Well does'nt it make us fell nice and safe that england is secure against terrorists. (sarcasm at it's best) Come on if Batman can beat security at the palace then I'm sure old osama can.

A father dressed as batman scaled the wall of Buckingham Palace to bring attention to his cause. It worked, but what sort of father is he to do such a dangerous, idiotic thing. Sounds like the kids are better off with out him! I wouldn't want him to have access to any children when he pulls stunts like that. PATHETIC!!

Originally posted by scrolling
A father dressed as batman scaled the wall of Buckingham Palace to bring attention to his cause. It worked, but what sort of father is he to do such a dangerous, idiotic thing. Sounds like the kids are better off with out him! I wouldn't want him to have access to any children when he pulls stunts like that. PATHETIC!!
the reason why this guys pulling stunts like this is to highlight the disgusting way a man can be treated after divorce unless you have been in this guys positon you can hardly pass comments like pathetic:mad:

I am a parent, why should fathers be treated any diffrent when they divorce or split up from their partners.They should have access the same as the other partner as long as the marriage did not end because of abuse.

Sometimes you have to do something radical to get your point across. I don`t see them hurting anyone else in trying to make their point.

These fathers want to be part of their childrens lives, they helped make them so why can`t they have better access.

As for saying the children would be better of without them because of the stupid thing they have done, don`t you believe something is worth fighting for. Do you have children?
If you feel that strongly for you children you will do almost anything and yes you do stupid things to fight for them, you only get them once in life.

These fellows are lucky not to have been killed.

Whilst I can understand their desire to have access to their kids, you have to look at whether a judge will look benignly on to someone who does such an irresponsible act.

The whole issue of parental access and the CSA needs looking at; this isn't the way to do it, though.

Joe

I totally agree with scrolling!
Fathers 4 Justice do themselves no favours the way they go about drawing attention to themselves.
I know that some fathers doget a rough deal when it comes to access with their children, but most of the fathersI know who do not have contact with their children are in that position through their own fault and in my humble opinion some fathers have too many rights - any absent father can walk back into their childs life whenever they feel like it regardless of what situation the child and mother are in - too me that is a right they should not have.

Originally posted by elf
Fathers 4 Justice do themselves no favours the way they go about drawing attention to themselves.
In that case they are lost both ways. Get their message across and be damned or be silent and ignored. I support them, and aslong as they aren't violent in their protest they are doing very little wrong.

Chris.

"In that case they are lost both ways. Get their message across and be damned or be silent and ignored. I support them, and aslong as they aren't violent in their protest they are doing very little wrong."

There are plenty of other ways to bring attention to a cause. They are causing potential harm to themselves. If he had fallen and killed himself, what good would that do the child?

Originally posted by scrolling
If he had fallen and killed himself, what good would that do the child?
The same could be said when he changes a light bulb, or climbs and ladder and cleans his windows. I know his act was extreme but its his choice what he does, it doesn't make him a bad parent.

Chris.

Originally posted by scrolling
"In that case they are lost both ways. Get their message across and be damned or be silent and ignored. I support them, and aslong as they aren't violent in their protest they are doing very little wrong."

There are plenty of other ways to bring attention to a cause. They are causing potential harm to themselves. If he had fallen and killed himself, what good would that do the child?

give me an example what else a person can do

I've said this on another thread, but the guy at Buckingham Palace was lucky the police didn't shoot him.

The same could be said when he changes a light bulb, or climbs and ladder and cleans his windows.

We all take risks every day. Crossing a road, driving a car, using electrical equipment, taking a bath. The difference is that those risks are more or less essential to our lives. Climbing up Buckingham Palace dressed like an idiot, surrounded by armed guards is not essential. It's stupid that could have easily left a child without a father.

"They do no harm" - Imagine the horror the Prime Minister and other MPs must have felt when they were pelted with a mystery powder. Nobody knew what that powder was - imagine the worry that must have caused to Cherie and the Blair children. I'm no fan of Blair but everyone has the right to be safe from danger while doing their job. Imagine, potentially, the trauma a policeman would experience if he did shoot one of these protesters. Sure, they do no harm.

Originally posted by Andy
I'm suprised the police didn't shoot that idiot. He could have been a suicide bomber or a terrorist.

Considering he strolled straight past them, they'd have probably hit the Queen.

Similar threads merged.

Andy

Being as they don`t get to see their children they have no other option than to do this.They have tried court amny times.

For some of them their children don`t know their dads and therefore it makes no diffrence to them how they protest.

Have you been divorced, it ain`t nice and even if you have done nothing wrong but you can`t live together anymore more often than not the female partner gets the kids and the father gets ignored.

We all have things in our lives that we don't like, or feel are unfair. The difference is how we deal with them. Sensible people don't throw powder-bombs at the Prime Minister, or climb up the front of Buckingham Palace.

I would argue that anyone who does that kind of thing is not fit to be a parent anyway.

I wonder, if these people spent had put as much effort into their marriages as they do into their silly stunts, maybe they wouldn't be in the situation they are in today.

Hmm... what's the old saying... never judge a man (person) until you've walked a mile in their shoes...

When it comes to love, be it for kids, or family, or friends/lovers/etc... people do extreme things...

Can't say I really agree with the whole, let's be passive and sit on our arses approach from "scrolling" though... yes it was dangerous but to no-one else but themselves... and I note, there's been no suggestions of alternative actions..


If they're barely getting any contact with their kids then what use their being alive, etc... Plenty of arguements for and against..


At the end of the day though, I can't help but think some people on here are b*tching purely because they didn't like their nice quiet lives intruded on by a topic that they couldn't give 2 hoots about because it doesn't affect them... Yet!

Posted by Alchresearch
Considering he strolled straight past them, they'd have probably hit the Queen.

Would have been one hell of a shot as she is currently in Balmoral.

However as they say there's no such thing as bad publicity. These guys are just trying to bring attention to a very poor situation.

These "men" are behaving like nothing more than cantankerous children themselves. They don't deserve to have children! What else can they do? Learn how to put on a condom!

These fathers obvously to have alot of growing up to do. They are not responsible for their own actions. How can they possibly take responsibility for a child?

Scrolling you really make my blood boil,you have no idea what these men are going through,I am going through a similar situation and I know how hard it is to get a fair hearing in the courts.
Until you have been through what we have then keep your opinions to yourself.

Originally posted by royjames
Scrolling you really make my blood boil,you have no idea what these men are going through,I am going through a similar situation and I know how hard it is to get a fair hearing in the courts.
Until you have been through what we have then keep your opinions to yourself.

Roy, didn't you say in the "Is Marriage Still Valid?" thread that you don't like or want children?

Regarding the Fathers For Justice group, I think dads should have access to their kids if they want to see them, but I don't see how "equal" access (ie the kids spend the same amount of time living with each parent, as proposed by the Tory party recently) would work in situations where one or both of the parents have remarried. Wouldn't that be putting the parents' interests above those of the children?

Fathers for justice can use the methods which all other protest groups use which are legal and not such a pain in the arse. Doing what they are doing is probably just proving the point that they are irresponsible and should have limited access to their children.

Why shouldn't mothers have the majority of custody to their children, it is ususally them that does the majority of the upbringing anyway- that is why you don't see any mothers out protesting in stupid costumes for their rights, because we are too busy looking after the kids.

It is very very hard to end up in the position where a court denies a father access - the courts will always try to maintain contact for both parents, so maybe these men should concentrate on trying to be better parents!

Originally posted by elf
Fathers for justice can use the methods which all other protest groups use which are legal and not such a pain in the arse. Doing what they are doing is probably just proving the point that they are irresponsible and should have limited access to their children.

Why shouldn't mothers have the majority of custody to their children, it is ususally them that does the majority of the upbringing anyway- that is why you don't see any mothers out protesting in stupid costumes for their rights, because we are too busy looking after the kids.

It is very very hard to end up in the position where a court denies a father access - the courts will always try to maintain contact for both parents, so maybe these men should concentrate on trying to be better parents!
to be brutally honest the above is complete and utter crap ive learned through experience that the present system is flawed put it this way a woman could be a drug addict. prostitute and she would still get custody now where is the fairness in that:mad: :mad:

scrolling

Have you got children have you ever been divorced, if not why do you think you have any idea what it is like when you can`t see your children.

They are being responsible because they are not just accepting what the court and their ex partner have dealt them.
Being responsible for having children means wanting and being allowed to take part in their lives. School plays, parents evenings and just going shopping with them.When this is taken away part of you is taken away and you would, believe me fight to get that piece back.

They hurt no one else and endangered no one else.

I give them my support as a mum and a divorcee. I know what the seperation feels like do you?

Yeah but you also get the situation where the father will just make life as awkward as possible and be a pain in the arse to make the mother unhappy.

If the father really does care about the kids, sometimes the best thing to do is just to step back and let the kids and mother get on with their lives in peace.

Its not always the father that loses out - I have a good female friend who lost custody of her child, she just has to get on and make the best of the situation, I am sure there are other women in her position too, you don't see them doing all this stupid stuff.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by panda79
to be brutally honest the above is complete and utter crap ive learned through experience that the present system is flawed put it this way a woman could be a drug addict. prostitute and she would still get custody now where is the fairness in that


Well she must have been able to look after the child well otherwise it would have been taken into care wouldn't it?

Originally posted by elf
[QUOTE]Originally posted by panda79
to be brutally honest the above is complete and utter crap ive learned through experience that the present system is flawed put it this way a woman could be a drug addict. prostitute and she would still get custody now where is the fairness in that


Well she must have been able to look after the child well otherwise it would have been taken into care wouldn't it?
its attitudes like that why they are organisations like ffj

elf

Why would the child be taken into care, I know of loads where I live that have a mum as a single parent and have custody but also do drugs.

The first priority is the child or children to the mum, it`s to do with bonding.

I divorced had two children and one came with me and one stayed with his dad. I know what it`s like and how you feel when you are split up from your child.

The courts ask the dad for money to support the child yet they give full access the majority of the time to the mum. You have to ask why?

Courts and the system are rubbish and should be changed to allow the fathers and in some cases the mothers better access that way the children will be brought up feeling wanted and not used as pawns.
It is after all the children we should think about and I am sure the children want both parents and not just one.

My brother in law is going through this kinda situation at the moment...

Why should fathers suffer?

There are 3 main hero's in a kids life Batman Superman & Spiderman...

Jason (Batman) has spent 6 hours in the past 3 years with his kids... I feel he has the right to do something about it... ok its a bit expreme... But to want something so badly in life i think most people would do almost anything to get it... I know i would!

If i were to be cut off from my kids... (if i had them which i dont at the moment) but should i have... i know i would do anything in my power to see them...

If i had to dress up and take a stand for my kids believe i would...

2 people bring kids into this world why should it be 1 person that gets a say?

Well all the arguements I could have predicted have come out...

Yes there are some absolutely crap fathers out there who will use any and all legal recourses as nuisance factors for their ex wives/partners and really don't give a hooha about that kids involved...

Yes there are some unfit fathers and frankly I doubt that the courts are so stupid as to not place a child with the father if the mother is deemed unfit when the alternative is care...

Just remember that all the points being made about fathers are equally applicable to mothers and all that rubbish about the mums always being the primary care giver is just that... rubbish... There are more and more "house husbands" nowadays and with a lot of couples both working full time and having to put their children in nursery, childcare, etc... while they both work, there's no arguement at all now for anything other than equal consideration...


All of that said though, what on earth was that muppet on about last night regarding the money pit and jobs for solicitors, family courts, etc.. If anyone did damage to the FFJ cause it was him... He hadn't a clue...

But can't you see it from the mothers point of view, when you know that your childs father doesn't care for the kid properly, when they consistently cause grief and anguish because of their half arsed attempts at parenting, when you know that both you and the child would be better off if the father was cut out totally while the child is growing up.

Originally posted by elf
But can't you see it from the mothers point of view, when you know that your childs father doesn't care for the kid properly, when they consistently cause grief and anguish because of their half arsed attempts at parenting, when you know that both you and the child would be better off if the father was cut out totally while the child is growing up.
I think you missed my point... There is ample proof that there are equally as many mothers who do nothing but use their children as a source of torment for their ex partner and think nothing of the childs welfare...

You're right that there are fathers like that but to tar all fathers and also ignore that mothers are equally human and responsible/irresponsible is blinkered and short sighted at best.

Originally posted by Martin_s
I think you missed my point... There is ample proof that there are equally as many mothers who do nothing but use their children as a source of torment for their ex partner and think nothing of the childs welfare...

You're right that there are fathers like that but to tar all fathers and also ignore that mothers are equally human and responsible/irresponsible is blinkered and short sighted at best.

Some Mothers look at it in a way of getting money without having to work... A father has the right to see their children

Its so unfair that when a couple get divorced or separate that the children have to suffer the consequences because their Mother no longer loves their Father...

Its upsetting to know that there are very young children out there that dont or cant have a say as their too young... They have no understanding in what is going on around them and in the long run they have to suffer...

This is why the Fathers are having to act and get their own point across...

Fathers deserve Justice!

Originally posted by Angel05
the children have to suffer the consequences because their Mother no longer loves their Father...
... and vice versa...

Let's be fair here, in the most part this isn't just about dads or mums it's about equality of worth for both parties...

Good grief - no harm was done!

OK, so the guy scaled the wall of her house - I think if someone dressed in a Batman costume tried to scale the wall of my house, I'd see the funny side of it. I certainly wouldn't expect him to be shot, for goodness sake!

I'm more perplexed as to why such an anachronistic figure (the queen) should get so much security anyway, when she's no more or less important than any one of us.

Originally posted by Martin_s
... and vice versa...

Let's be fair here, in the most part this isn't just about dads or mums it's about equality of worth for both parties...

I was going to put vice versa but in alot of cases it is on the Mothers side that once a divorce or separation has occured they do come to some agreement of the Father seeing their child/children... but once the Mother has a new partner in her life it causes problems... So the Mother then takes the rights away from Father of seeing his children on a regular basis...

I am no expert on this... but i have my brother in law and a few friends who are in this position... Its heartbreaking to hear and see that they cannot have permission from their ex's to see their own flesh & blood...

I do realise also that there can be circumstances too...

Originally posted by Hodge
Good grief - no harm was done!

OK, so the guy scaled the wall of her house - I think if someone dressed in a Batman costume tried to scale the wall of my house, I'd see the funny side of it. I certainly wouldn't expect him to be shot, for goodness sake!

I'm more perplexed as to why such an anachronistic figure (the queen) should get so much security anyway, when she's no more or less important than any one of us.

Like Robin said the're not terrorists there simply doing something to win the right of seeing their own children... And would not cause harm or damage

Batman is a hero after all... ;)