Lately i have see nothing else in the local papers but articles on nuisance teenagers and nuisance Off road bikers!
There have been multiple crackdowns by south yorkshire police who enforce tough penalties to Rogue bikers who ride their Motorbikes on public beauty spots. These youngsters are riding bikes at dangerous speeds along pathways and tracks that honest hard working people are trying to walk along on a sunday afternoon, these people are having a peaceful walk away from the hustle and bustle of everyday life of town living!
This is where my objection begins!
Try to imagine living on a council estate in Shirecliffe, You are 15 years old, your parents do not earn much money if any at all, and you have a need to express yourself and have a cheap thrill or two.
You have a few choices, you can either find a local drug dealer "which in Shirecliffe is not to hard to do" and pile yourself full of heroine!, You can walk the streets and encounter other kids who are nothing but aggressive towards you and have a fight or two, possibly getting some respect and letting you into their Crew who frequently Burgle and rob other local people. Or you can get your hands on an old Motorbike and ride it on the fields!!
Which sounds more innocent??
This is an actual reality for a good 60% of Youths in Sheffield!
Maybe the old people who walk along the Yorkshire trail should think about where they would rather have the youth of today be, On a bike in Wharncliffe side or in their bedroom taking their jewellery!
This is not a fantasy! This is a reality that i went through as a Child!
I could have easily gone along with the wrong crowd and gone down the road of drugs and crime. The only thing that kept me on the straight and narrow was my Trials bike which i used to ride on Parkwood springs every weekend, It is no longer possible to ride on there as large metal fences have been erected stopping anyone from entering.
I must ask the question "Where do kids go to have some innocent fun"
My nephew is 15 years old and lives in parsons cross, he was recently arrested and brought home for being nothing more than cheeky to a police officer while he sat with his friends in Grenoside park. I asked him what he did wrong to which he replied "I was not in my own area".
I paused and asked him to explain, he said the police said that because i was from parsons cross i had to be in parsons cross park "which is full of drug users"!!!!!!!!!
I WAS FURIOUS AT THIS as i pay my taxes to maintain all parks and my nephew should be able to go into any park he wishes.
I am 31 years old and have ridden Trials bikes for 25 years but now i cant ride it LEGALLY unless i travel for 60 miles.
Maybe the officials should look for ways of occupying young minds instead of Prosecuting them! But of course if they did this it would cost them money instead of creating revenue by fining them and confiscating their machines!!!!!!!
The LAW is a disgrace

Firstly, may I commend you on such a detailed speech you have just delivered into the public fold, however, on the grounds of health and safety, may I condemn you.

I rest my case at the amount of emotive responses that are about to ensue...

Off road biking also discussed on this thread.....

http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=170201&highlight=biking

Your claim that 60% of young people in Sheffield are somehow forced to choose between being a junkie burglar and riding illegally out in green spaces is total nonsense. If young people have the money for the latest trainers/ computer games/ motorbikes etc, they have the money for constructive hobbies and interests, sports or activities. Young people have never had so much opportunity or available diversions. The problem is not 'out there', it is in the mentality of those who create such a narrow and bitter attitude to life.

Firstly, may I commend you on such a detailed speech you have just delivered into the public fold, however, on the grounds of health and safety, may I condemn you.

I rest my case at the amount of emotive responses that are about to ensue...

Fantastic point mate and i do agree! There was an incident involving a young boy in the organised MotoX park at Ecclesfield wher the young lad did actually die and the place was shut down due to the HSE, People also die in swimming pools and while riding horses but why do the HSE not clamp down on this??? You do everything in life at your own risk but you also need adrenaline to feel alive!! How do you get it? By playing snooker and drinking beer????

When I grew up we went without birthday presents for 3 years as my old man was unemployed.

Thats not even a sherbert dip we were that skint

I did OK

I just wish id have had a motorbike paid for, maintained, taxed, insured and licenced to play with

that might of taken my mind off never getting an action man tank

Get real pal

Deepak

Your claim that 60% of young people in Sheffield are somehow forced to choose between being a junkie burglar and riding illegally out in green spaces is total nonsense. If young people have the money for the latest trainers/ computer games/ motorbikes etc, they have the money for constructive hobbies and interests, sports or activities. Young people have never had so much opportunity or available diversions. The problem is not 'out there', it is in the mentality of those who create such a narrow and bitter attitude to life.

Do not be nieve mate!!!
Parents can give thier kids the best trainers and clothes also computer games but can they give them the quality time that they need to feel actually occupied???????

Fantastic point mate and i do agree! There was an incident involving a young boy in the organised MotoX park at Ecclesfield wher the young lad did actually die and the place was shut down due to the HSE, People also die in swimming pools and while riding horses but why do the HSE not clamp down on this??? You do everything in life at your own risk but you also need adrenaline to feel alive!! How do you get it? By playing snooker and drinking beer????

therefore, its OK to ride bikes and injure people........... (sorry don't buy it)

When I grew up we went without birthday presents for 3 years as my old man was unemployed.

Thats not even a sherbert dip we were that skint

I did OK

I just wish id have had a motorbike paid for, maintained, taxed, insured and licenced to play with

that might of taken my mind off never getting an action man tank

Get real pal

Deepak
Answer me one question mate, Did you have the freedom to go to any local park that you so wished and have a few sneeky beers with your mates?.
It is the freedom of good kids that is held back by communist style policing!!!!!!!

Answer me one question mate, Did you have the freedom to go to any local park that you so wished and have a few sneeky beers with your mates?.
It is the freedom of good kids that is held back by communist style policing!!!!!!!
Actually, what the Police do is deal with young scrotes. they'd rather not have to be doing such trivial stuff - and if those kids received proper parental guidance - like not being given minibikes - the Police wouldn't have to spend time dealing with them.

The Police don't arrest good kids - they arrest cheeky little sods who are up to no good. You should be honest with yourself about what your 'lovely little nephew' must really be like.

Do not be nieve mate!!!
Parents can give thier kids the best trainers and clothes also computer games but can they give them the quality time that they need to feel actually occupied???????


Lol, I'm certainly not naive (and I'm not your mate).

Why are you suddenly talking about quality time? Where's the quality time in illegal biking and drinking beer in parks? There are so many activities and groups to get involved in, the only reason kids don't get involved is a culture of closed-mindedness and limited expectations.

Actually, what the Police do is deal with young scrotes. they'd rather not have to be doing such trivial stuff - and if those kids received proper parental guidance - like not being given minibikes - the Police wouldn't have to spend time dealing with them.

The Police don't arrest good kids - they arrest cheeky little sods who are up to no good. You should be honest with yourself about what your 'lovely little nephew' must really be like.

I am no idiot and my nephew is also like my Brother, he is no angel like any 15 yr old but he tells me the truth! (good or bad)
In September 2005 The police enforced a curfew where kids could not be in groups of more than 3 while walking the streets, My neice was made to walk on her own through the middle of parsons cross as she was with 3 other people!
Where do you live?????? Dore???

Lol, I'm certainly not naive (and I'm not your mate).

Why are you suddenly talking about quality time? Where's the quality time in illegal biking and drinking beer in parks? There are so many activities and groups to get involved in, the only reason kids don't get involved is a culture of closed-mindedness and limited expectations.

If you can enjoy yourself and not physically hurt anyone while honing your physical skills then who can this harm? Have you ever done a wheelie on a dirt bike????
You must have gone down the drugs route, it sure sounds like it, il bet you never rode a bike in your life!

Will people quote where they live as i find this fascinating?????????????

I am no idiot and my nephew is also like my Brother, he is no angel like any 15 yr old but he tells me the truth! (good or bad)
In September 2005 The police enforced a curfew where kids could not be in groups of more than 3 while walking the streets, My neice was made to walk on her own through the middle of parsons cross as she was with 3 other people!
Where do you live?????? Dore???Actually no, but by some degree of coincidence I am in S17 just outside Dore :thumbsup:
And, as it happens, the kids here aren't subject to control measure like the ones you describe because they aren't problem kids - they're raised with positive parenting, an understanding of social responsibility, and a positive, respectful view of the Police.

If they weren't, the Police would probably have to impose curfew measures. thankfully, that sort of thing is limited to sink estates of the sort to which you refer.

I WAS FURIOUS AT THIS as i pay my taxes to maintain all parks and my nephew should be able to go into any park he wishes.
I am 31 years old and have ridden Trials bikes for 25 years but now i cant ride it LEGALLY unless i travel for 60 miles.
Maybe the officials should look for ways of occupying young minds instead of Prosecuting them! But of course if they did this it would cost them money instead of creating revenue by fining them and confiscating their machines!!!!!!!
The LAW is a disgrace
I have been riding off road motorcycles for years as well - and I have always done so legally. Parks and council woods are for taking a stroll, walking dogs, playing ball games and relaxing, not for tearing round on motorcycles. Doubly so when we're talking unlicensed, uninsured law-breakers whose antisocial antics ruin law-abiding people's enjoyment of the parks.
The 60 miles claim is rubbish. There are hundreds of legal trails leading in and out of Sheffield from the Peak District. I know - I use them (legally).

People who ride illegally should be prosecuted, and should have their machines crushed.

Actually no, but by some degree of coincidence I am in S17 just outside Dore :thumbsup:
And, as it happens, the kids here aren't subject to control measure like the ones you describe because they aren't problem kids - they're raised with positive parenting, an understanding of social responsibility, and a positive, respectful view of the Police.

If they weren't, the Police would probably have to impose curfew measures. thankfully, that sort of thing is limited to sink estates of the sort to which you refer.
Think about it, Why do you not have a problem with antisocial bikers? is it because their are no bikers?
And are you telling me that kids do not ride bikes in S17???
Nonsense the thing is that you have lots and lots of space for people to just jose thierselves where they cannot annoy "The working MIDDLE class people"
They have parents that are wealthy enough to take the kids to organised events which need the best machines, i am fortunate enough to be able to afford them now and i take my nephew to the Uk national trials events. But we still have to practise!
Where do we go????

I have been riding off road motorcycles for years as well - and I have always done so legally. Parks and council woods are for taking a stroll, walking dogs, playing ball games and relaxing, not for tearing round on motorcycles. Doubly so when we're talking unlicensed, uninsured law-breakers whose antisocial antics ruin law-abiding people's enjoyment of the parks.
The 60 miles claim is rubbish. There are hundreds of legal trails leading in and out of Sheffield from the Peak District. I know - I use them (legally).

People who ride illegally should be prosecuted, and should have their machines crushed.

NAME ONE PLACE ??????????????
I ridicule your remarks!!!!!!!!

Actually no, but by some degree of coincidence I am in S17 just outside Dore :thumbsup:
And, as it happens, the kids here aren't subject to control measure like the ones you describe because they aren't problem kids - they're raised with positive parenting, an understanding of social responsibility, and a positive, respectful view of the Police.

If they weren't, the Police would probably have to impose curfew measures. thankfully, that sort of thing is limited to sink estates of the sort to which you refer.
Please define your remark "Sink Estate"??

I despise people like you

They get good off-road bikers a bad name

Mr Strix's dad had been riding a grasstrack bike for probably more years than you've been alive, and has always been part of a legal club, membership of which includes insurance do take part in such a dangerous sport (and don't even try to argue that it isn't)

I'm sorry, but the choices in life do not consisit of 'bike or drugs' :roll: :loopy:

You are incredibly narrow minded if you think there is nothing else in life


Now if you'll excuse me, Purdy and I have a common interest in walking to discuss ;)

Does anyone know of a yorkshireman named Dougie Lampkin???? Only a 12 times world champion who i used to ride with in a place caled Flappits Farm in Haworth Bradford! This was not a legal place to ride but it produced the best motorcycling talent of the millennium!!!! No Middle classed snot nosed people complained then!!!!!

I despise people like you

They get good off-road bikers a bad name

Mr Strix's dad had been riding a grasstrack bike for probably more years than you've been alive, and has always been part of a legal club, membership of which includes insurance do take part in such a dangerous sport (and don't even try to argue that it isn't)

I'm sorry, but the choices in life do not consisit of 'bike or drugs' :roll: :loopy:

You are incredibly narrow minded if you think there is nothing else in life


Now if you'll excuse me, Purdy and I have a common interest in walking to discuss ;)
You have exercised 13000 posts + on this site so i suggest that you get a life more than sitting on your butt complaining and try having some fun for a change GET YOUR HEART BEATING FOR ONCE!!!!!! you wont do that by walking

I am an ACU member and in case you dont know what that means "which you probably dont" it means auto cycle union.
I am respectful to anyone who i come across while riding my bike and many a horse rider have thanked me for my politeness!!!!!!!

Actually no, but by some degree of coincidence I am in S17 just outside Dore :thumbsup:
And, as it happens, the kids here aren't subject to control measure like the ones you describe because they aren't problem kids - they're raised with positive parenting, an understanding of social responsibility, and a positive, respectful view of the Police.

If they weren't, the Police would probably have to impose curfew measures. thankfully, that sort of thing is limited to sink estates of the sort to which you refer.

I am quite sure there are problem kids even in S17 and i find your narrow minded remarks offensive...I am fortunate enough to live in parson cross (a sink estate.. maybe?) raised all my kids there they all own bikes and been raised with i am sure the same values as you instill in the kids in S17.

I am quite sure there are problem kids even in S17 and i find your narrow minded remarks offensive...I am fortunate enough to live in parson cross (a sink estate.. maybe?) raised all my kids there they all own bikes and been raised with i am sure the same values as you instill in the kids in S17.

As do i my friend!!!!
Why are kids persecuted for their postal code!!!!!
IT IS PREJUDICE

Does anyone know of a yorkshireman named Dougie Lampkin???? Only a 12 times world champion who i used to ride with in a place caled Flappits Farm in Haworth Bradford! This was not a legal place to ride but it produced the best motorcycling talent of the millennium!!!! No Middle classed snot nosed people complained then!!!!!Oh, well that makes it alright then :roll:

there are murderers who've written novels about their experiences - by your logic that makes murder okay :mad:

You have exercised 13000 posts + on this site so i suggest that you get a life more than sitting on your butt complaining and try having some fun for a change GET YOUR HEART BEATING FOR ONCE!!!!!! you wont do that by walking
Your medical knowledge is somewhat limited I see :roll:

Your medical knowledge is somewhat limited I see :roll:

BY YOUR KNOWLEDGE KIDS RIDING MOTORBIKES IS COMPARED TO MURDERERS!!!!!!!!!
I use CV to train for my sport and that does get the heart beating, walking is good for your joints but will never burn fat!! It may burn calories which means that you can have that extra muffin before you go walking!!
Hows my knowledge of the human body???

Bazrippa, all you've done in your comments is prove that what I said is true. You've shown that your general attitude is narrow-minded, prejudiced, dismissive and limiting. You can't debate specific points so you resort to ignorant insinuations and insults. THAT is the cultural mentality which believes that there is no choice in life but nihilism. It is the creed of "anti-socialism."

You know nothing about me and your insinuations about me are wrong. I know about how to find fulfilling occupations and activities on a budget. I also know what it's like to come from a culture where your attitude is the norm. I also know how possible it is to find creative and exciting interests that do not aggravate people, contribute positively to society and open up further opportunities in life.

can somebody translate that last post of Baz's for me because I'm struggling with the standard of English :roll:

thanks in advance :thumbsup:

I think I grasped the bit where you proved how limited your knowledge of the human body is - but I have no idea about the muffin :huh:

As do i my friend!!!!
Why are kids persecuted for their postal code!!!!!
IT IS PREJUDICE

So who was it who wanted to know where people lived, apparently in order to judge their right to an opinion?


...Oh yes, it was you. :rolleyes:

I live in parson cross at the back of a large park where there are bikes everyday,i also have a hoard of grandchildren who use the park.Of course i dont agree with the bikes being there but i do think that the council should try and come up with a solution. And i am afraid until they do then the illegal riding is going to continue.

So who was it who wanted to know where people lived, apparently in order to judge their right to an opinion?


...Oh yes, it was you. :rolleyes:
Which part of this do you not understand???
Children and youths in the postal code of s5 have a limited resource of entertainment as money is scarce, due mainly to the unemployment of the estate! So why are they persecuted by the police so badly.
It reigns true with everything even with kids who have cars which are completely legal!! Being stopped 7 times a night by police who assume that they are not insured!!
Il bet that does not happen in nether edge!

Any bikers come buzzing by me and my dog on parkwood and they'll be in the NGH faster than they can say ouch.

can somebody translate that last post of Baz's for me because I'm struggling with the standard of English :roll:

thanks in advance :thumbsup:

I think I grasped the bit where you proved how limited your knowledge of the human body is - but I have no idea about the muffin :huh:
Ah yes it should have gone like this!


BY YOUR KNOWLEDGE KIDS RIDING MOTORBIKES ARE COMPARED TO MURDERERS!!!!!!!!!
I use CV to train for my sport and that does get the heart beating, walking is good for your joints but will never burn fat!! It may burn calories which means that you can have that extra muffin before you go walking!!
Hows my knowledge of the human body???
Thanks for the english lesson!!!

So why are they persecuted by the police so badly.
!

Because they are scum kids with scummier parents. It really is that simple.

Case in question - when the football pitch in Busk Meadow Park was first made last year - you know the one with the grass banks round it, the turf was swiped daily.

You say there's nowt to do - erm a ready built footie pitch for one. But they'd rather destroy it than play on it.

Respect or lack of it comes from home. Living in Shirecliffe is sometimes like watching a real life episode of Shameless.

Any bikers come buzzing by me and my dog on parkwood and they'll be in the NGH faster than they can say ouch.
And that is the exact attitude that causes the problem in the first place!!
Parkwood has never been a public land it has always been private so who would be in the wrong???

Because they are scum kids with scummier parents. It really is that simple.

Case in question - when the football pitch in Busk Meadow Park was first made last year - you know the one with the grass banks round it, the turf was swiped daily.

You say there's nowt to do - erm a ready built footie pitch for one.

Location "in a nicer house than you" Quoting you coopster you live in Shirecliffe so get real!!!!

Which part of this do you not understand???
Children and youths in the postal code of s5 have a limited resource of entertainment as money is scarce, due mainly to the unemployment of the estate! So why are they persecuted by the police so badly.
It reigns true with everything even with kids who have cars which are completely legal!! Being stopped 7 times a night by police who assume that they are not insured!!
Il bet that does not happen in nether edge!
:hihi: I love a good Sunday evenings entertainment on SF :hihi:

now how does
youths in the postal code of s5 have a limited resource of entertainment as money is scarce
line up with
even with kids who have cars which are completely legal!!
:huh:

Purdy, did you have a car before you were 25?

I didn't. We could't afford it. Though I did manage martial arts classes, circuit training and mountain walking on a regular basis before I was 18 :roll:

I feel that this thread is getting out of hand and definately off the subject. Yes we agree there are alot of problems in sheffield 5 of course on a large council estate with a high ratio of unemplyment its going to be the case. But lets not turn this debate into a north south divide. If we are all honest (despite our post codes) there are problems everywhere.But at least we are not afraid to admit we have them....

:hihi: I love a good Sunday evenings entertainment on SF :hihi:

now how does

line up with

:huh:

Purdy, did you have a car before you were 25?

I didn't. We could't afford it. Though I did manage martial arts classes, circuit training and mountain walking on a regular basis before I was 18 :roll:

I passed my driving test 12 days after my 17th birthday driving and riding is my passion and i have always driven a legal car as i had a job!!!!
I am trying to put across a point that it is difficult for youths of S5 to have any fun at all never mind riding bikes on wasteland!!!!
Im sure that it is difficult for you to understand!!

Location "in a nicer house than you" Quoting you coopster you live in Shirecliffe so get real!!!!

Haha if only you actually saw my house then you would probably be willing to eat your words.

You have exercised 13000 posts + on this site so i suggest that you get a life more than sitting on your butt complaining and try having some fun for a change GET YOUR HEART BEATING FOR ONCE!!!!!! you wont do that by walking
Can somebody point out to Baz (given that 19/20 of his posts are in this thread :roll: ) that SF is quite large and has thousands of topics of discussion, multiple threads on what to do with your time - and where to go in Sheffield (without an illegal bike)?

I'm off to bed as I have animals to see in the morning :)

Which part of this do you not understand???
Children and youths in the postal code of s5 have a limited resource of entertainment as money is scarce, due mainly to the unemployment of the estate! So why are they persecuted by the police so badly.
It reigns true with everything even with kids who have cars which are completely legal!! Being stopped 7 times a night by police who assume that they are not insured!!
Il bet that does not happen in nether edge!

Which bit of this do you not understand?

You know nothing about me and your insinuations about me are wrong. I know about how to find fulfilling occupations and activities on a budget. I also know what it's like to come from a culture where your attitude is the norm. I also know how possible it is to find creative and exciting interests that do not aggravate people, contribute positively to society and open up further opportunities in life.


The only limitations are preconceptions and prejudices such as you have displayed, not money.

You state that you have an open mind but your mind is closed to young people having fun even though they are skint!!!!
You are a snob!

Haha if only you actually saw my house then you would probably be willing to eat your words.

Send a pic to bazrippa@hotmail.com and i will pull out the salt!!!!

Which bit of this do you not understand?




You know nothing about me and your insinuations about me are wrong. I know about how to find fulfilling occupations and activities on a budget. I also know what it's like to come from a culture where your attitude is the norm. I also know how possible it is to find creative and exciting interests that do not aggravate people, contribute positively to society and open up further opportunities in lifeThe only limitations are preconceptions and prejudices such as you have displayed, not money.

Please specify how you have occupied yourself ? I am interested!!!!

g'night baz - ps welcome to the forum.

Does anyone know of a yorkshireman named Dougie Lampkin???? Only a 12 times world champion who i used to ride with in a place caled Flappits Farm in Haworth Bradford! This was not a legal place to ride but it produced the best motorcycling talent of the millennium!!!! No Middle classed snot nosed people complained then!!!!!

A little word of advice - if you wish to continue using teh Forum, please moderate your attitude and your language.

Do not get in to attempting to insult people on here - come of your comments on this thread have been unhelpful personally abusive.

Any more and I'll suspend your account.

Thanks

I was brought up on a large council estate in the North East. I didn't get involved in crime or make the lives of others a misery, all without the use of an off road bike. In fact I knew of a very few people who did do anything that could be called anti-social and they didn't live near us. The police would most likely have intervened if they saw you riding your pushbike on the pavement let alone riding a motorbike amongst children. I know of one person who did own an illegal scooter and who decided it was fun to ride it on the pavement. The police caught him and were just about to take him to the station when another call came in. He thought he had got away with it but they handcuffed him to the bike and came back for him later. Now we have the situation where we tolerate anti-social behaviour and the police can chase scum on bikes if they don't have helmets. This behaviour leads to far worse crime and so should be jumped on at the very start.

Originally Posted by Clagnut

The 60 miles claim is rubbish. There are hundreds of legal trails leading in and out of Sheffield from the Peak District. I know - I use them (legally).

NAME ONE PLACE ??????????????
I ridicule your remarks!!!!!!!!The only person you're ridiculing is yourself, because you're revealing an acute level of ignorance here.

I'll try to explain:

- First, get yourself an Ordnance Survey map of the area.
- Next, look at the map key, and read about RUPPs (Roads Used as public paths), BOATs (Byways Open to All Traffic), and UCRs (Unclassified Country Roads).
- Then, when the grey matter has digested the concept, look at the map and you will see that the Peak District, not to mention the rest of the country, is riddled with them. Thousands upon thousands of green lanes and trails that you can ride on legally - provided your bike is road legal. Once you get to know them, best doen through the Trailriders' Federation, you'll see that there are lots of very good routes - some are very demanding and offer technically challenging riding.

If you don't have a road legal bike, which obviously a lot of scrotes don't though this may not apply to you. you can take your bike to the track by Finningly for a start near Doncaster. Try that on a map - you'll see that it's just a tad under 60 miles. :rolleyes:

Ah yes it should have gone like this!


BY YOUR KNOWLEDGE KIDS RIDING MOTORBIKES ARE COMPARED TO MURDERERS!!!!!!!!!
I use CV to train for my sport and that does get the heart beating, walking is good for your joints but will never burn fat!! It may burn calories which means that you can have that extra muffin before you go walking!!
Hows my knowledge of the human body???
Thanks for the english lesson!!!Pretty poor it would seem, but no worse than your knowledge and understanding of off-road motorcycling. Brisk walking will actually keep somebody closer to the fat burning region than intense CV training.

Are you paying any attention to this thread???
My posts have stated that i ride a TRIALS bike which does not come with lights or a registration number as standard as they are not meant to ever be ridden on the road, it cost £3500!
They are a tool that is meant for one job only, which is to ride over terrain that would be near on impossible to travel over on any kind of Road going vehicle and possibly even climb without ropes!
Do you know the difference between Trail and Trials???
As my bike did not come with a Registration number it is impossible to insure it for the road or indeed tax it.
Do not be mistaken people i am not someone who has taken a beaten up old road bike and torn the lights from it so i can blast it down a local beauty spot.
I am passionate about my sport and i have become very good at it over the years, If you saw me riding then you WOULD be impressed with what i can do with my machine!
My knowledge of off road biking is surpassed by no one and my knowledge of the human body is also very very good, i am a very fit man!!!!
In the Isle of man you can ride absolutely anywhere you like as long as you are not on the public roads, You do not need tax, an MOT or insurance to do this and they do not have problems with nuisance bikers as they are up in the hills having the time of their life!
By the way I do not race around either i spend most of the time on the bike balancing on the spot, turning in tight circles and riding up Huge rocksteps.
Going to finningley with my bike would be a total waste of time, if you knew anything about off road biking then you would know this !!!!!!

Are you paying any attention to this thread???
My posts have stated that i ride a TRIALS bike which does not come with lights or a registration number as standard as they are not meant to ever be ridden on the road, it cost £3500!
They are a tool that is meant for one job only, which is to ride over terrain that would be near on impossible to travel over on any kind of Road going vehicle and possibly even climb without ropes!
Do you know the difference between Trail and Trials???
As my bike did not come with a Registration number it is impossible to insure it for the road or indeed tax it.
Wrong. I ride enduro machines which are road legal, and some of the chaps who have ridden out with us have turned up on trials bikes.
They were smart enough to obtain a letter proving year of manufacture from the manufacturer, so they could MOT, register and insure the machines. You can MOT a minimoto with a bit of effort, and doing so with a trials bike (yes, my dear fellow, I can spell and understand the meaning of trial in this context) is a piece of cake.

Do not be mistaken people i am not someone who has taken a beaten up old road bike and torn the lights from it so i can blast it down a local beauty spot. You’re no less of a criminal just because your bike isn’t tatty.

I am passionate about my sport and i have become very good at it over the years, If you saw me riding then you WOULD be impressed with what i can do with my machine!
My knowledge of off road biking is surpassed by no one and my knowledge of the human body is also very very good, i am a very fit man!!!!Good for you, I’m sure we’re all deeply impressed by your unique knowledge, physical prowess and riding skills – I’ll ask for an autograph later

In the Isle of man you can ride absolutely anywhere you like as long as you are not on the public roads, You do not need tax, an MOT or insurance to do this and they do not have problems with nuisance bikers as they are up in the hills having the time of their life!
By the way I do not race around either i spend most of the time on the bike balancing on the spot, turning in tight circles and riding up Huge rocksteps.
Going to finningley with my bike would be a total waste of time, if you knew anything about off road biking then you would know this !!!!!! I’m not in the position of divine wisdom that you hold – how could I be, when your knowledge is ‘unsurpassed’? Impossible, obviously.

However, I have a pretty good knowledge from over 20 years of off-and on-road motorcycling, including enduro and green laning.
So, it’s like this. If you get your kicks from balancing on the spot, do so legally in your own back garden/flat/bedsit or wherever it is you live. If you want to roam the country with no MOT, uninsured and untaxed go somewhere that allows you to do so legally. Not in mainland UK – where almost everybody will look down on you as an antisocial criminal when you are, breaking the law and ruining the peace and tranquillity of public parks and woods by riding illegally.

Bazrippa - safe to say that you are well and truly OWNED!

My posts have stated that i ride a TRIALS bike which does not come with lights or a registration number as standard as they are not meant to ever be ridden on the road, it cost £3500!
They are a tool that is meant for one job only, which is to ride over terrain that would be near on impossible to travel over on any kind of Road going vehicle and possibly even climb without ropes!
Do you know the difference between Trail and Trials???
As my bike did not come with a Registration number it is impossible to insure it for the road or indeed tax it.


Can I just ask one thing, If you knew that it would never be road legal as it can't be insured or taxed, you must have known that there is no where in the local area to ride the bike legally, why did you spend £3500 buying it, what were you planning on doing with the bike?

Can I just ask one thing, If you knew that it would never be road legal as it can't be insured or taxed, you must have known that there is no where in the local area to ride the bike legally, why did you spend £3500 buying it, what were you planning on doing with the bike?I doubt that entered his head any more than it would for the youngs chavs who pay £100 for a battered Chinese minibike.
If he's really such a riding demi-god on a trials machine, surely he must be competing at a high level - in which case he - like everybody else who competes - accepts that he has to travel round to do so.

Lots of kids want motorbikes. I did when I was a nipper - and my parents said no. Why? Because our garden wasn't big enough, and they would never have dreamt of letting me use the parks and local woods.

They weren't the only responsible parents in Sheffield, then or now - there are plenty of sensible, responsible parents who simply don't let their kids have bikes. It's just a shame that some of our lower class residents would sooner buy the kid the illegal bike/burberry cap/expensive trainers than go to the trouble of enrolling their kids in productive activities, and spending the time with them as a family to ensure they don't act like scrotes much to the annoyance of the other poor suls who share their council estates.

There are reasons for motor vehicles having to be licensed and insured, none better than the fact that people are killed or horribly injured by them. I feel gratified when low-lives on illegal bikes kill themselves - one less doley for the future - but hate to hear of it when some poor motorist has to deal with one going under his car. The first person to complain then will be the irresponsible parent/uncle who has encouraged the scrote to ride illegally, when in fact they should be held reponsible both for the death of the child and the damage to the car.

Can I just ask one thing, If you knew that it would never be road legal as it can't be insured or taxed, you must have known that there is no where in the local area to ride the bike legally, why did you spend £3500 buying it, what were you planning on doing with the bike?

It is good to see that people dont have much to do in the afternoons but reply to posts on the sheffield forum!!
I am a member of The ACU and also a member of Sheffield and hallamshire motor club, Hillsborough motor club and mansfield maun trials club.
This is where i compete. No i am not the best rider in the world but their is a lot of stiff competition and i am 31.
Still i wont be ready to move down to Enduro or green laning for another 15 years or so as this is for the Old riders who have had bad injuries in the proper competitions or just dont have the bottle for the dangerous stuff such as Trials Or Moto X.
I also Own a GSXR600 which is a Race replica road bike and more for the summer and track days, It is taxed tested and insured and goes like a rocket.
I have been riding Motorcycles since the age of 5 and i have competed since 8 and i know what i am talking about.
Some weekends i do not have an event to go to and i want to practice, unfortunately the nearest place that is of high enough quality terrain to interest me is Flappit Farm in Haworth which is around 60 miles away from me, also i have ridden every inch of it before and it is just nothing new any more!
So i will admit it i go to Wharncliffe woods as i can just disappear into the woods and i rarely see a member of the public the terrain is very difficult indeed so the Police patrols on their big cumbersome DR-Z650s dont have a chance of getting to see me nevermind chase me.
I go about my business of practising then i go home, very occasionally i come across a horse rider or two where i will stop my bike and allow them to pass without spooking their horses, most wish me a good afternoon and say thank you and some hurl abuse but i am never abusive to them in return!
I am aware that if i was caught in these woods that i would have my ACU license revoked but to me it is worth it as Wharncliffe is fantastic!!!!!!!
I reckon that the majority of people who are sitting and slagging me off on a pc are people who hardly ever go for a walk in the countryside and actually use it for what it is, the countryside does not belong to anyone and it is just as much mine as the next man, and until i am no longer able to ride a Trials bike and i have to resort to Enduro or Trail riding then i will risk Wharncliffe!

I've just removed an abusive post - please keep things civil or I shall simply close the thread.

I've already warned folks involved in this thread on another thread tonight. So consider this to be the last warning.

Still i wont be ready to move down to Enduro or green laning for another 15 years or so as this is for the Old riders who have had bad injuries in the proper competitions or just dont have the bottle for the dangerous stuff such as Trials Or Moto X. Trials may require very good balance and control, but I’d hardly call it dangerous. Neither of them require the physical endurance or cover the range of terrain of a 3-hour enduro race, and in enduro like in Moto X it is the younger riders who come out as the winners.
Of course, you’d know that because you know everything.

So i will admit it i go to Wharncliffe woods as i can just disappear into the woods and i rarely see a member of the public the terrain is very difficult indeed so the Police patrols on their big cumbersome DR-Z650s dont have a chance of getting to see me nevermind chase me. Well, perhaps somebody will be good enough to tip them off and your machine will end up in the crusher.

I reckon that the majority of people who are sitting and slagging me off on a pc are people who hardly ever go for a walk in the countryside and actually use it for what it is, the countryside does not belong to anyone and it is just as much mine as the next man, and until i am no longer able to ride a Trials bike and i have to resort to Enduro or Trail riding then i will risk Wharncliffe! Or perhaps they are law-abiding people who choose enduro and green laning because they can do so legally and locally?? I don’t expect that would even occur to you.

I am aware that if i was caught in these woods that i would have my ACU license revoked but to me it is worth it as

Why not post when you are next going to be there? I'll bring my video camera and send the results to the ACU.

Why not post when you are next going to be there? I'll bring my video camera and send the results to the ACU.And I'll arrange to be there with the motorcycle coppers that I go green laning with.

And I'll arrange to be there with the motorcycle coppers that I go green laning with.

Excellent, if they see you commit and offence and don't report it then they can face disciplinary action as well.

Excellent, if they see you commit and offence and don't report it then they can face disciplinary action as well.
No Ken, I'm on your side. My bikes, like theirs, are all road legal and used legally either on private ground or on country routes which are cleared for motor vehicles.
My point was to support your stance; most off-road motorcyclists would be appalled by bazrippa's anarchistic attitude. It's the likes of him, and the various other wastrels who ride illegally, who bring a bad name to all motorcyclists and result in restrictions on where we can legally go.
I'm quite happy for the OP to be arrested and have to watch his machine be crushed. Better still, that he remain on it.

No Ken, I'm on your side. My bikes, like theirs, are all road legal and used legally either on private ground or on country routes which are cleared for motor vehicles.
My point was to support your stance; most off-road motorcyclists would be appalled by bazrippa's anarchistic attitude. It's the likes of him, and the various other wastrels who ride illegally, who bring a bad name to all motorcyclists and result in restrictions on where we can legally go.
I'm quite happy for the OP to be arrested and have to watch his machine be crushed. Better still, that he remain on it.

Sorry about that, I thought you were the other bloke, the one who is a self confessed criminal.

Why not post when you are next going to be there? I'll bring my video camera and send the results to the ACU.
Errr yea OK :loopy:

Right here is a link for the people who think Trials is not dangerous or physically demanding, This is not a professional rider but he is quite good!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY_bITpYNwA

But of course in Enduro you have a big comfy cushioned seat so that you dont get sores on your butt!!

And I'll arrange to be there with the motorcycle coppers that I go green laning with.
You must be kidding mate! I also know a few motorcycle coppers and a few from traffic and most of them ride like looneys on the public roads.
One in particular is a Trials rider and rides in the national Park!!!!
They are more bent than anyone and the thing is, they are immune to the law!!!!!!!!!

Boys, boys i thought this thread was supposed to be about the kids!? and on that matter id like to strangle those annoying kids who ride around upperthorpe on off road bikes at 3 in the morning and that also goes for the two kids i nearly ran over when they shot out infront of me on scramblers with no consideration for their or anyone elses safety. And please tell me if they cant afford to do anything to keep themselves entertained how do these kids afford to run these bikes? i mean fuel aint free. and if they are that bored they should get a job!

I was just posting this on the other thread when it got closed so I am posting it here for you. This is obviously an emotive subject so I will get it in whilst I have chance.

Great story!! I like how you used a Grandma, this was in the press do i take it????????
I have heard one it the press about an angry resident who was fed up with the noise of bikes putting a barbed wire fence across a pathway and a 17 year old grade A student was nearly garotted and killed by it!

Great idea that one eh??

No I actually know the woman in question, she lives less than 50 yards from where I am sat right now. She was hit whilst walking her dog down the gennel onto the main road. They put bars up to prevent these riders using the gennel but they actually brought tools down to remove them, grown men with their kids that is.
Dont start on me matey, I aint having a go at you, theres already more than a few fulfilling that role. I am merely recounting an incident that happened last year. As you will see from my other posts I am an off road fan, have been for years but I am keeping out of the debate simply because so many people have been touched by this illegal off roader craze that your on to a loser.

I was just posting this on the other thread when it got closed so I am posting it here for you. This is obviously an emotive subject so I will get it in whilst I have chance.



No I actually know the woman in question, she lives less than 50 yards from where I am sat right now. She was hit whilst walking her dog down the gennel onto the main road. They put bars up to prevent these riders using the gennel but they actually brought tools down to remove them, grown men with their kids that is.
Dont start on me matey, I aint having a go at you, theres already more than a few fulfilling that role. I am merely recounting an incident that happened last year. As you will see from my other posts I am an off road fan, have been for years but I am keeping out of the debate simply because so many people have been touched by this illegal off roader craze that your on to a loser.
Ok mate i am not unreasonable and you seem to be one of the more sensible posters on these threads.
Do you agree that if a site was set up to be completely ignored as far as the laws of the highways were concerned and as long as the public were informed that bikes were ridden on the land, the so called illegal bikers would move away from local parks and school fields as they would have a more appealing option!
I myself love off road biking with a passion and it makes my heart sink when i read the posts that some of the more ignorant people in these two threads type.
They are obviously upset about the situation and to a degree i can understand, but instead of raging at one of the only considerate off road bikers around (Namely ME) why can they not put some thought into how the situation could be resolved!
Crushing bikes is not the way! their will be more bikes.
Arresting kids is not productive either as jails are already too full to accept peadophiles so a minor offence is just going to get someone at the most an overnighter in the cells and a smack on the wrist!
Give them some room to do some innocent blasting around and then they will suddenly disappear.
It is a shame that the posts are being closed as i do beleive that this is a subject worth debating but i have had to report a few posts which i found to be personally insulting, the offenders know who they are!!!!!

Baz.

What is the purpose of law that has been developed over centuries and regarded as the best for countries to follow, the world over?

I believe that it is to maintain the peace for societies and countries to develop without 'hassle'.

Without law, if I don't like what you do, I stop you. Maybe harm or even kill you.
Then your friends and nieghbours come and exact revenge upon me.
Which is why wars still continue.

In this country we got over all that **** by developing a complex system of laws.

The law against indiscriminate, illegal biking is as a result of the majority.
If you want to go against it, you are a minority.

In order to stop this should I resort to a 4x2?

You may well be a 'legal' off-road biker. Please don't waste time defending those who would never use a 'legal' facility anyway.

Baz.

What is the purpose of law that has been developed over centuries and regarded as the best for countries to follow, the world over?

I believe that it is to maintain the peace for societies and countries to develop without 'hassle'.

Without law, if I don't like what you do, I stop you. Maybe harm or even kill you.
Then your friends and nieghbours come and exact revenge upon me.
Which is why wars still continue.

In this country we got over all that **** by developing a complex system of laws.

The law against indiscriminate, illegal biking is as a result of the majority.
If you want to go against it, you are a minority.

In order to stop this should I resort to a 4x2?

You may well be a 'legal' off-road biker. Please don't waste time defending those who would never use a 'legal' facility anyway.

How can you defend laws like ours?????
Did you know that you can be arrested and jailed for sitting in your own car which is parked inside your own locked garage if you are over the legal alcohol limit? It is true and while i do not agree with drinking and driving i would not say that this is a sensible law.
Their is no actual law that states that i cannot ride on private land, for years i rode on parkwood and when police came they said to us "as long as you are not on the roads then we will leave you alone" As the land was private and they had no grounds to arrest!
If you were to attack me with a peice of 4x2 on this land then you would be a criminal...
Wars are started by Religion!! Nothing else. And religion is nothing but popular beleif.
For 30 or more years people have ridden bikes on Parkwood and the problem of Nuisance bikers has only risen to this level in recent times since parkwood was closed!
People keep referring to them as "ILLEGAL bikers", but it was not illegal to ride on Parkwood so back then they were just "bikers"!!!

It is good to see that people dont have much to do in the afternoons but reply to posts on the sheffield forum!!
I am a member of The ACU and also a member of Sheffield and hallamshire motor club, Hillsborough motor club and mansfield maun trials club.
This is where i compete. No i am not the best rider in the world but their is a lot of stiff competition and i am 31.
Still i wont be ready to move down to Enduro or green laning for another 15 years or so as this is for the Old riders who have had bad injuries in the proper competitions or just dont have the bottle for the dangerous stuff such as Trials Or Moto X.
I also Own a GSXR600 which is a Race replica road bike and more for the summer and track days, It is taxed tested and insured and goes like a rocket.
I have been riding Motorcycles since the age of 5 and i have competed since 8 and i know what i am talking about.
Some weekends i do not have an event to go to and i want to practice, unfortunately the nearest place that is of high enough quality terrain to interest me is Flappit Farm in Haworth which is around 60 miles away from me, also i have ridden every inch of it before and it is just nothing new any more!
So i will admit it i go to Wharncliffe woods as i can just disappear into the woods and i rarely see a member of the public the terrain is very difficult indeed so the Police patrols on their big cumbersome DR-Z650s dont have a chance of getting to see me nevermind chase me.
I go about my business of practising then i go home, very occasionally i come across a horse rider or two where i will stop my bike and allow them to pass without spooking their horses, most wish me a good afternoon and say thank you and some hurl abuse but i am never abusive to them in return!
I am aware that if i was caught in these woods that i would have my ACU license revoked but to me it is worth it as Wharncliffe is fantastic!!!!!!!
I reckon that the majority of people who are sitting and slagging me off on a pc are people who hardly ever go for a walk in the countryside and actually use it for what it is, the countryside does not belong to anyone and it is just as much mine as the next man, and until i am no longer able to ride a Trials bike and i have to resort to Enduro or Trail riding then i will risk Wharncliffe!

So you are a member of all these clubs, a member of the ACU etc. and you think it is ok to go riding around Wharncliffe Woods on your bike. You completely contradict the whole point of being a member of the clubs in question by doing this.

Yes it does!!!! Do you have a point???

The countryside does belong to somebody, by your own admission we could send this thread and all your claims of illegal riding to the ACU and have your membership revoked, motorbikes are heard well before you can see them in wooded land, so you flaming well are spooking horses - so no wonder you get abuse

some people :roll:

It is a shame that the posts are being closed as i do beleive that this is a subject worth debating but i have had to report a few posts which i found to be personally insulting, the offenders know who they are!!!!!


Threads are closed when people on a thread cannot debate without name calling. And that applies to EVERYONE on a thread.

I just want to make sure that you undesrtand that I'm happy to close this one as well if it gets in to name calling territory.

So, if we can all stay cool, calm and civilised I won't have to.

The countryside does belong to somebody, by your own admission we could send this thread and all your claims of illegal riding to the ACU and have your membership revoked, motorbikes are heard well before you can see them in wooded land, so you flaming well are spooking horses - so no wonder you get abuse

some people :roll:

So who does the countryside belong to??
Does it belong to the people on horseback???
Recently Equestrian people have been a victim of the public opinion in the form of the ban on Fox hunting! Who passed this law and who campaigned for it to be banned??? I have an answer, the answer is the people who sit in their living rooms and say "That is wrong" these are the people who have the vote!
These couch potatoes may claim to say that the countryside is theirs but how many actually go out and appreciate it?.
Fox Hunting was a time honoured tradition in this country for hundreds of years, even before we had what we would now call a civilised society and civilised laws!
Still it was banned and still the people who enjoyed the sport are campaigning to re instate this passtime!
I am not saying that i agree with it myself but what i am saying is that they do not have the opportunity to conduct the activity in the countryside due to what people from cities order!!!!!!
This weekend will be appreciatng the countryside as it is my property!!! How many people reading these posts willl actually do the same????

By the way please feel free to send the posts to the ACU if you so wish!

So who does the countryside belong to??
This weekend will be appreciatng the countryside as it is my property!!! How many people reading these posts willl actually do the same????

By the way please feel free to send the posts to the ACU if you so wish!


The countryside, Parkwood and any other land is likely to belong to somebody but most probably not you. It is private land. The hunts were on private land with the agreement of the landowners. You were on Parkwood without the landowners consent. The police did nothing because you were on private land and the landowners didn't have the resources to try and stop you. Now they do have the resources so you can't go on there. Why not buy your own land or why not club together with others of the same ilk and buy your own land - and then apply for planning permission.

Here isd a good link about a recent news story involving illegal bikers. Some stupid parents think that it is OK to buy bikes for their kids and say it is a good activity that gets them out and about - tell that to the old chap.

http://www.looklocal.org.uk/news.php?id=1596

The countryside, Parkwood and any other land is likely to belong to somebody but most probably not you. It is private land. The hunts were on private land with the agreement of the landowners. You were on Parkwood without the landowners consent. The police did nothing because you were on private land and the landowners didn't have the resources to try and stop you. Now they do have the resources so you can't go on there. Why not buy your own land or why not club together with others of the same ilk and buy your own land - and then apply for planning permission.

Here isd a good link about a recent news story involving illegal bikers. Some stupid parents think that it is OK to buy bikes for their kids and say it is a good activity that gets them out and about - tell that to the old chap.

http://www.looklocal.org.uk/news.php?id=1596

I feel bad for the old fella and i have never condoned riding bikes illegally on the road as i have to pay my road tax and insurance for my bike and car also and accidents involving un insured bikes on the road ends up costing ME!!!!!
Let me try to explain, The council have to provide safe places for people to enjoy sports!, Would you like your kids to go swimming in the river don or the local Dam because the council would not provide any swimming pools?? Do you think that people would just stop swimming????
No because it is not safe for kids to swim in these places and accidents would regretfully happen!
Same with bikers if they dont have anywhere to do it then they will stray into parks and public land as they have no other option!
To say that biking is not a good activity for kids is ridiculous, it teaches balance, clutch and throttle control which are very useful for learning to drive for example. Also it teaches (Some) kids to respect motorised machinery as if you fall it hurts!!
Better to learn this on dirt than tarmac is it not!!!
Again "I condemn anyone who rides Un insured, Un taxed and Un Mot`d Bikes on public roads!"

bazrippa,

You have a good point about finding other activities for kids. I'm upset to hear that you ride in Wharncliffe that is illegal at present but YES, there should be facilities for Crossers to ride legally off road.
I ride MTB's legally off road in wharncliffe, and the peaks and see weekly the damage caused by MX'rs, Horses and MTBs. The order of severity of damage is as listed there. I think there should be space for everyone in the countryside BUT, we have a responsibility to repair / build / maintain the trails we all use. I use the roads, and so pay for there maintenance. Why not with the countryside ?
I organise, with the co-operation of the forerstry commission, New Mountainbike trail building in wharncliffe, one day a month for the last two years I am helping build trails that will ensure the safety of horses / walkers and MTB riders by keeping the seperate. Unfortunatly, our hard work, that we put in our spare time, is often destroyed by motorbikes riding it.

If you do ride at Wharncliffe, could we politley ask that you do not ride on the mountain bike trails ?

Would MX/Enduro riders be willing to help build trails for them to use exclusivley ? If they did build those trails would they stay off the illegal ones ? are you making any efforts to do this kind of trail building ?

On a final note, anyone seeing illegal motorbikes riding in wharncliffe woods can call the "Golden Line" number at Hammerton road police station 0114 296 4912 PC Tony Gillet is running the action against illegal riding. Two weeks ago on Sunday there was a near miss between a motorbike and a horse. The police were present ALL day that sunday and talking to them they will be visiting Wharncliffe more often. Our group are present with the Forestry Commission twice a month and will report all motor bike riding.

If anyone is unsure of the dangers of motorbikes in wharncliffe, please take a look at this picture taken last year. My friend in front of the picture was narrowly missed by a motorbike launching over the Trans penine trail in wharncliffe.

oldgreen - that pic says more than any other post on this thread.

deleted, please read my other post below.....

bazrippa,

You have a good point about finding other activities for kids. I'm upset to hear that you ride in Wharncliffe that is illegal at present but YES, there should be facilities for Crossers to ride legally off road.
I ride MTB's legally off road in wharncliffe, and the peaks and see weekly the damage caused by MX'rs, Horses and MTBs. The order of severity of damage is as listed there. I think there should be space for everyone in the countryside BUT, we have a responsibility to repair / build / maintain the trails we all use. I use the roads, and so pay for there maintenance. Why not with the countryside ?
I organise, with the co-operation of the forerstry commission, New Mountainbike trail building in wharncliffe, one day a month for the last two years I am helping build trails that will ensure the safety of horses / walkers and MTB riders by keeping the seperate. Unfortunatly, our hard work, that we put in our spare time, is often destroyed by motorbikes riding it.

If you do ride at Wharncliffe, could we politley ask that you do not ride on the mountain bike trails ?

Would MX/Enduro riders be willing to help build trails for them to use exclusivley ? If they did build those trails would they stay off the illegal ones ? are you making any efforts to do this kind of trail building ?

On a final note, anyone seeing illegal motorbikes riding in wharncliffe woods can call the "Golden Line" number at Hammerton road police station 0114 296 4912 PC Tony Gillet is running the action against illegal riding. Two weeks ago on Sunday there was a near miss between a motorbike and a horse. The police were present ALL day that sunday and talking to them they will be visiting Wharncliffe more often. Our group are present with the Forestry Commission twice a month and will report all motor bike riding.

If anyone is unsure of the dangers of motorbikes in wharncliffe, please take a look at this picture taken last year. My friend in front of the picture was narrowly missed by a motorbike launching over the Trans penine trail in wharncliffe.
http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/bikest.jpg

Thanks for your comments Oldgreen
I am not exactly proud of the fact that i have to ride in wharncliffe woods and put myself in danger of prosecution, however the terrain in the woods is absolutely fantastic as it is. I do not want to change it in any way whatsoever!
Now firstly can i say that I absolutely LOVE MTB! I think it is a fantastic sport and i am all for people creating tracks and trails for Downhill Mountain bikes, if it were not for the trails in Wharncliffe then Sheffield would maybe not have produced the most talented Downhill rider ever! The informed will know who we are talking about!!!!!!!
Firstly i take your point of Motorbike riders who rip up the countryside and give you a counter argument. I have been riding in Wharncliffe woods regularly for around 3 years and i have seen more and more downhill tracks appear and i have seen how some of them have been built, on one occasion i saw a few very talented riders hacking away at and uprooting a small tree in order to make a berm (Corner Bank). On another occasion a witnessed a group of lads littering the course with drinks cartons and sweet wrappers, then there was something that was quite disturbing, i rode into the woods one day to find the scrubland ON FIRE beside one of the Downhill courses, this was to find suitable alternate routes for the bikes to cover.
Now i am not attacking the MTB community in any way as i think they are awesome, but i am saying that in my sport i keep the terrain completely natural, actually the more natural the better. and the downhill courses have to be man made! This could be seen as defacing the countryside to some people!
Also are you aware that the powers that be are planning to put fences at the bottom of the downhill tracks in order to avoid collisions between MTB riders and Horses or walkers as there have been reports of this happening more and more frequently!.
One last thing, im not sure if anyone can remember this but around 10 years ago on Parkwood some of the MX lads hired a Bulldozer and created a Racing Circuit near the ski village without council permission!!!!. This proved very popularwith all local Motorcyclists and seeing as the Trials riders had a quarry beside it then everyone was happy. All was well until the council sold the land to the Landfill company, now nothing is left and suddenly people are riding in national parks and public areas, is this a co incidence?? Of course not!!!!!!!!

Having re-read the entire post I think what Bazripper is saying is largely true, not so much your 1st post but my opinion of you is greatly improved by reading your last few posts, the points you've raised are mostly very true and I agree with the majority.

However damage is still caused by motorbikes wether the trail is manmade or not.
At least manmade stuff can be repaired to its original standard, unfortunately nature can't and to an extent that means we need to look after it a lot more.
The manmade stuff is being either built to have little or no impact on the area or being rebuilt in places it has had an effect on nature to reduce this.

This doesn't happen within motorbike riding the vast majority of the time.
I've spent a lot of time repairing damage to footpaths caused by motorbikes at Alport Castles in the peaks, with a far more technically challenging green lane only a few minutes away.

There are a huge amount of fairly technical green lanes, any responsible green laner will know to check the status of the routes and changes in the laws and keep to them.

Trials is a hard one, green lanes don't suffice for the majority of trials riders and you certainly wouldn't want to be ride a 60 mile loop on a trials bike.
I appreciate to a point you have to ride illegally to practice competitive trials, but I've never once seen a trials bike rider in Wharncliffe riding trials they've been on the fireroads or dowhill tracks.
It will never go away from the woods, the mountainbiker you mention is shown on a dvd driving off road karts in Wharncliffe with another pro rider, I've seen him several times riding a motorbike there.
Its not like he doesn't know or respect the area, he has nowhere else to do it.
BUT I still don't think that condones it.

I ride mountainbike trials and rode motorbike trials for years, only quitting because there was nowhere to ride so I know exactly where your coming from- but the fact is the choice for me was ride illgally or don't ride motorbike trials.
I took the latter because there is plenty (relatively) you can do on other motorbikes legally and theres a huge amount of bike trials again legally and opening up much more you couldn't ride on a motorbike anyway.

But I was young then, I wouldn't quit DH now because its illegal and I wouldn't expect you to quit trials because you have nowhere to do it.

But because theres a risk of not being able to ride DH locally I'm actively involved in legally building trails, though this isn't something Forestry etc. really want but they're prepared to make comprimises and allow us to build safely for other users alson as we meet their comprimises.
In an area like Wharncliffe I don't really think there is a safe option for motorbikes and I don't think for a second Forestry would allow it but there are plenty of potential areas that could safely house motorbikes.

You must be able to do something similar though, natural trials is always better, no questions asked- but you can have manmade "natural" stuff that is almost as nice, by that I mean manmade sections using rocks etc. from the area.
I'm sure motorbikes are a big enough sport to find funding, you'd probably find a huge amount of support really in getting people out of riding illegally.
You only need a bit of land that could be set up as a centre like a 4x4 centre and you've sorted the problem (obvioulsy nowhere near that simple but I think its overlooked by a lot of people).
It can be done, building/ working with authoritys needs to become an integral part of most sports for them to surive with the current situation most "extreme sports" face.

I'm aware of the accident at SIMX, which is now an indoor mountainbike track- I know this because I built a large amount of it so I could ride legally.
As you say this is a part of riding and with no disrespect meant to anyone involved its something you should be prepared to accept could happen.
Its a horrible thing to happen to anyone but anyone getting on a motorbike with the intention of jumping it should be aware that death is a possibility and not let it get as far as HSE.
You don't see Pastrana go crying to the track builders when he crashes, it should be the same for everyone- you accept full responsibility for all your actions all the time.
Accidents happen, unfortunately our society doesn't accept that anymore but its still an attitude accepted in some places- these are the ones people from the sports set up.


I'm sure trials could have sustainable sections built, 4x4's have sorted out centres and they allready have green lanes- its not like they're desperatley in need of more places but they've got them going and now have options.

In a lot of ways I feel for you and what your saying and to an extent i think a lot more would if you'd phrased things a bit better sometimes.
I will never agree that its a choice between drugs or bikes though.
It simply isn't and there are places for people to go for free kicks/ much cheaper chances for fun.
You've mentioned mountainbiking yourself- why don't they get a mountainbike, much cheaper, much easier to run/store and can be used legally in a huge amount of places.
Go climbing, bouldering etc.

Obvioulsy some people will want to ride motorbikes and I can understand that, buts thats a choice against hundreds of things not bikes or nothing.

I also agree with your police comment in a way, I've had a very similar experience of being cautioned for basically disagreeing with police in again a similar situation that there were 4 of us, I was walking our lass home (this is from town at around 3am) and certainly wasn't about to not walk her back because there were 4 of us instead of 3.

But we've also had several run ins through street riding and through being polite and respectfull had no futher trouble with them, unfortunately again its the attitude of a lot of kids/ adults that mean policing is this way.
Everyone will find a bit of it they'd be prepared to actively stand up against, but you respect it as being the way things work and move on- I've chosen to disagree (well mainly the alcohol chose for me but anway) but I still did it without being especially rude and certainly without being threatening or disrespectfull, I wasn't prepared to agree but I didn't have to be nasty about it.

There is no real justification for the amount of kids riding mini bikes or any other bike in our streets, parks, woods etc.
Some places its generally accepted, the police have known of areas and in a way overlooked it but kept control, wincobank seems to be the fravourite at the moment, parkwood was for ages but their disrespectful nature means the fact its illegal can't be overlooked, much of the time being illegal isn't the problem its the other behaviour that starts to cause problems.

You've started 2 different debates here really, trials needs a specific place- nothing exists and that is wrong, something should be done but it won't be done for you.
Motocross needs a specific place, very few places exist (especially without being a racer). Again should be sorted but needs actively sorting.
Enduro doesn't really need a specific place so is more catered for, but still heavily opposed and needing the riders support.

Kids riding bikes illegally in parks, round the street, round forests is nothing more than what it says.
It just needs to stop.

I appreciate not all kids (including the ones you mention) are riding a bike for the sake of it they probably do share your genuine interest and want to progress, but if theres as many as you suggest get something going for them even if its by just getting them together (kids and adults) on here and stating exactly what you need/ want and seek help getting it through all the various channel, MSA, MSU would all be willing to help I'm sure....

Any sport with the potential for injury will be bent over by red tape, if the potential for injury is to more than just the person doing it you mightaswell forget it without making some comprimise.
Unfortunately that comprimise will be to find and use just legal places/ competitions.

There are still competitions all over and clubs all over, again they'd all probably kill to have legal practice areas.
But people need to make it happen, complaining about the system is going to do nothing but wind you and other people up- yes its s**t but its here to stay for now, we have to just work around it or risk people with no involvement in your sport injury, upset, fear and venues.
If wharncliffe was closed to mountainbikes because of motorbikes (which has allready been on a knife edge for years) that would ruin 1000's of peoples enjoyment of the sport over a year and mean driving a very long way to use another similar venue.

By working to legalise this we're reducing the risk of this happening but not getting rid of it, I think this needs to happen with motorbikes in general aswell.

I'm happy for all the kids that never go futher than that park at the top of the road to have their bikes crushed, they know full well they shouldn't be doing it, their parents do when they buy them the bike and they'd soon get over it anyway.
3 bikes were seized on our road alone last summer, non of the kids they were taken off really care, they only used them to ride around the block quickly and annoy the **** out of everyone else.

Like I say for serious riders I have sympathy but the majority of kids riding are not serious riders and never will be.

Not meaning to sound like its everyones fault unless they're involved somehow in the sustainment of their sport but its the only way these sports work now...

Most kids love digging and creating stuff anyway, and every adult has some immaturity left for getting dirty. (and not with the wife 3 or 4 times a year)
Its a bit crap in a way but needs to happen.

Having re-read the entire post I think what Bazripper is saying is largely true, not so much your 1st post but my opinion of you is greatly improved by reading your last few posts, the points you've raised are mostly very true and I agree with the majority.

However damage is still caused by motorbikes wether the trail is manmade or not.
.

Thanks for that W.R.C
I admit that not everything i have said is agreeable to everyone especially not in the point about mis behaving youths but i feel this is a much bigger can of worms to be opened and i was using it mostly as an example as my nephew is Typecast by many as a hooligan when he most certainly is not.
I am interested in your commments about the mountain bike tracks though, you say that any damage that is caused by creating the tracks can be repaired but when would this happen? Would it be when the demand for the sport had filtered away and no one did it anymore? or will they always be part of the landscape from now on?
Are the trees that are torn down to create the berms re planted afterwards?
I for one think that the Red runs are great for riding up on a trials bike as they are very taxing especially in the rain as i am sure they are taxing to ride down on a push bike.
But i by no means damage them any more than a mountainbike would.

I realise that schemes will never be initiated by the council to cater for Trials bikes which is exactly why i ride in Wharncliffe!
I ride there from Shirecliffe where my bike is kept and i do not cross or ride on one public road when i arrive i keep as low a profile as possible so as not to annoy anyone!! I used to ride to Parkwood in the same way but i am now forbidden this priveledge...

Thanks for your comments Oldgreen
Now i am not attacking the MTB community in any way as i think they are awesome, but i am saying that in my sport i keep the terrain completely natural, actually the more natural the better. and the downhill courses have to be man made! This could be seen as defacing the
countryside to some people!
Also are you aware that the powers that be are planning to put fences at the bottom of the downhill tracks in order to avoid collisions between MTB riders and Horses or walkers as there have been reports of this happening more and more frequently!.


Wrong wrong and wrong im afraid.

1, You missed my point. We have are organising group dig days with the FC to stop illegal bulding of trails. Quality trails not qty. My point was that MX riders do not actively seek places to build trails and keep them under control.

2, The FC are now NOT building fences to stop DH MTB's im VERY envolved with the FC about wharncliffe developments and know this is certainly NOT the case, We intend to build berms at the bottom of the DH tracks to slow riders prior to entering the TPT. We as the MTB community have elected to work hand in hand with authorities and compromise to ensure that we have legal trails, perhaps the MX community should take note.

3, A motor powered vehicle creates more damage than a MTB, and the MTB community have prooved to repair its damage. As seen by the formation of our group and trail repair / maintenance that is happening. Take a look at the 4' deep ravines on the top of blackamoor. The large lake on the Roman road at hope.....you just cant deny the damage an MX bike does over MTB, Horses, Walkers. Its at the top of the list. And I did say that MTB's / Walkers and Horses all create damage to the countryside.....and thats why we have commited to build new trails and maintain and repair the ones we use....have you ?

4, I would suggest that you actually start to contact the FC for instance, or the owner of Greno woods and TRY to get a legal place to ride. It took many years for us to get approval from the FC, but now we work together.

5, Our group, and the IMBA, are designed to build sustainable trails in harmony with the woods. The idea is to build great authorised tracks to limit and deter the unauthorised building. take a look at the IMBA site for evidence that this works.

6, I see no defence for the photograph I posted, not even condemnation. If I saw a picture of a MTB'r acting that badley I would immediatly condem the action. http://www.verte.eclipse.co.uk/images/bikest.jpg

Ive seen no evidence form the MX community that leads me to believe they are not TAKE TAKE TAKE...the evidence that they do take and not give back is seen routinely around the woods by the damage created.

Get a spade, get motivated and give something back to the community and the countryside.

Why will you not advocate trail building for MX riders ? Why not join us on Sunday at the trail building day ? that would at least show some responsibility and intrest in the places your ride.

A point to add, Its actually possible to win over land owners, And what Im saying is that you SHOULD try to get legal riding areas. At Sherwood pines I believe the FC have sanctioned an area specifically for MX riders. So it can be done if you direct your energies in the right direction.

IF you succeed then everyone wins, other users of the woods would be secure in the knowledge they are safe where they are walking / horse riding/ MTBIng and you would be legal....you can't deny that makes sense, so stop complaining and get working on how to legalise your activities.

A point to add, Its actually possible to win over land owners, And what Im saying is that you SHOULD try to get legal riding areas. At Sherwood pines I believe the FC have sanctioned an area specifically for MX riders. So it can be done if you direct your energies in the right direction.

IF you succeed then everyone wins, other users of the woods would be secure in the knowledge they are safe where they are walking / horse riding/ MTBIng and you would be legal....you can't deny that makes sense, so stop complaining and get working on how to legalise your activities.

Again a very intellegent post which is respected!
I do not ride an MX bike it is a Trials bike, basically a Mountain bike with a small engine!!!
You say that it is not a fence that is to be built at the point where the DH trails meet the main trail and that it is a berm! You know more than i do about this which is obvious! However if they are building berms at the bottom of the trails then their obviously is a problem with the bikers coming into contact with hikers and Horse riders which the organisation you are associated with is acknowledging as a problem.
Their is a problem then??????
Also do you condone the use of living saplings to create berms for the DH trails which i witnessed and also the burning of the brush area?
The fact is that DH is a very popular sport to which a lot of people are passionate about, how difficult would it be to ban this sport in the woods?? There are enough people who are not associated with the sport who enjoy biking through the main pathways of Wharncliffe woods many who will only stop to look at the downhill trails, could they ever be banned from riding there??
Impossible.
My point is that cycles are already socially accepted by the general public so specifically banning a certain genre of cycling would be impossible to do in the woods.
Now if the DH bikes had engines and they came into contact with horses or walkers then they would be deemed dangerous and banned instantly.
I am passionate about my sport and if i could do anything to releive the bad press that motorcyclists have then i would but i fear that i would never be successful and my attempts would be in vain!

Sorry to get the bikes mixed up, I hate that. I ride and XC MTB not DH :-)

Fair point, Although in wales the FC stamped down on several places and did close them. But thats my point Barry, you wont stop, but its illegal, so why not try to do someting good rather than illegal ?

1, There is a problem. Correct. The FC met with us, and told us so. And our response has been two years of consultation. A 12 page document on how to contain and improve MTB trails whithin the woods. What are you doing ?
2, Yes live saplings are fine. Wharncliffe is partley run by the FE. Forestry Enterprise rather than FC. FE are designed to bring income to the woods. and the woods are a commercial growing acivity. Most of Wharncliffe is in fact a poor wood, silver birch and pines etc. Soon there will be thinning along the TPT that is to be done by the FC. AS long as Oaks and protected trees are not killed, and sustainable trail building / resources are used thats fine.
3, Your spot on about banning. They know they cant easly ban ridng MTB's But working with us we get to build better trails, legally with funding and make it even better than an unauthrorised ride. Trials / MX riders should do the same.
4, Cyles aint socially accepted. Its a nightmare for MTB's riding in the peaks or wharncliffe. THe problem in England is we all alienate other groups. Walkers dont like Horses / MTB;s and MTB's dont like riders etc etc etc yawn....its all wrong. But if we all actively take a roll in creating our own safe fun places to play then your sorted. I dont mind MX / Trails bikes in Wharncliffe as long as they are not destroying the MTB trails OR jumping on to the TPT and spooking horses. Motobikes look like fun to me....TBH though you should try riding up a hill...it makes the Downhills so much more fun :-)

Look Barry, to me your unique. You sound like our group. You love your sport and you have a brain. If you want I will give you contact details of the guys at the FC and you can contact them. Maybe you will be the one of the first in England to build a trails coarse on FC land ?? who knows.

In the end Barry, You have not committed to help building trails have you ???? why not ?

final final post tonight Barry. Think about scales of speed. Walkers are worried by Horses as they go faster. Horses by MTB's as we both do up to 30mph. Motor powered vehicles go up to 60mph....a serious speed with serious effects if your hit......think about that when your in Wharncliffe next time.

I haven`t committed to approaching any organisations with my thoughts as i do not think that they will be taken seriously by the FC. Look at some of the bigotry that has been shown to me in this thread alone. people cannot distinguish between a kid on a stolen ex road bike and a rider who is passionate about their sport!
A motorcycle is a motorcycle and they have as much bad press now as the old fashoined hells angels of the 70s!
I would love to help rebuild the woods and create places to ride my Gas gas in peace so if you could give me any leads as to how i can do this legally then i would very much appreciate it!!!!!
Baz

I onced joked with a DH biker about how fast i could get up the trail compared to him and he replied to me "Yea but you couldnt keep up on the way down mate!"
Baz

Here is a link to show you what we do as a sport!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY_bITpYNwA
It is an art and going fast is not involved in it at all!
It is a common misconception that all motorcycles are fast! Mine is not but it can go from 0 to 10mph in the bink of an eye!!!!
Thanks anyway Green!!!!

Look at some of the bigotry that has been shown to me in this thread alone. people cannot distinguish between a kid on a stolen ex road bike and a rider who is passionate about their sport!
A motorcycle is a motorcycle and they have as much bad press now as the old fashoined hells angels of the 70s!
That's because, while most responsible riders keep to riding legally, others ignore the law - in your case you justify your law-breaking because the quality of riding in the woods is good. I guess that means that we can all break the law, provided we're enjoying being a criminal.

People do not try to distinguish between you and the kid on the stolen motorbike because the only difference is that your bike is not stolen. Both are criminals, both should be arrested, both should be punished.

The real motorcyclists see you as lower than the stuff on the underside of their shoes for the bad name that your kind bring to respectable motorcyclists.

The fact the problem has been acknowladge by both us as riders and the FC is the only reason we are allowed to work on the trails in the woods- as of Sunday for DH.
Any work you have seen beorehand is illegal digging and is not "us" as a group its individuals working illegally and not to IMBA standards, not with FC?FE backing.

The only fires I'm aware of in the woods are kids, there has never been any fires started as a result of building work.
FC may well have burnt off after clearing paths, coppicing, felling etc. this is common practice and nothing to do with mountainbikers.
Noticed the majority of the peaks had smoke coming from it last weekend?
They are controlled fires to burn off heather.

A lot of what your using against us is reflecting that you aren't really aware whats going on- thats no bad thing, you have no way of finding out but it can't be used against a group when its nothing to do with them or of any benifit to mountainbikers in general, its conservation work essential for the area's biodiversity.

Again no trees have been cut down for the benifit of mountainbikes, fallen trees have been used, tree felling takes place by FC contractors and the trees are used but non have been removed by us- although we do have permission to do so if needed,
In an area such as Wharncliffe a motorbike tyre can cause much greater damage than a felled tree.
Tree felling is essential, ruts are not.

As you and Old Green have said they can't ban mountainbike riders, whatever they do people will get around, thats why we've formed a group to resolve these issues rather than letting it develop to the stage your at with motorbike access where its just a game of cat and mouse constantly where ever you go.

Forestry have no vested interest AT ALL in mountainbikes being in the woods and are well within their rights to ban it all together.
They're only working with us for the benifit of other forest users not us.

You still seem to be missing the point that while some of the issues mountainbike cause are illegal you just being in the woods is illegal so that almost throws out the argument of what causes more damage.
The fact is on a bridleway a motorbike is more damaging, more likely to spook horses- they don't even have to be close to scare a horse (more of a motox bike issue than trials I know but still...), harder to stop because of the added speed, traveling a greater speed, often comletely unidentifyable so more threatening, in large groups.
If a dog runs through the middle of a group its almost certain to be hit and injured.

I've been hit head on by a motorbike riding up a DH track, I've gone off a drop and a trials rider was sat on the landing eating- engine off right under the drop so I had no idea untill its too late.
This could've been a walker, other mountainbiker but the fact is it wasn't...

A motorbike going up a track causes far more damage than a mountainbike coming down, your speed is less constant for a start often using quite large amounts of throttle, much bigger tyres with a high amount of power going to the back.

I've no doubt a skilled rider could get up and leave no more than a tyre mark but the majority I've seen are pretty much incompitent and do leave a mess.

You've gone on a bit about us building trails being damaging to the area, your happy enough to use them to ride up though causing greater damage to the area?
The so called damage done by mountainbikes is done to designated mountainbike areas, mainly tyres wearing into man made stuff mainly berms which are easily repaired with material won from the land around with FC backing.

Your trying to pick this to bits but the simple fact is the FC are well aware of what goes on and what is done to repair it.
We're making trails that are sustainable and maintainable without any effect to the surrounding environment (unless your going to pick up on a wheel barrow tread....?)

Yet again the conclusion is continue to ride illegally but stop complaining people don't like it and don't complain when you lose your bikes to the police or actively sort something out as we've done.
We're no more welcome really and as your quite happy to point out cause potentially as much damage yet we've got sorted and are begining to make our trails sustainable- you can aswell.

Your obvioulsy not stupid, quite the opposite but you've got people with plenty of experience telling you the only answer is to sort something out to ride legally- restrictions are always going to be there where it is illegal.

For the record the gate has had to be opened buy the house owner 11 times last time I spoke to them. This is by no means an accurate break down of whats gone on in the woods but certainly is of the bottom gate in probably 2004
Twice for the fire brigade- neither of which were mountain or motorbikes.
Once for a walker with a broken ankle -neither of which were mountain or motorbikes
5 times for people needing medical treatment/ a horse box.
One was a mountainbike crash on track, 1 whiplash after the horse was spooked by a motorbike they didn't even see, one for a horse that was spooked by quads, one for a horse envolved in a collision with a motorbike.

2 times for police following on from motorbike complaints.

Once for mountain rescue after a reported broken back although nobody was actually found to be injured- we think this was a mountainbike and a big mis understanding with a walker calling for help that wasn't needed.

But it goes to show, at least for that period of time at that gate motorbikes were the biggest problem for other forest users.
This is always going to be true through the nature of them, they are more noisy, faster etc. i don't need to go on.
You must appreciate why people don't welcome motorbikes but doing nothing to resolve this can only make things worse.

The only conclusion is a group of riders need to sort things out if you want Wharncliffe to be a useable area- same applies anywhere else.
Theres big groups fighting for green lanes- find out more about them, there are plenty of green lanes on FC land in Derbyshire so they're obvioulsy willing to work with people that are willing to work with them.

In principle I've got no problem at all with motorbikes being in the woods, but not damaging existing trails they shouldn't be on anyway and deffinately not jeapordiseing the future of the woods for people who have put a lot of work into being accepted in the woods.
If there was a designated area I'd seriously consider getting back into it but at the moment you mightaswell be driving the wrong way up a motorway.
You know your not meant to, you know exactly why your not meant to, you know its putting everyone else at risk and everyone is going to be ****** off by it wether you do them any harm or not.

Illegal riding of motorbikes, mountainbikes will always exist, so will illegal/ improper building but the more stuff there is legally the better the situation will be for everyone.

As far as I'm concerned untill proper action is taken motorbikes will continue to be seen as an illegal nusance in Wharncliffe.
The second any proper action is taken to sort it out me and I'm sure plenty of others would happily help out with the building and planning stage but if people continue to break the law in such large numbers it'l never happen.
The waterfall is a perfect location for motorbikes and has good access avoiding most of the fireroads.

Theres probably 6 people really heavily envolved in mountainbikes with the FC represtenting 1000's of people that use the woods at some point but we've now got permission to build a whole new XC loop and exstentive improvements to the existing DH's.

Just out of interest you say you avoid the roads all the way, is this because your intending to ride illegally and want to draw as little attention as possible, riding illegally offroad because your not legally allowed on road or just because its more interesting?

For instance if you could ride in the woods legally in a set area provided you used aset entry point (which would be off Manchester Road for the waterfall) would you be prepared to ride on the road legally to get to it or continue to ride illegally?
Only asking as your views seem to represent the more responsible riders, its stuff like that that would show your prepared to make your own comprimises.

Again I don't mean to sound like such a prick but you seem to be defending yourself with the fact motorbikes are unpopular so theres no point trying to make it legal and can potentially cause no more damage than mountainbikes and not a lot else.

Actions speak louder than words.....

In the time i was typing that theres been a few new replies, I'm happy to give you details of people throughout Yorkshire and Derbyshire that could possibly help or at least point you in the right direction and help any way I can.

People are going to talk to you like crap because your admitting your breaking the law, however petty a law seems it takes a lot of justifying before people will accept your reasons for breaking it.

I can completely sympathise with your reasons but they don't justify it....
Feel free to email me at wharncliffe-downhill@hotmail.co.uk

I'm not going to carry on with this topic unless its going to result in productive action- its just going to break down into people picking at each others points, I could've gone into huge amounts of depth before my arguments were flawless but I've got much better things to do with my time than try and convince people breaking the law isn't something you should be openly admitting doing then trying to defend doing- it shouldn't need explaining (and I know you don't need it explaining to you, not trying to be patronising but you must know what I mean)

So who does the countryside belong to??
[strange rant edited out]
This weekend will be appreciatng the countryside as it is my property!!! How many people reading these posts willl actually do the same????The land registry is the best place to make that enquiry :rolleyes:
It is obviously way above your head that different parts of it belong to different people. Access to much of it was secured by the ramblers association many years ago - not for the purpose of spending a weekend walking infront of motorcyclists :roll:

I've already pointed out the reasons for my vehement objection to your sort - I'd rather my dog wasn't mown down by any idiots on motorcycles whilst we are out walking in the countryside

You also comment on the council providing swimming pools, and the likelyhood of people swimming in canals if the pools shut down. I think you are completely missing out the point that people pay to use a swimming pool - and it's highly unlikely that if one facility opened up for your style of biking (and an admission fee was charged) that this would immediately erradicate the nuisances from our parks, woods and open spaces

There would be no vehicles to steal from either :rolleyes:


I couldn't help thinking about the 'poor lad' who was killed on Retford Rd last year when you whinged about your relative not being a scrote - but I'll let you read that thread at your leisure. Suffice to say that everybody who knew him thought he was wonderful, but the motorist who he mangled himself in front of has to live with the nightmare for the rest of their life - and there is no documentation on how many near misses this kid had, or how many pedestians got the fright of their lives from his illegal activities

The fact the problem has been acknowladge by both us as riders and the FC is the only reason we are allowed to work on the trails in the woods- as of Sunday for DH.
Any work you have seen beorehand is illegal digging and is not "us" as a group its individuals working illegally and not to IMBA standards, not with FC?FE backing...

Maybe i have a selfish attitude when it comes to this subject but if i were to make waves and i were to officially announce plans to ride in the Wharncliffe wood area then i would most possibly never be able to ride there again as i would be known to the officials of the FC then the ACU, the chances of them letting a motorcycle ride there legally are quite frankly laughable! I would have less of a chance of winning than a one legged man in a butt kicking contest and that is putting it mildly..
At the moment i am unknown to anyone official and a silhouette on the horizon to many people who frequent the woods and maybe that is the safest way to do it, i do not think that i would be challenged by anyone official. Stealth has to be the way for me for the moment but i will anonymously study the ways in which i could do it legally, it will be a loophole if anything but i will always live in hope!

There are rogue units occurring in your community if your comments are correct as i definitely witnessed a fire started by Cyclists on the first Downhill trail as you enter the woods at the Platts lane entrance at Oughtibridge, there are bad seeds in every walk of life i am sure!

One more point if i may, is not building a trail in the first place defacing the countryside forever?, i recently visited Weston park museum and saw an oil painting dated 1786, a picture of the valley of the don covering the whole Hillsborough area, it is painted from the hillside near the allotments in Shirecliffe and shows a distinctive rock which is still there to this day. I have ridden over this very rock many times as a child while practising my sport and it still remains intact, this type of thing is our heritage and should be preserved along with the saplings around it, healthy or unhealthy!

Just in case you want to see here is a link to how it looks today
http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL873/4141620/8645194/229283466.jpg
Go to the Weston Park museum and compare the two!

Thank you WRC for your insightful aditions to this thread!

Yes to an extent building a trail is defacing the countryside, but no more so than a footpath, green lane, fireroad, house, visitor centre, public toilets, car park but these are all seen as being needed to allow people to get into the countryside- not to mention roads.

The fact remains we're responsibly and sustainably building trails and working to put right the illegal building that has taken place, the parts that are ruined or whatever you want to call it are being left and allowed to regenerate naturally.
The tracks are all either built around trees or through areas that we're felled for Forestry access over the years.
I'm sure some trees we're removed illegally but not in a way thats going to adversley affect the area- Wharncliffe was only planted so we had wood after the 2nd world war if there was another war and we couldn't import it.
Its only there as a result of being safety mat for the economy, like mant of the other Forestry owned land- its not naturally forest.

You don't seem to agree that we accept it can be seen as defacing the countryside, but is going to happen whatever is done- we've set up to do it with as little impact as possible.

Your still perfectly happy to use the defaced country side and make our job considerably harder and potentially in vain.

Parkwood, yes I used to ride trials on the rocks aswell, motorbike and mountainbike- but how is that not a much more considerable defacing (the fact the area is even there) than a small trail built to internationally recognised standards and maintained to the same standard.
Is the house you live in naturally formed in a naturally formed city or did some human come along while it was lush countryside and decide to build a city here.

We've put a lot of effort into even being able to start to minimise the effect on the countryside which would otherwise be left illegally.
Dalby and Sherwood forests both have areas motorbikes are allowed to use- Dalby certainly won't have as many illegal motorbike riders immediately surrounding it so if they can do it theres no reason Sheffield can't.

The fact your calling the trails at Wharncliffe a defacement of the countryside yet still prepared to use them, causing more damage to them than a push bike, doing so illegally and making no effort to repair any damage caused is very hipocritical.

As I've said I appreciate the problem you have, I've had the same problem with motorbikes and mountainbikes but there are ways around it.

I do genuinely believe you that you will give way to horses etc. and have no problem with motorbikes using the fireroads/ waterfall etc. if this is the way they act- but the fact is a lot don't, by owning up to using the woods on a public forum you've made yourself a scapegoat to all the issues motorbikes cause.

I also agree that if a designated area was set up for trials there would be very little damage caused to the area by the bikes- but thats because it'd be a suitable area for it, a DH track carved through peaty soil isn't suitable and just gets ripped to bits.

There are so many rocky areas in wharncliffe well away from fireroads, paths, tracks that you wouldn't damage, wouldn't cause anyone any problems in.
You could stick the bike in neutral and push it to them from Deepcar brickyard and then there'd be no safety issues other than your own which you accept and take responsibility for, but again this doesn't ever happen.

I wish I could suggest a better alternative and I fully understand the concern you face about even bothering to try and seek an official area, but the fact you could build and ride your own area would have to make it worthwhile if it did happen, its unlikely to in Wharncliffe I agree but no more unlikely than other areas that now have facilities.
This time last year it looked unlike DH would ever continue legally in the woods
Derwent valley gets over 2 million visitors a year and still accomodates motorbikes without any accidents/ real damage.
The second they go out of these areas there are problems though.

Mountainbikes do cause some errosion damage in derbyshire riding footpaths illegally but nothing like the same amount a motorbike can do.
Even just a rear tyre mark is 3 or 4 times wider than a mountainbike, at least twice as deep, if my legs had anything like the torque of a motorbike I'd be digging holes by pedalling- they dont though so I don't leave big marks.

I could live off repairing footpath damage throughout derbyshire, all of which is caused by illegal motorbikes to a huge extent.

I'm still confident with the amount of land and illegal motorbikes in Sheffield someone would allow an area to be used and maintained if you could prove a group of responisble people were prepared to take full control over it and meet all the demands and standards placed on them.

Illegal riding will always exist but it'd be lessened- especially in trials that does require a completely specific area.
Many people with a trials bike in Sheffield have never done anything more than climb a grassy bank on it- they mighaswell own a cub 90 for what they do on them but think what people could be doing in a designated area...

I really believe somebody would back a scheme like this fully just because of the nuisance factor motorbikes cause the city as a whole.
It just needs a group to put in the time and effort.

As I said I think you've really just made youself the scapegoat when your really not that bad compared to others- I'm doing it myself by reffering to all illegal riders in the woods as "you" so I wouldn't take the comments that personally you've just left yourself open to people taking out their dislike of illegal bikes on you.

Wish you wouldnt ride the trials though Barry,
It does cause quicker errosion on a motorbike than MTB. The Waterfall that you refer to riding up was ridable for many many years until motorbikes started to ride up it. Now its soo deeply rutted its unridable by anything without a motor.
Maybe well catch you in the woods sometime ;-)

intresting, we were with the FC last sunday and saw three riders in the woods. When they saw the van they soon sped off, actually almost falling off in there attempt to scarper the scene :-)

What ever happened to the parkwood track, as I remember when I used to go there it was a proper motox track and the police used to come up with a van and trailer full of bikes for people to learn on.
Thinking about it when we were allowed on parkwood my 1 bike took 5 or 6 teenager off the streets for a full day at a time.
Costs.
1 Honda C90 AKA Honda plastic £70.00
1 can of 4 star £2.00 yes £2.00
1 day on the tip FREE
Cost to society FREE yes FREE. No harm or damage done to anyone

No harm or damage done to anyone

Except when the little toerags decide to venture up to the top and tear up the football pitches. Or even worse, decide to razz round the new estate at the top.

No harm done? Guess again.

Except when the little toerags decide to venture up to the top and tear up the football pitches. Or even worse, decide to razz round the new estate at the top.

No harm done? Guess again.

Listen bud if the people on that new estate can live with the smell of thousands of tons of rotting rubbish under there noses, rats sharing there house, and swarms of flys and cockroaches Im sure a few moto bike races around the streets would not bother them. :hihi:

I am referring to 20 years ago when there was no houses, And the field was only used by kids who were not ready for the track, You should moan about the people who go on there at weekend and kick that stupid ball about making it all muddy and dogs that crap all over the place.

Listen bud if the people on that new estate can live with the smell of thousands of tons of rotting rubbish under there noses, rats sharing there house, and swarms of flys and cockroaches Im sure a few moto bike races around the streets would not bother them. :hihi:

I am referring to 20 years ago when there was no houses, And the field was only used by kids who were not ready for the track when I used to go there, You should moan about the people who go on there at weekend and kick that stupid ball about making it all muddy and dogs that crap all over the place.

Not even worth justifying myself to you if thats your attitude. I bet you have a sovereign ring though!

Ive seen no evidence form the MX community that leads me to believe they are not TAKE TAKE TAKE...the evidence that they do take and not give back is seen routinely around the woods by the damage created.

Get a spade, get motivated and give something back to the community and the countryside.

Why will you not advocate trail building for MX riders ? Why not join us on Sunday at the trail building day ? that would at least show some responsibility and intrest in the places your ride.

I am a member of 2 off road clubs, we regally go out and repair green lanes and byways, we also clear paths and tracks so horses, walkers and MTB'rs can use them as normally the track proffered by MTB'rs, walkers and horse riders are not suited to our sport.
We would be more than willing to come and help build tracks for MX's/enduro in Warncliffe woods and repair the footpaths and DH track for the MTB'rs but MX's will never be allowed in Warncliffe woods.
I do feel that everyone should obey the laws of the land, but a lot of the politics that surrounds the preservation of our woodland and public spaces makes no representation for the minority that are banned from practicing there sport in the woods, I am sure that if the FC gave motor bike riders a set weekend they could use the woods there would be a massive influx of volunteers to help repair/improve the woods for all.
At the present the woods will continue to attract the few illegal riders who have no care for the law or other users and that will never stop.

Not even worth justifying myself to you if thats your attitude. I bet you have a sovereign ring though!

You would be quite surprised to learn that I don’t own a sovereign. You are proberly a lot closer to any kind of Chav than I will ever be:loopy:

Not even worth justifying myself to you if thats your attitude. I bet you have a sovereign ring though!

Oh I can see from your sig.where you live"in a nicer house than you" that you are one of those people that thinks he is better than everyone else living around him. If you live on the Standish est. you deffo don’t live in a better house than me mate. Although I was brought up in Southey and I still own the old family home there; but you still seam to live in that area, what’s up cant you afford home in the south of Sheffield

Oh I can see from your sig.where you live"in a nicer house than you" that you are one of those people that thinks he is better than everyone else living around him. If you live on the Standish est. you deffo don’t live in a better house than me mate. Although I was brought up in Southey and I still own the old family home there; but you still seam to live in that area, what’s up cant you afford home in the south of Sheffield

You may be right but thats not the point is it?
The fact is that illegal bikers tear up the Parkwood footie pitches. If only these "people" would stay on the designated tracks then there wouldnt be half as much damage. That you cant deny.

I dont mind em, just dont want them in the wrong place where little kids are. Surely even you & Baz cant argue with that.

South Sheffield, pah! Not in my lifetime pal. Prefer real neighbours, not ones with their head up their own backsides!

You may be right but thats not the point is it?
The fact is that illegal bikers tear up the Parkwood footie pitches. If only these "people" would stay on the designated tracks then there wouldnt be half as much damage. That you cant deny.

I dont mind em, just dont want them in the wrong place where little kids are. Surely even you & Baz cant argue with that.

South Sheffield, pah! Not in my lifetime pal. Prefer real neighbours, not ones with their head up their own backsides!

It may be true now that kids/residents may be tearing up the footie pitches now, but when I was a youth bikes used the track and hills that were on the tip, the police never bothered unless they came up with there van full of bikes of there was a stolen bike reported in the area


But if the track was still available on the tip do you think the kids would want to ride around the roads when they could have the best ride on a track where they would not get in trouble for being there.

Idiots will always be present, but denying good people of honest fun is not the way

You may be right but thats not the point is it?
The fact is that illegal bikers tear up the Parkwood footie pitches. If only these "people" would stay on the designated tracks then there wouldnt be half as much damage. That you cant deny.

I dont mind em, just dont want them in the wrong place where little kids are. Surely even you & Baz cant argue with that.

South Sheffield, pah! Not in my lifetime pal. Prefer real neighbours, not ones with their head up their own backsides!

Sorry a little late but there are no legal track for bike on parkwood ant more

hi
i am new to this forum i moved to western australia last year having lived in north sheffield all of my life .I moved for a change and for my 2 kids to have different kind of life as i did.The best thing about living away for a while it gives you a unbiased opinion of the uk.Anyway reading the biking thread certainly stirred up some thoughts the uk tarnishes kids messing around on off road bikes akin to terrorists out here in WA you see almost every other car towing a couple of dirt bikes on sunday afternoon(me being one of them).Why dont the poncy uk government turn some off the derelict industrial land into a couple of bike circuits and also moniter them to make them safe.Instead of virtually giving the land to"enterprise zones" where arthur daley like characters set up "nice little earners" and pay staff peanuts.In the uk i was not really into biking after seeing things down got my 8 year old a peewee80 and a trailer a lot more exciting than fishing once house build is finished treating myself to klr 650.I find uk attituides against anything slightly fun:hihi: paul expat

hi
i am new to this forum i moved to western australia


Don't you think that the availability of land and lack of population pressures may have something to do with the differences that you have observed?

Don't you think that the availability of land and lack of population pressures may have something to do with the differences that you have observed?

Have a quick look on google earth (I know its a bit out of date, but most of it is still there), you will find plenty of spare land in and around sheffield.

Have a quick look on google earth (I know its a bit out of date, but most of it is still there), you will find plenty of spare land in and around sheffield.

excellent post good observation.In reply to the other point of view land prices have almost tripled in the last 5 years in western australia.Perth has a chronic land shortage which has pushed prices through the roof,but a lot of old industrial land considered to poor a location to build on has been given to leisure facilities motorcross being one of them. I would consider the uk attituide being partly to blame.Developers have an easier time with planning officials if they want to build a golf course for the "elite" to tap a ball round .facilities for rough round the edges council kids come a second place.Dont want to sound to political just saying as i see it.got to jump in the shower being 34 deg on site today bye:P

Looking for somewhere to legally ride motorcross bikes offroad this doesn't have to be anywhere fancy any muddy field will do is there such a place where this can be done without hassle from the fuzz?:help:

do it in gleedgless , they all ride on the oraods there illegally so u will be fine lol

Next to the Ski Village ?

Next to the Ski Village ?

Do you meen Parkwood ? its all been blocked off you cant get on there now !

Gutted why do sheffield council complain about people riding bikes on public land and causing a trouble for residents when its clearly their own fault for not providing one of the uks largest citys with access to legally ride a bikes off road when most of sheffield is made on the muddy stuff. surely if a service was provided then this would take a percentage of the people off the streets riding illegally and could be controlled even supervised to ensure a safe practise of riding is fulfilled this could also be a chargeable service to use and the funds could go towards damage caused by people riding bikes on public land and ruining it or speed cameras and asylum seekers whatever they want IMO Sheffield City Council need to pull a finger out!:rant:

Gutted why do sheffield council complain about people riding bikes on public land and causing a trouble for residents when its clearly their own fault for not providing one of the uks largest citys with access to legally ride a bikes off road when most of sheffield is made on the muddy stuff. surely if a service was provided then this would take a percentage of the people off the streets riding illegally and could be controlled even supervised to ensure a safe practise of riding is fulfilled this could also be a chargeable service to use and the funds could go towards damage caused by people riding bikes on public land and ruining it or speed cameras and asylum seekers whatever they want IMO Sheffield City Council need to pull a finger out!:rant:

We've been through all this before on another thread. The reasons why the Council (and it's always the Council that people blame isn't it, never mind whether it's a Local Authority issue or not ) are :

1. Nobody wants an off-road bike park near where they live. I get endless complaints about the noise from these bikes and the residents of Bowman Drive got up a petition when someone suggested that the Lightwood site be used.

2. A commercial company in Doncaster set up a scheme a couple of years ago. A young man killed himself in a bike accident on site and the insurance pay-out was so huge that the company went bust. No Council could take this on - the insurance premiums are astronomical.

3. How would bikers get from home to the site ? Can you seriously imagine parents of kids from the poorest parts of our city hiring a van to transport bikes across to a registered site ? They'd not go and would continue to ride in our parks and on footpaths free of charge.

Please refer to the previous very long thread on this. All the pros and cons were discussed to death and raking the same argument up again isn't going to help the situation one bit.

Get off your political hobby horse too. It's the wrong issue for it.

well if no one wants a off road bike park they have no right to complain when a pack of youths on monkey bikes terrorise a street thats just ts im affraid!

to refference of the doncaster park i did say SHEFFIELD!! but if one person kills themself on a off road bike park that is to how many in comparison to the amount of people that get killed elsewhere on bikes?

and to part 3 if they are so poor what are they doing buyin kids a bike when they should be more concerned about clothing and feeding their kids.

at the end of the day this is a problem that needs a solution so every excuse will arise surely its like oppinions and arseholes everyone has one.

my political hobby horse say nay nay nay.

although i do think that we should at least provide approved bike routes, cos having them razzing down the streets is a little silly and dangerous.

Or even better Firenfry, whilst you are avoiding the fuzz, try avoiding residential areas too, find a nice quiet spot where no-one complains about u using it, and then publish the route online.

yeah mad that was my point (to establish a place where i could go that was away from residential areas and legal) not to start the do-gooders waving their sticks it was just a quest for one man and his bike to stay out of trouble however it seems that its a catch 22 the "local authorities" or council dont want people rinding in public but refuse to supply such a location as it costs too much in insurance premiums apparently i guess they're just too tight to pay out if someone dies they would preffer to many more die or injured with no liability to themselfs have they heard of a disclaimer?.

There is some information from the Greater Manchester Police site about off road biking. There aren't many legal sites in their area either, but they are trying to point people in the right direction.
If you want to buy a bike be prepared for some costs:
Quad and motocross bikes start from around £700 new and £450 second hand to buy; Protective clothing can cost between £100-£300 with a helmet an additional £90-£250; You will also need a trailer to transport the bike to the riding site. If you do not own one they can cost £250-£500 or more, with an extra £60 plus fitting cost for a tow bar if your car does not currently have one. These costs could total between £950 and £1,800.
Based on a study of 80 tracks around the UK the average daily cost to ride is £14.50 for a child and £15.50 for an adult. Some tracks have additional membership schemes of £20 a year on top.
If you would like more information on how to ride legally pleasecontact the Auto-cycle Union who are the governing body for the sport. They will be able to provide youwith details of regional venues and latest news:

Auto-cycle Union Ltd,

ACU House,
Wood Street Rugby,
Warwickshire,
CV21 2YX
Tel: 01788 566 400
Email: admin@acu.org.uk
Web: www.acu.org.uk


Its like many other sports that don't have local bases - it needs commitment, finance and transport. Not every city in the UK can cater for everyone's hobby - and in cases where its not affordable, many children just don't get to do it. Anyone who takes this sport seriously can contact the above body, and find out where they can ride their bikes legitimately. I do get fed up with the cry of 'the council should' - leisure and sports organisations (like bowls) are often successful because of the commitment and effort put in by club members.

that Ms Macbeth will follow up that lead monday.
Your right about the costs and dont i know it, thats the main frustration the fact you can buy a bike and all the accessorise that costs a bomb but cant use it without fear of police crushing ur bike in front of you!

hi
i am new to this forum i moved to western australia last year having lived in north sheffield all of my life .I moved for a change and for my 2 kids to have different kind of life as i did.The best thing about living away for a while it gives you a unbiased opinion of the uk.Anyway reading the biking thread certainly stirred up some thoughts the uk tarnishes kids messing around on off road bikes akin to terrorists out here in WA you see almost every other car towing a couple of dirt bikes on sunday afternoon(me being one of them).Why dont the poncy uk government turn some off the derelict industrial land into a couple of bike circuits and also moniter them to make them safe.Instead of virtually giving the land to"enterprise zones" where arthur daley like characters set up "nice little earners" and pay staff peanuts.In the uk i was not really into biking after seeing things down got my 8 year old a peewee80 and a trailer a lot more exciting than fishing once house build is finished treating myself to klr 650.I find uk attituides against anything slightly fun:hihi: paul expat

Thank you very much for your comments Paul, I have ignored the comments on this forum for a while as i felt that they had lost relevance and did not need a sensible reply, Yours does and although i have not read all of the posts to date i wanted to extend my hand to you and shake it....
Thanks mate England is Poncey and stuck up themselves and if we were allowed to have fun then maybe we would not be as snot nosed in the first place...

Let me remind people what this is about!! When you were young did you not have something that you dreamed about? Did you not hope that someday you would be able to be the best at what you did. Were you ever disappointed because some beaurocrat made a law that said that you were not allowed to do the thing that you loved because some dog walker complained about it!
I used to practise with a young lad called Dougie Lampkin who is now the 7 times world trials Champion at a place called Flappits Farm in Haworth, there is now a campaign to ban Motorcycling at this site too..
Currently the spanish are the best in this genre of biking as they are allowed to ride wherever they like... where will our next Champ come from??
What Sheff needs is somewhere that is ignored by the authorities and has large signs sayin "Ride at your own risk "
Give it a rest all you off road critics and see that it is a sport to be catered for!!!!!!

It may be true now that kids/residents may be tearing up the footie pitches now, but when I was a youth bikes used the track and hills that were on the tip, the police never bothered unless they came up with there van full of bikes of there was a stolen bike reported in the area


But if the track was still available on the tip do you think the kids would want to ride around the roads when they could have the best ride on a track where they would not get in trouble for being there.

Idiots will always be present, but denying good people of honest fun is not the way

Bravo The sound of an intellegent user!!! Thanks Chop

Here is a thought for you! If the council provided a legitimate place for kids and adults alike to ride off road bikes then they would be liable to any claims for accidents on this land. However if the accidents are on the roads or railways then the council are not responsible and the statistic will be against road users! E.g. Insurance companies. So the fact that people are in more mortal danger is not a factor that they care about!

.......
Thanks mate England is Poncey and stuck up themselves and if we were allowed to have fun then maybe we would not be as snot nosed in the first place...

Sounds like it is time that you booked your ticket then!! :hihi:

Let me remind people what this is about!! When you were young did you not have something that you dreamed about? Did you not hope that someday you would be able to be the best at what you did. Were you ever disappointed because some beaurocrat made a law that said that you were not allowed to do the thing that you loved because some dog walker complained about it!
I used to practise with a young lad called Dougie Lampkin who is now the 7 times world trials Champion at a place called Flappits Farm in Haworth, there is now a campaign to ban Motorcycling at this site too..
Currently the spanish are the best in this genre of biking as they are allowed to ride wherever they like... where will our next Champ come from??
What Sheff needs is somewhere that is ignored by the authorities and has large signs sayin "Ride at your own risk "
Give it a rest all you off road critics and see that it is a sport to be catered for!!!!!!


im a huge off road motorbike fan, have been sicne i was a kid, but i don't want to see kids/adults riding their bikes in their local fields putting other people at risk, if you can afford a bike and safety clothing, you should be able to afford the extra costs involved in getting to a track and paying for track time

hi
i am new to this forum i moved to western australia last year having lived in north sheffield all of my life .I moved for a change and for my 2 kids to have different kind of life as i did.The best thing about living away for a while it gives you a unbiased opinion of the uk.Anyway reading the biking thread certainly stirred up some thoughts the uk tarnishes kids messing around on off road bikes akin to terrorists out here in WA you see almost every other car towing a couple of dirt bikes on sunday afternoon(me being one of them).Why dont the poncy uk government turn some off the derelict industrial land into a couple of bike circuits and also moniter them to make them safe.Instead of virtually giving the land to"enterprise zones" where arthur daley like characters set up "nice little earners" and pay staff peanuts.In the uk i was not really into biking after seeing things down got my 8 year old a peewee80 and a trailer a lot more exciting than fishing once house build is finished treating myself to klr 650.I find uk attituides against anything slightly fun:hihi: paul expat

I'll be following you then Paul, off to perth hopefully

im a huge off road motorbike fan, have been sicne i was a kid, but i don't want to see kids/adults riding their bikes in their local fields putting other people at risk, if you can afford a bike and safety clothing, you should be able to afford the extra costs involved in getting to a track and paying for track time
That is not really relevant mate as no one agrees with people riding in the parks and fields and no one wants to see them on the roads either, the point is that the local authorities have closed down the only places that bikes could be ridden without getting on the general publics nerves and now the bikers are riding wherever!!
Open up some land and ignore what goes on there!! Problem solved!!!!

That is not really relevant mate as no one agrees with people riding in the parks and fields and no one wants to see them on the roads either, the point is that the local authorities have closed down the only places that bikes could be ridden without getting on the general publics nerves and now the bikers are riding wherever!!
Open up some land and ignore what goes on there!! Problem solved!!!!

no, it may have been ignored but it was still an illegal riding place.

If you can't afford the extra expense of paying for a trailer/van and track time, you shouldn't have bought a bike in the first place, simple as.

You wouldn't expect the council to open up a dissused car park for racing car drivers to use would you?

I'll be following you then Paul, off to perth hopefully

perth is a brilliant city we often spend the weekend there we live in bunbury a large town about 120 miles south any info you want pm me

Which part of this do you not understand??
Children and youths in the postal code of s5 have a limited resource of entertainment as money is scarce, due mainly to the unemployment of the estate! So why are they persecuted by the police so badly.
It reigns true with everything even with kids who have cars which are completely legal!! Being stopped 7 times a night by police who assume that they are not insured!!
Il bet that does not happen in nether edge!

If money is so scarce in your area, how do the kids get the bikes in the first place? I suppose you'll say it's alright to nick someone else's bike because it "Gets the heart beating".
Off road biking does nothing apart from pollute and destroy greenery. If you can't do it away from civilization in designated areas, don't do it.
It's not good being in bed or on the back garden and listening to some w****r on a crappy moto cross/quad bike riding on the field behind your house. (No, I don't go to bed at 6pm either).
And before you say it, I've had bikes for years of all kinds and I've never had to off road in the middle of a public park or behind someone's house.
Why can't people like you consider the fact that some people have absolutely no interest in bikes and even less interest in some little scrote buzzzin' up and down the area where they live?
With regard to the unemployment and Police issues :
Not everyone in Sheffield has the actual inclination to work. There are jobs out there if somebody wants one.
I don't believe either, that the Police persecute people because they live in Parson Cross. I got stopped when I was younger and still, albeit vary rarely, get stopped now and I aint from Parson Cross.
It must be terrible to live your life under so much pressure from the authorities because you live on a Council estate. Funny, but I never encountered that when I lived at Shiregreen.

Off road biking does nothing apart from pollute and destroy greenery. If you can't do it away from civilization in designated areas, don't do it.

Thanks for the comedy comments willow. Im sure that off road biking contributes to almost all of the pollution that we have in the uk and cars or trucks dont.
Please read the posts first and you may see that i can afford to take my bike to events and other places to practise but i have to travel for hours and it costs a fortune when there are plenty of places to ride in sheff, at risk only from the authorities who i pay extortionate amounts of taxes to.
If i am going to live in rip off britain and pay through the nose for the priveledge then i will ride my off road bike wherever i want and i will do it safely and responsibly!!!!

I never said or implied that off roading was responsible for all the worlds pollution or was worse than trucks, etc. I merely stated that it adds to it.
You get yourself out and about and screw everyone that may not agree with you who also pays taxes.
Lame justification that.
As for comedy comments; your's are up there with Chubby.
Watch out for the selfish b******s who might be out enjoying the countryside using leg power.

Thanks for the comedy comments willow. Im sure that off road biking contributes to almost all of the pollution that we have in the uk and cars or trucks dont.
Please read the posts first and you may see that i can afford to take my bike to events and other places to practise but i have to travel for hours and it costs a fortune when there are plenty of places to ride in sheff, at risk only from the authorities who i pay extortionate amounts of taxes to.
If i am going to live in rip off britain and pay through the nose for the priveledge then i will ride my off road bike wherever i want and i will do it safely and responsibly!!!!

im with you, im not a biker but if its safe and responsible then whats the problem????
Like said, better than been a drug dealer etc etc.........

you were a kid once!

WHEN I WAS A LAD.... (I'm just forty) ...I didn't expect to aquire the things of adulthood until I was an adult.
As kids we found cycling, fishing, camping, hiking, etc etc enough to keep us happy.
When I was sixteen I saved for a full year to get a BSA Bantam. My friends had bikes and our horizons suddenly expanded. We were aware that motorbikes were designed primarily for road use; we had no desire to tear up foot paths in areas designated for walking.
Guess what - we rode out to these places and then we walked/camped/fished there, had great parties at night and no one was upset.
Let's be honest - most of these off-roaders are just trying to look hard. And it's not just kids it's grown 'men' a lot of the time.

Just wanted to point out. After many near miss events at Wharncliffe with MX'rs / Horses. The Police have increased there presence in Wharncliffe. Several bikes have been impounded. Work continues and word is spreading that Wharncliffe is a no go zone for motor vehicles of any type.

Does anyone know of a yorkshireman named Dougie Lampkin???? Only a 12 times world champion who i used to ride with in a place caled Flappits Farm in Haworth Bradford! This was not a legal place to ride but it produced the best motorcycling talent of the millennium!!!! No Middle classed snot nosed people complained then!!!!!

People have always ridden offroad at Flappits. Certainly since the 70s. And it's not 60 miles from Sheffield either. 40 at most.

Thing is Bazrippa, the lads who ride these bikes, certainly in our local woods, don't ride with any respect for either the woods, the wildlife or the other users of the woods. They ride at high speed, wheelspin and doughnut so tearing up the trails. They ride OFF the trails, churning up the grassy banks and the bluebells. They don't slow down or stop to let walkers, dogs and cyclists past, and they drop litter. If they rode responsibly and were friendly and respectful it wouldn't be so bad, although personally I'd still have issues with the noise and fumes.

As for offroad tracks nearby, get an OS map and look at the number of BOATS (Byeway open to all traffic) around Sheffield and the Eastern peak district. If you want a really good offroad area, which is perhaps a bit challenging and where you can ride to your heart's content, try Pin Dale behind the Hope Valley cement works. Not 10 miles from Sheffield and it's the equivalent of Flappits. Just give way to me and my mates when we ride through on mountain bikes! ;)

Just wanted to point out. After many near miss events at Wharncliffe with MX'rs / Horses. The Police have increased there presence in Wharncliffe. Several bikes have been impounded. Work continues and word is spreading that Wharncliffe is a no go zone for motor vehicles of any type.

As it should be. It's open to mountain bikers but too many motorbikers seem to see the presence of mountain bikes as licence for them to ride there too. Not the same at all. I'm really fed up with being tarred with the same brush that Motocrossers are, and coming across log traps and obstacles in my local woods, placed there to discourage motorbikes.

As for offroad tracks nearby, get an OS map and look at the number of BOATS (Byeway open to all traffic) around Sheffield and the Eastern peak district.

Not legal unless the bike is road legal though, surely?

Not legal unless the bike is road legal though, surely?

yeah the bike has to be a road legal trails bike (lights fitted, number plates, tax and insurance etc)

On my way home on a bus today, i overhead a youngish girl chatting to her mate on the phone, i only started listening when she mentioned motocross, she was on about the club she's a member of and the amca (amateur motor cycle association).

This is what anybody owning a motocross bike should be doing, join your local club and race in properly organised events, not riding illegally then complaining the council hasn't provided you with a place to ride.

If she can do it, why can't everybody else

One day, the off road Motorbikers will realise, as Mountain bikers did, that you have to work very hard to earn an off road riding location.
At present, the vast majority of off road motorbikers are too lazy to work to earn a legal place to ride off road.

Riding at 40mph on fireroads at Wharncliffe, or riding on Mountain bike trails that 50+ people have given up a Sunday month for over a year does nothing to help your cause....and this is why you have no supporters. Its simple really.

I really wish I had the time to read all posts on this thread and make a more comprehensive reply. Unfortunately, I do not. However, the first three pages have raised so many points which I have a BURNING desire to comment on that I have to respond in some way.
Without doubt, given a choice between drugs / crime and illegally riding a motorbike on Parkwood Springs, I hope the majority would not chose the former. However, please remember that this is not the only option and many young people find alternative LEGAL ways to pass their time.
By choosing illegal biking you commit offences and really ought to be dealt with appropriately.
Law abiding residents of any postcode deserve a good quality of life and should not be plagued by constant, dangerous, illegal off road motorbike activity. Police Officers should not have to spend the amount of time they do searching for ILLEGAL MOTORCYCLISTS, but they do because they upset so many people and many of them pose a real threat to LAW ABIDING MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC.
Officers should be spending more time targetting those responsible for burglary, car crime and the supply of drugs. It is often the misguided 'law abiding' member of the public (off road motorcyclists who justify their activity by not being dependant on heroin) who prevents them from doing this.
I look forward to reading the remainding posts over the next week or so.

WHEN I WAS A LAD.... (I'm just forty) ...I didn't expect to aquire the things of adulthood until I was an adult.
As kids we found cycling, fishing, camping, hiking, etc etc enough to keep us happy.
When I was sixteen I saved for a full year to get a BSA Bantam. My friends had bikes and our horizons suddenly expanded. We were aware that motorbikes were designed primarily for road use; we had no desire to tear up foot paths in areas designated for walking.
Guess what - we rode out to these places and then we walked/camped/fished there, had great parties at night and no one was upset.
Let's be honest - most of these off-roaders are just trying to look hard. And it's not just kids it's grown 'men' a lot of the time.

I am 32 my friend and i know all about BSA Bantams as they are used these days as pre 65 trials off road bikes, being single cylinder and the lightest in the category they were the best choice for Trials, riding through the rivers and up the muddy bankings, ask sammy miller who was the pre 65 champion for years and who rode a vintage Ariel for over 25 years and NEVER on the road!!!
I have a Suzuki GSXR600 which is a precision tool made for the open road and i also have a Gas Gas which is made for riding on natural terrain!!!!
Ask yourself this how is it legal to ride a GSXR600 which is capable of over 170mph on public roads as it is taxed tested and insured, but i cant ride my gas gas which is capable of 25mph but will make a 7 year old child wet his pants with the thought of possibly riding one someday.
It is the government which has ruled these bikes as antisocial as they cannot get any revenue from them, how can you tax someone for enjoying themselves in the middle of a wood??? You cant and that is why they disapprove so much as it is free to anyone who wants to do it!!!!!
Then the public percieves them as ANTISOCIAL as they are against "THE LAW"
If you wish to fish then that is great and i agree that this is a fine passtime!! You need a license TAX if you dont have one then it is against "THE LAW"!!!!!! If you wish to camp then you can do this also, you will be charged for the priveledge which is TAXED!!! If there is anything else that you can think of to do that is any kind of fun then it is TAXED to the rafters.
Damn it you cant even go for a sunday afternoon drive in your car without TAX on the fuel that you burn which is currently 85%

I DO ONE THING "RIDE OFF ROAD" please gun me down as i am obviously a criminal to TAX laws. Even though i am paying tax on the fuel that i am burning!!!!
This is my country!!! I have payed for the right to live here and as long as i dont physically hurt anyone then i will use the countryside however i want to! If you have any complaints then ring the samaritans cos they would love to hear from you!!!!!!!!!!!
supertyke times have changed my friend, even since our generation we are trampled on as a nation and lead to believe that we are criminals for doing what is essentially just fun!!!!!

People have always ridden offroad at Flappits. Certainly since the 70s. And it's not 60 miles from Sheffield either. 40 at most.

Thing is Bazrippa, the lads who ride these bikes, certainly in our local woods, don't ride with any respect for either the woods, the wildlife or the other users of the woods. They ride at high speed, wheelspin and doughnut so tearing up the trails. They ride OFF the trails, churning up the grassy banks and the bluebells. They don't slow down or stop to let walkers, dogs and cyclists past, and they drop litter. If they rode responsibly and were friendly and respectful it wouldn't be so bad, although personally I'd still have issues with the noise and fumes.

As for offroad tracks nearby, get an OS map and look at the number of BOATS (Byeway open to all traffic) around Sheffield and the Eastern peak district. If you want a really good offroad area, which is perhaps a bit challenging and where you can ride to your heart's content, try Pin Dale behind the Hope Valley cement works. Not 10 miles from Sheffield and it's the equivalent of Flappits. Just give way to me and my mates when we ride through on mountain bikes! ;)

Whatever matey Flappits is closed to all motor vehicles as of August 2007!!!!!
The end of an Era!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

no, it may have been ignored but it was still an illegal riding place.

If you can't afford the extra expense of paying for a trailer/van and track time, you shouldn't have bought a bike in the first place, simple as.

You wouldn't expect the council to open up a dissused car park for racing car drivers to use would you?

So i take it that Speedway Dan is into speedway then?
So you did all of your riding on a track? That isnt cheap and to be honest mate it doesnt take any talent to ride sideways round an elongated circle.....
Get yourself to a track day on a tarmac bike mate and you will see how much of a racer you are!!!
What would you do if your Daddy didnt have money then Dan????
Probably would have been on parkwood on a DTR125!!!!!!
Yes i have been skint and i have always ridden responsibly!!!!!!!!

I am 32 my friend and i know all about BSA Bantams as they are used these days as pre 65 trials off road bikes, being single cylinder and the lightest in the category they were the best choice for Trials,.......It is the government which has ruled these bikes as antisocial....... how can you tax someone for enjoying themselves in the middle of a wood???

If you wish to fish - You need a license TAX
If you wish to camp you will be charged for the priveledge which is TAXED!!!
If there is anything else that is fun then it is TAXED to the rafters.

Damn it you cant even go for a sunday afternoon drive in your car without TAX on the fuel that you burn which is currently 85%

I DO ONE THING "RIDE OFF ROAD" please gun me down as i am obviously a criminal to TAX laws.
This is my country!!! I have payed for the right to live here and
i will use the countryside however i want to!

If you have any complaints then ring the samaritans cos they would love to hear from you!!!!!!!!!!!

.....we are criminals for doing what is essentially just fun!!!!!

I think you'll find that there was a factory made Bantam with a higher ground clearance - sump and exhaust guards - nobbly tyres - off road suspension and bars etc etc, I can't remember its name and I can't be arsed to find out.

MY D7 BANTAM was made for road use - of course you can customise virtually any vehicle to do virtually anything, but D7 bantams were made for roads.
By the way I've had many bikes since the Bantam, the last one being a Z900.

Some self delusion happening here mate if you are trying to believe that it's the government that are behind the 'antisocial' branding of off roading. - Just because they can't tax it!! What utter cakka. Tearing through the tranquil beauty of OUR woodlands may be some perverse sort of fun to you, but for me it's tantamount to terrorism. Don't you think that we've given over enough space to the motor vehicle?

I can't grasp why you think it's so outragous to PAY for hobbies.
Waterways, camp sites, most 'fun things' need to be maintained - at a cost.
What's so unbelievable about that?
And if I could get away with it I would happily 'gun you down' - for your selfishness staggers me. I think you will find that this is MY country too - and a few more people may have the same claim to it.

You say that because this is YOUR country, you will, 'use the countryside however you want to'. So I presume the same privilege extends to us all? Great, I might just nip out Derbyshire and knock up a summer house in the hills. I wonder how much I could get for it in a couple of years?
As for the Samaritans, I reckon it's you who could do with giving them a ring; your deluded power complex can only worsen...

Get yourself a map of our end of the Peak District and look for green lanes, as far as I am aware - and from the activities of a previous partner and his mates - off ride bikes are permitted to use these. OK the ramblers and the horsey set don't like it but green lanes aren't just for their pleasure. There used to be a club in Sheffield but sorry have no details, maybe you can find it on the net or other SF users - try Sheffield Bikers website....what happened to parkwood springs, I know that was used for off roading when I first moved to Sheffield. And above all keep safe on that bike. :D

Whatever matey Flappits is closed to all motor vehicles as of August 2007!!!!!
The end of an Era!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's a shame. My brother used to go there in the late 70s. It was perfect, out of the way on the moors near Haworth, and it meant he didn't ride in the woods around Pudsey (where we lived) and annoy people.

However, as I said, get thee to Pin Dale near Hope. It's a 40 minute drive from Sheffield, and you can ride to your heart's content without upsetting anyone. It's the South Yorkshire Flappits. :hihi:

Get yourself a map of our end of the Peak District and look for green lanes, as far as I am aware - and from the activities of a previous partner and his mates - off ride bikes are permitted to use these. :D

As stated before, only road-legal bikes can use them legally - as they are roads! It seems the OP has a problem with paying the tax to make his bike road legal, then again maybe the bike in question can't be easily made legal, I don't know. I do know that some MXers don't rate "green laning" much as an activity (though as a mountain biker I know some BOATS that would provide a challenge).

Sorry Baz, just read back over the last few posts, seems what I have said has already been suggested. The only other thing is to make the off-roader legal and then green lane on it, or stick to the Suzuki (oh, how I miss mine - it was set fire too by vigilante pensioners!!!!!).

Some self delusion happening here mate if you are trying to believe that it's the government that are behind the 'antisocial' branding of off roading. - Just because they can't tax it!! What utter cakka. Tearing through the tranquil beauty of OUR woodlands may be some perverse sort of fun to you, but for me it's tantamount to terrorism. Don't you think that we've given over enough space to the motor vehicle?..

So now it is Terrorism!!!!! Things have gotten silly again havn`t they.
Building summer houses in Derbyshire has got nothing to do with Off road motorcycling!!
If you wish to make a point about Summer houses then please start a new thread Entitled "WHY CANT I BUILD A SUMMER HOUSE".
Please keep to the point
Thanks

As stated before, only road-legal bikes can use them legally - as they are roads! It seems the OP has a problem with paying the tax to make his bike road legal, then again maybe the bike in question can't be easily made legal, I don't know. I do know that some MXers don't rate "green laning" much as an activity (though as a mountain biker I know some BOATS that would provide a challenge).
I have tried Green laning mate and quite honestly i would prefer to clean out the oven, it is boring!!
Trials bikes are specialist tools which are designed to be ridden over very tough and rugged terrain which no other bike would be capable of riding over.
To slap a tax disc and a number plate on it would be similar to attaching them to a washing machine as they are not for the road either!

I dont want to ride on muddy roads and go fast, i want to find a steep banking or a huge rockstep or both and try to make the bike go up and over it.
Hard for people to understand sometimes but to try it is to love it!

Sorry Baz, just read back over the last few posts, seems what I have said has already been suggested. The only other thing is to make the off-roader legal and then green lane on it, or stick to the Suzuki (oh, how I miss mine - it was set fire too by vigilante pensioners!!!!!).

Is that true about the pensioners????
Read my last post dude!

Is that true about the pensioners????
Read my last post dude!

Well lets put it this way...the pensioners had been complaining for ages, not necessarily only about the bike, about me, my lifestyle etc (why me, I am not at all that interesting or fascinating). I was woken at 2am by the fire bridgade to tell my my bike was on fire.....and the vigilante pensioners were there fully dressed at a time when their cocoa should have taken effect, they were watching my bike burn. Makes you think though don't it. I am just waiting for revenge....as soon as one of the ******** gets a zimmer frame I'll be in there making mischief. :hihi:

So now it is Terrorism!!!!! Things have gotten silly again havn`t they.
Building summer houses in Derbyshire has got nothing to do with Off road motorcycling!!
If you wish to make a point about Summer houses then please start a new thread Entitled "WHY CANT I BUILD A SUMMER HOUSE".
Please keep to the point
Thanks

The point is Bazrippa, that the land belongs to us ALL. And however much we would like to 'do what we like' with it, we HAVE TO CONSIDER OTHERS.
WE HAVE TO CONSIDER WILDLIFE. We have to consider the future.

I love biking but come on, you must know that it's wrong to off road in these PUBLIC places.

Your claim that 60% of young people in Sheffield are somehow forced to choose between being a junkie burglar and riding illegally out in green spaces is total nonsense. If young people have the money for the latest trainers/ computer games/ motorbikes etc, they have the money for constructive hobbies and interests, sports or activities. Young people have never had so much opportunity or available diversions. The problem is not 'out there', it is in the mentality of those who create such a narrow and bitter attitude to life.

How true you are.Well said my friend.

I dont want to ride on muddy roads and go fast, i want to find a steep banking or a huge rockstep or both and try to make the bike go up and over it.
Hard for people to understand sometimes but to try it is to love it!

Pin Dale, Baz. Pin Dale

I have 20 acres you could use in Dronfield for using your quad bike, motocross, landrover or tiials bike 077 889 32 889 Grant

I have 20 acres you could use in Dronfield for using your quad bike, motocross, landrover or tiials bike 077 889 32 889 Grant

where abouts is it please and whats the charge for moto x ?

Yes there are safe areas for kids to practice on. The whole 20 acres has been used as a trial ground for 50 years and there are flat areas and also lots of technical slopes for challenging the more experienced riders
I normally charge for a six month period. This is for simplicity, to control numbers and for safety.
Call me on 077 889 32 889 if you would like to speak to me or discuss use or charges. P.s. It also has campsite permission.

think we will have a trip over tomorrow if thats ok Grant