There seems to be a lot of regeneration happening in so called deprived areas, which is fine if only the improvements were not continuously vandalized.

The other thing I don't get is that these anti social specimens are obviously brain dead but yet the Police don't seem to be able to catch them?

Some blame it on poor education, but is it their own fault if people want to educate themselves,? But then again, I suppose how do you make 10 Watt light bulb shine at 100?

Why waste millions of pounds if these same anti social families are just going to vandalize everything? Why not if possible try & change the anti social behavior of these families before wasting millions on housing, parks, community centres etc....

What do you think?

I worked on the Manor estate during the demolition of the old properties and the building of new houses, a time that hopefully gave people somewhere decent to live. One of the academic newcomers who learned all her skills from a text book in University suggested "Give people a decent home and they will respect it". However, some of the more cynical of us who had learned our skills, such as they were, from the University of Reality, realised that bad families who had made life a living hell on the estate, would continue to do so, new house or not. I believe we all felt proud when the new houses were let, but within 6 months the complaints of vandalism and harassment began to arise. When the second phase was built, the problem was exacerbated and the new vacant properties were stripped and vandalised. By the time Vikinglea had been erected, I believe everyone accepted that we were fighting a losing cause, the minority were ruining life for the majority. I`m afraid years of p****ng in the wind has made me a cynical old sod, but I firmly believe the old saying "rubbish in, rubbish out". They are a minority but what a headache for everybody, the only answer to this problem is unprintable and illegal, unfortunately.:sad:

The only way to sort out the sink estates is the euthenise the worst families. Men, women and children - get them out of society permanently and stop them breeding future generations of criminal underclass.

The only way to sort out the sink estates is the euthenise the worst families. Men, women and children - get them out of society permanently and stop them breeding future generations of criminal underclass.

i totally agree with you there. just because you spend millions of pounds to make their houses better, it dont mean that they are gonna change!

The only way to sort out the sink estates is the euthenise the worst families. Men, women and children - get them out of society permanently and stop them breeding future generations of criminal underclass.

BTW what does the PC stand for in your avatar?

BTW what does the PC stand for in your avatar?Political Correctness. It drives me mad - and there are plenty of posters on this forum that wave the banner of political correctness as though the very future of the world depends on it. Muppets.

Of course it's not a waste of time and money as a concept.

BUT! Unless the 'social problems' associated with a number of individuals and families isn't sorted as a part of that process then the investment impact will be negated. Frankly some people just don't deserve to live with decent humans.

I'll leave it to some of our more vocal contributers to make radical suggestions, but having seen and been affected by some of the genuine low-lifes that inhabit our society I cannot but help thinking that the rest of us would all be better off without them. Natural selection once took care of our dregs. These days the welfare state seems to do it.

The only way to sort out the sink estates is the euthenise the worst families. Men, women and children - get them out of society permanently and stop them breeding future generations of criminal underclass.

Blimey Barty, you are going further and further to the left.
You'll be voting Labour next

Of course it's not a waste of time and money as a concept.
BUT! Unless the 'social problems' associated with a number of individuals and families isn't sorted as a part of that process then the investment impact will be negated. Frankly some people just don't deserve to live with decent humans.
I'll leave it to some of our more vocal contributers to make radical suggestions, but having seen and been affected by some of the genuine low-lifes that inhabit our society I cannot but help thinking that the rest of us would all be better off without them. Natural selection once took care of our dregs. These days the welfare state seems to do it.
Tony, if I may be so bold as to infer that I'm one of those more vocal contributors, I must say that I can't better what you said here.
There will be people who don't like it, but it's a case of 'truth hurts'.

Now, as to how we should go about curing the problem . . . . . .I'll wait until some of my favorite liberals are online before I comment :twisted:

Why should the good and genuine people who live in poor housing etc be deprived of new homes just because of some idiots? We need to train the few inadequate parents how to bring up children to behave in an acceptable manner or even dare I say it sterilise them

People blame all this on poverty and lack of education. What bunkum!
I was born and brought up on Heeley Bottom. No one there was rich, or highly educated.
But they had many values they held high.
The main one of these was Pride, in themselves and in their neighbours.
Another was self respect, we were brought up to think of ourselves as kings of the world.
We did not have the trappings of wealth, but we had the knowledge that no one was better than we were.
That is what is lacking in todays world.
Self Respect

The people you speak about live in mansions compared to those old houses, yet they have made them disgusting slums, purely because they cant be bothered to shift their lazy backsides.

Of course it's not a waste of time and money as a concept.

BUT! Unless the 'social problems' associated with a number of individuals and families isn't sorted as a part of that process then the investment impact will be negated. Frankly some people just don't deserve to live with decent humans.

I'll leave it to some of our more vocal contributers to make radical suggestions, but having seen and been affected by some of the genuine low-lifes that inhabit our society I cannot but help thinking that the rest of us would all be better off without them. Natural selection once took care of our dregs. These days the welfare state seems to do it.

Left Wing, Tree-Hugging, Liberal!!!!!

People blame all this on poverty and lack of education. What bunkum!
.

Agree 100%.

THIS ISN'T POVERTY (http://www.ratemyhat.co.uk/chavs.jpg)................THIS IS (http://static.flickr.com/4/4987221_2932cea114.jpg).

I bet the poor kid kipping amongst the rat-infested rubbish isn't making life hell for her neighbours either, or nicking from them.

Thought poverty meant things like not having enough resources to feed yourself or have a roof over your head, as opposed to having a car, telly, fags, booze, full wardrobe, three bedroomed house, microwave, X-box, and mobile phone ...... but no job.

For poverty on a council estate, read STUPIDITY.

As long as these morons exist and are able to crawl out of their holes to get their hands on anything that looks half decent, or is not screwed down, then the money might as well go to the bloody Taliban.

The decent people will never see any benefit from it.

Agree 100%.

THIS ISN'T POVERTY (http://www.nofear.org/Archives/chavs_20050318_2.jpg)





No it's you being a bandwidth sneaking weazle :lol: You might wanna change the link :)

No it's you being a bandwidth sneaking weazle :lol: You might wanna change the link :)

Ooops!!

Changed it.

Notice the scum on the wall complained, but the kiddy kipping rough didn't.:suspect:

It is a waste of money, until we first thin out the benefit-dependant underclasses.

Round them up - the entire families - and turn them into dog food.

It is a waste of money, until we first thin out the benefit-dependant underclasses.

Round them up - the entire families - and turn them into dog food.
Give it up mate
You know even you dont believe that. It is arrant nonsense

Give it up mate
You know even you dont believe that. It is arrant nonsense
No artisan - I DO believe that.
I loathe the parasites that give nothing to society but crime statistics, then expect honest tax payers to fund their benefits. They are sub-human in my eye, not worthy of the oxygen they steal, and should not live to pollute our society.

No artisan - I DO believe that.
I loathe the parasites that give nothing to society but crime statistics, then expect honest tax payers to fund their benefits. They are sub-human in my eye, not worthy of the oxygen they steal, and should not live to pollute our society.

Calm down, I take it the nettle tea and the copy of the Socialist Worker hasn't worked then?

.

Round them up - the entire families - and turn them into dog food.

You may have an idea for a new petfood business here Barty:

"Nickalot"
"Chavvie"

Give it up mate
You know even you dont believe that. It is arrant nonsense

The RSPCA wouldn't take too kindly to that idea

It is a waste of money, until we first thin out the benefit-dependant underclasses.

Round them up - the entire families - and turn them into dog food.

The RSPCA wouldn't take too kindly to that idea

Thanks, A few good posts here but - Has anyone got any realistic suggestions as to what could be done?

your right that you cant polish a turd but i bet there are more decent people than crims on most estates its just that good deeds go unnoticed and bad deeds get plasted across the papers. i think in this day and age everyone should be intitled to housing of a decent standard if the scummy few want to ruin their nice new house thats fine its when they vandalise others that the problems begin.

A few quid spent on bricking up the doors and windows, with the occupants still inside, where the scummy and undesirable tenants are concerned would be money well spent.

Stage two would then be worthwhile. A complete overhaul for the benefit of those families who weren't responsible for the area being classed as 'deprived' in the first place.

Any so-called poverty on council estates is self inflicted anyway. They get sufficient money to live a reasonable life, but if they choose to spend it on luxuries they can't afford as opposed to necessities such as food and basic needs, then it's their choice and others shouldn't be expected to constantly pay out in time and money in order that the idiots 'can have a better life'.

Choice: Food for the kid, or an xbox? "Durrr! I'll 'ave t' fink abaht dat one!"
Choice: Pay the bills, or get a car I don't need? "Mmmmm! Dat's anuvva 'ard one!"
Choice: Stay in and play with the kids, or go down the pub and spend the kids' clothes money? "Sod da kids, ant 'ad a pint since yesterday!"

"Anyway, it dunt really matta duz it. Dem numpties wot work dere arses off and take care ov da estate'll see us reight. Even dem pillocks who live in da posh 'ouses up Fulwood'll chip in aswell. Afta all, we're part of society, an society is responsible for us! Daft buggers! Comin' for a pint and den a drive aroun' t'estate toneet Gazza? Got me dole dis mornin' dint I."

Yes, brick the buggers up, then spend the money where it will be appreciated......on the 99 (or so) % of people who deserve it, have earned it, and who paid it out of their hard-earned cash in the first place.

I would personally rather see money spent on rebuilding a garden wall in a leafy south Sheffield suburb, than on replacing a front door that was ripped off by the occupier of a council house or tidying up said occupier's front garden because the scum 'couldn't be bothered'. Especially since the occupier is probably living there for free, at my expense.

I await the backlash!!

A few quid spent on bricking up the doors and windows, with the occupants still inside, where the scummy and undesirable tenants are concerned would be money well spent.

Stage two would then be worthwhile. A complete overhaul for the benefit of those families who weren't responsible for the area being classed as 'deprived' in the first place.

Any so-called poverty on council estates is self inflicted anyway. They get sufficient money to live a reasonable life, but if they choose to spend it on luxuries they can't afford as opposed to necessities such as food and basic needs, then it's their choice and others shouldn't be expected to constantly pay out in time and money in order that the idiots 'can have a better life'.

Choice: Food for the kid, or an xbox? "Durrr! I'll 'ave t' fink abaht dat one!"
Choice: Pay the bills, or get a car I don't need? "Mmmmm! Dat's anuvva 'ard one!"
Choice: Stay in and play with the kids, or go down the pub and spend the kids' clothes money? "Sod da kids, ant 'ad a pint since yesterday!"

"Anyway, it dunt really matta duz it. Dem numpties wot work dere arses off and take care ov da estate'll see us reight. Even dem pillocks who live in da posh 'ouses up Fulwood'll chip in aswell. Afta all, we're part of society, an society is responsible for us! Daft buggers! Comin' for a pint and den a drive aroun' t'estate toneet Gazza? Got me dole dis mornin' dint I."

Yes, brick the buggers up, then spend the money where it will be appreciated......on the 99 (or so) % of people who deserve it, have earned it, and who paid it out of their hard-earned cash in the first place.

I would personally rather see money spent on rebuilding a garden wall in a leafy south Sheffield suburb, than on replacing a front door that was ripped off by the occupier of a council house or tidying up said occupier's front garden because the scum 'couldn't be bothered'. Especially since the occupier is probably living there for free, at my expense.

I await the backlash!!

no backlash from me! i totally agree with you. and none of it is over-exaggerated IMO!

saxon51
I think you will get no backlash, as most people agree with you. :thumbsup:

saxon51
I think you will get no backlash, as most people agree with you. :thumbsup:

thats just about everyone thats not on the dole and/or doesnt live in a council house!

I live in a council house, so I'm not some posh get with a gripe.:hihi:

The thing that rattles me is the fact that I work, pay full rent/council tax, and respect the place and those other decent folks around me....whilst others who are too idle to get off their arses - except when the pubs open - treat the place as thought it's someone else's problem, and then plead poverty.

These same scum probably get not much less income than some who go to work ... housing benefits etc taken into account.

Admittedly, if I lived up where Bartfarst lives I'd probably be even more rattled about the council estate 'regeneration' nonsense.

God knows how many chances, or how much money these scum expect to be thrown away on them to put right their self-inflicted lifestyle. It will go on forever, or as long as they exist. Getting rid of them from the gene pool would seem the only answer at the moment. Drastic, I know, but nobody - even the 'experts' - has yet come up with an answer.

This 'it is society's problem' nonsense is wearing a bit thin. Society didn't cause this. If society was to blame, then the majority would be the scum, not the minority.

Quite honestly, these types of people have always existed. The types that made "The Rookeries" in London a no-go area in the 19thc, drank themselves insensible in gin palaces, sold their children to chimney sweeps or sent them out begging.

The few intelligent, ruthless ones pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps and became millionaires, the honest types became servants or tradespeople, most of the others turned to petty crime and remained wallowing in their misery. Other than charity given only to the deserving poor, there was no other way out.

The difference today, it seems is that there are whole industries (eg social services for one) devoted to telling them that it's not their fault their lives are like that, instead of telling them a few home truths and making them sort themselves out.

When I was young, the (respectable) rest of the neighbourhood came down heavily on people who didn't toe the line, and either made them fit in, or they moved away to torment others. These days, it seems turned on its head and the (unrespectable) rest of the neighbourhood seems to turn on the odd ones out and make their lives a misery.

Postive reinforcement of the behaviour we want to see seems to be the only way we can ever change things. We can't just go round doing away with people whose behaviour we don't like. As satisfying as it may seem to contemplate sometimes!

Postive reinforcement of the behaviour we want to see seems to be the only way we can ever change things. We can't just go round doing away with people who's behaviour we don't like. As satisfying as it may seem sometimes!
There goes the collective fantasy of the decent folk on my estate then.:(

Positive reinforcement would mean a vigilante thumping, but as the law doesn't allow this, I guess we'll just have to carry on looking sternly at them.;)

just had to post,im involved with the desent homes project round the country where £10,000 to £30,000 are been spent on council properties,where alot of people are gratefull for wat has been done alot are been trashed within days this is very anoying an makes me wonder why these scum are getting it.also the problem lies that the new bidding system that is now in place for houses,does not allow for new tennents to be vetted(thank tou goverment ruling).so when you have a nice pocket of desent people it is not allowed that a nice freindly smack head wont be put there or in houseing for the elderly some young chav with 5 kids an no respect wont be your neighbour this is so wrong.an 1 of the reasons areas wont be cleaned up,if some 1 has been anti social in their previous house then on course their not goin to be any better in the next,so more vettin is needed an a houseing estate away from desent folk is needed at least their would be all together an easier to police,because theres always someone worse,but then will this lead to more problems as scum breeds more scrum

Positive reinforcement would mean a vigilante thumping, but as the law doesn't allow this, I guess we'll just have to carry on looking sternly at them

Then you'd get a shellacking for staring at them, even if they got caught they'd probably get a holiday to "find themselves" lol ;)

We need to build flats on old industrial sites....lots of them. These antisocial scum, and their entire broods, could then be housed in them. A shop and clinic should be provided, and a curfew put in place - 10am-2pm should do it - they should then have to log in and out at the gate which would be the only access through the 15 foot fence.

No pub. After all, they don't get much money, do they.:rolleyes:
No school. Their kids would only make it a living hell, as they already seem to.
No place to let their kids 'disappear' to. Let them have them under their feet for a change.

When their kids ask them, "Mummy, why do I have to live like this when all those other children can run around and have fun?"

They can answer, "Because me and your dad are undesirable to society. It's our fault love."

Now wouldn't that make a pleasant change.

And when the kids of the decent folk ask, "Mummy, how come I can suddenly play wherever I want in safety, and how come I can get to sleep at night now? How come when I go to school the teacher isn't shouting anymore, and I get a full 5 hours of being taught in a relaxed and friendly atmosphere all of a sudden?"

The parents can answer, "Because those who ruined life for you before have been festering in their own rot in those flats over there ever since the powers that be stopped burying their heads in the sand."

I think people are either, discussing a totally seperate issue or are just focussing on one point.

Urban regeneration such as use of objective 1 and the SRB are totally different to the decent homes programme being rolled out nationwide.

1. The government now say everyone should have a decent home. This doesnt mean they get a brand spanking new pad at the council tax payers expense. It means all homes have to have decent electrics, plumbing, windows heating and kitchens and insulation. Some homes in Sheffield have not been upgraded etc since they were built.

2. Regeneration covers a multitude of things, from the enviroment we live in to job creation and opportunities such as childcare, social group, training, healthcare and education.

So with that in mind, isn't it a good thing?

just had to post,im involved with the desent homes project round the country where £10,000 to £30,000 are been spent on council properties,where alot of people are gratefull for wat has been done alot are been trashed within days this is very anoying an makes me wonder why these scum are getting it.also the problem lies that the new bidding system that is now in place for houses,does not allow for new tennents to be vetted(thank tou goverment ruling).so when you have a nice pocket of desent people it is not allowed that a nice freindly smack head wont be put there or in houseing for the elderly some young chav with 5 kids an no respect wont be your neighbour this is so wrong.an 1 of the reasons areas wont be cleaned up,if some 1 has been anti social in their previous house then on course their not goin to be any better in the next,so more vettin is needed an a houseing estate away from desent folk is needed at least their would be all together an easier to police,because theres always someone worse,but then will this lead to more problems as scum breeds more scrum
I think what you are saying is that everything is brought to its lowest common denominator.
This is completely true
However, as Ruby was saying, this was not always the fact.
In the old days if a house was not immaculate then it was a disgrace.
The curtains had to be gleaming.
The doorstep donkeystoned and wiped clean

If this was not the case then the person was treat like a leper.
For some reason people these days see it the opposite way, and revel in filth.

For some reason people these days see it the opposite way, and revel in filth.

And destroy the efforts of those who do still make the effort.:mad:

People blame all this on poverty and lack of education. What bunkum!
I was born and brought up on Heeley Bottom. No one there was rich, or highly educated.
But they had many values they held high.
The main one of these was Pride, in themselves and in their neighbours.
Another was self respect, we were brought up to think of ourselves as kings of the world.
We did not have the trappings of wealth, but we had the knowledge that no one was better than we were.
That is what is lacking in todays world.
Self Respect

The people you speak about live in mansions compared to those old houses, yet they have made them disgusting slums, purely because they cant be bothered to shift their lazy backsides. Well said Artisan. :thumbsup:

I had a far better standard of living as a child than either of my parents, especially my father who is from an incredibly poor family. But I was brought up in a loving household that placed value on respect of all kinds so it didn't matter that we didn't have a phone in the house until 1982, or that a week at Butlins once a year was as exotic as our holidays ever got. In turn I have a much better standard of living than my parents and I hope that my children will continue the theme.

I do think that 'self-respect' is a double edged sword today though, and the other edge is named 'envy'. You can fight through your life with one or the other, but only one of those edges is self respect edge sharp.

However, when equipped with some (quote old fashioned) values and manners you seem to move up the pile as if by magic. Heck, how many kids are now taught to stand when people enter the room, eat at the table and ask to leave it, enter the room after ladies, and all the other tiny social niceties that you don't notice when you do it, but that make day to day life so much nicer? These small social skills are what separate us and I for one believe that they are very important.

I firmly believe that those who envy what others have seem to move down the pile which in turn leads to their attitude problems.

Giving a low life a shiny new house won't stop them being a low life. The decent people need the dregs removing from their environment.

And destroy the efforts of those who do still make the effort.:mad:
I know what you mean, but they live everywhere. More so it seems on the estates.
It seems that they need educating in personal behaviour.
It must run in families, as it always the same type of people who behave in this fashion.

Like I said, this isn't about regen. its about the decent homes programme.

So with that in mind, isn't it a good thing?


Yes it certainly is, when it works and is delivered to a realistic timetable. Regeneration where I live is years behind schedule, we were promised the earth and as time went on proposals were "remodelled". The improvements are happening, but too slowly

Yes it certainly is, when it works and is delivered to a realistic timetable. Regeneration where I live is years behind schedule, we were promised the earth and as time went on proposals were "remodelled". The improvements are happening, but too slowly

What do you want to see happen king-rat? Unfortunately the nature of the beast is there has to be committees/sub committees/project groups/forums and all this takes up valuable time.

What exactly was the original point you wanted to make?

Surely some of those committees can be made to be a bit "leaner"? Too much consultation, not enough action, in my experience anyway

Surely some of those committees can be made to be a bit "leaner"? Too much consultation, not enough action, in my experience anyway

Ahhhhh theres the rub. If consultation is cut down, 12 months later the rally cry will be, "nobody asked us if we wanted it!" said committees etc have to prove they have consulted before going ahead. Incidentally the groups/committees involved include lots of residents of council housing and tenants reps. who work voluntarily and unpaid.

I think that NPB! has a good point here. Our civil service is far too unwieldy and consumes huge amounts of the money that it seeks to spend on regeneration.

I for one would put in place an elected Mayor with complete overall responsibility and power. They would then establish effective working parties that in turn have direct responsibility and power for the areas that they represent.

They current Area Panels are little more than public relations exercises, and while they are useful to a point they have little or no funding, no authority and no responsibility, but the template is there if the Council allowed itself to let go of a little power. Sadly we live in an Old Labour city. :(

In our case not much of the consultation was followed through anyway, much of it was just lip service. I agree with your points Fox, just didn't work as well as it should in the case of the area I'm in, in my opinion anyway :)

In our case not much of the consultation was followed through anyway, much of it was just lip service. I agree with your points Fox, just didn't work as well as it should in the case of the area I'm in, in my opinion anyway :)

Oh I can relate NPB our area just began the refurb treatment. Fortunately for me and unfortuately for SCC I have the personal numbers and emails of the project leaders :hihi:

I intend to be a proverbial thorn in their side until work has concluded to my satisfaction. ;)

Go for it Fox, because trust me, you will have to be a real pain in the ar*e if our experience is anything to go by

I think people are either, discussing a totally seperate issue or are just focussing on one point.

Urban regeneration such as use of objective 1 and the SRB are totally different to the decent homes programme being rolled out nationwide.
I see what you are saying fox, but all these projects are linked in some way aren't they.

A council estate peopled by decent, caring folk only wouldn't be in such a state that a small fortune needed to be spent on it. It would still be in a reasonable state of repair - wear and tear aside.

Upgrading and maintaining the amenities would be minimal because those who seek to wreck everything that appears half decent wouldn't be there to do it. The decent folk would surely not allow the areas to fall into such states in the first place. Cars wouldn't need to be parked on grass verges, ruining them, if the owners weren't worried about the scum sideswiping them when parked on the roads.

Privet edges wouldn't be allowed to grow untidily to 8+ feet tall if the owners weren't sick and tired of picking chip wrappers and beer cans out of their front gardens on a daily basis.

Houses which are occupied by the dregs wouldn't be allowed to get in the state they are if the dregs weren't there. Most houses on our estate have double glazing, central heating, fitted kitchens, new wiring etc. What more do these houses need? Surely, if someone is living a life of Riley, rent free, paying nothing for the privelege, then all these luxuries are more than enough.

If regeneration meant repairing roads and paths, and painting the street furniture etc then I would say 'great', but when it means repairing/replacing/making safe the damage done on purpose by the scum who are having a free ride in the first place, then I say, "Get rid of the scum, and the regeneration wouldn't be as necessary!"

Let the decent people take the estates back, and maybe then we could seriously discuss what needs doing to improve facilities - such as benches on grassed areas for family picnics. Off-road parking so as to make the roads safer for the kids. Landscaping. Better street lighting. Trimming or replacement of overgrown trees - safe in the knowledge that none of this will be trashed, or taken over by yobs, within days.

Not replacing/ repairing the stuff trashed for fun by the scum!! Remove the scum instead, it would be cheaper in the long run.

Street lights have been smashed, trees damaged, street signs tagged and illegible, attempts to regenerate the grassed areas ruined. This shouldn't be happening. Decent folk wouldn't have caused this, the scum have. Money will now be wasted putting these faults right. My money, your money, not theirs.

My apologies to all council tenants who respect their areas and feel the same as I do. I know that the majority do. I appreciate that some of the yobs are from 'employed' families, but the majority of problem families are free-loaders who are taking the mickey out of the rest of us. I don't know what the 'humane' answer is, but the problem needs to go away.

By the way fox, don't think for one minute that by putting those eyes of yours on your avatar you'll get any mercy.:hihi: :hihi:

I once took a wrong turning onto an estate in Hereford.Nearly every house had boarded up windows, unkempt gardens, graffiti and rubbish all over the streets.
I've never left an area so fast in all my life.
When I were a lad many years ago, I used to walk home at 1 or 2 am thro' the centre of the town where I lived.
It's now full of clubs and pubs and and I would go thro' in the dark if you paid me, it's got a terrible reputation.
Someone was even shot dead in the hospital car park and you should see the q's at A andE at 11pm.

Okay Sax here we go:

I see what you are saying fox, but all these projects are linked in some way aren't they.

Upgrading and maintaining the amenities would be minimal because those who seek to wreck everything that appears half decent wouldn't be there to do it.

Like I said most properties have not been kept up to the standard they need to be eg: my house wasn't earthed when it was built in the 60's!

Cars wouldn't need to be parked on grass verges, ruining them, if the owners weren't worried about the scum sideswiping them when parked on the roads.

Parking is an issue, when most estates went up post war the number of cars were few, however its a crime issue not a regen one that tea leafs are about

Privet edges wouldn't be allowed to grow untidily to 8+ feet tall if the owners weren't sick and tired of picking chip wrappers and beer cans out of their front gardens on a daily basis.

I think you may be generalising Sax, personally I have no privet or fence and rarely see a chip wrapper or beer can[/colour]

Houses which are occupied by the dregs wouldn't be allowed to get in the state they are if the dregs weren't there. Most houses on our estate have double glazing, central heating, fitted kitchens, new wiring etc. What more do these houses need? they must either be new build or previously modernised then? Surely, if someone is living a life of Riley, rent free, paying nothing for the privelege, then all these luxuries are more than enough.

Not everyone is on benefits sax, come on I give you more credit than that for an assumption.

If regeneration meant repairing roads and paths, and painting the street furniture etc then I would say 'great', but when it means repairing/replacing/making safe the damage done on purpose by the scum who are having a free ride in the first place, then I say, "Get rid of the scum, and the regeneration wouldn't be as necessary!"

Regeneration is all about putting in place long term strategies to improve areas, not replace existing stuff. My park pictures on the other thread are an example, regeneration of the park and pavilion have had a positive effect on the local people and how they treat the area.

Street lights have been smashed, trees damaged, street signs tagged and illegible, attempts to regenerate the grassed areas ruined. This shouldn't be happening. Decent folk wouldn't have caused this, the scum have. Money will now be wasted putting these faults right. My money, your money, not theirs.

My apologies to all council tenants who respect their areas and feel the same as I do. I know that the majority do. I appreciate that some of the yobs are from 'employed' families, but the majority of problem families are free-loaders who are taking the mickey out of the rest of us. I don't know what the 'humane' answer is, but the problem needs to go away.

So, in conclusion, we are never going to be rid of that section of society, however the local council are seeking possession of properties where families are seen to be criminal/anti social etc. and the process is quicker and easier. Unless, people actively report these families to their local police and council they will not be moved. Unfortunately Sax far to many folk whinge behind their net curtains but are afraid to actually do something pro active to put an end to this kind of behaviour.

P:S

I apologise for the hatchett job I made of your post Sax :P

Can't argue with what you say fox.

Reporting things is good. As long as the police don't come straight aound to your house prior to dealing with the trouble. Not an intelligent move.:(

By sideswiping, I didn't mean theft, I meant idiot youth drivers, who can't control their Corsas.

Earthing houses where needed is good. It's the replastering of walls after being wrecked by free-loading tenants kind of thing I have a gripe about.

Litter chucked in front gardens is quite prevalent where I live.

Didn't say 'everyone' was on benefits, I was commenting on those who are - long term and voluntarily - and who think that they are still entitled to housing of 'luxury' status whilst being free to wreck the life-quality of others.

Hope this makes sense fox.

Just to add:

I see no problem with spending money on improving housing for those who live within the council conditions. Someone who pays rent deserves the house to be kept up to date and in line with Government guidelines.

Those who live rent free, and do so due to idleness and attitude, deserve only to live in the squallour that they have brought upon themselves and their brood. A scummy, workshy chav, who has the audacity to expect a decent standard of living needs taking to one side - by the throat - and putting right. It must really gall those who have mortgages and work their socks off, to see the free-loading scum laughing at them because their home is being kept in better shape than 'paying' home owners can afford.

Of course it does Sax :D

My only problem is, (and I seem to be banging a very worn out drum) that people tend to have a really good old moan about stuff and criticise but have no desire to take any actions. You're a driving instructor, no doubt you or one of your colleagues has had the pleasure of the MW test centre.

Little darling brats on here are always terrorising learner drivers, but does anyone every call the police? :rolleyes: Our biggest problem is with the 12 and under age group who like the new breed of street rat are getting bolder and tougher. Fortunately we have a good relationship with the local people and the authorities and try very hard to ensure it doesn't affect lives too much.

Example is last summer (05) the estate was prolific with mini motos and off road unlicenced bikes. This year... none! Fabulous, all as a result of the residents and the council and the police working together. Information sharing doesn't necessarily mean "grassing someone up" just making people aware that its a problem.

Hope that made sense :huh:

You've got the wrong Saxon, fox!:)

I'm the one with a small 's' and '51' at the end.... the good looking one.;)

'Saxon' is the driving instructor.

Anyhow, I see where you are coming from fox. Da CRU iz wivya:thumbsup:

Those eyes :heyhey:

Could these camps be a realistic approach for changing the ways of anti-social families in UK?
Apparently in Holland they have started to set up places like this for antisocial families & is proving to have a good success rate so far, but the only link I found was in Dutch so if anyone else finds a link then that would be most appreciated.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=364790&in_page_id=1770

Okay Sax here we go:



So, in conclusion, we are never going to be rid of that section of society, however the local council are seeking possession of properties where families are seen to be criminal/anti social etc. and the process is quicker and easier. Unless, people actively report these families to their local police and council they will not be moved. Unfortunately Sax far to many folk whinge behind their net curtains but are afraid to actually do something pro active to put an end to this kind of behaviour.

This could be because a large number of people have lost confidence that the authorities will back them up. e.g. see recent thread on women prosecuted for assaulting yobs. Or in this case perhaps people worry all that will happen is the yobs target them for grassing and their life gets even worse.

This could be because a large number of people have lost confidence that the authorities will back them up. e.g. see recent thread on women prosecuted for assaulting yobs. Or in this case perhaps people worry all that will happen is the yobs target them for grassing and their life gets even worse.

trust me in a lot of cases both can happen

i know this is a couple of days old now but the point of the police etc,an not helping is true i was woken up by my wonderfull aloholic neibough for the ump teenth time at silly o clock in the morning,we have had loads of problem in the past an following the right action have filled alot of diaries etc in for houseing an nothing was done(3 of us),so on this nite i phoned ecclesall police station up to ask if there was a car in the area could they have words(as im in parsonscross theres always one some where) only to be told that the police could not dop anything anymore as the man was in his own home an i had to call nuisance control with wasnt open after an hour i phoned the police bac up an said i had work in a couple of hours an enquired that if i went round again(i banged on his door at 3.15 be for the call to the police to just be verbal screemed at by him)an smacked him would they come out then to which i was told it wasnt a good ideal,hey thats why i phone them.
anyway the bottom line is the amount of red tape(or do gooders)are causeing these problems and people can get away with anything,an dont have to show any respect to anyone or anything so as has been said change the law you act like scrum youll be treated as it

Could these camps be a realistic approach for changing the ways of anti-social families in UK?
Apparently in Holland they have started to set up places like this for antisocial families & is proving to have a good success rate so far, but the only link I found was in Dutch so if anyone else finds a link then that would be most appreciated.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=364790&in_page_id=1770