Hi-

Does anyone know why the two-bed apartments on the new housing development called 'Park Grange Mount' in Norfolk Park are so expensive? I've seen them advertised at £114 000+ whereas the two-bed apartments on the 'Parklands' housing development in Manor (which are only 5mins up the road!) are only selling for around £75 000+.

Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other... so what's what's so special about the 'Park Grange Mount' apartments?

Please enlighten me!

Lib1

Erm... coz they are brand new and well-designed and have fabulous views across the city and out to Derbyshire and are a wonderful alternative to the v. expensive city centre flats. They are right next to the tram which takes 7 mins to get into town (or you can walk it in 20 mins)

I should know, I've just moved out of Royal Plaza on West Street (expensive, noisy, and full of rental tenants & students who are less than considerate) into a nice three-bed duplex on Park Grange Mount.

I think you'll find that the EU-funded regeneration of Norfolk Park is a great thing. It's an area of natural beauty, so they've knocked down / are knocking down all the old tower blocks and making it a really nice (but not up-it's-own-arse trendy) area to live.

Originally posted by Lib1
Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other

Norfolk Park is not "dodgy", some of the houses on Norfolk Park Road are huge, and very expensive. The Park itself is very nice and the view from the top of Norfolk Park/Park Grange is fantastic.

I have lived on Park Grange Mount for over 10 years (old houses included) and i have NEVER had any trouble. I now live in one of the new 2 bedroom houses and (once the silly fence comes down in front of my house)i fully intend to buy it asap.
The last remaining tower block is scheduled for demolition 04/01/2005. Just behind the tower block there are apartments being built in the grounds of Queens Tower. You can bet your bottom dollar you'll not get one of those for £114.000.
There is also going to be a new shopping complex built slightly further up from the new houses so all in all it is looking quite peachy for us at the moment!;).

Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other...


Oi, less of the 'dodgy! ;)

The houses/apartments on fairleigh (Manor) look fabulous, the area is much improved. I'd save meself £40,000 and go with the the Parklands.

Mat:thumbsup:

Originally posted by mat1978
Oi, less of the 'dodgy! ;)

The houses/apartments on fairleigh (Manor) look fabulous, the area is much improved. I'd save meself £40,000 and go with the the Parklands.

Mat:thumbsup:
I did'nt think Manor and Manor park were the same estate? and speaking from experience, i know where i would rather live:)

I did'nt think Manor and Manor park were the same estate? and speaking from experience, i know where i would rather live

Wouldnt the new buildings come under 'Manor'? Oh I dunno its sooooo confusing :confused:

Ur right about the difference tho m8, Just like Dore and Totley everyone on Manor says they live on Manor Park ;) :hihi:


Mat:thumbsup:

Originally posted by mat1978
Wouldnt the new buildings come under 'Manor'? Oh I dunno its sooooo confusing :confused:

Ur right about the difference tho m8, Just like Dore and Totley everyone on Manor says they live on Manor Park ;) :hihi:


Mat:thumbsup:

Yeah...I work just off Manor Lane and it seems a lot quiter than parts of the Manor.
I do still have a soft spot for the Manor though!. I lived on there for 16 years and although i saw quite a bit of trouble, i did'nt really have that much.

Norfolk Park seems to have come a long way since the days of the old tower blocks, and the new houses up there are well designed and have great views over Sheffield - something that you don't get from the city centre complexes. My boyfriend and I have just moved into one of the new apartments on Park Grange Mount, and for young first time buyers I think we have hit the nail on the head! its reassuring to hear from you that the area is relatively safe and crime free compared with others around it (Norfolk Park is all new to us!), and we are cautiously optimistic about this first step on the property ladder.

Are they going to blow up the remaining tower block too? I had been told that is was going to be pulled down in the same way as those behind the station. It would be more impressive to watch another demolition like Mickley!

Welcome to the forum startingout:thumbsup:.
While walking the dog the other night, i saw that notices had been put up saying that the last tower block is coming down on the 4th of January 2005. I would think that with them giving just the one date, they are planning to blast them (well hopefully);).

Having been past the 'Park Grange Mount' development several times, I'm still not convinced that they are worth £110,000+ (!) in comparison with the 'Parklands' development.

Although some of you have said that the tall council tower blocks across the road from Park Grange Mount will soon be knocked down, the run-down looking council estate just up and around the corner from the development would still worry me!

In addition, what's this view that you have been talking about? All thar I can see from the Park Grange Mount development are the (less than attractive) buildings of Sheffield city centre.

Are you really trying to say that the two bed apartments on the Park Grange Mount development are worth at least £35,000 more than the Parklands apartments? I don't think so!

Lib1

I happen to think that the view over Sheffield with the hills in the background is wicked. If you ever sat there and watched a thunder storm roll over the hills and into Sheffield, you would soon change your mind, IMO.

No, i do not think the 2 bedroom houses are worth £110.000 but that is the price people are paying so, obviously other people do!

I suppose it's everyone to their own really. I agree that £110,000 is a lot of money for the apartments on Park Grange Mount, especially as the bedrooms are quite small, but we got our reservation in there early and paid much less than that, which is why I am quite happy with the current price!!!!
The new estate at Park Grange Mount is only the beginning - there are two more estates planned, one for the Kenninghall Road area and another further down by Beeches, as well as shops and a small estate of energy efficient houses near to and built on the same idea as the new school, so real effort is being made to improve the whole area - they are not just building a single estate and hoping that will be enough. There has to be a reason, especially in this property booming age, why the Parklands development is so cheap!

I response to Lib1's comment "the run-down looking council estate just up and around the corner from the development would still worry me!" I hear that those council houses around Samuel Road are due for demolition next year to be replaced by Housing Association properties along the same lines as those on the Park Grange Mount development. Apparently one of the residents discovered this by asking to purchase hers from the council only to be told they were going to be demolished anyway!

Looks like Norfolk Park will be further improved then... :-)

Originally posted by BertieBasset
I response to Lib1's comment "the run-down looking council estate just up and around the corner from the development would still worry me!" I hear that those council houses around Samuel Road are due for demolition next year to be replaced by Housing Association properties along the same lines as those on the Park Grange Mount development. Apparently one of the residents discovered this by asking to purchase hers from the council only to be told they were going to be demolished anyway!

Looks like Norfolk Park will be further improved then... :-)

Welcome to the forum Bertie :D. Good post....VERY good user name;).

By the way, who do you support?, lol :hihi:

Thanks Vidster, I'm not an owls or blades fan, but follow Forest.....lol sorry about that! You must be pretty close to the Park Grange Mount development regarding your comments about the big fence on other threads, have u heard anything about the houses round Samuel Rd being compulsarilly repurchased and then replaced with ones a la the new Park Grange development?

Rgds

One too many any you just might turn Bertie!

I did hear that someone applied to buy their house on Samuel but were turned down because they are going to be pulled down in the next 2 years.

This is only hearsay but it only makes sense NorthBritish and Gleesons do not want older houses side by side with their shiny new development.

Just to continue my point...

Was having a look through Sheffield estate agent lettings webpages and noticed that 2 bed apartments on the Parklands development are being let at £450 per month... however, 2 bed apartments on the Park Grange Mount/ Rise development ARE ALSO being let at £450 per month!

Parklands apartment info: (Saxton Mee Residential Property Details 2283) 132 Fitzhubert Road, Manor, S2 - S2 1JG £450.00 per calendar month

Park Grange Mount/ Rise apartment info: http://www.vebra.com/home/includes/vdetails.asp?src=agent&fd=693&bd=0&db=2&cl=2160&pid=9179030

So my question still remains... WHAT IS SO SPECIAL ABOUT PARK GRANGE MOUNT/PARK GRANGE RISE???

Sorry to put a downer on this but I used to live on the brown mickley block & I wouldn't pay 1p a year to live up there now. Even if they were £1000000 mansions.

Originally posted by gezmac
Sorry to put a downer on this but I used to live on the brown mickley block & I wouldn't pay 1p a year to live up there now. Even if they were £1000000 mansions.

Used being the operative word!.
Estates change a lot in 5 years, it's a pity people's attitudes don't do the same:rolleyes:

My attitude as changed a hell of a lot since moving out of that area :clap:

i notice you don't let on where you are now....

i have lived on norfolk park for the best part of my 27 years. have never had any trouble, yes, of course that could always change, trouble happens anywhere. i would be proud to buy our two bed house now and would be happy staying here full stop. the flats had a bad reputation, it was a small area to have such a vast amount of people. i personally didn't like the flats and will be glad to see the last block go. it has changed so much for the better.:clap:

Norfolk park used to be a well established area with really nice people years ago, I suppose it's going that way again but it's surrounded by some of Sheffield's worst areas. I f I was going to spend that kind of money I'd look else where.

i admit i was surprised by the prices of the houses but i suppose its just the housing market and not really much about the areas the houses are anymore. new houses anywhere are going to be expensive. :(

Vidster - I'm also a bit bemused by the inflexibility of the attitudes surrounding Norfolk Park's redevelopment.

Gezpac - have a real good look at what's going on in that area: 1. The luxury Queens Tower development lower down Park Grange Road will mean that to the south of Park Grange Mount there will be only good quality housing

2. The tower blocks you refer to have been/are being demolished.

3. The company that built Norfolk Park are building another development just up the hill from the current new development.

4. The old properties up the hill from Norfolk Park that still remain are now owned by the property developer who plan to get rid of them.

Taking that into account I don't know how you can say that Park Grange is "Surrounded by some of Sheffield's worst areas".

When I was a kid growing up in London, my uncle lived in Notting Hill and it was considered scummy. You'd be hard pushed to find a decent property there for under a million these days.

Areas change mate. The geography and infrastructure of this area is good.

As said before E-man growin, for good money i expect a better
Location Location Location

But Gezmac, while shopping around, I found it hard to find properties that fit these criteria for the same price:

* New build (and the 10 year guarantee that goes with it)
* Walking distance to town centre
* On Supertram route
* Nice views

I was initially looking around Crookes and Walkley (even made a couple of offers). But apart from the snobbery value, I'm very happy here. Show me properties that meet that criteria at a similar price and I'll be happy to stand corrected.

Originally posted by gezmac
As said before E-man growin, for good money i expect a better
Location Location Location

So you haven't kept an eye on the property market at all over the last 2 years?.

110-120 grand is not OTT for a house these days, especially a brand spanking new one!.

Your right about Queens Tower E-Man Groovin, i walk my dog around that area sometimes and the development looks amazing. I bet you can't get one of those apartments for 110 grand when they are finished ;)

In reply to the quote below by 'E-man grooving'

"But Gezmac, while shopping around, I found it hard to find properties that fit these criteria for the same price:

* New build (and the 10 year guarantee that goes with it)
* Walking distance to town centre
* On Supertram route
* Nice views..."


Lib1's reply- Besides the 'Walking distance into the town centre' bit- the Parklands development meets all of your criteria, i.e.

- NHBC 10 year newbuild guarantee
- 5-10 mins walking distance from Manor Top/Elm Tree Supertram stop
- As my part of the devlopment overlooks a national park I'd say that it has nice views too!

In addition to all this, the flats cost approx £40,000 less than the Norfolk Park ones!!!

Lib1

Wow i might buy one myself then :suspect:

Here's a few i would have chose starting from £95000+ s10 area eg Broomhill, Sandygate, Lodge Moor, Ranmoor, Fulwood

http://house.rightmove.co.uk/search.rsp/svr/2001;jsessionid=228E8D0C0D7EC6F74ECB57BC42B37006?l o_u=2209&lo_n=S10&nh_st=1&stc_s=false&tr_t=buy&pa_n=8&eventsubmit_dosearch=1 (http://) :cool:

Ok this should work, http://house.rightmove.co.uk/search.rsp/svr/2001;jsessionid=228E8D0C0D7EC6F74ECB57BC42B37006?l o_u=2209&lo_n=S10&nh_st=1&stc_s=false&tr_t=buy&pa_n=8&eventsubmit_dosearch=1

You're new to the property thing aren't you Gezmac? Firstly, none of the properties met the criteria suggested (close to town, brand new w/guarantee, supertram..). Also Lodge Moor is so in the suburbs it's virtually in the Peak District! I work in Leeds and need good access to the train station. That's why living close to town / transport infrastructure is important.

Also you're not seriously suggesting you can get a brand new or equivalent quality two bedroom flat in Broomhill, Fulwood, Ranmoor or Crookes are you for 95,000? The majority of the properties on the link you include are 1 bedroom. I have a 3 bedroom duplex in Park Grange Mount which I bought for less than most of the properties on your list (although it's worth a bit more now).

If you want a one bedroom property in the sticks for 110k then go for it. You could get something bigger, brand new and close to town and transport for the same money if you'd just lose your misplaced snobbery.

I don't live in those areas mentioned & I have been into property for quite a good few years, I was giving you a example of the areas which are well established & are good areas in Sheffield & as for snobbery how can you say that buying a so called "designer flat" listen mate you just keep telling yourself you got a good buy & if you was from Sheffield in the first place you wouldn't have made that mistake, maybe you should have just stopped in Landon.

But you seem to be unable to argue your case without resorting to cheap shots about "stopping in London". What about the many Sheffielders who bought in Park Grange Mount (Come on Vidster, back me up here)? Where do you suggest they should "stop"? What's the reason for their "mistake" of buying into the lovely Norfolk Park regeneration?

My view if that area was good eneough for the Duke of Norfolk in the early 20th Century, then it's good enough for me.

you seem to be unable to argue your case? come on vidster help me i'm sinking :help: I have a 3 bedroom duplex in Park Grange Mount, who gives a ****

Hmmm....gezmac. I still don't see which affluent part of our great city you live in?.
Norfolk park may have been a dive at one point but as i said in an earlier post, estates change over time and Norfolk park is changing faster than most. One of the biggest reasons for this is the demolition of the tower blocks (especially the brown one :hihi: ).

I could not see which sub standard one bedroom properties you had picked out for us because none of your links are working now?. Like your arguement, they failed!.

Every house/Duplex (except 1) sold well before they were even completed. Does that mean every single person buying one of these properties are infact wrong about the estate and you (who have not lived here for at least 4 years) are right?.

Oh s**t back up is here! I lived up there about 10 years ago, I wasn't even there a year I had to get out, to many smack heads for my liking so I was happy to see them come down. Yeah they might look the dogs but you can't move arbourthorne & manor that surround the new area, ive lived in both them areas to so i know what they are like. Someone else mentioned the parklands estate there's no difference between manor & Norfolk park through my eyes so that would have been a better deal for your mate "e-man"

So where do you live? and what ohh-so-brilliant estates do you so happen to have bordering your own fantastic estate?

Can't say to much kid:cool:

Gezmac that was 10 YEARS AGO!

What was Royal Plaza on West Street 10 years ago? (Answer: an NCP Car Park). What was West One (Answer: I don't know, but probably some post industrial wasteland).

Given your logic people wouldn't pay 170k to live in Royal Plaza "coz ten years ago it were a car park with lots of unsavory types hanging round..."

well (officially back up three) i have lived in park grange mount (as said earlier) since being knee high to a grass hopper. vidster, keep yer gob shut on the knee high thing:P .....

anyhow, i have seen it go through the changes, for a start it was nowhere near the length it is now. can i just ask gezmac.... when was the last tme you strolled around the area? or have you just swept by on a tram or in a car? i notice also you said you have lived on all, norfolk park, manor and arbourthorne, and are now somewhere else??? are you moved on regularly? sorry i had to ask! its very rare i get angst about posts yet i am protective about my area as well as my home city so i had to state my view.
the original thread of course about the prices i'm presuming, the 'whats so special to warrent the prices...' well, its a great place to live, just as good as any other in sheffield, has great views, great people and is being rebuilt as a fantastic community.
gez, sorry you didn't see the good side mate;)

Kblade it was a few month ago i was driving through cause i have family living on Arbouthorne so yeah point taken, e-man what was Royal Plaza on West Street 10 years ago? A good car park to **** in after a skin full in the forum & alsyum on the way to west st to bash a few pigs as in wendy fans! :P

Once the last tower block on Norfolk Park is gone the view from the top of that hill will be fantastic, some people will pay extra for that alone.

Children, children! Calm it! I didn't post my original message to start a war!

However, despite all the bickering, no one has provided me with an adequate answer to my question...

As Park Grange Mount/Rise and Parklands are both stylish NHBC new build developments that are intended to regenerate the equally socio-economically deprived areas of Norfolk Park and the Manor, why do the Park Grange Mount/Rise apartments cost approx £40,000 more than the Parklands apartments?

Take into account that the Park Grange Mount/Rise deevlopment is on a busy main road with heavy traffic. Also take into account that the Parklands buildings (apartments and houses) are far more aesthetically pleasing than the Park Grange Mount/Rise equivalents.

If anyone replies that the (so-called) view from the Park Grange Mount/Rise development is worth an extra £40,000... I will scream!!!

Lib1

It's all your fault Lib1 I have half of Norfolk Park ganging up on me :D but no as said before I don't see any reason why they are £40000 more.

I lived on the Manor for 18 years and i have lived on Norfolk Park for 11 years. Of the two estates i think Norfolk Park is a more pleasant place to live.
As to the £40,000 difference in price i do not know?. Maybe the stigma of once being THE worst council estate in Europe is taking it's toll to this day!.


PS.
Since when has Park Grange Road been a busy road?. Yes it has the Supertram on it but that does not make it a busy road
:confused: .

Went past the Park Grange Mount/Rise development on the tram on Monday- it was in the early evening, but it was getting quite dark. As many of the residents didn't have their curtains/blinds closed and had their lights on, everyone on the tram could see right into the living rooms and dining rooms of the apartments and houses (many of which were v. nicely decorated, by the way!) facing the road. Not sure that I would want to live with so much exposure!

Supertrams passing by every 10 mins constitutes a busy road in my book!

And... as the "the worst council estate in Europe"... What about Longsight and Mosside in Manchester? Surely crime rates are far much higher there and in council estates in inner-city London!

Here here:heyhey:

Originally posted by Lib1
And... as the "the worst council estate in Europe"... What about Longsight and Mosside in Manchester? Surely crime rates are far much higher there and in council estates in inner-city London!

I never said it is the worst council estate in Europe NOW did i?

Originally posted by vidster
Maybe the stigma of once being THE worst council estate in Europe is taking it's toll to this day!.

Originally posted by gezmac
Here here:heyhey:

More constructive comments then :loopy:

May not be the sharpest tool in the box but i'm clever enough not to be living up there.

Sorry to open up this thread again, but I just wanted to thank everyone who has contributed. I found this forum and threads like this one very informative and useful. I have been looking at a few houses in the S2 area but didn't really find anything that fits the bill.

Then yesterday I stumbled on Park Grange Mount as I was driving up Park Grange Road, and I popped in to have a look around. I immediately fell in love with one of the last 3 remaining "Suffolk" 3-storey 3-bedroom houses and today I put down the deposit.

Before I made up my mind, I also had a good look around the Parklands development. Park Grange Mount is definitely more expensive, about £20,000 more expensive for the 3-bed house - £130,000 vs £110,000.

For me, it's worth paying that for (1) being 2-3 miles closer to the city centre (2) having the tram stop on your doorstep, rather than a 10-15 minute trek through the estate (3) not having to deal with any possible "anti-social issues" and (4) not having to pass through (and also, out-of-town visitors not having to pass through) the run-down areas along City Road en-route to the house.

Also, Park Grange is smaller and so seemed more friendly and intimate, whereas Parklands looks like a vast sprawling American estate where everyone gets about in their cars and noone talks to anyone. Just my 1st impressions.

I am hoping that when they demolish the last remaining shops on Park Grange Drive, they will build something really nice in their place.

Also, the Beeches development just down the road should be coming online in the next 12 months, and this will help raise the profile of the whole area and so hopefully raise resale values in the future.

I'm a bit disappointed with the mynorfolkpark.co.uk website though. It thought it would give some unique insights, but it's just a glossy sales tool, nothing more.

Hiya mm93fm :)
I 'think' you might have just put a deposit down on a house that's virtually just across the road to me :wink:
Lets hope the final road surfacing has been put down by the time you move in :rolleyes:
Welcome to Park Grange Mount :thumbsup:

what an excellent post! :thumbsup: :clap:

Dine out on this Lib1.... :banana: :hihi:

Originally posted by mm93fm
Sorry to open up this thread again, but I just wanted to thank everyone who has contributed. I found this forum and threads like this one very informative and useful. I have been looking at a few houses in the S2 area but didn't really find anything that fits the bill.

Then yesterday I stumbled on Park Grange Mount as I was driving up Park Grange Road, and I popped in to have a look around. I immediately fell in love with one of the last 3 remaining "Suffolk" 3-storey 3-bedroom houses and today I put down the deposit.

Before I made up my mind, I also had a good look around the Parklands development. Park Grange Mount is definitely more expensive, about £20,000 more expensive for the 3-bed house - £130,000 vs £110,000.

For me, it's worth paying that for (1) being 2-3 miles closer to the city centre (2) having the tram stop on your doorstep, rather than a 10-15 minute trek through the estate (3) not having to deal with any possible "anti-social issues" and (4) not having to pass through (and also, out-of-town visitors not having to pass through) the run-down areas along City Road en-route to the house.

Also, Park Grange is smaller and so seemed more friendly and intimate, whereas Parklands looks like a vast sprawling American estate where everyone gets about in their cars and noone talks to anyone. Just my 1st impressions.

I am hoping that when they demolish the last remaining shops on Park Grange Drive, they will build something really nice in their place.

Also, the Beeches development just down the road should be coming online in the next 12 months, and this will help raise the profile of the whole area and so hopefully raise resale values in the future.

I'm a bit disappointed with the mynorfolkpark.co.uk website though. It thought it would give some unique insights, but it's just a glossy sales tool, nothing more.

:lol: I never realised the Norfolk Park Vs Parklands debate went back so far! I've had a good laugh reading this thread though. :hihi:

Originally posted by vidster
Lets hope the final road surfacing has been put down by the time you move in :rolleyes:
Welcome to Park Grange Mount :thumbsup:

Any ideas when they'll be doing the road surfacing? I'll hopefully be moving in in a few weeks!

Hi,

I have been reading through this post as I am trying to get more information on Norfolk Park area in general (sorry to but in here an change the subject slightly, lol).

I am currently looking at an apartment on Park Grange Croft which is opposite the Park Grange Croft tram stop. I am planning to move near to the centre with easy access to the town by car or other means of transportation without paying inner city prices.

This is the best place I have come across so far and keep getting mixed views on the area, I understand it has a bad rep, but this is from the past and it is now an up and coming area. Just after some opinions from people living in or around that area now, or from people who know what its like.

Thanks

Lisa

Park Grange Croft is a very nice and quiet location. I think quite a few retired elderly people live in some of the flats. I spoke to a retired policeman and he told me that there's no crime down there.

The flats themselves have very pleasant outlooks, but the only disadvantage is that they all have warm air central heating and many are very dated inside.

Other than that, very nice indeed in my opinion and very close to town.


Originally posted by Lisa86
Hi,

I have been reading through this post as I am trying to get more information on Norfolk Park area in general (sorry to but in here an change the subject slightly, lol).

I am currently looking at an apartment on Park Grange Croft which is opposite the Park Grange Croft tram stop. I am planning to move near to the centre with easy access to the town by car or other means of transportation without paying inner city prices.

This is the best place I have come across so far and keep getting mixed views on the area, I understand it has a bad rep, but this is from the past and it is now an up and coming area. Just after some opinions from people living in or around that area now, or from people who know what its like.

Thanks

Lisa

Surprisingly, I agree!

Apartments at Park Grange Croft are very well priced and comparatively inexpensive considering their 'close to the city centre' location.

Lib1

:shocked: :wow:

Originally posted by Lib1
Surprisingly, I agree!

Apartments at Park Grange Croft are very well priced and comparatively inexpensive considering their 'close to the city centre' location.

Lib1

Thanks guys, you have been a big help.

I have heard some bad things about the Norfolk Park area, but mainly from people who lived there a while back and when i went to view the flat they seemed nice enough to me! Just needed some confirmation from people who know the area better than me.

Thanks

Lisa

Park Grange Croft is probably the quietest part of Norfolk Park Lisa86. It's almost like a little estate on it's own and you have one of the best Chinese Take Aways i know of 200 meters away :wink:
*Mmmmmm........Chinese......Drools.......*

Thanks Vidster,


Going to have another look at the apartment today and then probably placing an offer! So I may need the name of that Chinese! (I love Chinese food!!) lol.

Originally posted by chri5
Any ideas when they'll be doing the road surfacing? I'll hopefully be moving in in a few weeks!

We got notification of restricted access tomorrow and Friday for the final surfacing chri5 (21st & 22nd)

Lisa86: The Chinese is called The Swan. It's on Queens Rd opposite B&Q *drools*
It looks like it's about to fall down at any minute but the food is nice :wink:

Anyone got any info on the ground rent/service charge for Park Grange Mount?

Thanks for everyone's messages of support & welcome!

Unfortunately, I have some bad news. :o

Today I had the valuation of my new dream house. I went for the more expensive Homebuyer's Report and not just the mortgage valuation. My bank said a simple valuation would be OK for a new build, but I insisted on a Homebuyer's Report.

The surveyor was a nice man, and he had issues right from the start. He said the bricks in the outisde wall were not as straight as they ought to be in a brand new house. And sure enough, once he pointed it out to me, it was plain to see. As you look up on the side wall, it is quite uneven because of this. He said over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall. Then he had issues with the quality of the cement between the bricks, saying it was not smooth and a sign of poor worksmanship.

:o The block paving on the driveway was not laid down properly, which meant that water would run into the garage when it rained. And sure enough when we went into the garage, there was a tide mark from sand that had been swept inside.

There was a big problem with the drainage of water from the balcony. Basically, he said it would run down the front of the house. Also, he was concerned about the flat roof over the living room window.

He then looked at the central heating pipes, which (first time I have ever seen this) are not copper, but rubber tubing. He said this was to cut costs, and over time, these would corrode faster than copper does.

If you look at the point where the rubber pipes (like on your washing machine) enter the wall, there is a big hole. They have not bothered to fill it in or do it neatly. This was in all the rooms. Again, he said, they have cut corners to save on costs. He asked who the builder was, and when I said Gleesons, he said it now made sense.

The downstairs toilet opens out into the kitchen, which I always thought was very odd, but he said this was possibly illegal! He was very surprised to see how this could have been allowed by the building regulations people.

Going into the back garden, he pointed out immediately that none of the back gardens in the entire row of houses has a lawn. It is just topsoil where weeds and wild grasses have been allowed to grow. To my untrained eye I initially thought that the back garden needs a mow, but he demonstrated that there was actually NO lawn there to mow. It is just a field with overgrown grass. Move the grass away with your feet, and there is no lawn there, it is just soil.

OK, some of these things you can call "character". Others you can call "features". But check this out..

There must be a damp-proofing course built-in to the walls, at a height of 2 bricks above ground. In front of the house, there is a block paving driveway, and they have laid this down in such a way that it almost reaches the 2nd brick. I.e. there is only 1 brick between the road and the damp proofing. Apparantly, this is a major major flaw in the construction of the house. His face (and my heart) sank when he saw this.

And if you look at the lower row of bricks, you can clearly see that they are damp. Even the sand lying on the ground next to the wall is damp. There is also an air brick at ground level here, and he said because the paving was too high, water can flood into the cavity in the wall and stagnate there.

He said the only way to sort the problem of the garage flooding when it rains would be to uproot the paving on the whole row of houses and start again. Then that would affect the main road and they may have to do something there too.

The way to deal with the rising damp on the front wall was to inject a new damp proof course, but that would involve drilling holes in the bricks, etc. You shouldn't have to do that a brand new house!

Plus, there were some more minor problems ("snags"), which he said any new house would have, and these snags would have to been sorted out before completion. He was happy with the attic, and he was very happy with the construction of the garage door. :thumbsup:

:help: Overall, he said he had seen enough problems to be quite concerned about the property. He was not able/allowed professionally to say "don't buy it" but he told me enough times how worried he was for me to get the hint, which is what I think he was doing.

In the end, I asked him - if I put the house on the market tomorrow, would I at least get my money back - - - he said I probably wouldn't. :o

Now, this is not meant to be a reflection on the rest of the properties. Maybe it is just this particular property, and that is the reason it is still on the market.

Come to think of it, the sales agent did say when I first met her, that a couple of the houses had been reserved, but had come back on the market for whatever reason. I never probed or thought anything about that. You "live and learn" I suppose!

Now, I've got £13,050 sitting in the bank with nothing to spend it on... anyone have any suggestions?!?!? :heyhey:

These are the problems that can arise even when you are buying a new build. How about the risk people take when they buy off-plan? No thanks!

i understand that those houses have 10 year NHBC guarantees and have also been passed by a building inspector.

It's common practice to use speedfit pipes on central heating nowadays rather than copper pipes and they satisfy modern building regulations. These pipes are more useful as you can embed them in the plasterboard walls rather than having them come up through the floorboards, so he's behind the times there.

Building regs have changed with respect to downstairs toliets. Previously they were not allowed to open into kitchens, but now apparantly they have to, I think something with respect to disabled access. Very surprised he wasn't aware of it!!

As far as I understand the back gardens have been seeded with grass seed rather than turfed.

With you having agreed to buy a newbuild I guess you've now lost your reservation fee or deposit?

From what you've said it sounds like he was a bit too picky, no houses are perfect. If I were you I would show Gleesons representative the valuation report and ask them what they are going to do about it.....



Originally posted by mm93fm
Thanks for everyone's messages of support & welcome!

Unfortunately, I have some bad news. :o

Today I had the valuation of my new dream house. I went for the more expensive Homebuyer's Report and not just the mortgage valuation. My bank said a simple valuation would be OK for a new build, but I insisted on a Homebuyer's Report.

The surveyor was a nice man, and he had issues right from the start. He said the bricks in the outisde wall were not as straight as they ought to be in a brand new house. And sure enough, once he pointed it out to me, it was plain to see. As you look up on the side wall, it is quite uneven because of this. He said over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall. Then he had issues with the quality of the cement between the bricks, saying it was not smooth and a sign of poor worksmanship.

:o The block paving on the driveway was not laid down properly, which meant that water would run into the garage when it rained. And sure enough when we went into the garage, there was a tide mark from sand that had been swept inside.

There was a big problem with the drainage of water from the balcony. Basically, he said it would run down the front of the house. Also, he was concerned about the flat roof over the living room window.

He then looked at the central heating pipes, which (first time I have ever seen this) are not copper, but rubber tubing. He said this was to cut costs, and over time, these would corrode faster than copper does.

If you look at the point where the rubber pipes (like on your washing machine) enter the wall, there is a big hole. They have not bothered to fill it in or do it neatly. This was in all the rooms. Again, he said, they have cut corners to save on costs. He asked who the builder was, and when I said Gleesons, he said it now made sense.

The downstairs toilet opens out into the kitchen, which I always thought was very odd, but he said this was possibly illegal! He was very surprised to see how this could have been allowed by the building regulations people.

Going into the back garden, he pointed out immediately that none of the back gardens in the entire row of houses has a lawn. It is just topsoil where weeds and wild grasses have been allowed to grow. To my untrained eye I initially thought that the back garden needs a mow, but he demonstrated that there was actually NO lawn there to mow. It is just a field with overgrown grass. Move the grass away with your feet, and there is no lawn there, it is just soil.

OK, some of these things you can call "character". Others you can call "features". But check this out..

There must be a damp-proofing course built-in to the walls, at a height of 2 bricks above ground. In front of the house, there is a block paving driveway, and they have laid this down in such a way that it almost reaches the 2nd brick. I.e. there is only 1 brick between the road and the damp proofing. Apparantly, this is a major major flaw in the construction of the house. His face (and my heart) sank when he saw this.

And if you look at the lower row of bricks, you can clearly see that they are damp. Even the sand lying on the ground next to the wall is damp. There is also an air brick at ground level here, and he said because the paving was too high, water can flood into the cavity in the wall and stagnate there.

He said the only way to sort the problem of the garage flooding when it rains would be to uproot the paving on the whole row of houses and start again. Then that would affect the main road and they may have to do something there too.

The way to deal with the rising damp on the front wall was to inject a new damp proof course, but that would involve drilling holes in the bricks, etc. You shouldn't have to do that a brand new house!

Plus, there were some more minor problems ("snags"), which he said any new house would have, and these snags would have to been sorted out before completion. He was happy with the attic, and he was very happy with the construction of the garage door. :thumbsup:

:help: Overall, he said he had seen enough problems to be quite concerned about the property. He was not able/allowed professionally to say "don't buy it" but he told me enough times how worried he was for me to get the hint, which is what I think he was doing.

In the end, I asked him - if I put the house on the market tomorrow, would I at least get my money back - - - he said I probably wouldn't. :o

Now, this is not meant to be a reflection on the rest of the properties. Maybe it is just this particular property, and that is the reason it is still on the market.

Come to think of it, the sales agent did say when I first met her, that a couple of the houses had been reserved, but had come back on the market for whatever reason. I never probed or thought anything about that. You "live and learn" I suppose!

Now, I've got £13,050 sitting in the bank with nothing to spend it on... anyone have any suggestions?!?!? :heyhey:

These are the problems that can arise even when you are buying a new build. How about the risk people take when they buy off-plan? No thanks!

Good God... Yep, the Norfolk Park dev homes are worth every penny!

Lib1

Thanks for your advice BertieBasset, I will wait for the final written report from the surveyor before taking it to the sales agent. If I pull out now, I will lose the £750 deposit. :mad:

http://parkgrangemount.blogspot.com/

I have uploaded a picture of the front of the house. Click on the photo to see it bigger.

You can see the damp areas on the left of the door, and the pool of water in front of the garage door due to the paving being wonky.

The damp has arisen because the paving has been laid too high, and so there isn't the necessary clearance between it and the damp course.

Also, the air brick is very low and so water has entered through it in to the cavity between the outside bricks and the load-bearing bricks inside. Again, this is because the paving is too high.

I have examined the other houses in the row, and some have their air brick half covered up because the paving is so high!

Yes, this particular surveyor may have been too critical/picky... but if he can criticise the house like this, then another surveyor may also be equally picky in 5-10 years time when I come to sell the property!

Putting the Norfolk Park vs Parklands debate aside for the mo- and putting my 'I live in a new-build too' hat on...

Surely you should be able to get Gleesons/NHBC to guarantee that they will rectify the problems (well rectify the rectifable probs at least!) before you complete on the house. It seems unfair that nothing will be done about the (totally obvious!!!) defects in the build- maybe you should seek advice from your conveyancer. I know that the other homes on the row are nothing personally to do with you, but it may be useful to point out their probs to the builder/NHBC as well. I would hate to think that a future buyer may suffer because they did not check the build as thoroughly as you did.

If these guarantees are not provided, then if I were you, I'd cut my losses and look for a home (wherever it may be!) with less inherent structural problems.

Lib1

I feel for you mm93fm :(
We finally had our driveway finished last week (we've been here for over three years!). The workmanship is very poor indeed. The block paving on the path is supposed to be on a slant. Whoever did ours had obviously forgot about this. Now we have a paving slab cut in half to try and compensate for not putting the paving on a gradual slope :?
The contractors who are doing the road surfacing etc are nothing to do with Gleesons (so i was told).
I would take your report to Gleesons and see what they say about it. All that bottom row of houses are the same and i think everyone in them should be warned about the damp problem at least.

I 'think' Gleesons have tried to make some sort of statement with the brickwork on the new houses because mine is the same. I just thought i must have had a pisshead doing mine :wink:
All the houses have toilets opening in to the kitchen. I've never herd of this being illegal. Did you notice the size of the wash basin? (tiny)
Our heating must have been fitted when Gleesons were feeling flush as we have Copper pipes :)

The back gardens have been seeded, albeit very sparingly and after three years mine is still looking very poor.

With a list like that i think that i would walk away. I never thought I'd be saying that about a house on here :rolleyes:

Thanks for the constructive comment Lib1 :loopy:

Obviously I haven't seen the gable end that you refer to where the brickwork doesn't look very good but I would be surprised if the building inspector passed it if it's a serious problem. Building inspectors need to inspect both at damp course level and then at roof level prior to the roof going on.

It may be worthwhile calling Building Control at Sheffield City Council and speaking to the building inspector for the S2 area and mentioning your concerns to him/her.

I suspect the problems that the surveyor has raised with respect to the block paving is because Gleesons did the block paving after the damp course was initially inspected and probably after the building inspector had given his certificate for the house. I imagine they could put in a damp course higher up.

The problems the surveyor has raised about the flat roof over part of the living room is just a matter of design, so there's nothing you can really do about it.

When you have a "scheme 2" Homebuyers Report surveyors like to make themselves be seen to be earning their money, so if I were you I'd be open minded about things until Gleesons give you a response, you may be able to negotiate a discount and have any repairs done.

While new builds do have the benefit of modern building regs, etc, nowadays people have much less attention to detail than perhaps they did years ago. I had a look at a new build around Ringinglow that was on the market for £975K and there was some sloppiness there too, not what you'd expect for such a lot of money.

I don't think anyone will find a perfectly constructed house, unless they are a high quality builder and have built it themselves, and even then another person will come along and questions this that and the other!!

Let me know how you get on please.





Originally posted by mm93fm
Thanks for your advice BertieBasset, I will wait for the final written report from the surveyor before taking it to the sales agent. If I pull out now, I will lose the £750 deposit. :mad:

http://parkgrangemount.blogspot.com/

I have uploaded a picture of the front of the house. Click on the photo to see it bigger.

You can see the damp areas on the left of the door, and the pool of water in front of the garage door due to the paving being wonky.

The damp has arisen because the paving has been laid too high, and so there isn't the necessary clearance between it and the damp course.

Also, the air brick is very low and so water has entered through it in to the cavity between the outside bricks and the load-bearing bricks inside. Again, this is because the paving is too high.

I have examined the other houses in the row, and some have their air brick half covered up because the paving is so high!

Yes, this particular surveyor may have been too critical/picky... but if he can criticise the house like this, then another surveyor may also be equally picky in 5-10 years time when I come to sell the property!

a bit of an afterthough really, but on valuation reports a surveyor will list anything that affects the lenders "lending decision" as an "essential repair", these are the only ones that would be considered to be serious enough to be addressed immediately.

Hope this helps.

We had no such problems with our reports and various builders/friends opinions.

That report sounds hysterical. When you compare this development to the city center flats I dread to think what he would say about them!!

Originally posted by vidster
Thanks for the constructive comment Lib1 :loopy:

Which 'constructive' comment of mine are you questioning? The comment where I recommended that a guarantee to sort out the build problems should be gained... or the comment where I suggested that the apparent poor workmanship of the Norfolk Park dev homes does not provide good value for (quite a lot of!) money? You yourself stated that "With a list like that i think that i would walk away"

Genuine question- Why haven't you mentioned the problems of the poor quality of your build to potential buyers that have expressed an interest in the Norfolk Park dev homes on this Forum?

Lib1

most of the areas mentioned have been caused by careless builders and can be rectified very quickly. As I mentioned previously surveyors like to be "seen to be earning" their fee when you have anything other than the standard report.

Originally posted by chri5
We had no such problems with our reports and various builders/friends opinions.

That report sounds hysterical. When you compare this development to the city center flats I dread to think what he would say about them!!

mm93fm: "He said the bricks in the outisde wall were not as straight as they ought to be in a brand new house... He said over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall"

BertieBasset "most of the areas mentioned have been caused by careless builders and can be rectified very quickly."

Lib1: The problems listed by the surveyor seem v. serious and cannot be recified "very quickly"- I can't see how the long-term effects that he has listed can be solved without knocking walls/buildings down and starting again (and possibly even changing the flat design of the roof over the living room window). The £750 deposit that mm93fm may lose if he walks away is nothing compared with the costs and hassle that these problems will cause in the future.

I know that you are very proud of your beloved Norfolk Park dev, but I think that with this particular property, the risks of continuing with the purchase are much too high.

To mm93fm: Are any of the other houses on the row that are unspoken for? If so, if there are less problems with them, maybe you could arrange a deal to swap the deopsit that you have put down on your build for an alternative home. Bellway allowed me to do this on the Parklands dev (I made the change due to personal preferences, not build quality issues)

Lib1

The main weight on that gable wall will be carried by the inner skin of blockwork, the wall ties between the outer and inner skin further strengthen the wall, the brick work may look untidy but I would be surprised if it would cause you any structural problems. See what he lists as "essential repairs" and work off that.

Lib1 is as ignorant with construction as she is with everything else.....:hihi:

Wouldn't it be fun to see what the surveyor would say about Parklands.......:hihi:

Originally posted by Lib1
mm93fm: "He said the bricks in the outisde wall were not as straight as they ought to be in a brand new house... He said over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall"

BertieBasset "most of the areas mentioned have been caused by careless builders and can be rectified very quickly."

Lib1: The problems listed by the surveyor seem v. serious and cannot be recified "very quickly"- I can't see how the long-term effects that he has listed can be solved without knocking walls/buildings down and starting again (and possibly even changing the flat design of the roof over the living room window). The £750 deposit that mm93fm may lose if he walks away is nothing compared with the costs and hassle that these problems will cause in the future.

I know that you are very proud of your beloved Norfolk Park dev, but I think that with this particular property, the risks of continuing with the purchase are much too high.

To mm93fm: Are any of the other houses on the row that are unspoken for? If so, if there are less problems with them, maybe you could arrange a deal to swap the deopsit that you have put down on your build for an alternative home. Bellway allowed me to do this on the Parklands dev (I made the change due to personal preferences, not build quality issues)

Lib1

A QUALIFIED surveyor said that the slanted walls would mean that: "over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall". I would take his word over your totally biased and blind opinions any day! There is a serious amount of money at stake here- put your pride aside and advise mm93mm with more caution.

Think about it- if this many problems are in existence now- God knows what future problems will crop up in a couple of years time. Even your fellow resident Vidster said that if he were in the same position, he would walk away from the build.

What makes you assume that the build quality at Parklands would be as bad or poorer than that of the Norfolk Park dev? Even if problems did crop up- at least we didn't pay out stupid amounts for our homes.

The original qu for this thread was "what's so special about 'Park Grange Mount' " ... I'm now less convinced by the Norfolk Park dev than I was before...

Lib1

everyone knows that you don't know your @rse from your elbow, the best advice to the prospective purchaser is to look at what features on the list of "essential repairs" and not to follow any of your prejudiced contorted "advice" from someone who lives on an estate that gets letterbombs.... :gag:

Better than living on an over-priced, over-hyped estate with crap build quality, honey!


mm93mm- I hope that everything works out well for you, but please remember to heed the advice of the INDEPENDENT/NEUTRAL surveryor.


Lib1

nowt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol.

Originally posted by Lib1
A QUALIFIED surveyor said that the slanted walls would mean that: "over the years, they would start to erode and weaken the wall". I would take his word over your totally biased and blind opinions any day! There is a serious amount of money at stake here- put your pride aside and advise mm93mm with more caution.

Think about it- if this many problems are in existence now- God knows what future problems will crop up in a couple of years time. Even your fellow resident Vidster said that if he were in the same position, he would walk away from the build.

What makes you assume that the build quality at Parklands would be as bad or poorer than that of the Norfolk Park dev? Even if problems did crop up- at least we didn't pay out stupid amounts for our homes.

The original qu for this thread was "what's so special about 'Park Grange Mount' " ... I'm now less convinced by the Norfolk Park dev than I was before...


they should have thought of that before they buit them.
Lib1

i'm sure lots of people would love the prospect of letterbombs.....

and u always come across as the kind of girl who's generally and continually very frustrated in life, don't u get any honey.... :hihi:

Originally posted by Lib1
Better than living on an over-priced, over-hyped estate with crap build quality, honey!


mm93mm- I hope that everything works out well for you, but please remember to heed the advice of the INDEPENDENT/NEUTRAL surveryor.


Lib1

Oh- so you're backed into a corner and now you're getting personal... very childish (as usual!). Dear Moderators- you've warned me about 'going too far' before... where are you now?

Actually- the building in which the letter bomb incident occured is now finished and people have now moved into the same row with no problems whatsover. That was the only letter-bomb incident that there was (and even then, they only damaged and intended to damage the actual letter-box).

The stupid and mindless attacks on the unfinished Parklands builds will end as soon as they are completed and occupied... however your probs of poor build quality will go on and on and on...

Lib1

not much of a denial then... :hihi:



Originally posted by Lib1
Oh- so you're backed into a corner and now you're getting personal... very childish (as usual!). Dear Moderators- you've warned me about 'going too far' before... where are you now?

Actually- the building in which the letter bomb incident occured is now finished and people have now moved into the same row with no problems whatsover. That was the only letter-bomb incident that there was (and even then, they only damaged and intended to damage the actual letter-box).

The stupid and mindless attacks on the unfinished Parklands builds will end as soon as they are completed and occupied... however your probs of poor build quality will go on and on and on...

Lib1

bertie- give it up. you're not impressing anybody- you're just making a fool of yourself.

you can dish it out but can't take it....

Originally posted by Lib1
bertie- give it up. you're not impressing anybody- you're just making a fool of yourself.

Dishing-out? Bertie- When have I ever queried your private sexual life?

Look back at my posts to mm93mm- I never recommended that he should forget about the Norfolk Park dev entirely- I advised that he should ensure that the problems will be sorted out by the builder/NHBC- I even said that he may want to try and find out if he could change his build for an alternative one on the Norfolk Park dev...

What on earth is wrong with you?

who mentioned anything about your private sexual life???? OK so given that you've just brought it up what do you want to tell us about it...?

Don't be shy, we'll do our best to help.... :heyhey:

Originally posted by Lib1
Dishing-out? Bertie- When have I ever queried your private sexual life?

Look back at my posts to mm93mm- I never recommended that he should forget about the Norfolk Park dev entirely- I advised that he should ensure that the problems will be sorted out by the builder/NHBC- I even said that he may want to try and find out if he could change his build for an alternative one on the Norfolk Park dev...

What on earth is wrong with you?

Mod. Note

Lib1, you ask 'Where are the Mods'?

Well, I'm here and if this carries on then both people involved will receive a ban.

Keep the personal attacks off the boards.

Joe

Originally posted by Lib1
Which 'constructive' comment of mine are you questioning? The comment where I recommended that a guarantee to sort out the build problems should be gained... or the comment where I suggested that the apparent poor workmanship of the Norfolk Park dev homes does not provide good value for (quite a lot of!) money? You yourself stated that "With a list like that i think that i would walk away"
I was referring to this one Lib1:Originally posted by Lib1
Good God... Yep, the Norfolk Park dev homes are worth every penny!

Lib1

Originally posted by Lib1
Genuine question- Why haven't you mentioned the problems of the poor quality of your build to potential buyers that have expressed an interest in the Norfolk Park dev homes on this Forum?

Lib1
The brickwork is not slanted as you would have people believe :loopy: Every so often there is a brick protruding by a few mm. It will in no way effect the strength of the wall. I only noticed it because i worked in the construction industry. No one else i have spoken too has noticed it.
The paving has only been completed last week. How could i have for-warned anyone about it?

There are many things i haven't mentioned about NP. The shops are a real eyesore. A car was burnt out a few weeks ago near the Jervis Lum bridge. Builders have now left but not taken half their rubbish with them.

I've also got 18 years of things about the Manor that i haven't talked about on this forum. Would you like me to start spilling all that out in the threads too?
I am probably the most experienced out of anyone on this/these threads to talk about the two estates. I would rather live here than where you are.
That is a fact.

I live a few doors up and in the same style house as the one in question and can comment on a few points made:

Originally posted by mm93fm
There was a big problem with the drainage of water from the balcony. Basically, he said it would run down the front of the house.

The drainage on my balcony is fine... any water quickly makes its way down effective guttering. None spills down the front of the house. It wazzed it down the last week - no problems, and I have plants on there which I water every day - any surplus just goes down the drainpipe.

Originally posted by mm93fm
THe then looked at the central heating pipes, which (first time I have ever seen this) are not copper, but rubber tubing. He said this was to cut costs, and over time, these would corrode faster than copper does.

If you look at the point where the rubber pipes (like on your washing machine) enter the wall, there is a big hole. They have not bothered to fill it in or do it neatly. This was in all the rooms. Again, he said, they have cut corners to save on costs.

True and i asked my plumber friend about this. They might not last as long as copper, but they are commonplace nowadays and should be OK for many years. There are holes, but mine are small and can't be seen unless the radiator is removed. I actually quite like the fact that the piping goes behind the radiators rather than down into the floor.

Originally posted by mm93fm
Going into the back garden, he pointed out immediately that none of the back gardens in the entire row of houses has a lawn. It is just topsoil where weeds and wild grasses have been allowed to grow. To my untrained eye I initially thought that the back garden needs a mow, but he demonstrated that there was actually NO lawn there to mow.

You're sort of correct, but I spent half an hour with my petrol strimmer and was left with a reasonable lawn. They have just laid grass seed onto top-soil, but it's no major issue. I'm currently having my garden landscaped and the garden designer was impressed with the state of soil.

Originally posted by mm93fm
He said the only way to sort the problem of the garage flooding when it rains

No rain enters my garage as it drains into the metal drainage gully

----------------------

I don't have the knowledge to comment on any of the other issues your surveyor raises but I will be asking people who know what they are talking about to take a look. If you are haven't pulled out of your purchase, do you mind updating us on any more info you get please?

I have to say I am really pleased with my new house and the area. I'm a little concerned about some of the issues your surveyor raises, but not overly so. If, mm93fm, you want to have a chat or maybe pop round and look at my place then feel free to PM me.

anyone else think the council should've kept at least park grange mount tower block? i'd've lived there and i reckon there were enough off norfolk park who would've done too.

I thought there were structural problems that were not cost-effective to repair with the tower blocks?

Yeah, the cement was blistering off and the windows were getting a tad too draughty by modern day standards :suspect:
There weren't too many people wanting to live them any more either. People were just waiting around for their clearance keys and compensation.

yeah, that's true about the cement/ concrete.

i'd rather think it was maintenance costs that finished norfolk park than a nasty plan to kick out tenants and move in the better off...

so let's stick to the maintenance theory!:)

Originally posted by pete_fcs


i'd rather think it was maintenance costs that finished norfolk park than a nasty plan to kick out tenants and move in the better off...


None of the tenents were kicked out though. They were all offered one of the new houses/flats that were built.

that's true too!

i'm just bitter 'cos i put my name down for one only to find i was too late!:|

Hi Just thought you may like to know that if a car is stolen, it's usually found burnt out around the fairleigh area of the Manor. It's not exclusive to Fairleigh but that's the most popular spot.

I have lived on both and Norfolk Park is the lesser of 2 evils.

I started this thread on 09-09-2004 at 09:24 AM and it has taken 11 months for more than one NP dev resident to own up to problems in the council estates near to the NP dev.

Before you start having a go at me, I've never tried to say that Manor is safer, I've always maintained that the two areas are basically just as bad as each other. My original post was this (please note that some of the figures mentioned below have now changed):

"Does anyone know why the two-bed apartments on the new housing development called 'Park Grange Mount' in Norfolk Park are so expensive? I've seen them advertised at £114 000+ whereas the two-bed apartments on the 'Parklands' housing development in Manor (which are only 5mins up the road!) are only selling for around £75 000+... Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other... so what's what's so special about the 'Park Grange Mount' apartments?"


So, Vidster and Sandy_L state that the Norfolk Park dev is the lesser of two evils, which is a fair enough opinion I suppose... but is the 'lesser evil' nature of the NP dev really worth approx £30,000 extra? And... if the 'lesser of two evils' theory is correct, then why do two bed apartments on both of the developments rent out for around the same price (usually about £450 per month)?

Discuss...

Lib1

PS- No more petty arguments or psychotic rants please , I just want answers to the questions that I have raised.

Your slowing up Lib1! I expected your reply much earlier than this :wink:

Hi Lib

I wasn't sure if you knew the areas well and all I wanted to do was to let you know what they are like.

I'm not trying to pull down either one, just thought it's as well to have as much information as possible before committing to either.

Kind regards
Sandy

Red sky at night Parklands alight! :hihi:

Originally posted by Sandy_L
Hi Just thought you may like to know that if a car is stolen, it's usually found burnt out around the fairleigh area of the Manor. It's not exclusive to Fairleigh but that's the most popular spot.

I have lived on both and Norfolk Park is the lesser of 2 evils.

I have today gotten my hands on the Homebuyer's Report. I have uploaded extracts of it to http://parkgrangemount.blogspot.com/

Apologies in advance for the quality of the images! There are 6 images in total. The 5th one refers to the damp on the front wall.

Have you decided what you're going to do mm93fm?

I'm just about to complete a purchase just up the road from the property in question and must say I've had none of those problems described to me (and had tons of opinions)!

The issue of mixed tenants (renting & buying) is outweighed by the location and the future sale of the property won’t be a problem IMO.

Have you contacted the developer about the report?

Originally posted by BertieBasset
Red sky at night Parklands alight! :hihi:

Is that a threat? You went a little crazy a coupla weeks ago... you are scaring me.

Originally posted by vidster
Your slowing up Lib1! I expected your reply much earlier than this :wink:

Wisecracks and no answers... if you don't know, just say so... then this thread can rest in peace!

Lib1

The £110,000 your surveyor quotes in the insurance section of the report you have posted relates to the rebuilding cost of the property, rather than the current market valuation. Re-building costs are usually significantly lower.

Originally posted by Big_Dipper
The £110,000 your surveyor quotes in the insurance section of the report you have posted relates to the rebuilding cost of the property, rather than the current market valuation. Re-building costs are usually significantly lower.

Yes I can confirm this as this is the figure we have for the insurance!

chri5, I am going to pull out.

I agree with you that our surveyor was being a little over-critical about the mixed tenants issue, and that's just his opinion. Given the location, I'm sure things will turn out OK.

Maybe I've just got the black sheep on the estate! :suspect: :D (if that's the right expression) Sometimes you're unlucky.

I will go and speak to the saleswoman tomorrow morning and see what she says. She will probably underplay it and say it's normal for a new house to have a slightly damp wall etc. We will see...

some of the language your surveyor has used on that report seems a little "risque", quite unusual to be so outspoken, they are usually quite reserved whilst still getting their point home. Perhaps he's had a falling out with Gleesons before and is trying to exact some revenge? :suspect:

so what's this about red skies at Parklands, do they have regular fireworks parties there or something???

>Perhaps he's had a falling out with Gleesons before

Possibly. But maybe he was saying "Don't buy it!" as strongly as possible without actually saying it.

Originally posted by Big_Dipper
so what's this about red skies at Parklands, do they have regular fireworks parties there or something???

It's a reference to an arson problem involving unnoccupied and derelict council houses on the part of the Manor council estate which is across the road (Prince of Wales Road- a very wide road, btw) from Balmoral Grange (private new build development built 2-3 years ago) and Parklands (adjacent private new build development that was started about a year ago and will be completed in 2006-ish).

Balmoral Grange is closest to Prince of Wales Road, but it is still extremely popular. Homes sell very quickly on Balmoral Grange (usually within 6 weeks) and the actual development is not really affected by the 'going's on' across the road. Parklands is located from Windy House Lane to Bassledene Road and suffers zero effect from the arson probs on the old council estate (see Multimap: http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&X=438250.905507032&Y=385750.199624144&width=500&height=300&gride=438266.905507032&gridn=385728.199624144&srec=0&coordsys=gb&db=GB&addr1=&addr2=&addr3=&pc=&advanced=&local=&localinfosel=&kw=&inmap=&table=&ovtype=&zm=1&scale=10000 and http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&X=438500.905507032&Y=385500.199624144&width=500&height=300&gride=438266.905507032&gridn=385728.199624144&srec=0&coordsys=gb&db=GB&addr1=&addr2=&addr3=&pc=&advanced=&local=&localinfosel=&kw=&inmap=&table=&ovtype=&zm=1&scale=5000)

There are no 'red skies at Parklands' or at Balmoral Grange for that matter. The arson prob has been going on from since at least 2003 and the new-build devs have not been affected by damage or a lack of sales. Therefore, the repeated reference to the arson in connection to fabricated detrimental affects on the new-build developments is futile and irrelevant. The derelict council houses are soon to be demolished and the problem will be solved. It's partly the council's fault for not demolishing them sooner.

Lib1

do you mean that letter bomb that exploded on Parklands, I heard about that, thank God I don't live there! Who'd want to live in a place like that? :loopy:

Where do u live by the way? :smile:

Originally posted by Lib1


the repeated reference to the arson in connection to fabricated detrimental affects on the new-build developments is futile and irrelevant.
Lib1

Don't believe the hype... don't believe me... travel to Parklands and see it for yourself.

Lib1

PS- BigDipper/BertieBasset...?

sounds a bit rough to me

Originally posted by Lib1
Don't believe the hype... don't believe me... travel to Parklands and see it for yourself.

Lib1

PS- BigDipper/BertieBasset...?

So you've created a new identity to 'get' at me... not sure whether to be flattered or sickened.

Surely that counts as some kind of misconduct on a Forum such as this one... hmmm?

Are you going to behave yourself or should I call the Mods out on you... again?

?????????????


Originally posted by Lib1
So you've created a new identity to 'get' at me... not sure whether to be flattered or sickened.

Surely that counts as some kind of misconduct on a Forum such as this one... hmmm?

Are you going to behave yourself or should I call the Mods out on you... again?

Profile For Big_Dipper Search for all posts by this user.

Date Registered: 17-08-2005
Status: Registered User
Total Posts: 12 (12 posts per day)
Last Post: 17-08-2005 03:05 PM


Very knowledgable for one who only joined the Forum today, now aren't we?

how creepy, are u a stalker? Surely I'm entitled to my opinions as a new user, so what if I joined today and I join in the discussions. Is everyone as creepy and weird as you? :suspect:

Originally posted by Lib1
Profile For Big_Dipper Search for all posts by this user.

Date Registered: 17-08-2005
Status: Registered User
Total Posts: 12 (12 posts per day)
Last Post: 17-08-2005 03:05 PM


Very knowledgable for one who only joined the Forum today, now aren't we?

Yes, I'M the one that is 'weird and creepy'.

So what are you supposed to be then? BertieBasset's even more idiotic twin brother?

i think you have some fixation with this other character, bit intense aren't u, talk about obsessive.... :loopy:

Originally posted by Lib1
Yes, I'M the one that is 'weird and creepy'.

So what are you supposed to be then? BertieBasset's even more idiotic twin brother?

OK then, newcomer- fancy having a go at answering the original question:

My original post was this (please note that some of the figures mentioned below have now changed):

"Does anyone know why the two-bed apartments on the new housing development called 'Park Grange Mount' in Norfolk Park are so expensive? I've seen them advertised at £114 000+ whereas the two-bed apartments on the 'Parklands' housing development in Manor (which are only 5mins up the road!) are only selling for around £75 000+... Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other... so what's what's so special about the 'Park Grange Mount' apartments?"

it would be difficult to comment on something accurately where the figures have changed, rather like giving an opinion on an apple when really it looks like an orange...

I also first posted to help clarify the insurance valuation and interpretation of it of the lady who was considering purchasing on the development, as such I would rather not be drawn into what it appears is your squabble

Thanks

Originally posted by Lib1
OK then, newcomer- fancy having a go at answering the original question:

My original post was this (please note that some of the figures mentioned below have now changed):

"Does anyone know why the two-bed apartments on the new housing development called 'Park Grange Mount' in Norfolk Park are so expensive? I've seen them advertised at £114 000+ whereas the two-bed apartments on the 'Parklands' housing development in Manor (which are only 5mins up the road!) are only selling for around £75 000+... Surely the two areas (Norfolk Park and Manor) are just as 'dodgy' as each other... so what's what's so special about the 'Park Grange Mount' apartments?"

Glad to hear it. Bye.

Same old same old every time you post Lib1 :rolleyes:

NP is simply more desirable than the Manor. Isn't it about time you let this information register and stop with all the bickering?

That's easy enough to say, but then why do two bed apartments on both of the developments rent out for around the same price (usually about £450 per month)?

If I was to rent in lets say Crookes or Ranmoor (arguably more 'desirable' areas), then I would expect to pay more than if I were to rent in lets say Heeley or Sharrow (arguably less 'desirable' areas).

I don't mean to bicker with you, I'd just like a valid answer.

Lib1

Originally posted by mm93fm
chri5, I am going to pull out.


I'm sure you'll get something better, perhaps it wasn't meant to be. I hope you get the deposit back.

Lib1, Just my 2$ but I think the answers to the original question "what's so special about Park Grange Mount?" is there's nothing special about it.
The location simply gives it more value. I know the argument then goes to why does just a few miles closer to town mean an extra 10/20-30k, I don't know but it does, and this can be seen when you look at other areas around the city too.

I lived at the Riverside Exchange and my flat was much larger than the ones at west one/point on West Street but mine was cheaper to the tune of 20K!! All because I had to walk an extra 10 minutes into town.
I took advantage of that just like you've taken advantage of Parklands being cheaper than Park Grange.

last year I rented a 2 bed flat in Ranmoor for £425/month - where does that leave your argument eh?

Originally posted by Lib1
That's easy enough to say, but then why do two bed apartments on both of the developments rent out for around the same price (usually about £450 per month)?

If I was to rent in lets say Crookes or Ranmoor (arguably more 'desirable' areas), then I would expect to pay more than if I were to rent in lets say Heeley or Sharrow (arguably less 'desirable' areas).

I don't mean to bicker with you, I'd just like a valid answer.

Lib1

Just wandering how everyone is getting on who lives on the new Norfolk Park development? Noticed a few people on here have said they do. I am considering a house on there and would be interested to hear how people have found it who have lived there a while? Thanks in advance if anyone responds :)

I'm perfectly happy having been here since June. Feel free to PM me if you want to know anything specific.

Originally posted by mrinvestigat
I'm perfectly happy having been here since June. Feel free to PM me if you want to know anything specific.

And me! I've been here since March. :thumbsup:

moved in october and very happy with it!

murdered my knees doing laminate wood flooring lol

hi there
i am moving onto park grange mount from hull and heard that area has bad rep can anyone put my mind at rest as my partner is quite nervous about move and would hate to be making a bad move cheers

hi there
i am moving onto park grange mount from hull and heard that area has bad rep can anyone put my mind at rest as my partner is quite nervous about move and would hate to be making a bad move cheers

It HAD a bad reputation in the past, it's not like that round there now.

Not a thing to worry about when moving around here as far as i'm concerned. The scariest thing i've seen is my reflection when taking the dog for a walk at night :hihi:

What's so special about Park Grange Mount???

I LIVE THERE! WOOOOOOOO. :hihi:

I LIVE THERE! WOOOOOOOO. :hihi:

Hang on...we're meant to be encoraging people to move here, not scare them away :hihi:

I moved here in November, new to Sheffield.
We haven't had any trouble, the flat is a good size for the price, and the locals are friendly, plus great for the tram. The only downer is people who haven't been up here for years giving it a bad name... It'll be much nicer when the old shops/flats/post office come down - does anyone now when that'll happen??

cheers chaps eased my mind slightly

The new estate down between Park Grange Road and Park Grange Croft looks quite nice, though the houses look a bit small.

Hi

I'm a first time caller, long time listener!

I've just been reading this rather old thread about Park Grange Mount and wondered what people think of the area these days as I'm potentially looking at a house/flat to buy

Hi BoopBoop

I lived there for 18 months between 2006-2008 and I did have problems with my car getting broken into. My friends who still live there haven't had any problems for over a year now so it seems to be improving. I think its a nice place to live, just wanted to give you a heads up that I did experience problems when I lived there.

The prices here have almost halved, I saw a 2 bedroom duplex for sale at under £90,000!

Is this simply in line with the lack of demand? Or is this area still plagued by anti social behaviour?

hiya just seen this post, im just about to rent a flat on park grange mount, but there are differences with peoples posts whether its a nice area or not.
can anyone show me some photos? thanks x