This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.

Having never been racially insulted before I dont really no what it would feel like but I am very sure I would just take it as an insult.

You are asking for bother there posting that here sits back and looks with :!:ntrest

This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.


Racism is commonly defined as a belief or doctrine where inherent biological differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, with a corollary that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.[1]

The term racism is sometimes used to refer to preference for one's own ethnic group (ethnocentrism),[2] fear of foreigners (xenophobia), views or preferences against interbreeding of the races (miscegenation),[3] and nationalism,[4], and/or a generalization of a specific group of people (stereotype); regardless of any explicit belief in superiority or inferiority embedded within such views or preferences. Racism has been used in attempts to justify social discrimination, racial segregation and violence, including genocide. Politicians are known to practice race-baiting in an effort to win constituents.

The term racist, when used to describe someone who supports racism, has been a pejorative term since at least the 1940s, and the identification of a group or person as racist is nearly always controversial.

Without knowing the exact context of why that person said what they did, I'd say yes it is quite racist. I say this as a non-white person.

personally i believe if you think it's racist then it is, i have thick skin so comments made to me like that would just brush off my shoulders!

remember

"sticks and stones may break your bones, but names will never hurt me!!:thumbsup:

This is not racism in my opinion because racism needs a particular socio-political context for it to exist. White citizens of a white majority country which has for hundreds of years exploited and pillaged asian and African countries (don't forget Ireland) has no right to cry "racism" at the drop of a hat when someone decides they've had enough and throws an insult back at them. It is just that, though, an insult. A stupid pathetic one maybe but it is not racism in my book.

On the other hand, Macpherson defines a racist incident as one which a person perceives as racist and so by this definition the comment was racist. however I don't subscribe to this view even though I have to (and do) implement it at work.

This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.

It makes me laugh, these people would be the first to cry foul should you have racially abused them.

The only people who come out with this crap are people who have a chip on their shoulders or suffer a major inferiority complex because of their colour, yet choose to perpetuate abuse for themselves, others and generations to come. It's an advert that basically says "I am stupid".

It makes me laugh, these people would be the first to cry foul should you have racially abused them.

The only people who come out with this crap are people who have a chip on their shoulders or suffer a major inferiority complex because of their colour, yet choose to perpetuate abuse for themselves, others and generations to come. It's an advert that basically says "I am stupid".
Yes - racism claims are only supported against white people in this country thanks to the ridiculously PC-obsessed government, with its sickening obsession of bowing down to the loud and contantly winging minorities.

There is no excuse for it either way but due to the polotical nature of this country: If a white individual verbaly directs a typicaly 'racist' insult at a black individual then it is racist (fair enough out of order). If they direct any kind of 'non-racist' insult at a black individual it is made out to be racist (not fair). If a black individual directs a racist insult at the white person they simply get away with it (takes the p**s)!

It doesn't bother me being called white anything, I spend a lot of time in Bradford and hear these comments going both ways between people very frequently. It's no worse than being called fat, bald, ginger, four eyed, ugly, lanky, short a*** or whatever, it's just another word intended to insult and doesn't deserve special treatment as the giver of the insult just wants to be rude.

It's not being called white or black that is the insult it's the words that accompany it that are the insults and they apply to everyone regardless of race. Whether or not the receiver of the insult is offended is highly subjective and they should decide that for themselves but it may well be that some people find comments more insulting than was intended and vice versa, depends on the context.

Yeah, I would say this was racist remark. If you insult someone, for whatever reason, why do you need to highlight their race within that insult if you weren't having a dig at their race???

Yeah, I would say this was racist remark. If you insult someone, for whatever reason, why do you need to highlight their race within that insult if you weren't having a dig at their race???Any insult is having a dig or it isn't an insult. Someone on here called me a lying, hypocritical, idiotic, moron the other day, if he'd put white into it, it wouldn't make any difference. It's just another dig aimed at insulting and offending me.

Any insult is having a dig or it isn't an insult. Someone on here called me a lying, hypocritical, idiotic, moron the other day, if he'd put white into it, it wouldn't make any difference. It's just another dig aimed at insulting and offending me.

surely it would. why would it be relevant to point out the colour of someone in the middle and/or in the same line of insults? surely, their colour is irrelevant whether you are calling them stupid, thick or whatever. The person on the receiving end know their ethnicity so why should it be pointed out!!!!!

surely it would. why would it be relevant to point out the colour of someone in the middle and/or in the same line of insults? surely, their colour is irrelevant whether you are calling them stupid, thick or whatever. The person on the receiving end know their ethnicity so why should it be pointed out!!!!!
So does a person who is fat or ugly. Those comments aren't relevant either, there is no courtesy in insulting or it isn't an insult.

there is no courtesy in insulting or it isn't an insult.

I agree, but the OP asked whether it was just an insult or racial. The fact that the perpetrator used the colour of the person and added that to the insult makes it racist, in my opinion.

I agree, but the OP asked whether it was just an insult or racial. The fact that the perpetrator used the colour of the person and added that to the insult makes it racist, in my opinion. I think it's a just rhetorical question we don't know the context. As ever it comes down to the definition of racist and it doesn't meet my criteria.

I think it's a just rhetorical question we don't know the context. As ever it comes down to the definition of racist and it doesn't meet my criteria.

This is obviously subjective so we'll agree to disagree then :)

By definition, the mention of colour in a derogatory sentence makes it racist.

By definition, the mention of colour in a derogatory sentence makes it racist.

What, like "I hate black olives because they taste awful".

(Actually, I love olives).

By definition, the mention of colour in a derogatory sentence makes it racist.
So what offends a Zebra then when people mention colour?

By definition, the mention of colour in a derogatory sentence makes it racist.

It makes the insult a racist insult, but it doesn't make the person throwing the insult a racist person.

Case in point, Mr. Ron Atkinson, who was kicked off television for calling someone a useless ****** ******* (or similar).

If the guy he was insulting happened to be from London, he would've called him a useless Cockney *******; from Scotland, a useless Scottish *******; from Germany, a useless Kraut *******; and so on, and so on. Because the guy happened to be black, he called him a useless ****** *******. So what? He should be dealt with for having insulted someone, but to call him a racist is patently silly.

It makes the insult a racist insult, but it doesn't make the person throwing the insult a racist person.

Case in point, Mr. Ron Atkinson, who was kicked off television for calling someone a useless ****** ******* (or similar).

If the guy he was insulting happened to be from London, he would've called him a useless Cockney *******; from Scotland, a useless Scottish *******; from Germany, a useless Kraut *******; and so on, and so on. Because the guy happened to be black, he called him a useless ****** *******. So what? He should be dealt with for having insulted someone, but to call him a racist is patently silly.Yes and Ron Atkinsons record of being one of the first managers to recruit black players shows him to not be a racist and yet he was pilloried by the media for a throwaway remark. This misinterpreting of the racist issue has to be one of the worst blights of our times.

Yes and Ron Atkinsons record of being one of the first managers to recruit black players shows him to not be a racist and yet he was pilloried by the media for a throwaway remark. This misinterpreting of the racist issue has to be one of the worst blights of our times.

Indeed !

Colour of course has not very much to do with 'race', - amongst 'black' people there are many clearly different racial origins in Africa; - Masai, Hottentots, Pigmies etc.

And I've never heard 'brown' used in a racist context, yet most Middle Eastern and Asian people can only be described as such as far as their colour is concerned.

Calling an Asian a 'brown balustrade' is as ridiculous as calling me a white one ;)

And I've never heard 'brown' used in a racist context, yet most Middle Eastern and Asian people can only be described as such as far as their colour is concerned.

In this country, at least, the preferred stupid epithet for anyone of Middle Eastern or Asian etiquette is "Paki."

Which only goes to show that how these words come to be USED has no bearing on what they actually MEAN.

In this country, at least, the preferred stupid epithet for anyone of Middle Eastern or Asian etiquette is "Paki."

Which only goes to show that how these words come to be USED has no bearing on what they actually MEAN.

I doubt very much whether the word 'Paki' is now in general use as you appear to think. I cannot remember the last time I heard anyone, or indeed read about anyone, using it. The preferred current description of anyone from the Indian sub continent or from the Middle East is more likely to be 'Asian'.

I doubt very much whether the word 'Paki' is now in general use as you appear to think. I cannot remember the last time I heard anyone, or indeed read about anyone, using it. The preferred current description of anyone from the Indian sub continent or from the Middle East is more likely to be 'Asian'.
In Bradford and Leeds where I spend a lot of term that word is common parlance in all kinds of social circles by all types of people. I have often heard it used by Pakistanis and other Asians when describing people and it's not been said as an insult but as a description.

well i wouln't be insulted - i would reply, yes i am a white person but unfortunately no longer f***

bloody hell grow up its racist simple as

bloody hell grow up its racist simple as
Don't shout, it's frightfully rude.

Don't shout, it's frightfully rude.
cool:thumbsup:

cool:thumbsup:

You're welcome.

bloody hell grow up its racist simple as
Who the f** do you think you are walking into a conversation and bellowing like that. That is far more rude and ignorant than making a remark which might pertain to race.

Who the f** do you think you are walking into a conversation and bellowing like that. That is far more rude and ignorant than making a remark which might pertain to race.
are didems you do seem a little fragile today

are didems you do seem a little fragile todayQED.......

at least you get strait to the point not rant on with 200 words saying the same thing

This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.

I personally would say try harder as surely most people could think of a better insult/racist comment than this towards whites?

by using the word white in the swearing its become racist,without the white word its an insult

has anyone ever witnessed asian v asian racism?. iv'e witnessed it on a few occassions and it shocked me. it seems that indian people don't always like pakistanis or hindus and vice versa. i just assumed that ethnic groups got along quite well but this is not always so.

I doubt very much whether the word 'Paki' is now in general use as you appear to think. I cannot remember the last time I heard anyone, or indeed read about anyone, using it. The preferred current description of anyone from the Indian sub continent or from the Middle East is more likely to be 'Asian'.:) what a pleasantly sheltered life you have sir, i myself must hear that word several times per day,i suppose it depends on where you live,around here it is common usage to refer to the local off licence as the paki shop

:) what a pleasantly sheltered life you have sir, i myself must hear that word several times per day,i suppose it depends on where you live,around here it is common usage to refer to the local off licence as the paki shopI think that means that many of us are sheltered - might I ask which palatial estate you live on?

:) what a pleasantly sheltered life you have sir, i myself must hear that word several times per day,i suppose it depends on where you live,around here it is common usage to refer to the local off licence as the paki shop
That is not used in a derogeraty fashion, not by most people anyway.
It is a description of the shop and the people running it.
It is quicker to say than 'The shop on the corner run by those hardworking people, which is open all hours and sells almost everything you could possibly require, even on Christmas Day.' :)

That is not used in a derogeraty fashion, not by most people anyway.
It is a description of the shop and the people running it.
It is quicker to say than 'The shop on the corner run by those hardworking people, which is open all hours and sells almost everything you could possibly require, even on Christmas Day.' :)

I prefer to say "I am just nipping down to the shop that sells out of date stock whilst the shopkeeper chats away on his mobile in another language throughout a cash exchange that will inevitably result in me having to pick coins up off the floor............................................. ...........that is if its even open".

I prefer to say "I am just nipping down to the shop that sells out of date stock whilst the shopkeeper chats away on his mobile in another language throughout a cash exchange that will inevitably result in me having to pick coins up off the floor............................................. ...........that is if its even open".
Yes, that is also a valid description, it is much quicker to say the paki shop.
When the corner shops were run by English people, we always called the shop after the name of its owners, as this was usually the name on the shop wall.
People do not seem to use their own name anymore for the name of the shop.
They are all 'Spar' or something

Aw grow up the lot of you, with your comments folliwng mine, when referring to people, colour only becomes neccesary to distinguish one from another or in racist comments.
My family are from a multi cultural background so my education about racist comments is broader than most white peoples.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.
Would you be insulted more if the non-white person being lower down the social ladder or working class like for example a taxi driver as opposed to the offender being a few rungs higher like say Naseem Hamed?
I would expect that the insult felt to be greater when you feel looked down upon for other reasons as well as colour.

Would you be insulted more if the non-white person being lower down the social ladder or working class like for example a taxi driver as opposed to the offender being a few rungs higher like say Naseem Hamed?
I would expect that the insult felt to be greater when you feel looked down upon for other reasons as well as colour.
sad a racist coment is just that nothing to do with status and who is this Naseem Hamed anouther jumped up little freak (note no colour involved in my reply)

a few rungs higher like say Naseem Hamed?.Rungs higher????
Do you seriously see that jumped up little criminal as being higher than anything in the social scale?

In my opinion yes, it has nothing to do with the point.

I believe
"f***ing white person"
"f***ing black person"
"f***ing <insert colour here> person"
...all to be racist.

However don't care either, people can call me a wigger or whatever it is until the cows come home... doesn't bother me.

By definition, the mention of colour in a derogatory sentence makes it racist.

I agree. If there was no racial intent then why bring colour into it??
If I said you feckin Irish ****
by highlighting the fact the person is Irish, in the context of the insult, is a way of adding to the insult!

If i said that black guy over there asked me the time. that would not b racist.

Would you be insulted more if the non-white person being lower down the social ladder or working class like for example a taxi driver as opposed to the offender being a few rungs higher like say Naseem Hamed?
I would expect that the insult felt to be greater when you feel looked down upon for other reasons as well as colour.

Naseem would need to stand on a box to look down on most other people, but that disadvantage is of course more than compensated for by his moral rectitude. :rolleyes:

If I was ever referred to to as a white bitch, which I have been on many occasions, I would look upon it as a term of enderement...............my fellow black and Asian friends may see it as something else...................

This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.

it is rasist.. as it uses colour! come on, its obvious! i would never use colour as an insult. ( my husband is ' a non white person'). i just call him a useless waste of space!! when in a good mood!!

cloudbay your a very big white bitch. love the sig ;)

If I was ever referred to to as a white bitch, which I have been on many occasions, I would look upon it as a term of enderement...............my fellow black and Asian friends may see it as something else...................

what?:confused: :confused: if my husband called me that i would lamp him one!! how can you see that as a term of endearment?:confused: :confused:

what?:confused: :confused: if my husband called me that i would lamp him one!! how can you see that as a term of endearment?:confused: :confused:

I never take life that seriously

well if your friends see it as an insult .. why dont you? its not about taking life that seriously!! I was just curious at to why you didnt feel offended..

cloudbay your a very big white bitch. love the sig ;)


I so love those who love me ...............:hihi:

well if your friends see it as an insult .. why dont you? its not about taking life that seriously!! I was just curious at to why you didnt feel offended..

I never said they did, did I? We are not talking in definitive terms here. I'm probably the least offended person on the planet.

If I was ever referred to to as a white bitch, which I have been on many occasions, I would look upon it as a term of enderement...............my fellow black and Asian friends may see it as something else...................

no you didnt. i was just using your quote... and response. never mind ( great pic by the way). was just curious...

Due to the nature of some of the replys I'm not going to post the link to the other forum as I don't want them to have the problems that I can see coming.

The thread was a result of a thread on a chinese forum about the word "gwai lo"
It means white person and in it's self is in no way an insult.
(direct translation is something like ghost man but chinese languages are descriptive like that)

My argument on that thread was that "gwai lo" is fine but when coupled with an insult it becomes racist.
"Pok gai gwai lo" (would translate to F**King White guy) as said in a brandon lee film was a racist comment as it used race as part of the insult.

The other side of the coin was my argument that while I understand the word chink to be upsetting but many english people just use it as slang for a take away and mean no harm.
That's not to excuse it's use but does explain it.

My argument on that thread was that "gwai lo" is fine but when coupled with an insult it becomes racist.
"Pok gai gwai lo" (would translate to F**King White guy) as said in a brandon lee film was a racist comment as it used race as part of the insult.

It's still just an insult and isn't racist, they just say a word that comes into their head because they want to insult you. It is simply a way of saying "I insult you" but a bit more forceful. A lot of these words are slang rather than racist but have been misinterpreted as racism by people who have neither said it nor been on receiving end of it. I deal with people of other races all day long and they only cry racist when it suits them for other reasons which is very unusual. I have heard Pakistanis use the word Paki, Chinese use Chink and Black people say ****** many times in everyday conversation.

Pakistanis and Indians incidentally criticise one another quite a lot and don't get on especially well as "races" but as individuals they do which is often the case with all races.

I have heard Pakistanis use the word Paki, Chinese use Chink and Black people say ****** many times in everyday conversation.
That because's they know what it means, and in an odd way, reclaiming such words to desensitize it. The younger generation can relate less to racism than the older generation who encountered such words usage. My cousins uses the ch!nky word to each other, and they laugh about it. Though, I'd imagine they would be shell-shocked if some stranger say in London shouts this at them.

That because's they know what it means, and in an odd way, reclaiming such words to desensitize it. Which is a good thing as there always has been and always will be slang terms for foreigners or other races which the people they pertain to also use such as Aussies, poms, yanks etc .

Rungs higher????
Do you seriously see that jumped up little criminal as being higher than anything in the social scale?Was only an example. :hihi:
That is exactly my point, of being insulted more by the offender's own estimation of himself as better than you, that brings the attitude of, who the hell does he think he is to call me that? From some of the other replys too I feel that people would be offended more by some jumped up criminal passing such comment than by a normal person.

we have an asian guy on my building site who last week misplaced his car keys. when he eventually found them he said i can't help being a daft paki. according to him that word is not an insult and as an indian he accepts that people generalise about asians by calling them paki regardless of their race.

In conversation with my landlord a while ago, about repairs to the property, and who should pay for the work, he laughingly said I was like a paki. I was quite taken aback to hear that word said really, so I asked him what he meant. He said "We don't like paying money out on other people's property either, that's why you don't find many pakis living on council estates".

I personally feel that using the terms "paki shop" and "chinky" aren't insulting/racist, just descriptions of a type of establishment like "irish pub" or "italian restaurant" but I wouldn't say the first and I've learned from SF that chinese people resent the word "chinky" and would prefer us to say "chinese takeway". Calling someone whatever (fat/gay/lesbian/ impotent/thick mick/ paki/ black/ *******) if you're in an argument with them, is sort of defensible, as you often say the things you hope will cut the deepest even when you don't mean them, and is just an insult.

I think racism is like sexism, it's an attitude of mind and you can never do anything right for that person, who will always think you're inferior to them and uses every opportunity to bring you down. It's horrible to have to live with that but I really don't think you can do very much to alter the mindset of those people.

I mean women have been around for a lot longer than most immigrants :P and yet you see casual sexism everyday on this Forum and no-one turns a hair. These things are just a fact of life, I'm afraid.

I think the most disturbing use of the intended insult 'white person' is when used within ethnic communities - for instance when a child of Caribbean extraction is mocked and chided for acting 'white', meaning they try hard at school or don't like the sentiments of gangster rap, or whatever. If a young black person (don't know enough about other cultural groups to comment) wants to go into a profession or pathway that's not common in their community they can be branded a 'coconut' or 'bounty bar' (i.e. white on the inside.) I've known this attitude to be fed to children from their own mothers, and just reinforces a feeling of otherness or a culture of underachievement. Why can't success, worthwhile values and positive attributes be seen as non-culture specific? It depresses me. :|

'coconut' or 'bounty bar' (i.e. white on the inside.)|The irony there being that everyone is the same on the inside which is why racism is such a confusing and misunderstood concept.

This question is a lead from a thread on another forum that I will post a link to later so you can see the context of the question.

If a non white person called you a f***ing white person would you consider it racist or just an insult as the white person part is just a fact ?

Honest non racist answers please.
if anybody called me a f@@@ing anything then they can expect an open can of asswhoopery!

we have an asian guy on my building site who last week misplaced his car keys. when he eventually found them he said i can't help being a daft paki. according to him that word is not an insult and as an indian he accepts that people generalise about asians by calling them paki regardless of their race.
I dont know what the humph is. We are English because we are from England. They are Pakis because they are from Pakistan. Italians from Italy etc etc. Just people moaning `cos theyve got nothing better to do.

I dont know what the humph is. We are English because we are from England. They are Pakis because they are from Pakistan. Italians from Italy etc etc. Just people moaning `cos theyve got nothing better to do.

Just being pedantic,really, I suppose. But the correct term would then be Pakistani. But they aren't actually from Pakistan or Italy, are they? They're from England/UK too.

How many generations is one supposed to label like this before one stops using the indentifier? People used to say Eye-ties when I was little, but I've never heard anyone use the term for years. So say, 50 years, then? Fifty years too long imo.

I mean women have been around for a lot longer than most immigrants :P and yet you see casual sexism everyday on this Forum and no-one turns a hair.

like what rubes?

Just being pedantic,really, I suppose. But the correct term would then be Pakistani. But they aren't actually from Pakistan or Italy, are they? They're from England/UK too.

How many generations is one supposed to label like this before one stops using the indentifier? People used to say Eye-ties when I was little, but I've never heard anyone use the term for years. So say, 50 years, then? Fifty years too long imo.

ruby, the difference of course is that the Italians (or Poles or Ukrainians etc) who came to the UK after the War were quite quickly assimilated into the general population and their descendants are indistinguishable from indigenous British people, apart from their names.

Six factors have prevented the same thing happening to Pakistani immigrants and their descendants: firstly, the insularity, and tenacious adherence of the Pakistani community to the cultural practices of their original homeland; secondly, the strong physical links which Pakistanis tend to maintain with this original homeland (through family visits, property ownership and marriage etc); thirdly, the doctrine of multiculturalism, which has provided an ideological sanction, and which has even promoted, the above; fourthly, the 'uniform of colour'; fifthly, the sheer size of the Pakistani community, which has enabled it to resist assimilation in a way which much smaller communities would have found far more difficult; and sixthly, the rise of an increasingly strident Islamism, which, among other things, has promoted a culture of difference and separation from the wider community.

I remember once while on a GNER train to London a pensioner of about 80 could not find her ticket so the conducter (who happened to be a black guy) said "bloody white trash you should have your own ticket!!!"

Now if thats not considered racist then i don't know what is?!

This is not racism in my opinion because racism needs a particular socio-political context for it to exist. White citizens of a white majority country which has for hundreds of years exploited and pillaged asian and African countries (don't forget Ireland) has no right to cry "racism" at the drop of a hat when someone decides they've had enough and throws an insult back at them. It is just that, though, an insult. A stupid pathetic one maybe but it is not racism in my book.

On the other hand, Macpherson defines a racist incident as one which a person perceives as racist and so by this definition the comment was racist. however I don't subscribe to this view even though I have to (and do) implement it at work.

I've never pillaged an African or Asian country so why should I accept being insulted with racism? What if it happened in a context in which I was outnumbered and became for that instant a minority, would being part of an overall majority be of any help to me then?

I've no idea where you work but I hope I never have to use your services as it seems to me that you not only have foolish ideas of your own, you act on foolish ideas you don't even believe in.

I've never pillaged an African or Asian country so why should I accept being insulted with racism?
Here here. I had a friend at school who was Scottish, and he used to call lots of people English ********. I look back on it and see how silly it is. I never invaded his homeland to rape and pillage, i just walked to school with him.

Racism exists on all fronts, and if you excuse one and not the other then its pointless.

"I never invaded his homeland to rape and pillage, I just walked to school with him"

Heh heh! I like that, it's worthy of Monty Python. All joking aside, I understand what you mean though. Howevever, it does depend on how things are said and who by. If it's a bit of outrageous, mocking banter between friends who understand each other's sense of humour then just about anything goes.