Mr Ronson - pack it in before you have a nasty accident.

I'm going to follow the advice of his song they keep playing ad nauseum on the radio. If anyone can tell me whereabouts I can find him I plan to stop him for good.

welll ive listened to the album quite a few times now, i love it! guess i must be a member of the dumbed down masses :hihi:

i especially like Lily Allens version of 'Oh My God'

ps alchresearch, Ronson is in Manchester in May I think :)

welll ive listened to the album quite a few times now, i love it! guess i must be a member of the dumbed down masses :hihi:

i especially like Lily Allens version of 'Oh My God'

ps alchresearch, Ronson is in Manchester in May I think :)

Anyone fancy teaming up with some "Ronson Smells" banners and some rotten eggs?

Anyone fancy teaming up with some "Ronson Smells" banners and some rotten eggs?

He was in Sheffield about a month ago. You're all too late.

He was in Sheffield about a month ago. You're all too late.

Damn! :o

He's a brave man, though, to be appearing in Manchester.... :hihi:

StarSparkle

Damn! :o

He's a brave man, though, to be appearing in Manchester.... :hihi:

StarSparkle

I sadly think now the people who like this song in Manchester will outweigh the Smiths fans. Plus pelting people with daffodils is hardly scary these days.

They may have done a few covers for b-sides but the only one I recall is 'Golden Lights' which is one of the weakest tracks they ever released.

I'll chuck in "Work is a Four Letter Word" and "His Latest Flame" as my contributions to the list of Smiths covers.

And, Plekhanov, I would break up your "This Charming Man" Groundhog Day situation whilst DJ-ing by spinning "The Queen Is Dead". It's absolutely tip-top for, ahem, shaking one's booty to, thanks in main to the funky bassline.

As for Mr Ronson's effort, it doesn't really float my boat but, much as I love them, I'm not precious enough about the Smiths (or indeed any of the bands I love - you wanna make Joy Division trainers? - have at it, Sir!) to get uptight about it.

As Scroobius Pip would say: "The Smiths - just a band!"

Coincidentally, on my drive to work this morning I was chortling along to MJ Hibbetts new single "The Lesson of The Smiths" ("...just because a bunch of ******* like it doesn't mean that it's ****..."). Heartily recommended to people with ears and smiley bits. :thumbsup:

Indeed, why completely destroy one song when you can totally mess up two classics? Mr Ronson - pack it in before you have a nasty accident.

It obviously isn't your thing (along with most people on this thread) but it reminds me of when I was younger and how my parents used to complain about songs that had been remixed! Fair enough when you're a big fan of the original but the 'new versions' are almost always aimed at a different generation/crowd and I don't see what the problem is. The original is still intact so I don't see what the fuss is about!

When I think about my fave music I wouldn't care if they were remixed etc, the reality is music evolves and changes and I love hearing a new take on a track, even if I don't like it

It obviously isn't your thing (along with most people on this thread) but it reminds me of when I was younger and how my parents used to complain about songs that had been remixed! Fair enough when you're a big fan of the original but the 'new versions' are almost always aimed at a different generation/crowd and I don't see what the problem is. The original is still intact so I don't see what the fuss is about!

When I think about my fave music I wouldn't care if they were remixed etc, the reality is music evolves and changes and I love hearing a new take on a track, even if I don't like it

All valid points, but you will change your mind in a few years when you turn into a miserable old git like me - lol.

The test of great songwriters is whether their songs can still work if covered in a totally different genre. Although The Smiths were a competent band who made a few good songs, they never really developed beyond the indie ghetto; indeed being a Smiths fan in the mid-1980s was more about subscribing to a certain lifestyle rather than being about the music.

With Morrissey having long-descended into self-parody and Marr appearing to have lost interest in music altogether, it’s actually far more interesting to see what more forward-thinking artists can do with the Smiths back catalogue than it is to listen to the Smiths themselves.

I look forward to someone doing an epic trance version of “This Charming Man”……it’ll probably sound rubbish but it’ll annoy the hell out of the purists…….

...and Marr appearing to have lost interest in music altogether,

...despite losing interest in music altogether, he's just written, played on (and produced?) a recent #1 album in the US; imagine what he might be capable of when he regains that interest.

Plus pelting people with daffodils is hardly scary these days.

Not if you tie them round house bricks!

With Morrissey having long-descended into self-parody and Marr appearing to have lost interest in music altogether, it’s actually far more interesting to see what more forward-thinking artists can do with the Smiths back catalogue than it is to listen to the Smiths themselves.

Um, either I imagined hearing Zane Lowe playing a track by Johnny Marr's new band Modest Mouse (whose album has just gone to no.1 in America) last night - or you're talking a load of twaddle, Basil, as always.

StarSparkle

And you think that reaching number one in America is a sign of quality and innovation? Normally when an artist starts chasing success in the USA, they have to sacrifice any hint of creativity in favour of bland, formulaic drivel.

And you think that reaching number one in America is a sign of quality and innovation? Normally when an artist starts chasing success in the USA, they have to sacrifice any hint of creativity in favour of bland, formulaic drivel.

A no.1 in America is certainly not a guarantee of quality or innovation - but whatever I think of the likely quality or otherwise of a no.1 American album, it does make a mockery of your comment that Marr appears to have lost interest in music altogether.

StarSparkle

And you think that reaching number one in America is a sign of quality and innovation? Normally when an artist starts chasing success in the USA, they have to sacrifice any hint of creativity in favour of bland, formulaic drivel.

You clearly have never heard any of Modest Mouse's stuff, perhaps you should before judging it. If you think they are an REO Speedwagon tribute band, you couldn't be further from the truth.

Bland, definitely not. Formulaic, well there are some people playing instruments and a guy who sings but other than that, not really. Drivel, it's not my cup of tea but each to their own.

I love it.

I'll chuck in "Work is a Four Letter Word" and "His Latest Flame" as my contributions to the list of Smiths covers.

And, Plekhanov, I would break up your "This Charming Man" Groundhog Day situation whilst DJ-ing by spinning "The Queen Is Dead". It's absolutely tip-top for, ahem, shaking one's booty to, thanks in main to the funky bassline.
Don't worry I most certainly don't restrict myself to playing 'This Charming Man' just because people can't see beyond requesting it, I play it about once a month these days and if people request it the rest of the time and I'm feeling amenable I play something else by the Smiths instead.

Similarly I wish that more people would realise that that Blue Monday isn't the only damn good song New Order ever recorded, that there's more to Joy Division than 'Love will tear us apart', the Undertones than 'Teenage Kicks', The Buzzcocks than 'Ever Fallen in Love?'...

Don't worry I most certainly don't restrict myself to playing 'This Charming Man' just because people can't see beyond requesting it, I play it about once a month these days and if people request it the rest of the time and I'm feeling amenable I play something else by the Smiths instead.

Similarly I wish that more people would realise that that Blue Monday isn't the only damn good song New Order ever recorded, that there's more to Joy Division than 'Love will tear us apart', the Undertones than 'Teenage Kicks', The Buzzcocks than 'Ever Fallen in Love?'...

I think you should play some of the very early Buzzcocks tracks, Plekhanov - that might get the crowd going a bit! :cool: :hihi: Nothing like a good blast of "Boredom".... ba dum, ba dum :hihi:

StarSparkle

Similarly I wish that more people would realise that that Blue Monday isn't the only damn good song New Order ever recorded, that there's more to Joy Division than 'Love will tear us apart', the Undertones than 'Teenage Kicks', The Buzzcocks than 'Ever Fallen in Love?'...

Tearproof by The Undertones would be my request (if I had a request).

Tearproof by The Undertones would be my request (if I had a request).
Getting a request is pretty easy all you need to do is turn up @ Tequila on a Thursday between 9 and 1 and fill out a request slip.

Of course the DJs reserve the right to refuse, ignore, forget and creatively interpret requests. Especially if you request the likes of Rasorlite, though we do tend to look very favourably on under requested stuff that isn’t crappy marketing driven haircut indie which will most likely be forgotten in 12 months time.

Incidentally I find it hard to choose between be 'Get over you' and 'Thrill Me' when it comes to the Undertones.

Incidentally I find it hard to choose between be 'Get over you' and 'Thrill Me' when it comes to the Undertones.

Thrill me? Not heard that one.

Thrill me? Not heard that one.

It's on their Non-Feargal comeback LP of a couple of years back (http://www.amazon.com/Get-What-You-Need-Undertones/dp/B0000C52G0)

Fopp occasionally have copies for £1 :o

It's on their Non-Feargal comeback LP of a couple of years back (http://www.amazon.com/Get-What-You-Need-Undertones/dp/B0000C52G0)

Fopp occasionally have copies for £1 :o
A real bargain at £1 or even £10, Sharkey may have given the Undertones a distinctive voice but he didn't write the songs so when the rest of the band reformed and drafted in someone who could do a good Sharkey impression the results were pretty damn good though for me atleast 'Thrill Me' is a real standout.

Thrill me? Not heard that one.
Just to save you the trouble of going down to Fopp and having the spend one whole english type pound sterling here's a link to it on Youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4cLVftPLqU) teh video is a bit pants but the songs ace.