Wouldn't it be better to increase the cost of fuel and scrap car tax altogether.

I personally think it is a good idea for 2 reasons.

It eliminates car tax cheats.

If you use the road more, then you pay more since more fuel is consumed. Why should someone who use a car once a week pay the same as someone who uses it every day? They are less likely to cause wear and tear on roads.

What are your views on this?

Our fuel duty is already high enough thank you.

it sounds a good idea in theory, but then again, so does communism ;) :lol:

I must admit paying out £62 for a tiny little circle is quite painful to do for me but it would probably work out cheaper for me to pay this amount every 6 months than to put petrol up to subsidise this and i just do average mileage.

i believe road fund licence should be related to mileage. The more wear and tear you put on the road, the more you should pay.

The idea that some chap who uses his car for occasional outings and picking up some shopping now and again, should pay the same road fund licence fee as someone who drives 34,000 miles a year on british roads is a bit silly.

maybe use car trackers to calculate mileage. then all roads could be privatised and could institute transparent tolls. The new road maps would be a nightmare since they'd need to indicate the cost of driving on each road - maybe it could be standardised in bands for motorway, dual carriageway, single lane highway etc.

I just paid £92 for 6 months tax there is noway I would pay for 12 months tax I'm too worried that some thief would steal it.

Road tax has the advantage of discouraging people hanging on to wrecks, an eyesore and a safety hazard. Rather than taking my old banger to the scrap yard, hang on to it for emergencies for example. When the Road Tax bill arrives and it costs more than the car is worth it makes you reassess the sense in keeping the car.

The tory fuel tax escalator was a good idea, progressively raising the tax on car use and hence gradually increasing the incentive to use public transport, walk or cycle which have health and environment gains. At the same time high fuel consumption vehicles got taxed more heavily for polluting more. Labour made a mistake by trying to hang on to the fuel tax price escalator when world oil prices were growing fast so the petrol price was increasing anyway and the combination began to hurt too much, so they scrapped it rather than suspending it.

The Labour proposals to fit a tracker in every vehicle and charge us for miles travelled is stupid. It achieves almost the same as increasing the fuel price but:

One way or another, the motorist will pay for the in-car transponder

Much of the revenue raised will by absorbed by the cost of the technology and administration

It empowers the government to access records of where each one of us has been and when. Don't think they will? Remember how they named Rose Addis in parliament in breach of medical confidentiality (IDS had respected her anonymity).

It taxes a low fuel consumption car at the same rate as a gas guzzler. In contrast high fuel tax bears down harder on the rich.

There may be differential tax rates on different roads, so it might cost more to travel by motorway - pushing vehicles off onto country roads and small towns causing more accidents, pollution, congestion.

Running a car is very expensive, but the fact that public transport is so unbearable and degrading makes it all worthwhile. Standing out in the rain for a late bus waiting and waiting for it to arrive is not appealing at all. I don't understand where all the taxes go though. There are so many pot holes about it makes you wonder where the tax revenue is spent. Then you see the speed bumps, bus lanes for the 2 buses an hour, and the latest traffic 'calming' measures and it all makes sense. Motorists are paying to be forced off the same roads that they fund.

If the government want to take over the bus, train, tram and all other public transport system I will HAPPILY use public transport again.

So long as they subsidise it and make sure everything runs like clockwork!

Anyone ever see the episode of Harry Enfield and Chums where he plays Yurgen the German. He waiting at the bus stop and the bus is late.

"Zis is most strange"; "On Ze time table it's states quite clearly that zer iz a bus due every 5 minutes"; "But already I have been standing ere for 8 minutes and I am ogling ze horizon and zer iz NO bus in sight". "ZIZ WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED UNDER ZE NAZI'S"

Hillarious!

Well I don't know which buses you people use, but the 76, 97, 75 and 22 are all good, frequent buses that are neither unbearable nor degrading.

I think fuel tax should remain in order to dissuade gas guzzlers, and road fund licence should be mileage based so that light road users are not penalised.

Basically cars should be more expensive to use the more they travel and the more uneconomical they are.

bus lanes are great. There's nothing quite like the feeling of zipping past a long queue of traffic on Arundel Gate whilst relaxing to music on the MD player and reading a newspaper.

Well I get the tram to work usually and ok, it's a fairly smooth ride (apart from when it crashed nr Gleadless Townend, but I wont go into that)!

During the morning rush though it gets VERY crowded, VERY hot (even with windows open) and after 45 minutes (which is the journey time from mine to town) I am well p***** off but glad to be off the hell hole!

Taking my car takes only 30 mins (in rush hour traffic) to get to work, and I can have time by myself (or giving my fiancee a lift home too). I much prefer my car than the tram (especially in rush hour, over crowded trams).

I believe only 2% of the road fund licence (car tax) goes back into the roads.

90% of fuel cost is duty and you pay VAT on the fuel and ALSO VAT on the duty - so you are paying tax on tax!

People aren't going to give up their cars, so the government has us over a barrel to charge what they like.

Something should be done to tie it in with insurance, combining it together. The police would then instantly see who has insurance and who doesn't.

.....that's if the police were around to check!

Well it has been mooted to remove road tax and bring in tax based on milage done and the time you were doing it.

A detector would be fitted to your car and you would be charged per mile from (apparently ) 2p to 50p a mile. This would change during the day to manage transport down to avoid congestion.

Some insurance companies have also thoughts to go along this lines, so that the milage that you give them would be accurate and the less miles you do the cheaper your insurance would be.

Also whilst on about cars I think that cars should have an insurance disc showing in their vehicle to say they are insured next to the tax disc to show they ared covered.

bus lanes are great. There's nothing quite like the feeling of zipping past a long queue of traffic on Arundel Gate whilst relaxing to music on the MD player and reading a newspaper. [/B][/QUOTE]


You're a better driver than me, i find the paper obscures my view

Originally posted by Fraser Also whilst on about cars I think that cars should have an insurance disc showing in their vehicle to say they are insured next to the tax disc to show they ared covered. But you can't buy a tax disk without showing your insurance. The probelm is drivers caught without tax and/or insurance are treated too leniently and there is no attempt to check on them a few months later to see if they are now compliant.

Road Fund License should definitely be removed and put on fuel. All things being equal you will see an increase in overall income. 1 - you cannot avoid buying fuel. 2 - no admin needed.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme

bus lanes are great. There's nothing quite like the feeling of zipping past a long queue of traffic on Arundel Gate whilst relaxing to music on the MD player and reading a newspaper.

Next time I'm driving legally on arundel gate, I'll know who the tw** that thinks he is too good to queue up is then won't I?

Originally posted by Fraser
Also whilst on about cars I think that cars should have an insurance disc showing in their vehicle to say they are insured next to the tax disc to show they ared covered.

Except that it's the driver that has the insurance, not the car itself.

Originally posted by Phanerothyme

bus lanes are great. There's nothing quite like the feeling of zipping past a long queue of traffic on Arundel Gate whilst relaxing to music on the MD player and reading a newspaper.

Orignally posted by t020
Next time I'm driving legally on arundel gate, I'll know who the tw** that thinks he is too good to queue up is then won't I?


lol t020 you're just looking for reasons to denigrate me it seems - The reason I can zip past traffic on Arundel Gate in the bus lane and read a newspaper at the same time is because I'm not driving - the bus driver is.....

Did you honestly think I drive a car and read a newspaper at the same time?

Why go to all the trouble and expence of changing the present system? why not retain the staus quo?Why cause innumerable problems for ourselves and making it more complicated than it need be?

In the words of the prophet, if it aint broke, don't fix it!

Originally posted by Phanerothyme
lol t020 you're just looking for reasons to denigrate me it seems - The reason I can zip past traffic on Arundel Gate in the bus lane and read a newspaper at the same time is because I'm not driving - the bus driver is.....

Did you honestly think I drive a car and read a newspaper at the same time?

You'd be surprised how many drivers do that in the morning. Shave, eat breakfast, etc. Well, maybe you wouldn't be surprised. Nothing is that surprising these days.

Scrap road tax, put it on petrol at an amount worked out by average engine size, average annual mileage and Bob's yer uncle.

You only use it when you drive, high mileage, big engined cars (4x4 drivers on school runs, boy racers, bentley owners etc.) will pay the lion's share and the poor sap who's car is laid up for months at a time won't have to pay for what they're not using.

It may even cut down on speeders, badly tuned wrecks and encourage car sharing.

Originally posted by markham
Scrap road tax, put it on petrol at an amount worked out by average engine size, average annual mileage and Bob's yer uncle.

You only use it when you drive, high mileage, big engined cars (4x4 drivers on school runs, boy racers, bentley owners etc.) will pay the lion's share and the poor sap who's car is laid up for months at a time won't have to pay for what they're not using.

It may even cut down on speeders, badly tuned wrecks and encourage car sharing.

But we already pay one of the highest rates of fuel tax in the world?

Originally posted by markham
Scrap road tax, put it on petrol at an amount worked out by average engine size, average annual mileage and Bob's yer uncle.

You only use it when you drive, high mileage, big engined cars (4x4 drivers on school runs, boy racers, bentley owners etc.) will pay the lion's share and the poor sap who's car is laid up for months at a time won't have to pay for what they're not using.

It may even cut down on speeders, badly tuned wrecks and encourage car sharing.

It would also lead to old cars not being removed from the road. If it doesn't need to be taxed there is no incentive to get old heaps of junk off the road - they can be left in the way for free...

Originally posted by fnkysknky
It would also lead to old cars not being removed from the road. If it doesn't need to be taxed there is no incentive to get old heaps of junk off the road - they can be left in the way for free...

True - but it could be made law that you have to display something similar to a tax disc to show that the car has a valid MOT - with similar fines for not displaying same.

Nomme

Originally posted by halevan
Why go to all the trouble and expence of changing the present system? why not retain the staus quo?Why cause innumerable problems for ourselves and making it more complicated than it need be?

In the words of the prophet, if it aint broke, don't fix it! Cool Hal,
Your right whats the whole point, its not going to make things any better, it will just confuse matters.
Regarding taxing those that put more miles in well they already pay for that milage with the cost of fuel they have to put in the tank.

Taxing the motorist to death is not the answer to congestion.

British drivers regularly experience traffic jams on 19% of journeys, compared with 7% in France and 4% in Germany. Britain has doubled its motorway network in the last 30 years, but France on the other hand has quadrupled theirs. We need more roads and we need to stop penalising drivers for using the roads that they fund themselves.

One innovative idea the Lib Dems had a few years ago was to prevent students from bringing cars into the city when they came to University here. Perhaps they should have extended this to students who actually live here and use their cars where once upon a time they would have walked or cycled.

Needless to say when they actually ran the city, albeit briefly, we never heard of this scheme again.

Originally posted by max
One innovative idea the Lib Dems had a few years ago was to prevent students from bringing cars into the city when they came to University here. Perhaps they should have extended this to students who actually live here and use their cars where once upon a time they would have walked or cycled.

Needless to say when they actually ran the city, albeit briefly, we never heard of this scheme again.
I can't understand how students can afford to drive anyway. I sold my car before I came here because there would be no way I could afford insurance, petrol, tax and maintainence as well as food, books, beer etc. with just my student loan.

Originally posted by Sidla
I can't understand how students can afford to drive anyway. I sold my car before I came here because there would be no way I could afford insurance, petrol, tax and maintainence as well as food, books, beer etc. with just my student loan.

Don't exaggerate. Insurance and petrol can be high, especially at our age, but I'd much rather pay more money and be in the comfort of my own car than have to use the awful public transport system. Who knows what I'd catch and who I'd have to sit/ stand up next to? It also saves a lot of valuable time. Its horrible waiting in the cold and the rain for a bus thats always late.

I'm not exaggerating. My car must have cost me at least a quater of my wages in my 2 years out and I was being paid £10,000 a year. How people can afford to run a car on £3000 a year when you have to buy food and books, fund a social life and pay for accomodation (as many students have to), is beyond me.

What's wrong with walking? I happily walk a few miles around Sheffield each day. It's really not that painful and it's good exercise. Also I don't believe the public transport system is awful. I don't use it much, but when I do it's perfectly adequate. There's trains to Leicester every hour and regular transport to Meadowhall. That's all I need and I have no gripes about it.

Originally posted by t020
But we already pay one of the highest rates of fuel tax in the world?

That's right, but only as and when we use the stuff.

Originally posted by fnkysknky
It would also lead to old cars not being removed from the road. If it doesn't need to be taxed there is no incentive to get old heaps of junk off the road - they can be left in the way for free...

Not if the tax disk is replaced by an MOT disk which contains a bar coded owner's address.